Beggars Banquet

[sunholidaysun1]

Perhaps the 10% also includes the foreign asians - then it makes more sense..........the minor point I am making is that the people on this thread who are claiming horror at the 'use' of ladies as a 'product' by farang....should perhaps look closer to home regarding the perpetuation of the male entertainment industry here in Thailand..........

Well Said .

[dkstoney]

They come INTO your bar and don't make a purchase? They are taking money that could be going to you. Toss the lot of 'em out on their ears! Then hire a Thai to work the door and chase off the undesirables.

[Geekfreaklover]

My local Thai Bar gets many beggars . First there are the children selling naff unscented wilting roses , not only one time in the evening but a steady stream of them from 8pm until about 1 am . They are all ages from about 5 - 12 years old. They can see flowers already on the bar or being held by a bar girl , so in love with the man who bought one for her from the previous child who was in , so why do they keep on asking ?

Then later , in comes the man on crutches with a leg missing , holding a cup out and saying nothing. I have been tempted to pour a bit of my Leo in there , but had 2nd thoughts, just as well with the price of Leo these days.

Then we have the 2 peice Orchestra , the blind man with his trusted guide leading him to every bar in town. He has an Amplifier strapped to his chest , a Mic attached also , and stands in the bar regardless of what music is being played in the bar , and sings along to the music bellowing out of his Amp. The old dear propping him up also has a cup in hand and slowly taking him with her , stops at every farang in the bar. However, hes the only one I see farangs dipping into their 5 bht of change just to get them out the way .

Then theres the aging twins, these two are mountain people , Acka I think. They must be in their 70's either that or they have had a hard life .

With Beetle nut stained lips and teeth , they look like they have just devoured a sick buffalo and look a bit scary .

When this is happening every night and contstantly being badgered for dosh it gets really annoying . I am sure we have all dipped into our pockets and given , knowing their plight . Now I turn away from them and ignore but at the same time feel a little bit guilty . What are your thoughts on this ?

This is Thailand. Drink at home, or in your own country, and spare a thought for those less well off than you are.

What a original response.

Yes, what a moronic response So if you happen to be hit by a truck travelling on the wrong side of the road at 150kmph then we can say 'get over it - This is Thailand"

We all know that it would be the farangs fault for 'being in the road'

[mauGR1]

Yes it is quite surprising the way the beggars are so desperate as to continually approach the insensitive,niggardly,hard hearted,mean farang......just gluttons for punishment I guess......because clearly they would get a much better response from local people?

Well,i think we know,and they know,people on holiday are happy and give more easily..And they know they can get sometimes the odd drunk tourist that give them a 100 B. note

[edgarfriendly]

i hand out 100s and im never drunk! nor do i ever 'rent' people, unless taxi drivers count. i tip them if im in the mood too.

ef

beggars annoying non beggars?? how dis-courteous of them!!

i've met so many ppl who think and behave this way, whats to be done?

the ignorance of the 'educated' sickens me.

E2A = giving a beggar a single baht is a pisstake! worse than nothing in my eyes.

Edited August 31, 2009 by edgarfriendly

[rgs2001uk]

Must be a newbie still in the honeymoon period of Thailand. That's their usual response.

Don't give to beggars. It doesn't help and it perpetuates the practice.

If you check the number of posts and the date below the username you can see Dbrenn is not a newbie..BTW i think he/she's a Thai(or not?)While often i disagree with his/her opinions,i fully agree on this one.I admit that when i was sitting in bars i was slightly bored with beggars,actually i was feeling guilty paying 100 for a drink,which is 3 or 4 meals for the average poor guy.Yes,i know about the beggars mafia,but everybody have to eat..If you don't like to give,don't give,live and let live

Don't let the Thai flag fool you, I would be very surprised if the poster is a Thai. The writing is too fluent. And if he were then the 'if you don't like it go home' could be seens xenaphobic...wait a minute? -

Anyways its beside the point..

