Red Shirt Leaders Flee As Thai Forces Surround Hotel

[Jerrytheyoung]

It confirms what I stated already before: the Government want blood and powder and most of the supporting posts to Government are utilising the military language: now some want to "exterminate the Red Shirts" like cockroach.do you realise the agressivity of your language?....You help to skid to the Civil war.

You will cry aftermaith. This is something we should put all our energy to avoid. No, it is provocation after provocation... Not a chance this will finish on an intelligent way. This government is too stubborn and cannot handle the situation and bring back peace. It is not a question of ideology, it is a question of men, human being unable to manage this situation. The boots are too big for them. Sorry for what will happen to this beautiful Country in the coming days, an incapable government ......

Edited April 16, 2010 by Jerrytheyoung

[bangkokrick]

^unless they do not want to arrest them...

It would appear to be that way.

Cheers, Rick

[animatic]

THis sort of action by the Thai "authorities" - who are clearly acting on the orders of a political party - the Democrats - just brings into the open how UNDEMOCRATIC the current order is - how can a political party order the arrest of demonstrators? - However it is presented - using terms like "terrorism" or "ill-intentioned" it does not look good to the world that those clearly involved in political protest are being pursued as criminals - this is simply not how democratic governments operate and is a paper-thin ruse.

I think you kind of missed the point. they are not to be arrested for protesting.

They are to be arrested for illegal actions, that may or may not have had to do with the protests,

but are considered CRIMINAL ACTS, under ANY situation.

Just because they are protesters, doesn't suddenly give them a free pass to be criminals.

[neverdie]

MCOT: Red Shirt activist Worawut Vichaidit faints while speaking at Ratchaprasong rally, sent to nearby Police General Hospital

He's taken to hospital where he keeps the patients awake 24/7 with his hate speeches?

Yeah I am sure he was popular there.

[anotherpeter]

THis sort of action by the Thai "authorities" - who are clearly acting on the orders of a political party - the Democrats - just brings into the open how UNDEMOCRATIC the current order is - how can a political party order the arrest of demonstrators? - However it is presented - using terms like "terrorism" or "ill-intentioned" it does not look good to the world that those clearly involved in political protest are being pursued as criminals - this is simply not how democratic governments operate and is a paper-thin ruse.

You can't be blaming the Dems for that one. That's the Thais system under any government here.

How would it look to the world if leaders of a "political" protest continued to incite violence and encourage the overthrow of an elected government were not arrested?

And before you go no about "not elected", have a look where Abhisit is accepted around the world, and where Thaksin is not. The rest of the world accept that Abhisit is the elected leader of the country.

There may have been some back room deals done to get Abhisit elected as PM, but those back room deals would have happened during every election in Thailand since there were elections in Thailand, especially when the PPP came to power with the help of the smaller parties in 2007. And back room deals go on in any country where a smaller party holds the balance of power.

The reds supporters on TVF always go back to the standard "But the yellows did ..." for all the ILLEGAL things that the reds do, well this is one time when an anti-red can say "what's good enough for the PPP, should be good enough for the Democrats" for a something LEGAL.

[LuckyLew]

What is all the fuss about?

[bangkokrick]

It confirms what I stated already before: the Government want blood and powder and most of the supporting posts to Government are utilising the military language: now some want to "exterminate the Red Shirts" like cockroach.do you realise the agressivity of your language?....You help to skid to the Civil war.

You will cry aftermaith. This is something we should put all our energy to avoid. No, it is provocation after provocation... Not a chance this will finish on an intelligent way. This government is too stubborn and cannot handle the situation and bring back peace. It is not a question of ideology, it is a question of men, human being unable to manage this situation. The boots are too big for them. Sorry for what will happen to this beautiful Country in the coming days, an incapable government ......

Hate to disagree, but if as you say the Government want blood they could have easily smashed the protest on the first day by using force. They decided to take a softly softly stance because they did not want to see people get hurt.

May I ask you, in your opinion who is the best man to run the Country and why?

Cheers, Rick

[hpl]

Who was paying the Hotel Bill?

