westybrook Posted July 6, 2005 Share Posted July 6, 2005 Hi all I have a friend who has come back from LOS and she taught out there, she did a TESOL in England then went out there and taught in BKK. She has a uni degree (Real) but claims it's very easy to get one in BKK. (Fake degree) She even said that schools are none the wiser, also some of her friends got a job on a fake degree and beat someone who she knows who has a real degree for a job Whats your thoughts on this, what would the Thai Work Permit guys do if they knew it was fake, or the school or college you work at? Who has done this before, thought about it, or just knows about it. Pros and Cons welcome Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capco1 Posted July 6, 2005 Share Posted July 6, 2005 Go ahead guys.....have at him.....I know you will! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_Pat_Pong Posted July 6, 2005 Share Posted July 6, 2005 Why would we waste time on a cheat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westybrook Posted July 6, 2005 Author Share Posted July 6, 2005 Capco im sure they will. But if it is that hard to get a Work Permitt and schools now want degrees and TESOLS, then obtaining a fake degree is clearly the option some are taking and its paying off. No dought someone is gonna give a reply that is a horror story of someone getting caught with a fake, and something bad happening to him/her. But I just want to get peoples opinons, thoughts and experiences with fake degrees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capco1 Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 I agree with you! I really wonder what motivates an individual to spend somewhere between what?.....$35K to $50K for a college education only to pick up sticks and secure a teaching job that pays what?......$700.00 a month. Seems like a typical high school drop out could just as well working at the local fast food joint! Could it be that there's something I'm missing? I would think that a teaching position that pays somewhere between 25k and 35k baht is fair pay for a bogus degree! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatabike Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 All this fuss about a degree, I have had to get a friend in Uk to go sort through all sorts of stored crap of mine to find my degree, that I have not seen in many, many years (which I was never asked for in any job I took whilst in the Uk) so that they can process my work permit. What was the degree? Model making, great help to me in teaching English I must say. Yet with this I can be a teacher here. I seem to be doing a good job, my student are starting to get confident to actually speak English, and learning that making a mistake is ok. They are starting to use the 7 years of learning from Thai teachers in an active, speaking way. But none of this was due to my degree; it was due to hard work and personality in the classroom. Different schools different needs but at the government school where I teach I see 760 students a week, they all have a good knowledge of the English language from their Thai teachers but can’t speak it. My degree helps me not one jot, and if I had a high level degree in English I would not be teaching here in LOS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capco1 Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 Thank you for the honest answer! That's exactly what I'm trying to stress! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Doctor Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 You can easily buy fake degrees on the web - I often get offered them over email (I think having university email addresses causes that). Obviously having worked for my degrees, I have strong moral objections to these cheats. But, here's one story; ------------ Last year, working at one university in Thailand, we had many applicants for teaching jobs to sort through and check up on. One guy managed to get all the way to the interview stage before one of my colleagues found out he had fake degrees. Moments before walking into the interview, my colleague passed around the advert from where the guy had got his degrees - and this was duly attached to his file in front of all of us. He then had an interview with 5-6 professors all of whom knew he had fake degrees. We humoured him for a while, and then got him to make a presentation... Watching the presentation, it was very hard to stop laughing as this 'doctor of marketing' tried to explain to us that is "wasn't enough to just advertise a printer on tv, you needed to have someone to sell it too". The presentation lasted 2 minutes (should have been 20). After which the guy was laid into. ------------- My point is this, ok you can buy a degree and maybe you are arrogant enough to feel that you are good enough to do the job and you won't learn anything from doing a degree anyway. You may even get an interview, and even manage to con someone into giving you a job, but then you'll not be equipped with the knowledge and ability to really do the job. Then, you'll either get found out, or you'll ruin the reputation of the good, real teachers. Capco - you are missing something big, life isn't always about money, money, money - if I was in life for money, I certainly wouldn't be in Thailand. I spent 8 years at university, and probably a lot more money than you suggest on my degrees, but I got them. I had a high paid city job before returning to study, but I'm a lot happier doing something that makes a real difference in a great environment, earning 35kBaht. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capco1 Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 Doc, Point well taken, however I feel that you may very well be the exception to the rule! I really think that a large majority may have other motives i.e. 1. Unable to function in their own society. 2. Unable to communicate in a normal relationship. 3. Drinking problems. 4. Sexual addiction. Etc, etc, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ijustwannateach Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 Let's see... a post about how what happens to be an average foreign- teacher's wage here is really the same as a fast food worker's at home... a post about how the majority of teachers working here must have social, sexual, alcohol problems.... Nah, Capco, I don't think my first impression of you was that far off. "Steven" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capco1 Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 Whatever my friend....I've got better things to deal with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluebear Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 then why dont you ###### off and do it instead of TROLLing round a teachers forum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capco1 Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 Whats wrong? Did you find yourself in one of the above catagories? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluebear Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 no, but i think you do. TROLL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyree D. Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 places ask for transcripts now, to be officially mailed from your school. Fine for me since all these places remember when I was a student at Chiang Mai University. capco, I don't like your attitude. some of us don't care about money, even though I got inheritance, an American accident settlement and profits from the ForEx market. are you even in Thailand? and before I came here, all I heard was, "you don't have experience in anything". Well, I just got out of college. I am offended by your, "my degree is irrelevant posts". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capco1 Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 Who said anything about your degree? Good Lord...From the posts I've been reading here I really feel for the students in Thailand! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neeranam Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 places ask for transcripts now, to be officially mailed from your school. Well if you got your degree in Scotland pre95 like I did, the school won't issue a transcript. As for needing a degree, well upcountry you don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westybrook Posted July 7, 2005 Author Share Posted July 7, 2005 Ok back to topic, Neeranam, please explain more about up country not needing degrees? How then do you get a Work Permitt? Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vit42 Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 I'm met harvard phd's who were dumb as doorknobs, good ceo's with only a highschool education... point is, proven ability is what matters in the end. Don't dis a degree as if it's not worthy and don't dis someone without a degree as if they couldn't do the job. However, If you have to lie to prove your ability that's a joke. If you really think you can do the job w/o the degree tell the truth and then prove it. If you really have what it takes, you will succeed despite the naysayers. Do it honorably otherwise your success is just b.s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capco1 Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 I agree! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westybrook Posted July 7, 2005 Author Share Posted July 7, 2005 What about Diplomas? I have a BTEC Diploma in IT, is this worth anything in Thailand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samran Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 All, go easy on poor westybrook. He is a bit worried that his significant other won't get her visa to come live in the UK, and if you look at his other posts, you will see he is searching all options. Westy - a word of advice from someone who has actually gone though the UK visa system. I think you'll be fine! If you are devoting the same amount of time to the visa application as you are to asking questions, I guarantee that a visa will be granted! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_Pat_Pong Posted July 8, 2005 Share Posted July 8, 2005 Samran willya get Westy to explain what a Work Permitt is. All great English teachers should be able to spell permit ( even those boasting fake degrees ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenkannif Posted July 8, 2005 Share Posted July 8, 2005 Ok back to topic, Neeranam, please explain more about up country not needing degrees? How then do you get a Work Permitt?Cheers! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> While degrees help with the process and most people 'need' to have one. It is possible for the school to get you a WP without one, this is especially true outside of the 'main' areas (your Bangkok, Phuket etc. Although I know a couple of people that have managed to get a WP without a degree in Bangkok). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capco1 Posted July 8, 2005 Share Posted July 8, 2005 This may be so....but not the norm! I'd hate to see a person pick up roots and move thousands of miles away only to find themselves unemployed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patricktan Posted July 8, 2005 Share Posted July 8, 2005 So where can I buy one? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenkannif Posted July 8, 2005 Share Posted July 8, 2005 This may be so....but not the norm! I'd hate to see a person pick up roots and move thousands of miles away only to find themselves unemployed. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> But you have to ask yourself why it's not the norm? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neeranam Posted July 8, 2005 Share Posted July 8, 2005 (edited) So where can I buy one? lol I know a guy who bought one from <We don't do that kind of thing here mate KK>. He didn't even get a Masters! If you are going to cheat them, why not get a Phd or masters, this gives nore money at most places I know. Up-country is is up to the head/principal of the college/uni. The Ministry Of Education are not involved. Edited July 8, 2005 by kenkannif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Som _Tam Posted July 8, 2005 Share Posted July 8, 2005 As far as teaching goes, a monkey with a tie can do it. I mean of course it is good to get some classroom management experience but the rest is easy...I don't see why you have to get some stupid piece of paper from some University in order to teach children or even adults. Schools are all about making money not “education”. More like mental adjustment. Just taught to follow the rules. I have been teaching in Asia for over 5 years. To me teaching is the biggest joke. I prefer to teach only kids because they are sincere and are always learning anyway. But with adults all they are is a bunch of programmed robots. I’ve been in Thai classrooms for years and have had the opportunity to look at their textbooks. A bunch of nonsense propaganda. I have seen inside of a Protom 6 book 2 pictures of brooms. They were showing the difference between a boom used to sweep the street and a broom used to sweep the home!! Is this all a 11 year old can understand? Of course I am involved with the children’s education but I think the most important thing is to smash their stereotypes that they have implanted in their heads through societies agents. (parents, teachers) That is more beneficial to them. Maybe they will realize that they are not just Thai children but they are human children. They can forget about what they think they are supposed to respect. (nation,teacher,parents,teachers,king,) any maybe they will think for themselves. Oh yeah, I started to rant sorry. I forgot. But I have seen these T.O.E.F.L heads or whatever certificate they have come and go. It seems the more qualifications the worse they are, Teaching is all personality. And if all you know is how to follow rules and vomit out stupid information that was told to you by somebody else you will fail. And I have seen them fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenkannif Posted July 8, 2005 Share Posted July 8, 2005 (edited) So where can I buy one? lol I know a guy who bought one from <We don't do that kind of thing here mate KK>. He didn't even get a Masters! If you are going to cheat them, why not get a Phd or masters, this gives nore money at most places I know. Up-country is is up to the head/principal of the college/uni. The Ministry Of Education are not involved. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The MoE issues the teachers licence so they are involved, minimally possibly, but nevertheless involved. Also generally you'd have a Bachelors before you got your Masters and most schools at the mid level wouldn't pay you anymore IME! Edited July 8, 2005 by kenkannif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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