Leicester Dad Tells Of Battle To Cut Thai Drugs Sentence

[john b good]

Lesson to be learned... do not do drugs in thailand.

Agree 100% and have no sympathy for this guy whatsoever.

Do the crime and you have to accept that you are gonna have to do the time.

If the guy hadn't learned by the time he was 40 he can only described as a "very slow learner"

[john b good]

That's crazy! Why won't the British let him out?

Okay, I really am no fan of drugs, but 2020? This is a mans life?

What is wrong with that government, at the same time they let the Lockerbie bomber out on compassionate grounds.

I see your point when you compare it to the Lockerbie bomber.

But the guy did a crime in a country where they have decided upon a punishment.

Arguing on that is pointless.

I think he should first of all be happy to have been moved, before he start asking for early release.

Yes, but he's British and he's in Britain and not in this draconian . . . . anymore . . . . so what's the problem?

He has a child. He has a life. The British really need to learn to look after their own and stuff the rest of the world.

What you should say is that "he had a life and by his own stupid actions he fcuked up.

[john b good]

Emotive subject …….. but an extremely harsh sentence by any standards.

The OP can be extremely glad and lucky he is a UK citizen and that the UK has a bilateral repatriation/exchange agreement in place, and that he is back home just a few years into his 33year sentence. There are Thai citizens in UK (and in other European) prisons who do not want to avail themselves to the repatriation agreements their conutry has with Thailand ... wonder why?

The OP was caught with a “small amount of ecstasy, amphetamines and cannabis ……..”

1) Can the OP (or anyone else) clarify just exactly what the respective drug quantities were …..grams, kilos, or what …?

2) Was the sentence for “distribution” based on the respective quantities, individually or/and collectively, and was there any additional evidence presented by the prosecution to support the charge of “distribution” - or was it based on only the quantities?

3) Do the terms of the bilateral exchange agreement prevent one, or does one automatically surrender their appeal/judicial review rights (in Thai courts) after repatriation?

I can’t help wondering that if I was in the OP’s position I wouldn’t bite my lip and hold on for 10 – 15 years in the anticipation that a Royal pardon was a strong likely hood (?) Thats a rhetorical statement no-one needs answer. Pardons are often given when Major Royal events occur (.... and I'll leave it that).

MJP – “why wont they let him out” – firstly Jack Straw is known for his reluctance to grant release to repatriated prisoners – with or without a pardon, He has a reputation for supporting overseas convictions. The most recent release he asked Her Majesty (HMG – not Thai) to approve was only because evidence came to light supporting Micheal Sheilds’ innocence (this was the Bulgarian soccer assault case), and secondly – and this is a very important point to keep in mind – was only after, through diplomatic channels it was established that the Popova (Bulgarian Minister for Justice) had no objection (Straw always seeks the opinion of his counterpart in such cases).

MJP – Lockerbie bomber case was a Scottish matter, not a UK matter – though not withstanding Brown’s protestations that is was up to the Scot’s to decide, I do agree that it’s implausible to think the Scot’s would have gone ahead with al-Megrahi’s release if “Whitehall” had objected. al-Megrahi is in any event pretty close to death - if anything he supposed to now be a couple weeks at most from the end. One can look at how one wants, but no one had anything to gain by keeping him in Scotland - I do support his release.

Someone will now ask me - what about Ronnie Biggs?

A leopard doesn;t change its spots: from all accounts in the media it would appear that he well and truely pulled the wool over everyone's eyes.

……….. all this aside, if the OP had been sentenced in a Singaporean court, he would now be facing capital punishment – and in Singapore if you are caught and successfully prosecuted for quantities that are considered to be for “distribution” the judge has NO OPTION, he is bound by legislation to pass the death sentence. In Thailand, for what it worth, the judge can exercise discretion. Not so in Singapore – the ONLY sentence is death. Thailand has always been reluctant to execute Westerners – Thailand doesn’t think twice about executing other Asians (and it has done so on several occasions over the last 10 years or so), but when it comes to Westerners I think it is now well over 150 years (if not 200plus - someone want to go and search it up on Google?)since the last Westerner was executed.

