Thai Protesters Accept Pm Abhisit Election Roadmap, but refuse to go home

[warfie]

This is the stupidest Thai soap opera in Thailand history.

I can't believe Abhisit sets down five generalities with no specifics that everyone on this planet would agree to - "motherhood and apple pie" and the red shirts agree to it and decide they might end the rally.

What Abhisit proposed is like the Declaration of Independence. They are truths any moron would agree to.

Fact is, he will not leave the country and he will not dissolve the House immediately. So the red shirts have LOST if they accept his offer.

This is ridiculous

so you're saying that the reds are stupid and ridiculous?

[jdinasia]

There is a small possibility that the Red leaders are just a tiny bit reserved of taking anything that come from the government as truth. What legal consequence would it have for Abhisit if he start postponing the dissolution? None. He and the coalition control the majority in parliament, and thats it.

Of course the red leaders can go home, and watch the government launch a propaganda war when we get closer to september. There WILL be "incidents" when the army reshuffle is completed, enough for Mark to put on his most sincere face on all NBT stations interrupting whatever soap might be playing and announce that due to national unrest there will be no new elections. Then we're back to march and red shirts on the streets again.

.

This was abundantly clear to me from the moment is was announced and yet when the reds started by seeking assurances, the government supporters immediately started with cries of " why dont they just go home " and " the reds are not being serious ".

Apart from that the PM may not even have the proper authority to promise all this yet so its understandable the reds are treading carefully :-

NNT 2010-05-05

"BANGKOK (NNT) -- The ruling Democrat Party has admitted disunity among its own party members in agreement towards the reconciliation roadmap proposed by Prime Minister and Democrat Party Leader Abhisit Vejjajiva.

Spokesperson to the Democrat Party Leader, Thepthai Senpong, stated that not all party members agree with the reconciliation roadmap. "

Face it -- the Reds aren't getting ANYTHING that they asked for originally and yet they will gratefully take the offer and go home OR they will actually face what they have really wanted (and feared) from the beginning. A real crackdown.

They are not getting an immediate dissolution. Abhisit isn't leaving he country. The people that committed serious crimes will not get a blanket amnesty.

The government will see to the annual budget, the military reshuffle, and the charter reform.

[jcbangkok]

This is the stupidest Thai soap opera in Thailand history.

I can't believe Abhisit sets down five generalities with no specifics that everyone on this planet would agree to - "motherhood and apple pie" and the red shirts agree to it and decide they might end the rally.

What Abhisit proposed is like the Declaration of Independence. They are truths any moron would agree to.

Fact is, he will not leave the country and he will not dissolve the House immediately. So the red shirts have LOST if they accept his offer.

This is ridiculous

so you're saying that the reds are stupid and ridiculous?

In the words of Forrest Gump ... Stupid is as stupid does.

[retarius]

Arrest warrants sought for leaders

By The Nation

BANGKOK: -- The Department of Investigation is obtaining arrest warrants for nine leaders of the Democratic Alliance against Dictatorship for their alleged acts of terrorism during the month long protest of red shirted demonstrators in Bangkok.

Abhisist said two weeks ago, that he had a plan to seperate the terrorists from the red protesters

this is it.

DSI have just received 29million in extra funding

they have done a stirling job so far

in fact i would go as far to say that the DSI have saved Abhisit

its only a matter of time before they round up everyone involved and in true Thai tradition, everyone will inform on each other to try to get out from under the rock and the whole conspiracy will unwind from the bottom up

there may be one or two mysterious disapearances, odd accidents and outright assassinations along the way but once the conspiracy road map is complete, the opposition Phua Thai will be given a choice, get out of politics or go to jail free

same for the rest of the red leaders, they will be told to shut up, quietly fade away or go immediately to jail

if the were foolish enough to try to fight the charges there will be more trials here than Nuremburg, and likely as many public hangings.......

Abhisit and Korn will walk the next election with a landslide

Landslide? let's see...

ok we'll see what happens but i am certain of this, by the time all the evidence has been amassed by the DSI against the conspirators, they will be merely Abhisit's pawns in the end game

the Dems will get to campaign in red territory because their leaders will tell the local reds to let them do so without any harassment

whatever reasons they give to them to justify it will be up to them to manufacture but the real reason will be because they have been told to do so by Abhisit or they will go to jail on charges of conspiracy to murder, treason, lesse majeste and terrorism

Abhisit is not so meek and mild, to let this opportunity pass him by

the reds 15 minutes of fame is over.........

