Cheaper Alternatives To Those Expensive Pool Chems

[jaideeguy]

We all know that most of those branded pool chems are simply chemicals and that most can be formulated at home with the right recipe of chemicals at 1/10th the price.

One example is flocculant.....can be cheap as alum or PAC from a chemical company.

What I would like to find is a recipe for a water clerifier like 'pooltrene'.

any other DIY pool maintenance recipes out there??

[Naam]

most can be formulated at home with the right recipe of chemicals at 1/10th the price

i wouldn't know a single one out of more than a dozen different pool chemicals on the market.

[mikecwm]

most can be formulated at home with the right recipe of chemicals at 1/10th the price

i wouldn't know a single one out of more than a dozen different pool chemicals on the market.

And your point is?

[in2fridge]

Don't know where you are..but .. "Advance" chemicals are approx 50 % cheaper than "pooltrine"

eg Cleartrine 1 gall + 1850 Bht

Advance Clear 1 gall + 880 Bht

Check poolspa.co.th

pr

pwpoolthailand.com

[jaideeguy]

most can be formulated at home with the right recipe of chemicals at 1/10th the price

i wouldn't know a single one out of more than a dozen different pool chemicals on the market.

And your point is?

My point is to save a few thb, which I thought I was clear about in my OP] I don't know what Naam's point was.

[mikecwm]

most can be formulated at home with the right recipe of chemicals at 1/10th the price

i wouldn't know a single one out of more than a dozen different pool chemicals on the market.

And your point is?

My point is to save a few thb, which I thought I was clear about in my OP] I don't know what Naam's point was.

Hi Jaideeguy. Sorry I wasn't more precise. I fully understand your point.

I just don't understand someone posting who had no answers for you - who could offer no useful information. Except to go for a world record for posts.

I too would like to find simple cheap options for pools.

I'll be following this thread. Maybe someone can help with real information.

Cheers

[Naam]

I just don't understand someone posting who had no answers for you...

and what you don't understand is that Jaydeeguy asked me in a personal message to contribute to this thread. unfortunately my only contribution is of no help for him but i thought it would be polite to react on his message.

perhaps next time you refrain from bitching based merely on assumptions?

[Naam]

My point is to save a few thb, which I thought I was clear about in my OP] I don't know what Naam's point was.

my point is that there are no cheap do it yourself chemicals to treat and sanitise pool water assuming you or your family want to swim in it.

if the pool is just for show and you want algae free clear water then cheaper alternatives do exist but your pump, filter, valves, tiles and grout won't like them.

Hydrochloric acid combined with copper sulfate. 25 liters of acid = 700 Baht, 3 kg copper sulfate 600 Baht should last for a whole year (depending on precipitation).

there is no free [pool] lunch and nothing cheaper than liquid chlorine if you don't want to spoil your pool and its equipment.

p.s. i could advise you the other way round if you win the jackpot and recommend the equipment i installed (i must have had too much of that heavy Portwine when i made that stupid decision). this is my setup, initial cost 148,000 Baht, running cost for all three chemicals 1,500-2,000 Baht per month. and that's for an enclosed pool that never receives any sun, dirt, leaves and the like.

[jaideeguy]

"my point is that there are no cheap do it yourself chemicals to treat and sanitise pool water assuming you or your family want to swim in it."

But Dr Naam, there ARE cheap alternatives as I posted in my OP........PAC, [Polyaluminium Chloride] @ less than 200thb/k worked much better than the most expensive bottled super floculant made especially for pools @ 800thb/lt.

And several forms of cholorine.....liquid, powder, granular, tablets etc and some are cheaper and just as effective than others. An old friend in Hawaii tells me the he simply supershocked his pool once a week.....stayed out of it for a day, then the cholorine disapated and was much cheaper than the last 50k of 90% tricholor @ 4,500thb.

I'm sure there are other tricks and I normally appreciate your informed input on technical matters, but maybe your knowlege of chemicals is limited.....no problem, maybe someone else out there may have a knowlege of chemicals and their safe combinations.

After all....everything is chemical and we know the pool supply ripoff scam that we are stuck with wants us 'hooked' on their products..

If I have time today, I'll consult with my all knowing friend, 'Dr Google'.