Personaly I feel addicts/abusers (what ever one wants to call them) are actually victims ….. and deserving of help, especially if they ask for it (and I don’t know one way or the other what the case is with the OP)…… I’ve been through it myself. Coming out of hospital a few years back I found it difficult to get off all the analgesic pain killer shit I was perscribed (Oxynorm liquid Instant release 600 – 700mg a day - milligram for milligram not far off Diamorphine Hydrochloride – which, for those who don’t know is medical grade heroin), and Morphine Sulphate slow release tabs’ 400 – 600mg’s per day. I got down to about 20% of the above over a period of around 6months – then stonewalled: couldn’t get any lower untill one day decided to go "cold turkey" – f’k, what an experience and a half that was! That was physical addiction (the brain stops producing its own dopamine when you use analgesics longterm - then you stop using analgesics and your body says, "hey wheres my dope?" - takes around 5-10 days for the brain to switch back on its internal dope production and regulation and during the first part of that week to 2 weeks, you will go through absolute hel_l). Apparently if you’re psychologically addicted as well … you really need professional help.

Quite why judicial systems incarcerate drug users/addicts/abusers/dependents (attach whatever lable one cares to - a rose would smell the same by any other name i.e. the problem is the same whatever label is attached to it) for long periods of time - let alone time-periods like 33 years, is quite beyond me – it doesn’t make sense at all - it serves no benefit to society, and if anything I think theres a strong argument that it does a great deal of psychological harm to the incarcerated individual - which I don't believe any State/Government/Judicial system has the right to do to a person.

I wish the OP all the best.

I would suggest that the OP is not the person currently incarcerated in a jail in the UK.

[Arkady]

The UK prisoner transfer treaty is archaic and dates back to the 1930's

If this bloke was a Dane, French, German or a Yank he'd be out on parole in a couple of months.

If he had a 99 year sentence then the UK would re-assess his sentence and he'd also be out in no time.

If I was banged up in Thailand, I would prefer the 99 year sentence (life sentence) to the 33 year sentence anyday!

It's a horrible legal loophole that this boy is trapped in, but there are so much backround politics going on that he doesn't stand a chance..

I am sympathetic, he has to do 1/2 the time to be eligible for release in the UK whereas his european and North american cousins get released after only 4 years!

My understanding is that Thailand counts a life sentence as 50 years for the purposes of calculating parole eligibility and the UK does likewise with lifers repatriated from Thailand under the treaty. Therefore, you would not be better off with a life sentence rather than 33 years.

I agree that the Home Office's justifications for treating its citizens who are repatriated under the treaty so much more harshly than is the practice in other Western countries are totally unconvincing.

Edited October 13, 2009 by Arkady

[bobjenssen]

Lesson to be learned... do not do drugs in thailand.

Agree 100% and have no sympathy for this guy whatsoever.

Do the crime and you have to accept that you are gonna have to do the time.

If the guy hadn't learned by the time he was 40 he can only described as a "very slow learner"

do the crime and have to accept that you have to do some time?

do you honestly believe that this takes place?

It is a dream, a fantasy, it does not ever happen and those with money accept zero

they do not, for the large part ever suffer from this non existent karma of which you seem to believe in

[sokal]

I could be wrong but my understanding is that he got caught with 26 gram amphetamines (probably ice since yaba is normally counted in pills instead of grams). Regarding amphetamines Thai law says anything over 1.5 gram is automatically considered trafficking so that's why he got charged accordingly.

On top of that he had the bad luck to be caught during the height or aftermath of taxin's war on drugs. Amphetamines were classified that time not only as a hard drug (class I) but also as a threat to Thai national security which could clarify why his sentence was much harsher that the one Gregory got.

In the end I feel he was plain stupid by stashing 26 grams. If he had only one gram and the balance in cash he could have bought his way out.

Ice, yabba or whatever you want to call it is a loser trash drug. If somebody is using that garbage then they have already hit rock bottom. 30 years in the BKK hilton might do them some good.

[yabaaaa]

This is the exact kind of harsh, over the top and inhumane sentence that would make me consider not gong to a country.

Sounds fine to me shoud be done worldwide, dont worry you'll be lucky if the Police even turn up for anything less than murder in the Uk.

[yabaaaa]

Hang the Bastard!!!!!

By the B*lls!!

[MB1]

Ice, yabba or whatever you want to call it is a loser trash drug. If somebody is using that garbage then they have already hit rock bottom. 30 years in the BKK hilton might do them some good.

Actually he was caught with 24 grammes of heroin as well as an undisclosed quantity of marijuana, ecstasy and amphetamine......

That should bring the hang em high brigade crawling back out of their caves.

http://www.phaseloop.com/foreignprisoners/...ve_willcox.html

dont worry you'll be lucky if the Police even turn up for anything less than murder in the Uk.

By the B*lls!!

((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((YAWN))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

)))))))

[britmaveric]

The US is here to stay ???? Its actually in the process of losing the reserve currency status at the moment. You need to visit the economy and banking section of this forum and read up.

