Govt Readies Land Policy For Poor Thais

[george]

Community land scheme ready

Cabinet endorsement expected in two weeks

BANGKOK: -- The community land ownership scheme is expected to be endorsed by the cabinet within two weeks, Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva says.

Speaking during his weekly broadcast address yesterday, the prime minister said agencies had finished drafting the community land ownership regulations and they would be submitted for cabinet approval in mid-September.

The Democrats' flagship land policy calls for communities to be given the right to own state land now lying idle. The scheme would benefit more than 1.5 million farmer families, Mr Abhisit said. "I am confident that the scheme will help needy farmers to occupy land plots to grow crops," he said. "They will be allowed to use the land under regulations set by the community."

Mr Abhisit would visit a pilot project in Pathum Thani this week, where idle land owned by state agencies would be allocated to landless farmers.

The government had been working with the Land Reform Network, an alliance of grass-roots groups petitioning for land rights, to solve continuing problems.

Mr Abhisit said the two most pressing problems associated with land ownership were the lack of land for cultivation and disputes between villagers and state agencies.

The idea of granting community land rights over idle state land, instead of to individuals, has long been proposed by grass-roots groups after land issued under a previous government's land reform scheme, known as Sor Por Kor land, fell into the hands of landlords.

Many farmers holding Sor Por Kor land rights sold the rights to non-farmers who turned the documents into title deeds.

Mr Abhisit said granting rights over the land to communities would help tackle the problem of illegal trading in Sor Por Kor deeds that had been given to poor farmers.

About 30 communities across the nation have run community land ownership schemes since 2002, when they seized idle land and issued rules to prevent land sales by individual villagers.

The communities set up a fund to buy land from villagers who no longer wanted the land to prevent it from falling into the hands of outsiders.

Union for Civil Liberty secretary-general and adviser to the Land Reform Network Pairoj Polpetch yesterday backed Mr Abhisit's community land rights policy, saying it was "the right tool to prevent the land from ending up in the hands of wealthy landlords and to promote the community's right to manage the lands".

It was also a promising measure to solve a long-running conflict between forest dwellers and forestry officials.

"It is impossible to move people out of the forest," Mr Pairoj said.

"The best way is to let them live in harmony with the forest. The community land rights will encourage them to use the land in a sustainable fashion."

Mr Pairoj said there were more than 600,000 families living in the forest. In Mae Hong Son, 85% of the population live in forest areas.

-- Bangkok Post 2009-08-31

[hammered]

Land reform of the genuine kind is always a good idea. Lets hope the corruption is minimised as being realsitic it isnt going to be zero. It is good that this suggestion stems from the idea of grassroot groups.

It will be interesting to see which MPs oppose this as parliament is stacked with MPs from rural constituencies who regard them as their personal fiefdom and whose families benfit directly from the status quo.

[bf2002]

hahahahah....it seems that the truth of "yellow" and "red" is coming out....they are just 2 gangs trying to gain control of the country.

Notice that Abhisit and his "democrats", who once claimed Thaksin was buying votes with his populist land schemes, are now doing the exact same thing!

[bf2002]

Land reform of the genuine kind is always a good idea. Lets hope the corruption is minimised as being realsitic it isnt going to be zero. It is good that this suggestion stems from the idea of grassroot groups.

It will be interesting to see which MPs oppose this as parliament is stacked with MPs from rural constituencies who regard them as their personal fiefdom and whose families benfit directly from the status quo.

Are you serious? This isn't some socialist Western nation trying to redistribute land for the "good" of the people by some liberal.

There is no fear of giving away land....it's a payoff to stay in power for the democrats.

They KEEP their power by giving something away....this isn't medieval european politics....it's SE Asian politics....you don't beat down your slaves....you pay them off.

[baht&sold]

The idea of granting community land rights over idle state land, instead of to individuals, has long been proposed by grass-roots groups after land issued under a previous government's land reform scheme, known as Sor Por Kor land, fell into the hands of landlords.

This is self-explanatory. About time too.

Various previous Thaksin govt's land for poor 'schemes' allegedly mostly enriched local land barons, TRT/PPP connected cronies and the poor 'lost the plot'.

Hopefully they 'won't get fooled again'...

[tig28]

Community land scheme ready

Cabinet endorsement expected in two weeks

Congratulations to the Government !! My heartfelt support goes out to an announcement like this. I am far from an admirer of Abhisit

--- but an initiative like this provides some reason to have hope.

