Proof Of Retirement Income

[expatriot]

please correct my understanding that.... RETIREMENT visa.. 50+ years older... the financial qualifications are either A) 800,000 BAHT deposit into Thai bamk for period not less than 3 months... or evidence showing yeasrly income 400,000 BAHT..

Please advise papers to prepare income qualifications.... Immigration retirement Visa financial income source declaration,,,

The source of income reported is from a foreign bank...

Income source is a term deposit income... retained at a bank not inside Thailand, a bank with no remote office in Thailand...

The bank is a large VISA credit card recognized USA bank offices operating inside the USA

The interest income statement is prepared in US dollars as the annual earned interest % paid for the term deposit... by foreign USA bank...

Please advise what papers as the income documents are recognized to show income to Thailand Immigration... at time of Visa application...

Thank you

[jesimps]

My understanding of it is, if not married to a Thai, you need:

a) 800,000 baht deposited in a Thai bank for a period of not less than 3 months: or

An income equating to at least 65,000 baht according to the exchange rate at the time of the application.

c) An annual amount of deposit funds plus income providing the combination of the two comes to no less than 800,000 baht.

I do it on monthly income only (it's over 65,000 baht) by producing a copy of my UK P60 along with a letter from the British Honorary Consul. I believe you can also do it on income other than pension but I don't know what documents are required.

This is my understanding of the rules, someone else may tell you different. Hope it helps.

[pagallim]

Yes, proof of income (65,000 baht/month) has to be obtained from the relevant Embassy/Consulate. The amounts if actually married to a Thai reduce to 400,000 baht bank balance, or 40,000 baht/month income.

[Jingthing]

The USA embassy in Bangkok requires no proof of income to get your embassy letter that you use at Thai immigration. You put down the figure on their form and sign that it is true. Thai immigration officers, at their discretion, may ask you to back up this letter with some documentation. I don't know if the officers are more likely to ask for this documentation of Americans, who they know do not need to provide any proof to their embassies to get the letter.

Edited January 2, 2010 by Jingthing

[flying]

The USA embassy in Bangkok requires no proof of income to get your embassy letter that you use at Thai immigration. You put down the figure on their form and sign that it is true.

That is pretty interesting/amazing

[InterestedObserver]

The USA embassy in Bangkok requires no proof of income to get your embassy letter that you use at Thai immigration. You put down the figure on their form and sign that it is true.

That is pretty interesting/amazing

How so? The US Embassy is only administering an oath and witnessing a signature, not guaranteeing any amount stated on the proof of income form. You affirm (swear) that the information you provided on the form is true and accurate under penalty of perjury.

[flying]

The USA embassy in Bangkok requires no proof of income to get your embassy letter that you use at Thai immigration. You put down the figure on their form and sign that it is true.

That is pretty interesting/amazing

How so? The US Embassy is only administering an oath and witnessing a signature, not guaranteeing any amount stated on the proof of income form. You affirm (swear) that the information you provided on the form is true and accurate under penalty of perjury.

Well I meant it in contrast to the alternatives such as a seasoned savings account which leaves no doubt.

If it were consistent then they would also accept your sworn oath that you have that without the need for a bank book

[Jingthing]

The USA embassy in Bangkok requires no proof of income to get your embassy letter that you use at Thai immigration. You put down the figure on their form and sign that it is true.

That is pretty interesting/amazing

How so? The US Embassy is only administering an oath and witnessing a signature, not guaranteeing any amount stated on the proof of income form. You affirm (swear) that the information you provided on the form is true and accurate under penalty of perjury.

Most other embassies require more than your word, that's all.

I still think its important, even more so for Americans, to bring along some kind of documentation of income in case the officer asks for it. They have every right to do so.

Note to mods -- this thread belongs in the VISAS forum, yes?

Edited January 2, 2010 by Jingthing

[Mario2008]

Move to visa section.

[lopburi3]

1. A retirement visa (long stay non immigrant OA) is issued in home country - you seem to be asking about a one year extension of stay for retirement reasons.

2. Requirement requires 800k in Thai bank account 2 months (first time) and bank letter/account book; or 65k per month income and Embassy letter; or a combination to meet the 800k amount on a yearly basis.

3. The requirement does not change with marriage. But there are other extensions of stay available (not retirement) with different requirements.