This sounds like wishful thinking at best, and may even be verbal diarrhea...you sound like you have probably never even been north of Bangkok....

I, for one, don't know what the election result will be, and I suspect that no-one posting here actually knows what it will be...it's probably fair to say that everyone who claims to 'know' is actually only guessing...

The one thing that puzzles me is that if it would be to Abhisit's advantage to have international vote monitors in the country for the election, he would undoubtedly do so...my theory, astounding though it may seem, is that both sides pay voters to vote, and thus having international observers is not to his advantage, as the observers would point this out...if however there are no monitors and (however unlikely it may seem) Abhisit loses, he can claim vote buying by the winners and then ask the new army chief (that he will have appointed two months earlier) to step in and overturn the election result...just a theory, but strange things happen in power politics and as astounding as it may seem to you, not every yellow politician tells the whole truth and the absolute truth all the time....

I'm wondering what the yellow propaganda is on the international vote monitor thing...I don't know but I'm guessing that it's all about the principle of the thing...even though the red shirts cheat, it's better to let them cheat than to have independent observers in, observing the cheating by the red shirts and the snow white purity of the yellow shirts...ahhh the sweet,sweet smell of hypocrisy....

[pornsasi]

Arrest warrants sought for leaders

By The Nation

BANGKOK: -- The Department of Investigation is obtaining arrest warrants for nine leaders of the Democratic Alliance against Dictatorship for their alleged acts of terrorism during the month long protest of red shirted demonstrators in Bangkok.

Abhisist said two weeks ago, that he had a plan to seperate the terrorists from the red protesters

this is it.

DSI have just received 29million in extra funding

they have done a stirling job so far

in fact i would go as far to say that the DSI have saved Abhisit

its only a matter of time before they round up everyone involved and in true Thai tradition, everyone will inform on each other to try to get out from under the rock and the whole conspiracy will unwind from the bottom up

there may be one or two mysterious disapearances, odd accidents and outright assassinations along the way but once the conspiracy road map is complete, the opposition Phua Thai will be given a choice, get out of politics or go to jail free

same for the rest of the red leaders, they will be told to shut up, quietly fade away or go immediately to jail

if the were foolish enough to try to fight the charges there will be more trials here than Nuremburg, and likely as many public hangings.......

Abhisit and Korn will walk the next election with a landslide

Short of putting the opposition in jail , an idiotic idea sorry to say , its by no mean certain that Abhisit or the dems

will win the next election (by winning i mean a dem dominated coalition coming to power) i dont mean an absolute majority .

In fact most analysts agree that if Abhisit remain as unpopular in North and Central Thailand as he is now , he

is likely to loose .

Maybe if he has enough MPs and all his coalition partners stay with him he may win . Thats an iffy proposition and again

recipe for unstability (thaksin was the only PM in what ? 50 years to serve a full term) which says a whole lot on the stupidity

of the half digested parlementary system a la british currently in use .

In this situation, I don't expect the Dems to be able to make any significant gains in the traditionally 'red' areas. The dems never really had any support there, and it will remain that way.

I had an interesting conversation with someone the other day who was possibly the most fervent pro-Thaksin person I have ever met. He is a businessman in one of the business areas around Bangkok. He would be the perfect example of an SME owner. He explained to me that once the parliament changed hands to be the dems, he was being offered all sorts of access to business, but with huge (30%) under the table payments to various government people. When asked if this was the case under TRT/PPP he explained no. He explained to me that their way was to siphon off major government contracts whilst, under the dems the system was to siphon from local business.

I didn't buy his line hook and sinker but he was absolutely convinced that this was the case. So, it would appear in his eyes that as long as the PPP people were paid from skimming major government deals through the party network he didn't care as long as it meant that the PPP reps weren't trying to skim too much from local business. He was convinced that the Dems have never cared for the little man in their entire political history and that this perception will prevent the Dems from ever winning a majority in an election.

Your friend is right about the dems not caring for small ppl up at least until now , and same could be said of some other thai parties as well in the past . Else Thaksin would never had managed to gain such an influence in thai politics and become so popular . See if Abhisit can show that he is different from the old dems , i have some doubts but i would be very glad to be plainly wrong .

