My Personally Q, If Got Asking Out For A Drink..

[MidoriApple]

Hi, I have one question, a little personal kind.

Just got an sms from an acquaintance, a westerner whom I met once in a bar one night when I followed my friend to his casual (not that casual) biz's meeting there. It was about..umm.. many months ago..I can't remember.

It is ordinary that we would exchange our biz card, but I didn't have it that night, so I sms him my number in day after. We had spoken many words together, general topics mostly.

No any contact after that, just today he sms me about his friend might need to make biz's contact with me. I said I would happy to give my number to his friend for making deal. I own a small food's biz here in BKK. This my acquaintance said he will forward my number to his friend, but then he said also he likes to ask me out for drink sometimes.

I might think too much due to I had bad experience before. For Thai like me, it is so normal when two persons would ask out for having meet like this, although we have different genders, I would not consider this as "a date", might be just to get better known each other, so we may develop from acquaintance to be platonic friend (right?) I thought this way all the time before my not much pleasant experience which I found Western and Asian cultures are differ for this.

I am not sure what I should reply to him. I don't mind going out but within the condition that I am seeing someone now.

What does this mean for Westerner? Is it a date kind..?

Hope not.. Seem we can be good friends in this future.

[GizmoBKK]

Hi MindoriApple,

Well, it might very well be that as you say it "might be just to get better known each other, so we may develop from acquaintance to be platonic friend." It might as well be that he is looking for a date.

More important is the question what do you want?

No one will be able to tell you what the guy wants except this person is a mind reader - or you just try to find out. We can do a lot of stereo-typing, but it does not go so far that we could predict what another Farang wants.

So, what does your heart tell you? Do you want to find out? Then go ahead. If not, then just don't.

The good thing from my point of view about dealing with Westerners (so I do some stereo-typing here...) is that you can be straight-forward: if you feel that he wants more than you want, you can just straight away tell him that you are neither looking for dating nor a relationship. Most probably he will appreciate your direct way of communication. An no one loses face ;-)

Chok dee khrap,

G.

Edited November 28, 2010 by GizmoBKK

[MidoriApple]

Yeah, you are right, GismoBKK

Good that I can straightforward express my needs to Westerner, whilst is considered impolite if this is to Thai. I intend doing so, because I just accepted his asking, with biz's thinking, I would not want to lose chance for having new customers-may-be. So better see his exact needs first.

You know what.. Sometimes I become too confused.. What is the right way of thinking, actually. Like I got confusion from my own mixed-culture.

Same as my English, once in a while I said and wrote in more perfect tense and vocabulary, same as foreigners study English. But then I stop thinking of this English as a foreign language, this should be good, but what I got.. I started saying wrong words, writing in funny grammars.. Used it more casualty. How come my English is going down the hill sometimes? Weird..

Similar to this situation, I thought this is normal asking out, but then one situation declined my belief, that's why I got this kind of Q.

So this is not cultural difference, is in dividual then... Oiii..

Thanks you indeed for your nice pointing out / kob kun mak ka.

[bifftastic]

Sawatdee khap MidoriApple

yes, I agree with Gizmo,

you can just say directly that you don't want a date and you only want to be friends. There should be no problem, he will not lose face or be embarrassed. It's quite normal to have that kind of conversation so that everyone understands.

As for your English, I think it's just practice. We talk differently from how we write so it can be difficult to get the balance just right. I know when I'm learning Thai, that sometimes I think I'm doing ok and then I forget how to say very easy things! If you don't use it regularly then it seems like it's disappearing!

I hope everything works out well for you in your meeting and that the mixture of a social and business occasion does not present you with any difficulties.

Chok dee khap.

Biff

[GizmoBKK]

You know what.. Sometimes I become too confused.. What is the right way of thinking, actually. Like I got confusion from my own mixed-culture.

"There is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so"

Shakespeare, in Hamlet

Enjoy life

[MidoriApple]

Goodmorning,

Thank you for your both nice answers, bifftastic and GizmoBKK.