[jazzbo]

quote 1: The USA embassy in Bangkok requires no proof of income to get your embassy letter that you use at Thai immigration. Quote 2.That is pretty interesting/amazing. Not really -- Here's at least in part why:

U.S. Consular officers are not empowered to authenticate public documents issued in the United States. Such documents include vital records (birth, marriage, death and divorce), as well as academic,

commercial,

or other credentials. Consular Officers do not have access to the records of the issuing office or the seal of the custodian of these records.

Procedures for Authentication and Legalizing Official Documents Issued In the United States

Official documents requiring authentication will need to be certified first by the entity that issued them, then by the state in which that entity is located, and then by the federal government (the U.S. State Department). Once the document has been authenticated by the U.S. State Department, the foreign embassy in the United States of the country requesting the document will perform a final authentication. Following is a brief outline of what will be required (though the actual requirements will vary greatly from state to state)...

To authenticate and legalize official documents issued in the United States, please follow the steps below. Thereafter, (lengthy) Steps 1-6.

http://bangkok.usembassy.gov/service/notarial-services.html

So, given the above, Thailand has agreed that a sworn statement before a US Consular Official, with Thai Immigration reserving the Right to request any document of additional proof, will suffice for a USA citizen for Proof of Income purposes... Remember Martha Stewart, the Billionaire, who was sent to jail, not for illegal stock trades, but for lying to a US government Official... beyond any documents, the real giveaway the Thai Immigration Police will notice is body language.

[expatriot]

Interpolations of financial documents ("or other regular income from a source outside of Thailand;")

Back ground bank deposit... financial outside of Thailand

Investment income... retained term (time period) bank deposit, 7%AUD interest income.

Banks calculate the annual percentage income on principle term deposits... Percentage of

Bank Deposit interest compounded is the cash income available after one year if one decide

to withdraw... or one may decide to compound and continue term deposit i.e. over 5 years....

Declaration of income from ("outside of Thailand") is vague... worded as monthly income amount..

not specified as the ANNUAL income qualification generated outside of Thailand..

May Immigration interpolate regular annual 7% interest income? replace worded 65,000 Baht monthly?

Or

Some other mechanisms of monthly 65,000 Baht cash flow transfer is mandatory for retirement VISA ?

("or other regular income from a source outside of Thailand;")

From the US Ebassy qualifications for Retirement Visa

Retirement Visas

Retirement visas for Thailand are available to foreigners 50 years of age or older. These visas are valid for only one year and employment of any kind is strictly prohibited. According to Thai immigration, applicants must meet the following qualifications:

Applicant must be able to provide proof of a pension or other regular income from a source outside of Thailand;

Applicant’s pension or other regular income must be no less than the equivalent of 65,000 Baht per month;

Alternatively, the applicant may meet the financial requirement by maintaining a Thai bank account with a minimum amount of 800,000 Baht. (Applicants will need to show that they have 800,000 Baht in savings each year when they renew their visa.)

Any applicant married to a Thai citizen may be able to receive a visa on that basis rather than retirement.

For additional requirements and information, please consult the Ministry of Foreign Affairs or the Royal Thai Embassy in Washington, D.C. websites.

[Jingthing]

I find your post unclear.

Anyway, some points.

The US embassy info (why are you looking there??) about THAI retirement qualifications is missing the COMBO method. That involves adding your ANNUAL income PLUS your banked Thai account to get annual extensions based on retirement IN Thailand. That amount must exceed 800K annually.

This monthly/annual thing is a red herring. Just multiply the monthly by 12 and you have the annual. If you are using the combo method, just annualize it.

If you are have enough income to qualify by income alone, the income must be 65K monthly or more. Yes 65K x 12 equals 780K, not 800K. That is quirky but that's the rules.

You do need to find the exchange rate the immigration office will use. It is safer to assume a very bad exchange rate while preparing to qualify.

Edited January 3, 2010 by Jingthing

[RickSee]

I find your post unclear.

Anyway, some points.

The US embassy info (why are you looking there??) about THAI retirement qualifications is missing the COMBO method. That involves adding your ANNUAL income PLUS your banked Thai account to get annual extensions based on retirement IN Thailand. That amount must exceed 800K annually.

