Freed Red-Shirts In Surprise Meeting With PM Abhisit

[webfact]

RED SHIRTS

Freed red-shirts in surprise meeting with PM

By The Nation

Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva summoned two of the three red shirts released on bail yesterday morning Sommai Inthanaka, 32, and Boonyarith Sodakham, 24 to meet him and expressed concern about their health and lack of employment.

The surprise move came after the three red shirts were freed after spending six months in jail for violation of the emergency decree.

The meeting, which lasted 20 minutes at the Government House also included Justice Minister Peeraphan Saleeratpitak and Suwanna Suwanyuta, director general of the Department of Rights and Liberty Promotion and Protection.

Sommai told reporters he was arrested on May 5 after trying to convince his friends to leave the protest site at Lumpini Park. He was detained at a military checkpoint around Suan Lumpini Night Bazaar and sentenced to one year’s imprisonment.

Panitan Watnayakorn, deputy secretary to the prime minister, was also at the meeting. He said later the PM expressed concern about the health of the released detainees and asked the Justice Minister to help find work for them.

The PM also enquired about conditions in prison. Panitan said there are 48 red shirts still in detention who do not have anyone to apply for bail on their behalf. The PM asked the Justice Minister to look into the matter too.

Meanwhile, 30 red shirts went to Bangkok Remand Prison to greet those released," but the more famous detainee, Vishnu Kamoltan who did not meet the PM was reported to have left the prison shortly after 7am and before their arrival.

Prison staff told the red shirts that Vishnu left only in a prison uniform of short pants and yellow T-shirt, and had nobody to meet him.

Red-shirt lawyer Karom Pholthaklang said the red shirts would challenge the authority of Abhisit Vejjajiva, the chief of the Centre for the Resolution of Emergency Situation (CRES) and Department of Special Investigation chief Tharit Pengdit in arresting the United Front for Democracy members.

-- The Nation 2010-11-12

[whybother]

Red-shirt lawyer Karom Pholthaklang said the red shirts would challenge the authority of Abhisit Vejjajiva, the chief of the Centre for the Resolution of Emergency Situation (CRES) and Department of Special Investigation chief Tharit Pengdit in arresting the United Front for Democracy members.

Given that Abhisit didn't arrest anyone, I don't think Karom will get very far with this. Maybe he could put more effort into getting the poorer Red Shirt supporters released instead of wasting money on pointless attention grabbing lawsuits.

[craigt3365]

Red-shirt lawyer Karom Pholthaklang said the red shirts would challenge the authority of Abhisit Vejjajiva, the chief of the Centre for the Resolution of Emergency Situation (CRES) and Department of Special Investigation chief Tharit Pengdit in arresting the United Front for Democracy members.

Given that Abhisit didn't arrest anyone, I don't think Karom will get very far with this. Maybe he could put more effort into getting the poorer Red Shirt supporters released instead of wasting money on pointless attention grabbing lawsuits.

For sure. If the UDD is so intent on helping the poor, why don't they help those in jail who can't get bail money? Unreal.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The PM also enquired about conditions in prison. Panitan said there are 48 red shirts still in detention who do not have anyone to apply for bail on their behalf.

[rreddin]

Red-shirt lawyer Karom Pholthaklang said the red shirts would challenge the authority of Abhisit Vejjajiva, the chief of the Centre for the Resolution of Emergency Situation (CRES) and Department of Special Investigation chief Tharit Pengdit in arresting the United Front for Democracy members.

Given that Abhisit didn't arrest anyone, I don't think Karom will get very far with this. Maybe he could put more effort into getting the poorer Red Shirt supporters released instead of wasting money on pointless attention grabbing lawsuits.

And Abhisit is not grabbing attention?

[whybother]

Red-shirt lawyer Karom Pholthaklang said the red shirts would challenge the authority of Abhisit Vejjajiva, the chief of the Centre for the Resolution of Emergency Situation (CRES) and Department of Special Investigation chief Tharit Pengdit in arresting the United Front for Democracy members.

Given that Abhisit didn't arrest anyone, I don't think Karom will get very far with this. Maybe he could put more effort into getting the poorer Red Shirt supporters released instead of wasting money on pointless attention grabbing lawsuits.

And Abhisit is not grabbing attention?

