PM Abhisit Announces Next Election Will Be Held On Nov 14

[tombradly]

My final points

A House divided cannot stand.

Abe Lincoln.

It was true in 1860 USA and it is true in 2010 Thailand.

An elite with NO respect what so ever for the poor or democratic rule will find itself at some point with no more room to move.

The anger in the rurual land is real.

The split between the groups is real and deppening.

Yes--a great compramise can be tried but it is doomed to failure because the two sides have deep divides with no room for compramise.

A compramise now will just set the stage for the next breakdown as the elite again over throws the next democraticly electeg government.

It is obvious that the system is broken.

The ruling groups will not willingly let go of power.

Next time you get on your knees to approack another human being, let me know how you feel about it.

( A broken and corrupt and absurd system)

[enginerevision]

Nice 5 points from the army shoved forward towards Abhisit....

[ChiangMaiFun]

Fool us once, shame on you.

Fool us a second time, shame on us.

Only a complete moron would believe anything the current government says.

No deal.

Reds will hold the city until the government folds.

Well... I really don't think this is great tactics - I'm not quite sure if you are serious or not - I don't support this as I think the reds have to take this date now and work with it - reds 'don't hold the city' it's a pipedream - they have to be seen to compromise - or they will be crushed I'm afraid and lose all public support.

Uh oh, first time I have agreed with you. Something must be wrong.

what????? they must have put something in my afternoon tea! Nurse!!!

[gl9999]

My final points

A House divided cannot stand.

Abe Lincoln.

It was true in 1860 USA and it is true in 2010 Thailand.

An elite with NO respect what so ever for the poor or democratic rule will find itself at some point with no more room to move.

The anger in the rurual land is real.

The split between the groups is real and deppening.

Yes--a great compramise can be tried but it is doomed to failure because the two sides have deep divides with no room for compramise.

A compramise now will just set the stage for the next breakdown as the elite again over throws the next democraticly electeg government.

It is obvious that the system is broken.

The ruling groups will not willingly let go of power.

Next time you get on your knees to approack another human being, let me know how you feel about it.

( A broken and corrupt and absurd system)

Yes that's the same whining we've heard for the last couple of months.

PM Abhisit's latest plan is to address and try their very best, whether you're Yellow or Red to fix that problem. The system may be broken but the refusal to let go of power exists on both sides. But one thing about the Thai people is that they've always good at compromise and this plan by the PM may work.

Stop being such a drama queen. No really, your posts are going to near histrionics.

[quiksilva]

Fool us once, shame on you.

Fool us a second time, shame on us.

Only a complete moron would believe anything the current government says.

No deal.

Reds will hold the city until the government folds.

Well... I really don't think this is great tactics - I'm not quite sure if you are serious or not - I don't support this as I think the reds have to take this date now and work with it - reds 'don't hold the city' it's a pipedream - they have to be seen to compromise - or they will be crushed I'm afraid and lose all public support.

Uh oh, first time I have agreed with you. Something must be wrong.

what????? they must have put something in my afternoon tea! Nurse!!!

Seems to be happening a lot today In fact it might be a good excuse for a drink if the next round of announcements go well!

[timekeeper]

Fool us once, shame on you.

Fool us a second time, shame on us.

Only a complete moron would believe anything the current government says.

No deal.

Reds will hold the city until the government folds.

Well... I really don't think this is great tactics - I'm not quite sure if you are serious or not - I don't support this as I think the reds have to take this date now and work with it - reds 'don't hold the city' it's a pipedream - they have to be seen to compromise - or they will be crushed I'm afraid and lose all public support.

The song from "THE WHO" comes to mind.

We Won't Get Fooled Again

Meet the New boss

Same as the Old Boss

It might go something like this.

Reds win government control in the elections.

Another coup occurs by either the Courts or the military.

Coup number 23 or 34 is it?

We won't get folled again.

The Red Shirt leaders seem to be more reasonable then you. But I'm pretty sure a lot of Yellow shirts would be happy if they rejected the offer. It will just give PM Abhisit the excuse to send the soldiers in and crack some heads. And this time, everyone will blame the Red Shirt leaders for being so uncompromising, rather then the PM for being violent.

