Abhisit Ready For Political Debate With Yingluck

[animatic]

She didn't come out too strong looking in her asset forfeiture case testimony.

Crying on the stand under moderate pressure can't be close to the pressure of playing hardball with other national leaders, with national prestige, benefits and well being at stake

In another situation I think I could enjoy her company, but this is not just a social evening in discussion for her, but being the primary representative and chief negotiator for a nations well being.

Edited May 16, 2011 by animatic

[animatic]

I posted a long comment yet only the first line appeared, is this to be blamed in True or some tactic by the mods?

I'll be damned if I write it again.

No, the software has been flakey lately. I have written comments and had three versions posted. It may also be their DBMS and your browser.

Mods don't erase partially without making a notation as to why and what. Or the whole post goes bye bye and another replaces it with reasons.

Edited May 16, 2011 by animatic

[Insight]

I'm no red supporter, but I vote for Yingluck. She's hot. That's all this country needs -- a good image. How can you people think that good-looking things are NOT good?? Tch. Farang thinking. You and this stupid thing you call 'logic'. Everyone knows that rich people are always good and are rich because they've done good things in their past life. Who cares if they're corrupt "now"? Theyve been good in their past life!! Don't you silly farangs understand this??

Love it. See you on stage on the 19th at Ratchaprasong

I don't think they understand irony on the stage at Ratchaprasong

Which will make it all the more entertaining

[anterian]

I posted a long comment yet only the first line appeared, is this to be blamed in True or some tactic by the mods?

I'll be damned if I write it again.

No, the software has been flakey lately. I have written comments and had three versions posted. It may also be their DBMS and your browser.

Mods don't erase partially without making a notation as to why and what. Or the whole post goes bye bye and another replaces it with reasons.

Hm, 2 months ago the Nation blog servers died and have never been sorted, then last week we hear that the Thai national ID database is inoperative, now you say Thavisa is on the blink, just what is the problem with IT skills in Thailand.

I guess this is off topic so don't feel obliged to reply

[animatic]

I posted a long comment yet only the first line appeared, is this to be blamed in True or some tactic by the mods?

I'll be damned if I write it again.

No, the software has been flakey lately. I have written comments and had three versions posted. It may also be their DBMS and your browser.

Mods don't erase partially without making a notation as to why and what. Or the whole post goes bye bye and another replaces it with reasons.

Hm, 2 months ago the Nation blog servers died and have never been sorted, then last week we hear that the Thai national ID database is inoperative, now you say Thavisa is on the blink, just what is the problem with IT skills in Thailand.

I guess this is off topic so don't feel obliged to reply

TVF servers are in Singapore. Admin and mods are mostly in Thailand but not exclusively. I know one is in USA at the moment.

But the software is relatively new, under a year, and with the

traffic flow of TVF it is a pretty hefty throughput to manage. So between the multitude of different browsers and multiple posters trying for the same database slot, the servers get a pretty good workout and the software must juggle quite a bit more than your typical chain store accounting system.

Edited May 16, 2011 by animatic

[WinnieTheKhwai]

But in the interests of public discourse and national safety, she SHOULD be given chance to speak; on her feet, extemporaneously, and in relation to her opponent, on issues of the day, so that the Thai People may see if she comes across qualified to go one on one with international leaders and national power brokers and vested interests, that will not hesitate a fraction of a second to go for the jugular on any slip up and pursue their interests at her and Thailands expense.

Agreed.

Thaksin of course abraces the old school dinosaurs and powerbrokers in EXACTLY the old school way that Thailand does not need.

I would agree. Sadly though, we don't get to vote or decide on what Thailand needs. At the core is what Thais feel they need, which is very different depending on their individual background.

I note you say "feel they need" as opposed to understand they need.

Does a thinking person want his childrens and grandchildrens futures set into stone by a beauty contest or a meeting of minds?

Well... there you really have me. My children are growing up very middle class, likely attend university, will build up a good network of people, etc. So with reference to my own genes, the yellower Thailand gets the better. Keep the stupid farmers out, only let educated and rich people vote, and divide up Thailand amongst themselves. What do they know, they've been known to sell their vote to the highest bidder. And yet.. I respect the poorer / rural people in Thailand too much to dismiss any aspirations or opinions they might have, regardless of if I agree with them or not.

