Why Do You Stay?

[taxexile]

neerenram

and there is no way that I would have survived back in my home in Scotland(Edinburgh/Leith). I was in locked up 8 times in the UK, and have never been in Thailand!

i'm just reading "trainspotting" , you're not the inspiration for "sick boy" are you ?

you've probably read it by now , but if you havent , then grab a copy.

regarding street violence in the uk and the west in general , this is from todays uk press and makes horrifying reading , and just one reason why , in spite of whinges and complaints about thailand , it is a far better place to live than europe , and especially the uk.

A terrified teenager is tied to a railing in a dark stairway.

His face is marked with a black pen. The voice of a vicious thug taunts his victim, hitting him repeatedly while another yob films the disturbing act on his mobile phone.

 

Visibly weary and unable to resist, the victim's head slumps forward as more punches rain down.

His attacker wants money - £75 to be precise - and he will not accept any answering back.

Accomplices to this chilling crime can be heard cheering in the background. At one point the torture is interrupted as another man passes in the stairwell and carries his bicycle up the next flight of steps - barely raising an eyebrow.

A spokesman from the Internet Watch Foundation, which tracks abuse of children, described the film as a damning "indictment of Britain's youth culture".

From the accents it sounds likely that the attack took place somewhere in the south-east of England. Although there is no evidence that it happened in London, officers from the Metropolitan Police are looking into the incident after video footage of the attack, obtained as a result of a Sunday Telegraph investigation, was made available to them. A spokesman said: "We are reviewing the video and will be making inquiries."

Torture and extortion of this nature appear to be an escalation of the "happy slapping" craze which began with teenagers slapping adults on public transport and filming the incidents on their mobiles to later exchange like Pokemon cards or football stickers.

Since the disturbing trend began in south-east London six months ago there has been a shocking rise in the severity of violence being filmed, according to charities monitoring the practice.

Liz Carnell, the director of the charity Bullying Online, said: "Since the craze started it has become much more sinister and disturbing. We are seeing an escalation in the violence in these videos and are becoming concerned for the safety of children.

"We are bracing ourselves for the first attack of this kind that leads to a murder or a violent rape. If current trends continue it is only a matter of time before this happens. It is very serious."

The violence seen in the video obtained by this newspaper has echoes of the extreme violence portrayed in Stanley Kubrick's 1971 film, A Clockwork Orange. In the film, a gang of youths travels the country to commit violent acts, including rapes and murders, for fun.

Jan Harlan, the late director's brother-in-law, who helped to make the Oscar-nominated film, said that such violence was "beginning to make A Clockwork Orange seem like Bambi".

He said: "Violence is on a totally different level than it used to be. We do not realise how violent the whole world has become in the last few decades. The danger is that in the next 30 or 40 years there will be a huge crowd of uneducated young men with nothing to do except become more violent and anti-social."

Graham Barnfield, a youth studies expert with the University of East London said: "In the case of 'happy slapping' the motive appears to be humour, sick though it is. This film is on a whole new level. It appears motivated by the desire to strike fear and terror into an individual.

"In the past, people committing crimes like these tried to hide the evidence. This film shows just how brazen and dehumanising thugs have become. The abandonment of criminal common sense is a new and disturbing development.

"The apparent willingness to supply proof of a violent crime is clear evidence of the escalating nature of violence in youth cultures in Britain."

It has been suggested that the film of the stairway abduction and assault may have been shot to intimidate other children in the same estate into handing money over to the gang.

Police said that it would be difficult to prosecute the individuals in the film because it was impossible to identify where the video was made, and no reports of such an assault have been lodged with the Met.

Closer examination of the video may reveal the identity of at least two of the three attackers, whose faces appear for brief moments during the assault. The face of the witness is visible for longer and is clearer, raising hopes of furthering the investigation.

The video was posted on an American website where clips of CCTV footage of real crimes, jokes and prank videos are shown alongside clips of "happy slapping". Police cannot have the site shut down because hosting the films is not illegal.

A spokesman for the Internet Watch Foundation said: "It is a matter for the police - clearly it is an assault. But it is not illegal to show the films. This phenomenon is a sad indictment of our society."