If you don't want to give money to a beggar then don't give money to a beggar - no need to go home.

Some people really need to get off of their high horse once in a while.

I find it rather comical that you assume that Thais can't write English fluently. Some are very well educated.

Well I am Thai, and all I was saying was:

1) There is absolutely nothing that the OP can do about beggars. They congregate wherever tourists do. If the OP finds them so intolerable, then he is perhaps better off in a place where they are controlled, i.e. a private place like his home, or in his home country

2) This indeed is Thailand, and there is nothing whatsoever that you, the OP or I can do to change it. Beggars, being part of Thailand, must therefore be tolerated. resenting their presence is an exercise in utter futility

3) Sitting in a girlie bar while showing contempt for those less well off is rather an unpleasant way to behave, and shows a lack of compassion for ones fellow men and women. The girls in the bar are also less well off than the OP, on a par with the beggar were it not for their physical attractiveness, but the OP tolerates their presence. The beggars, human beings none the less, are the object of the OP's contempt simply because he can't take advantage of them and they are asking his charity for no return of sexual favour. What does the OP really add to the good of society?

Thailand is better off if people like this do go home

Correct me if I am wrong, but my understanding is the beggars do not even get to keep the money. Rather, it goes to the organized gangs who kidnap these children, maim and/or drug them and force them into a life of begging or selling items on the street.

If you feel the need to truly help the poor, give to the local Wat or an established, respected charity (such as the Duang Pretheep Foundation) which actually do something to help the poor aside from force them to beg.

dbrenn,

Yes, it is highly unfortunate the Thai authorities won't do anything to stop this reprehensible practice. If only foolish people would stop giving them money, then maybe it would not occur. Thailand, however, would be MUCH better off if the Thais actually did something about the less fortunate and other bad situations, instead of saying it will never be fixed and keeping their head in the sand.

Well said Furbie, however I fell this being Thailand its only an illusion.

As long as too many people are getting rich out of it nothing will happen.

In the past week I have witnessed,

a, at most 4 year old beggar girl being hit by a taxi,

an elephant handler hitting a farang not once but twice because he refused to buy overpriced bags of bananas for the elephant,

gobstopper man cursing and swearing at every farang within earshot, blaming them for his woes, what an advert for Amazing Thailand, I feel sure the TAT could find him a role more suited to his talents.

Beggars must be tolerated, my ass, ask yourself why these people exist in the first place and do something about it.

Why do these poor unfortunates never appear in RCA or some of the other more upmarket Thai areas?

[dbrenn]

As for the mafia running the nana bar girl scene. You are incorrect as far as i gather.

Just arrived, have you? There are some good ones, but many of the police behave like mafia in uniform. The extort protection money from girlie bars and from nightspots in general. How do the bar girls get there? You imply that they all choose to be there to serve the likes of foreign tourists, but it isn't that simple. The bars are run by businesses that traffick people from the provinces to work in them, sometimes by encouragement of the naiive, sometimes by coercion if debts are involved, and some do join the sex trade willingly just as in the western world. Some bars are run by the Thai mafia, others by westerners who are no better in many cases than the Thai mafia, others by farangs who married a hooker, and still others by farangs who are trying (often in vain) to make money out of it. For your information, Thais smile for a variety of reasons, and not always because they are happy. If you think that bar girls enjoy being taken advantage of by drunken and repulsive tourists just because they are smiling, then you really don't know anything at all about Thailand or its people, and you may be disappointed when you learn enough Thai to find out what the mainstream really thinks deep down.

But the majority of women working in the tourist areas are by no means slaves to mafia run operations. Contrary to the majority of beggars who are.

Wow! What great research, supported by such compelling evidence. Ah yes, all the deformed beggars have been made that way by the mafia, and none have stepped on a landmine.