Interesting on under the under the table money , i did not know that . When Thaksin was in power my business was much better then now but then lets not forget times were different (financial crisis last year) so dunno . Yes agree with you it will be extremely difficult , almost impossible , for the dems to gain votes in the central and northen areas . Its almost as if Abhisit name is not used to scare small children when they are naughty over there LOL . Probably Newin's BJTP will be one of the key , as much more popular in Isaan then the dems (the other one beeing Banharn which i feel is not very satisfied under Abhisit ). Who will they join after general election is unknown , and then , is that a good thing for small parties to be so powerfull. Also remains to see PTP performance , without Thaksin they appear a bit lost ...

[jdinasia]

Ah, the sweet smell of hypocrisy ........

Tell me, how would an international observer that doesn't speak Thai, has no access to the village headmen, has no long-term presence in Thailand etc .... be able to judge vote buying? They can't and it really isn't their job to do so.

Election monitors watch how ballots are handled. They look at the layout of voting booths. They talk to locals and gather anecdotal information (gossip) regarding votebuying but rarely ever would see money changing hands.

Vote buying in Thailand sometimes consists of people paying in cash (or in-kind things like phone cards) in advance. That can be visible if you are trying to spy on the right people. Vote buying can also be payment in things to a village like a new water supply etc provided AFTER the village voting record is entered.

The way that PPP was nabbed was video evidence of a PPP exec paying off village headmen.

International observers will be able to see direct intimidation or issues with ballots and voting booths but little else.

[Thai at Heart]

Ah, the sweet smell of hypocrisy ........

Tell me, how would an international observer that doesn't speak Thai, has no access to the village headmen, has no long-term presence in Thailand etc .... be able to judge vote buying? They can't and it really isn't their job to do so.

Election monitors watch how ballots are handled. They look at the layout of voting booths. They talk to locals and gather anecdotal information (gossip) regarding votebuying but rarely ever would see money changing hands.

Vote buying in Thailand sometimes consists of people paying in cash (or in-kind things like phone cards) in advance. That can be visible if you are trying to spy on the right people. Vote buying can also be payment in things to a village like a new water supply etc provided AFTER the village voting record is entered.

The way that PPP was nabbed was video evidence of a PPP exec paying off village headmen.

International observers will be able to see direct intimidation or issues with ballots and voting booths but little else.

Oh I am sure that the NGO's in Bangkok could provide a few thousand bi-lingual speakers to give an idea of what is going on.

The issue about whether or not it is on the balance sheet or off the balance sheet bribery is irrelevant in my opinion. If the Election Commission can quite often find and prove relevant corruption, adding a lot more independent eyes to the "force" can't be a bad thing.

Your logic is a little obtuse, in that what you are saying is that to try harder to find the corruption because we believe it is there is pointless because it is so sophisticated as to be un-discoverable. Obviously, Thailand has a monopoly on advanced corruption techniques that would be beyond even seasoned poll monitors? In fact, it is so sophisticated, that you know about it.

Wowee. And the PPP have only been at it for 10 or so years, imagine how clever the Dems have been at it to survive 80 years intact.

What would we do, if we didn't find any significant corruption, much like WMD in Iraq? We would have to assume there isn't any, and then what would we do if the PPP won? We would have to honour the result. What a bummer.

Edited May 5, 2010 by Thai at Heart

[Motoon]

Ah, the sweet smell of hypocrisy ........

Tell me, how would an international observer that doesn't speak Thai, has no access to the village headmen, has no long-term presence in Thailand etc .... be able to judge vote buying? They can't and it really isn't their job to do so.

Election monitors watch how ballots are handled. They look at the layout of voting booths. They talk to locals and gather anecdotal information (gossip) regarding votebuying but rarely ever would see money changing hands.

Vote buying in Thailand sometimes consists of people paying in cash (or in-kind things like phone cards) in advance. That can be visible if you are trying to spy on the right people. Vote buying can also be payment in things to a village like a new water supply etc provided AFTER the village voting record is entered.

The way that PPP was nabbed was video evidence of a PPP exec paying off village headmen.

International observers will be able to see direct intimidation or issues with ballots and voting booths but little else.

I have to agree that International observers wouldn't have much of an impact given the fact how refined the vote buying, probably practiced by all major parties, has become. And then there's also the issue of face...

[deadsnoopy]

"Thai Red Shirts accept roadmap but refuse to go home "

Q. I wonder why they don't want to go home?

A. They have a better standard of living in Bangkok than on their farms

If they return home now they may have to work for a living instead of living off Thaksins handouts

They know it is rice planting season and that is hard work

REDS THE PARTY IS OVER !! GO HOME AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR FAMILIES

I don't think that they are being allowed to go home until the red leaders say so. They first need to get back their ID cards and probably the money that they earned from taking part in the protest.