[Neeranam]

neerenram

QUOTE

and there is no way that I would have survived back in my home in Scotland(Edinburgh/Leith). I was in locked up 8 times in the UK, and have never been in Thailand!

i'm just reading "trainspotting" , you're not the inspiration for "sick boy" are you ?

you've probably read it by now , but if you havent , then grab a copy.

Yeah Tax, I've read it a couple of times, great book especially with the local references. Welsh was a bit of a celeb. in Leith.

No, I was more like a cross between Spud and Beggar Boy Begbie

Crazy place, much much safer in Thailand.

Torture and extortion of this nature appear to be an escalation of the "happy slapping" craze which began with teenagers slapping adults on public transport and filming the incidents on their mobiles to later exchange like Pokemon cards or football stickers.

Coincedence, I got an email yesterday with one of these videos. I had never heard of this Happy Slapping before. Actually the thing is in America where a guy tries to knock a cyclist off his bike while filming. Things don't quite go as planned. I can send you a copy if you want to see some thug getting his just desserts.

[kreon]

neerenram

QUOTE

and there is no way that I would have survived back in my home in Scotland(Edinburgh/Leith). I was in locked up 8 times in the UK, and have never been in Thailand!

i'm just reading "trainspotting" , you're not the inspiration for "sick boy" are you ?

you've probably read it by now , but if you havent , then grab a copy.

Yeah Tax, I've read it a couple of times, great book especially with the local references. Welsh was a bit of a celeb. in Leith.

No, I was more like a cross between Spud and Beggar Boy Begbie

Crazy place, much much safer in Thailand.

Torture and extortion of this nature appear to be an escalation of the "happy slapping" craze which began with teenagers slapping adults on public transport and filming the incidents on their mobiles to later exchange like Pokemon cards or football stickers.

Coincedence, I got an email yesterday with one of these videos. I had never heard of this Happy Slapping before. Actually the thing is in America where a guy tries to knock a cyclist off his bike while filming. Things don't quite go as planned. I can send you a copy if you want to see some thug getting his just desserts.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i actually have the movie and it really gave me the conviction that europe sucks and that thailand is paradise

[Neeranam]

Coincedence, I got an email yesterday with one of these videos. I had never heard of this Happy Slapping before. Actually the thing is in America where a guy tries to knock a cyclist off his bike while filming. Things don't quite go as planned. I can send you a copy if you want to see some thug getting his just desserts.

i actually have the movie and it really gave me the conviction that europe sucks and that thailand is paradise 

You mean the American one where the guy falls out the car and gets splattered by a car coming the other way?

[taxexile]

I can send you a copy if you want to see some thug getting his just desserts.

thanks , but no thanks.

whereas i can watch violent movies all day long and not be bothered , the real thing i find too disturbing.

i mistakenly watched some violent real life footage on a wesite called "ogrish.com" some time back.

they have the iraqui beheadings , film of south american vigilante killings and some african street justice and burnings , i dont know what possessed me to trawl through that stuff , a morbid curiosity i suppose , but seeing actual violence like that really disturbed me for days , i also witnessed a murder in bangkok over songkran and that also did my head in for a few days.

i have no wish to see any more real life violence thanks.

i obviously have a meaningful and sensitive side to my nature lurking away in there somewhere.

[kreon]

Coincedence, I got an email yesterday with one of these videos. I had never heard of this Happy Slapping before. Actually the thing is in America where a guy tries to knock a cyclist off his bike while filming. Things don't quite go as planned. I can send you a copy if you want to see some thug getting his just desserts.

i actually have the movie and it really gave me the conviction that europe sucks and that thailand is paradise 

You mean the American one where the guy falls out the car and gets splattered by a car coming the other way?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

no--filmed in the uk, about drug junkies..starring ewan mcgregor

[taxexile]

another good reason to stay here and keep away from the increasing insanity that infests the uk these days.

Farmer faces jail for disturbing dormice (what's even madder: nobody has ever seen a dormouse on his land)

By Roya Nikkhah

(Filed: 29/05/2005)

A farmer faces a six-month jail sentence after becoming the first person to be accused of disturbing a dormouse habitat.

 

Stephen Jones was charged under the Wildlife and Countryside Act when he attempted to erect a fence on his land near Caerphilly, South Wales.