The thing is, you cry and bitch about coups but no one controls the military. They do whatever the hel_l they please. So if the Red Shirts do win the November 14 elections, first thing they need to do is majorly kiss some military ass.

the reds will have to kiss ass very hard to pacify the Thaksin hater Gen. Prayuth who will be in command by the time the elections come around

in fact he was very nearly in command right now

rumour has it that he wanted to stage a coup the day after the bloody battle of April 10

Edited May 4, 2010 by timekeeper

[Siripon]

Well done, Khun Apisit, you are proving to be an outstanding PM. Now is an excellent time for the police and prosecutors to move swiftly forward with both the prosecution of the PAD leaders (note the yellow shirts followers are not facing prosecutuion for the occupation of Government House and Suwannapum airport) and the red leaders for the present illegal protest.

May both groups of leaders share the same cells in jail and emerge with more peaceful and constructive ideas on how to improve society. But justice moves slowly in Thailand with 3 court levels and it will be years before they see the inside of a cell on a day to day basis.

[gl9999]

the reds will have to kiss ass very hard to pacify the Thaksin hater Gen. Prayuth who will be in command by the time the elections come around

in fact he was very nearly in command right now

he wanted to stage a coup the day after the bloody battle of April 10

The thing is, at that particular time, a coup would have been a good thing. Many Bangkokians, including myself would have welcomed it.

Right now, the red shirts better find a way to reconcile with General Prayuth. If it means distancing themselves from Thaksin, they should do it. The governments of this country, whether Red or Yellow rule by the grace of the military.

[Roadman]

My final points

A House divided cannot stand.

Abe Lincoln.

It was true in 1860 USA and it is true in 2010 Thailand.

An elite with NO respect what so ever for the poor or democratic rule will find itself at some point with no more room to move.

The anger in the rurual land is real.

The split between the groups is real and deppening.

Yes--a great compramise can be tried but it is doomed to failure because the two sides have deep divides with no room for compramise.

A compramise now will just set the stage for the next breakdown as the elite again over throws the next democraticly electeg government.

It is obvious that the system is broken.

The ruling groups will not willingly let go of power.

Next time you get on your knees to approack another human being, let me know how you feel about it.

( A broken and corrupt and absurd system)

And if the next democraticly elected government goes the same way as Thaksin, his idiot successors as PM and this current scum trying to turn Thailand into the next Burma then I will thankfully bless the next Khun Anupong (with loyally to the Monarch and the Thai people) to bust their balls the same way all over again. You don't like it? Tough. Thailand is a Constituional Monarchy in case you forget. Good reason for that. It's to keep the lowest of the scum from grabbing power, and a lot of them sure turned up this time around.

[tombradly]

My final points

A House divided cannot stand.

Abe Lincoln.

It was true in 1860 USA and it is true in 2010 Thailand.

An elite with NO respect what so ever for the poor or democratic rule will find itself at some point with no more room to move.

The anger in the rurual land is real.

The split between the groups is real and deepening.

Yes--a great compromise can be tried but it is doomed to failure because the two sides have deep divides with no room for compromise.

A compromise now will just set the stage for the next breakdown as the elite again over throws the next democratically elected government.

It is obvious that the system is broken.

The ruling groups will not willingly let go of power.

Next time you get on your knees to approach another human being, let me know how you feel about it.

( A broken and corrupt and absurd system)

Yes that's the same whining we've heard for the last couple of months.

PM Abhisit's latest plan is to address and try their very best, whether you're Yellow or Red to fix that problem. The system may be broken but the refusal to let go of power exists on both sides. But one thing about the Thai people is that they've always good at compromise and this plan by the PM may work.

Stop being such a drama queen. No really, your posts are going to near histrionics.

Funny how things work here. If I were to call someone a "Drama Queen" Thaivisa would suspend me for 7 days. Then if I were to tell him he is whining, I would get another 7 days. But OK--that is the way it is here and the less than fair and neutral site.

It is kind of like Fox news. The ruling class being Fox here.

But my response now to your post, just before I get suspended while you and yours continue to trash us at will.

What compromise?