Cynics (like myself) shall--- I hope be proven wrong. Abhisist surely should not be criticized for adopting policies which may actually be of benefit to Thailand. The point that this mirrors one of the Thaksin governments policies in no way diminishes the value of adopting genuine land reform for the poor.

[lannarebirth]

These various land schemes, SPK, STK, SGN, PBT span many governments. A lot of rural votes are gained by the promise of implementing the schemes which should have been enacted long ago in most cases. Kudos to the Abhisit government for following through on a promise Thaksin (and prior govts) made and never delivered on.

[lannarebirth]

These various land schemes, SPK, STK, SGN, PBT span many governments. A lot of rural votes are gained by the promise of implementing the schemes which should have been enacted long ago in most cases. Kudos to the Abhisit government for following through on a promise Thaksin (and prior govts) made and never delivered on.

Just my opinion, but what I particularly like about this government, imperfect as it is, it handles these matters solely as a function of good governance. There is none of that sickening rhetoric of Thaksins about "what papa did for his children because he loves them, like they love him". That shit is just pathetic.

Edited August 31, 2009 by lannarebirth

[hammered]

Land reform of the genuine kind is always a good idea. Lets hope the corruption is minimised as being realsitic it isnt going to be zero. It is good that this suggestion stems from the idea of grassroot groups.

It will be interesting to see which MPs oppose this as parliament is stacked with MPs from rural constituencies who regard them as their personal fiefdom and whose families benfit directly from the status quo.

Are you serious? This isn't some socialist Western nation trying to redistribute land for the "good" of the people by some liberal.

There is no fear of giving away land....it's a payoff to stay in power for the democrats.

They KEEP their power by giving something away....this isn't medieval european politics....it's SE Asian politics....you don't beat down your slaves....you pay them off.

Of course the Dems want to gainj electoral advantage by it, but that doesnt make it a bad thing. Community conmtrolled land for farmers to use is not a bad idea.

By the way, cash for clunkers, Japanese cash handouts, tax cuts, universal healthcare etc etc are all examples of how other governments pay off their slaves in the hope of electoral advantage

[givenall]

hahahahah....it seems that the truth of "yellow" and "red" is coming out....they are just 2 gangs trying to gain control of the country.

Notice that Abhisit and his "democrats", who once claimed Thaksin was buying votes with his populist land schemes, are now doing the exact same thing!

Woo you are really slow. I said this many time that “Yellow”, “RED” is not about democracy is about who controls the country.

And “Yellow is the winner!!!!

[hammered]

hahahahah....it seems that the truth of "yellow" and "red" is coming out....they are just 2 gangs trying to gain control of the country.

Notice that Abhisit and his "democrats", who once claimed Thaksin was buying votes with his populist land schemes, are now doing the exact same thing!

Woo you are really slow. I said this many time that “Yellow”, “RED” is not about democracy is about who controls the country.

And “Yellow is the winner!!!!

And Hatoyama just won the Japanese election after promising free education for all. How many right wing and conservative governments win by promising tax cuts?

Not unique to Thailand. Being cynical, in a democracy parties effectively win by promising the most effective bribe to the electorate in many but not all cases.

[Wuffy]

{Humour on}

Now lets sit back and watch how long it takes before we hear accusations that Foreigners own most of the land through poor thai farmers again.

[stumonster]

, are now doing the exact same thing!

maybe you could explain how it is the same ? show us your understanding.

[givenall]

{Humour on}

Now lets sit back and watch how long it takes before we hear accusations that Foreigners own most of the land through poor thai farmers again.

It is funny that most of foreigner I know come over here to have a less hectic life and relax near water, etc. so who are these foreigners how are always after lands?

[baht&sold]

{Humour on}

Now lets sit back and watch how long it takes before we hear accusations that Foreigners own most of the land through poor thai farmers again.

Hmmm... All the recent noise over 'foreign land grab fear' is conveniently coming at a time when red & rural feathers are needed to be ruffled.

Let's see... The Director General of the Land Department Mr Anuwat was appointed by Mr Thaksin's brother in-law's Govt just last Oct, and a rather dubious appt at that. Mr Anuwat 'helpfully' caused quite a stir in May and again last week by stating: "Land purchase through a Thai spouse is forbidden and will be revoked if caught"...