How on earth do you know that? Do you go around asking all the beggars who manages them and how they lost their legs? Do you do the same for all the bargirls, asking them what motivates them? Even if bar girls might in some cases not be a slave to a specific bar, many are slaves to the industry through often tragic personal circumstances, and hate being there. Likewise for the beggars.

You mentioned elsewhere that I don't need to be an expert in psychology to understand why you would pay a bar girl but not a beggar, and I do understand your point. You can use the bargirl's miserable situation for your gratification, but not that of the beggar.

Edited September 1, 2009 by dbrenn

[MiG16]

Im going to ask everyone to stop with the personal attacks.

any more of those and the posters will be issued with warnings, possibly suspension of posting rights.

also, if no civil discussion on this topic can continue, then the thread will be closed.

your choice

[Geekfreaklover]

As for the mafia running the nana bar girl scene. You are incorrect as far as i gather.

Just arrived, have you? There are some good ones, but many of the police behave like mafia in uniform. The extort protection money from girlie bars and from nightspots in general. How do the bar girls get there? You imply that they all choose to be there to serve the likes of foreign tourists, but it isn't that simple. The bars are run by businesses that traffick people from the provinces to work in them, sometimes by encouragement of the naiive, sometimes by coercion if debts are involved, and some do join the sex trade willingly just as in the western world. Some bars are run by the Thai mafia, others by westerners who are no better in many cases than the Thai mafia, others by farangs who married a hooker, and still others by farangs who are trying (often in vain) to make money out of it. For your information, Thais smile for a variety of reasons, and not always because they are happy. If you think that bar girls enjoy being taken advantage of by drunken and repulsive tourists just because they are smiling, then you really don't know anything at all about Thailand or its people, and you may be disappointed when you learn enough Thai to find out what the mainstream really thinks deep down.

But the majority of women working in the tourist areas are by no means slaves to mafia run operations. Contrary to the majority of beggars who are.

Wow! What great research, supported by such compelling evidence. Ah yes, all the deformed beggars have been made that way by the mafia, and none have stepped on a landmine.

How on earth do you know that? Do you go around asking all the beggars who manages them and how they lost their legs? Do you do the same for all the bargirls, asking them what motivates them? Even if bar girls might in some cases not be a slave to a specific bar, many are slaves to the industry through often tragic personal circumstances, and hate being there. Likewise for the beggars.

You mentioned elsewhere that I don't need to be an expert in psychology to understand why you would pay a bar girl but not a beggar, and I do understand your point. You can use the bargirl's miserable situation for your gratification, but not that of the beggar.

I have no idea where you get your concepts from. Maybe we are living in different cities.

No, I haven't just arrived. And I don't really need you to tell me what I already know. It's a personal decision to give to beggars or not. Lets leave it there.

Edited September 1, 2009 by Geekfreaklover

[ageless]

I met a fake monk last week. . .one of those who dresses differently from the typical Thai monk who ( at 4:30 in the afternoon) should be in his temple anyway. He was probably from Burma or Laos . . .or just Thai and working the streets.

Anyway, he held out his cup to me and it had several bills in it. I was passing a bar at the time with a couple of bar-girls within earshot. Without flinching or thinking, I said "Mai ao Khap". And moved on. I realized immediately that I had told him "I dont want any" or "Dont want/need". The bar girls had a good laugh and I giggled about it for days afterwards.

I have one ancient legless beggar who I ALWAYS greet and give to. He smiles and says hello and seems to recognize me when I am headed in his direction. I believe he is on his own . .but who knows. The flower kids are part of a larger business. I have seen them dropped off by adults with nice motorcycles and cell phones. I believe the women with babies in Bkk have either bought the babies or rented them for a cut of the take and are "managed" to maximize somebody elses profits. Not peculiar to Thailand certainly . .common in India too I understand.