Some in the world would love this to happen.... however the truth is this isn't happening anytime soon. So yes the Yanks are here to stay for least a few more hundred years.

[meom]

Actually he was caught with 24 grammes of heroin as well as an undisclosed quantity of marijuana, ecstasy and amphetamine......

That should bring the hang em high brigade crawling back out of their caves.

That's what's written but on the other hand the guy mentions “I don’t deny that I was taking drugs, I had become addicted to amphetamines at a very stressful time in my life"

If he's addicted to amphetamines for what purpose does he need 24 g of heroin which has the complete opposite effect of amphetamines when taken?

Anyway heroin carries also a life sentence if you get caught with 3 grams or more so it don't really matter in the end from a sentencing point of view since either way he would have been sentenced to life.

[MB1]

If he's addicted to amphetamines for what purpose does he need 24 g of heroin which has the complete opposite effect of amphetamines when taken?

Without actually writing to him and asking him, I'd say that he was probably addicted to heroin as well, I don't think there is any hard fast rule for drug users who are dependant on them that says don't take heroin when taking ampetamine.

Anyway heroin carries also a life sentence if you get caught with 3 grams or more so it don't really matter in the end from a sentencing point of view since either way he would have been sentenced to life.

But he was not sentenced to life, he received 33 years and some months, talking about 3 grammes means a life sentence, how about the Australian caught December last year trying to exit Thailand with 3 kilos of heroin, he received a life sentence and if repatriated back to Australia under the treaty he could be eligble for release before Wilcox if the same happens as did in the case of a British prisoner jailed for heroin trafficking, he had a ten year tarriff set by UK Judges when returned to the UK under the rules of the treaty...Still seems one rule for one and one rule for another IMO.

Edited October 13, 2009 by MB1

[bobjenssen]

I could be wrong but my understanding is that he got caught with 26 gram amphetamines (probably ice since yaba is normally counted in pills instead of grams). Regarding amphetamines Thai law says anything over 1.5 gram is automatically considered trafficking so that's why he got charged accordingly.

On top of that he had the bad luck to be caught during the height or aftermath of taxin's war on drugs. Amphetamines were classified that time not only as a hard drug (class I) but also as a threat to Thai national security which could clarify why his sentence was much harsher that the one Gregory got.

In the end I feel he was plain stupid by stashing 26 grams. If he had only one gram and the balance in cash he could have bought his way out.

Ice, yabba or whatever you want to call it is a loser trash drug. If somebody is using that garbage then they have already hit rock bottom. 30 years in the BKK hilton might do them some good.

Complete ignorant nonsense!

typical silly statement by someone who automatically thinks that taking such a drug means the end of the road.

HELLO EARTH TO ALL- here is something that completely fly's in the face of that nonsense.

Many people take that drug "ice and many others and function perfectly.

Have jobs and family, and do rather well thank you very much.

How many authors ( Arthur Conan Doyle seemed to do rather well,

and film directors ( ken Russell- and, and guess what he turns 90 soon, how can this be, when according to you, by taking certain things he has "hit rock bottom" it does not work does it? wanna know why- here is the answer- one can, many do, function perfectly well)

Shall I continue- I could name 100 who have excelled in their chosen field and been taken these life destroying substances. How can this be when according to you- they are losers???

You are completely and utterly mistaken. Please do cling to such a misguided igronant opinion

The Japanese were able in ingest large amount of the stuff and give the Allys one heck of problems. They could in fact fly planes straight into big ships and direct war effort that caused all sorts of problems.

I hope to see the end of such nonsense.

Who is the loser I ask myself?

[britmaveric]

^ obvious losers are the drug takers.

However this thread isnt about whether you think drugs are good or bad. It's about a tough sentence being served or not.

[bobjenssen]

The US is here to stay ???? Its actually in the process of losing the reserve currency status at the moment. You need to visit the economy and banking section of this forum and read up.

Some in the world would love this to happen.... however the truth is this isn't happening anytime soon. So yes the Yanks are here to stay for least a few more hundred years.

Exactly- so nice to see we can agree on something. The yanks and their European 'parents" are not going any where soon.

Not in our lifetime.

And you know what- it is kind of better that way because God help us should anyone else have the sort of power that they can wield.

They will never give up their hold and control.

Put all the false silly false pride, forget this outdated, totally unworkable, misguided

tosh about " sovereign nations" put it all away and lets see things as they really are. The Americans and friends, like it or not, call the shots.

[bobjenssen]

^ obvious losers are the drug takers.

