Farangs Calling Thai'S Racist...

[JRinger]

glitch

Edited August 17, 2010 by JRinger

[JRinger]

rgs2001uk

Last time I looked it up, Australia allows retirees for only A$500,000.

I would have thought in these times of financial uncertainty it would make sense to allow moneyed retiree immigration rather than the economic migrants many seem to encourage.

Many countries could do worse than follow the Thai example.

My how time flies....seems only yesterday, all that was needed to get into Australia was a prior conviction

[phetaroi]

I just read the OP, and I think that the author makes some technically valid intellectual points...and he writes well.

But I think also it's a question of semantics and degrees.

The author is correct, in my view, it's really not so much racism, as it is discrimination against all things and people not Thai. It exists in little things. For example, over the years, whether in Thailand or here in the U.S., if I said to a Thai friend, "Let's go out for Mexican (or Italian, or Indian, or etc.) food," I was virtually always turned down because, "Oh no, Thai food is better." And it was never even a statement about them preferring Thai food, almost the point of exclusivity of any other cuisine, it was always stated that it was better. Now that's a little example of discriminating against something.

On the other end of things, people with a Lao background in Thailand are often looked down on as being not to bright, "but they are very friendly people." It's no wonder that Issan is the poorest region of Thailand...for more than one reason...but certainly partly because the culture their is discriminated against by central Thais. Similarly, the Muslim culture of the south is looked down on, and the region suffers, in part, because of that discrimination. Some people say it's racism. It's not, because as the OP point out, they are Asian race also. But it is discrimination.

And of course, there is discrimination against white farangs. We are treated as second class citizens...well, visitors. Now that could be racism, but actually I think it's just discrimination against people who are non-Thai.

But although it's all not racism, it's still discrimination that diminishes other groups of people, and while it may not compare to lynchings or near-extermination of cultures, wrong is still wrong.

[BWPattaya]

If a bar decides they only want Japanese or Koreans etc why would enyone else want to go in? I know there are some bars catering for Japanese and Thais where generally Westerners are not allowed in unless they speak reasonable Thai. I know a huge number of places that will not let Indians and Arabs in. Westerners only.

However, we could go on about this for days and nothing would change so simply go where you are welcome.

Accept that which we cannot change.

[Jingthing]

If we aren't Thai, we have to accept things here. But that doesn't mean we have to approve of them, endorse them, or not comment about them.

[phetaroi]

Have never known Thais to be racist, except for my Thai neighbour who hates Scots people.

I asked him why? He said what other nation would be proud of it`s men that wear no underwear and short skirts with a big furry dangly thing at the front.

So you are sticking up for stupidity?

[phetaroi]

'Racism'?

I am not wasting my time here.

And therein lies the problem, straight from the mouth of a Thai -- racism (or discrimination) is not important enough to waste time on thinking about or doing something about. Hence the karma of the deep south and its effect on the rest of the Thai nation.

[phetaroi]

OP

ask the next 10 Thais you meet, yes or no only, Do you like blacks? yes or no

Then read worker wanted ads in any Thai paper. Draw a line through ones that contain, age, sex or race discrimination.

Then read up on how past PM's, and Others, called the Chinese, the 'jews of the East' and established laws discriminating them. That has been reversed in modern days, of course, with the Chinese Thais now the upper class.

Finally, in a perverted way, Thais are racist against themselves by using whitening cream and swallowing whitening pills. How idiotic, if not racist, is it to try to change one's skin color? how spell self mutilation due racial color?

How many women politicians are there compared to western ratio?

Terrific stuff!

I agree. I'm not sure there's a better summary of the existence of rampant discrimination among Thais.

[phetaroi]

This whole "light skin" business is such a misunderstood concept. First of all, it's a preference thing, not racist tendencies (i.e., beauty, attractiveness). Obviously it's not racial--all Thai's are of the same race regardless of their skin color (can we freakin agree on that??). I've been told that dark skin is viewed exactly the same as obesity in the USA. Are Americans racist against fat people? Wrong term. Do Americans discriminate against fat people? Probably, although at a more subliminal level and more against fat women (it's complicated). Substitute "fat" for "dark skin" and it's very similar. Thai's consider light skin Asians (e.g., Koreans, Chinese, Japanese) to be the most attractive. This preference is more pronounced for men choosing women.