[lioness]

I have no problems with giving a few Baht to beggars, however I shall be more selective in future, just last week I am at my local market where for many years I have given regularly to an elderley man who gets around the market on a kind of skateboard, I believed he couldn't walk until I arrived early last week to see him walking into the market to get set up with his wheels tucked under his arm.... I have been here long enough to know better, however my husband is Thai and the old bloke had him conned too.

My pet hate is not the beggars in the restaraunts but the lottery ticket sellers who come and shove the box right in your face.

[sunholidaysun1]

I think we all agree about the plight of the poor people of Thailand however as you all know , the more you give the more they come back. We can all have sympathy and understanding and have all possibly given from time to time, but it is annoying to be contstantly harrassed into guilt in order for those to gain again and again and again. There are millions around the world who are far worse off than the beggars of Thailand and dont have the option to beg, yet all seem to have somewhere to live and are clothed and fed. I cant say I have seen any in Thailand without a roof over their heads and as thin as rakes due to no food.

There are poor people yes and many scam artists .

As we are also talking about beggars that work for someone else and most of the money they collect goes to the boss. I can say I know of this and what I have seen is a Foreigner driving a pickup full of flower girls , dropping them off at the bar area where I live and then for him(the foreigner) to sit in a bar and have a beer while they do the rounds. This particular man I have only seen once doing this , but it makes me wonder if he is really the man behind this in my town ? Shame on him if he is !!

[dbrenn]

I have no idea where you get your concepts from. Maybe we are living in different cities.

No, I haven't just arrived. And I don't really need you to tell me what I already know. It's a personal decision to give to beggars or not. Lets leave it there.

I don't care whether people give money to bargirls, beggars or both. This is a personal choice, so long as one recognises that both are members of the human race, and both are working in equally desperate situations and deserve sympathy, respect and kindness.

But I'm curious. Which 'concept' are you referring to in your above reply? The one about the police acting like the mafia and extorting protection money from bars? Or, the one about the mafia acting like police and extorting money from beggars? Or both?

You were telling me that only the police take money from bars, and that the mafia take money from the beggars, and you use this premise as a reason to justify that bars are OK and that beggars are not. Please explain the difference, and how regional variations affect the way in which the mafia and the police operate.

[onnut]

Beggars who walk around with there hand out annoy me, it does not matter which country they are from and where they are, I just have no time for people who expect money for nothing. however, if they are trying to make a living by cleaning shoes or windscreens, selling little trinkets or something like that then I do not mind giving.

Isee a one legged guy on Rama 4 while I am on the way to work everyday, he looks like he scares the <deleted> out of most people, he just thrusts his cup into your face and scowls, or taps on your window and does the same. now he might have one leg but he sure as hel_l can work or try selling something I am sure. why doesnt he try cleaning the windscreens? at least then he is earning some money.

anyway, I do give to certain less well off beings quite often, but I do not give to people who could work for money when they are too lazy to work for a living. I know plenty of Thais who live on 5-7k a month and I bet these beggars earn more then that!

[Geekfreaklover]

I have no idea where you get your concepts from. Maybe we are living in different cities.

No, I haven't just arrived. And I don't really need you to tell me what I already know. It's a personal decision to give to beggars or not. Lets leave it there.

I don't care whether people give money to bargirls, beggars or both. This is a personal choice, so long as one recognises that both are members of the human race, and both are working in equally desperate situations and deserve sympathy, respect and kindness.

But I'm curious. Which 'concept' are you referring to in your above reply? The one about the police acting like the mafia and extorting protection money from bars? Or, the one about the mafia acting like police and extorting money from beggars? Or both?

You were telling me that only the police take money from bars, and that the mafia take money from the beggars, and you use this premise as a reason to justify that bars are OK and that beggars are not. Please explain the difference, and how regional variations affect the way in which the mafia and the police operate.

The 'concept' i was reffering to was your concept that beggars and bargirls are both put in their situation by equally dramatic circumstances. I disagree.

