Please Advice: Do We Have The Right For Some Refund?

[Guido1976]

Hello all,

My girlfriend and I have been looking for a new condo for rent and we found one. We checked it out during the day when there was not much traffic and it’s about 10 minutes walk from MRT (Subway).

We then decided to take it and the owner said that we should pay the first deposit for 11,000 THB for the guarantee that we were seriously taking it and we thought that made sense so we paid.

Later on the week we agreed to sign the contract, we went there right after work which was around 5.30pm and there was a heavily congested traffic, no flyover to cross to the other side (where the condo is) so we had to go though cars to get to the other side.

We realized that we couldn’t possibly live like this for another year since we have to commute to work by MRT. We decided to not sign the contract and talked to the owner right away. He said it was ok but would have to think about the deposit we paid.

Then he sent an email saying that he would not refund any of the money.

Would anybody let us know if we deserve to get at least 50% of the money back? Or it is the right thing for the owner to take this whole money?

Thanks everybody for their answer. It's highly appreciated.

[ukrules]

Anything like this is not generally refundable, maybe he cancelled other peoples appointments to view the apartment after you paid your deposit.

[pattaya_girl]

I think he has a right to keep the Deposit, like the other poster said, he might have turned other people away.

But, if he is a decent sort of chap, he should give half back, but there again, This is Thailand.

[Jingthing]

You don't mention whether you signed anything when you gave the deposit. Such deposits are usually non-refundable but that is often stated in writing with a contract/receipt of some kind. If you didn't have anything in writing, it is of course up to him and his sense of ethics. I don't think keeping it all is unreasonable but it isn't saintly either. One time I collected a 10,000 dollar fee on a real estate deal because the buyer backed out. It was all contractual and of course I took it, I didn't feel at all guilty because he hurt my opportunity to sell to other buyers during the lock up period. Bottom line, forget it.

[DP25]

It'd be 'nice' if he gave you a partial refund but certainly doesn't have to. It's a bad idea to hand over money without a contract in general. How would you prove any of this even happened? Did you get any kind of receipt?

If he got you to hand over money in advance because it was the last unit he was probably lying, almost every unit I've ever looked at I've been told was the last unit in the building.

[Guido1976]

thanks everybody for their reply's.

To start with, the rent per month would be 11K. so an 11K reservation deposit is maybe a bit too much.

we got a receipt stated we paid 11K as deposit for reservation. That's the only thing the receipt says.

so no any sentence what so ever that states it was non-refundable if we would cancel the appartment.

I agree that he has some right to keep the deposit but a 5 or 6K would be more than fair.

[mca]

Sorry OP but to be honest I don't think such things as ethics or moral should really come into it as to whether the guy should give any of the money back. To me a deposit is a guarantee that I'm going to buy or rent something and on the other persons part it guarantees that they aren't going to rent or sell it to somebody else.

The deposit shows a commitment to doing a deal. If a person then reneges on that deal then in my humble opinion they've lost the deposit.

I tried to sell a motorcycle back home and took a deposit. I then turned away 3 other people who were interested with a "Sorry it's sold"

The original guy then didn't want it and got shirty when I wouldn't give his deposit back. Not even partially.

He pissed me about. I lost the chance to sell the bike for the time being. He lost his deposit. To me end of story.

[Guido1976]

Sorry OP but to be honest I don't think such things as ethics or moral should really come into it as to whether the guy should give any of the money back. To me a deposit is a guarantee that I'm going to buy or rent something and on the other persons part it guarantees that they aren't going to rent or sell it to somebody else.

The deposit shows a commitment to doing a deal. If a person then reneges on that deal then in my humble opinion they've lost the deposit.

I tried to sell a motorcycle back home and took a deposit. I then turned away 3 other people who were interested with a "Sorry it's sold"

The original guy then didn't want it and got shirty when I wouldn't give his deposit back. Not even partially.

He pissed me about. I lost the chance to sell the bike for the time being. He lost his deposit. To me end of story.

You are right about it. And I don't say I need the full deposit back. But the deposit should be a small fracture of the actuall costs.

In my opinon a full month rent as deposit is not totally fair.

[Travel2003]

Sorry to the OP, but I do not think you have been cheated in this case.

