Medical Repatriation To England

[Nonja]

I write on behalf of someone else and I seek your advice. For reasons of privacy I need to respect their confidentiality and personal details. I am sure you will understand.

The patient is 67 and has in the last few days become paralysed from the waist down.

The patient is of sound mind.

The patient has no family.

The nearest aiport is Chiang Mai.

The patient has sufficient funds to travel business class with a carer.

My specific question is:

In your opinion, is it possible to travel by plane to London in this condition?

What are the options?

I have been in contact with the Consulates in BKK and CM but they are closed until Tuesday.

Is there any advice you can give me?

The matter is urgent.

The patient refuses to go to the hospital.

There are serious concerns in the village regarding the illness.

What options are there if he is evicted?

I have been told no hotel will take a person in this condition. Is this true?

Thank you. I appreciate your advice.

[IMA_FARANG]

I'm not sure if the airlines will agree to fly this person or not, they may need a doctor's opinion on whether it is safe for the patient to fly.

At any rate...contact the AIRLINE to see what they have to say about flying him or her. They will know the IATA rules on flying the person, whether they need a doctor to certify if the person is allowed to fly medically, and they can also arrange for airline staff to meet the person, take him or her through check-in and arrange for a wheelcahir to the gate and special boarding for the passenger.

If the person can afford it, traveling business class would be preferable to traveling economy...just due to the fact that the airline staff will be more receptive to a obviously disabled business class passenger.

You should know too, that by IATA international rules...if a doctor certifies a person is physically able to safely travel by air...the airline is legally obligatd to allow that passenger to travel...the airline can't deny the patient the right to travel if the doctor certifies that it is o.k. for the patient to travel.

[Nonja]

I'm not sure if the airlines will agree to fly this person or not, they may need a doctor's opinion on whether it is safe for the patient to fly.

At any rate...contact the AIRLINE to see what they have to say about flying him or her. They will know the IATA rules on flying the person, whether they need a doctor to certify if the person is allowed to fly medically, and they can also arrange for airline staff to meet the person, take him or her through check-in and arrange for a wheelcahir to the gate and special boarding for the passenger.

If the person can afford it, traveling business class would be preferable to traveling economy...just due to the fact that the airline staff will be more receptive to a obviously disabled business class passenger.

You should know too, that by IATA international rules...if a doctor certifies a person is physically able to safely travel by air...the airline is legally obligatd to allow that passenger to travel...the airline can't deny the patient the right to travel if the doctor certifies that it is o.k. for the patient to travel.

Thank you very much.

[Soutpeel]

agreed as per the above.

The guys concerned really needs to see a doctor/hosptial right now and obviously they can assist with the documentation which will be required to get him on flight

I believe your first priority is getting this guy into hosptial and take it from there, as it would appear the person concerned doesnt quite know what is wrong with him

best of luck

[Nonja]

Thank you I appreciate your help

[JohnC]

Yes above is correct, I had a seriously ill friend fly home last year, we needed a doctors certificate to say he was fit to fly and his family arranged for the local hospital to admit him and he was met by an ambulance when he disembarked from the plane. If he is unable to get a doctors certificate he could use a medical company to evacuate him but this is costly around 250,000 baht . In addition you do not say how long he has been out of UK, if more than 90 days he will have to convince the authorities he is returning for good in order to receive treatment.

[meatboy]

serious concerns in the village,might be evicted,no hotel will take im either what kind of people are living there?regarding treatment in the uk i understand you are kept on the n.h.register for 6years,so if he hasnt been away any more than that and has his national health card he should be alright,good luck to him,and if he comes back find somewhere else to live.

[NancyL]

Does the British Consul in CM have a 24 hr emergency number? The Americans do and it's listed on their website. This would certainly seem like a good reason to use an afterhours emergency phone number.

You could check on the Chiang Mai forum for information about how to contact Dr. Morgan, whose office is between Chiang Mai and Hang Dong. She has a reputation of being very caring and will to make house calls. Perhaps your friend would be more receptive to seeing a doctor if the doctor came to his home.

There are hotels that will accept guests with disabilities, provided the guest has a care-giver with him at all times. Just contact the manager of one of the better hotels in Chiang Mai to discuss your friends special needs before you bring him to the hotel.

