Thai Army Defends The Effectiveness Of Gt200 Bomb Detector

[webfact]

CONTROVERSIAL BOMB DETECTOR

Dogs could sniff bomb out better than GT200

Published on January 26, 2010

BANGKOK: - The Army yesterday defended the effectiveness of the GT200 bomb detector despite the fact the UK has banned the export and use of the equipment, due to its ineffectiveness.

In response to reporters' angry questions about the British-made scanner, Army chief Anupong Paochinda shot back: "Is the company using you to ask these questions?"

Joint Military Police Civilian Taskforce commander Lt-General Kasikorn Kirisri said the GT200 scanner was very useful in detecting and preventing explosions in the deep South, where violent incidents on an almost daily basis have killed more than 3,900 people to date.

"Not using the bomb detector may affect efforts to restore peace in the deep South," he warned, adding that there might have been some problems with the detector, but they mostly involved human error.

Fourth Army Region Commander Lt-General Pichet Wisaichorn said the military would continue using the equipment in the South until it had something else.

However, the police believe the bomb detector is not effective enough, with only a 30-40-per-cent reliability factor, which means the chance of it failing is higher than succeeding.

"It is not accurate. If the operator is too close to the target - less than 3 metres - it will not work," said Pol Senior Sgt-Major Chan Warongpaisit, who regularly operates the equipment in the South.

Meanwhile, the BBC reported the UK had banned the export of ADE651 and other similar bomb detectors to Iraq and Afghanistan because they did not work.

Just like the ADE651, no tests have proved the GT200 to be totally effective. Yet manufacturer Global Technical claims it can detect all kinds of explosive substances and narcotics within a 700-metre radius on land and 800 metres under water.

The GT200, powered by the movements of the operator, becomes active when the operator is moving and starts receiving signals from the magnetic signature of the targeted substance, the company says on its website.

Yet, the GT200 failed to detect many bombs in the deep South, which led to several tragic incidents. Last October, two bombs killed two people and injured dozens of others in Yala and Narathiwat provinces after the so-called bomb detector failed to detect any explosive devices in the area. However, military officials say the operators were in an excited state, which prevented the equipment from working properly.

In reality though, bomb detectors like the GT200 have never succeeded in double-blind tests. A test of the equipment conducted for Thai authorities by a sales agent resulted in a "random chance" finding, which meant a sniffer dog would be better at detecting explosives.

A 1999 guideline from the US Justice Department regarding commercial explosive-detection systems said so far, there were no devices that could successfully detect specific materials like explosives as part of controlled double-blind tests.

The GT200 was previously known as the Mole substance detector, but the manufacturer changed its name because the Mole detector failed to pass scientific testing in the US, one expert said.

An Chulalongkorn University engineer said the bomb detector was being used in the deep South as if it were a magic dowsing rod.

Meanwhile, residents in the South wonder if officials believe the device is a lie detector, because they always use it when trying to prove if any suspects - held over suspicions of having made or planted bombs - had contact with explosive substances.

Human-rights defender Pornpen Khongkajornkiart said many fellow activists questioned the GT200's effectiveness and advised the government to review the equipment and conduct tests to prove its quality.

Meanwhile, Dr Pornthip Rojanasunand, director of the Forensic Science Institute and who always uses the GT200, said the UK had only banned the ADE651.

She said the detector was effective when searching for bombs and even nails under water.

-- The Nation 2010-01-26

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

[Hardback]

The military should check out the recent BBC Newsnight report regarding these scanners which were shown to be nothing more than dowsing rods. This is just face-saving, they got scammed good and proper.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQMwXo1SSVo (link to BBC story)

[Tywais]

In other words, your odds are better by tossing a coin.

[p_brownstone]

Gambling with peoples' lives, giving them a false sense of security rather than admit they were conned.

Truly pathetic.

Patrick

[Asa]

How many times that Thai officials try to defend their decision made earlier without listening to a new findings about scams, bogus equipment, frauds as if they are at the wrong in doing so. Why not hear the finding first and make necessary judgement if the thing should be used in the future. Don't be stupid by defending the equipment and put servicemen at risk.

[sharecropper]

I suspect this was a well padded project for the military and this might explain his Canute-like stance on the dowsing rods.

