Democrats To Target Yingluck And Surapong For Impeachment

[Sadiegirl1975]

Why can't the people of Thailand have a democratically elected government serve a full term, after this they can see for themselves the good or the bad of the party(s) in power. Then at the next election they vote again for who they think will be better. This cycle of coup's, resignations and impeachment requests will never allow Thailand to progress democratically so that elections will be so one sided. Look at western democracies, one party serves for 1 or 2 terms, people get fed up with them and vote differently. If a party is not allowed to serve it's full term and then be voted in or out on their merits then Thailand is doomed to follow this cycle over and over again.

Or am I being too simple minded.

[webfact]

Democrat to impeach PM, foreign minister

BANGKOK, 18 August 2011 (NNT) – The Democrat Party will seek impeachment against Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra and Foreign Minister Surapong Tovichakchaikul for allegedly seeking help from the Japanese authority to issue visa for ex-Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

Democrat MP Nipit Intarasombat stated that the Democrat law team believed that Mr Surapong should be found guilty on two charges. He explained that the government had not yet elucidated policy statement to Parliament; therefore, the minister should not be allowed to perform on such a policy issue.

Mr Nipit believed that Prime Minister Yingluck should also have acknowledged the movement of the foreign minister, which contradicted the Constitution. He said the minister thereby could be impeached according to Section 157 of the Constitution.

The MP, also former culture minister, said Mr Surapong should arrest the former prime minister for legal proceedings instead of requesting the Japanese authority to grant visa for him. He noted that the time to file the case would be decided in the party meeting.

Mr Nipit, as the Democrat law team member, however admitted that it would depend on Senate Speaker General Teeradej Meepian and the Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Holders of Political Position if they would accept the case into consideration or not.

Meanwhile, in a related report, Mr Surapong today convened a meeting of civil servants at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs responsible for Thai-Cambodian relations to discuss border issues and agreements of the two countries cancelled by the Democrat government.

The withdrawal of Thailand from the World Heritage Convention in the recent World Heritage Committee in France is also one of the important topics of discussion.

-- NNT 2011-08-18

[hanuman1]

Why can't the people of Thailand have a democratically elected government serve a full term, after this they can see for themselves the good or the bad of the party(s) in power. Then at the next election they vote again for who they think will be better. This cycle of coup's, resignations and impeachment requests will never allow Thailand to progress democratically so that elections will be so one sided. Look at western democracies, one party serves for 1 or 2 terms, people get fed up with them and vote differently. If a party is not allowed to serve it's full term and then be voted in or out on their merits then Thailand is doomed to follow this cycle over and over again.

Or am I being too simple minded.

No, you're being too normal.

[noahvail]

Does anyone know how many votes it takes to impeach an MP, or the PM, for that matter? I'm thinking if it's 50% + 1, that's 251. If it's 2/3 + 1, that would be 336. Given that the coalition has 300 out of 500 votes, I cannot see an impeachment vote succeeding.

[webfact]

Democrats Seek Legal Action against Foreign Minister

The main opposition Democrat Party has launched a legal campaign against the foreign minister for alleged abuse of power to help the fugitive ousted premier to enter Japan.

Members of the Democrat Party's legal team Wirat Kalayasiri and Nipit Indharasombat said Foreign Minister Surapong Towichukchaikul has violated the Constitution's Article 176 for starting his work before the government's policy statement and Articles 189 and 192 for aiding and abetting a fugitive convict.

If found guilty, Surapong could be sentenced up to three years in prison and fined up to 6,000 baht.

They said Surapong help facilitate fugitive former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra to enter Japan legally.

The two remarked the explanation from a Japanese official that the permission for Thaksin's entry was made to the request by the Thai government can serve as proof against the minister although he has denied it.

The pair said the party will solicit names of 125 MPs, which is one-fourth of the House, or gather 20,000 eligible voters' signatures to file a petition with the Senate speaker to seek Surapong's impeachment.

The legal team also filed charge with the Phya Thai police against Surapong today.

Meanwhile, the Democrat Party will meet the Election Commission tomorrow to submit the findings by the National Press Council of Thailand suggesting Pheu Thai's deputy spokesperson Wim Rungwatthanajinda offered kickbacks to journalists in exchange for providing news content for the benefit of its election campaigns.