Cheers, Rick

Stop talking trash. Nobody has to give up their ID cards. A few weeks ago they started making their own "red shirt ID cards" to help identify them when they enter/leave the protest sites. Nobody is being held hostage in there, everybody is free to leave and join.

[TheOldWolf]

"Thai Red Shirts accept roadmap but refuse to go home "

Q. I wonder why they don't want to go home?

A. They have a better standard of living in Bangkok than on their farms

If they return home now they may have to work for a living instead of living off Thaksins handouts

They know it is rice planting season and that is hard work

REDS THE PARTY IS OVER !! GO HOME AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR FAMILIES

I don't think that they are being allowed to go home until the red leaders say so. They first need to get back their ID cards and probably the money that they earned from taking part in the protest.

Cheers, Rick

Stop talking trash. Nobody has to give up their ID cards. A few weeks ago they started making their own "red shirt ID cards" to help identify them when they enter/leave the protest sites. Nobody is being held hostage in there, everybody is free to leave and join.

How do you know that?

[gl9999]

Stop talking trash. Nobody has to give up their ID cards. A few weeks ago they started making their own "red shirt ID cards" to help identify them when they enter/leave the protest sites. Nobody is being held hostage in there, everybody is free to leave and join.

Maybe they are free to leave if they want to but after a couple of months in the hot sun, they're not going to leave without getting paid first. So in essence they are being held hostage.

[timekeeper]

"Thai Red Shirts accept roadmap but refuse to go home "

Q. I wonder why they don't want to go home?

A. They have a better standard of living in Bangkok than on their farms

If they return home now they may have to work for a living instead of living off Thaksins handouts

They know it is rice planting season and that is hard work

REDS THE PARTY IS OVER !! GO HOME AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR FAMILIES

I don't think that they are being allowed to go home until the red leaders say so. They first need to get back their ID cards and probably the money that they earned from taking part in the protest.

Cheers, Rick

Stop talking trash. Nobody has to give up their ID cards. A few weeks ago they started making their own "red shirt ID cards" to help identify them when they enter/leave the protest sites. Nobody is being held hostage in there, everybody is free to leave and join.

there you are deadsnoopy......... does you shift start at 3pm?

Edited May 5, 2010 by timekeeper

[Jingthing]

Stop talking trash. Nobody has to give up their ID cards. A few weeks ago they started making their own "red shirt ID cards" to help identify them when they enter/leave the protest sites. Nobody is being held hostage in there, everybody is free to leave and join.

Maybe they are free to leave if they want to but after a couple of months in the hot sun, they're not going to leave without getting paid first. So in essence they are being held hostage.

Not to mention the stigma or worse of returning home a quitter. We did have that report about a death threat over a red wanting to quit. Of course, many are expecting payment, that is a FACT, and naturally don't want to lose their payday.

[deadsnoopy]

Stop talking trash. Nobody has to give up their ID cards. A few weeks ago they started making their own "red shirt ID cards" to help identify them when they enter/leave the protest sites. Nobody is being held hostage in there, everybody is free to leave and join.

Maybe they are free to leave if they want to but after a couple of months in the hot sun, they're not going to leave without getting paid first. So in essence they are being held hostage.

More trash. Even respected journalists like Dan Rivers from CNN have yesterday said on live TV from Bangkok that it's highly doubtful that the protesters are here for money. Wake up.

[warfie]

"Thai Red Shirts accept roadmap but refuse to go home "

Q. I wonder why they don't want to go home?

A. They have a better standard of living in Bangkok than on their farms

If they return home now they may have to work for a living instead of living off Thaksins handouts

They know it is rice planting season and that is hard work

REDS THE PARTY IS OVER !! GO HOME AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR FAMILIES

I don't think that they are being allowed to go home until the red leaders say so. They first need to get back their ID cards and probably the money that they earned from taking part in the protest.

Cheers, Rick

Stop talking trash. Nobody has to give up their ID cards. A few weeks ago they started making their own "red shirt ID cards" to help identify them when they enter/leave the protest sites. Nobody is being held hostage in there, everybody is free to leave and join.

Even if this were true, a "redneck ID card" is not going to BE accepted in lieu of an official Thai ID card... so, outside redneck city, it is worthless.