However, he has never seen a dormouse on the 14-acre woodland site, and the only evidence of the animal's presence is a collection of hazelnut shells which appear to bear its distinctive teethmarks.

Mr Jones, 44, wanted to put sheep on the site to control weeds and undergrowth and drove his tractor through 200 yards of woodland in preparation for erecting the fence.

He had previously informed a landscape officer at Caerphilly borough council of his plans because the site is protected by a tree preservation order and was told that there would not be a problem.

He was astonished, therefore, to receive a telephone call from Gwent police informing him that if he continued, his machinery would be confiscated.

Shortly afterwards he received a letter informing him that he was being charged with five offences under the Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981 and the Conservation (Natural Habitats) Regulations 1994.

Under the Act, it is an offence to "intentionally or recklessly either damage or destroy, or obstruct access to any structure or place which a dormouse uses for shelter or protection". If found guilty, Mr Jones faces a maximum fine of £5,000 or up to six months in prison.

Mr Jones said that he was unaware that the mammal - an endangered species that measures less than 3½in - might be on his land.

"I am absolutely stunned by the charges as neither myself nor anyone else who worked on the land had ever seen any evidence of dormice," said Mr Jones.

violent criminals roam the streets unpunished and untouchable , whilst doormouse disturbers face the full weight of the judicial process.

kafka couldnt better some of this stuff.

[bubblemonkey]

Opps! I just put this reply in the wrong place and don't know how to delete the post.

So I just cut the whole post and typed this instead.

Sorry.

Edited May 29, 2005 by bubblemonkey

[billd766]

Come on guys I tried to get something positive going in this thread, there are enough negative things going on, so why do you stay?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ray23

See my post #14.

That is my reason.

nuff said.

[taxexile]

pretty much the same reasons as you bill ,

i'm happily married , i'm part of a good thai family here , i've met some of the best people i've ever met in my life over here and ( in spite of all the complaining i do on this forum) i feel far more comfortable , relaxed and happy here than i ever did back in england.

good thais abound , there are far more good people than bad here , its just that you hear about the bad all the time , people rarely get on this forum and say how they met a "good person " today.

i've never had any really bad things happen to me here and if you dont stick your head above the parapet too much then there is no reason why they ever should happen. i feel i can spot the bad things before they affect me or before i get in too deep and out there in the real world i back away from anything that remotely resembles trouble ( or a request to borrow money !)

i can only hope i never lose that sense.

there is far more tolerance of foriegners here than back home , probably because foriegners here have to look after themselves and are not a drain on local resources , the immigration laws are strict and fine by me , but the procedures are annoyingly lengthy and convoluted though.

its a pity that thais are adopting more and more western habits and traits , it doesnt bode well for society here , but it cant be stopped.

but all in all i'm as happy as a pig in sh1t here.

[duke69]

Its also naïve to think there are not injustices, corruption and negativity in the Western, so called 1st world.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What should the wife of the Italian agent say when the US soldier who killed him was found not guilty??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, that "agent" fcuked up - plain and simple.

Shouda driven the speed limit and stopped when required.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

May be ..... but if a naive soldier shoots before asking the car to stop, just because he had no training, I understand now why it's so easy for Iraq resistance to get ridd of all the US chickens ....

Vietnam was a sugar drop, the bitter bite (Iraq) is coming soon on CNN>>>>

[meadish_sweetball]

Its also naïve to think there are not injustices, corruption and negativity in the Western, so called 1st world.

What should the wife of the Italian agent say when the US soldier who killed him was found not guilty??

Well, that "agent" fcuked up - plain and simple.

Shouda driven the speed limit and stopped when required.

Boon, how about some empathy. Agents are people with families.

[ray23]

Its also naïve to think there are not injustices, corruption and negativity in the Western, so called 1st world.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What should the wife of the Italian agent say when the US soldier who killed him was found not guilty??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, that "agent" fcuked up - plain and simple.

Shouda driven the speed limit and stopped when required.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

May be ..... but if a naive soldier shoots before asking the car to stop, just because he had no training, I understand now why it's so easy for Iraq resistance to get ridd of all the US chickens ....