[Naam]

But Dr Naam, there ARE cheap alternatives as I posted in my OP........PAC, [Polyaluminium Chloride] @ less than 200thb/k worked much better than the most expensive bottled super floculant made especially for pools @ 800thb/lt.

flocculants do NOT sanitise a pool, i.e. kill bacteria. moreover flocculants are not needed if pool water is taken care in every respect. unfortunately, to "take good care" neither the testing equipment nor all the chemicals are available in Thailand. Thai pool "eggsburts" know two things only, namely Cl ppm and pH.

maybe your knowlege of chemicals is limited...

you guessed right Sherlock 3½ decades having had half a dozen pools in as many homes (5 of them in tropical countries) to take care gave me only some rudimentary knowledge about pool water care.

An old friend in Hawaii tells me the he simply supershocked his pool once a week.....stayed out of it for a day, then the cholorine disapated and was much cheaper than the last 50k of 90% tricholor @ 4,500thb

only clowns supershock their pools once a week and then think 7ppm of Cl dissipate within 24 hours and only rich people with money to burn buy 50k of "something" for 4,500 Baht. average laymen (like me) with only modest knowledge of pools and required chemicals keep their pool water crystal clear and "sound" by spending a total of 450 Baht per month for 20 liters of 30% liquid Cl, 50-100 grams of copper sulfate and perhaps a shot of acid to balance pH based on an outside pool with a 40-50m³ volume (assuming moderate precipitation).

I'm sure there are other tricks...

of course there are other tricks. best of all tricks is not to listen to people who possess a wealth of "no idea" about pool care.

[jaideeguy]

"only clowns supershock their pools once a week and then think 7ppm of Cl dissipate within 24 hours and only rich people with money to burn buy 50k of "something" for 4,500 Baht. average laymen (like me) with only modest knowledge of pools and required chemicals keep their pool water crystal clear and "sound" by spending a total of 450 Baht per month for 20 liters of 30% liquid Cl, 50-100 grams of copper sulfate and perhaps a shot of acid to balance pH based on an outside pool with a 40-50m³ volume (assuming moderate precipitation)."

OK, now, we're getting somewhere.....That is what I was looking for Naam. My pool supplier says to dose with a litre of the trichlor once a week and that should do it. 50k of trichlor lasts me almost a year at that rate= 90thb/week.

not too bad.

re: the copper sulfate.....that's heavy duty chems and not toxic at that rate?? .....for algae??

FYI....my pool is outside and is 84,000 lt or 84 cu/mtrs

Thanks for that info Naam and why did I have to pry it out of you??

[jaideeguy]

"i could advise you the other way round if you win the jackpot and recommend the equipment i installed (i must have had too much of that heavy Portwine when i made that stupid decision)."

I too often regret the decision of just building a pool, but I did and now I am stuck with it and am a slave to it.....only getting a few minutes a day of satisfaction out of it while spending several hours a week maintaining it. I originally built it for my kids, but they now would rather play video games than splash in the pool.

Anybody wanna buy a pool.....cheap.

[Naam]

Thanks for that info Naam and why did I have to pry it out of you?

your question was "cheaper alternatives" and "DIY at home for 10% of the cost" for which i had no answer.

[Naam]

1. the copper sulfate.....that's heavy duty chems and not toxic at that rate??

2. .....for algae??

1. heavy duty and highly toxic in high concentrations.

2. algaecide, fungicide and "miscellaneous-cide". used in every vineyard on grapes.

[Naam]

My pool supplier says to dose with a litre of the trichlor once a week and that should do it. 50k of trichlor lasts me almost a year at that rate= 90thb/week. not too bad.

you talk weight and volume (kilos and liters). you buy it dry and then dilute it? how do you apply?

if Cl content is 90% the estimate is fair for 84m³. but that does not mean you don't have to check Cl and pH at least once a week (twice better!)

questions:

-what about your pump times. do you run the pump up to 12 hours a day as some "eggsburts" here suggest?

-number of persons and frequency of pool use?

-what's your pump capacity in watts and flow liters/hour? a lot of people concentrate on saving chemicals and have no idea about the Baht they waste on electricity.

[jaideeguy]

My pool supplier says to dose with a litre of the trichlor once a week and that should do it. 50k of trichlor lasts me almost a year at that rate= 90thb/week. not too bad.

you talk weight and volume (kilos and liters). you buy it dry and then dilute it? how do you apply?

if Cl content is 90% the estimate is fair for 84m³. but that does not mean you don't have to check Cl and pH at least once a week (twice better!)

questions:

-what about your pump times. do you run the pump up to 12 hours a day as some "eggsburts" here suggest?