However this thread isnt about whether you think drugs are good or bad. It's about a tough sentence being served or not.

legal ones too?

So, if I take a diarrhea pill am I now a loser?

How many times must I show the flaw in your logic before you concede what is the undeniable truth

that taking drug's includes ALL drugs, not just ones which some nations have deemed illegal

how can people who have achieved such fame be called losers?

Why is people like you seem to want o shut out all reasonable logic and insist upon such nonsense?

[meom]

If he's addicted to amphetamines for what purpose does he need 24 g of heroin which has the complete opposite effect of amphetamines when taken?

Without actually writing to him and asking him, I'd say that he was probably addicted to heroin as well, I don't think there is any hard fast rule for drug users who are dependant on them that says don't take heroin when taking ampetamine.

Anyway heroin carries also a life sentence if you get caught with 3 grams or more so it don't really matter in the end from a sentencing point of view since either way he would have been sentenced to life.

But he was not sentenced to life, he received 33 years and some months, talking about 3 grammes means a life sentence, how about the Australian caught December last year trying to exit Thailand with 3 kilos of heroin, he received a life sentence and if repatriated back to Australia under the treaty he could be eligble for release before Wilcox if the same happens as did in the case of a British prisoner jailed for heroin trafficking, he had a ten year tarriff set by UK Judges when returned to the UK under the rules of the treaty...Still seems one rule for one and one rule for another IMO.

Good point and I had to reread the Thai Narcotics Act to figure that one out.

It seems in the case of heroin if you’re caught with 3-20 gram you are liable to 4 years –life imprisonment and a fine of four hundred thousand to five million baht.

Anything over 20 grams carries a life sentence or death penalty.

When they talk about grams they’re meaning pure substance so I guess when the guy got 33 years instead of life that the total quantity caught was less than 20 g pure which makes sense since most drugs are cut.

The Australian was caught with a few kilo’s and even when cut if definitely will still be more than 20 g which explains the life sentence.

[britmaveric]

Well Jap zero pilots are hardly a prime example of a winner.

Any rate does not matter? We are talking about penalties for drugs that are illegal. You may not think they should be illegal fair enough, but they are illegal so if you get caught out then you must be willing to pay the penalty.

[bobjenssen]

Well Jap zero pilots are hardly a prime example of a winner.

Any rate does not matter? We are talking about penalties for drugs that are illegal. You may not think they should be illegal fair enough, but they are illegal so if you get caught out then you must be willing to pay the penalty.

yes, pay the penalty ( good choice of words) is paying money for those who have it and the kingpins more than likely do- therefore the laws do not work in their case

and they are the ones most deserving of punishment

do you agree that people who have the moneys have little chance of being brought to bear? truth= very little

that their ill gotten gains makes them extremely hard to be brought to justice? truth= '' ''

and do you agree that involving yourself in these activity's does not automatically mean you will go to jail? truth= it most certainly does not

And does the partaking of these illegal "hard" drugs mean you cannot function ? or do you think that somehow it is preordained that if you take these your life will be ruined. Truth= many, in fact despite the propaganda, most, do not have their life's ruined at all and live in a perfectly functionally way.

[britmaveric]

I think its safe to say most habitual drug users do not function so well, and when they do function they are doing so only so they can have their next fix. Sure there are creative geniuses that done alright, but they are the first to admit prob not a good idea for most people to get involved in such endeavours. Illicit Drugs destroy lives full stop - there is no point debating this.

Perfect case is the recent death of DJ AM - his drug problem killed him.

[yabaaaa]

Ice, yabba or whatever you want to call it is a loser trash drug. If somebody is using that garbage then they have already hit rock bottom. 30 years in the BKK hilton might do them some good.

Actually he was caught with 24 grammes of heroin as well as an undisclosed quantity of marijuana, ecstasy and amphetamine......

That should bring the hang em high brigade crawling back out of their caves.

http://www.phaseloop.com/foreignprisoners/...ve_willcox.html

dont worry you'll be lucky if the Police even turn up for anything less than murder in the Uk.

By the B*lls!!

((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((YAWN))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

)))))))

Hang em high castrate em flog em etc etc

[smokie36]

castrate em

In an attempt to eradicate a genetic disposition to illegal substances...or just for the hel_l of it?

[IanForbes]

Personally, I'd legalize all drugs (even the very bad ones) everywhere and make them almost free. Leave it up to the person to destroy themselves anyway they want. There are just as many other ways that humans destroy their bodies and lives. Take away the profits from the drug sales and the evil pushers will have to fine some other means of employment.