The same people always win.

The poor still crawl on the ground.

Over 20 coups and the same group always wins.

The poor are really angry and you are mistaken if you do not think they are.

[timekeeper]

the reds will have to kiss ass very hard to pacify the Thaksin hater Gen. Prayuth who will be in command by the time the elections come around

in fact he was very nearly in command right now

he wanted to stage a coup the day after the bloody battle of April 10

The thing is, at that particular time, a coup would have been a good thing. Many Bangkokians, including myself would have welcomed it.

Right now, the red shirts better find a way to reconcile with General Prayuth. If it means distancing themselves from Thaksin, they should do it. The governments of this country, whether Red or Yellow rule by the grace of the military.

and rumor has it that the key to April 10 shootings may lay at Lt. Gen Manas Paolik's door

he is a former deputy 3rd Army Commander, now a Phua Thai member and was Thaksin’s classmate at the Army Pre-Cadet School

if the government were to follow the money from Mr T. they might be surprised where it ended up and if proven would label Thaksin as a terrorist and murderer for paying mercenaries to shoot soldiers

[Tanaka]

a little more than 3 months, as proposed by the protesters

What solutions were the protestors offering for all Thais, or any Thais for that matter?

The protesters are not campaigning they only want ELECTIONS.

They said they want democracy. That is probably why they killed people. They don't know what democracy means. Besides, they did not read their leader Taksin's words: Democracy is not on my agenda.

[Jingthing]

if the government were to follow the money from Mr T. they might be surprised where it ended up and if proven would label Thaksin as a terrorist and murderer for paying mercenaries to shoot soldiers

Indeed. No wonder Thaksin just hired a fancy/schmancy western law firm. He's going to need them.

[gl9999]

Funny how things work here. If I were to call someone a "Drama Queen" Thaivisa would suspend me for 7 days. Then if I were to tell him he is whining, I would get another 7 days. But OK--that is the way it is here and the less than fair and neutral site.

It is kind of like Fox news. The ruling class being Fox here.

But my response now to your post, just before I get suspended while you and yours continue to trash us at will.

What compromise?

The same people always win.

The poor still crawl on the ground.

Over 20 coups and the same group always wins.

The poor are really angry and you are mistaken if you do not think they are.

I called it whining because it's exactly the same crap that's been coming out of the Red Shirts since this problem started. As for being a drama queen, well read your post it's really IS dramatic!

"Next time you get on your knees to approack another human being, let me know how you feel about it." LOL! Your words!

It is a compromise because the number of days to the election is right in the center. That's what compromise is. Everyone gives an inch.

Of course the poor are still crawling on the ground(hahaha more drama!) but the point of this thing by PM Abhisit is to try to address this problem. To help the poor. And he wants everyone, Yellow or Red to help fix the problem. Will it succeed? Well we won't know if we don't try, will we?

I never said the poor aren't angry. But I also believe they've been thoroughly manipulated for the gains of a few people. That being said, once again, this compromise by PM Abhisit is to address their anger and hopefully fix it.

You're so against this compromise but what else is there? You want the tanks to roll in? You want a civil war? What? I've said it before and I'll say it again. Thai people are resillient and they're great at compromise.

[tombradly]

Funny how things work here. If I were to call someone a "Drama Queen" Thaivisa would suspend me for 7 days. Then if I were to tell him he is whining, I would get another 7 days. But OK--that is the way it is here and the less than fair and neutral site.

It is kind of like Fox news. The ruling class being Fox here.

But my response now to your post, just before I get suspended while you and yours continue to trash us at will.

What compromise?

The same people always win.

The poor still crawl on the ground.

Over 20 coups and the same group always wins.

The poor are really angry and you are mistaken if you do not think they are.

I called it whining because it's exactly the same crap that's been coming out of the Red Shirts since this problem started. As for being a drama queen, well read your post it's really IS dramatic!

"Next time you get on your knees to approach another human being, let me know how you feel about it." LOL! Your words!

It is a compromise because the number of days to the election is right in the center. That's what compromise is. Everyone gives an inch.

