Accounting Cost

[newny]

Dear,

I'm thinking to set up a business in thailand, and try to evaluate all the cost.

I contacted an attorney, account office, and read this forum, but I still have a problem.

I wish launch a small legal business, but all the account office I contact to do legal requirement (tax, account, payroll) ask me 10 000TBT/month. And I think this expensive!

Can you confirm me, and tell me how can decrease this cost.?

Thanks

[newny]

In fact I'm looking for minimum legal, and I don't how it cost I thailand That why I asking you.

[mausplan]

In fact I'm looking for minimum legal, and I don't how it cost I thailand That why I asking you.

If you want financial accounting , taxation accounting and payroll services from an outsourced agent 10k is about normal, perhaps you should look carefully into how much work is required to help you understand the workload. Revenue department reporting alone will almost take up one headcount. if you think about how much one junior accountant or experienced bookkeeper will cost per month then 10K is reasonable. Are you permitted to carry out your legal business as a foreigner (which I assume you are). good idea to check this carefully

[mallyrd]

In fact I'm looking for minimum legal, and I don't how it cost I thailand That why I asking you.

I can tell you that I pay THB 18,000 a year for a chartered account to take of my company books. This also includes Tax Returns and VAT returns.

[newny]

In fact I'm looking for minimum legal, and I don't how it cost I thailand That why I asking you.

I can tell you that I pay THB 18,000 a year for a chartered account to take of my company books. This also includes Tax Returns and VAT returns.

Thank you mallyrd.

Between 18 000 THB a Year and 10 000THB a month is huge gap.

Can you tell me who is your account office?

I precise I want to set up a very small business.

[raro]

for a small company with some 50 to 100 invoices (AR and AP combined, that is) reckon 2,500 to 3,000 Baht. On top of that comes the annual balance sheet and auditor fees, another 15,00 to 20,000....break it down over the year you end up with less than 5,000 Baht for this.

[newny]

Ok So:

2 500 ~3 000THB / monthly

+

15 000 ~20 000THB / Yearly (annual balance sheet and auditor fee)

= 45 000 ~ 56 000 Year ==> 3750 ~ 4700THB/month

But I contact 10 account office find on the web and the all purpose me

10 000 ~20 00THB / monthly

+

20 000 ~30 000THB / Yearly (annual balance sheet and auditor fee)

= 140 000 ~ 270 000 Year ==> 12 000 ~ 23 000THB/month

So There Is a huge difference between what you told me and the quotation I received.

And What you tell sound to me more reasonnable.

Do you have some adress or know where I can find? (I'm in BKK)

Regards

[TheWalkingMan]

Ok So:

2 500 ~3 000THB / monthly

+

15 000 ~20 000THB / Yearly (annual balance sheet and auditor fee)

= 45 000 ~ 56 000 Year ==> 3750 ~ 4700THB/month

But I contact 10 account office find on the web and the all purpose me

10 000 ~20 00THB / monthly

+

20 000 ~30 000THB / Yearly (annual balance sheet and auditor fee)

= 140 000 ~ 270 000 Year ==> 12 000 ~ 23 000THB/month

So There Is a huge difference between what you told me and the quotation I received.

And What you tell sound to me more reasonnable.

Do you have some adress or know where I can find? (I'm in BKK)

Regards

Those prices sound extremely high and it looks like you could hire your own bookkeeper and save some money. If the pay rates are as follows, I would suggest that everyone who has a partner looking for a career to jump on the bookkeeping bandwagon. 10k-20k sounds extremely high to me for a non-full-time person and mirrors or exceeds charges in the west.

mausplan - Could you please post the approximate wages for one junior accountant or experienced bookkeeper. Thanks!

[newny]

Thanks Thewalkingman.

I totally agree with you that price sound extremelly high, but the problem is that I haven't any more affordable contact.

And I wish set up my business ASAP.

So If i don't have some contact I'll have to choose between forget this project, or pay this price.

So If anyone have a contact. please...

Thanks

[raro]

Where are you in Thailand? If in Pattaya I might be able to recommend you some.

[newny]

Unfortunaltelly I'm in bangkok.

If someone have an adress in bangkok.

[newny]

I really don't understand.

Today I contact more than accounting office, 10 reply to me, between 10 to 15K?

How could they ask me 15K when the wages of a full junior accounting is 18K?

I ask the for minimum legal accounting task.

Most of they reply to me 5000K for less than 5 transaction by month then 15K?

For the price they are provide following services:

- Bookkeeping

- financial monthly report (English) amount of 5,000 Baht per month

- tax calculate such as (withholding tax, Value add tax, income tax, mid and ending year)

- payroll tax

- Stock control

So if I'm right financial report, and stock control aren't goverment required? (So I can do without?)

Futhermore, I guess bookkeeping must be in thai (which I don't speak yet), but Is there some software which allow me to manage it by myself?

Could I also manage payroll?

Thanks

[raro]

Theoretically you could do all the above by yourself, however, it is more convenient/cost efficient to outsource certain tasks.

You do need stock control by law. I reckon "financial report" is the monthly P&L which calculates also your VAT dues in one go. Required by law.

There is plenty of bookkeeping software around, some of it is recognized by the Thai Revenue Department. Best is, ask them which one they would recommend.