As for "trying to change one's skin color," isn't that sort of like getting a tan? Actually, it's exactly the same. But I'm sure you will all disagree.

While I agree that the whitening cream phenomenon is not that different than getting a tan, I think the light versus dark skin thing is beyond just "looks". Dark skinned people are often looked down upon as being poor farmers types who are not very sophisticated.

[phetaroi]

White people whine to much lol, about one little word "Farang" they will hold that against Thai people until there death in there province.

Please leave thailand.

Speaking of whining, I'm getting rather tired of hearing you whine about people whining and suggesting they leave Thailand.

[phetaroi]

Farrang to me is nothing more than a word. Its not racist its just a word that describes wetsterners in a simple to use way.

I was talking to a very rich lady in Bangkok who asked if I minded being called a farrang, I said not in the slightest. She replied that its used not to offend but has been taught to them from a very early age.

When I go to pick up my GFs son the other four year old kids are shouting do farrang yai. It what they have been taught we can't change that.

In general, the word farang doesn't offend me, although depending on context, it can.

But I disagree with your mention about it being what they've been taught and therefore can't be changed. The same can be said of racism against Blacks in America...it's what many Whites, particularly (but not only) in the South were taught. Yet, over time, to a very large degree people were taught differently and things did change.

[phetaroi]

As a Thai, I'll gladly admit that there are plenty of racist Thais, local gov't policies, etc. Plenty of socio-economic class based discrimination as well.

Big deal, welcome to the planet.

Atlast....common sense. Welcome to the planet. :clap2:

And it took a Thai to make the point.

I think the point he mistakenly made is that Thais don't think discrimination is a significant thing. That in itself is discrimination.

[F1fanatic]

Farrang to me is nothing more than a word. Its not racist its just a word that describes wetsterners in a simple to use way.

I was talking to a very rich lady in Bangkok who asked if I minded being called a farrang, I said not in the slightest. She replied that its used not to offend but has been taught to them from a very early age.

When I go to pick up my GFs son the other four year old kids are shouting do farrang yai. It what they have been taught we can't change that.

In general, the word farang doesn't offend me, although depending on context, it can.

But I disagree with your mention about it being what they've been taught and therefore can't be changed. The same can be said of racism against Blacks in America...it's what many Whites, particularly (but not only) in the South were taught. Yet, over time, to a very large degree people were taught differently and things did change.

Agree, but must also add that farang is generally used in a dismissive way, the same way we would refer to someone we thought unimportant. If we thought someone was worth considering, we wouldn't refer to them as 'that foreigner, person over there' or whatever, we'd make an effort to describe them in a NICE way.

[phetaroi]

Funny how it's always white people telling me this. however in 9 years here the only racism I received for being black was from white people, never Thais. Thais will do the rip you off because your obviously not from here deal, but never anything for being black specifically.

Were I do see it from Thais is in their advertising. "Darly" Toothpaste and "Black Man" Cleaning supplies....like I was born with a F'ing broom in my hand and wearing a bow tie LOL

I don't think that's actually so odd, because while Thais MAY look down on you, most wouldn't be so rude as to make a comment about it. However, as a White person, I have had several Thais make very rude comments to me about Blacks. Although there seems to be an emphasis on negative stereotypes of Africans over Black westerners. And, how many condos and hotels will not accept Indians and Pakistanis.

[Ulysses G.]

Agree, but must also add that farang is generally used in a dismissive way, the same way we would refer to someone we thought unimportant. If we thought someone was worth considering, we wouldn't refer to them as 'that foreigner, person over there' or whatever, we'd make an effort to describe them in a NICE way.

Thai people do not think the same way that we do because of Buddhism and a completely different culture Trying to put them in a Western box just does not work.

[F1fanatic]

Agree, but must also add that farang is generally used in a dismissive way, the same way we would refer to someone we thought unimportant. If we thought someone was worth considering, we wouldn't refer to them as 'that foreigner, person over there' or whatever, we'd make an effort to describe them in a NICE way.

Thai people do not think the same way that we do because of Buddhism and a completely different culture Trying to put them in a Western box just does not work.

Of course. Its not common sense (or courtesy) to find a nice description (as opposed to the dismissive 'farang') for someone that we consider important - especially not in such a status-ridden country as Thailand.

Please don't blame Buddhism or culture. Lack of education (or empathy) may explain why referring to someone as 'the foreigner' is considered OK, - but to blame it on Buddhism or culture??