He signs for things this way:

Thaksin Shinawatra

[grandpops]

Seeing through the mist of tear gas

Giles Ji Ungpakorn

Machine guns and tanks are not brought on to the streets to cook noodles, show off to tourists or repair the roads.

TV, are you sure Gile is allowed to post here?

Don't you remember why he is not in Thailand?

However I really love Giles writing. Especially the red m... sorry cannot mention here.

Nice to see free speach been promoted by the yellows on here.

Same happend to Jonathan Head. PAD don't like him, LM charges off he goes.

Is the CRES a sort of modern day SS one wonders. They are summoning all and sundry to appear before it, and all and sundry are ignoring it.

Meanwhile the Army base has conscripted a mob of PAD human shields.

So spontaneous, so spontaneous.

Thailand is another set of murderous assaults on demonstrators away from basket case status.

[animatic]

According to Tulsathit from the Nation, the operation that began at dawn involved plain-clothed commandos who intended to slip in, take the leaders out quietly, and slip out again. But two things foiled them-

1) They actually asked the front desk for the key, which led to the UDD being alerted to the operation

2) The untimely (or timely, whichever way you look at it) arrival of an uninvited group of noisy riot policemen which brought the media along with them

The question is was this a screw up on the part of the police force, or outside help for the UDD?

Hang on!! Didn't someone say this was an assassination attempt????

Arisman of course,

trying to add to his legend and wind up the troupes another notch.

And shortly there after those pethetic shots of a shot up room came plastered here,

as if ANYONE believed they were from the SC Park hotel with that cheesy Winner furniture,

and mini frigo. Another pathetic attempt at twisting the story.

Arisman was saved by the mob and his attempt at being an action hero,

who had to have some young guy lift his fat arse over the balcony rail to get going,

was lame as all get out.

[grandpops]

Seeing through the mist of tear gas

Giles Ji Ungpakorn

Machine guns and tanks are not brought on to the streets to cook noodles, show off to tourists or repair the roads.

TV, are you sure Gile is allowed to post here?

Don't you remember why he is not in Thailand?

However I really love Giles writing. Especially the red m... sorry cannot mention here.

Nice to see free speach been promoted by the yellows on here.

Same happend to Jonathan Head. PAD don't like him, LM charges off he goes.

Is the CRES a sort of modern day SS one wonders. They are summoning all and sundry to appear before it, and all and sundry are ignoring it.

Meanwhile the Army base has conscripted a mob of PAD human shields.

So spontaneous, so spontaneous.

Thailand is another set of murderous assaults on demonstrators away from basket case status.

[Slip]

Seeing through the mist of tear gas

Giles Ji Ungpakorn

Machine guns and tanks are not brought on to the streets to cook noodles, show off to tourists or repair the roads.

TV, are you sure Gile is allowed to post here?

Don't you remember why he is not in Thailand?

However I really love Giles writing. Especially the red m... sorry cannot mention here.

Nice to see free speach been promoted by the yellows on here.

Same happend to Jonathan Head. PAD don't like him, LM charges off he goes.

Is the CRES a sort of modern day SS one wonders. They are summoning all and sundry to appear before it, and all and sundry are ignoring it.

Meanwhile the Army base has conscripted a mob of PAD human shields.

So spontaneous, so spontaneous.

Thailand is another set of murderous assaults on demonstrators away from basket case status.

Don't think you'll find Chantorn so much of a yellow Pops. Try to keep up old chap.

[hpl]

Another news flash, the Democratic party is NOT "the yellows", that would actually be the PAD who have their own political party, just with no MP’s.

(edited for factual errorz and sa-pelling)

Wasnt one of the 5 leaders of PAD, Somkiet Pongpaibul, a Democrat MP elected under the Democrat party list?

Still don't let get facts get in the way of your posts.

And don't let exaggeration get in the way of your posts. One MP out of over 200 does not equate to "the Democratic Party".

Unlike the Reds and Pheu Thai connection, which have far more than one.

