Big Trouble In Tourist Thailand

[MrHammer]

Isn't it funny how some people never seem to outgrow that 'police are scum' mentality. I'm sure we all know that guy/girl who always got into trouble with the police, but it was never their fault. With the average age of thai visa members (103 +-) you'd think the troublemakers had grown up but aparantly not.

I have never met these tourist cops, but anyone who's willing to deal with british lager louts, hooligans, german fetishists and thai ladyboys on a daily basis deserves some respect!

[mommysboy]

Isn't it funny how some people never seem to outgrow that 'police are scum' mentality. I'm sure we all know that guy/girl who always got into trouble with the police, but it was never their fault. With the average age of thai visa members (103 +-) you'd think the troublemakers had grown up but aparantly not.

I have never met these tourist cops, but anyone who's willing to deal with british lager louts, hooligans, german fetishists and thai ladyboys on a daily basis deserves some respect!

And as for the Yanks, Ozzies, and - oops sorry where did you say you were from?

[DC1066]

I've just finished watching the first three episodes - taped them while I was over in Thailand.

All of the events portrayed are examples of what actually happens over there, its just that it is partially contrived for the camera, then compressed and edited. Believe it or not the crap that happens in Eastenders (not that I watch it) does also happen, just not to the same family in the same 30 minutes three times a week.

That is the point, the production team have gone to those exact places where they are likely to find trouble, filmed countless hours of footage and then cut and packaged the odd flashpoint incident for entertainment aimed at a specific audience demographic, so what would we expect. Do you really think it would sell seeing the 99% of Thai life that is ordinary? The typical Thai guy going out to work at the cement factory and his wife preparing som tam?

As for the bit with the Marines, it had to be at least partially set up. I do think better of British Marines in general, but a 20 year old squaddie will typically be out of his depth in this situation (whether British or American, despite this we're harder than you, chest puffing crap that some on here like to get into). The Royal Marines I know - and I do know a couple of experienced guys well, would take the 'appropriate action' in this situation. Whether this means paying up a small amount, or using a necessary degree of force, this would depend on the exact specifics of the situation. I can imagine that when those kids did get back on their ship, they would get a punishment and beasting behind closed doors, far worse than losing a few hundred quid to a Thai con artist.

I'm enjoying the series, but taking it as light entertainment, largely to remind me of some of the places I know and enjoy and miss when I'm back here in not so sunny Sheffield.

[cdnvic]

Lets drop the personal attacks shall we? Next guy referring to another member as a muppet or any other derogatory form is going to get stepped on. Name calling belongs on the playground.

[losworld]

Laughing my ass off that the guy submitted his application as a version of "cops" but in Thailand. Nowhere does the show cops show law enforcement or the system in a negative fashion... only the arrested, etc. I can tell you right now if he pulled this trick with law enforcement in the U.S. or elsewhere he'd be in a court pretty quickly. This is why he bolted from Tland.

So the guy basically lied on the application which is what I thought all along. He then proceeds to show the tourists and the Thai system in the most negative light possible for the sake of viewership.

Thanks Ahole for damaging Tourism and putting foreign film making in Thailand back 50 years so you can make a few quid.

Pathetic.

Edited September 26, 2009 by losworld

[caf]

^only one who needs a life is you mate. Get off your arse and do smth rather than whinge.

is that not why we are on this forum---- ie to put our views across --- or is it only the ones you agree with that you want to read ---- ps get of your arse and go read something you agree with

A typical Tv response as you say. Some posters will never admit they COULD be wrong. If you dont agree with them, they flame.

For those who have not met Howard, I say again watch the video and read his replies carefully. No serving or retired genuine police officer would give him house room.

I'm all for the concept of volunteering, TPV included. But as in all cases of volunteer work you need to be careful who you accept

Weed those out and the TPV would be respected.

[caf]

just in case no one mentioned it, did you see when the thai police officer slapped the suspected thief on the stomach? I hardly think the bald farangs (sorry, forgot his name) back slap is worth so much scrutiny.

I mentioned it in post 886, But no comment from anyone.

Some members on here only see what they want to see.

Yes I did see it and you have a point.

