All Rubber Sapling Defendants Cleared

[Scott]

The main defendants in this case may have only been two--politics and expediency.

[Plus]

I love it "Anybody knows any details of the actual case?" ROFL Hint! somebody that knew Thaksin was involved, what else matters?

That bad, huh?

Newin got away because he was acting according to the policy set by Thaksin, he didn't invent it (just took the opportunity).

Also there was no evidence of any illegal gains, only vague "damage to the state", and the case for lower ranking officials was all about not following proper procedures, and the court ruled in their favor. Who here knows what the proper procedures are and how they subverted them?

It was a "policy corruption" case, when everything was done legally to benefit a particular party.

[tig28]

Not a Thai verdict at all.

I had expected that some lower Thaksin boys had been convicted.

How about former commerce Minister Adisak Potharamik that made a "Thaksin" and left the country before the verdict.

All got cleared, that must have hurt the red shirts argument that Thaksin was convicted on political grounds.

Not a very valid point PS --- this line from The Nation might make the real position clearer for you.

"the case was initiated when Newin was on Thaksin's side but was concluded when he was not - yesterday's ruling did not come as a shock."

[caf]

The main defendants in this case may have only been two--politics and expediency.

I'm new to Thai justice.

Was this ruling flexible because of the nature of the product

[xminator]

Nation hit it head on yeah, on purpose or just accident of translation --- up to you.

[PoorSucker]

Not a Thai verdict at all.

I had expected that some lower Thaksin boys had been convicted.

How about former commerce Minister Adisak Potharamik that made a "Thaksin" and left the country before the verdict.

All got cleared, that must have hurt the red shirts argument that Thaksin was convicted on political grounds.

Not a very valid point PS --- this line from The Nation might make the real position clearer for you.

"the case was initiated when Newin was on Thaksin's side but was concluded when he was not - yesterday's ruling did not come as a shock."

Don't agree.

It was concluded during one of Thaksins proxy PM's.

This trial started when the red shirts still was in power.

[Plus]

Out of 44 defendants only Newin openly betrayed Thaksin and so is "useful" for the elite conspiracy. The rest are either old Thaksin cronies or "non-essential personnel".

It's a bit of a stretch to say they were all cleared just for the sake of Newin. Don't forget that there were three groups of defendants, Newin being one of the least involved in actual workings (though at the very top).

[jayjayjayjay]

Anybody knows any details of the actual case?

As far as I remember it was bid rigging to favor certain companies (CP) that delivered substandard seedlings.

First case of policy corruption and down the drain.

Will the prosecution appeal?

>>>

Or are we going to expand on rotten politics without having a clue of what we are so cocksure about?

Seriously, I hope your not holding our for a clean politician to be found in Thailand............ let me laugh a thousand laughs for you.

[Plus]

Seriously, I hope your not holding our for a clean politician to be found in Thailand............ let me laugh a thousand laughs for you.

I don't fully understand what you mean.

This is the first "policy corruption" case, when the govt legally initiated policies for the benefit of certain companies or individuals, and the dismissal doesn't look good for the future. Either the legislation is not suitable or the there are impossible demands for the burden of proof.

In individual politicians cases they don't need to prove that he benefited from corruption, simply hiding shares is enough, for example. When it comes to cabinet resolutions or let alone parliament approved bills, it's a lot more difficult.

There are great many ways in which CP could have shown its gratitude for rigging this bid - they were so deeply involved with the government work. Perhaps they need to put greater legal distance between private companies and govt business, or greater distance between the govt and bureaucracy. I don't know, it's a big topic.

[jasreeve17]

"the case was initiated when Newin was on Thaksin's side but was concluded when he was not - yesterday's ruling did not come as a shock."

This is the best line I've ever seen in The Nation.

I'd like to comment on the content of the rulings, but it's illegal to do so.

Well, Abhisit best watch out that he doesn't pisss orf the generals, or it's Newin for PM; & you thought MrT was bad! If only MrT had known his place (under the generals) he'd still be there, but he got to big for their boots, and now Newin's sizing them up - size eleven I believe... - I think I've been reading to many Animatic quotes, I'm getting all poetic and metaphoric...