[Lost in LOS]

what is unbelievable to me it how stupid are these governments? It is pretty easy to see if a bomb tester works, just supply a bomb, I am sure most countries can get one readily, pass the machine over it and wa-la, test over

[Thai at Heart]

Ummm.

It has to work, because someone here signed off on it and got paid to do so.

This kind of embarrassing purchase has everything to do with corruption and nothing to do with bomb detection.

[Reasonableman]

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/01/22/do..._detector_bust/

The Iraqi government has bought 1,500 ADEs from ATSC for a total of $85m. McCormick told the Times that he'd provided the ADE-651s for no less than $8,000 each - some $12m. The other $73m apparently went on training and "middlemen", the paper said.

Major General Jehad al-Jabiri of the Iraqi interior ministry insisted last year that he really believes in the ADE.

"Whether it's magic or scientific, what I care about is it detects bombs," he told the New York Times last year. He even went so far as to "demonstrate" that it worked by placing a grenade and a submachinegun in his office (in plain sight) and having one of his policemen "detect" them with the ADE. When a reporter couldn't get the dowsing rod to work, the general blithely stated:

"You need more training."

what is unbelievable to me it how stupid are these governments? It is pretty easy to see if a bomb tester works, just supply a bomb, I am sure most countries can get one readily, pass the machine over it and wa-la, test over

[Sunny Valentine]

Follow the money trail.

[mythBuster]

Just like the Iraqi army and the British authorities Anupong is criminally neglecting the well being of people. The sole fact that someone does not take apart a bomb scanner like the BBC did and is not able to figure out that there is nothing in it and the fact that they do not read the CIA statements makes this gentleman a disgrace.

If Anupong had seen the report on the BBC and read the reports of the American government he would know that the equipment is completely ineffective. Fact is however that there must have been fine kickbacks from the company selling it. Once again, Thai journalists did not ask the right questions. How come Anupong and his friends can drive big Benz cars have lots of property on a salary of far less than 100,000 THB a month? The petrol is more expensive so they need a but more income.

From the Iraqi army and decision makers nothing better can be expected you might expect from a Thai army general that he takes apart an piece of equipment and at least ask his computer experts to analyze the software. But than again maybe the general things that keeping up an appearance is more important than the truth.

Anupong should ask himself the question why he believes that he is smarter than professors in the best American and European universities who do not claim but know for sure that all of this equipment is completely useless and does no better job than any random inspection.

[mythBuster]

what is unbelievable to me it how stupid are these governments? It is pretty easy to see if a bomb tester works, just supply a bomb, I am sure most countries can get one readily, pass the machine over it and wa-la, test over

Why do you think the poor are sick and tired of these morons. They know that these people do not protect anything except for their own wallets. Anupong is just thriving on chaos. They all lack integrity and they truly think that their subject still do not go to school and that they can get away with it. 40,000 pound a piece equipment that costs 50 Pound Sterling to make leaves a lot of room for kickbacks. Follow the money and you know why they are making these claims. Or did you think second homes at Khao Yai comes cheap?

[Sabum]

pass the machine over it and wa-la, test over

It's VOILA not wa-la.....

[PhilHarries]

pass the machine over it and wa-la, test over

It's VOILA not wa-la.....

If it's a magic wand it should be "Hey presto!".

This kind of screw up is mostly possible where people are promoted to positions of power and authority based on who they know rather than their technical ability. Hence Thailand is prime target.

[AsiaCheese]

Simply from the manufacturer's claim "starts receiving signals from the magnetic signature of the targeted substance", one must conclude that the effectiveness of such devices is on par with homeopathy...

There are millions of people being suckered into all sorts of "magic" schemes on a daily basis, which is bad enough. But to think that governments find themselves on the receiving end of such sucker schemes is hair-raising to say the least: they're spending large amounts of taxpayers' money (that could go to umpteen more sensible causes) on something that puts their own people (soldiers) in grave danger!

Every country has a scientific community who should be able to assess whether something like this works or is just a scam. But then, there's always the tea-money aspect too...

[Thailand]

Same stance from the Iraqi military, too many pay offs- come on Mr Abhisit get these things checked out and if they are as crook as they seem heads need to roll, it's simply criminal.

[bangon04]

Gambling with peoples' lives, giving them a false sense of security rather than admit they were conned.

Truly pathetic.

Patrick

Likewise see the thread on airport scanning X-rays and other technological breakthroughs.