Abhisit is PM. How does he NOT grab attention?

The point is, they complain how these red shirts are in jail, yet they do nothing to actually get them out. Why? Because they are more newsworthy if they are left there.

[Robby nz]

Red-shirt lawyer Karom Pholthaklang said the red shirts would challenge the authority of Abhisit Vejjajiva, the chief of the Centre for the Resolution of Emergency Situation (CRES) and Department of Special Investigation chief Tharit Pengdit in arresting the United Front for Democracy members.

Wonder is he is going to "challenge the authority" of the PM to let them out as well?

[whybother]

Sorry... just an off topic comment on something at the end of your profile.

What on earth leads you to believe HG Wells was an American author albeit British born.He was born, lived and died British.

I've noticed this tendency before in US newspapers.For example describing Hugh Laurie (of all unlikely people) as a British born American actor.

Again apologies for off topic digression.

Discussion continues here ... http://www.thaivisa....merican-actors/

edit ... well it would have continued there if it had been related to Thailand.

Edited November 12, 2010 by whybother

[craigt3365]

Red-shirt lawyer Karom Pholthaklang said the red shirts would challenge the authority of Abhisit Vejjajiva, the chief of the Centre for the Resolution of Emergency Situation (CRES) and Department of Special Investigation chief Tharit Pengdit in arresting the United Front for Democracy members.

Given that Abhisit didn't arrest anyone, I don't think Karom will get very far with this. Maybe he could put more effort into getting the poorer Red Shirt supporters released instead of wasting money on pointless attention grabbing lawsuits.

For sure. If the UDD is so intent on helping the poor, why don't they help those in jail who can't get bail money? Unreal.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The PM also enquired about conditions in prison. Panitan said there are 48 red shirts still in detention who do not have anyone to apply for bail on their behalf.

Sorry... just an off topic comment on something at the end of your profile.

What on earth leads you to believe HG Wells was an American author albeit British born.He was born, lived and died British.

I've noticed this tendency before in US newspapers.For example describing Hugh Laurie (of all unlikely people) as a British born American actor.

Again apologies for off topic digression.

Very good question! I got this off an investment web site. I just cut and paste. I will take off the part about British and American. Sorry, I guess I should have researched this more, but it came from a fairly well known website...apologies! :jap:

[phiphidon]

Red-shirt lawyer Karom Pholthaklang said the red shirts would challenge the authority of Abhisit Vejjajiva, the chief of the Centre for the Resolution of Emergency Situation (CRES) and Department of Special Investigation chief Tharit Pengdit in arresting the United Front for Democracy members.

Given that Abhisit didn't arrest anyone, I don't think Karom will get very far with this. Maybe he could put more effort into getting the poorer Red Shirt supporters released instead of wasting money on pointless attention grabbing lawsuits.

PM Abhisit did declare the state of emergency which created the climate for these arrests, so technically, you're right of course, he didn't personally arrest these people. Good point. Perhaps if Abhisit put in a bit more effort he might already know what conditions are like inside the prisons, and as for enquiring after their health and expressing concern about their current employment status? These two points may have been influenced by the fact they have been inside a prison. Would have been interesting to see the replies. Perhaps the Justice Ministry could find them a job, there's at least one post going vacant at the moment...........

[AleG]

PM Abhisit did declare the state of emergency which created the climate for these arrests, so technically, you're right of course, he didn't personally arrest these people. Good point. Perhaps if Abhisit put in a bit more effort he might already know what conditions are like inside the prisons, and as for enquiring after their health and expressing concern about their current employment status? These two points may have been influenced by the fact they have been inside a prison. Would have been interesting to see the replies. Perhaps the Justice Ministry could find them a job, there's at least one post going vacant at the moment...........

Sorry to be nit-picky, but the causation chain there is a bit twisted, the climate that led to the arrests was caused by an unyielding mob occupying a big chunk of BKK downtown for a couple months, daily bomb/grenade attacks and numerous other unlawful acts. Abhisit didn't just wake up one morning and declared a state of emergency on a whim.

[Buchholz]

as for enquiring after their health and expressing concern about their current employment status? These two points may have been influenced by the fact they have been inside a prison. Would have been interesting to see the replies. Perhaps the Justice Ministry could find them a job, there's at least one post going vacant at the moment...........