The bargirl working in a tourist area usually has a choice, the beggar often doesn't. The beggar is put there, the bargirl made a choice to go there.

Moreover, I was simply pointing out that the beggars that are working in the tourist areas are more often than not put there and employed by organised cirminals operating in these areas. They have little choice but to work due to their physical condition (blind, limbless etc) or their age. Companies can not legally employ children.

Whereas the women that work the bars in tourist areas are more often than not there from their own free will. They could work in a factory, an office or a hospital but they choose not to. Maybe this is to do with family pressure or their own greed to make money doing what they like doing best.

It's a matter of choice. Which is the gift we all have. I choose not to give money to beggars or bargirls. Others do. That is their choice.

On a personal note. One of my employess was subject to horrific burns she recieved when she was six months old in a household fire. No company would employ here as 'your contry' does not employ people with major disfigurements, despite a university dgree and post grad studies. I was shocked when she was offered a job to work on the streets begging for money for 200 bt a day. I have now employed her for over two years and she is an excellent employee.

Edited September 1, 2009 by Geekfreaklover

[perousing]

everyone can have ther own opinion that's what foram's are for, but what i am reading here i cant understand, these " beggers " (with there hand out ) are seriously disabled or very disadvantaged people do you think they want to be walking around bars like this. GO AND GET A LIFE what's that old phrase YOU BUNCH OF CHEAP CHARLIES and yes its up to you, give or not

[harleyclarkey]

I see what your saying - but 10% is way too high. Why do westerners keep thinking that they invented prostitution? They have been at it for years all over the place.

Exactly...we are not the big heros here with big fat....???

No...just big fat wallets.

[harleyclarkey]

everyone can have ther own opinion that's what foram's are for, but what i am reading here i cant understand, these " beggers " (with there hand out ) are seriously disabled or very disadvantaged people do you think they want to be walking around bars like this. GO AND GET A LIFE what's that old phrase YOU BUNCH OF CHEAP CHARLIES and yes its up to you, give or not

Yep....give them loads of baht. Then watch them swarm all over you....in the bars, the streets, the shops, the beaches, everywhere. You won't have a moments peace. Many, if not all, of the kids you see are being manipulated by their elders and are mere cannon fodder for these scum.

You will teach them to only beg for a living. The ONLY way to help a beggar is through a NGO. Or, go and help them out yourself?

I am not a cheap charlie....just a realist as to what really goes on.

[onnut]

everyone can have ther own opinion that's what foram's are for, but what i am reading here i cant understand, these " beggers " (with there hand out ) are seriously disabled or very disadvantaged people do you think they want to be walking around bars like this. GO AND GET A LIFE what's that old phrase YOU BUNCH OF CHEAP CHARLIES and yes its up to you, give or not

thats what they are, Beggars with there hands out wanting money for nothing. why would I be a cheap charlie? I give plenty to those who also try to help themselves. I saw a guy missing a leg and he was still working, suit on and a laptop bag, I dont see him asking for handouts. now of course the guy on Rama 4 did not have the opportunity to get an education, but he does not need one to clean windscreens or sell flowers. why would I give him moey just coz he thrusts his cup at my window and scowls? if he attempted to clean my windscreen I would give him some money and say thanks with a smile.

I can remember giving 100 baht to a little boy who was missing an arm down Silom way a few years back, and as soon as I gave it to him some ars64ole of a parent or uncle or just some skidmark of a guy who had "borrowed him" took the 100 baht off him and pushed him back into place to keep begging. so I would also agree that there are some beggars out there run by maffia sorts and why would I want to put money into there pockets?

[perousing]

everyone can have ther own opinion that's what foram's are for, but what i am reading here i cant understand, these " beggers " (with there hand out ) are seriously disabled or very disadvantaged people do you think they want to be walking around bars like this. GO AND GET A LIFE what's that old phrase YOU BUNCH OF CHEAP CHARLIES and yes its up to you, give or not

Yep....give them loads of baht. Then watch them swarm all over you....in the bars, the streets, the shops, the beaches, everywhere. You won't have a moments peace. Many, if not all, of the kids you see are being manipulated by their elders and are mere cannon fodder for these scum.