Secondly, with reference to the future, I do firmly believe that only a VERY strong political system can weather the coming challenges. Currently the political system is the weakest it's been in a long time, with the military and other top groups having gained a lot of power. A strong political system and stable transitions of governments will mean that the whole thing won't fall apart during upcoming major challenges, the worst example being Thailand's next door neighbour Cambodia a couple decades ago.

With the 'worst case' being pretty $*Y&^#$ bad, I think I would prefer not to leave out any major segments of the population and show respect to everyone, even if they elect Yingluck because of her nice smile.

Edited May 16, 2011 by WinnieTheKhwai

[animatic]

But in the interests of public discourse and national safety, she SHOULD be given chance to speak; on her feet, extemporaneously, and in relation to her opponent, on issues of the day, so that the Thai People may see if she comes across qualified to go one on one with international leaders and national power brokers and vested interests, that will not hesitate a fraction of a second to go for the jugular on any slip up and pursue their interests at her and Thailands expense.

Agreed.

'animatic' timestamp='1305512969' post='4426762'

Thaksin of course embraces the old school dinosaurs and powerbrokers in EXACTLY the old school way that Thailand does not need.

I would agree. Sadly though, we don't get to vote or decide on what Thailand needs. At the core is what Thais feel they need, which is very different depending on their individual background.

I note you say "feel they need" as opposed to understand they need.

Does a thinking person want his childrens and grandchildrens futures set into stone by a beauty contest, or a meeting of minds?

Well... there you really have me. My children are growing up very middle class, likely attend university, will build up a good network of people, etc. So with reference to my own genes, the yellower Thailand gets the better. Keep the stupid farmers out, only let educated and rich people vote, and divide up Thailand amongst themselves. What do they know, they've been known to sell their vote to the highest bidder. And yet.. I respect the poorer / rural people in Thailand too much to dismiss any aspirations or opinions they might have, regardless of if I agree with them or not.

Secondly, with reference to the future, I do firmly believe that only a VERY strong political system can weather the coming challenges. Currently the political system is the weakest it's been in a long time, with the military and other top groups having gained a lot of power. A strong political system and stable transitions of governments will mean that the whole thing won't fall apart during upcoming major challenges, the worst example being Thailand's next door neighbour Cambodia a couple decades ago.

With the 'worst case' being pretty $*Y&^#$ bad, I think I would prefer not to leave out any major segments of the population and show respect to everyone, even if they elect Yingluck because of her nice smile.

My point was nothing to do with preventing the poor from voting.

Nor about letting the rich divvy up the country for their own profits.

But about ALL Thais voting from making informed decisions based on full disclosure by ALL sides, rather than emotionally charged decisions foisted on them by rabble rousers and political charlatans, stoking angry emotions, obscuring hidden ulterior motives.

I think to build a strong political system we must remove the pervasive influence of face obsessed politicians with way too much money to buy their ego gratification through power. If this was simply a battle between two elites, in the feudal kow tow manner that it appears to be, then let them fight it out without bringing the whole nation low in the process and harnessing the worst elements of the culture and worst emotions of the citizenry to do it.

Right now the two elites are pushing the populace into a collision course to emotionally driven civil war.

Edited May 16, 2011 by animatic

[diehard60]

It would be fun to watch! Abhisit --- speaking clearly and addressing the issues .... Yingluck stammering and saying "but when my brother picked me to head AIS and when my brother picked me to head PTP as party list #1 ...."

Thaksin thinks, PTP ...... succumbs?

I wasn't awareYingluck was afflicted or likely to be afflicted with a stammer......................

Perhaps you would provide medical evidence to support your statement......whilst you mock people with an innocent affliction to enhance your political "fun"

No he is just being rude, crude and sociably unacceptable. That's all. No more to say.