This monthly/annual thing is a red herring. Just multiply the monthly by 12 and you have the annual. If you are using the combo method, just annualize it.

If you are have enough income to qualify by income alone, the income must be 65K monthly or more. Yes 65K x 12 equals 780K, not 800K. That is quirky but that's the rules.

You do need to find the exchange rate the immigration office will use. It is safer to assume a very bad exchange rate while preparing to qualify.

If I understand correctly, the demonstrated monthly income does not need to be shown to be coming into Thailand, while the lump sum deposit (Bht 800k, or whatever combo) must be shown to be held in a Thai bank. Is that right?

[Jingthing]

Correctomundo.

That's for extensions.

For those going for an O-A in their home country, even the banked amount does not need to be in Thailand.

Edited January 3, 2010 by Jingthing

[expatriot]

Note... the following RULES are interpolated for RETIREMENT O and O-A Visa conversions... People who have 2 or more

homes or travel to other foreign countries for business, family, etc.. away.. therefore can not return... apply at original home

country of residence.. do not have time to wait for O-A retirement Visa application inside their home country...

Thank you for explanation of Retirement qualifications financial responsibility outside of Thailand.... Example of $AUD term

banking deposit.... 7% interest income compounded annually as is accepted 800,000 BAHT annual income qualification

specification....

1) One can apply for category (Multiple Entry) O Retirement VISA at Thai airport and at the time of arrival?...

2) If not then please explain.... information, papers requested for category O (multiple entry) Visa at time of airport arrival?

3) One who has (multiple entry) category O Retirement Visa... may leave and enter Thailand during 90 day Visa time term??

4) Before 90 day time expiration of category O visa... (apply inside Thailand for multiple entry retirement O-A VISA)

financial qualification interest income... from foreign bank... earned per year.. >800,000 BAHT??

5) One can not apply for category Retirement O-A Visa direct at the airport at the time of arrival??....

7) After arrival at Thailand receiving category O Visa (multiple entry/departure) one must wait 90 days and

then apply convert category O visa to the category O-A Visa... One may leave Thailand on a multiple entry O

Visa but must return before 90 days to apply and convert the Retirement O Visa to the O-A visa....

Thank you again for all patient comments that prepare one to complete airport arrival retirement applications that

are not guided, prepared, executed from inside the applicant resident country.. rather the application is to be

executed at time of airport arrival as explained herein... and prepared for as suggested here with your comments

[lopburi3]

1. No and there is no such visa - retirement visa is OA - an O multi entry would only be issued by a Consulate outside Thailand.

2. Have no idea what you are asking.

3. A multi entry O visa yes you can enter unlimited time during validity for up to 90 days each stay.

4. Apply for one year extension of stay for retirement (not a visa) and requirement is 800k in Thai bank account for 2 months or 65k income by Embassy letter or combination to meet the 800k total.

5. No. Only in home/residence country.

6. ?

7. You apply for extension of stay per 4 above. You can do this on any 90 day entry during the last 30 days.

[Jingthing]

It is 100 percent impossible to apply for an O or an O-A visa upon Thailand airport arrival.

Rather than answering your very unusual questions, it is best for you to learn the two major ways this is done, and then just do one of those.

Option 1 --

Arrive in Thailand with a single entry O visa obtained at a Thai embassy or consulate outside Thailand (does not have to be your home country)

Alternatively, if you lack an O visa on arrival, arrive with a 30 day stamp or tourist visa and CONVERT that to a single entry O at the local Thai immigration OFFICE (not the airport) that is closest to your residence in Thailand. The conversion must be applied for with at least 21 days left on your permission to stay, so a tourist visa would be much better than a 30 day stamp. Not all Thai immigration offices will do this. You need to state which office you will be using and ask if you choose this scenario. Otherwise, just get a single entry O visa as above.

Then, apply for an annual extension based on retirement at your local Thai immigration OFFICE (not the airport). Typically this is done with 30 days left on your extension to stay. If you did the conversion as above, sometimes they will do both applications on the same date, its up to the officer.