You will teach them to only beg for a living. The ONLY way to help a beggar is through a NGO. Or, go and help them out yourself?

I am not a cheap charlie....just a realist as to what really goes on.

nobody is asking for loads of baht, i am very sure if you gave them 5 or 10 baht it would be well appreciated, or dont give this is up to you, the kids you see are usually selling something they are not beggers, but i agree with you sometimes a nuisance and are "manipulated by scum" but these children dont have an option this is a serious goverment issue that has been ignored for a very long time. yes sometimes i do help them myself, as i said before only 5 or 10 baht is better than the bull sh-it you hear here

[Oberkommando]

Why should foreigners be expected to care for them when the Thais don't?

[mauGR1]

Why should foreigners be expected to care for them when the Thais don't?

I think nobody said that foreigners "should take care" of the beggars in Thailand.

BTW when i had a small accident slipping with my motorbike some Thais stopped to help me,so according to your logic they shouldn't have stop to help me because i am a foreigner?

[Geekfreaklover]

I find it rather comical that you assume that Thais can't write English fluently. Some are very well educated.

Well I am Thai, and all I was saying was:

1) There is absolutely nothing that the OP can do about beggars. They congregate wherever tourists do. If the OP finds them so intolerable, then he is perhaps better off in a place where they are controlled, i.e. a private place like his home, or in his home country

2) This indeed is Thailand, and there is nothing whatsoever that you, the OP or I can do to change it. Beggars, being part of Thailand, must therefore be tolerated. Resenting their presence is an exercise in utter futility

3) Sitting in a girlie bar while showing contempt for those less well off is rather an unpleasant way to behave, and shows a lack of compassion for one's fellow men and women. The girls in the bar are also less well off than the OP, on a par with the beggar were it not for their physical attractiveness, but the OP tolerates their presence. The beggars, human beings none the less, are the object of the OP's contempt simply because he can't take advantage of them and they are asking his charity for no return of sexual favour. What does this say about the nature of the OP's character, and what does this say about the value of his contribution to the good of society?

Thailand is better off if people like this do go home

No you are not Thai. You may have obtained Thai citizenship, but you are not Thai. Remember that.

[onnut]

No you are not Thai. You may have obtained Thai citizenship, but you are not Thai. Remember that.

great one, peeps should remember what other topics they posted on before replying to other topics about the same topics, if you get what I mean. its late

great one geekfreaklover.

[IanForbes]

If you spend any length of time in any non western culture country you come to realize that you can't help everyone in need. All you can do is help a few help themselves. The rest will just have to survive on their own. There are too many needy people in the world, and the wealthy in those countries who have the most problems are too greedy and won't share. There is no social security for the poor in Asia. All they have for support is their own family. Unfortunately, there is the heartless mafia who use the poor for their own evil profit. Most of us who have spent any length of time in Asia have seen the mafia run system and after a while we just ignore the beggers.

[dbrenn]

No you are not Thai. You may have obtained Thai citizenship, but you are not Thai. Remember that.

What nonsense. Just like the rest of your social commentary in this thread, you are again talking from a position of inexperience - you have only been a non-Thai in Thailand, and you have never been a Thai coz I bet you don't qualify to be one, so whadda you know? Enlighten me!

The King approved my application, and my Thai passport and ID card mean that I get all the benefits that the locals do. Since becoming Thai, the locals treat me like one of them, so who cares what you think? .

Are you discriminated against by the locals? If so, ask yourself why and do something about it mate.

Edited September 1, 2009 by dbrenn

[dbrenn]

Why should foreigners be expected to care for them when the Thais don't?

I think nobody said that foreigners "should take care" of the beggars in Thailand.