However, two considerations:

1. The Thai cop was probably taking his cue from Howard who made the first slap from behind. He could hardly then be criticised if the volunteer leader had set the ground rules as it were.

2. Whatever the Thai did does not excuse Howard.

[caf]

Isn't it funny how some people never seem to outgrow that 'police are scum' mentality. I'm sure we all know that guy/girl who always got into trouble with the police, but it was never their fault. With the average age of thai visa members (103 +-) you'd think the troublemakers had grown up but aparantly not.

I have never met these tourist cops, but anyone who's willing to deal with british lager louts, hooligans, german fetishists and thai ladyboys on a daily basis deserves some respect!

As you say you've never them.

[KhunAussie52]

So,you get a few bad apples......just like any other organization. The T.P.V has only been around a few years.....give them a break!!

I am sure that any constructive criticism about operational procedures and recruitment, would be listened too.

So for those who genuinely care.get in contact with Howard or any other of the volunteers...........Then make your point!!!

[cyb]

just in case no one mentioned it, did you see when the thai police officer slapped the suspected thief on the stomach? I hardly think the bald farangs (sorry, forgot his name) back slap is worth so much scrutiny.

I mentioned it in post 886, But no comment from anyone.

Some members on here only see what they want to see.

Yes I did see it and you have a point.

However, two considerations:

1. The Thai cop was probably taking his cue from Howard who made the first slap from behind. He could hardly then be criticised if the volunteer leader had set the ground rules as it were.

2. Whatever the Thai did does not excuse Howard.

The thai cop at the full moon party did what he did well before Howards act.

Also he has most likely never set eyes on howard.

[caf]

just in case no one mentioned it, did you see when the thai police officer slapped the suspected thief on the stomach? I hardly think the bald farangs (sorry, forgot his name) back slap is worth so much scrutiny.

I mentioned it in post 886, But no comment from anyone.

Some members on here only see what they want to see.

Yes I did see it and you have a point.

However, two considerations:

1. The Thai cop was probably taking his cue from Howard who made the first slap from behind. He could hardly then be criticised if the volunteer leader had set the ground rules as it were.

2. Whatever the Thai did does not excuse Howard.

The thai cop at the full moon party did what he did well before Howards act.

Also he has most likely never set eyes on howard.

I was not aware of that. My comment was based on the clip I saw which was specific on who started it. Whether he knew Howard or not neither you nor I know for sure.

[caf]

So,you get a few bad apples......just like any other organization. The T.P.V has only been around a few years.....give them a break!!

I am sure that any constructive criticism about operational procedures and recruitment, would be listened too.

So for those who genuinely care.get in contact with Howard or any other of the volunteers...........Then make your point!!!

More than a few bad apples I fear. Thai policing is hardly a "hub of good policing"

And your comparison with other organisations - do you mean police volunteers in other countries? Again, I would not agree. Other forces are much more professional most of the time and their vetting procedures more thorough.

The Tpv was set up in 1974 hardly a few years (as you try to spin)

And as for being listened to. Is it a Thai trait to listen to another person's opinion particularly a foreigner. Face is too important for that

[cyb]

I was not aware of that. My comment was based on the clip I saw which was specific on who started it. Whether he knew Howard or not neither you nor I know for sure.

I admit that was an assumption of mine based on the fact that koh phangan and pattaya are some distance apart.

But i am sure howard could clear that little point up for us.

[DLock]

i think it would be fair to say that the thai police force is one of the most corrupt and unjust anywhere in the world, who would want to assist them, and for what reason is beyond me.------ ps before you start whinging howard and his assistants are only doing it help the tourists,--- yeh rite --- get a life

No one is debating the merits, or lack thereof the Thai police. There is probably not much disagreement on that angle.

However, I am not connecting why you you think a TPV would want to join to "assist them"? What makes you think that? Is it your vast experience with the TPV, or just your dislike of authority that colors your opinion?

I don't think anyone is whinging about "howard and his assistants are only doing it help the tourists"...that's my opinion based on the people I know in the TPV having spent some time with them (in Phuket) and seeing what they have to deal with.

As to you last comment of "get a life". Do you think that helps validate your opinion, or makes you look silly? Just asking.

[Mark Wolfe]

I think that the "cops" might be of some use if there is no other actual law enforcement there at all.