Edited August 17, 2010 by F1fanatic

[rgs2001uk]

If we aren't Thai, we have to accept things here. But that doesn't mean we have to approve of them, endorse them, or not comment about them.

No you dont have to accept things here, if you dont approve or endorse them, leave.

No one is keeping us here, we are all here for our own reasons.

Personally I would rather be here warts and all than in some Orwellian newspeak PC BS country, and its obvious so would you, otherwise you would be leaving.

[F1fanatic]

If we aren't Thai, we have to accept things here. But that doesn't mean we have to approve of them, endorse them, or not comment about them.

No you dont have to accept things here, if you dont approve or endorse them, leave.

No one is keeping us here, we are all here for our own reasons.

Personally I would rather be here warts and all than in some Orwellian newspeak PC BS country, and its obvious so would you, otherwise you would be leaving.

I always love the "you dont have to accept things here, if you dont approve or endorse them, leave."

Its always the best argument when you have no defense against the point made.....

Edited August 17, 2010 by F1fanatic

[Jingthing]

Yeah, it's the old redneck Love it or Leave it tact applied to Thailand.

Listen up folks, if you love EVERYTHING about any country, including your home country, you should seek professional help.

Of course leaving Thailand is always an option for expats. Why even mention that? We are talking about people who are here and choose to be here. Still no need at all to love everything here and certainly not to endorse and approve of everything here. Duh.

[rgs2001uk]

If we aren't Thai, we have to accept things here. But that doesn't mean we have to approve of them, endorse them, or not comment about them.

No you dont have to accept things here, if you dont approve or endorse them, leave.

No one is keeping us here, we are all here for our own reasons.

Personally I would rather be here warts and all than in some Orwellian newspeak PC BS country, and its obvious so would you, otherwise you would be leaving.

I always love the "you dont have to accept things here, if you dont approve or endorse them, leave."

Its always the best argument when you have no defense against the point made.....

What exactly is the point being made?

If JT isnt happy here, why does he stay?

Maybe JT could present his case as to why he is willing to stay, even though he neither aproves or endorses things here.

We are all guests here, we chose to come here, no one is being held against their will, we knew what we were coming to, no one said it was some sort of nirvana.

I am here for (non) tax reasons, and they can call me what ever they chose, if I ever get pissed off I pull out my bank statement, sure makes me feel a lot better.

If you could let me know of other countries that have zero personal income tax rates I would be willing to check them out, providing they offer the same as Thailand.

Wonder what would happen "back home" if a bunch of visitors started bitching and moaning about their host country, what do you think the host countries reaction would be? We didnt ask you to come here, you came of your own free will, and are free to leave whenever you want.

[Jingthing]

What exactly is the point being made?

If JT isnt happy here, why does he stay?

Maybe JT could present his case as to why he is willing to stay, even though he neither aproves or endorses things here.

We are all guests here, we chose to come here, no one is being held against their will, we knew what we were coming to, no one said it was some sort of nirvana.

I am here for (non) tax reasons, and they can call me what ever they chose, if I ever get pissed off I pull out my bank statement, sure makes me feel a lot better.

If you could let me know of other countries that have zero personal income tax rates I would be willing to check them out, providing they offer the same as Thailand.

Wonder what would happen "back home" if a bunch of visitors started bitching and moaning about their host country, what do you think the host countries reaction would be? We didnt ask you to come here, you came of your own free will, and are free to leave whenever you want.

I never said I don't like lots of things here or mention either way whether I was happy to be in Thailand or not. It's bizarre that you came to the ridiculous assumption that I find nothing to like here (where did you get that??!!??). Obviously, I don't like racism and discrimination, here or anywhere. I don't need to justify to anyone why I stay except myself; nor does anyone.

Again, the old love it or leave it tact is cheap and tacky. Not to mention extremely unoriginal.

Edited August 17, 2010 by Jingthing

[F1fanatic]

If we aren't Thai, we have to accept things here. But that doesn't mean we have to approve of them, endorse them, or not comment about them.

No you dont have to accept things here, if you dont approve or endorse them, leave.

No one is keeping us here, we are all here for our own reasons.

Personally I would rather be here warts and all than in some Orwellian newspeak PC BS country, and its obvious so would you, otherwise you would be leaving.

I always love the "you dont have to accept things here, if you dont approve or endorse them, leave."