Vietnam was a sugar drop, the bitter bite (Iraq) is coming soon on CNN>>>>

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well I guess that has a lot to do with why you stay in Thailand. Or probably more accurately you seem to want to turn everything into a negative, you must be a really happy person here.

You know you could start another thread yourself, just a thought.

I was really interested in hearing what the guys who have been here for years, had to say in refrence to what made them long term residents.

Build766 my apologies as you said post 14 nuff said.

[duke69]

Its also naïve to think there are not injustices, corruption and negativity in the Western, so called 1st world.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What should the wife of the Italian agent say when the US soldier who killed him was found not guilty??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, that "agent" fcuked up - plain and simple.

Shouda driven the speed limit and stopped when required.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

May be ..... but if a naive soldier shoots before asking the car to stop, just because he had no training, I understand now why it's so easy for Iraq resistance to get ridd of all the US chickens ....

Vietnam was a sugar drop, the bitter bite (Iraq) is coming soon on CNN>>>>

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well I guess that has a lot to do with why you stay in Thailand. Or probably more accurately you seem to want to turn everything into a negative, you must be a really happy person here.

You know you could start another thread yourself, just a thought.

I was really interested in hearing what the guys who have been here for years, had to say in refrence to what made them long term residents.

Build766 my apologies as you said post 14 nuff said.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually Ray23

I'm the one who is wondering about your reply.

You should have attacked the one pissing me off, rather tha insulting me.

Yes I can start another 3d but I do not understand why, living in LOS gives me freedom .... isn't it??

I was one of the first ones to reply explaining with some examples what everyone else later wrote: Thailand is safe (or unsafe) as any other country in the west!!!

May be Ray, you stay here in Thailand because you never read nor understand what others want to say (me) .... and find it easier if a Thai doen'st speak a single word of english so that it's not a problem if you don't understand ...

take it easy, sun is shining and Viagra is widely avalable also tonight

[ray23]

Its also naïve to think there are not injustices, corruption and negativity in the Western, so called 1st world.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What should the wife of the Italian agent say when the US soldier who killed him was found not guilty??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, that "agent" fcuked up - plain and simple.

Shouda driven the speed limit and stopped when required.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

May be ..... but if a naive soldier shoots before asking the car to stop, just because he had no training, I understand now why it's so easy for Iraq resistance to get ridd of all the US chickens ....

Vietnam was a sugar drop, the bitter bite (Iraq) is coming soon on CNN>>>>

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well I guess that has a lot to do with why you stay in Thailand. Or probably more accurately you seem to want to turn everything into a negative, you must be a really happy person here.

You know you could start another thread yourself, just a thought.

I was really interested in hearing what the guys who have been here for years, had to say in refrence to what made them long term residents.

Build766 my apologies as you said post 14 nuff said.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually Ray23

I'm the one who is wondering about your reply.

You should have attacked the one pissing me off, rather tha insulting me.

Yes I can start another 3d but I do not understand why, living in LOS gives me freedom .... isn't it??

I was one of the first ones to reply explaining with some examples what everyone else later wrote: Thailand is safe (or unsafe) as any other country in the west!!!

May be Ray, you stay here in Thailand because you never read nor understand what others want to say (me) .... and find it easier if a Thai doen'st speak a single word of english so that it's not a problem if you don't understand ...

take it easy, sun is shining and Viagra is widely avalable also tonight

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well my reply is easy. meant no insult to anyone, you or the original poster. So you want a negative thread be my guest. You want to flame people out be my guest. Why I stay in Thailand, is pretty simple, best place in the world that I know of. I'm sure find a way to flame at least some of that, have fun

[Tyree D.]

I am from L.A. Here I can actually walk outside at night and there is food. I've never been shot in Thailand.

don't listen to these hater posters. Thailand didn't work out for them and they have to goto a board and try to bring others down. Like any of us rather be in North Korea.

[duke69]

I am from L.A.  Here I can actually walk outside at night and there is food.  I've never been shot in Thailand.

don't listen to these hater posters.  Thailand didn't work out for them and they have to goto a board and try to bring others down.  Like any of us rather be in North Korea.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Technically speaking, North Korea is one of the safest places on this planet unless you're from US, Jap or South Korea.