Happy Monday! /MA

[PattayaParent]

You could maybe consider doing it 'the Asian way' and take along a chapperone?

But I would tell him that you will bring a friend also.

[bifftastic]

You could maybe consider doing it 'the Asian way' and take along a chapperone?

But I would tell him that you will bring a friend also.

That is one way, but wouldn't that make it more like a 'date' ?

[sbk]

Personally, if it were me, I would think the same as you, that it is simply a friendly meeting, best to approach it that way and if he gets out of line, you can say thank you but I am not interested, and walk away.

[bina]

u can tell him straight out that this is a business only date , also by stating 'since this will be a business meeting,lets meet at ...and then u will name whatever places people meet for business in thailand, just not some romantic little bistro in an alley

or u can imply by asking him if u can come with your partner since u are meeting in a bar/cafe and they (your partner) has some errands to do but will catch up with u later

or u can just go, and if he starts to get too friendly, tell him u are flattered by his offer but u are in a relationship now, and turn the converstaion back to business.

actually, havent been around too many americans/anglo westerners in these situations but israelis get forward way quick and do get pissed off if turned down on offers of business and pleasure together...so here, i would make a big deal of paying my own meal, also, avoiding the alcohol and sticking to short quick meal, sending all the signals of 'business only' and keeping the conversation away from the ' soooooooo, tell me about yourself' style...... but here is middle east style where 'men are men and women are targets to be conquered'..

bina

[PattayaParent]

You could maybe consider doing it 'the Asian way' and take along a chapperone?

But I would tell him that you will bring a friend also.

That is one way, but wouldn't that make it more like a 'date' ?

maybe take along the company accountant? Lawyer? or someone business related.

[MidoriApple]

Hi, Everyone,

Thank you also for more nice advices, especially from woman.. same as me.

Well, I think I can continue more for my story if you guys will not mind.. will write it shortly.

I went having dinner with him last night, all went very well. We had Paella in a decent hotel. He seems understanding Thai culture, so he been courtesy. It was good time for us, I guess. For the approaching, I think I didnt see any of his sign, we talked relaxing and laughed oftens, just that. I think he thinks of being friend only.. dunno.. I usually have no sense of this.

PattayaParent: Chaperone? I thought also but didn't do, my Thai friends..they usually afraid to speak English and one who are fluent, they are too naughty! (very talkative, chaos, teasing loads, tricky kind..)

Personally it is little childish for having chaperone to come along due to I am not a young woman. And last night, with him it is right that I didn't bring a friend with, because he said it is kind of impolite for taking the third person come since it is his treat, and usually when Thai meets Thai..we will speak only Thai and he as a Westerner, it must be too boring. ---> I agree.

And I agree with bifftastic, that this would make more like 'a date' myself, what if he didn't think that far, so I am the one who think too, too farrrrrrrrr...... (Oiiii...... )

sbk: what you have said is what I decide doing so, should be best for me

bina: your advices "or u can imply by asking him if u can come with your partner since u are meeting in a bar/cafe and they (your partner) has some errands to do but will catch up with u later

" this is also very good idea, I think it is nice and so compromise. I will keep this a good tip, thanks..

Edited November 30, 2010 by MidoriApple

[Berkshire]

I went having dinner with him last night, all went very well. We had Paella in a decent hotel. He seems understanding Thai culture, so he been courtesy. It was good time for us, I guess. For the approaching, I think I didnt see any of his sign, we talked relaxing and laughed oftens, just that. I think he thinks of being friend only.. dunno.. I usually have no sense of this.

Midori, interesting that you cannot tell if he has romantic interest in you or not. I've always thought that women have more of a sense for this sort of thing than most men. But anyways, do you think of him more as a friend only or possibly more?

By the way, I know many of the folks here have mentioned that you should be direct/honest with western men if you are not interested. It seems to make sense, but many farangs that I've seen don't take rejection well. I know a Thai woman who was constantly being hit on by a farang and after weeks and weeks of gently hinting that she wasn't interested, he still wouldn't get the message. So she finally just told him to go away. He responded by calling her a b**ch, among other things.