Of course the poor are still crawling on the ground(hahaha more drama!) but the point of this thing by PM Abhisit is to try to address this problem. To help the poor. And he wants everyone, Yellow or Red to help fix the problem. Will it succeed? Well we won't know if we don't try, will we?

I never said the poor aren't angry. But I also believe they've been thoroughly manipulated for the gains of a few people. That being said, once again, this compromise by PM Abhisit is to address their anger and hopefully fix it.

You're so against this compromise but what else is there? You want the tanks to roll in? You want a civil war? What? I've said it before and I'll say it again. Thai people are resilient and they're great at compromise.

I want free and real elections.

I want a government and laws that are respected and followed by all and not just used against the poor.

How is it that there are over 20 coups and no one ever goes to jail for the coups?

Pardons are given? Last time-YES!

Compromise?

It works like this.

Both sides give up something.

So tell us all, we really want to know, what is the ruling group going to give up?

Again--over 20 coups and the same group rules.

I offer this analogy.

Pretend that the southern confederate states in America in 1850, before the war, had given fair elections allowing Blacks to vote. BUT-every-time any candidate elected tried to help the slaves, they were thrown from office in a coup. How long would the people have to see this occurring before they understood that the system would never allow them equal rights?

You seem to be asking for patience. The year is 2010 and the poor in Thailand are being robbed of their voting rights. Likely, most of you would be condemning a Western Nation for this 14th century behavior. But you make excuses for the Thai ruling classes.

Why is that?

I seem to hear racism, class-ism and outward, bigotry from many posters here toward the people who are poor.

[ratcatcher]

My final points

A House divided cannot stand.

Abe Lincoln.

It was true in 1860 USA and it is true in 2010 Thailand.

An elite with NO respect what so ever for the poor or democratic rule will find itself at some point with no more room to move.

The anger in the rurual land is real.

The split between the groups is real and deepening.

Yes--a great compromise can be tried but it is doomed to failure because the two sides have deep divides with no room for compromise.

A compromise now will just set the stage for the next breakdown as the elite again over throws the next democratically elected government.

It is obvious that the system is broken.

The ruling groups will not willingly let go of power.

Next time you get on your knees to approach another human being, let me know how you feel about it.

( A broken and corrupt and absurd system)

Yes that's the same whining we've heard for the last couple of months.

PM Abhisit's latest plan is to address and try their very best, whether you're Yellow or Red to fix that problem. The system may be broken but the refusal to let go of power exists on both sides. But one thing about the Thai people is that they've always good at compromise and this plan by the PM may work.

Stop being such a drama queen. No really, your posts are going to near histrionics.

Funny how things work here. If I were to call someone a "Drama Queen" Thaivisa would suspend me for 7 days. Then if I were to tell him he is whining, I would get another 7 days. But OK--that is the way it is here and the less than fair and neutral site.

It is kind of like Fox news. The ruling class being Fox here.

But my response now to your post, just before I get suspended while you and yours continue to trash us at will.

What compromise?

The same people always win.

The poor still crawl on the ground.

Over 20 coups and the same group always wins.

The poor are really angry and you are mistaken if you do not think they are.

OK I won't call you a "Drama Queen" but stop being a Prima Donna.

What makes you think the PTP or Red Shirts or Thaksins gang would do better for the poor of Thailand than the Dems underP.M. Abhisit?

Abhisit's government has already made major changes to improve the lives of the disenfranchised, documented on this forum in detail.

I believe that one of the conditions of elections being held in November was that all candidates must have free access to canvas constituents anywhere in the country.Voters must also have privacy when voting free of coercion and bribery.

Judging by past performances of the PTP and latterly the Red Shirts, anyone from the Democrat party attempting to canvas for votes in Isaan or the north is in danger of being injured or killed.

As for the poor crawling on the ground, that's a cultural thing. They still bowed and scraped whenever Thaksin or any of his cohorts paid a publicity visit. And all Thais crawl in the immediate presence of the 'higher institution"

The same group always wins? Really? Whose group was TRT and PPP?

The poor have every right to be angry. Abhisit is determined to see that they get a greater share of government largesse, instead of it being diverted into the pockets of Isaan pooyais and mafia families in order to buy new cars,mia nois and land.