I have paid 2 months deposit to the 3 last buildings I lived in here in BKK.

All the money back, if I use the contracted time to let them know I am planning to move, so they have time to look for new people to move in.

Have also heard about 3 months deposits.

I can also understand this, because in the building I live now, one person (happened to be a farang) suddenly just left with several unpaid bills behind him.

[Jingthing]

Look at it this way. Assuming you had no contract and you took this to a court of law in any land, do you think you would get a refund? I say no. The man said he wanted a guarantee. That implies he was going to keep the FULL deposit if you bailed. Sorry, lesson learned. That's life.

[Soutpeel]

We realized that we couldn't possibly live like this for another year since we have to commute to work by MRT. We decided to not sign the contract and talked to the owner right away. He said it was ok but would have to think about the deposit we paid.

Then he sent an email saying that he would not refund any of the money.

In this particular case, IMHO that the owner is 100% correct in keeping the deposit amount you paid him.

You commited to a verbal contract/agreement paid the amount he requested, indicating you where serious about moving in, and then you reneged on the agreement.

Now lets suppose the owner had turned away prospective tenants because you have committed to this lease and now as a result of you backing out, he is unable to find another tenant for a month or two, then he would be out of pocket because of your action.

If he finds a tenant quickly...he scores THB 11k,

if it takes him a month, he breaks even,

if takes 2 month, he is out of pocket 11k

He is carrying all the risk..

[chuang]

Hello all,

Later on the week we agreed to sign the contract, we went there right after work which was around 5.30pm and there was a heavily congested traffic, no flyover to cross to the other side (where the condo is) so we had to go though cars to get to the other side.

We realized that we couldn’t possibly live like this for another year since we have to commute to work by MRT. We decided to not sign the contract and talked to the owner right away. He said it was ok but would have to think about the deposit we paid.

Forget about the deposits, this happens everywhere not only in Thailand...take this as an insurance that you would not have to live for 1 year in the about environmental conditions....

[posttenebraslux]

Hello all,

My girlfriend and I have been looking for a new condo for rent and we found one. We checked it out during the day when there was not much traffic and it’s about 10 minutes walk from MRT (Subway).

We then decided to take it and the owner said that we should pay the first deposit for 11,000 THB for the guarantee that we were seriously taking it and we thought that made sense so we paid.

Later on the week we agreed to sign the contract, we went there right after work which was around 5.30pm and there was a heavily congested traffic, no flyover to cross to the other side (where the condo is) so we had to go though cars to get to the other side.

We realized that we couldn’t possibly live like this for another year since we have to commute to work by MRT. We decided to not sign the contract and talked to the owner right away. He said it was ok but would have to think about the deposit we paid.

Then he sent an email saying that he would not refund any of the money.

Sorry to disappoint you, the landlord is right to keep your deposit. Normally, the deposit is in the amount

of the rental for two months. So, let go and be careful next time soon.

Would anybody let us know if we deserve to get at least 50% of the money back? Or it is the right thing for the owner to take this whole money?

Thanks everybody for their answer. It's highly appreciated.

[mca]

In my opinon a full month rent as deposit is not totally fair.

I'll be honest Guido but every apartment I've ever lived in here I've paid 2 or 3 months deposit.

[kyb789]

In my opinon a full month rent as deposit is not totally fair.

I'll be honest Guido but every apartment I've ever lived in here I've paid 2 or 3 months deposit.

I had a similar thing happen. I moved in for 1 week, then moved out. The traffice noise at night was unbelievable. The window was vibrating from the buses and taxi horns. I didn't notice in the daytime because of other noise and the room was not over the street. But the noise bounced off other buildings.

I moved out and the guy kept my deposit. 45k baht. You got off easy. I found a cheaper place and made my money back in 7 months. Best decision I ever made.

[givenall]

Anything like this is not generally refundable, maybe he cancelled other peoples appointments to view the apartment after you paid your deposit.

Kiss the money good bye and don’t waste your time. It is almost impossible to get money back over here at the best of situations, and this is for sure is the land lord right to keep

[Guido1976]

In my opinon a full month rent as deposit is not totally fair.

I'll be honest Guido but every apartment I've ever lived in here I've paid 2 or 3 months deposit.

it was'nt really a deposit. The deposit was 2 months rent if we would have moved in.