Perhaps a Pheu Thai Party bigwig could hire him to be a paid House Committee adviser position the same as they did for Red Shirt Leader Wiputhalaeng:

Wiputhalaeng Patthanaphumthai

Democrat MP for Bangkok Watchara Petchthong said red shirt key element Wiputhalaeng Patthanaphumthai, who is still being detained at the Bangkok Remand Prison, has been paid a monthly salary of 10,000 baht by Parliament since February 1 until now as a member of the advisory staff for Deputy House Speaker from Pheu Thai Party Apiwan Wiriyachai.

OR

in another Red Shirt employment case, the Red Shirt Guard Leader hired by Red Shirt Leader and Pheu Thai Party MP Jatuporn for a different House Committee and who is currently a terrorist fugitive from justice:

the other newspaper is reporting that Jatuporn made a Red Shirt Guard Leader a member, as an adviser, to the House Committee on political development and mass communications. Based on Jatuporn's recommendation, Aree Krainara, was appointed to a paid position on the Committee. Aree is a leader of the Red Guards who is wanted on terrorism charges and has been on the run from the law since he fled after the May Mayhem 2010 debacle on May 19.

[scorecard]

PM Abhisit did declare the state of emergency which created the climate for these arrests, so technically, you're right of course, he didn't personally arrest these people. Good point. Perhaps if Abhisit put in a bit more effort he might already know what conditions are like inside the prisons, and as for enquiring after their health and expressing concern about their current employment status? These two points may have been influenced by the fact they have been inside a prison. Would have been interesting to see the replies. Perhaps the Justice Ministry could find them a job, there's at least one post going vacant at the moment...........

Sorry to be nit-picky, but the causation chain there is a bit twisted, the climate that led to the arrests was caused by an unyielding mob occupying a big chunk of BKK downtown for a couple months, daily bomb/grenade attacks and numerous other unlawful acts. Abhisit didn't just wake up one morning and declared a state of emergency on a whim.

Well said!

[monkfish]

From:

http://asiancorrespo...ased-red-shirts

Matichon reports that Sommai spoke to reporters before meeting with the PM. He stated that he had been detained on May 5 after he met some red shirts friends at Lumpini Park to try to persuade them to return home. After leaving he encountered a military checkpoint near Suan Lumpini night plaza and was detained. He said he was never questioned and he was just charged with breahing the state of emergency and immediately sentenced to 1 year in jail. He stated that he was unsure why the PM had requested he visit the PM today as his older sister received a telephone call at 10 a.m and was informed that Abhisit wanted to meet him so he came. After meeting with the PM, he spoke again to reporters and said the PM asked about the conditions inside the jail and said that investigations showed that he was not involved so assistance was provided and that he would help those who are still in jail.

Seems the press and AC failed to mention those released are probably not red shirts.

Good for a photo shoot though.

Edited November 12, 2010 by monkfish

[Robby nz]

Matichon reports that Sommai spoke to reporters before meeting with the PM. He stated that he had been detained on May 5 after he met some red shirts friends at Lumpini Park to try to persuade them to return home. After leaving he encountered a military checkpoint near Suan Lumpini night plaza and was detained. He said he was never questioned and he was just charged with breahing the state of emergency and immediately sentenced to 1 year in jail. He stated that he was unsure why the PM had requested he visit the PM today as his older sister received a telephone call at 10 a.m and was informed that Abhisit wanted to meet him so he came. After meeting with the PM, he spoke again to reporters and said the PM asked about the conditions inside the jail and said that investigations showed that he was not involved so assistance was provided and that he would help those who are still in jail.

If he was so innocent why wasnt he put on a bus or train (for free) and sent home like all the others?

That is only his side of the story.

Could it be that there is a little more to it than that?

It would seem that all the leaders who are locked up are pleading not guilty regardless of the volumes of video evidence that spouted from their own mouthes.

Not unreasonable for him to follow their example (again).

