Certified Copy Of A Uk Marriage Certificate

[sirhips]

Hello,

My application for a ‘change of visa-type’ from a 2 month temp stay to a non-O visa (married Thai wife in UK) was refused yesterday at the Bangkok immigration office…..and I’m confused what to do next.

The requirement (no. 6) of the application process states :

Marriage certificate (Kor Ror.2 and 3) , in case of marriage registration at foreign country, submitting certifying copy of marriage certificate and family status registration paper (Kor Ror.22) .

Or

Letter from a government office, embassy or consulate, Certifying that the applicant belongs to the referred family. (Certifying by Ministry of Foreign Affairs.)

I have previously obtained 2 non-Visas from the UK Hull office with no need to verify our UK wedding, but now it seems they want something more official.

I understand that I need to present some sort of notorised (assume British embassy) wedding certificate, then get that translated into Thai for the local MFA……is this correct or is there an easier way…….or should I just fly back to UK for a quick (but expensive) holiday??

NB. I need to submit docs by Monday as you also need 15 days on your current visa outstanding….so I really only have 2 days to get this sorted or I’ll need to re-enter again.

Thanks for any advice...

[lopburi3]

Obtain a 60 day extension of your current stay to gain some time. Then have your marriage certificate translated/confirmed by your Embassy and register at MFA and then visit local District Office to file it there and get there receipt for Immigration extension of stay use. This is Thailand and not the same procedure as asking for visa. Not hard but will likely take a few days.

Edit: If they are unable to accept your current marriage certificate to issue the 60 day extension to visit wife just make a quick trip to Laos or Cambodia to obtain a single entry non immigrant O entry (same price for visa there as change in Thailand so little lost is doing so).

[sirhips]

Thanks for the quick reply,

Just for clarification........

Do I need to get the UK marriage certificate translated before going to the UK embassy OR should I get the UK embassy to certify the UK marriage certifcate first and then get the translation done....??

also, I'm currently on a 60 day visit wife visa......but given its a national holiday this Monday, i'll run out of time to submit everything before the 15day rule......is it possible to get a second 60 day visit wife visa?

Thank you

[lopburi3]

I believe the translation comes first but have never done the process.

Did they say conversion had to be done by 15 days before? There have been a few reports of even less time allowed but not sure where or if valid.

If by visa you mean extension of stay from immigration the answer is no - only one 60 day extension can be issued per entry. In that case I would just use your UK certificate/copy of wife ID and home register (signed by her) and visit Vientiane/Savannakhet/Phnom Penh or Malaysia and obtain a single entry non immigrant O visa.

[bifftastic]

As far as the translation is concerned, the UK Embassy will not verify a document in the Thai language, they will only certify that your English language document is genuine. When they have done that, you can get the translation, which will include the phrase 'this is the signature of xxxxx offiical at the UK Embassy (or something along those lines!)

Then the MFA will stamp both it, and the translation as being genuine. So, in order for it to be recognised, I think you need to have the UK stamp before the translation, as the translation will contain what the UK Embassy add to the document.

They (the UK Embassy) certainly won't refuse to do it if you haven't got the Thai translation, as they aren't interested in it or, indeed, able to read it!

As with all these things, it is possible for things to go wrong with translations, so it might be better to use the translation service that is actually inside the MFA building. Easier (and cheaper) to pop downstairs to get things corrected, than to have to start again or go back into town, should you need to.

Hope you get it all sorted out

[sirhips]

Thanks for all the advice,

I was fortunate to received a call from a lady at the UK embassy today.

She explained that they no longer ‘certify UK wedding certificates’ as since April 2011 there’s been a ‘conflict with the UK Crown’ (whatever that means)….but as explained by BIFFTASTIC they will certify that the document (wedding certificate) is genuine and that I am who I say I am (I assume this is an affidavit type doc) – she informed me that the MFA offices accept this document, although she does know of 2 cases where it was refused.

The letter is issued at the same time as applying (i.e. no wait) and she advises that both myself and wife should be present; we both simply sign a letter, they countersign, apply their seal and charge me 2,800 for the privilege.

Regards the translation – I read that the building opposite the UK embassy can do this…..but BIFFTASTIC refers to a MFA building possibly being cheaper?...my wife believes she needs to take the translated letter to her local city hall in Bangphee…….is there an easier way or a more local MFA near the embassy??

On a separate note she also stated that the UK embassy no longer provides ‘a statement of residency’ letter – this I remember needing some time ago to register a car in my name….so I’m not sure how people will progress car/bike ownership from now on.

Regards

[lopburi3]

The MFA office is located above there passport office on Chiang Watanna Road and that is the only location. But once documents are registered there you can go to a District Office to have it recorded.

[maloyd1]

Thanks for the quick reply,

Just for clarification........

Do I need to get the UK marriage certificate translated before going to the UK embassy OR should I get the UK embassy to certify the UK marriage certifcate first and then get the translation done....??

also, I'm currently on a 60 day visit wife visa......but given its a national holiday this Monday, i'll run out of time to submit everything before the 15day rule......is it possible to get a second 60 day visit wife visa?