BTW when i had a small accident slipping with my motorbike some Thais stopped to help me,so according to your logic they shouldn't have stop to help me because i am a foreigner?

That's right - comtrary to most of the assumptions that people make with little knowledge of Thailand, the Thais are actually very charitable people. I once read an interview in the paper of a farang beggar. He was doing very well from the charity of the locals, and one had even given him 5,000 Baht to help him with his trip home. Now, this guy was not mafia run or anything like that - he was just scrounging so that he could stay longer. Most Thais will certainly help out if they can, unlike a lot of foreign tourists who, as you correctly pointed out earlier, would fight over 10 Baht having just blown 2,000 on a hooker.

People who whitewash Thais as misers, beggars as mafia employees, and bar girls as happy people, really don't know anything about life or Thailand.

[dbrenn]

The 'concept' i was reffering to was your concept that beggars and bargirls are both put in their situation by equally dramatic circumstances. I disagree.

The bargirl working in a tourist area usually has a choice, the beggar often doesn't. The beggar is put there, the bargirl made a choice to go there.

Bargirls are there for a variery of reasons. Some by choice. Many with families to support who have no other recourse. Some are alcoholics or drug addicts, some are victims of violent or deadbeat husbands. Of course, we see the physical reasons why the beggars are there, but the psychological reasons that put the bargirls there are not obvious by looking at them. To say that the above amounts to a 'choice' is a gross oversimplification, and indicates a lack of knowledge or worse, a rationalisation.

Moreover, I was simply pointing out that the beggars that are working in the tourist areas are more often than not put there and employed by organised cirminals operating in these areas. They have little choice but to work due to their physical condition (blind, limbless etc) or their age. Companies can not legally employ children.

I agree that nobody should send kids out to work. But how do you know that they are all on the mafia payroll, whereas the bargirls aren't. Quite simply, you don't know, and you are guessing.

On a personal note. One of my employess was subject to horrific burns she recieved when she was six months old in a household fire. No company would employ here as 'your contry' does not employ people with major disfigurements, despite a university dgree and post grad studies. I was shocked when she was offered a job to work on the streets begging for money for 200 bt a day. I have now employed her for over two years and she is an excellent employee.

Well that's very nice of you. Well done. But I take issue with your scathing 'your country' comment, when claiming that only a good foreigner samaritan like yourself would employ a deformed Thai, and the locals wouldn't. Like the rest of what you say in this thread, it simply isn't true. People with deformaties face problems the world over, and I can think of multiple examples where capable Thais with deformaties were employed by local and foreign companies alike.

[dbrenn]

everyone can have ther own opinion that's what foram's are for, but what i am reading here i cant understand, these " beggers " (with there hand out ) are seriously disabled or very disadvantaged people do you think they want to be walking around bars like this. GO AND GET A LIFE what's that old phrase YOU BUNCH OF CHEAP CHARLIES and yes its up to you, give or not

thats what they are, Beggars with there hands out wanting money for nothing. why would I be a cheap charlie? I give plenty to those who also try to help themselves. I saw a guy missing a leg and he was still working, suit on and a laptop bag, I dont see him asking for handouts. now of course the guy on Rama 4 did not have the opportunity to get an education, but he does not need one to clean windscreens or sell flowers. why would I give him moey just coz he thrusts his cup at my window and scowls? if he attempted to clean my windscreen I would give him some money and say thanks with a smile.

I can remember giving 100 baht to a little boy who was missing an arm down Silom way a few years back, and as soon as I gave it to him some ars64ole of a parent or uncle or just some skidmark of a guy who had "borrowed him" took the 100 baht off him and pushed him back into place to keep begging. so I would also agree that there are some beggars out there run by maffia sorts and why would I want to put money into there pockets?

Nice guys! Welcome, and going home soon, Thailand hopes

[473geo]

I see big similarities between ex-farang and ex-smokers.............