Lastly, it would seem that the best thing that Thai women can do to avoid complications (such as the above) is to tell would-be suitors that they already have a boyfriend ("mee fan lao"). Strangely, Thai woman have a real problem doing this and would prefer to give out phone numbers to random men, even if they weren't remotely interested in said men. Afraid to hurt their feelings?

Edited November 30, 2010 by Berkshire

[bina]

Lastly, it would seem that the best thing that Thai women can do to avoid complications (such as the above) is to tell would-be suitors that they already have a boyfriend ("mee fan lao"). Strangely, Thai woman have a real problem doing this and would prefer to give out phone numbers to random men, even if they weren't remotely interested in said men. Afraid to hurt their feelings?

hence my suggestion. israeli men are often similar in this respect so either u do the meeting in some place totally not fun, but very formal or respectable and neutral, or you tell them u are meeting your husband/bf/date after the business meeting so u will order a lite meal, or that your time is somehwhat limited as u have to meet up with partner blablabla... this is a good thing when u need an escape route... here often u cant be blunt in rejection as here business and pleasure are still often mixed, although recently several 'sex inuendos at the work place' scandals have made it to the front pages involving high level people, not secratary and boss types... a bit asian here also i suspect... btw, midori, remember that western men dont know how to read thai women either and might wrongling assume things that wouldnt be assumed if u were western... good idea not to bring some girlfriends along as that would turn it all in to a flirt party situation... but bringing an other business associate along could work also...

bina

[lannarebirth]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zFWGOKuFyjk&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PuSyX2d1tbY&feature=related

[IanForbes]

You already got some good advice, MidoriApple. But, I can speak from experience that most men DO have an ulterior motive when they take a woman to supper or even a simple lunch meeting. We DO have a romantic motive, even if we don't follow up on it. It's better to get that off the table at the start (as others have already said). Most men are gentlemen enough to accept rejection if it isn't too hostile. However, for a business to work you must be at least friendly with each other. Just make certain that the man understands there will be no romantic involvement. You can re-inforce that by mentioning your boyfriend from time to time.

And, don't worry about not being fluent in English. Just put the shoe on the other foot... you speak more English than the man speaks Thai. I often hear Thai women apologize for not speaking good English. There is no need for an apology at all so long as you can make yourself understood.

[MidoriApple]

Midori, interesting that you cannot tell if he has romantic interest in you or not. I've always thought that women have more of a sense for this sort of thing than most men. But anyways, do you think of him more as a friend only or possibly more?

By the way, I know many of the folks here have mentioned that you should be direct/honest with western men if you are not interested. It seems to make sense, but many farangs that I've seen don't take rejection well. I know a Thai woman who was constantly being hit on by a farang and after weeks and weeks of gently hinting that she wasn't interested, he still wouldn't get the message. So she finally just told him to go away. He responded by calling her a b**ch, among other things.

Lastly, it would seem that the best thing that Thai women can do to avoid complications (such as the above) is to tell would-be suitors that they already have a boyfriend ("mee fan lao"). Strangely, Thai woman have a real problem doing this and would prefer to give out phone numbers to random men, even if they weren't remotely interested in said men. Afraid to hurt their feelings?

Well, I usually see romantic sign from men's eyes, men cannot lie from (in?,at?..which one?) their eyes, although they stay polite. For westerners are more easier since they usually been straight-forward until too forward as they said and acted flirty since the very first. Apart from this, I really have no idea.

But Berkshire, how come you ask if I would think of him more than just a friend? Come on.... You are leading me to think too far right now..

Honestly, deep inside my mind, I think it's 50-50 that he may get crushing on me. Just last hour ago, he had meeting nearby, so he called to visit. ..Yeah, good time again.

Dunno, I will just take this easy, whatever will be, will be... I am an honest person, anyways.