[Jerrytheyoung]

THis sort of action by the Thai "authorities" - who are clearly acting on the orders of a political party - the Democrats - just brings into the open how UNDEMOCRATIC the current order is - how can a political party order the arrest of demonstrators? - However it is presented - using terms like "terrorism" or "ill-intentioned" it does not look good to the world that those clearly involved in political protest are being pursued as criminals - this is simply not how democratic governments operate and is a paper-thin ruse.

I think you kind of missed the point. they are not to be arrested for protesting.

They are to be arrested for illegal actions, that may or may not have had to do with the protests,

but are considered CRIMINAL ACTS, under ANY situation.

Just because they are protesters, doesn't suddenly give them a free pass to be criminals.

When you have a mass demonstration, you do not arrest the leaders, you will have to negotiate with them. However you can sue them and bring the story to the Court after the conflict. What if we have arrested Cohn Bendit during May 68? the balance of actions is done after, everybody suing each other but not DURING it is an unsafe provocation.

Those who have engaged army Saturday are also responsible and can be considered as blood tainted, as well they should be arrested.

Edited April 16, 2010 by Jerrytheyoung

[whiterussian]

May I just remind all of you, that TOURISM, is the #1 industry in Thailand... responsible for more jobs than any other sector of the economy.

Killing Tourism is like Killing the Golden Goose.....

Up2U

CS

Tourism is certainly an important job provider, but Thailand is now an industrial Country, more income from automotive, electrics/electronics Industries Tourism weights now around 7% or 8% only.

Not Correct.... Better check your facts.

Tourism is Still #1... by a long shot. CS

nope. unless the bar fines add up to a whole load of tax free income! Now there is an idea... if they taxed Pattaya per 'shot'!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Thailand

Industry and manufacturing 43.9% (34.5% manufacturing) and 14% of workforce

Agriculture, forestry, and fishing 8.4%

Services 44.7% (37% workforce) (6% tourism)

http://www.gfmag.com/gdp-data-country-repo...try-report.html

% of population living on less than $2 a day 11.50% (2008)

Edited April 16, 2010 by whiterussian

[ozzieman05]

If the governments actions are all above board, if they have nothing to hide, and if the country is behind them, let there be free and fair internationally monitored elections "so the red shirts can be well and truly put in their place."

This Is Burma.

You are a dreamer if you believe this can happen with the mentality of the Red Shirts at this time

What justice has ever been don ee by a lnych mob

I am a nuteral observer

and agree with all you say with a period of 6-8 months for Thailand to settle down

Election yes

But when the time is right for the Thai people

Not for the pleasure of people like yourself

This is their country, we can have an opinion, but have no right to tell them what to do

[animatic]

What is all the fuss about?

Comes in; Little Miss, Moon Maid and Stuck Pig strengths

Because some days you are feeling 'Less Than Fresh'!

Gonna wash that man right outta my short red hairs.

Edited April 16, 2010 by animatic

[Sisaketmike]

As I said in the other closed thread....

Don't any of the security forces own a Helicopter???

Why wasn't the arrest and capture carried out by landing a Helicopter on the Roof???

Why weren't these guys taken out by AIR so as to avoid any confrontation with the crowd?

Why aren't all these incompetent watermelons FIRED immediately???

CS

Please keep that as a secret. They couldn't find the farlang SWAT leader from Pattaya with his yellow Hummer, which is really sad. I guess he had to train the SWAT teams in the deep south.

Unfortanetley the yellow Hummer will be seen in Bangkok soon, with weapons all around. Holy..sh.....

[hpl]

You just can't fathom that that Red movement has gone very far beyond to the point that if he died tomorrow and lost all his money, the movement would continue.

Would it? As evidenced just today of his hotel being involved and his being labeled the de facto leader of the reds by Reuters, it's apparent they have not "gone very far beyond him" at all.

All their actions reinforce that connection, not strip it down.

[ozzieman05]

THis sort of action by the Thai "authorities" - who are clearly acting on the orders of a political party - the Democrats - just brings into the open how UNDEMOCRATIC the current order is - how can a political party order the arrest of demonstrators? - However it is presented - using terms like "terrorism" or "ill-intentioned" it does not look good to the world that those clearly involved in political protest are being pursued as criminals - this is simply not how democratic governments operate and is a paper-thin ruse.

