6,000 Guns And Explosives Stolen From Thai Army Barracks

[nowork114]

Just for your information - one pallet holds 8 crates each with 10 guns - that means one pallet = 80 guns. I uploaded some photos here http://pbckt.com/sB.wC9

On the photos are Czech made SA58 - a bit similar like AK-47 - in a long-term storage. M16 and other weapons ale stored like this too.

In case someone wants to steal 6,000 guns you can do the calculations ...

Edited March 7, 2010 by nowork114

[eggomaniac]

How could it possibly be the Reds who pulled this off? Don't you remember, there is no support for the Reds in the South, it's only the poor and uneducated in the North? Also, don't you remember the Thai Visa Headlines, Military against the Reds?

--------- Yes, I am being facetious. My previous Posts have stated the Red movement is highly underestimated. There IS support in the South from shop keepers and upwardly mobile tradesmen. Also, generals don't get to where they are by being politically stupid. They will measure which side to line up with.

---------

Just walk to lake in the southern insurgents moccasins for a minute. What do you think their impression of all this is?

A civil war in Thailand would be an answer to their prayers.

Notice, how they have been particularily quiet lately, hunkered down?

Remember, they have access to World leading strategists on insurgency and take overs. I think they are planning THEIR move to coincide with when Thailand is rolling in the soi fighting amongst themselves. With the Reds and Yellows on the ground, they will be able to walk in and take over the shop in the South.

They don't need to rope a dope, the dopes have the ropes arpound each others' necks already.

---------

There is Solution to put Thailand on the road to Stability and peace, The Joseph Solution.

[animatic]

Looking at it from the disinformation angle.

Just taking them and hiding them down south in a field,

would make for some very nervous security personal at the demo,

when 6 long range snipers start taking quick shots at them...

Are there six or 6,000, could make for some panicking and rash actions.

600 is an accounting snafu or loss, 6,000 sounds MUCH more deliberate...

"Maybe it's a lie."

Maybe it's a whole Russian Doll set of lies within lies.

Riddles wrapped in conundrums;

no matter what, who has the most to worry about it?

Edited March 7, 2010 by animatic

[animatic]

How could it possibly be the Reds who pulled this off?

Don't you remember, there is no support for the Reds in the South, it's only the poor and uneducated in the North?

There is quite limited suport from all but Issan migrant construction workers in the south,

the shop keeper argument is none too strong, except for one VERY important segment.

THE ARMY GRUNTS...

how many drafted Issanese are in the army and sent to do year tours in the south?

Plenty, canon fodder they are called. Sent down to use the GT200 no less.

More than just a few and they don't suddenly shed their home town roots and thinking

by a getting a draft notice. They also have instant obedience and not asking questions beaten

into them by their superiors for their whole tours. Standard army spec obedience from the lower ranks.

So, could a high ranking set of officers strips with an accent from home and ginned up papers,

get most officers and enlisted personnel on an army base to do pretty much anything?

Load these trucks from this list NOW soldier! Good bet yes.

Especially if said officer doesn't care about later repercussions, because he's going for broke.

And once the deed is done and more info comes in there is the self questioning by the on base pawns,

'well I followed order's, but 'were they good', 'should I report this and to whom',

'Will I not get cashiered for reporting it or cashiered for reporting it?'

Will my boss at high rank lose face...? oh well silence is good.

So many valid reasons why this can be an inside job and pulled off cleanly for a week or longer.

Edited March 7, 2010 by animatic

[elcent]

if Abhisit and the democrats not act swiftly things will be completely out of control.

Recommended Agenda for this week

Indictment of PAD - SERIOUS AND URGENT so that they can't work around at the expenses of Thai people

Call for an election.

After the election, indictment of the coup leaders from 2006, regardless of their self honored amnesty.

Why did they need a self amnesty if a coup would be legal by any means?

Who else you think is interested in troubles? Smell the coffee.

[OZEMADE]

Looking at it from the disinformation angle.