Thank you

I just went through the same thing at the Mae Sai imigration office. You need to go to the British Embassy/Consulate and have the Marriage Certificate Affirmed. They produce a document that you sign and they counter sign and stamp. You then have both documents translated and take them to the MFA for certification. Once this is done you go to your local Amphur and register the marriage and make sure you ask for a copy of the Khor Ror 22.

When I did this the immigration office accepted the British Marriage Certificate and Affirmation document from the Consulate without translation or certification at the MFA and certainly without the Khor Ror 22. Problem is Immigration offices play the game differently so I would check if the Affirmation in English is OK without the translation, certification at the MFA etc.

As I understand it the documents go to Bangkok for all Marriage Visas as it takes them 1 month to process. As such if the head immigration people in Bangkok accepted my application without translation etc. they should accept yours. But TIT they may not and I may have been lucky. The rules for Marriage documents changed or were enforced to the correct rules this year, hence the requirement for all this Affirmation/translation etc.

[Arkady]

Thanks for all the advice,

I was fortunate to received a call from a lady at the UK embassy today.

She explained that they no longer ‘certify UK wedding certificates’ as since April 2011 there’s been a ‘conflict with the UK Crown’ (whatever that means)….but as explained by BIFFTASTIC they will certify that the document (wedding certificate) is genuine and that I am who I say I am (I assume this is an affidavit type doc) – she informed me that the MFA offices accept this document, although she does know of 2 cases where it was refused.

The letter is issued at the same time as applying (i.e. no wait) and she advises that both myself and wife should be present; we both simply sign a letter, they countersign, apply their seal and charge me 2,800 for the privilege.

Regards the translation – I read that the building opposite the UK embassy can do this…..but BIFFTASTIC refers to a MFA building possibly being cheaper?...my wife believes she needs to take the translated letter to her local city hall in Bangphee…….is there an easier way or a more local MFA near the embassy??

On a separate note she also stated that the UK embassy no longer provides ‘a statement of residency’ letter – this I remember needing some time ago to register a car in my name….so I’m not sure how people will progress car/bike ownership from now on.

Regards

I wasn't aware that the British Embassy had ever "certified" marriage certificates. To my knowledge embassies have never had any legal authority to do that. That resides solely with the Foreign and Commonwealth Office in London. They will provide an apostile of a British government document that has already been notarized by a UK registered notary public. That apostile is recognized under the Hague Convention on Legalization of Documents as a certified copy of a genuine government issued document. What embassies can do is to certify a photocopy. They do this by making the photocopy themselves. This certifies that that it is a genuine photocopy of the original document but not that the original document is genuine, as in the case of an apostile. Fortunately Thailand is not a signatory to the Hague Convention and their government officials seem blissfully unaware of the boundless opportunity to make life utterly miserable for foreign residents by demanding apostiles. They remain convinced that an embassy certification of a photocopies guarantees the original document is genuine and long may they remain in their ignorance.

You get a translation done of the marriage certificate or other foreign government office by a translator who has a "certified translation" stamp with name, address and telephone number on it. (Anyone can have a stamp made up as there is no register of certified translators and most of them only have primary school level written English anyway). You take this with your embassy certifed photocopy of the original to the MFA to legalize the translation AND legalize the signature of the vice-consul at the embassy who certified the photocopy (they have a register of authorized signatures of all consular staff). The MFA won't handle translations of foreign documents without one of these meaningless certifications that the photocopy (but not the original document) is genuine. Either wait 4 or 5 days or pay extra for the express service after an argument to explain why you need it quickly. Then you are done.

[xtr3mx7]

Just want to add something that I experienced 2 years ago.

If you have to bring an official document from your home country, get the Thai Consulate in your home country to review and certified it (Signature and the Thai Consulate Stamp with Date and Time of review). Then, get the document translated in Thailand, and have it reviewed and certified by MFA at Chaeng Wattana.

When visiting the immigration office for your extension of stay, produce a copy of the original version with the Thai Consulate stamp together with the certified translated one. This is enough to help you with your extension since it has been endorsed by the Thai Consulate in your home country.

Hope that helps.

Cheers.

[bapak]

A slightly different slant... I recently witnessed a person going thru a similar process but they wearied of the paperwork. So they were advised to marry at a Amphur office. And this they did... and Immigration very happy with Thai Marriage Certificate. Granted the guy had to get a simple letter from his Embassy certifying that he was free to marry. No translations were required.

[lopburi3]

If they were not legally married that is what is required. Or are you saying he signed false paperwork at his Embassy saying he was single when he was actually married? Hope it never comes back to bite if that is what he did.

[bifftastic]

The translation company inside the MFA building might not be much cheaper (they did mine for 200 baht whereas the one in Ploen Chit was 300 baht) but the main reason I recommend them is that, if there's a problem, which there was with my affirmation of freedom to marry translation, you can just nip downstairs to get it sorted out.

In actual fact, it doesn't really matter where you get the translation done, as long as it's accurate. The possession of both the original English and the MFA stamped Thai translation is the goal here.

And there is only one MFA and it's in Chaeng Wattana, Bangkok.

Good luck (take a cushion with you!),

Biff