Edited May 5, 2010 by warfie

[deadsnoopy]

"Thai Red Shirts accept roadmap but refuse to go home "

Q. I wonder why they don't want to go home?

A. They have a better standard of living in Bangkok than on their farms

If they return home now they may have to work for a living instead of living off Thaksins handouts

They know it is rice planting season and that is hard work

REDS THE PARTY IS OVER !! GO HOME AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR FAMILIES

I don't think that they are being allowed to go home until the red leaders say so. They first need to get back their ID cards and probably the money that they earned from taking part in the protest.

Cheers, Rick

Stop talking trash. Nobody has to give up their ID cards. A few weeks ago they started making their own "red shirt ID cards" to help identify them when they enter/leave the protest sites. Nobody is being held hostage in there, everybody is free to leave and join.

Even if this were true, a "redneck ID card" is not going to accepted in lieu of an official Thai ID card... so, outside redneck city, it is worthless.

Twist twist. The point is that nobody has to give up their ID card to enter the rally.

[jdinasia]

"Thai Red Shirts accept roadmap but refuse to go home "

Q. I wonder why they don't want to go home?

A. They have a better standard of living in Bangkok than on their farms

If they return home now they may have to work for a living instead of living off Thaksins handouts

They know it is rice planting season and that is hard work

REDS THE PARTY IS OVER !! GO HOME AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR FAMILIES

I don't think that they are being allowed to go home until the red leaders say so. They first need to get back their ID cards and probably the money that they earned from taking part in the protest.

Cheers, Rick

Stop talking trash. Nobody has to give up their ID cards. A few weeks ago they started making their own "red shirt ID cards" to help identify them when they enter/leave the protest sites. Nobody is being held hostage in there, everybody is free to leave and join.

Even if this were true, a "redneck ID card" is not going to accepted in lieu of an official Thai ID card... so, outside redneck city, it is worthless.

The reds from this part of the country DID indeed have to hand over their ID's and check in daily to have their attendance recorded in order to get paid.

[gl9999]

More trash. Even respected journalists like Dan Rivers from CNN have yesterday said on live TV from Bangkok that it's highly doubtful that the protesters are here for money. Wake up.

Sorry but the local people(that's us) know better then any foreign journalist. Deny it all you want but even you know a lot of them are being paid.

[deadsnoopy]

The reds from this part of the country DID indeed have to hand over their ID's and check in daily to have their attendance recorded in order to get paid.

Please provide a credible source or stop spreading lies.

[Jingthing]

More trash. Even respected journalists like Dan Rivers from CNN have yesterday said on live TV from Bangkok that it's highly doubtful that the protesters are here for money. Wake up.

Sorry but the local people(that's us) know better then any foreign journalist. Deny it all you want but even you know a lot of them are being paid.

Red propagandists should know when to stop.

[deadsnoopy]

I'm just asking to see proof from a credible source. Maybe I'm asking too much? Just let me know if I should start believe in the Tooth Fairy too without seeing proof.

[Norcan]

"Thai Red Shirts accept roadmap but refuse to go home "

Q. I wonder why they don't want to go home?

A. They have a better standard of living in Bangkok than on their farms

If they return home now they may have to work for a living instead of living off Thaksins handouts

They know it is rice planting season and that is hard work

REDS THE PARTY IS OVER !! GO HOME AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR FAMILIES

I don't think that they are being allowed to go home until the red leaders say so. They first need to get back their ID cards and probably the money that they earned from taking part in the protest.

Cheers, Rick

Stop talking trash. Nobody has to give up their ID cards. A few weeks ago they started making their own "red shirt ID cards" to help identify them when they enter/leave the protest sites. Nobody is being held hostage in there, everybody is free to leave and join.

Sorry, but I have to shatter your delusions.

Mrs Norcan is a station supervisor with the BTS. She regularly works nights at one of the stations that are within Fort Redneck. At midnight, the BTS staff padlock the shutter from the inside, which is about 30 seconds before a Red comes up and locks the staff in from the OUTSIDE. How's that for peace and harmony for starters?

However, some of the older, more gentle, country folk (read: old ladies) pop upstairs to the BTS and offer the staff food and drinks, because they know they are being held hostage every evening. Mrs N. recently asked one of the old ladies "why don't you go home? Don't you realise how dangerous this could be for you?" The little old ladies reply ---> "I want to go home. I was only told I had to come here for 3 days and I have only been paid for 3 days. But now they will not allow us to leave."

This is not rumour, conjecture or gossip...it is fact!

I trust this source is credible enough for you.