[harrry]

He may not want to go home and it may not be the best for him. There is at least one aged care home in Chiangmai and probaly many other options.

Bussiness class will not get him more help. An economy ticket for him and any carer needed is enough.

Being paralised is no reason for having to go to The UK. He may get better medical there but he will live a fuller life here if he can afford to pay for a carer.

[KimoMax]

It will be troubeling for any Doctor to certify your friend is able to fly if he has not been diagnosed why he has recently become Paralized from the waist down.

Your friend needs to see a Doctor about his condition regardless. Unfortunately your friend can not be forced against his will to travel or see a Doctor if he is of a Sane mind or not Confused.

Doctor's Certificate of Ability to Travel will be Required by Airline carriers.

Needs to travel at least Business Class and Accompanied by a Caregiver.

Caregiver to accompany a disabled person who needs assistance while traveling, in Hotels, and In-Flight to take care of personal needs will be Required.

[NancyL]

I've made a couple of phone calls alerting some people to this posting. Unfortunately, no one seems to have the personal phone number for CM's honorary British consul, although everyone agrees that Ben can't do anything about repatriation until the OP's friend sees a doctor. If unwilling or unable to go to the hospital he could contact Dr. Morgan, who speaks flawless English and has been known to make house calls in situations like this.

http://www.healthcar...icalclinic.com/

For travel arrangements and help with setting up a stay in a Chiang Mai hotel, the OP's friend could contact Boong at Boutique Travel Services. The website is www.btsthailand.com but my virus software won't let me open it. You can find Boong's phone number for Boutique Travel Services on the CM Expats Website Boong is well-connected within the expat community of CM and has probably arranged medical repatriations before

http://www.chiangmai...listofsponsors/

Everyone I've talked with agrees that the first order of business is to get a doctor involved, either at a hospital or with a home visit. Without a doctor, the OP's friend can't arrange transport or possibly even a stay in a hotel.

Perhaps it's something that could be corrected here. Recently, we had a friend who developed severe muscle weakness in his legs and couldn't walk. Turned out it was because of his cholestrol medicine and he was experiencing organ failure. If he'd refused medical treatment here and insisted on flying back to his home country, he'd probably be dead now.

The OP is a real angel to get involved. Our thoughts and prayers are with the OP and especially with his friend. Please let us know how everything works out.

[harrry]

It will be troubeling for any Doctor to certify your friend is able to fly if he has not been diagnosed why he has recently become Paralized from the waist down.

Your friend needs to see a Doctor about his condition regardless. Unfortunately your friend can not be forced against his will to travel or see a Doctor if he is of a Sane mind or not Confused.

Doctor's Certificate of Ability to Travel will be Required by Airline carriers.

Needs to travel at least Business Class and Accompanied by a Caregiver.

Caregiver to accompany a disabled person who needs assistance while traveling, in Hotels, and In-Flight to take care of personal needs will be Required.

Could you quote your sources for that incorrect information.

I am a person with a disability and I have flown regularly from Thailand to Australia using THai, Singapore airlines and Quantas. You are correct that the airline is only responsible for boarding and seating him and seplaning him and the normal services it provides in the air. It will assist him to the toilet door but will not provide personal assistance or medication. If these are required a crer is needed.

Even low cost airlines have to provide these services free but the quality of them varies.

Most airlines provide seats in the economy section and modern aircraft have armrests which are able to be raised to enable seating.

Transfer is often done manually though QANTA do use a lifting device.

The patient must be in a condition that he does not present a danger to the aircraft or crewl He also must be not likely to die on the flight.

THe best people to deal with this are the airlines themselves not a travel agency.

Any fare may be used even the lowest special fare however I would advise that it should be capable of Date changes.

www.qantas.com.au/travel/airlines/medical-assistance/global/en

www.britishairways.com/travel/ba6.jsp/disabilityassistanceinfo/public/en_gb

[MickA]

Get your friend to a hospital! I had a spinal cord injury C4/5 and because I waited it got worse if I had had it treated straight away here I may have been able to walk unsupported as it is I now use a walker to get about. I also travel by air and have had no problems on local carriers or international ones in getting flights

[KimoMax]

There is a difference in a person with a recent acute medical condition and a person who is stable with a disability.