The party hopes the findings will help the poll panel accelerate its investigation into its complaint asking that Pheu Thai be dissolved on charge of bribing members of the media to gain advantage in the election.

-- Tan Network 2011-08-18

[coma]

Pheua Thai party asked for things like this to pop up when they voted in the sister of a wanted fugitive as their leader / prime minister. And this will be a weak point of the current government as long as she is the party leader. This leaves it open for the democrats to exploit for all it is worth. And IMO they wouldn't be doing their job if they didn,t attack their opponents in this matter.

[Jingthing]

Yes, coma, they could do so much better to unify the country and work towards reconciliation if they dumped both Yingluck and her big brother ASAP. There are in power now and they could do this if they wanted to. Of course they won't.

[webfact]

PM reasserts government has no policy to help fugitive ex-PM Thaksin, declines comment on Democrat plan to impeach Foreign Minister Surapong /MCOT

[Jingthing]

They don't need a policy. That is their raison d'être. This reminds me of the Bill Clinton defense -- “it depends on what the meaning of the word ‘is’ is.”

Edited August 18, 2011 by Jingthing

[tragickingdom]

The Democrat party is a sad party of sore losers. Where Yingluck should really file charges for human rights abuses Assad style against Abhisit and Suthep she did nothing. Even the people in Bangkok find the Democrat party a sad party and believe that they will make it 6 in a row this time with even less seats. Just 17% of the Bangkok voters support the loser party in this. The remaining seems to be on the Yingluck side or don't know..

[gemini81]

Get 'er done!

Being a leader and being on a catwalk are two different things.

[gregb]

The Dems just will not accept that the lost the election. Give the democratically elected government a chance to do something. How long has she been sworn in, a week? What next yellow shirts blockading the airport next month?

The Democrats in opposition have a sworn duty to bring to attention any and all abuses by power of the PTP. I find it interesting how some of the Thaksin lovers on this site immediately cry foul because they are doing their job. If you want them to back off, you should try telling your beloved leaders to stop trying to aid the fugitive demagogue in exile.

The most serious threat towards the stability of Thailand is Thaksin. Nothing is more important than making sure he is never again allowed to lead the country into tyranny. Nothing else is as important as making sure Thaksin is neutered.

And yes, if the PTP actually tries to amend the constitution to whitewash the crimes of Thaksin, you can expect that the Thai people will be out in force blockading anything necessary to force the PTP to reconsider their position. Majority or not, you must respect the rule of law. Even a minority can cause serious problems for you if you insist on oppressing them. If you feel the reds were oppressed previously and supported their protests, then you must also understand and support the protests of the rest of us who were oppressed by Thaksin.

If anyone here honestly wants to give the PTP a chance to do their job, then they should rise up against the current actions of the PTP leadership in trying to aid and assist the fugitive. Don't blame the Democrats because they are exposing the hypocrisy of the people who have assumed power.

[gregb]

Does anyone know how many votes it takes to impeach an MP, or the PM, for that matter? I'm thinking if it's 50% + 1, that's 251. If it's 2/3 + 1, that would be 336. Given that the coalition has 300 out of 500 votes, I cannot see an impeachment vote succeeding.

I thought impeachments were done in the senate, not the house.

[Bkkorupcountry]

I'm sure that the Dems are doing what they think is best for the country - throwing it into political turmoil, destabilising the Govt, preventing them from doing anything that might be good for the country. After all, first and foremost, the LAW must be upheld, regardless of the consequences for the country as a whole. I'm sure many posters here would agree.

"I'm sure that the Dems are doing what they think is best for the country - throwing it into political turmoil, destabilising the Govt, preventing them from doing anything that might be good for the country."

Could you please explain how this is any different to the actions of Thaksin/PTP/red shirts over the last 3 years? At least we haven't seen any armed insurrection or border crossings by neighbouring countries as of yet.

" After all, first and foremost, the LAW must be upheld, regardless of the consequences for the country as a whole." OTOH this is definitely NOT Thaksin/PTP/red shirts, the antithesis even. Some people might even think that adhering strictly to the law of the land is an admirable thing, one of the pillars of Democracy - western thinking, eh?

