Duel Sport Electric

[visions]

RedShift SM from BRD Motorcycles

The performance of electric motorcycles may not yet be on par with their fuel-snorting brethren, but our outings on this new breed of two wheeler have convinced us that they are well on the way. Now San Francisco start-up BRD is throwing its hat into this rapidly expanding ring by announcing plans for battery powered bikes designed to "outperform their gas equivalents." Called RedShift, the motorcycles are slated for production in 2012 and will come in "dual-sport" and "urban" variants with both promising performance that would put them in the same ballpark as a gas-powered 250cc 4-stroke.

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BRD unveiled a pre-production version of the RedShift SM (the urban version) in San Francisco this week. The dual-sport RedShift MX is in parallel development and the preliminary specs have both bikes at about the 250 lb mark with "target power" of 40 hp and 5.2 kWh battery capacity. Range is likely to be around 50 miles per charge but the company isn't rushing to confirm this figure at this stage of proceedings. Given the wild variation we've encountered depending on how hard you twist the throttle on electric motorcycles, we can see the sense of this cautious approach.

The very sharp chassis design is also common to both models, as is the drivetrain and suspension. "We've developed a completely new method for manufacturing motorcycle frames that allows us to build a competitive chassis right here in California," said Chief Design Officer, Jeff Sand.

They're zippy, fun, quiet, require very little maintenance and they don't produce emissions at the tail-pipe. Range anxiety and twiddling your thumbs while waiting for the bikes to recharge are the clear downsides, but improved battery technology and designs that allow batteries to be swapped over should help address these issues moving forward.

[TongueThaied]

I can just imagine running out of juice way out in the sticks!

[visions]

I can just imagine running out of juice way out in the sticks!

By Juice I presume u mean battery power?

Whats so different about that, than running out of petrol in an ICE powered bike?

Surely you know what limits the bike is capable of before taking off on a run. Most electric bikes have a guage to show what charge is left.

Do lCE duel sport bikes have fuel guages, I have no idea as i dont ride them?

My guess is that there are more battery powered bikes sold worldwide than petrol powered now. And the trend will continue expotentially Im sure.

Even the bastion of ICE power...the Formula 1 race cars are required to run under electric drive in 2013. Its the 21st century now.

[13budgies]

I can just imagine running out of juice way out in the sticks!

By Juice I presume u mean battery power?

Whats so different about that, than running out of petrol in an ICE powered bike?

Surely you know what limits the bike is capable of before taking off on a run. Most electric bikes have a guage to show what charge is left.

Do lCE duel sport bikes have fuel guages, I have no idea as i dont ride them?

My guess is that there are more battery powered bikes sold worldwide than petrol powered now. And the trend will continue expotentially Im sure.

Even the bastion of ICE power...the Formula 1 race cars are required to run under electric drive in 2013. Its the 21st century now.

My guess is that you're guess is a bad one, and in 2013 F1 cars will have to use electric drive only in the pit lane.

Edited August 10, 2011 by 13budgies

[visions]

I can just imagine running out of juice way out in the sticks!

By Juice I presume u mean battery power?

Whats so different about that, than running out of petrol in an ICE powered bike?

Surely you know what limits the bike is capable of before taking off on a run. Most electric bikes have a guage to show what charge is left.

Do lCE duel sport bikes have fuel guages, I have no idea as i dont ride them?

My guess is that there are more battery powered bikes sold worldwide than petrol powered now. And the trend will continue expotentially Im sure.

Even the bastion of ICE power...the Formula 1 race cars are required to run under electric drive in 2013. Its the 21st century now.

My guess is that you're guess is a bad one, and in 2013 F1 cars will have to use electric drive only in the pit lane.

My guess ....try checking production figures of electric bikes made and sold in China, a greater figure than all petrol powered bike manufacturers production added together.

And thanks for confirming that my statement about F1 having to be running solely on electric power in 2013 was correct. Sure in pits only....so far. And as Im sue you are aware...electric drive is and has been for 2 years now, assisting performance during the race. That is a huge change of outook by diehard petrol heads. How long before its electric drive all round the circut?? probably a long time but the move to electric assistance was a major move in that direction. Actually with the number of pits stops they have now, maybe they could even change battery banks? Who knows? Electric drive would be far cheaper option than the high tek ICE engines used currently. But....ahhh the sound..... silent electric F1 wouldnt be the same eh?

Also just to throw in the mix.... Isle Of Wight The top battery powered bike was able to lap very close to the winners lap times also. Not bad for only a second time electric bikes have been allowed to enter, albeit in their own class. But Im old enuf to remember when people used to walk in front of ICE cars with a red flag waving....times have changed....... and will keep changing

What I am saying.... is that technology is bringing the options of battery power ever closer to a feasible reality for main stream use. What we are seeing now wasnt even a dream just only 5 years ago.

Welcome new technology with an open mind. As an aside, I posted the artical about the duel sport for interest sake only, Im never likely to be riding one.

[guzzi850m2]

Battery powered bikes/cars still have much development to do before they will/can replace a petrol powered ones.

That Redshift you mention only run on batteries as far as I can see, so what do you do if one of your riding buddies (on a petrol bide) suggest a day ride on 400 km? Oh we will have to take a brake after 2 hours and recharge my batteries (min 3-4 hours) before proceding, he-he.