However, that doesn't change the fact that the stupid idiots that do illegal drugs in countries with harsh penalties only have themselves to blame. I can legally jump on a motorcycle and go flying through blind corners in Asia with the same odds of survival as taking harsh drugs. The end result is I mortgage my future for a few minutes of enjoyment. Everyone with half a brain knows the harsh penalties for taking drugs in Thailand and Malaysia. But, there are still idiots that keep doing it. I may not agree with the harsh penalties and draconian methods of dealing with addicts, but those are the rules in Thailand. Break them at your own peril. The Leicester Dad who found out the hard way is just passing on his warning to those who MIGHT not have gotten the message. If you want to do drugs then move to a country where there are not the draconian laws against it. If you are from the UK then stay home. Thailand doesn't want you.

[britmaveric]

^nicely stated IanForbes!! Yes- legalize\make free all drugs just keep them in jail while they use them away from others so they can do no harm. Perfect solution!!!

[smokie36]

If you are from the UK then stay home. Thailand doesn't want you.

And if you commit crime abroad the UK doesn't really want you back either.

If you want to visit foreign countries at least abide by their customs and laws which the locals will expect you to respect.

Why do people expect tolerance when they abuse their hosts hospitality?

[sokal]

The US is here to stay ???? Its actually in the process of losing the reserve currency status at the moment. You need to visit the economy and banking section of this forum and read up.

Some in the world would love this to happen.... however the truth is this isn't happening anytime soon. So yes the Yanks are here to stay for least a few more hundred years.

Now go to the Banking and investment section.

[sokal]

I could be wrong but my understanding is that he got caught with 26 gram amphetamines (probably ice since yaba is normally counted in pills instead of grams). Regarding amphetamines Thai law says anything over 1.5 gram is automatically considered trafficking so that's why he got charged accordingly.

On top of that he had the bad luck to be caught during the height or aftermath of taxin's war on drugs. Amphetamines were classified that time not only as a hard drug (class I) but also as a threat to Thai national security which could clarify why his sentence was much harsher that the one Gregory got.

In the end I feel he was plain stupid by stashing 26 grams. If he had only one gram and the balance in cash he could have bought his way out.

Ice, yabba or whatever you want to call it is a loser trash drug. If somebody is using that garbage then they have already hit rock bottom. 30 years in the BKK hilton might do them some good.

Complete ignorant nonsense!

typical silly statement by someone who automatically thinks that taking such a drug means the end of the road.

HELLO EARTH TO ALL- here is something that completely fly's in the face of that nonsense.

Many people take that drug "ice and many others and function perfectly.

Have jobs and family, and do rather well thank you very much.

How many authors ( Arthur Conan Doyle seemed to do rather well,

and film directors ( ken Russell- and, and guess what he turns 90 soon, how can this be, when according to you, by taking certain things he has "hit rock bottom" it does not work does it? wanna know why- here is the answer- one can, many do, function perfectly well)

Shall I continue- I could name 100 who have excelled in their chosen field and been taken these life destroying substances. How can this be when according to you- they are losers???

You are completely and utterly mistaken. Please do cling to such a misguided igronant opinion

The Japanese were able in ingest large amount of the stuff and give the Allys one heck of problems. They could in fact fly planes straight into big ships and direct war effort that caused all sorts of problems.

I hope to see the end of such nonsense.

Who is the loser I ask myself?

I used to do GHB on a weekends to replace alcohol because it had no hangover and a breath tester could not pick it up. I have done drugs before, just not ISE because ICE is for losers. I happen to live in Canada, a country that DOES NOT carry life sentances for drugs.

I am not stupid enough to get involved with drugs in Thailand. Is a life sentance or death not a good enough reason ? What is a good enough reason for these stupid morons ? What about Saudi Arabia ? Manditory sodomy with some lashes to the face ?

[sokal]

^ obvious losers are the drug takers.

However this thread isnt about whether you think drugs are good or bad. It's about a tough sentence being served or not.

legal ones too?

So, if I take a diarrhea pill am I now a loser?

How many times must I show the flaw in your logic before you concede what is the undeniable truth

that taking drug's includes ALL drugs, not just ones which some nations have deemed illegal

how can people who have achieved such fame be called losers?

Why is people like you seem to want o shut out all reasonable logic and insist upon such nonsense?

A drug that is made by some crack head in a basement which ingredients include, draino and accetone is for losers. Poor lowlife scum bag street dwelling losers.

[cdnvic]

This topic has degenerated into a shouting match. Time to put it to sleep.