Just taking them and hiding them down south in a field,

would make for some very nervous security personal at the demo,

when 6 long range snipers start taking quick shots at them...

Are there six or 6,000, could make for some panicking and rash actions.

600 is an accounting snafu or loss, 6,000 sounds MUCH more deliberate...

"Maybe it's a lie."

Maybe it's a whole Russian Doll set of lies within lies.

Riddles wrapped in conundrums;

no matter what, who has the most to worry about it?

But they forgot the bullets and the det cord.

[DavidHouston]

I am a bit confused regarding the facts in the news report. The following comes from Matichon:

จากกรณีที่ นายณัฐวุฒิ ใสยเกื้อ แกนนำแนวร่วมประชาธิปไตยต่อต้านเผด็จการแห่งชาติ(นปช.) หรือคนเสื้อแดง เปิดเผยว่า คลังอาวุธของกองพันทหารช่างที่ 401 จังหวัดพัทลุง ซึ่งอยู่ภายใต้การดูแลของกองทัพภาคที่ 4 ถูกงัดแงะ โดยมีอาวุธและวัตถุระเบิดหายไปหลายรายการ อาทิ ระเบิดเอ็ม 67 หายไปจำนวน 69 ลูก กระสุนปืนเอชเค 3,100 นัด และปืนพกอีกจำนวนหนึ่ง ซึ่งสอดคล้องกับกระแสข่าวการการก่อวินาศกรรม นั้น

Mr. Narawut Saikua, a leader of the UDD or the “red shirts” discussed the events which occurred at the arsenal of the 401^st Engineering Regiment, under the command of the Fourth Army Group in Patalung Province. Many weapons and explosive material disappeared from the arsenal including 69 M67 grenades; 3,100 HK bullets; and an additional number of side arms. This information is consistent with the rumors of sabotage which have previously been revealed.

Is the amount of weapons 6,000 or does this number refer to the number of bullets?

[rhondda]

if Abhisit and the democrats not act swiftly things will be completely out of control.

Recommended Agenda for this week

Indictment of PAD - SERIOUS AND URGENT so that they can't work around at the expenses of Thai people

Call for an election.

After the election, indictment of the coup leaders from 2006, regardless of their self honored amnesty.

Why did they need a self amnesty if a coup would be legal by any means?

Who else you think is interested in troubles? Smell the coffee.

This is stupid the Democrats were elected honestly and fairly they joined with a collation to form the government this is a legit administration. But they are far too lilly livered to do very much about the real threat that they and the country face.

[peter48]

Probably the same level of security as allowing the rabble to walk in and take over the International Airport despite the heavy security that should have been in place to protect Thailand's international passengers and tourists from sudden terrorist attacks - frightening!

[rhondda]

We find out,next week with the red rally.I'm happy that I'm not living in Bangkok.

I was told by red friends not to go to bkk on those days.

Typical piece of scaremongering - you should have lived through the 'troubles' in Northern Ireland to know what real insurrection is.

[animatic]

So because of threats of a red rally they should just call the election?

Well that argument has been used all year. Hasn't worked.

All the repeated reports of dead in 2 weeks, won't last the spring, out by Songkran,

The petition drive and huge march Sept 19th aniversary massive rally etc etc.

Guess what they are still there.

Last gasp of Thaksins money now to keep a grouping together.

So they need to change the game, playing... acchmm, 'fair' hasn't worked.

Like accusations and doctored sound tracks and blatant lies in the legislature,

and multiple censure attempts... a year later violence denied, but violence used,

may sadly be the only tool the have left to play.

Edited March 7, 2010 by animatic

[elcent]

if Abhisit and the democrats not act swiftly things will be completely out of control.

Recommended Agenda for this week

Indictment of PAD - SERIOUS AND URGENT so that they can't work around at the expenses of Thai people

Call for an election.

After the election, indictment of the coup leaders from 2006, regardless of their self honored amnesty.

Why did they need a self amnesty if a coup would be legal by any means?

Who else you think is interested in troubles? Smell the coffee.