Yes I did see a footage on TV about all the electric bikes in China, but they are more bicycle types so go slow. I guess they are ok for going to work and back on, as you got plenty of time to recharge. So all these electric powered bikes in China when charged will draw power from coal/oil based power plants polluting our Earth even more, not good. A good old pedal driven bicycle is way better than electric bicycle pollution wise.

Edited August 11, 2011 by guzzi850m2

[visions]

Battery powered bikes/cars still have much development to do before they will/can replace a petrol powered ones.

That Redshift you mention only run on batteries as far as I can see, so what do you do if one of your riding buddies (on a petrol bide) suggest a day ride on 400 km? Oh we will have to take a brake after 2 hours and recharge my batteries (min 3-4 hours) before proceding, he-he.

Yes I did see a footage on TV about all the electric bikes in China, but they are more bicycle types so go slow. I guess they are ok for going to work and back on, as you got plenty of time to recharge. So all these electric powered bikes in China when charged will draw power from coal/oil based power plants polluting our Earth even more, not good. A good old pedal driven bicycle is way better than electric bicycle pollution wise.

Oh I agree about the development still required..... and of course about the extended range trips. I guess when petrol was taking over from steam the steamies would have been saying about range...."oh what happens when u run out of fuel.....we can get water anywhere". Well they solved that with gas stations.......as they will find the answers for battery recharges or swaps or whatever.

But the majority of rides are of very short distances/commutes etc so isnt really an issue even now.

Yes the majority of production in China of electric bikes are either push bike type or smallish scooters, but look around Thailand and all of Asia and what do you see....smallish scooters, I suspect Europe also????

As my statement of previous post said...

What I am saying.... is that technology is bringing the options of battery power ever closer to a feasible reality for main stream use. What we are seeing now wasnt even a dream just only 5 years ago.

[Atmos]

see the Electric Motorcycle thread - battery powered race bikes doing 150mph at Isle of Man and LAguna Seca; technology improving rapidly.

[nikster]

see the Electric Motorcycle thread - battery powered race bikes doing 150mph at Isle of Man and LAguna Seca; technology improving rapidly.

Not really. The electric race bike is impressive, but its battery packs are also insanely expensive. There's a factor of 10 needed in battery capacity / cost before these can replace gas powered vehicles. At the same time the charging problem needs to be solved.

I think I diid the math in that other thread, normal power outlets simply won't be able to charge a battery quickly enough, they don't have enough juice. I remember that race bike had an 18KWH battery. 18,000 watts draw for one full hour. You'd need a specialized charging station to charge this within a few minutes like you can gas powered cars. Or you make them last more than 12 hours or so so people can leave them to charge overnight - but if they last longer, they'll also have a bigger capacity still...

Electric motors are trivial (and good) - the only problem is batteries. And the advances made in batteries are very gradual. They're getting a tiny bit better every year. At this rate they're going to be 10 times better than today in 10 years or even more.

That said I think urban transportation with a ~80km range makes perfect sense.

Edited August 11, 2011 by nikster

[Atmos]

^ my comment related to:

Rapp's fastest lap time in this year's race was 1:33.194, obliterating Czysz record of 1:44.496 set last year.

If there was ever an improvement in petrol-powered technology that could take 10 seconds off a lap time at Laguna Seca it would be a miracle.

Mission Motorsport:

Mission Motors is racing to advance the state of the art of electric powertrains.

Pushing the envelope for what is possible with electric drive shapes not only the future of motorsports, but the future of transportation.

Mission's key powertrain technology has wide application in a variety of vehicle types, from automotive, to powersports, to truck and bus.

Mission's core DNA lies in the advancement of electric drive systems.

[visions]

A bit off topic but relevent to the direction this thread has taken.......

There are several battery powered planes commercially built now. (no secondary power) One i was looking at yesterday has a 500 mile range and cruise at 150kts.

hell...no speed cameras up there either..

[RED21]

These would probably fit right in here...

ZERO MOTORCYCLES

[visions]

These would probably fit right in here...

ZERO MOTORCYCLES

Thanks for that RED21. Certainly fits in. Im not suggesting to rush off and buy an electric powered bike......but the tide of change is certainly coming in.

There will be more and more varieties/models becoming available. Even Honda have electric models on the way (if not available now)

One of the things that does surprise me, is that the electric scooters havent swamped the Thai market yet like it has in China. With seemingly zero running costs (ok I know it does cost, but u dont need spend to buy a bottle top up of gas) it would I thought, appeal to many Thais who never ride more than a few KM at any one time. I actually bought one in China some years ago and was only about 15000 baht from memory. (equivelent) Guess one reason, in Thailand none have a Honda brand sticker on them??

[Atmos]

we saw these bikes in Singapore last year - maybe more an electric bicycle than an electric motorbike but they seemed to me to be ideal vehicles for round-town commuting.

Saw them for sale from Singapore $800 - that's about 20,000 baht at today's exchange rate.

Would there be a market for them here?

[visions]

we saw these bikes in Singapore last year - maybe more an electric bicycle than an electric motorbike but they seemed to me to be ideal vehicles for round-town commuting.

Saw them for sale from Singapore $800 - that's about 20,000 baht at today's exchange rate.

Would there be a market for them here?

Not unless they have the Honda Logo on them

While there are plenty of that "bicycle type" in China from what Ive seen in the larger cities, most are more scooter style. Bit more up market I guess. (but that was a few years ago now)

[RED21]