To qualify for the extension, use one of the methods -- 800K in a Thai bank for at least 2 months, OR income letter from your embassy/consulate in Thailand (showing 800K per annum or perhaps 65K per month), OR use the COMBO method which is money in a Thai bank plus embassy letter exceeding 800K per annum

Option 2 --

Obtain an O-A visa from your home country. Enter Thailand, get a 12 month stay. If the O-A is a multiple entry you can enter Thailand again before that 12 months and get an additional year. If staying long term, you will later apply for extensions based on retirment in Thailand (at your local immigration office, not the airport) subject the same rules as Option 1

For trips outside Thailand you need reentry permits obtained at your Thai immigration office to keep your current extension of stay valid. An exception would be if your multientry O-A is still valid.

So, in summary, pick which of these options is best for you, and then continue to ask questions until you are clear about the process.

Edited January 5, 2010 by Jingthing

[true blue]

My understanding of it is, if not married to a Thai, you need:

a) 800,000 baht deposited in a Thai bank for a period of not less than 3 months: or

An income equating to at least 65,000 baht according to the exchange rate at the time of the application.

c) An annual amount of deposit funds plus income providing the combination of the two comes to no less than 800,000 baht.

I do it on monthly income only (it's over 65,000 baht) by producing a copy of my UK P60 along with a letter from the British Honorary Consul. I believe you can also do it on income other than pension but I don't know what documents are required.

This is my understanding of the rules, someone else may tell you different. Hope it helps.

ive included my dividends income last 3 years,you do get a dividend tax certificate.

[expatriot]

Many thanks to Jingthing posted explanations described as option 1 or option 2...

Bibliography of prior posted history project a snap shot of why I ask and now

select Option 1 described by Thai member Jingthing...

As part of Option 2.. it is not practcal to spend 2 thousand dollars fly to USA and

wait for a O or OA visa application from a USA hotel room...

Vietnam Thai embassy not staffed at the present time with English speaking

translators.. I got polite smiles rambling in broken Vietnamese and English words..

I was shown the door to the rest room after I put my hands together to form a

picture of the letter O... since I was requesting the O visa application... I left the

Vietnam embassy...

Below is the schedule to renew a Viet 90 day VISA and at same time complete steps to Thai O Visa

OK then Option 1 it is... please review once again before my final departure to

Thailand in pursuit of the sequence acquisitions for the Tourist, the O and finaly the OA retirement visa...

My schedule for O VISA application window is related to simultaneous Viet Visa renewal and inside 14 days

total time January enter and then depart Thailand airport.. I plan return <90 days for OA conversion... So

I must have continuity provided with MULTIPLE entry applications to synchronize with Viet Visa renewals

during this period of a household relocation chaos... your patient understanding is welcomed...

1) January 2010 Arrival at airport apply at immigration and get a first time entry 30 day tourist VISA

2) CONVERT tourist VISA to MULTIPLE entry O VISA arrival at Thai immigration OFFICE (not airport) closest to

my target hotel room residence located Pataya.. Apply for O Visa as quickly as possible after arrival...

4) PLEASE ADVISE WHAT OTHER DOCUMENTS REQUESTED AT PATAYA for O conversion?

(financial? business resume? Pataya hotel rental invoice? etc. etc.)

All requested documents delivered to CONVERT TOURIST VISA to MULTIPLE ENTRY O VISA...

5) I schedule Pataya return before MULTIPLE entry 90 day O VISA expires and APPLY for MULtIPLE entry OA

VISA May2010?

6) Please review sequence of steps and comment.. since the object of operations is also synchronize with

Viet 90 day Visa renewals... therefore timing is important to complete phases of the VISA mission

Not all Thai immigration offices will do this. You need to state which office you will be using and ask if you choose this scenario

[TerryLH]

1) January 2010 Arrival at airport apply at immigration and get a first time entry 30 day tourist VISA

That is not a visa. It is a visa exempt entry. Visas are obtained at Thai embassies or consulates.

2) CONVERT tourist VISA to MULTIPLE entry O VISA arrival at Thai immigration OFFICE (not airport) closest to

my target hotel room residence located Pataya.. Apply for O Visa as quickly as possible after arrival...

While it may be possible to convert a tourist visa at immigration, you would not get a multiple entry.

4) PLEASE ADVISE WHAT OTHER DOCUMENTS REQUESTED AT PATAYA for O conversion?

(financial? business resume? Pataya hotel rental invoice? etc. etc.)