As I said before, the most glaring thing for me is the way the volunteers strut around, intimidating those around them.

It seems to me that a policing force can be viewed as "pigs" or as "our friends." It seems from some of the posts here that others feel uncomfortable with them around, which does not serve the greater good.

I think that the policing force should be trying to set an example for all to see and macing a ladyboy out of uniform and off duty and apparently doing so without consequences raises eyebrows and questions. Smacking a harmless drunk for no other reason than the volunteer is tired of dealing with him is unprofessional and is assault. Slugging the same drunk for no reason at all (after he was in the van) other than because you were angry that he drunkenly took the car keys is unprofessional and is assault.

Is that not clear? Law enforcement -- professionals, that is -- don't hit people out of frustration or anger.

All I am really saying is that constructively, the volunteers should reassess the way they conduct themselves and try to put on a kinder, less arrogant and egotistical air. They should also attempt to adhere to professional law enforcement guidelines and not act as authorized vigilantes.

I have yet to hear any official explanation as to why the foreigners are there "policing" Walking Street. I can't imagine the real Thai police saying, "Well, we are corrupt and incompetent, so let's have foreigners do it." Or is it that the actual Thai police think that foreigners are so odious that they can't be bothered dealing with them?

[cyb]

I think that the "cops" might be of some use if there is no other actual law enforcement there at all.

As I said before, the most glaring thing for me is the way the volunteers strut around, intimidating those around them.

It seems to me that a policing force can be viewed as "pigs" or as "our friends." It seems from some of the posts here that others feel uncomfortable with them around, which does not serve the greater good.

I think that the policing force should be trying to set an example for all to see and macing a ladyboy out of uniform and off duty and apparently doing so without consequences raises eyebrows and questions. Smacking a harmless drunk for no other reason than the volunteer is tired of dealing with him is unprofessional and is assault. Slugging the same drunk for no reason at all (after he was in the van) other than because you were angry that he drunkenly took the car keys is unprofessional and is assault.

Is that not clear? Law enforcement -- professionals, that is -- don't hit people out of frustration or anger.

All I am really saying is that constructively, the volunteers should reassess the way they conduct themselves and try to put on a kinder, less arrogant and egotistical air. They should also attempt to adhere to professional law enforcement guidelines and not act as authorized vigilantes.

I have yet to hear any official explanation as to why the foreigners are there "policing" Walking Street. I can't imagine the real Thai police saying, "Well, we are corrupt and incompetent, so let's have foreigners do it." Or is it that the actual Thai police think that foreigners are so odious that they can't be bothered dealing with them?

You are implying that the thai guy that hit the man whilst in the van was a police officer.

I cannot see in any post that says he was, All i can see is that Howard said that the guy in question was arrested for assault later.

Edited September 27, 2009 by cyb

[Mark Wolfe]

You may be right. I was under the impression that he was some Thai associated with law enforcement, or the driver or something. He was not "arrested" on film for the blow, and I have my doubts if anyone actually followed up on that, in spite of what Howard says. They may have told him that the guy would be charged, but if so, why was he not immediately detained by Howard right then?

[cyb]

I think that the "Is that not clear? Law enforcement -- professionals, that is -- don't hit people out of frustration or anger.

But they do it does not matter what country they are from.

Try doing a good search on youtube and enlighten yourself, You will see much worse than you have seen on this program.

[cyb]

You may be right. I was under the impression that he was some Thai associated with law enforcement, or the driver or something. He was not "arrested" on film for the blow, and I have my doubts if anyone actually followed up on that, in spite of what Howard says. They may have told him that the guy would be charged, but if so, why was he not immediately detained by Howard right then?

Please remember Howard had no control over the editing of the episode. Maybe it was filmed and not included for screening.

There really is to much hearsay and assumptions without proof on this thread.

[samran]

have no sympathy whatsoever for most of the 'victim's' shown in episode one. Apart from the consul, the only other people who seem to come across well are the tourist police...but I know there is a TV hate squad for them too.

Jet ski guys are a little scary though...If what comes out of this is exposure of potential scams, well and good. Compulsory insurance for jet ski's, like when you hire a car is a great idea.