Likewise the vaccines and medicines for the flu "pandemic"

[slapout]

For a widget that advertised cost is 13,500 US amid claims of 900,000 baht cost here in Thailand, I am not sure who got scammed/conned. Just another typical day in the market place of Thailand.

[AsiaCheese]

For a widget that advertised cost is 13,500 US amid claims of 900,000 baht cost here in Thailand, I am not sure who got scammed/conned. Just another typical day in the market place of Thailand.

Luxury goods tax, VAT, built-in tea money -- which part don't you understand?

[Oberkommando]

These bomb detectors are perfect for a nation that is superstitious, and who's leaders regularly base their decisions on the predictions of fortune tellers.

Who needs science?

[Hardback]

Suthep Thaugsuban, deputy PM has also public defended these devices saying "Don't worry we are using a different brand".

This would be funny if lives weren't at stake.

[Nuchanart]

http://www.waydownhere.com/2008/10/11/fore...es-pad-members/

Interesting read. I think this tool is very useful, if used in the right way. Thanks Khunying for being a PAD supporter. I really love you as much as I love your hair.

[chantorn]

I bet you a dollar that these fake equipments were bought be Thaksin, and not Mark.

[Nuchanart]

"The Central Forensic Science Institute also used the GT 200."

I can take it that the Thai police and army are stupid. But the Central Forensic Science Institute too? I mean Khunying?

[Lost in LOS]

pass the machine over it and wa-la, test over

It's VOILA not wa-la.....

its wa-la for me, I don't speak french, but thanks for the help

Edited January 27, 2010 by Lost in LOS

[geriatrickid]

"The Central Forensic Science Institute also used the GT 200."

I can take it that the Thai police and army are stupid. But the Central Forensic Science Institute too? I mean Khunying?

No.

Meanwhile, Dr Pornthip Rojanasunand, director of the Forensic Science Institute and who always uses the GT200, said the UK had only banned the ADE651.

She said the detector was effective when searching for bombs and even nails under water.

I hope that now people can understand why I do not have much respect her. She seems to have never met a microphone that she didn't like. Unfortunately, this position will undercut her credibility. I wonder if she watched too many Quincy, ME shows,

[Thai at Heart]

"The Central Forensic Science Institute also used the GT 200."

I can take it that the Thai police and army are stupid. But the Central Forensic Science Institute too? I mean Khunying?

No.

Meanwhile, Dr Pornthip Rojanasunand, director of the Forensic Science Institute and who always uses the GT200, said the UK had only banned the ADE651.

She said the detector was effective when searching for bombs and even nails under water.

I hope that now people can understand why I do not have much respect her. She seems to have never met a microphone that she didn't like. Unfortunately, this position will undercut her credibility. I wonder if she watched too many Quincy, ME shows,

I couldn't agree more. She is in the limelight far far too much. The fact that she thinks this machine works says it all. Why would you want to find nails under water anyway?

This machine is quite odd, in the fact that wouldn't sniffer dogs achieve largely the same result and 1/10th of the price?

[hazz]

So many big, self important people are going to look so foolish.

I think one primary use the army and police have for these is that by simply moving your hand a millimetre or two you came make the magic wand point at anyone. Then you can arrest them on suspicion of what ever and do what is needed to get the confession.

Its very telling that the "The Central Forensic Science Institute" have used these says stacks about their professionalism. I wonder if any of the defenders of the GT-200 would be prepared to demonstrate the device with a little bit of de-mining along the cambodian border, either way the results would be good

[Hawk]

Meanwhile, Dr Pornthip Rojanasunand, director of the Forensic Science Institute and who always uses the GT200, said the UK had only banned the ADE651.

She said the detector was effective when searching for bombs and even nails under water.

Under water bombs, absolutely amazing. Are the "southerners" trying to sink the Thai navy now?

And nails as well?

But what's the point of looking for wet, rusty old nails?

[majorpacman]

The thai army is stupid, they defending using because they found out it defective or scammed device. They just trying to cover their ass. If i was an thai military officer, i would not let my men use it. They probably have safe money and have better luck if they pick a up a rock or tree branch and use it to detect bombs or terroist...........just plain stupid...and they still using trying to detect bombs,,,,just very stupid.

Edited January 27, 2010 by majorpacman