Edited May 5, 2010 by Norcan

[deadsnoopy]

All quiet. Thought so. Some people here are big talking trash but when it comes to actually showing a credible source to back up their ridiculous statements, they suddenly go quiet.

[timekeeper]

Stop talking trash. Nobody has to give up their ID cards. A few weeks ago they started making their own "red shirt ID cards" to help identify them when they enter/leave the protest sites. Nobody is being held hostage in there, everybody is free to leave and join.

Maybe they are free to leave if they want to but after a couple of months in the hot sun, they're not going to leave without getting paid first. So in essence they are being held hostage.

More trash. Even respected journalists like Dan Rivers from CNN have yesterday said on live TV from Bangkok that it's highly doubtful that the protesters are here for money. Wake up.

what would he know? does he speak Thai?

the reds are told to deny they are being paid by their beloved leaders

thy probably laugh at him behind his back, he's a farang after all and probably wearing a green press armband that says ''dissolve parliament''

the reds are getting paid, its been proven over and over

its just trashy propaganda to say they aren't.

i remember seeing a Dan Rivers interview about belching cows on you tube

real in depth reporting............

[deadsnoopy]

"Thai Red Shirts accept roadmap but refuse to go home "

Q. I wonder why they don't want to go home?

A. They have a better standard of living in Bangkok than on their farms

If they return home now they may have to work for a living instead of living off Thaksins handouts

They know it is rice planting season and that is hard work

REDS THE PARTY IS OVER !! GO HOME AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR FAMILIES

I don't think that they are being allowed to go home until the red leaders say so. They first need to get back their ID cards and probably the money that they earned from taking part in the protest.

Cheers, Rick

Stop talking trash. Nobody has to give up their ID cards. A few weeks ago they started making their own "red shirt ID cards" to help identify them when they enter/leave the protest sites. Nobody is being held hostage in there, everybody is free to leave and join.

Sorry, but I have to shatter your delusions.

Mrs Norcan is a station supervisor with the BTS. She regularly works nights at one of the stations that are within Fort Redneck. At midnight, the BTS staff padlock the shutter from the inside, which is about 30 seconds before a Red comes up and locks the staff in from the OUTSIDE. How's that for peace and harmony for starters?

However, some of the older, more gentle, country folk (read: old ladies) pop upstairs to the BTS and offer the staff food and drinks, because they know they are being held hostage every evening. Mrs N. recently asked one of the old ladies "why don't you go home? Don't you realise how dangerous this could be for you?" The little old ladies reply ---> "I want to go home. I was only told I had to come here for 3 days and I have only been paid for 3 days. But now they will not allow us to leave."

This is not rumour, conjecture or gossip...it is fact!

"Mrs. Norcan"? Would that be the wife of "Norcan" (you) who has 6 anonymous posts on this forum? I asked for a credible source, not for someone signing up for a new forum username and posting more rumors.

[Norcan]

All quiet. Thought so. Some people here are big talking trash but when it comes to actually showing a credible source to back up their ridiculous statements, they suddenly go quiet.

Please see post #353 above.

[timekeeper]

All quiet. Thought so. Some people here are big talking trash but when it comes to actually showing a credible source to back up their ridiculous statements, they suddenly go quiet.

not me boy

here you go.........

[bangkokrick]

Reply to JD as Dead has screwed up the quotes again.

Agreed JD and in fact the Government offered to replace the ID cards of the reds that wanted to return home.

Cheers, Rick

[timekeeper]

I'm just asking to see proof from a credible source. Maybe I'm asking too much? Just let me know if I should start believe in the Tooth Fairy too without seeing proof.

now then wheres that tooth?

[lannarebirth]

Ah, the sweet smell of hypocrisy ........

Tell me, how would an international observer that doesn't speak Thai, has no access to the village headmen, has no long-term presence in Thailand etc .... be able to judge vote buying? They can't and it really isn't their job to do so.

Election monitors watch how ballots are handled. They look at the layout of voting booths. They talk to locals and gather anecdotal information (gossip) regarding votebuying but rarely ever would see money changing hands.

Vote buying in Thailand sometimes consists of people paying in cash (or in-kind things like phone cards) in advance. That can be visible if you are trying to spy on the right people. Vote buying can also be payment in things to a village like a new water supply etc provided AFTER the village voting record is entered.

The way that PPP was nabbed was video evidence of a PPP exec paying off village headmen.

International observers will be able to see direct intimidation or issues with ballots and voting booths but little else.

Actually, I agree with this. It will be much easier to catch vote buyers without Intl observers.