[Insight]

From:

http://asiancorrespo...ased-red-shirts

Matichon reports that Sommai spoke to reporters before meeting with the PM. He stated that he had been detained on May 5 after he met some red shirts friends at Lumpini Park to try to persuade them to return home. After leaving he encountered a military checkpoint near Suan Lumpini night plaza and was detained. He said he was never questioned and he was just charged with breahing the state of emergency and immediately sentenced to 1 year in jail. He stated that he was unsure why the PM had requested he visit the PM today as his older sister received a telephone call at 10 a.m and was informed that Abhisit wanted to meet him so he came. After meeting with the PM, he spoke again to reporters and said the PM asked about the conditions inside the jail and said that investigations showed that he was not involved so assistance was provided and that he would help those who are still in jail.

Seems the press and AC failed to mention those released are probably not red shirts.

Good for a photo shoot though.

Hi, Mr Plywood here. So they're "fake reds" then?

[monkfish]

From:

http://asiancorrespo...ased-red-shirts

Matichon reports that Sommai spoke to reporters before meeting with the PM. He stated that he had been detained on May 5 after he met some red shirts friends at Lumpini Park to try to persuade them to return home. After leaving he encountered a military checkpoint near Suan Lumpini night plaza and was detained. He said he was never questioned and he was just charged with breahing the state of emergency and immediately sentenced to 1 year in jail. He stated that he was unsure why the PM had requested he visit the PM today as his older sister received a telephone call at 10 a.m and was informed that Abhisit wanted to meet him so he came. After meeting with the PM, he spoke again to reporters and said the PM asked about the conditions inside the jail and said that investigations showed that he was not involved so assistance was provided and that he would help those who are still in jail.

Seems the press and AC failed to mention those released are probably not red shirts.

Good for a photo shoot though.

Hi, Mr Plywood here. So they're "fake reds" then?

I believe he was arrested for breaking the Emergency Decree and not for being a Red Shirt.

Are you saying all those arrested were Red Shirts and without exception?

[TheyCallmeScooter]

put more effort into getting the poorer Red Shirt supporters released instead of wasting money on pointless attention grabbing lawsuits.

For sure. If the UDD is so intent on helping the poor, why don't they help those in jail who can't get bail money? Unreal.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The PM also enquired about conditions in prison. Panitan said there are 48 red shirts still in detention who do not have anyone to apply for bail on their behalf.

This kind of vile hypocrisy is evident to 100% of objective / intelligent spectators, but evident only to 30% of the remainder (including all those involved, including almost all of those being back-stabbed by their own 'movement').

And Abhisit is not grabbing attention?

This is the kind of Red Shirt response which should be grounds for serious sanction by TV mods. It's a ridiculous situation where such a provoking insult (which this 'response' effectively is), is protected from being responded to in a manner the provocateur would complain is 'rude' or 'offensive'.

The nausea inspired by this type of vile response (rreddin, you had nothing to offer as to the issue of Red Shirts effectively betraying their own movement's 'victims'; simply not caring one iota for the 'disposable' people they supposedly fighting for) is - I assure anyone who cares about childish issues of 'offence' and 'rudeness' (as they are perceived by the 'offended' party) - is 100x more offensive to decency than any colourful / justified language might be in response, directing the poster where he or she should go.

Wonder is he is going to "challenge the authority" of the PM to let them out as well?

Blessed sanity in an insane world.

[mythBuster]

Now the ICC gets involved everybody seems concerned with the health of Thailand's Political Prisoners. The Bangkok Post was outraged about the fact that the International Criminal Court becomes involved. They better release all two hundred plus political prisoners or treat them equally good as the people who shot on passersby near Don Muang during the airport. occupation.

Even Than Shwe seem to understand that keeping political prisoners in jail is not a good promotion. Let's see if David Cameron (who preaches austerity back home but will stay in Thailand in a 1000 plus P.Sterling room during christmas)can convince his fellow schoolmate Abhisit that it is bad for Thailand's image and totally unnecessary.

[Insight]

I believe he was arrested for breaking the Emergency Decree and not for being a Red Shirt.

Are you saying all those arrested were Red Shirts and without exception?

ฺBrilliant. So red shirts are now identified by what they got arrested for. So (and also forgetting the red shirt welcoming party for these fake red shirts, presumably also organised by fake red shirts) other what charge do you need thrown at you be considered a real red shirt?

At first I thought this was a smart move by Abhisit. Now I realise he simply rubbed two brain cells together.