It is not wise or prudent to try to not tell the airline of a person's undiagnosed recent acute medical condition.

The passenger is at risk if flying at altitude from a multitude of possible complications and risks of altitude and the passengers undiagnosed medical condition.

No one wants to have a In_Flight Medical Emergency where the plane has to suddenly divert and or land due to the Emergency.

This can and will be avoided if the person mentioned here goes thru a Doctor.

In my experience with local and International Medivac's, a caregiver will be required, as well as upgraded seating for privacy and room for the patient and caregiver to take care without disturbing other passengers on the flight. Much different from a person who regulary has delt with their disability.

The person referred to by the OP is Paralyzed from the waste down and most likely, can not walk, ambulate, or even crawl to a toilet or emergecny escape door. Much less have bladder and bowl control. A 12 hour flight for this person would require a caregiver.

It will be troubeling for any Doctor to certify your friend is able to fly if he has not been diagnosed why he has recently become Paralized from the waist down.

Your friend needs to see a Doctor about his condition regardless. Unfortunately your friend can not be forced against his will to travel or see a Doctor if he is of a Sane mind or not Confused.

Doctor's Certificate of Ability to Travel will be Required by Airline carriers.

Needs to travel at least Business Class and Accompanied by a Caregiver.

Caregiver to accompany a disabled person who needs assistance while traveling, in Hotels, and In-Flight to take care of personal needs will be Required.

Could you quote your sources for that incorrect information.

I am a person with a disability and I have flown regularly from Thailand to Australia using THai, Singapore airlines and Quantas. You are correct that the airline is only responsible for boarding and seating him and seplaning him and the normal services it provides in the air. It will assist him to the toilet door but will not provide personal assistance or medication. If these are required a crer is needed.

Even low cost airlines have to provide these services free but the quality of them varies.

Most airlines provide seats in the economy section and modern aircraft have armrests which are able to be raised to enable seating.

Transfer is often done manually though QANTA do use a lifting device.

The patient must be in a condition that he does not present a danger to the aircraft or crewl He also must be not likely to die on the flight.

THe best people to deal with this are the airlines themselves not a travel agency.

Any fare may be used even the lowest special fare however I would advise that it should be capable of Date changes.

www.qantas.com.au/travel/airlines/medical-assistance/global/en

www.britishairways.com/travel/ba6.jsp/disabilityassistanceinfo/public/en_gb

[Thongkorn]

how long has he been out of the Country thats the big question

[Beetlejuice]

It appears that your friend does not have medical insurance and may have problems affording medical fees here in Thailand; otherwise he would have admitted himself to a hospital.

Do not understand the part about the locals evicting him, unless your friend cannot pay his rent, cannot extend his visa or has other debts.

Firstly, I believe that a UK national must have an accommodation address within the UK and already be registered with a doctor or sign up with a doctor using the accommodation address.

Also the time period to become resident again is 6 months if having been outside of the EEC for a long time.

If his health problem appears serious where he is completely incapacitated, he could just visit a UK hospital as an emergency case, but he would still be required to give details of his Doctor and residential address.

In any case, no airline would accommodate him in his condition if it were as serous as described, plus the embassy or consulate are under no legal obligation to assist in these matters.

So it seems the man is caught between a hard rock and the deep blue sea.

[KimoMax]

Once Cleared to fly by a Doctor, either contact a International Medivac Company, or arrange all the transportation and caregiver accompaniement yourself.

A travel agent could assist in certain aspects of this, but not all of it.

I know Bumrungrad and Bangkok Hospitals both arrange incoming medivac's, and possibly can assist with outgoing to the UK as well.

The doc referred to by another poster here, or a Chiang Mai Hospital may also have a medivac unit, or able to assist with contacts.

Or search on-line for Medivac companies.

[Flatouthruthefog]

Get your friend to a hospital! I had a spinal cord injury C4/5 and because I waited it got worse if I had had it treated straight away here I may have been able to walk unsupported as it is I now use a walker to get about. I also travel by air and have had no problems on local carriers or international ones in getting flights

Very sensible!

There are a few aspects of this which don't make total sense. One being the apparent refusal to go to hospital, the other re the "people in the village." Very odd.