[otherstuff1957]

This is an absolutely disgusting verdict . After this and the two rallies this weekend I'm just about ready to put on a red shirt. I really expected better from the courts.

[KevinBloodyWilson]

"the case was initiated when Newin was on Thaksin's side but was concluded when he was not - yesterday's ruling did not come as a shock."

This is the best line I've ever seen in The Nation.

I'd like to comment on the content of the rulings, but it's illegal to do so.

Well, Abhisit best watch out that he doesn't pisss orf the generals, or it's Newin for PM; & you thought MrT was bad! If only MrT had known his place (under the generals) he'd still be there, but he got to big for their boots, and now Newin's sizing them up - size eleven I believe... - I think I've been reading to many Animatic quotes, I'm getting all poetic and metaphoric...

Strange thing. I also got the feeling he is being positioned for when Abhisit gets the elbow. he will serve his 5 years out of politics so everyone will poit to his rehabilitation and then he will be at the top table. Does anyone have any idea at all what the corruption will be like then? Awful, just awful.

[PoorSucker]

This is an absolutely disgusting verdict . After this and the two rallies this weekend I'm just about ready to put on a red shirt. I really expected better from the courts.

Why, because the red shirts win a battle in supreme court?

43 of the defendants are still red shirts.

[KevinBloodyWilson]

This is an absolutely disgusting verdict . After this and the two rallies this weekend I'm just about ready to put on a red shirt. I really expected better from the courts.

Why, because the red shirts win a battle in supreme court?

43 of the defendants are still red shirts.

Not the one that mattered, his taste runs to the blue side of red.

[TAWP]

This is an absolutely disgusting verdict . After this and the two rallies this weekend I'm just about ready to put on a red shirt. I really expected better from the courts.

Why, because the red shirts win a battle in supreme court?

43 of the defendants are still red shirts.

Not the one that mattered, his taste runs to the blue side of red.

Yes, but the poster in question seemed to be a red-fan and missed that the case in large was against red people, and took the verdict as being...anti-red.

Funny.

So now we can claim that the courts are proven to not be anti-red?

[Scott]

There was something written about the US justice system that said something to the effect that it was better for 100 guilty people to go free than for 1 innocent person to be convicted.

Maybe in Thailand it's vice versa?

[Rumfoord]

This is an absolutely disgusting verdict . After this and the two rallies this weekend I'm just about ready to put on a red shirt. I really expected better from the courts.

Why, because the red shirts win a battle in supreme court?

43 of the defendants are still red shirts.

Not the one that mattered, his taste runs to the blue side of red.

Yes, but the poster in question seemed to be a red-fan and missed that the case in large was against red people, and took the verdict as being...anti-red.

Funny.

So now we can claim that the courts are proven to not be anti-red?

what funny you a talking about?

[KevinBloodyWilson]

There was something written about the US justice system that said something to the effect that it was better for 100 guilty people to go free than for 1 innocent person to be convicted.

Maybe in Thailand it's vice versa?

On the basis of this case and their general reputation, it's a possible perhaps, reasonable conclusion.

[Publicus]

There was something written about the US justice system that said something to the effect that it was better for 100 guilty people to go free than for 1 innocent person to be convicted.

Maybe in Thailand it's vice versa?

On the basis of this case and their general reputation, it's a possible perhaps, reasonable conclusion.

TiT

Proposed: That Thaksin return to LOS to be injected with truth syrum so he could speak the actual truths, which would be a lethal injection indeed.

Then finally, at long last, the case would be .

[LaoPo]

There was something written about the US justice system that said something to the effect that it was better for 100 guilty people to go free than for 1 innocent person to be convicted.

Maybe in Thailand it's vice versa?

On the basis of this case and their general reputation, it's a possible perhaps, reasonable conclusion.

TiT

Proposed: That Thaksin return to LOS to be injected with truth syrum so he could speak the actual truths, which would be a lethal injection indeed.

That's an interesting proposition.