Then there's Deputy Permanent Secretary for Agriculture Mr Thawatchai, who was promoted in the 2004 Thaksin Govt and is currently drafting a bill which will 'assist measures to prohibit foreigners from buying land'. The current Agriculture Minister Theera Wongsamut who is assisting comes from Mr Newin's faction. All worked together in previous Thaksin Govts.

Along with the report by the Thailand Research Fund last week, this all combines to make it difficult for the Foreign Chambers of Commerce in their ongoing lobby for loosening restrictions for foreigners. Abhisit & Korn have been very receptive to the Foreign Chambers lobby but then it stops at Newin's controlling faction's doorstep.

Until such time as any Govt (along with Thaksin/Newin political machines which controls their NE populace like convenient re-useable bond-slaves) decides to seriously make education, access to technology and skills upgrading etc a priority over short-term populism for votes (with 'foreign fear' thrown in if it suits or distracts), sadly nothing will change on the farm (just the way some politicians prefer).

Meanwhile, Abhisit's community land policy, along with long overdue land tax reform (which 'the rich' plus land barons and most politicians do NOT want) which will see tax collected in communities going to fund the communities development, are most welcomed steps in the right direction.

Edited August 31, 2009 by baht&sold

[christcourt]

{Humour on}

Now lets sit back and watch how long it takes before we hear accusations that Foreigners own most of the land through poor thai farmers again.

Hmmm... All the recent noise over 'foreign land grab fear' is conveniently coming at a time when red & rural feathers are needed to be ruffled.

Let's see... The Director General of the Land Department Mr Anuwat was appointed by Mr Thaksin's brother in-law's Govt just last Oct, and a rather dubious appt at that. Mr Anuwat 'helpfully' caused quite a stir in May and again last week by stating: "Land purchase through a Thai spouse is forbidden and will be revoked if caught"...

Then there's Deputy Permanent Secretary for Agriculture Mr Thawatchai, who was promoted in the 2004 Thaksin Govt and is currently drafting a bill which will 'assist measures to prohibit foreigners from buying land'. The current Agriculture Minister Theera Wongsamut who is assisting comes from Mr Newin's faction. All worked together in previous Thaksin Govts.

Along with the report by the Thailand Research Fund last week, this all combines to make it difficult for the Foreign Chambers of Commerce in their ongoing lobby for loosening restrictions for foreigners. Abhisit & Korn have been very receptive to the Foreign Chambers lobby but then it stops at Newin's controlling faction's doorstep.

Until such time as any Govt (along with Thaksin/Newin political machines which controls their NE populace like convenient re-useable bond-slaves) decides to seriously make education, access to technology and skills upgrading etc a priority over short-term populism for votes (with 'foreign fear' thrown in if it suits or distracts), sadly nothing will change on the farm (just the way some politicians prefer).

Meanwhile, Abhisit's community land policy, along with long overdue land tax reform (which 'the rich' plus land barons and most politicians do NOT want) which will see tax collected in communities going to fund the communities development, are most welcomed steps in the right direction.

In the "shortTerm" yes it's a good policy if it gets to the farmers that need it most. I live up near Sakon Nakhon NE and the farmers here are at the "tail end" of any land reforms. The land here doesn't all go to making rice etc as some farmers has been forced to find other types of work in the Cities due to higher costs of farming and not enough land/money to feed their families. Some Farmers end up in debt and it's the Banks [managers] who either take the land or buy the land themselves. The "big Boys" bank managers and company land owners are the ones that are saying "its the Foreigner who's buying land just to throw the government a false track" as thats the easy way.

This Land policy is an old idea and previous governments have tried it before to get the Rural farming communities to back their government But as as I said it'll find its way to the Bank's or Manager's pocket sooner or later.

[Rumfoord]

The idea of granting community land rights over idle state land, instead of to individuals, has long been proposed by grass-roots groups after land issued under a previous government's land reform scheme, known as Sor Por Kor land, fell into the hands of landlords.

This is self-explanatory. About time too.

Various previous Thaksin govt's land for poor 'schemes' allegedly mostly enriched local land barons, TRT/PPP connected cronies and the poor 'lost the plot'.