[TheyCallmeScooter]

Now the ICC gets involved everybody seems concerned with the health of Thailand's Political Prisoners. The Bangkok Post was outraged about the fact that the International Criminal Court becomes involved. They better release all two hundred plus political prisoners or treat them equally good as the people who shot on passersby near Don Muang during the airport. occupation.

Even Than Shwe seem to understand that keeping political prisoners in jail is not a good promotion. Let's see if David Cameron (who preaches austerity back home but will stay in Thailand in a 1000 plus P.Sterling room during christmas)can convince his fellow schoolmate Abhisit that it is bad for Thailand's image and totally unnecessary.

This is ridiculous.

I'm going to stop wasting my time here. I come here to waste good time, not waste good time wasting time.

Unless someone gets proactive about the insult presented by ridiculousness like that 'argued' in a post like this one above, my time-wasting is being wasted. I shall spell it out for anyone who is unable to detect the ludicrous 'position' peddled by mythBuster (how cute) and his many myth-generating friends.

Thaksin's dancing monkey (paid for by non-declared, illegitimately-obtained, ferreted-overseas, laundered baht) Robert Amsterdam is abusing procedural flaws which require the ICC to "seriously investigate" the 'evidence' presented. Ignoring the fact that there is no 'evidence' for a crime which did not occur, ignoring the fact that a nation of 65 million have the right to use force to protect the capital city from violent and armed hijackers, ignoring the quite evident fact that Thaksin's MiB killed his own supporters whilst Amsterdam and Thaksin claimed on every news channel who would idiotically give them airtime that the 'protest' was a peaceful, unarmed, non-intrusive one of which Gandhi would be proud, ignoring the fact that Abhisit pretty much bent over backwards horizontally to give the hijackers what they demanded (and 'earned' via illegal and criminal and violence holding Bangkok to ransom) only to have his concessions rejected out-of-hand, at which point the Army (with endless warnings in advance) slowly and cautiously worked through the hijacked areas to return property stolen and damaged to their rightful owners....

...ignoring all of that, Amsterdam is the 'lawyer' for a man who Amnesty International has denounced for his human rights abuses, Amsterdam is the 'lawyer' for a convicted criminal and fugitive from justice, Amsterdam is the lawyer for a man described by Human Rights Watch as "a human rights abuser of the worst kind", Amsterdam is pretending (anyone who thinks Thaksin is insane enough to believe the ICC would really accept the case needs to be sectioned) to be pressing for an ICC trial of Thailand's softly-spoken, liberal, peace-loving PM....

...Amsterdam is a dancing monkey, dancing to the tune of his organ-grinding owner. Who just happens to be a convicted criminal, a fugitive from every kind of justice, a criminal human rights abuser (of the worst kind! there are many kinds). And who just happens to be a tyrant who made corrupt deals with Burma's military junta (at Thailand's expense), who killed people whom he could not bribe (and many who weren't worth the 'expense' of a bribe), who is bankrolling terrorism in Thailand, and who simply laughed at demands made by pretty legitimate NGOs like Amnesty / HRW that he allow an international inquiry to investigate the extra-judicial killings of thousands under his 'watch'.

This is vile, filthy, and evil stuff.

------------

Not a single word of the above is 'opinion' (psychopaths may debate that final line, but whatever). Every single fact stated is verifiable and evidence proving it is available in the public domain.

But a post like the one I'm ranting at in fury is 'allowed'? Calling those who order crowds of tens of thousands to burn Bangkok with VERY specific instructions outlining what to bring, what to do, when to do it, etc...crowds who then burned Bangkok (surprise, surprise)...calling them "political prisoners" and demanding their release is allowed? When the evidence for their crimes are plastered everywhere in the form of footage of their own speeches?

And I am told I cannot call this position 'ridiculous' because doing so would be a breach of forum rules? Sure. It's not ridiculous. It's a great deal more ridiculous than merely ridiculous. It's criminal if the intent is to lie. And if the intent is not to lie, how does one reconcile the fact that the same posters have no wish to 'address' their ignorance when the facts have been politely pointed out to them 1000's of times prior?

If my valid concerns are not addressed, I shall waste my valuable time somewhere else. Not much of an ultimatum, I realise this...but then, it shouldn't be an 'ultimatum' that motivates addressing this particular injustice.