However, if he would start talking there is the possibility that a lot of Thai politicians, generals, police officers and other very hi-so individuals will run for the border or try to book the last first-class seats on the first available flight

The question is...will they make it or will they face the same lethal injection?

I fear a lot of those injections will be needed and finally, real Democracy is able to make a start.

LaoPo

[Plus]

He has promised to start talking already, about a dozen times, even on the eve do or die Songkran assault.

He's got nothing.

[webfact]

GRAFT ACQUITTAL

Prosecutors blame AEC for failed case

By The Nation

Published on September 23, 2009

OAG says rubber saplings case was 'incomplete'

The Office of the Attorney-General yesterday blamed the now-defunct Assets Examination Committee (AEC) for the court acquittal of all 44 defendants in a corruption case linked to the controversial Bt1.44-billion rubber saplings project.

OAG spokesman Thanapit Moonlaphruek said the AEC, appointed after the 2006 coup, went ahead alone to pursue the case in the Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Political Office Holders after prosecutors suggested more witness testimonies were needed.

"The AEC did not listen to the protest by the OAG that they had an incomplete case. They went ahead alone to bring the case to court," the spokesman explained.

"The AEC did not cooperate with the OAG in finding complete facts. Now that the Supreme Court has acquitted the defendants, damage has been done to the state in hiring lawyers. Certain defendants should not have been sued and now their reputation has been damaged and a lot of money spent hiring their lawyers," he said.

The court on Monday acquitted all 44 defendants in the case that included former Cabinet members, bureaucrats, and executives and employees of private companies.

The spokesman said the OAG would not blame any party for the court acquittal. "But we would like to call for future cases to be based on actual facts and proof, and not personal confidence or social or media pressure."

He noted that the corruption case involving the two and three digit lotteries - the verdict for which the Supreme Court is due to read next Wednesday - was also filed by the AEC without support from public prosecutors.

Meanwhile, fugitive ex-premier Thaksin Shinawatra said in a Twitter message that Monday's court verdict on the rubber-saplings project "made Thai society better informed" about the allegations against him and his government.

"It means the CNS lied when they accused my government of corruption," his message read.

Chalerm Yoobamrung, chief MP of the opposition pro-Thaksin Pheu Thai Party, said the court acquittal proved the coup-makers' allegation of corruption against Thaksin was unfounded.

Surapong Tovichakchaikul, another Pheu Thai MP, called on the AEC to apologise to Thaksin and the 44 defendants acquitted in the rubber-saplings case.

Klanarong Chantik, a former member of the defunct AEC, said yesterday that the committee did its job without bias and did not see the acquittal verdict in the case as a failure.

Now a member of the National Anti-Corruption Commission, Klanarong argued the prosecution was based on cause to suspect wrongdoing. "The AEC's work was based on facts and reasons and its prosecution decision was suspected wrongdoing," he said.

The graft-buster said he had no fear of counter lawsuits because the AEC did everything in accordance with the legal principles. The AEC stood ready, he said, for the upcoming graft verdict on the lotteries case on September 30, he said.

He dismissed Thaksin's remark that the coup leaders fabricated graft charges in order to oust his government. "The AEC worked independently and was not directed to fault anyone," he said.

Auditor-General Jaruvan Maintaka, another former AEC member, said that the panel did "the best job" in bringing the case to court and that its members were confident the legal framework was followed.

-- The Nation 2009/09/23

[KevinBloodyWilson]

He has promised to start talking already, about a dozen times, even on the eve do or die Songkran assault.

He's got nothing.

Caveat:as my previous posts show, I am no fan of Thaksin, but I do believe that properly constrained and kept honest, he would be the best thing for Thailand.

As to the proposal that 'He's got nothing', on the contrary, I believe he has got a lot, otherwise they wouldn't keep trying to chase him down. The snippet about Prem and the coup was hugely damaging, and everyone already knew about that. The good stuff is in his gunny bag waiting for the right time for a demolition job.

Thats why they're so scared of him.

[TAWP]

Caveat:as my previous posts show, I am no fan of Thaksin, but I do believe that properly constrained and kept honest, he would be the best thing for Thailand.

So when you made a dog into a cat you consider it a pet for you. Cute, but not applicable to reality here.