Gt out of your shell and take a good look at the world

My friend you have no idea

[Jerrytheyoung]

Another news flash, the Democratic party is NOT "the yellows", that would actually be the PAD who have their own political party, just with no MP’s.

(edited for factual errorz and sa-pelling)

Wasnt one of the 5 leaders of PAD, Somkiet Pongpaibul, a Democrat MP elected under the Democrat party list?

Still don't let get facts get in the way of your posts.

And don't let exaggeration get in the way of your posts. One MP out of over 200 does not equate to "the Democratic Party".

Unlike the Reds and Pheu Thai connection, which have far more than one.

Do not fool us, we all know the relation between the Democrats and the Yellows. Everybody has understood that the New Politic Party of the yellows is the back up solution in case of dissolution.

[Sisaketmike]

Who was paying the Hotel Bill?

He signs for things this way:

Thaksin Shinawatra

I guess you're wrong. That's Adolf's signature.

[ozzieman05]

Given the obvious divide here on TVF, amongst people that have most of the information that they need at hand, there is no chance for the Thais to ever come to some sort of compromise.

It doesn't matter what the truth is, if it's not the truth that someone wants to hear, then it's all just lies to them.

Regardless of who wins this round, the battle will continue for years to come.

You are a light at the end of the tunnel

If only people on TV would listen to you

Sadly that is but a dream

[asiawatcher]

the SC Park Hotel

http://www.scparkhotel.com/

this hotel is known to be owned by the fugitive Thaksin

it should be closed forthwith for harbouring wanted fugitives

if they refuse to close then cut the power, water supplies, revoke all the drink, dining and dancing licenses and arrest the management for aiding and abetting fugitives

send the staff home on full pay at the hotels expense

this is a message that should be relayed to all other hotels anywhere in the kingdom, that accept red shirts under arrest warrant as hotel guests

if the red leaders want to be at one with their red brethren then let them sleep on the floor in the street with them instead of bunking up in a 4* hotel

Agree - a clear message now is necessary - Takki Shinega aka Thaksin Shinawatra is now Thailand's Osama Bin Laden. He is financing terrorists, using his 'assets' in his fight and now has acts of murder, kidnapping, complete disregard for law and order and Thailand at large all 62M of them are fed up to the back teeth with this narcissist sociopath.

Time for Interpol to step in and arrest him for what he is - a terrorist of the worst order.

[ozzieman05]

^Yes those that support the red shirts should counter all rubbish posted by those detractors who are preventing the fruits of democracy from being picked. The red shirts will make thailand a more prosperous and happy place through free elections and the resignation of the current puppet regime.

How many people have died a terrible death because they put their trust in a WOLF

[animatic]

Another news flash, the Democratic party is NOT "the yellows", that would actually be the PAD who have their own political party, just with no MP’s.

(edited for factual errorz and sa-pelling)

Wasnt one of the 5 leaders of PAD, Somkiet Pongpaibul, a Democrat MP elected under the Democrat party list?

Still don't let get facts get in the way of your posts.

And don't let exaggeration get in the way of your posts. One MP out of over 200 does not equate to "the Democratic Party".

Unlike the Reds and Pheu Thai connection, which have far more than one.

Do not fool us, we all know the relation between the Democrats and the Yellows. Everybody has understood that the New Politic Party of the yellows is the back up solution in case of dissolution.

Well you seem to have lost your false flag frenchness and now show a different political image.

hmmm

[robbieh]

Some people are either being deliberately thick to stir the pot or really are lacking in brainpower. Personally I would not call the majority of grass-roots reds terrorists. They're not. They have genuine grievances that need to be heard. They need the right to better education (without bribes determining how far they go and what grades they get), healthcare etc. The terrorists are the leaders and Sae Daeng's lot.

This causes a problem. Some people here lump them all together. Wrong approach guys. The ordinary reds probably have no idea about the more sinister side of things, and don't forget they're there on the ground or at home watching red tv only getting a very limited set of information (information management is something the red leaders have handled very cleverly). Btw in case anyone thinks I'm biased I also think other media sources are pretty <deleted> but we have the option of scanning the channels, seeing different views on twitter etc. The guys at the rally don't have that option.