This 11K was a reservation fee. and it was never mentioned verbally or written that it was non-refundable in case we would cancel.

[eggomaniac]

I think he has a right to keep the Deposit, like the other poster said, he might have turned other people away.

But, if he is a decent sort of chap, he should give half back, but there again, This is Thailand.

what 'this is Thailand'? mean - that he might refund the money!

thailand must be special; you wouldn't even have a chance in any other country

[LivinLOS]

You are right about it. And I don't say I need the full deposit back. But the deposit should be a small fracture of the actuall costs.

In my opinon a full month rent as deposit is not totally fair.

Why ??

You agreed to rent it.. You gave him a deposit. Now you dont want to rent it.. Now you lose the deposit..

I would see it as clearly your choice, and in his case would without question keep the deposit. Nothing to do with Thai morals etc.

I cant see (except for being cheap) how you can think a partial deposit return makes sense.. Hes either liable to return it or liable to keep it, theres no middle ground, you yourself admit he could / should / kinda can keep some.. Why not all.

[iamsam]

Hello all,

My girlfriend and I have been looking for a new condo for rent and we found one. We checked it out during the day when there was not much traffic and it's about 10 minutes walk from MRT (Subway).

We then decided to take it and the owner said that we should pay the first deposit for 11,000 THB for the guarantee that we were seriously taking it and we thought that made sense so we paid.

Later on the week we agreed to sign the contract, we went there right after work which was around 5.30pm and there was a heavily congested traffic, no flyover to cross to the other side (where the condo is) so we had to go though cars to get to the other side.

We realized that we couldn't possibly live like this for another year since we have to commute to work by MRT. We decided to not sign the contract and talked to the owner right away. He said it was ok but would have to think about the deposit we paid.

Then he sent an email saying that he would not refund any of the money.

Would anybody let us know if we deserve to get at least 50% of the money back? Or it is the right thing for the owner to take this whole money?

Thanks everybody for their answer. It's highly appreciated.

renting a apt is not play.

what do you think deposit is for? to prevent willy nilly like u and u girl from wasting peoples time.

you lose, next!

[iamsam]

Hello all,

My girlfriend and I have been looking for a new condo for rent and we found one. We checked it out during the day when there was not much traffic and it's about 10 minutes walk from MRT (Subway).

We then decided to take it and the owner said that we should pay the first deposit for 11,000 THB for the guarantee that we were seriously taking it and we thought that made sense so we paid.

Later on the week we agreed to sign the contract, we went there right after work which was around 5.30pm and there was a heavily congested traffic, no flyover to cross to the other side (where the condo is) so we had to go though cars to get to the other side.

We realized that we couldn't possibly live like this for another year since we have to commute to work by MRT. We decided to not sign the contract and talked to the owner right away. He said it was ok but would have to think about the deposit we paid.

Then he sent an email saying that he would not refund any of the money.

Would anybody let us know if we deserve to get at least 50% of the money back? Or it is the right thing for the owner to take this whole money?

Thanks everybody for their answer. It's highly appreciated.

apt renting is not play. you lose!

what do you think deposit is for, for buddhas sake? its not sin sod where you get it back...................lol.

[way2muchcoffee]

In my opinon a full month rent as deposit is not totally fair.

I'll be honest Guido but every apartment I've ever lived in here I've paid 2 or 3 months deposit.

it was'nt really a deposit. The deposit was 2 months rent if we would have moved in.

This 11K was a reservation fee. and it was never mentioned verbally or written that it was non-refundable in case we would cancel.

Sounds like a mis-communication. An apartment retainer deposit is typically a few thousand baht until contract signing time when the full deposit of two or three months is paid. You paid a large deposit, indicating to the apartment owner that you would definitely be moving in. In future you should try to be clear with all monies given precisely what they are for, and get it in writing.

Edited September 28, 2009 by way2muchcoffee

[CWMcMurray]

I hate to pile on, but in this case I agree with everyone else....

It is not important that it did not say "non refundable" on the receipt as this is the standard, if you wanted it to be refundable, you would have needed him to state that this was refundable on the receipt.

I believe if you make it a requirement that the reservation fee is refundable, you are unlikely to be getting condo owners to reserve their condo for you anywhere in the world...