[Robby nz]

Now the ICC gets involved everybody seems concerned with the health of Thailand's Political Prisoners. The Bangkok Post was outraged about the fact that the International Criminal Court becomes involved. They better release all two hundred plus political prisoners or treat them equally good as the people who shot on passersby near Don Muang during the airport. occupation.

Even Than Shwe seem to understand that keeping political prisoners in jail is not a good promotion. Let's see if David Cameron (who preaches austerity back home but will stay in Thailand in a 1000 plus P.Sterling room during christmas)can convince his fellow schoolmate Abhisit that it is bad for Thailand's image and totally unnecessary.

I keep wondering who all these political prisoners are?

And how you define a political prisoner?

To my way of thinking those break into an ASEAN meeting, burns buses, holds a city to ransom, breaks into a hospital, shoot at the army, fire grenades, treaten the PM's life, burn buildings etc etc are streight out crims and yes terrorist fits nicely.

As this topic is about red protesters being released who were caught on camera commiting the above acts could one of you red supporters please explain to me, and everyone else where the political prisoner bit comes in?

[TheyCallmeScooter]

I believe he was arrested for breaking the Emergency Decree and not for being a Red Shirt.

Are you saying all those arrested were Red Shirts and without exception?

ฺBrilliant. So red shirts are now identified by what they got arrested for. So (and also forgetting the red shirt welcoming party for these fake red shirts, presumably also organised by fake red shirts) other what charge do you need thrown at you be considered a real red shirt?

At first I thought this was a smart move by Abhisit. Now I realise he simply rubbed two brain cells together.

Are you calling Red Shirts criminals? I assure you that you are, likely without even realising that you are.

It is not a crime to be a Red Shirt or to wear a red shirt.

It is a crime to break the law. You can focus on laws you believe are invalid all you want; I will even support you if your positions on their validity have substance...but good luck attempting to argue the 'invalidity' of laws which are passed to prevent the violent hijacking of buildings, malls, streets, highways that do not belong to you but belong to specific individuals or to the greatly inconvenienced public.

This fellow was arrested for a crime. He admitted his guilt, but claimed he was guilty only in attempting to persuade his friends not to commit the crime. Whilst they were committing the crime. If he's telling the truth, as it appears he might have been, he cannot really be angry at anyone but his friends and at himself. And, I suppose, the 'movement' which ignores the Red Shirts who are innocent of crimes...but spends millions of $ attempting to free the very guilty criminals who are the Red Shirt leadership inciting violence and rebellion and chaos with their speeches and their dishing out of Thaksin's baht.

You owe an apology for your ignorance, to the Red Shirts who are not criminals. Though I have little sympathy for a non-criminal who refuses to denounce their criminal 'brothers'. You owe an apology for your offensive defence of terrorism. To everyone who doesn't believe violence and anarchy is a valid form of protest. Let alone an 'acceptable' pastime for tycoon criminal fugitives from justice.

[notime]

Hey Abhisit I have a job for them. Cleaning toilets at my place. I have 12 toilets here and other places that also need cleaning. Always in a big trouble to find the right staff. What is it with the Thai people that cleaning, toilets especially is a no-go?

[TheyCallmeScooter]

I believe he was arrested for breaking the Emergency Decree and not for being a Red Shirt.

Are you saying all those arrested were Red Shirts and without exception?

ฺBrilliant. So red shirts are now identified by what they got arrested for. So (and also forgetting the red shirt welcoming party for these fake red shirts, presumably also organised by fake red shirts) other what charge do you need thrown at you be considered a real red shirt?

At first I thought this was a smart move by Abhisit. Now I realise he simply rubbed two brain cells together.

Are you calling Red Shirts criminals? I assure you that you are, likely without even realising that you are.

It is not a crime to be a Red Shirt or to wear a red shirt.

It is a crime to break the law.

You owe an apology for your ignorance, to the Red Shirts who are not criminals.

You owe an apology for your offensive defence of terrorism. To everyone who doesn't believe violence and anarchy is a valid form of protest. Let alone an 'acceptable' pastime for tycoon criminal fugitives from justice.

Edit Post function no longer possible, but my post above was the result of confusion of Insight's intended tone in his post. Or, I think it was - we're working on clarifying it at the moment - we are hampered by no small level of drunkenness. When I say 'we', I (exclusively) refer to 'me'.