All requested documents delivered to CONVERT TOURIST VISA to MULTIPLE ENTRY O VISA...

Re-read answer to #2.

5) I schedule Pataya return before MULTIPLE entry 90 day O VISA expires and APPLY for MULtIPLE entry OA

VISA May2010?

Forget O-A. That can only be obtained at an embassy or consulate in your home country.

Most retirees are on extensions of an "O" visa, not O-A's.

6) Please review sequence of steps and comment.. since the object of operations is also synchronize with

Viet 90 day Visa renewals... therefore timing is important to complete phases of the VISA mission

I suggest you stop using a dictionary to write sentences with.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Get a non O visa at a Thai embassy or consulate. That can be done in Laos or Malaysia if you don't do it in your home country.

Enter Thailand. During the last 30 days of the 90 day entry, go to immigration and get a one year extension of the O visa - based on retirement.

Prior to going to immigration go to your country's embassy in Bkk or your consulate in CM and get a letter of proof of income. Contact your embassy for what they need to give you the letter.

This isn't rocket science. If I can do it, I'd assume that anyone can do it.

Good luck.

[lopburi3]

1. No such visa. You present passport without a visa and obtain a 30 day permitted to stay stamp. It is called visa exempt entry. Airline may require you to have outbound tickets within 30 days or arrival to allow boarding for flight into Bangkok.

2. Impossable. Multi entry visas are only issued at Consulates outside Thailand and you would probably not qualify at most.

4. You can not convert to a multi entry non immigrant O visa in Thailand.

5. You can not obtain and OA visa in Thailand.

6. Please try reading above posts again. If you arrive without a non immigrant visa you will have to convert at immigration to a single entry for 2,000 baht and later extend your stay for 1 year for 1,900 baht. The requirement is 800k in Thai bank account or letter from your Embassy of 65k per month income or combination. For any travel outside of Thailand on an extension of stay you must buy a re-entry permit.

[Jingthing]

Lopburi, correct.

One note, it IS possible at Pattaya immigration to convert a 30 day entry stamp to a SINGLE entry O visa IF you are qualified to apply for the annual extension and you have at least 21 days left on the 30 days at time of application. It may be wiser to get a TOURIST visa in Vietnam as that will give you more time to get your application ready for the conversion application (also need 21 days left when applying). WHEN you get your annual extension based on retirement, at that time, you can apply for a multiple reenty permit which will allow you to keep your one year permission to stay alive as you leave and reenter Thailand. OP, you really should stop using the term O-A visa. The scenario we are now talking about will NEVER involve an O-A visa.

[lopburi3]

The question was "CONVERT tourist VISA to MULTIPLE entry O VISA arrival at Thai immigration OFFICE" and that is not possible at any office.

I provided reference to the routine change information in para 6.

[devaram]

A very important question regarding the USA embassy statement of income would be DO THEY ASK FOR YOUR SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER?

[devaram]

The USA embassy in Bangkok requires no proof of income to get your embassy letter that you use at Thai immigration. You put down the figure on their form and sign that it is true. Thai immigration officers, at their discretion, may ask you to back up this letter with some documentation. I don't know if the officers are more likely to ask for this documentation of Americans, who they know do not need to provide any proof to their embassies to get the letter.

Does the usa embassy record your social security number when you declare your income?

[lopburi3]

They record your passport number - they already have your social security number on file in box 5 of your DS-11 passport application.

[devaram]

They record your passport number - they already have your social security number on file in box 5 of your DS-11 passport application.

Has anyone ever complained that they were punished by the usa government because they exaggerated their income to get a thai visa?

[Jingthing]

They record your passport number - they already have your social security number on file in box 5 of your DS-11 passport application.

Has anyone ever complained that they were punished by the usa government because they exaggerated their income to get a thai visa?

If that did lead to a criminal charge against someone, do you actually think anyone would broadcast that on a public forum?

[tropo]

The USA embassy in Bangkok requires no proof of income to get your embassy letter that you use at Thai immigration. You put down the figure on their form and sign that it is true. Thai immigration officers, at their discretion, may ask you to back up this letter with some documentation. I don't know if the officers are more likely to ask for this documentation of Americans, who they know do not need to provide any proof to their embassies to get the letter.

Did they ask you to provide proof? If they did, what proof did they want to see.