This is stupid the Democrats were elected honestly and fairly they joined with a collation to form the government this is a legit administration. But they are far too lilly livered to do very much about the real threat that they and the country face.

Why did Abhisit himself say that he isn't happy about the way his admin came to power. It is legal no doubt. But still, no excuse to hang on. Why did the former coup leader admit that the coup was wrong? With a wrong coup the nation got a wrong constitution with no option for people to choose.

[OZEMADE]

I am a bit confused regarding the facts in the news report. The following comes from Matichon:

จากกรณีที่ นายณัฐวุฒิ ใสยเกื้อ แกนนำแนวร่วมประชาธิปไตยต่อต้านเผด็จการแห่งชาติ(นปช.) หรือคนเสื้อแดง เปิดเผยว่า คลังอาวุธของกองพันทหารช่างที่ 401 จังหวัดพัทลุง ซึ่งอยู่ภายใต้การดูแลของกองทัพภาคที่ 4 ถูกงัดแงะ โดยมีอาวุธและวัตถุระเบิดหายไปหลายรายการ อาทิ ระเบิดเอ็ม 67 หายไปจำนวน 69 ลูก กระสุนปืนเอชเค 3,100 นัด และปืนพกอีกจำนวนหนึ่ง ซึ่งสอดคล้องกับกระแสข่าวการการก่อวินาศกรรม นั้น

Mr. Narawut Saikua, a leader of the UDD or the "red shirts" discussed the events which occurred at the arsenal of the 401^st Engineering Regiment, under the command of the Fourth Army Group in Patalung Province. Many weapons and explosive material disappeared from the arsenal including 69 M67 grenades; 3,100 HK bullets; and an additional number of side arms. This information is consistent with the rumors of sabotage which have previously been revealed.

Is the amount of weapons 6,000 or does this number refer to the number of bullets?

The original thread states, Informed sources claim about 6,000 assault rifles and a large amount of explosives were taken from Engineering Regiment 401, part of the Fourth Army Region, in Phatthalung Province, and the theft was only discovered on Tuesday.

[elcent]

Probably the same level of security as allowing the rabble to walk in and take over the International Airport despite the heavy security that should have been in place to protect Thailand's international passengers and tourists from sudden terrorist attacks - frightening!

Exactly! The same are behind it with just a few more flavors added.

[TexasMike]

Well am glad my flew into bangkok already, last time when they shut down they airport, I was about to go beat some heads.

[WitawatWatawit]

Calm down everyone. There's no need to panic. The guns were purchased by the military, which is a sure fire (pun intended) guarantee that they were supplied by Tonka Toys. I expect they're now aboard a certain aircraft carrier parked in Satthahip along with dozens of jets that can't fly, nestled next to armoured personnel carriers that have no wheels, adjacent to tanks that split open when the gun is fired, coupled with Chinese tear gas cannisters that explode without warning, cuddled up to helicopters that can't fly because they're American and the spare parts are Russia, overlooking a submarine that hasn't been bought yet, while observed from a helium dirigible that was designed for tourists, yet only has one seat and still can't fly above 10,000 feet (Stingers, anyone?).

Thank god for the GT200 bomb defectors. They've restored Anupong's pride.

(Incidentally, why buy a $10 million blimp - "Sky Dragon" - that's supposed to fly at 30k feet with powerful cameras, when the Thaksinner has put up satellites? Just a thought.)

Forget the red shirts, I just hope the Laotian army doesn't decide to invade Thailand. That's a scarier thought. How will the Thai military coordinate 650 generals? I know, threaten them with the aircraft carrier and the missile powered submarine. The Burmese can supply maps to locate Laos.

Wit

[TexasMike]

Awise Army would steal from themselves before the 12th event. Make a public media speach that weapons were stolen and come down hard on the opposition on the 12.\th. After all they stoll 6,000 weapons

dam_n I have to leave my assult rifles here in the US. Anyone get me a good deal of an AK? I know tghat weapon very well, LOL

[Bard]

What makes you think that they will not use the 6ooo rifles and explosives phyaically against anyone. That's what they were stolen for.