[cyb]

have no sympathy whatsoever for most of the 'victim's' shown in episode one. Apart from the consul, the only other people who seem to come across well are the tourist police...but I know there is a TV hate squad for them too.

Jet ski guys are a little scary though...If what comes out of this is exposure of potential scams, well and good. Compulsory insurance for jet ski's, like when you hire a car is a great idea.

Also what better way to open the eyes of tourists so they can best avoid the scams.

If tourism drops due to this program the only people to blame are the scammers no one else.

[KhunAussie52]

The TPV was set up 2005,get you facts right please

There are no police volunteers in other countries to the best of my knowledge.

Maybe a few night following a TPV around might enlighten you as to there duties

attached is the application form for the TPV.

http://www.phuket-tourist-police-volunteer...CATION_FORM.pdf

I suggest you read it!!!

[Mark Wolfe]

But they do it does not matter what country they are from.

I didn't say this never happens elsewhere, just that to be wholly professional, it ought not to, anywhere.

[Mark Wolfe]

Maybe a few night following a TPV around might enlighten you as to there duties

attached is the application form for the TPV.

http://www.phuket-tourist-police-volunteer...CATION_FORM.pdf

I suggest you read it!!!

I read it. So? It tells me nothing. Nowhere does it state any requirements, just asks the applicant, "What do you want to do in a Tourist Police Volunteer position?"

[DLock]

Mark, if you have another perspective on the TPV's "strutting around and intimidating people" then I can respect that, but I don't see it on Tourist Trouble and to be honest, my experience is that while they do walk with an air of authority (which is a good thing), I have seen them helpful on many occasions and never seen anything I would consider negative.

I do like your line about the Thai police saying "Well, we are corrupt and incompetent, so let's have foreigners do it." Funny.

My take is that Thai police would admit that they don't have the communication skills to deal with foreigners, at least not at the street cop level, and are more than happy to let the foreigners do the street work.

But I also wonder about what Thai cops really think of the TPV?

[KhunAussie52]

The concept of Tourist Police is unique to Thailand. Its role is to provide security and protection to both Thai and international tourists. They can be called upon in all kinds of situations where a tourist gets into difficulties, including traffic accidents, theft or disputes with hotels or shopkeepers.

Sometimes the language skills of Tourist Police officers are limited, and that’s when members of the Volunteers’ Group will be brought in. The volunteers on Koh Samui are all expats living on the island, and between them speak English, German, French, Russian, Hebrew, Korean and seven other languages.

The women in the team have provided extraordinary support to female tourists, including rape victims. Fortunately, confrontations between visitors and local Thais are not a major problem on Koh Samui.

“The role of the Tourist Police is not to police the tourists, but to act as a cultural bridge,” says Kelly. But as tourism in Thailand grows in leaps and bounds, do tourists need to take lessons in the art of being good guests?

story by Graham Simmons......28th February 2009

[KhunAussie52]

"do tourists need to take lessons in the art of being good guests?"

A good question!!!!

[cyb]

"do tourists need to take lessons in the art of being good guests?"

A good question!!!!

The answer to that for most not all is a very big Yes

[samran]

Mark, if you have another perspective on the TPV's "strutting around and intimidating people" then I can respect that, but I don't see it on Tourist Trouble and to be honest, my experience is that while they do walk with an air of authority (which is a good thing), I have seen them helpful on many occasions and never seen anything I would consider negative.

I do like your line about the Thai police saying "Well, we are corrupt and incompetent, so let's have foreigners do it." Funny.

My take is that Thai police would admit that they don't have the communication skills to deal with foreigners, at least not at the street cop level, and are more than happy to let the foreigners do the street work.

But I also wonder about what Thai cops really think of the TPV?

bit of a rethorical question? The TPV wouldn't be in existence with your the RTP sanctioning them, and they wouldn't gave grown if the RTP didn't think they served a useful purpose.

My experience with most government agencies is that they'd love to be able to communicate better. People here complain about Thai's not liking to lose face, which is true. What people don't realise is that Thai people generally realise that they do lose face if they can't communicate properly, come across to the foreginer as stupid etc.

[Mark Wolfe]

So Thais are the only nationality that feels so at sea with non-Thais they have to recruit foreigners to do their police work? Absurd.