[Smile4u]

You made an agreement - you broke it = you loose your money.

" if we deserve to get at least 50% of the money back?" No.

Same all over the world.

Seems that your opinion differs from all other responses here ...

Check out the place daytime/evening/weekend, before you pay any money. What happend to you, have happend to many of us before.

Not fun to "loose 11K", but again you was the one who broke the agreement.

[sunnymarky]

Hello all,

My girlfriend and I have been looking for a new condo for rent and we found one. We checked it out during the day when there was not much traffic and it's about 10 minutes walk from MRT (Subway).

We then decided to take it and the owner said that we should pay the first deposit for 11,000 THB for the guarantee that we were seriously taking it and we thought that made sense so we paid.

Later on the week we agreed to sign the contract, we went there right after work which was around 5.30pm and there was a heavily congested traffic, no flyover to cross to the other side (where the condo is) so we had to go though cars to get to the other side.

We realized that we couldn't possibly live like this for another year since we have to commute to work by MRT. We decided to not sign the contract and talked to the owner right away. He said it was ok but would have to think about the deposit we paid.

Then he sent an email saying that he would not refund any of the money.

Would anybody let us know if we deserve to get at least 50% of the money back? Or it is the right thing for the owner to take this whole money?

Thanks everybody for their answer. It's highly appreciated.

just remember consumer rights for goods and services in Thailand are pathetic and even where there are some for a Falang to pursue any recovery is nigh on impossible.

[sunnymarky]

I think he has a right to keep the Deposit, like the other poster said, he might have turned other people away.

But, if he is a decent sort of chap, he should give half back, but there again, This is Thailand.

what 'this is Thailand'? mean - that he might refund the money!

thailand must be special; you wouldn't even have a chance in any other country

Lets make it clear in Thailand you don't get a refund for ANY goods or services, be the goods faulty and or the service not what you were told.In the UK there is a 14 day or 30 day period for most goods and some services ,contracts whereby you can change your mind and get your money back. THIS IS LAW Consumer rights. Handing over 11K Baht to a Thai without some signed paper and then changing your mind is a bad thing to do.

Edited September 28, 2009 by sunnymarky

[Guido1976]

Well, to tell everybody who said I was wrong in my thoughts. I'm not sure. I send an email to the farang landlord

that legally he had no rights to keep the full reservation fee.

And at the same day the money has been refunded. Without any twist or turn.

[sunnymarky]

Well, to tell everybody who said I was wrong in my thoughts. I'm not sure. I send an email to the farang landlord

that legally he had no rights to keep the full reservation fee.

And at the same day the money has been refunded. Without any twist or turn.

Hmmm Interesting it's the first time you mentioned a non thai landlord..I am guessing this is one big troll fake OP

[Guido1976]

Well, to tell everybody who said I was wrong in my thoughts. I'm not sure. I send an email to the farang landlord

that legally he had no rights to keep the full reservation fee.

And at the same day the money has been refunded. Without any twist or turn.

Hmmm Interesting it's the first time you mentioned a non thai landlord..I am guessing this is one big troll fake OP

Well, I also never said the landlord was a thai. But in the last post someone said that handing over 11K to a thai was not smart to do.

So I had to get that straight.

My girlfriend asked around at her work regarding this and everybody said the money had to be paid back.

She then asked the legal advisor of the company and they also said the money had to be paid back.

Anyway, This still does'nt give us a new conde so that search is still on.

And offcourse we gonna check out the new condo even more carefull. Lesson learned.

I did'nt expected the landlord to return it and already accepted it as a loss. But you have no and you can get yes.

So I just asked it back and on what legal grounds he assumed he could keep it.

No reply on that question, without hesistation it was refunded.

The landlord seems to be very reasonable and with this experience I can reccomand him.

If he has a condo which suits our needs I have no doubts to rent from him.

nothing fake or scam about this story. It happened to us and not even a week ago.

[sisteregg]

I have a problem with my landlord as well. She tries to keep about 40k baht of deposit and said she is not going to pay us back. Can anybody tell me how to get this deposit back. She is trying to charge me for the paintings and maintaining the house. This is really not fair to do that. Do I have any rights as a tenant to get my money back?

It's really frustrating.