I am more concerned that it would have taken a truck to move that ammount of gear, where were the soldiers guarding the armoury, where was the gate keeper etc.

How many other weapons ie rocket launchers and grenades were stolen.

how many other military complexes have had their weapons stolen because of slack guards. <deleted>***n APES.

They have already been found with weapons caches, have they used them so far? No. However if they suddenly have a large quantitive of weapons usable for fighting the army they might be in negotiation position.

To say fokking apes is not very intelligent, like I stated my Western Country origin have so much weapon caches around you would be surprised, they are not guarded at all but hidden and pretty well locked. If someone knows the exact location and knows how to break an entry you would end up with much much more than 6k silly assault rifles with some explosives. To use these guns and explosives you have to actually be brave enough to be there and use them, you risk getting shoot or even annihilated by the air force. Does that tempt anyone other than idiots who think they can beat "the government with a rifle?" Anyone so far who was dumb enough to believe that has been taken out. Do USA and several other countries own nuclear weapons? Do they use them? Why not? Why use them? If the Red Shirts suddenly have enough guns to actually run an insurgency do they have to use it if the government knows? This cache is a major negating point, and that is most likely all that will happen.

The Red's won't hit hard and loose support, the Army won't fire and get a massive uprising so it's a catch 22 really.

To obtain very dangerous weapons is very easy anywhere in the world, anyone with 1/2 a brain can make some serious impacting assault weapons. However nobody will believe you unless you have "assault rifles, grenades etc." How hard is it to make assault guns out of standard piping? If you state you have 10k assault guns made of piping, pipe bombs, grenade launchers, 6 ton bombs, bacteriological agents etc. but nobody seen it go away, how many will take you seriously? Every attack which has been a real success has been with such weapons in modern times by civilians, but nobody takes fertilizer seriously do they?

Luckily almost every terrorist is a moron, and they don't know these simple things. The common terrorist is the same as a criminal, unable to obtain a job due to stupidity hence they are beaten by governments pretty easily. Some very few does exist outside the rule though and they are the only ones to really worry about. However they never used government issue guns to do the job, they used guerilla fix weapons and always surprise tactics.

No if the Red's will ever use the guns it will be directed to the Army, Government and supporters of the coup. If they do attack the Army what is the big difference? That already is ongoing with the insurgency in the South. If they use it for negotiating or attack the sitting government something might happen. But attack foreigners or civilians has so far NOT been an idea of any sides.

I would not even consider it as a threat until that would change, why would it ever be an attack on innocent people which would definitely lead to a massive loss in grass root support? Have anyone seen any signs of this so far?

[coolhandjoe]

This is bad. 6000 weapons (plus ammunition presumably) indicates a well planned and organised theft.

This indicates equally thought out plans for their use.

Somebody is planning for a civil war

Maybe this is all rubbish, media stiring things up again.

[mommysboy]

Probe on stolen Thai army weapons underway

BANGKOK (TNA) -- An investigation into massive losses of weapons and explosives stolen from an arms depot of a military camp in the southern province of Phatthalung is underway, according to Panitan Wattanayagorn, acting government spokesman.

The incident was reported to police and concerned officials last Thursday, said Dr Panitan, adding that investigators were checking whether the stolen weapons and explosives were secretly transported within the insurgency-affected southern provinces or to Bangkok where anti-government protesters from the United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD) plan to hold a mass demonstration next Sunday aimed at ousting the government.

UDD activists nationwide will begin moving to Bangkok March 12 and will gather at Sanam Luang in the morning of March 14.

Asked whether the Fourth Army Region which is responsible for security in the South should be held accountable for the loss of the materiel, Dr Panitan said the probe is focusing on whether it was an inside job.

Security at other army weaponry warehouses, especially in Bangkok, has been tightened following Thursday's incident, he added. (TNA)

-- TNA 2010-03-07

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

surely not who wuld do such a thing!