[lannarebirth]

You seem to be asking for patience. The year is 2010 and the poor in Thailand are being robbed of their voting rights. Likely, most of you would be condemning a Western Nation for this 14th century behavior. But you make excuses for the Thai ruling classes.

Why is that?

To be fair, they are not being robbed of their voting rights but are being paid for them. It creates the same kind of problems though, but maybe not from the quarter you're looking at.

[gl9999]

I want free and real elections.

I want a government and laws that are respected and followed by all and not just used against the poor.

How is it that there are over 20 coups and no one ever goes to jail for the coups?

Pardons are given? Last time-YES!

Compromise?

It works like this.

Both sides give up something.

So tell us all, we really want to know, what is the ruling group going to give up?

Again--over 20 coups and the same group rules.

I offer this analogy.

Pretend that the southern confederate states in America in 1850, before the war, had given fair elections allowing Blacks to vote. BUT-every-time any candidate elected tried to help the slaves, they were thrown from office in a coup. How long would the people have to see this occurring before they understood that the system would never allow them equal rights?

You seem to be asking for patience. The year is 2010 and the poor in Thailand are being robbed of their voting rights. Likely, most of you would be condemning a Western Nation for this 14th century behavior. But you make excuses for the Thai ruling classes.

Why is that?

I seem to hear racism, class-ism and outward, bigotry from many posters here toward the people who are poor.

What are free and real elections? You mean elections where there's no bribery? Where there's no intimidation if the other side campaigns?

Yeah, Red Shirts are just the people we should look up to for free and real elections.

There are always sad to say 2 different laws for the rich and poor. Maybe this is more so in third world countries like Thailand, but this exists in EVERY country, even in the United States. It's naivety to think laws that are adhered to by everyone.

Once again, the coups are conducted by the military. Once again, the military does anything it pleases. No one controls them. Good luck to anyone who wants to reform the military here. You cannot compare the United States to a country like Thailand. If you had a President who was half as bad as Thaksin, the military wouldn't be needed to kick him out. He would have been impeached easily.

What do you suggest we do for the poor then? PM Abhisit's plan is a START. Don't you think it's worth a try at least? The same poor people who are 'robbed' of their voting rights seem to be putting the same corrupt people back in power. The only difference is, these corrupt people are pretending to be helping them. These poor people want a person who stole billions and who killed over 2000 Thai people back in power. If Thaksin were an American president, he would have been impeached and spending time in a federal prison now, irregardless of how many votes he got. Should we not impeach a corrupt murderer even though he has the support of the poor people?

Perhaps there is bigotry and racism here. But I think a lot of these people are angry because of what these people have done to Bangkok the last couple of months. If they're being called names, well that's because they've actually proven that they are the names they've been called!

[tombradly]

Rightist and ultra-conservative icons such as Samak Sundharavej blasted the students, instigating violent mean to suppress the movement of the students, culminating in the October 6, 1976. The army unleashed the paramilitaries, and used the resultant mobs of violence, in which hundreds of students were tortured and killed, to suspend the constitution and resume power. Immediately after the incident, an amnesty was issued to prevent any of those responsible for the massacre from coming to justice.

Same old same old

Amnesty

Shoot and kill and torture college students--thousands--and no one goes to jail for it.

Captain does a coup not long ago.

What a joke.

No one goes to jail for it.

Likely no one in the North believes a thing this current government is saying and they are right not to believe this government.

After all, this government is a puppet.

[gl9999]

Rightist and ultra-conservative icons such as Samak Sundharavej blasted the students, instigating violent mean to suppress the movement of the students, culminating in the October 6, 1976. The army unleashed the paramilitaries, and used the resultant mobs of violence, in which hundreds of students were tortured and killed, to suspend the constitution and resume power. Immediately after the incident, an amnesty was issued to prevent any of those responsible for the massacre from coming to justice.

Same old same old

Amnesty

Shoot and kill and torture college students--thousands--and no one goes to jail for it.

Captain does a coup not long ago.

What a joke.

No one goes to jail for it.

Likely no one in the North believes a thing this current government is saying and they are right not to believe this government.

After all, this government is a puppet.