(edit: clarified, I thought the "two brain cells rubbing together" reference was directed at Abhisit - Insight, quite correctly, intended it otherwise, pointing out how easy the Red Shirts 'outwit' themselves - I'm attempting to recover from the embarrassment of misunderstanding his tone by launching a counter-'attack', with the claim they cannot outwit themselves because that would require non-existent 'wits'...not much of a defence argument, but I am learning from Amsterdam's practising of 'law'.)

Apparently Insight and I are arguing the same point. On the same side. When I figure it out, I will be furious at the Red Shirts* for craftily using alcohol to divide and rule, confusing me into fighting an ally in the Good Fight. I have fallen into their diabolical trap. I'm embarrassed, that's not just alcohol reddening my ruddy cheeks. Cursed villains!

*I have no evidence that my drinks were spiked by Red Shirts with my alcohol. As I poured them myself, and there are no Red Shirts presently present, it's actually even somewhat unlikely.

Edited November 12, 2010 by TheyCallmeScooter

[animatic]

Trolls with linguistic abilities are still trolls.

A pretense to a moral high ground doesn't bestow it,

still the pretense remains.

Seeing these released men and asking about their detentions

is a good PR move, but also a good understanding move because he will

gleen some insight into their thinking and the whole show down last spring.

Also it could be seen as one more baby step towards reconciliation

with the grass roots, the Red Puyais are beyond reconciliation,

they just want a big slice of pie, and a seat with a large knife and fork.

Edited November 12, 2010 by animatic

[yellow1red1]

I keep looking for signs of a mafia style truce so they can 'get back to normal' = carve up the Corruption pie = call it Democracy haHA ha<BR>was Sanan behind this move?

[yellow1red1]

Trolls with linguistic abilities are still trolls.

A pretense to a moral high ground doesn't bestow it,

still the pretense remains.

Seeing these released men and asking about their detentions

is a good PR move, but also a good understanding move because he will

gleen some insight into their thinking and the whole show down last spring.

Also it could be seen as one more baby step towards reconciliation

with the grass roots, the Red Puyais are beyond reconciliation,

they just want a big slice of pie, and a seat with a large knife and fork.

sumthin you don't have to concern about - linguistic abilities that is --- jk mate

the Red Puyais want a piece of the pie AGREE; sAme/same yellow Elites

# 1 root cause of turmoil is Corruption

#1 roadblock to cure is Censorship

[animatic]

Not all are believing 'The Big Lie' as absolutely and as blindly

as they were last spring. The Red leadership has done a lot of

mouth and foot shooting lately, coupled to inaction for their small fish.

The numbers have dwindled dramatically. And there is an odor of

desperation to hold the masses enthralled till the election comes.

PTP is fragmenting and going off message more and more.

All they have is the hardcore indoctrinated, Jatuporn the big mouth,

and Thaksin waiting to throwh money at a power grab, come election time,

but the grass roots are not as lockstep as they once were. IMHO.

This is just one more little wedge between the Red Leadership and the grass roots,

and progress is made through many tiny moves, when grand actions meet

strong resistance from the chattering classes working for vested interests.

Edited November 12, 2010 by animatic

[TheyCallmeScooter]

This is just one more little wedge between the Red Leadership and the grass roots,

and progress is made through many tiny moves, when grand actions meet

strong resistance from the chattering classes working for vested interests.

God, but I do hope you are right.

I wish I shared your optimism. But a world in which violent thugs hijack shopping malls and turn Bangkok CBD into a scene which is reminiscent of something out of Apocalypse Now can still be represented as anything but violent thugs hijacking shopping malls and turning Bangkok CBD into chaos...yeah I dunno about that optimism.

I literally don't know what to think anymore. Might throw some kids on top on some barricades to protect myself from return fire, or something. It seems perfectly acceptable. Was the trendy inner-city family activity for awhile there (my kids didn't want to go, lazy sods never go outside - won't know the thrill of being on top a barricade in a Live Fire Zone until Nintendo releases Terrorism for Wii). Even the media (domestic or global) don't seem to have a problem with it. It's barely newsworthy, really.