[ding]

23,130 kilos (51,000 pounds) of assault rifles alone. That's figuring second generation or later US M16's. If payload capacity of a Toyota Hilux Tiger is 1085 kg, then 22 trips in and out would be required for the assault rifles alone. This theft required logistical planning and capacity. This ain't good. No mention of stolen vehicles.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

We find out,next week with the red rally.I'm happy that I'm not living in Bangkok.

I was told by red friends not to go to bkk on those days.

Ah, those wouldn't be the Red friends that wrote that lovely sounding invitation (grammatically correct and without a single spelling mistake)for farangs to join the rally to oust the government and guaranteeing that no harm will come to them? So, they're concerned for your safety, but don't mind others dying in the cause of recovering toxic assets?

Who said anything about safety? I'd imagine major traffic jams being the main concern. (It is for me). I wouldn't have any qualms being at a Red rally. Depending on the mood I may not stick around though as I don't want to be there if the military decides on a crackdown and the bullets start flying. (I don't think that's likely, but it's not completely impossible either)

[Sabre]

The assault rifles aren't particularly worrying. The region has, for decades been awash with cheap weapons from various wars fought in the neighbourhood.

A Thai friend of mine was raised in Surin, close to the Cambodian border and he told me once that when he was a kid it was possible to purchase an old M16 for about 10 dollars and grenades generally cost 5 dollars.

So the guns have always been out there somewhere, but of course the explosives are a different matter entirely.

[ding]

23,130 kilos (51,000 pounds) of assault rifles alone. That's figuring second generation or later US M16's. If payload capacity of a Toyota Hilux Tiger is 1085 kg, then 22 trips in and out would be required for the assault rifles alone.

-----> or <-----

1 lovely parting gift for those Kazaks(?) detained for smuggling arms for North Korea.

[mommysboy]

Maybe its a lie.

Maybe you are in denial.

[dviol]

Obviously it had to be an inside job of sorts. Depending on the size of transport trucks used your talking about what? 60 to 100 transport trucks just for the rifles stolen, minimum. That is a large coordinated effort.

Someone obviously noticed that kind of opperation going on. The article says they were taken from a barracks. That is a generic statement. It could just as easily mean a warehouse. Still, I'm sure there are guards and security.

This is either an act of support for a faction without certain powers admitting to supporting a group, or a group in the region has supporters in the military who looked the other way.

Oh, to answer previous comments, 6000 rifles is about right for a regiment. It does not matter if they were engineers, they still carry rifles in combat.

And no, explosive "sniffers" can be very expensive to own and require a trained individual to opperate them. A small military installation would probably not have them.

What concerns me is the "large" amount of explosives. Has anyone heard of what type of explosives or what additional equipment to detonate explosives where stolen????

Are we talking grenades which have a small bang and a kill radius of 3-5 meters or C-4 with Det cord or time fuze which requires someone trained to use it????

[seri thai]

All these news stories which helpfully guide readers into making the 'correct' assumptions. It's a real life 'Wag the Dog'.

Why would the military feel the need to release this information to the public at all?

In the interests of greater transparency and accountability? -after the recent GT200 embarrasment

Abhisits off to Oz next weekend and General Anupong to the US. Suthep and Prayuth are being left in charge of the laundry.

We live in interesting times.

[ding]

Regarding explosives; Unfortunately there are loads of trained and experience muslims after the Iraq debacle. They need to get this wrapped fast, checkpoints, warehouse searches, anything and everything. Mobilize jointly.

Edited March 7, 2010 by ding

[cellbuilder]

John Burdett could not have scripted better. Army v Police - Taksin v Everybody.

Pawns against Pawns, while the players match wits, their agents afflict the nice people of Thailand.

Sounds a bit like home.

[dviol]

Agreed, a fast, joint, and tough response will be critical to the safety of the public. If this theft was carried out with the assistance of any military or public officials you can assume that won't happen.

A simple reason for admitting to the theft is the simple fact that sooner or latter it will become obvious when 6000 assualt rifles end up in the hands of one group or the other.