[KevinBloodyWilson]

Caveat:as my previous posts show, I am no fan of Thaksin, but I do believe that properly constrained and kept honest, he would be the best thing for Thailand.

So when you made a dog into a cat you consider it a pet for you. Cute, but not applicable to reality here.

*shrug* maybe. But when you neuter an undisciplined dog, it calms down and becomes more compliant. I still think that properly disciplined, he would be the best thing for Thailand, the present shower are not good for anything, that's for sure. While Thailand wasn't perfect under Thaksin by any means, it was still a better place in my opinion.

Edited September 23, 2009 by KevinBloodyWilson

[hammered]

Caveat:as my previous posts show, I am no fan of Thaksin, but I do believe that properly constrained and kept honest, he would be the best thing for Thailand.

So when you made a dog into a cat you consider it a pet for you. Cute, but not applicable to reality here.

*shrug* maybe. But when you neuter an undisciplined dog, it calms down and becomes more compliant. I still think that properly disciplined, he would be the best thing for Thailand, the present shower are not good for anything, that's for sure. While Thailand wasn't perfect under Thaksin by any means, it was still a better place in my opinion.

So I will assume that you arent worried about such things as formal equality in the eyes of the law, innocence until proven guilty, right to trial and dont give much thought to the most basic of human rights ie the right to not be offed because you got on some blacklist.

[KevinBloodyWilson]

Caveat:as my previous posts show, I am no fan of Thaksin, but I do believe that properly constrained and kept honest, he would be the best thing for Thailand.

So when you made a dog into a cat you consider it a pet for you. Cute, but not applicable to reality here.

*shrug* maybe. But when you neuter an undisciplined dog, it calms down and becomes more compliant. I still think that properly disciplined, he would be the best thing for Thailand, the present shower are not good for anything, that's for sure. While Thailand wasn't perfect under Thaksin by any means, it was still a better place in my opinion.

So I will assume that you arent worried about such things as formal equality in the eyes of the law, innocence until proven guilty, right to trial and dont give much thought to the most basic of human rights ie the right to not be offed because you got on some blacklist.

I do. At least as much now as then. Nothing has changed for the better.

[Publicus]

Caveat:as my previous posts show, I am no fan of Thaksin, but I do believe that properly constrained and kept honest, he would be the best thing for Thailand.

So when you made a dog into a cat you consider it a pet for you. Cute, but not applicable to reality here.

*shrug* maybe. But when you neuter an undisciplined dog, it calms down and becomes more compliant. I still think that properly disciplined, he would be the best thing for Thailand, the present shower are not good for anything, that's for sure. While Thailand wasn't perfect under Thaksin by any means, it was still a better place in my opinion.

The 1997 Constitution provided a government structure of checks and balances which Dr. Thaksin and TRT systematically dismantled so there wouldn't be anything to reign them in. These aspects of the constitution were targeted consciously, deliberately, purposefully and willfully.

Moreover, even a military coup d'etat has failed to neuter the pit bull Thaksin. Thaksin now has become a vulture hovering over Thailand.

"[P]roperly constrained and kept honest" sounds like talking about a werewolf or vampire.

Edited September 23, 2009 by Publicus

[stumonster]

I do. At least as much now as then. Nothing has changed for the better.

maybe you have missed what is happening to the rest of the planet ? every country is struggling.

the mastermind behind the Thai elite card does not make astute business decisions.

where are his comphrensive plans with the numbers to back them up that will help this country ?

his only plan is to come back and play poo yai - he is incompetent and I doubt he could run a corner store at a profit.

[caf]

I do. At least as much now as then. Nothing has changed for the better.

maybe you have missed what is happening to the rest of the planet ? every country is struggling.

the mastermind behind the Thai elite card does not make astute business decisions.

where are his comphrensive plans with the numbers to back them up that will help this country ?

his only plan is to come back and play poo yai - he is incompetent and I doubt he could run a corner store at a profit.

you have a clever turn of phrase - but he did rather well in telecoms, leaving aside the controversial tax bits. the corner store metaphor is not well chosen. but of a misapplied cliche