Yeap and look what happened to Samark! He became a powerful man, the proxy right hand of Thaksin and for a short time, ruled Thailand with Thaksin whispering in his ear!

That's Thailand for you. It's all about compromise. But you don't speak for everyone in the North so your statement is moot. I still believe PM Abhisit is sincere in wanting to help the poor. However, if you don't want to see that, you're entitled to your opinion. I however see you as a very naive person with your 'free elections' and 'justice for all'. The only way this will ever happen in Thailand will be after a civil war and I for one don't ever want that. But a lefty like you, I bet for 'justice' you wouldn't mind seeing Bangkok burn would you?

[gl9999]

Veera Agrees to Join Peace Talks to Avoid More Death

Red-shirt core leader Veera Musikkapong has formally accepted the proposal made by PM Abhisit Vejjajiva as a foundation for further negotiations to end the red-shirt rally to avoid any more casualty.

Looks like it's over for now...

[tombradly]

Rightist and ultra-conservative icons such as Samak Sundharavej blasted the students, instigating violent mean to suppress the movement of the students, culminating in the October 6, 1976. The army unleashed the paramilitaries, and used the resultant mobs of violence, in which hundreds of students were tortured and killed, to suspend the constitution and resume power. Immediately after the incident, an amnesty was issued to prevent any of those responsible for the massacre from coming to justice.

Same old same old

Amnesty

Shoot and kill and torture college students--thousands--and no one goes to jail for it.

Captain does a coup not long ago.

What a joke.

No one goes to jail for it.

Likely no one in the North believes a thing this current government is saying and they are right not to believe this government.

After all, this government is a puppet.

Yeap and look what happened to Samark! He became a powerful man, the proxy right hand of Thaksin and for a short time, ruled Thailand with Thaksin whispering in his ear!

That's Thailand for you. It's all about compromise. But you don't speak for everyone in the North so your statement is moot. I still believe PM Abhisit is sincere in wanting to help the poor. However, if you don't want to see that, you're entitled to your opinion. I however see you as a very naive person with your 'free elections' and 'justice for all'. The only way this will ever happen in Thailand will be after a civil war and I for one don't ever want that. But a lefty like you, I bet for 'justice' you wouldn't mind seeing Bangkok burn would you?

I am not a violent man.

Change need not be violent.

When, in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the laws of nature and of nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shown that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security. --Such has been the patient sufferance of these colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former systems of government. The history of the present King of Great Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute tyranny over these states. To prove this, let facts be submitted to a candid world.

He has refused his assent to laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

He has forbidden his governors to pass laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till his assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, he has utterly neglected to attend to them.

He has refused to pass other laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of representation in the legislature, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only.

He has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their public records, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures.

He has dissolved representative houses repeatedly, for opposing with manly firmness his invasions on the rights of the people.

He has refused for a long time, after such dissolutions, to cause others to be elected; whereby the legislative powers, incapable of annihilation, have returned to the people at large for their exercise; the state remaining in the meantime exposed to all the dangers of invasion from without, and convulsions within.

He has endeavored to prevent the population of these states; for that purpose obstructing the laws for naturalization of foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migration hither, and raising the conditions of new appropriations of lands.

He has obstructed the administration of justice, by refusing his assent to laws for establishing judiciary powers.

He has made judges dependent on his will alone, for the tenure of their offices, and the amount and payment of their salaries.

He has erected a multitude of new offices, and sent hither swarms of officers to harass our people, and eat out their substance.

He has kept among us, in times of peace, standing armies without the consent of our legislature.

He has affected to render the military independent of and superior to civil power.

He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving his assent to their acts of pretended legislation:

For quartering large bodies of armed troops among us:

Thomas Jefferson

[gl9999]

I am not a violent man.

Change need not be violent.

When, in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the laws of nature and of nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shown that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security. --Such has been the patient sufferance of these colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former systems of government. The history of the present King of Great Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute tyranny over these states. To prove this, let facts be submitted to a candid world.

He has refused his assent to laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

He has forbidden his governors to pass laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till his assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, he has utterly neglected to attend to them.