A totally flexible low cost option in Chiang Mai with qualified, sincere advice is the McKean Rehabilitation Centre. Dr Trevor Smith there would give an opinion and treatment and temporary or long term accommodation if required. They are also not too far from the airport.

PM me with your own e-mail address if you want Dr Smith's tel number.

Re the NHS in UK, depending on the severity of the case and the man's NI contributions, he may NOT get care there or may have to wait many months. As other helpful posters have said, you'd do well to research that aspect before the man buys an air ticket or two.

[JohnC]

</h4>

Also the time period to become resident again is 6 months if having been outside of the EEC for a long time.

Not true, this issue is complex and depends how long someone has been out of the country and will depend on whether you are going back permanently to live or not, see the website below for further info.

<h4 style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0.857em; margin-left: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; font-size: 1.166em; color: rgb(2, 134, 115); font-weight: normal; ">What if I should need hospital treatment?

Under the current Regulations, anyone who spends more than 3 months living outside the UK is no longer automatically entitled to free NHS hospital treatment in England. However, people in receipt of UK state retirement pensions who have lived in the UK for at least 10 continuous years at some point in the past remain entitled for certain levels of coverage. The extent of coverage depends on where outside the UK you live, and how long you live there.

http://www.dh.gov.uk/en/Healthcare/Entitlementsandcharges/OverseasVisitors/Browsable/DH_074384

[NancyL]

It's been over 24 hrs since the OP last contributed to this posting, which I'm taking as a sign that he's been busy helping his friend obtain medical care locally. I hope everything turned out alright for his friend.

[harrry]

On reading this again there are a couple of points which seem to be forgotten. He is the one who has the total right to make decisions. These decisions include the right to receive treatment or not or to stay or not. It seems other people may be deciding it may be best for him if he returns to the UK. If it would be better I do not know but the decision is totally his.

No airline will allow him to fly without his consent. No reputable medical professional will act against his wishes even if they consider them unwise.

The only exception is if he is not capable of making a decision and deciding that is a major step which involves medical and legal professionals. The OP has already stated he is of sound mind.

[lovelaos]

</h4>

Also the time period to become resident again is 6 months if having been outside of the EEC for a long time.

Not true, this issue is complex and depends how long someone has been out of the country and will depend on whether you are going back permanently to live or not, see the website below for further info.

<h4 style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0.857em; margin-left: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; font-size: 1.166em; color: rgb(2, 134, 115); font-weight: normal; ">What if I should need hospital treatment?

Under the current Regulations, anyone who spends more than 3 months living outside the UK is no longer automatically entitled to free NHS hospital treatment in England. However, people in receipt of UK state retirement pensions who have lived in the UK for at least 10 continuous years at some point in the past remain entitled for certain levels of coverage. The extent of coverage depends on where outside the UK you live, and how long you live there.

http://www.dh.gov.uk...sable/DH_074384

I went back to U.K last year for a holiday and I needed to visit an eye hospital for some treatment.

Having told the nurse I had been living abroad for the past 7 years she told me not to tell anyone this as I would have to pay for treatment.

I wasn't aware of this and when asked my address just gave a relatives address in U.K.

You will recieve free treatment if you tell them you intend to live in UK permanantly

[Nonja]

I apologise for my inability to reply earlier. I want to thank each and every one of you for your help and advice. It has been a fraught situation: it has been chaotic. And then my computer stopped working. Please forgive me.

The patient at this moment is being transported by ambulance to CM where medical arrangements have been made.

I think this issue (medical emergency) is important and I will try to summarise what I have learnt at a future date. At this very moment, I would like to sleep. I am exhausted. Perhaps Thai Visa might create an icon and an article on this matter in the future?

I have learnt a few things along the way.

One of the most important things I think I have learnt is that, if this ever happens again, I need to be more assertive. However, how assertive can a total stranger be? I have no rights whatsoever: no authority whatsoever. I cannot force someone to go to the hospital.

I respected the patient's insistence that they would not go to the hospital. In the future, I would insist on their going to hospital.

But, how do I insist?

It is very hard to expect total strangers to shoulder the responsibility of one's dying, and I think it is unfair. But it happens.

We did have unofficial medical advice, so we were not working blind. Please, do not ask me the details: I must respect the patient's privacy.