I also get awkward to say I am "mee fan lao" (have BF), I haven't yet said anything about this with him... well, he didn't ask, so I didn't tell. I don't know how to say.. but I don't do giving out phone number for this, of course.

[MidoriApple]

You already got some good advice, MidoriApple. But, I can speak from experience that most men DO have an ulterior motive when they take a woman to supper or even a simple lunch meeting. We DO have a romantic motive, even if we don't follow up on it. It's better to get that off the table at the start (as others have already said). Most men are gentlemen enough to accept rejection if it isn't too hostile. However, for a business to work you must be at least friendly with each other. Just make certain that the man understands there will be no romantic involvement. You can re-inforce that by mentioning your boyfriend from time to time.

And, don't worry about not being fluent in English. Just put the shoe on the other foot... you speak more English than the man speaks Thai. I often hear Thai women apologize for not speaking good English. There is no need for an apology at all so long as you can make yourself understood.

So you think it is more like he has romantic interests in me?

I am less worrying of my English skill actually, you are right that I can use English better than westerners use Thai. Moreover I seen many here wrote wrong spellings, wrong grammars so oftens, so I think to myself... NO NEEDED BEING TOO WORRIED ....right? () Sorry, I am a little irony

[bifftastic]

Hi MidoriApple,

I'm glad your dinner was ok

It's true, men can't lie with their eyes!

If I were you I would continue without thinking too much. If this guy has a crush on you it's his mind not yours. I think it's good advice to mention your boyfriend at some point, just casually. Maybe something like.. " oh yes, my boyfriend likes that too..." in conversation. Just so he knows there's a man in your life already.

Hopefully he will continue to be nice and even if he does have some romantic ideas about you, he will understand that it's not going to happen.

It's normal to have these ideas I think, but also normal to find out that the woman you like, or think you might like, in that way, already has someone and so you can just be friends with her.

I hope it all works out well.

Biff

[Berkshire]

But Berkshire, how come you ask if I would think of him more than just a friend? Come on.... You are leading me to think too far right now..

Actually, I didn't mean to pry. Your previous posts didn't indicate whether you were interested in him or wanted him to be interested in you (unless I missed something). Your tactics would be completely different if you were interested in him and wanted to know if he felt likewise. On the other hand, if you weren't interested in him, then you should do as another poster suggested and mention a "boyfriend" in a conversation (very easy to slip that in). Then you will see if he has an ulterior motive.

I also get awkward to say I am "mee fan lao" (have BF), I haven't yet said anything about this with him... well, he didn't ask, so I didn't tell. I don't know how to say.. but I don't do giving out phone number for this, of course.

I've recommended for Thai women to mention a BF to ward off unwelcome advances, even if they didn't actually have one. It's much better to say that than to give out your phone number and then not answer when the guy calls. Some girls will do that because they're afraid to not give out their number in the first place. Odd.

[Hadrian1]

Excuse me for being nosy....but what happened? This is almost like a soap. I'm waiting for the next instalment.

[jfchandler]

Midori is a serious business woman who also happens to be a real cutie...

So, obviously, there'd be something wrong with the guy if he wasn't interested...

[F4UCorsair]

Can somebody send me her number? It's only business, seriously!

[MidoriApple]

Excuse me for being nosy....but what happened? This is almost like a soap. I'm waiting for the next instalment.

Oh..I didn't think there would be some more comments in here, so didn't come checking at all.

Well, Hadrian1... I think I may disappoint you, nothing has happened after. I haven't met him since then.

He was out town after that last meeting, then we (both, I guess) been so busy with work, I was very much... and remained busy until now.

Was about to meet him last week.. he does a leisure type of biz here in BKK, and that I can become his customer. Why not, right?

But we didn't meet finally, he been busy once, me once.... so couldn't make it.

To: Jfchandler.... Hi, JF... haven't heard of you so long, how's thing going? Wish you well.

...what you have said is sweet, but hey...seem exaggerated , I am very simple, actually. Thanks for your nice compliment, anyway ./ Cheers.