He has refused to pass other laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of representation in the legislature, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only.

He has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their public records, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures.

He has dissolved representative houses repeatedly, for opposing with manly firmness his invasions on the rights of the people.

He has refused for a long time, after such dissolutions, to cause others to be elected; whereby the legislative powers, incapable of annihilation, have returned to the people at large for their exercise; the state remaining in the meantime exposed to all the dangers of invasion from without, and convulsions within.

He has endeavored to prevent the population of these states; for that purpose obstructing the laws for naturalization of foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migration hither, and raising the conditions of new appropriations of lands.

He has obstructed the administration of justice, by refusing his assent to laws for establishing judiciary powers.

He has made judges dependent on his will alone, for the tenure of their offices, and the amount and payment of their salaries.

He has erected a multitude of new offices, and sent hither swarms of officers to harass our people, and eat out their substance.

He has kept among us, in times of peace, standing armies without the consent of our legislature.

He has affected to render the military independent of and superior to civil power.

He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving his assent to their acts of pretended legislation:

For quartering large bodies of armed troops among us:

Thomas Jefferson

Oh now we're quoting Thomas Jefferson. You're such a romantic. You really want to cling onto the believe that it's the poor unwashed masses fighting against the corrupt rich regime don't you?

Tell me, now that you've cut and paste a whole paragraph from a 300 year old dead person, how would you apply it to a place like Thailand?

[Crossy]

Ladies and Gentlemen, I'm sure you're all aware of the rules regarding the Monarchy.

Several posts (and those replying to them) have been removed.

Further transgressions will not be tolerated!

[ableguy]

If Thailand ever does get their act together and the poor of this country actually are able to get good paying jobs ... there would be far few of us Farangs in Thailand.

Very astute and very true.

[ableguy]

Rightist and ultra-conservative icons such as Samak Sundharavej blasted the students, instigating violent mean to suppress the movement of the students, culminating in the October 6, 1976. The army unleashed the paramilitaries, and used the resultant mobs of violence, in which hundreds of students were tortured and killed, to suspend the constitution and resume power. Immediately after the incident, an amnesty was issued to prevent any of those responsible for the massacre from coming to justice.

Same old same old

Amnesty

Shoot and kill and torture college students--thousands--and no one goes to jail for it.

Captain does a coup not long ago.

What a joke.

No one goes to jail for it.

Likely no one in the North believes a thing this current government is saying and they are right not to believe this government.

After all, this government is a puppet.

Yeap and look what happened to Samark! He became a powerful man, the proxy right hand of Thaksin and for a short time, ruled Thailand with Thaksin whispering in his ear!

That's Thailand for you. It's all about compromise. But you don't speak for everyone in the North so your statement is moot. I still believe PM Abhisit is sincere in wanting to help the poor. However, if you don't want to see that, you're entitled to your opinion. I however see you as a very naive person with your 'free elections' and 'justice for all'. The only way this will ever happen in Thailand will be after a civil war and I for one don't ever want that. But a lefty like you, I bet for 'justice' you wouldn't mind seeing Bangkok burn would you?

I am not a violent man.

Change need not be violent.

When, in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the laws of nature and of nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shown that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security. --Such has been the patient sufferance of these colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former systems of government. The history of the present King of Great Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute tyranny over these states. To prove this, let facts be submitted to a candid world.

He has refused his assent to laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

He has forbidden his governors to pass laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till his assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, he has utterly neglected to attend to them.

He has refused to pass other laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of representation in the legislature, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only.

He has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their public records, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures.

He has dissolved representative houses repeatedly, for opposing with manly firmness his invasions on the rights of the people.

He has refused for a long time, after such dissolutions, to cause others to be elected; whereby the legislative powers, incapable of annihilation, have returned to the people at large for their exercise; the state remaining in the meantime exposed to all the dangers of invasion from without, and convulsions within.

He has endeavored to prevent the population of these states; for that purpose obstructing the laws for naturalization of foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migration hither, and raising the conditions of new appropriations of lands.

He has obstructed the administration of justice, by refusing his assent to laws for establishing judiciary powers.

He has made judges dependent on his will alone, for the tenure of their offices, and the amount and payment of their salaries.