But in LOS there is plenty of fun, nice locals and nice farangs to hang out, just to avoid tourists places.

I stay here:

1) money (expat manager)

2) quality of life

3) easy life

4) CAUSE OF THE JET LAG, the mother company's calls are only in the afternoon, so even if I got some extra drinks the night before, I still have till 2 pm to have enough cofee in my blood to kill the "blond Tiger"

[moebius]

And on that note, let's talk about love and the pursuit of love!

I was working happily in rural China teaching English. Came here to take a TEFL course because a lot of teachers I know encouraged me to see a bit of Thailand. Fell in love with an expat from Singapore, went back to China where my school had changed hands (and my contract), quit that, came back here and have been living with her for the past four months. If it wasn't for her I would be back to China on the next flight out. Not a negative...just a preference.

Yes, Thailand is a cool place to hang out. Nice weather, nice people. If it wasn't for the paper jungle I'd probably be working till our departure. In the meantime we travel a lot, I'm looking into doing some volunteer work in Bangkok somewhere near the BTS that is somewhat flexible and leaves me weekend free. If we can manage to see most of the Thai historical sites north, east, south, and west of the country before we leave then all the better. Thailand is a great place to travel out of as a base too. Good location.

We'll come back time and again to visit the beaches and some friends.

So now you know why I stay here.

[Ajarn]

pretty much the same reasons as you bill ,

i'm happily married , i'm part of a good thai family here , i've met some of the best people i've ever met in my life over here and ( in spite of all the complaining i do on this forum) i feel far more comfortable , relaxed and  happy here than i ever did back in england.

good thais abound , there are far more good people than bad here , its just that you hear about the bad all the time , people rarely get on this forum and say how they met a "good person " today.

i've never had any really bad things happen to me here and if you dont stick your head above the parapet too much then there is no reason why they ever should happen. i feel i can spot the bad things before they affect me or before i get in too deep and out there in the real world i back away from anything that remotely resembles trouble ( or a request to borrow money !)

i can only hope i never lose that sense.

there is far more tolerance of foriegners here than back home , probably because foriegners here have to look after themselves and are not a drain on local resources , the immigration laws are strict and fine by me , but the procedures are annoyingly lengthy and convoluted though.

its a pity that thais are adopting more and more western habits and traits , it doesnt bode well for society here , but it cant be stopped.

but all in all i'm as happy as a pig in sh1t here.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Taxexile, thanks for those thoughtful and balanced reflections. Food for thought for me, too.

[Boon Mee]

Its also naïve to think there are not injustices, corruption and negativity in the Western, so called 1st world.

What should the wife of the Italian agent say when the US soldier who killed him was found not guilty??

Well, that "agent" fcuked up - plain and simple.

Shouda driven the speed limit and stopped when required.

Boon, how about some empathy. Agents are people with families.

It's cool, Meadish. I'm just sick and tired of the same old same old America-Bashing that never ends. That "agent" was driving at a "high rate of speed" from ALL accounts. Proven by satellite. He did not alert the authorities that he and the Italian "journalist" were going to be coming thru AND, he refused a legimate command to halt.

There is this small thing called WAR going on over there...

[patricktan]

Where ever country you go, or work. Basic thing is show respect and do not show of......Smile.(I feel safer that way.)

[abdulrahman]

Its also naïve to think there are not injustices, corruption and negativity in the Western, so called 1st world.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What should the wife of the Italian agent say when the US soldier who killed him was found not guilty??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, that "agent" fcuked up - plain and simple.

Shouda driven the speed limit and stopped when required.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Boon, how about some empathy. Agents are people with families.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It's cool, Meadish. I'm just sick and tired of the same old same old America-Bashing that never ends. That "agent" was driving at a "high rate of speed" from ALL accounts. Proven by satellite. He did not alert the authorities that he and the Italian "journalist" were going to be coming thru AND, he refused a legimate command to halt.

There is this small thing called WAR going on over there...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[Som Nam Na]

I've lived in Udon for a while now.

I've seen four guys walking down the street with shotguns (outside a well known nightclub). A shooting. Several beatings a couple of hit and runs... even guys carrying pistols in bars. I've also seen a bloke knocked off his bike by a car and the girl pillion dragged off and bundled into the back seat.