[BillR]

I pay 8k monthly for small business with 5 employees, plus about 20k for year end stuff, and another 20k for my visa work permit. Good thing is I have not been to an immigration or employment office in 2 years aside from my 90 day reports.

[proto]

The first year of my job as managing director of "my own" company, I paid 2,000 b/m plus 10,000 b for the year-end report to an English speaking attorney. After having learned the tricks, I did the month-by-month accounting and reporting all by myself  - free of charge although I did spend about 15 minutes plus 2 minutes to coerce my wife to go and pay revenue department the VAT, I had found reasonable to report that month... Had to have the same discussion every year with a registered accountant whether he just should have the minimum of 8,000 baht for signing my 12-15 sheets of honest and humanly readable excell-printouts or he should have 22,000 for having some staff entering the figures into a computer to produce something like 600 indecipherable sheets of (to me) seemingly random numbers that would make sure that the revenue-office would absolutely not pick my tiny business for a closer investigation.

[worldfun]

amazing no one even suggested sunbelt, indosiam, or thai accountants etc who advertise on this very forum LOL?

just boasting how cheap you're getting it, but not sharing - what financial Thai hard dicks you all are!!!

[PoorSucker]

500 baht/month.

14.000 yearly for balance sheet.

3500 for WP.

We do all the accounting ourself.

The Law firm is just our interface with the bureaucrats.

Also include legal advice from lawyer, head of company is a judge.

I'm on Koh Samui.

If you want this company to represent you you must go for an interview with the judge.

He will decide if he wants your business or not.

Edited May 27, 2010 by PoorSucker

[richardt1808]

hi,

As people have mentioned above, it is possible to do all the reports, VAT salaries and Revenue issues by yourself BUT you dont speak Thai and you obviously dont have hands-on business experience here so there is no shortcut for you. You need to either employ a competant financial person or outsource this to one of the companies mentioned. 10-15K is certainly reasonable as a fee.

If you hired a full-time person, you would need to pay more than 20K for someone with the required skill (and who can also speak English) - definitely not worth the risk hiring a junior or less experienced person.

At any rate, if your business model cannot support a pivotal 15-20K monthly expense like this, then perhaps it is not worth persuing.

[jlelouer]

My bookkeeping company wants to make me pay 100 THB/transactions for a volume of over 50 transactions per month (i already pay a fix fee). Looks expensive to me... What is a "normal" fee?

[chesternim]

You are looking at the wrong end of the stick. It is not the cost which you should look at but the benefit. Even 18000 Baht a year is expensive if the accountant does not save you a penny in tax. $300 a month (10k baht) is $10 a day day or 3 cups of coffee. I think that is expensive for coffee simply because I would rather pay just $1 a cup - but unfortunately the cups I can buy at Dunkin Donut at that price are about half the size of the mugs at Star Bucks - and the coffee tastes worst.

So do you want an accountant that is worth his salt or one that is very cheap?

I would not trust an 18000baht a year accountant to save me anything in taxes - so then if the tax I have to pay is like 500,000 Baht the cheap accountant probably costs a lot more than the more expensive better skilled and qualified types.

Don't look at the price tag until you feel the quality - what do you get for your money?

[muratremix]

You are looking at the wrong end of the stick. It is not the cost which you should look at but the benefit. Even 18000 Baht a year is expensive if the accountant does not save you a penny in tax. $300 a month (10k baht) is $10 a day day or 3 cups of coffee. I think that is expensive for coffee simply because I would rather pay just $1 a cup - but unfortunately the cups I can buy at Dunkin Donut at that price are about half the size of the mugs at Star Bucks - and the coffee tastes worst.

So do you want an accountant that is worth his salt or one that is very cheap?

I would not trust an 18000baht a year accountant to save me anything in taxes - so then if the tax I have to pay is like 500,000 Baht the cheap accountant probably costs a lot more than the more expensive better skilled and qualified types.

Don't look at the price tag until you feel the quality - what do you get for your money?

I don't think he is looking an expensive accountant. If you make that much profit, of course you can afford for something better but if you have shelf company or empty company, you really don't need to pay too much for accountant.

[Pingis]

Is this old problem solved?

Otherwize I can ask my gf if she has time now. She has university exam in business administration, in her work she handle acounting for some schools now, parallell to she go on study at Master level.

If interested - send me a PM.

Cost comparing coment:

I haven't checked how complicated Thai acounting is compared to Swedish, but when I have done acounting for small businesses in Sweden I have billed normaly a bit less than 1 MONTH salary to handle all 1 YEAR including "all" basics as tax papers.

(A bit advice included, but not economic or organization consultant jobs. Then I have got percentage of improved result normaly, when it osn't to complicated to count.)

[Valjean]

You've not going to get a full-time accountant who even close to knows what they are doing and speaks English for 18,000 per month. If you're well versed in accounting and just want to direct them day to day in every detail that's still very low. It's more like 30-40K per month for someone with good experience and skills. I'm speaking of Bangkok, don't know about up country.

Search "MSNA Bangkok" - they do lots of small business expat company accounting. I used them for a few years until I got a CFO and brought everything in house.

Good luck,