He has erected a multitude of new offices, and sent hither swarms of officers to harass our people, and eat out their substance.

He has kept among us, in times of peace, standing armies without the consent of our legislature.

He has affected to render the military independent of and superior to civil power.

He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving his assent to their acts of pretended legislation:

For quartering large bodies of armed troops among us:

Thomas Jefferson

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[kissdani]

The problem is that Abhisit is just words, words come easy as his smirk in the face. He failed to bring ALL together. About the circumstances that brought him into power can be said he got lucky. 'Karma' has given him a chance, but he spoiled it or was not able to do it. To be the PM is not just a technical question, that you have the most MPs behind you, a good leader needs also a certain aura to be the MAN.

Don't judge him be his words, he talks and promise so much, look at his actions, the results of his work and his success. It is more than a tiny small minority in Thailand he could not convince.

He tried hard but he isn't somebody who can inspire the people.

The last weeks have been a total fiasco and disappointment.

The man has done a good job under such difficult circumstances and I truly believe he is sincere in this compromise. I was one of the many people who cursed him for not sending the troops in and breaking up the protest. I was of the many people so sick about the 'please have patience' speeches he kept throwing out during the weeks the animals held Bangkok hostage. But last night, the man won me over and I think this compromise is a win for everyone.

Of course there are lot of haters like you out there who want this to fail. You guys don't want free elections or 'democracy' if you even understand what that is. You guys just want an outright win for your side, not a win for both sides. If the red shirts are smart, they hopefully don't think this way. If they do, then when the tanks roll in, they only have themselves to blame for the bloodbath.

A good job in the eyes of a red shirt hater maybe, but not for sane persons.

Not everybody who criticize your object of love & devotion is a red shirt and/or wanna die by tanks rolling over him/her. you have a sick fantasy and a crude and false understanding of what democracy means.

[Robby nz]

If Thailand ever does get their act together and the poor of this country actually are able to get good paying jobs ... there would be far few of us Farangs in Thailand.

Very astute and very true.

And who provides the paying jobs good or bad?

Why the wealthy business owners.

But hang on arent they the enemy the reds are fighting?

Well yes but they are the elite and we have to get rid of them.

OK but who will then provide the jobs?

We wont talk to you anymore your obviously a trouble maker

[Deeral]

Don't have silly hopes. The evidence is clear. 2 cases, in one the EC voted 4:1 and in the other 5:0.

It is a save bet to say that the democrats will be dissolved and Abhisit banned from politics.

-----------------

There is no guarantee that even if the charges are substantiated in the courts that this will lead to disbanding of the party. They are not being charged with election fraud.

And let us not forget that the EC only made its recommendation after being overrun and threatened by the reds. Please tell me where in the world rational people would put much weight into this kind of recommendation given the threats and duress they were under? I am not saying the allegations of illegal contributions is not true but it is a long ways from being proven and it is still a very long way from knowing what the results will be if it is proven.

Illegal contributions or misusing money in an election is a far cry from election/voter fraud. In fact it is fairly common in the US with the result almost always being the party simply returning the money. I am not saying this is right but it is what it is in politics and in the grand scheme of corruption in Thailand this is not all the grand.

"Illegal contributions or misusing money in an election is a far cry from election/voter fraud." - so what is it then - "just a jolly good idea"?

[gl9999]

A good job in the eyes of a red shirt hater maybe, but not for sane persons.

Not everybody who criticize your object of love & devotion is a red shirt and/or wanna die by tanks rolling over him/her. you have a sick fantasy and a crude and false understanding of what democracy means.

You can criticise PM Abhisit all you want, whether you're Red, Yellow or Purple. But pray tell, if this compromise is that bad, what would you suggest as an alternative? This plan isn't a solution to the ills of this nation but it's a start which hopefully, future leaders down the road grow upon.

You people talk about a 'true' democracy but let's be frank here, this country no matter what color rules it will never ever be a 'true' democracy. Only the naive believe in a 'true' democracy. I guess people like you long to live in Freedonia where the sun shines all day, the people sing and dance all the time and farts smell like flowers. Grow up.