I have learnt a few things. The ambulance costs 7,000BHT for a 3 hour transfer: It is an efficient modern ambulance, but we really needed a stretcher. A flexible stretcher. The stretcher provided had metal infrastructure and wheels. We needed an old-fashioned manual fabric stretcher to get down 2 flights of stairs. This was not a good situation and was a bit of a disaster, really. There were insufficent strong men available. The pateint had bto be carried manually. You really need 4 strong men for a man of this size. There was no back-up plan by the ambulance service for rain. A clutch of us stood around with umbrellas but the seriously ill patient was very damp by the time we got him in the ambulance. Then the ambulance got bogged.

So: when you order an ambulance:

You need to ascertain what kind of stretcher they have available

You need 4 strong men

:You have to organise this yourself. We made do with the gardner and a visitor, but this is not good

You need to provide umbrellas etc in case of a thunderstorm, and, ideally, we should have had a plastic sheet to cover the patient

I really thank you all. I will keep you informed. In an emergency, we need information. I hope that Thai Visa might be able to help out here with an icon and some info.

[Thongkorn]

</h4>

Also the time period to become resident again is 6 months if having been outside of the EEC for a long time.

Not true, this issue is complex and depends how long someone has been out of the country and will depend on whether you are going back permanently to live or not, see the website below for further info.

<h4 style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0.857em; margin-left: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; font-size: 1.166em; color: rgb(2, 134, 115); font-weight: normal; ">What if I should need hospital treatment?

Under the current Regulations, anyone who spends more than 3 months living outside the UK is no longer automatically entitled to free NHS hospital treatment in England. However, people in receipt of UK state retirement pensions who have lived in the UK for at least 10 continuous years at some point in the past remain entitled for certain levels of coverage. The extent of coverage depends on where outside the UK you live, and how long you live there.

http://www.dh.gov.uk...sable/DH_074384

I went back to U.K last year for a holiday and I needed to visit an eye hospital for some treatment.

Having told the nurse I had been living abroad for the past 7 years she told me not to tell anyone this as I would have to pay for treatment.

I wasn't aware of this and when asked my address just gave a relatives address in U.K.

You will recieve free treatment if you tell them you intend to live in UK permanantly

And the good old tax payer picked the bill up . because you lied.

[NancyL]

Nonja,

good to hear that there has been some progress in caring for this poor man. You bring up some interesting points in your update. Yes, how far can any of us go in trying to help people who aren't close friends or relatives, especially when the ill person refuses treatment? I would be interested in learning how others have coped with this.

Also, a good point that it isn't fair of someone to expect strangers to assume the burden of helping, especially when the person wanting the kindness of strangers has gotten into his situation because of his own actions. But often, the kindness of strangers is all we have, especially when you're a stranger in a strange land. How many of us have a plan on what would happen if we suddenly became ill?

It is amazing that the ambulance didn't have a cloth stretcher. Something like that wouldn't take up much storage room in an ambulance. There are steps and stairways everywhere here. How can they expect to use a wheeled gurney to bring patients out from their homes? I know it wouldn't work in my home and I cringe at the thought of four large men attempting to carry my husband down from our bedroom. I don't think our stairs could support that much weight. I don't know if a stretcher could be fashioned on the spot, using bedcovers and lord-knows-what for the poles. We usually have large trash bags in the house and some of those could be taped together and used to protect from the rain, but many people here don't use anything larger than a grocery-store bag in their home.

I hope you're able to get some well-deserved rest, now, Nonja, knowing that your friend is in good medical care.

I apologise for my inability to reply earlier. I want to thank each and every one of you for your help and advice. It has been a fraught situation: it has been chaotic. And then my computer stopped working. Please forgive me.

The patient at this moment is being transported by ambulance to CM where medical arrangements have been made.

I think this issue (medical emergency) is important and I will try to summarise what I have learnt at a future date. At this very moment, I would like to sleep. I am exhausted. Perhaps Thai Visa might create an icon and an article on this matter in the future?

I have learnt a few things along the way.

One of the most important things I think I have learnt is that, if this ever happens again, I need to be more assertive. However, how assertive can a total stranger be? I have no rights whatsoever: no authority whatsoever. I cannot force someone to go to the hospital.

I respected the patient's insistence that they would not go to the hospital. In the future, I would insist on their going to hospital.