The thing that has always struck me though is that it has always happened for a reason.....and between Thai's. There is little "mindless" crime which is rife in my own country.....You get what you ask for.

The shotguns were because the guy got a beating (don't know that reason, maybe a gang thing) then he ran up the street and returned with 3 mates and some artillery.

The shooting was a grudge between two families and the other beatings were because of foul behaviour.

(Don't know the reason for the girl being dragged off....but she knew them..maybe jealous ex or something)

Here, we (farang) seem to be looked at more like annoying flies than real threats (of which I am glad). There seems to be a lot of tolerence for our "abhorrent" behaviour which is not tolerated for our Thai equivelents.

The reality here is life is cheap. But I still feel 1000% safer here than my own country.

Why do I stay?

It's just plain better....oh and having a g/f 15 years younger and 100 times prettier than farang women.

Edited May 30, 2005 by Som Nam Na

[HedKeeQuai]

yea, i'd say the women.

[abdulrahman]

Its also naïve to think there are not injustices, corruption and negativity in the Western, so called 1st world.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What should the wife of the Italian agent say when the US soldier who killed him was found not guilty??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, that "agent" fcuked up - plain and simple.

Shouda driven the speed limit and stopped when required.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Boon, how about some empathy. Agents are people with families.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It's cool, Meadish. I'm just sick and tired of the same old same old America-Bashing that never ends. That "agent" was driving at a "high rate of speed" from ALL accounts. Proven by satellite. He did not alert the authorities that he and the Italian "journalist" were going to be coming thru AND, he refused a legimate command to halt.

There is this small thing called WAR going on over there...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[duke69]

It's cool, Meadish. I'm just sick and tired of the same old same old America-Bashing that never ends. That "agent" was driving at a "high rate of speed" from ALL accounts. Proven by satellite. He did not alert the authorities that he and the Italian "journalist" were going to be coming thru AND, he refused a legimate command to halt.

There is this small thing called WAR going on over there...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I would say that I'm sick of all these lies.

There is no proven that the car was high speed, bon't bullshit with satellite, this is invented by you right now.

No Halt was given and this was confirmed by US authorities.

Yes there is a WAR over there and war has to be made by soldiers not by recalled unemployed americans ....... (this is a fact)

Having said that and after having visited the Museum of WAR crimes in Ho Chi Min City, I fully support the resistance and the battle for freedom, the terrorists are the ones who can act like in Abu Gravi and being sentenced to "candies"

[chuchok]

I smell a thread closure coming up...

[Rhys]

Learn the game... stay low to the ground for speed... Throttle back...high speed low drag.. DRIVE on

[moebius]

Yeah...close this topic and start one with simpler language in the thread header.

[alex100]

It's cool, Meadish. I'm just sick and tired of the same old same old America-Bashing that never ends. That "agent" was driving at a "high rate of speed" from ALL accounts. Proven by satellite. He did not alert the authorities that he and the Italian "journalist" were going to be coming thru AND, he refused a legimate command to halt.

There is this small thing called WAR going on over there...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I would say that I'm sick of all these lies.

There is no proven that the car was high speed, bon't bullshit with satellite, this is invented by you right now.

No Halt was given and this was confirmed by US authorities.

Yes there is a WAR over there and war has to be made by soldiers not by recalled unemployed americans ....... (this is a fact)

Having said that and after having visited the Museum of WAR crimes in Ho Chi Min City, I fully support the resistance and the battle for freedom, the terrorists are the ones who can act like in Abu Gravi and being sentenced to "candies"

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Unfortunaley the US Military at grunt level are not trained to a high enough degree to think outside the box. The are trained to act in a very gung ho fashion and respond aggresively. This is is out of place in what should ahve been a policing action in Iraq - that now has turned into a guerrila war. The main porblem in Iraq is the style of the US appoach shhot first ask questions later. I am sure that this will attacct some reaction from our US buddies but it is true. The Brits have made a far better job at policing the peace. This has been honed by years on the streets in Northern Ireland where a potentially war like situation was kept under control.

I do have a right to express this opinion as I worked in SA with the US forces for over 11 years. And their training was always their limitation.

Edited May 30, 2005 by alex100