Its always the best argument when you have no defense against the point made.....

What exactly is the point being made?

If JT isnt happy here, why does he stay?

Maybe JT could present his case as to why he is willing to stay, even though he neither aproves or endorses things here.

We are all guests here, we chose to come here, no one is being held against their will, we knew what we were coming to, no one said it was some sort of nirvana.

I am here for (non) tax reasons, and they can call me what ever they chose, if I ever get pissed off I pull out my bank statement, sure makes me feel a lot better.

If you could let me know of other countries that have zero personal income tax rates I would be willing to check them out, providing they offer the same as Thailand.

Wonder what would happen "back home" if a bunch of visitors started bitching and moaning about their host country, what do you think the host countries reaction would be? We didnt ask you to come here, you came of your own free will, and are free to leave whenever you want.

I despair - I thought most posters realised that this was (mainly) an expat forum.... to express our feelings about living here, good and bad.

You obviously prefer to pretend everything is wonderful - good for you - some of us are more honest.

And no, some of us had no idea what we were coming to, despite having come for holidays for many years! Being on holiday is entirely different to living in a country!

[surayu]

If we aren't Thai, we have to accept things here. But that doesn't mean we have to approve of them, endorse them, or not comment about them.

No you dont have to accept things here, if you dont approve or endorse them, leave.

No one is keeping us here, we are all here for our own reasons.

Personally I would rather be here warts and all than in some Orwellian newspeak PC BS country, and its obvious so would you, otherwise you would be leaving.

Ok let's apply your "logic" here....you don't like what JT is writing or anything else about the forum? why don't you just leave then ? do you have a mate in Alaska by any chances?

[kevozman1]

Are Thai's racist........................YES

Has anybody posted on this forum comparing their racist experiences with

Thai's to that of a African slave in America or a Jew in Nazi Germany...................NO

....................................NEXT

[SuperstarStatus]

Are Thai's racist........................YES

Has anybody posted on this forum comparing their racist experiences with

Thai's to that of a African slave in America or a Jew in Nazi Germany...................NO

....................................NEXT

CO-SIGN.

[kevozman1]

^What?

No need to get rude fam.

Edited August 17, 2010 by kevozman1

[Ulysses G.]

If we aren't Thai, we have to accept things here. But that doesn't mean we have to approve of them, endorse them, or not comment about them.

No you dont have to accept things here, if you dont approve or endorse them, leave.

No one is keeping us here, we are all here for our own reasons.

Jingthing is here for the baht-bus riding experience.

[RPETER65]

'Racism' is a word thrown around by the liberal politicians intended to stifle any objection to our governenments' devotion to a global multicultural Utopia. It's never worked throughout history and is not working now. Human nature dictates that we stick with our own kind and nothing can alter that fact. Falangs only come to Pattaya for the cheap sex with young women not because they wish to embrace Thai culture. We don't go in Thai bars and Thais don't go to Falang hangouts.

Speak for yourself, I stay in Thailand because I have a Thai wife, and many very good Thai friends.I do not live in Bangkok and the community I live in has been nothing but accepting and helpful.I go to the hardware store and the owner invites me for breakfast, and never increases the price when I buy something because I am a farang. I get the same price where ever I go, the Thai price.

[maccaroni man]

'Racism' is a word thrown around by the liberal politicians intended to stifle any objection to our governenments' devotion to a global multicultural Utopia. It's never worked throughout history and is not working now. Human nature dictates that we stick with our own kind and nothing can alter that fact. Falangs only come to Pattaya for the cheap sex with young women not because they wish to embrace Thai culture. We don't go in Thai bars and Thais don't go to Falang hangouts.

Speak for yourself, I stay in Thailand because I have a Thai wife, and many very good Thai friends.I do not live in Bangkok and the community I live in has been nothing but accepting and helpful.I go to the hardware store and the owner invites me for breakfast, and never increases the price when I buy something because I am a farang. I get the same price where ever I go, the Thai price.

in your village, NOT the parks, even the ones not worth seeing...... good for you that you have found a little piece of paradise, having said this you must admit that your situation is not the norm for the rest of us, no matter how much thai we speak, how many thais we employee, how much we love thailand the fact is predjudice is alive and well in the lol.

[Ulysses G.]

There are plenty of prejudice people, cheats and thieves in every country. Why should Thailand be any different?