The domestic media seems primarily interested in attacking the one guy who's spotless, for his 'crime' of not fixing ALL of the other guys' 'crimes' at a speed or in the way the various rambling OpEd writers would desire. Abhisit had done a lot of good, but what does that mean when he can't fix up ALL of Thailand's problems at once? He's simply not doing enough to address the corruption of elected representatives, not doing enough to reconcile with Terrorists, not doing enough to give the violence-subscribers what they want (which is? they don't even know). Not doing enough to prepare Thailand for Acts of God like excessive rainfall. Why didn't he do something to stop the rain? You'd think the Thai 'pro-establishment' media would be more likely to blame those who are actually to blame (Thaksin, his employees, Isan voters represented by BJT politicians, the Constitution which forgot to give the Court authority to disqualify corrupt officials from stepping down or running again, every Thai government which hasn't addressed the annual flooding issue prior to Abhisit's 'distracted' last couple years, the gods of the clouds who launch monsoons at Thailand and have done so annually for millions of years).

You'd think wrong. I only really read the Bangkok Post now. And they're just...terrible. And I know the others are worse. Which makes the Thai media...a bad, really unfunny joke (or something even less funny, if a bit more 'bad'). Everything is Abhisit's fault. For not fixing everything. Nothing is the fault of the people who break it. Or the fault of those who failed to protect against it. Laws enacted by Thaksin are being abused by Abhisit apparently (to protect against Thaksin's terrorism). Burmese military junta governments with whom Thaksin made illegal, vile B4 billion loans (to buy Thaksin's services / products) run an election which is a sham, much like Thaksin's electoral wins...and I haven't seen one single mention of the fact this is the junta with whom Thaksin was in bed with, screwing over Thailand with. Nup. Not newsworthy. Everyone's too busy trying to draw parallels with Abhisit's government (ostensibly a front for a junta). Strange power-hungry junta here in Thailand. Oppressively giving democracy away to people who don't want it. Over and over again. Once in 1997, again in 2006, a third time (attempted, rejected by those demanding it) in 2010. God, whenever will this oppression end! When will this cursed junta stop forcing democracy down Thailand's throat. And protecting capital cities from terrorists. Why doesn't the international community DO something!!

It's just...brutal stuff. This oppression. I hope we can survive till the human rights abuser gets back to free us. And give us less. And abuse our liberty some more.

What is with the Thai media? Serious question. Are they ALL as mind-numbingly stupid as they would have us believe they are? Or is there shenanigans afoot?

Why would the Bangkok Post bother with their responsibility to educate their readers on things like 'democracy' (they'd rather join in the sullying of a smear campaign on a democratic institution required for democracy to have a chance - it's irrelevant whether their integrity is 100%, there is a clear source of the smear, and that source is one which leads me to know they are...clean enough. Why would they bother with explaining the realities to their readers, when they can give another half page to yet another OpEd column whip-lashing the government, authored by yet another unemployed (ahem) political analyst formerly serving in the Thaksin administration? That seems responsible / logical. I know The Nation is a joke. Now I - reluctantly - have to concede the Bangkok Post is a joke. I hear the Thai-language dailies and TV are even more sensationalist and random. I cannot imagine what the tabloids are up to (not actually true, I have read Prachatai). Yeah, tight media here in Thailand.

It's not a problem though - if you believe the media isn't influential.

If the Thai media cannot grow up overnight, I fear Thailand is simply doomed. I hope I'm wrong. But I've been all over this globe and have never come across a media quite so unfathomably immature and irresponsible as the media is here. It's unbelievable, that they would have the nerve to rant whine about 'censorship', demanding even more freedoms to be even more unfathomably irresponsible. "Freedoms of the press"? They take more 'liberties' in their 'reporting' of the 'news'...than a high school paper ever would. And I'm talking about the mainstream press. It's unbelievable.

/rant for tonight. perhaps for good. holla

[rubl]

I keep looking for signs of a mafia style truce so they can 'get back to normal' = carve up the Corruption pie = call it Democracy haHA ha<BR>was Sanan behind this move?

If you really want people to understand you should be a bit less cryptic in your posts.

The OP is 'freed red-shirts in surprise meeting with PM Abhisit'. So who are 'they'? The red-shirts just freed or all mentioned? If not them I guess you look for signs in the wrong topic