[jdinasia]

Nothing more selective in my comment than in your response. This is for the position of PM and being seen as a capable orator who can actually get his/her points across and convince people is of vital importance particularly internationally. .... sincerity when not based upon facts/truth just doesn't go far ... and the emotional appeal has obviously failed Yingluck in court in the past.

I just don't see Yingluck sitting at an ASEAN meeting waiting on the SMS from her surrogate dad (her older brother that she described that way) telling her how to reply being very good for the image of Thailand

Not to mention that sincerity based on lies, is prima facia insincere.

How do people think of someone who is sincere but full of ______ ummmm inconsistencies (I had to find another word for "crap") ????

The general response is "She means well, but doesn't know what she's talking about." --- not exactly a glowing recommendation for someone wanting to be PM .... Graceful oration (or even decent oratory skills), subject matter knowledge, and believability (the appearance of sincerity) are all requisite in a capable leader (in business or politics.)

[jdinasia]

It would be fun to watch! Abhisit --- speaking clearly and addressing the issues .... Yingluck stammering and saying "but when my brother picked me to head AIS and when my brother picked me to head PTP as party list #1 ...."

Thaksin thinks, PTP ...... succumbs?

I wasn't awareYingluck was afflicted or likely to be afflicted with a stammer......................

Perhaps you would provide medical evidence to support your statement......whilst you mock people with an innocent affliction to enhance your political "fun"

No he is just being rude, crude and sociably unacceptable. That's all. No more to say.

LOL ...

Sorry kids, but stammering is not always a medical affliction. It also happens to people when caught unprepared or when caught in lies etc .....

There was certainly nothing rude, crude or even marginally socially unacceptable in my post ((Unless, of course, you think that poking fun at the idea of Yingluck being Thaksin's proxy is either democratic or reasonable ... then I guess you could think it is rude ))

[NanLaew]

"Sorry, I can't debate you publicly because I have no relevant experience other than doing what my big brother tells me to. Yes, I know I am being tapped to be the PM candidate for one of the two strongest political parties in Thailand, but please ... remember our motto! "Thaksin thinks ....."

Since when has having political experience ever counted in getting the top job anywhere in Asia? It's normal and expected that siblings, widows and all sorts of relatives get first crack at running the noodle stand. Nepotism is par for the course so why on earth should we expect Thailand to be any different when even Singapore, that 'shining example' of democracy in the far east is so far up it's own filial arse, their eyes must be watering?

[jdinasia]

I think Singapore rates lower on the Democracy Index (both flawed democracies) than Thailand does. That being said ... it has nothing to do with the question of a debate

[sirchai]

Interesting, a rather arrogant sounding statement.........

Are the Democrats under estimating the opposition yet again?

Never underestimate anybody else.............:jap:

[NanLaew]

I note you say "feel they need" as opposed to understand they need.

Does a thinking person want his childrens and grandchildrens futures set into stone by a beauty contest or a meeting of minds?

T&A trumps Mensa IMHO.

[NanLaew]

I think Singapore rates lower on the Democracy Index (both flawed democracies) than Thailand does. That being said ... it has nothing to do with the question of a debate

Yes, I should have deleted the words 'democracy' from my last sentence.

But you missed the main point. What has the lady candidate's lack of political experience have to do with whether a debate will be beneficial?

Abhisit knew bugger all about PM'ing about one year ago. Thai politics should be easy enough? You get the army on your side by letting them have their toys and benefits, then the police by letting them carry on with their money-making opportunities, then the Provincial Governors by giving them Mercs and their minions by bussing them all around the country on junkets whilst mumbling something about upholding the palace.

Oh yes, and be seen doing lot's of stuff at temples including at least one photo-op of dishing out early morning grub to monks.

[hyperdimension]

I note you say "feel they need" as opposed to understand they need.

Does a thinking person want his childrens and grandchildrens futures set into stone by a beauty contest or a meeting of minds?

T&A trumps Mensa IMHO.

Having both is better.

I wonder if she'll be dressing up in tight blouse and short skirt during campaigning, or during a debate with Abhisit if she accepts the invitation.