This presents a real problem for government/police/army to handle even if they were competent. If terrorists are hiding among civilians (I count terrorists as people who carry grenade launchers and ak47s and use them) how do you take them out without harming civilians? It's a tough call. Warn them and the terrorists will flee. Don't warn them and you'll have a bloodbath. Take no action and the belligerent leadership will keep on pushing and keep on making things even more lawless. And with the grass-roots reds being so lovey-dovey while the iron fist of the red terrorists lurks unseen, the world's media will rip you to pieces if you take action.

Of course the above was on the assumption of competence. Crap. We can't make that assumption. We have police who lack the skill to handle crowd-control and frankly don't give a crap anyway, and an army that's split through the middle and stuffed with watermelons. Sae Daeng vs Thai Police and army? You know who's going to win.

Now the problem here is that whichever side 'wins' will face the same problem. If an armed group rises against them they have no means to do anything about it, lacking competent police and army. This makes Thailand incapable of having a functioning government. Which brings me to the present government.

If I was Abhisit I'd say "<deleted> to this" and leave everyone else to it, as the PM's job is an absolute poisoned chalice and anyone who takes the job is doomed to lose it within a fairly short space of time. I don't think any truly democratic leader will last more than 2 years from here on in, until a radical shift happens in Thailand.

So who can rule Thailand? Whoever has a big and ruthless private army (because the state one is hopeless). One could argue that this is the reds, with Sae Daeng's lot. Yep, Thailand has backed itself into a corner where the only type of leader who can successfully rule is an armed despot. No civilian leader will have a chance, because more thugs will come and the state army and police will fail again. So the future is either red-yellow-red-yellow-red-yellow or a slide into brutal dictatorship.

Personally I don't see a way out and that bothers me. I love Thailand, I really do (admittedly mostly for the food) but I just don't see a way out of this mess Maybe that's why I'm not a diplomat, rather just another anonymous wanke_r on the internet.

Good post.

Unfortunately in the 21st century, Democracy is often a poor reflection of its original philosophy. Politicians realize that with the power of the media that is far easier, and more importantly cheaper, to deceive the electorate than actually make life for the masses either better or fairer.

Democracy is still a relatively new concept in Thailand, and ironically is diametrically opposed to the established elite rule and class system. To think that this system, which has been in place for hundreds of years can be eliminated with yet another short lived election is potentially naive.

I agree with 10027586 that the current possible outcomes are bleak. There has been rumors going around about a 3rd option, which of course is purely wild speculation. Basically Taksin will make a deal with the next elite leader and will be given free reign as PM to keep the masses in check indefinitely as long as the elite get to hold onto their trillions of baht, which is currently under threat. Then both Reds/Yellows Win/Lose!?

Whatever the outcome, history has often shown that when there has been a great political/power struggle..."Be Careful What You Wish For!"

[Jingthing]

Time to call in Jimmy Carter? They could do worse.

[humfurry]

oops

Edited April 16, 2010 by humfurry

[humfurry]

What I find interesting is the fact that although we are told that farang opinions don't matter, a massive influx of new Red TV members have signed up to argue their case with those whose opinions don't matter.

The international reach of the searchable web means that our poking holes in

Thaksins Perception Management exercise is seen and considered world wide.

So he must csend in 'counter-blogger teams' and try and derail our logical skewering of his plans,

using propaganda sound bite style repetition, and ad hominum attacks on the

more logical and clear sighted here. It's a battle for hearts and minds, and later pocketbooks.

And if the red shirts do cause and win a (deleted), Thaksin needs to have

bought for himself and his puppets, some sort of widely viewed moral high ground position,

or the big players world wide, like energy companies, will go Burma on him

and call him Pariah and shut him out.

The more the truth will out the hard it is for him to build and defend this false image.

We are countering a successful end game for his avaricious attempt to take over this lovely country.

Thanks, I really haven't wanted to say the words

Edited April 16, 2010 by humfurry