Hopefully they 'won't get fooled again'...

guess why the the Bangkok Post just speaks of "a previous government's land reform scheme" without naming names?

what makes you you to assume they speak about the cabinets under the PPP and TRT? any examples of famous cases of corruption?

earlier this year a BP journalist showed better memory skills of the sor por kor land scandal, Suthep Thaugsuban and The Democrats and in 1994/95:

the

Democrat-led government led by then prime minister Chuan Leekpai was forced to dissolve the House

after it came under heavy attacks by the Opposition over abuses of the land reform programme.

Then agriculture minister Suthep Thuagsuban was accused of granting sor por kor 4-01 land certificates to rich landlords in Phuket

,

including Tossaporn Vanich, husband of Suthep’s assistant secretary, Mrs Anchalee Vanich. The land reform programme has been suspended since then. Also, the Supreme Court eventually revoked Tossaporn’s sor por kor 4-01 certificates coverning 98 rai of land in Phuket on the ground that the documents were not properly issued because Tossaporn is not an agriculturalist as stipulated in the law.

The sor por kor 4-01 land reform scheme was intended to solve the problem of widespread illegal occupation of state land in forest reserves or national parks by providing land certificates to the land grabbers who are actually landless poor.

The scheme was however badly abused as rich people also grabbed the state land, especially prime plots with commercial prospect,

and tried to claim the land rights.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/13...and-reform-plan

[Felt 35]

Well hope its only fertile farmland then this is a good thing. If it include all idle land then Im afraid its going to be a shack and Karoke bar on any green spot from Hatyai to Chiang Rai.

[Bosse137]

"Community controlled".. Yeah,sounds good..And who,may I ask,controlls the communities..? From my experience,those in control enrich them self all the time with money meant for the community!! Like letting the fox guard the henhouse.How naive are you folks out there; did you just come here or do you all live in the cities.. On another,related note: Nobody forces farmers to sell their land! They do it for many reasons,mostly not related to wether the land is giving profit or not,but for financing a wedding,a funeral,a new car and so on. I know of Many such cases. Afterwards they complain,of course,of how they have been "taken advantage of".

[teetersb]

{Humour on}

Now lets sit back and watch how long it takes before we hear accusations that Foreigners own most of the land through poor thai farmers again.

It is funny that most of foreigner I know come over here to have a less hectic life and relax near water, etc. so who are these foreigners how are always after lands?

Givenall,

Could you please explain what you are saying here? Your first sentence "It is funny that most of foreigner I know come over here to have a less hectic life and relax near water, etc." I understand, but I'm not sure what this means "so who are these foreigners how are always after lands?". Wuffy's post is being satirical about Foreigners, so are you agreeing with Wuffy, or are you asking about Foreigners taking land?

Cheers

[Rumfoord]

Prime Minister Presented the Leasing Contract of State Property to People

Mr. Abhisit Vejjajiva, Prime Minister, presided over the presentation ceremony of the Leasing Contract of State Property under the Food Plants and Renewable Energy Plants Growth on the State Property Project, in which Mr. Korn Chatikavanij, Finance Minister, and Mr. Pruttichai Damrongrat, the deputy Finance Minister, also joined the ceremony and harvested the rice, at State Property and Watnoparattanaram, Pratumthani Province, September 3, 2009.

http://www2.mof.go.th/picture_news_detail.php?id=2324

[hammered]

"Community controlled".. Yeah,sounds good..And who,may I ask,controlls the communities..? From my experience,those in control enrich them self all the time with money meant for the community!! Like letting the fox guard the henhouse.How naive are you folks out there; did you just come here or do you all live in the cities.. On another,related note: Nobody forces farmers to sell their land! They do it for many reasons,mostly not related to wether the land is giving profit or not,but for financing a wedding,a funeral,a new car and so on. I know of Many such cases. Afterwards they complain,of course,of how they have been "taken advantage of".

In this case I think it is being given to community groups to try and remedy problems that have plagued these handouts before rather than why farmers sell their own land. In the past land was made available to farmers but in many cases rich people gave the farmers money to buy the land and then transfer it with a slight profit or rich people just accessed the land by using their power and connections to be "seen" as farmers when the land was handed out. By giving land to community and it being leased not owned they hope to avoid this happening and of course if corruption does occur this time around th government will suffer a backlash as all know the old Dem land scandal. It remains to be seen but lets see how the scheme works before knocking it.

Oh and of course if it does work there is a political bonus for who enacted it.