Edited May 16, 2011 by hyperdimension

[Siripon]

I'm no red supporter, but I vote for Yingluck. She's hot. That's all this country needs -- a good image. How can you people think that good-looking things are NOT good?? Tch. Farang thinking. You and this stupid thing you call 'logic'. Everyone knows that rich people are always good and are rich because they've done good things in their past life. Who cares if they're corrupt "now"? Theyve been good in their past life!! Don't you silly farangs understand this??

Love it. See you on stage on the 19th at Ratchaprasong

I don't think they understand irony on the stage at Ratchaprasong

Which will make it all the more entertaining

Oh, they do,last year Jatupotn had the reds in fits of laughter as the end neared and he said on stage how the reds might panic as the army stormed the barricades, leading the reds in their confusion to break into the department stores nearby and in the chaos accidentally liberate expensive items.

[Siripon]

I think Singapore rates lower on the Democracy Index (both flawed democracies) than Thailand does. That being said ... it has nothing to do with the question of a debate

Yes, I should have deleted the words 'democracy' from my last sentence.

But you missed the main point. What has the lady candidate's lack of political experience have to do with whether a debate will be beneficial?

Abhisit knew bugger all about PM'ing about one year ago. Thai politics should be easy enough? You get the army on your side by letting them have their toys and benefits, then the police by letting them carry on with their money-making opportunities, then the Provincial Governors by giving them Mercs and their minions by bussing them all around the country on junkets whilst mumbling something about upholding the palace.

Oh yes, and be seen doing lot's of stuff at temples including at least one photo-op of dishing out early morning grub to monks.

It's not only being PM, Apisit has been an MP for 19 years, he's helped form legislation, been on many committees, he has a firm grasp of the scope of an MP and PM's job.

[jdinasia]

It's not only being PM, Apisit has been an MP for 19 years, he's helped form legislation, been on many committees, he has a firm grasp of the scope of an MP and PM's job.

Nanleaw has a point ----

but sadly it doesn't work in this case.

Her lack of experience COULD be considered a big plus, if she had the debating skills and practical knowledge to be PM. Being a political outsider has been beneficial in many places and at many times .... sadly, for Yingluck, she won't be considered a political outsider due to "Thaksin Thinks, Puea Thai ..."

Had she been the legitimate head of a company that did international business (and not a short-term figurehead for her brother) she could have claimed another big plus ... sadly she is tainted ....

A Thaksin family member simply won't bring any kind of reconciliation to Thailand .... and perhaps Abhisit can't either. It may be time for them to pop Korn up to the number 1 party-list seat for the dems ...

or even find a coalition partner to put someone up that would be more acceptable to Thailand as a whole. If the Dem's pull a coalition government together again I would personally like to see the Abhisit government continue forwards ... but it honestly might not be best for Thailand.

[ballpoint]

I don't think they understand irony on the stage at Ratchaprasong

Yes they do. Irony is what the reds make all their gunneries and kniveries out of.

[geriatrickid]

On the contrary, I think it is Abhisit that should avoid the debate. He will be in a difficult position and he has more to lose that Mme. Yingluck. Here's why;

- The expectation is that he will be able to eat the woman for breakfast as he is more experienced and polished etc. If his opponent can manage to hold her own and get in a few zingers without looking too stupid, she will have beaten expectations and "triumphed". This sort of battle has played out in western countries before and tossed a spanner into campaigns. The bar is set so low for the lady, tha all she basically has to do is show up, and act responsibly and she will get a boost.

- If PM Abhisit is too rough on her, he will risk creating sympathy for the opponent. The misogynists of TVF may not understand that, but a lot of Thai women have thoughts of their own that will cause them to be more open to considering a female candidate. There are some men that will vote against her just because she's a woman, but there are also those that may look upon her as a faithful sister, daughter and that will appeal to inherent Thai family values.

PM Abhisit will have to tread delicately as he will not just be arguing policy, but will be grappling with a lot of psychological and social issues that are part of Thai society. He's got a lot more at stake that his opponent who will go in with he public's rock bottom expectations.