-number of persons and frequency of pool use?

-what's your pump capacity in watts and flow liters/hour? a lot of people concentrate on saving chemicals and have no idea about the Baht they waste on electricity.

I check Cl at least once a week and it is in the 'safe zone'. Ph is 7.6-7.8

I run the pump about 4 to 5 hrs a day.

Pump size is 2 hp.....not sure what the flow rate is.

Now a days, the pool only gets a half hr of me doing some excercise at night when it is cooler and an occasional 2 hrs on the weekend of kids [that i insist they rinse off and pee before they enter my pool]

[jaideeguy]

Just did a check on cholorine and it is still high after the 3rd day since dosing.......but I still have a bit of a green tint to the water and maybe a little green algae on the sides.

Naam......would your copper sulfate attack this kind of algae??

[Valentine]

Just did a check on cholorine and it is still high after the 3rd day since dosing.......but I still have a bit of a green tint to the water and maybe a little green algae on the sides.

Naam......would your copper sulfate attack this kind of algae??

Copper sulfate should knock it on the head but it may be dead already so try brushing & vacuuming. BTW chlorine works more efficiently when the pH is lower so do not worry if your pH is around 7. Keeping your total alkalinity in line is important as this will help keep the pH stable & thus more efficient use of the chlorine. Do make sure the total volume of the pool passes through the filter 1 to 2 times per day (I prefer 2) & I have always used sand filters but nowadays I use glass filter media (has a much finer cut, less backwashing) rather than the usual sand.

Edited July 24, 2011 by Valentine

[Naam]

Just did a check on cholorine and it is still high after the 3rd day since dosing.......but I still have a bit of a green tint to the water and maybe a little green algae on the sides.

Naam......would your copper sulfate attack this kind of algae??

yes, but it works better when used preventive.

[Naam]

1. I check Cl at least once a week and it is in the 'safe zone'. Ph is 7.6-7.8

2. I run the pump about 4 to 5 hrs a day.

3. Pump size is 2 hp.....not sure what the flow rate is.

1. reduce pH to 7.0-7.2

2. run pump not once 4-5 hours but in intervals 3 x 1.5 hours (timing 11.00, 14.00, 17.00)

3. depending on model gross flow rate is ~350-400l/min but actual rate due to resistance is most probably max 300l/min.

[jaideeguy]

Just did a check on cholorine and it is still high after the 3rd day since dosing.......but I still have a bit of a green tint to the water and maybe a little green algae on the sides.

Naam......would your copper sulfate attack this kind of algae??

Copper sulfate should knock it on the head but it may be dead already so try brushing & vacuuming. BTW chlorine works more efficiently when the pH is lower so do not worry if your pH is around 7. Keeping your total alkalinity in line is important as this will help keep the pH stable & thus more efficient use of the chlorine. Do make sure the total volume of the pool passes through the filter 1 to 2 times per day (I prefer 2) & I have always used sand filters but nowadays I use glass filter media (has a much finer cut, less backwashing) rather than the usual sand.

Valentine.....where did you find your crushed glass filter media?? [and how much thb??]I have read of the atrributes of crushed glass over what they sell as quartz sand [which i suspect is actually just river sand].

In my search a couple of years ago, local sources of the glass was quite over priced IMHO and i used a zeolyte and sand combo, but feel that the filtration could be better than what I have.

i brought my ph down to 7 and hope that increases the efficiency of the cholorine.

[Naam]

filtration

quite unhappy with the sandfilter after using in all other pools diatomite i came up with a solution that works to my satisfaction. every three months i add 1½ lbs of DE to the sandfilter and run pump for 5-6 hours. after that backwash and rinse. in case you try it, don't overdo it with the amount of DE without checking filter pressure which might go up too high!

good thing is that you can measure filtration success by opening the filter before backwashing and check DE discolouration. no other filter media beats diatomite!

[Bagwain]

In the first instance - go for a salt chlorination system for a domestic pool.

15/20% salt content of sea water.

You can't even taste it unless your body needs it.

Lower maintenance and bugger all chemicals (Little bit acid and salt when required)

In Oz you have to ask for your pool "not to be salt"!!!

Edited November 4, 2011 by Bagwain