But, how do I insist?

It is very hard to expect total strangers to shoulder the responsibility of one's dying, and I think it is unfair. But it happens.

We did have unofficial medical advice, so we were not working blind. Please, do not ask me the details: I must respect the patient's privacy.

I have learnt a few things. The ambulance costs 7,000BHT for a 3 hour transfer: It is an efficient modern ambulance, but we really needed a stretcher. A flexible stretcher. The stretcher provided had metal infrastructure and wheels. We needed an old-fashioned manual fabric stretcher to get down 2 flights of stairs. This was not a good situation and was a bit of a disaster, really. There were insufficent strong men available. The pateint had bto be carried manually. You really need 4 strong men for a man of this size. There was no back-up plan by the ambulance service for rain. A clutch of us stood around with umbrellas but the seriously ill patient was very damp by the time we got him in the ambulance. Then the ambulance got bogged.

So: when you order an ambulance:

You need to ascertain what kind of stretcher they have available

You need 4 strong men

:You have to organise this yourself. We made do with the gardner and a visitor, but this is not good

You need to provide umbrellas etc in case of a thunderstorm, and, ideally, we should have had a plastic sheet to cover the patient

I really thank you all. I will keep you informed. In an emergency, we need information. I hope that Thai Visa might be able to help out here with an icon and some info.

[KimoMax]

Nonja, Great that you or whoever were able to convince the sick person to go to the Hospital. Many times to a Lay Person, someone may sem to be of a sound mind, but in fact they may be confused to Person, Time, Place, or Purpose. Medical professionals and some legal professionals are trained in evaluating this.

Other times people are just stubborn and refuse to give up their freedoms, and can be in denial of a real problem.

Re; EMS (Emergency Medical Services) and Ambulances in Thailand:

EMS here in Thailand is relatively new. 10 years or less in many areas. Ambulances are staffed with medically qualified Nurse(s) and a Driver that may have some First Aid or EMT I training. Thailand does not have true, real, Paramedics or many other Rescue professionlas that are normal in the Western world.

Ambulances, Rescue Vehicles and Equipment and training is not regulated. Each Hospital or Rescue Association carries their own equipment provided either by the Hospital, Rescue Association, or Individual Rescue Volunteers.

Most EMS vehicles do carry at least a Backboard and some type of Cerivical (neck) immobilazation device.

I have not seen the use of what is called a "Flat" (a folding slim style stretcher litter) here in Thailand.

All Ambulances from Hospitals will always be medically qualified, the crew May, or May Not have all the best, or appropriate equipment to deal with all situations, as is the case in the Western World.

Rescue pick-up trucks may or may not have EMS equipment or anyone properly medically trained.

Hopefully this will evolve and change as time goes on. Remember TIT and they will do it in their own time.

In the mentime, anyone in this type of situation should ask other persons or farangs to help extricate a sick farang from difficult place within a home or building.

Remember to take care in cases of suspected broken bones or spinal cord injuries.

Sometimes the only way to extricate a person is by manually carrying that person.

Kind of like moving a Piano. sometimes it will just not fit the normal way.

[chickenslegs]

And the good old tax payer picked the bill up . because you lied.

Perhaps he is a UK tax payer.

I paid my taxes all my working life. I have been living here in Thailand for over 6 years and I pay UK tax on my pension and savings - exactly the same amount as I would be paying if I still lived in the UK.

And I don't receive any of the benefits I would be entitled to in the UK.

Should I feel entitled to free medical care in the UK? - Yes!

Should I need to lie in order to get it? - Of course not!

[lovelaos]

I went back to U.K last year for a holiday and I needed to visit an eye hospital for some treatment.

Having told the nurse I had been living abroad for the past 7 years she told me not to tell anyone this as I would have to pay for treatment.

I wasn't aware of this and when asked my address just gave a relatives address in U.K.

You will recieve free treatment if you tell them you intend to live in UK permanantly

And the good old tax payer picked the bill up . because you lied.

Okay, firstly I didn't lie, if you read my post again I stated that I told the nurse the truth.

She, out of the kindness of her heart, decided to help me by informing me to not tell anyone this.

Secondly, I and my family have been "good old taxpayers" for centuries and never recieved anything in return.

Are you for real?