[ballpoint]

On the contrary, I think it is Abhisit that should avoid the debate. He will be in a difficult position and he has more to lose that Mme. Yingluck. Here's why;

- The expectation is that he will be able to eat the woman for breakfast as he is more experienced and polished etc. If his opponent can manage to hold her own and get in a few zingers without looking too stupid, she will have beaten expectations and "triumphed". This sort of battle has played out in western countries before and tossed a spanner into campaigns. The bar is set so low for the lady, tha all she basically has to do is show up, and act responsibly and she will get a boost.

- If PM Abhisit is too rough on her, he will risk creating sympathy for the opponent. The misogynists of TVF may not understand that, but a lot of Thai women have thoughts of their own that will cause them to be more open to considering a female candidate. There are some men that will vote against her just because she's a woman, but there are also those that may look upon her as a faithful sister, daughter and that will appeal to inherent Thai family values.

PM Abhisit will have to tread delicately as he will not just be arguing policy, but will be grappling with a lot of psychological and social issues that are part of Thai society. He's got a lot more at stake that his opponent who will go in with he public's rock bottom expectations.

But the very fact that The Democrats are pushing for a debate, and the PTP are running scared of it would suggest they disagree with your theory. From my long term observations, I'd go so far to say that, for many Thai women, they'd like nothing better than to see a fellow female of a higher social status being "taken apart".

[animatic]

He is not likely to be any rougher on her than the international contacts she will have no choice but to play hardball with. Abhisit is a gentleman, and he would no doubt make pointed but polite responses, and she would need to respond appropriately if she can. She is walking onto the world stage not just Thailand, either she can handle a debate or she can't. But if she DOES get the job, she will HAVE NO CHOICE, debates with real consequences WILL be in her face.

[Siripon]

On the contrary, I think it is Abhisit that should avoid the debate. He will be in a difficult position and he has more to lose that Mme. Yingluck. Here's why;

- The expectation is that he will be able to eat the woman for breakfast as he is more experienced and polished etc. If his opponent can manage to hold her own and get in a few zingers without looking too stupid, she will have beaten expectations and "triumphed". This sort of battle has played out in western countries before and tossed a spanner into campaigns. The bar is set so low for the lady, tha all she basically has to do is show up, and act responsibly and she will get a boost.

- If PM Abhisit is too rough on her, he will risk creating sympathy for the opponent. The misogynists of TVF may not understand that, but a lot of Thai women have thoughts of their own that will cause them to be more open to considering a female candidate. There are some men that will vote against her just because she's a woman, but there are also those that may look upon her as a faithful sister, daughter and that will appeal to inherent Thai family values.

PM Abhisit will have to tread delicately as he will not just be arguing policy, but will be grappling with a lot of psychological and social issues that are part of Thai society. He's got a lot more at stake that his opponent who will go in with he public's rock bottom expectations.

And that's where Apisit's image as a gentleman will pay off, he's no bulldog like Chuwit or Samak, or traditional senior figure with an attractive mistress in tow.

He's a man who treats women as his equal,courteous and polite with a firm grasp of all the issues in this election, he would destroy her in any debate.

[Buchholz]

On the contrary, I think it is Abhisit that should avoid the debate. He will be in a difficult position and he has more to lose that Mme. Yingluck. Here's why;

- The expectation is that he will be able to eat the woman for breakfast as he is more experienced and polished etc. If his opponent can manage to hold her own and get in a few zingers without looking too stupid, she will have beaten expectations and "triumphed". This sort of battle has played out in western countries before and tossed a spanner into campaigns. The bar is set so low for the lady, tha all she basically has to do is show up, and act responsibly and she will get a boost.

- If PM Abhisit is too rough on her, he will risk creating sympathy for the opponent. The misogynists of TVF may not understand that, but a lot of Thai women have thoughts of their own that will cause them to be more open to considering a female candidate. There are some men that will vote against her just because she's a woman, but there are also those that may look upon her as a faithful sister, daughter and that will appeal to inherent Thai family values.

PM Abhisit will have to tread delicately as he will not just be arguing policy, but will be grappling with a lot of psychological and social issues that are part of Thai society. He's got a lot more at stake that his opponent who will go in with he public's rock bottom expectations.

And that's where Apisit's image as a gentleman will pay off, he's no bulldog like Chuwit or Samak, or traditional senior figure with an attractive mistress in tow.

He's a man who treats women as his equal,courteous and polite with a firm grasp of all the issues in this election, he would destroy her in any debate.

I'll never forget Samak's belligerence, threatening, and crudeness with the female interviewer for Al-Jeezeera that was broadcast for the whole world to see.

Part I

Part II

Abhisit is night and day different.

[scorecard]

On the contrary, I think it is Abhisit that should avoid the debate. He will be in a difficult position and he has more to lose that Mme. Yingluck. Here's why;

- The expectation is that he will be able to eat the woman for breakfast as he is more experienced and polished etc. If his opponent can manage to hold her own and get in a few zingers without looking too stupid, she will have beaten expectations and "triumphed". This sort of battle has played out in western countries before and tossed a spanner into campaigns. The bar is set so low for the lady, tha all she basically has to do is show up, and act responsibly and she will get a boost.

- If PM Abhisit is too rough on her, he will risk creating sympathy for the opponent. The misogynists of TVF may not understand that, but a lot of Thai women have thoughts of their own that will cause them to be more open to considering a female candidate. There are some men that will vote against her just because she's a woman, but there are also those that may look upon her as a faithful sister, daughter and that will appeal to inherent Thai family values.

PM Abhisit will have to tread delicately as he will not just be arguing policy, but will be grappling with a lot of psychological and social issues that are part of Thai society. He's got a lot more at stake that his opponent who will go in with he public's rock bottom expectations.

But the very fact that The Democrats are pushing for a debate, and the PTP are running scared of it would suggest they disagree with your theory. From my long term observations, I'd go so far to say that, for many Thai women, they'd like nothing better than to see a fellow female of a higher social status being "taken apart".

Part quote: ".........................but there are also those that may look upon her as a faithful sister, daughter and that will appeal to inherent Thai family values."

you say 'faithful sister', so I assume you mean faithful to thaksin. then you mention family vales. thakins is definitely not a role model for family values!

[khaowong1]

It would be fun to see a debate. But you have to remember, the debate would be in Thai, as only the Thai people would be voting. The truth of the matter is, Thailand pretty much doesn't care what the rest of the world thinks, they are just going to do what ever they want to. As for a debate between Abhist and Yingluck, Abhist is a politician, educated in England and is probably quite good at debating, where as Yingluck probably has never been involved in a debate in her life. I would imagine she would sound quite foolish. My advice to her would be to follow the programs of the U.S. beauty contestants. ie: My wish is for world peace. and - My wish is for all the children of the world to be pretty and have something to eat. etc, etc.

[animatic]

On the contrary, I think it is Abhisit that should avoid the debate. ...

And that's where Apisit's image as a gentleman will pay off, he's no bulldog like Chuwit or Samak, or traditional senior figure with an attractive mistress in tow.

He's a man who treats women as his equal,courteous and polite with a firm grasp of all the issues in this election, he would destroy her in any debate.

I'll never forget Samak's belligerence, threatening, and crudeness with the female interviewer for Al-Jeezeera that was broadcast for the whole world to see.

Part I

Part II

Abhisit is night and day different.

He was startlingly incoherent....

But easy to see why Thaksin was very quickly unhappy with Samak.

Edited May 16, 2011 by animatic

[letitbe]

As there is nothing to gain by inserting detrimental comments about other posters, and I have nothing new to add on this topic, I will now depart......

who said just go for gods sake please just go

[letitbe]

I think Singapore rates lower on the Democracy Index (both flawed democracies) than Thailand does. That being said ... it has nothing to do with the question of a debate

while i would not want to live in Singapore I visit often for business and i think many here and elsewhere would really welcome their peaceful safe life although for me to antiseptic. Id take Singapore's democracy any day against Thailand's constant coup's total corruption and divides and doubt very much if a meglomaniac 100% corrupt and dangerous man like Mr Taksin would ever get the chance to totally ruin a beutiful country like mugabwie idi amin hitler and so many before him have done. Sadly if he gets the chance people who have to stay here will understand much to late since damage will have been done.