Exactly, no different. Just childish and immature. You pushed me, that's why I pushed you back. You did this to me, that's why I'm doing it back to you. There can be no hope for reconciliation with this sort of mindset. And some think the Dems are the right party to lead the country.

[dude007]

poor joke, simple minds...

This will never work here in Thailand! I thought the Dems smarter than that! Bad loosers...

[rubl]

I'm sure that the Dems are doing what they think is best for the country - throwing it into political turmoil, destabilising the Govt, preventing them from doing anything that might be good for the country. After all, first and foremost, the LAW must be upheld, regardless of the consequences for the country as a whole. I'm sure many posters here would agree.

"I'm sure that the Dems are doing what they think is best for the country - throwing it into political turmoil, destabilising the Govt, preventing them from doing anything that might be good for the country."

Could you please explain how this is any different to the actions of Thaksin/PTP/red shirts over the last 3 years? At least we haven't seen any armed insurrection or border crossings by neighbouring countries as of yet.

" After all, first and foremost, the LAW must be upheld, regardless of the consequences for the country as a whole." OTOH this is definitely NOT Thaksin/PTP/red shirts, the antithesis even. Some people might even think that adhering strictly to the law of the land is an admirable thing, one of the pillars of Democracy - western thinking, eh?

Exactly, no different. Just childish and immature. You pushed me, that's why I pushed you back. You did this to me, that's why I'm doing it back to you. There can be no hope for reconciliation with this sort of mindset. And some think the Dems are the right party to lead the country.

Exactly, and some think Pheu Thai is the right party. The right party to care for k. Thaksin probably. Barely in government and only helping k. Thaksin, the rest can wait. Inflation, cost of living rising, wait, too early. 'one man, one party, no compromise'

[Bkkorupcountry]

I'm sure that the Dems are doing what they think is best for the country - throwing it into political turmoil, destabilising the Govt, preventing them from doing anything that might be good for the country. After all, first and foremost, the LAW must be upheld, regardless of the consequences for the country as a whole. I'm sure many posters here would agree.

"I'm sure that the Dems are doing what they think is best for the country - throwing it into political turmoil, destabilising the Govt, preventing them from doing anything that might be good for the country."

Could you please explain how this is any different to the actions of Thaksin/PTP/red shirts over the last 3 years? At least we haven't seen any armed insurrection or border crossings by neighbouring countries as of yet.

" After all, first and foremost, the LAW must be upheld, regardless of the consequences for the country as a whole." OTOH this is definitely NOT Thaksin/PTP/red shirts, the antithesis even. Some people might even think that adhering strictly to the law of the land is an admirable thing, one of the pillars of Democracy - western thinking, eh?

Bkkorupcountry - Perhaps you'd be so good as to explain the consequences for the country if the LAW isn't upheld?

I can give you an example of a country where the law isn't fanatically and religiously upheld. Thailand. Not to bad a country to live in, compared to what's happening in the rest of the Western World. And since we are all still very happily living here, the consequences aren't all that bad.

[random]

the amount of straw clutching in here is a joy to behold

[Bkkorupcountry]

I'm sure that the Dems are doing what they think is best for the country - throwing it into political turmoil, destabilising the Govt, preventing them from doing anything that might be good for the country. After all, first and foremost, the LAW must be upheld, regardless of the consequences for the country as a whole. I'm sure many posters here would agree.

"I'm sure that the Dems are doing what they think is best for the country - throwing it into political turmoil, destabilising the Govt, preventing them from doing anything that might be good for the country."

Could you please explain how this is any different to the actions of Thaksin/PTP/red shirts over the last 3 years? At least we haven't seen any armed insurrection or border crossings by neighbouring countries as of yet.

" After all, first and foremost, the LAW must be upheld, regardless of the consequences for the country as a whole." OTOH this is definitely NOT Thaksin/PTP/red shirts, the antithesis even. Some people might even think that adhering strictly to the law of the land is an admirable thing, one of the pillars of Democracy - western thinking, eh?

Exactly, no different. Just childish and immature. You pushed me, that's why I pushed you back. You did this to me, that's why I'm doing it back to you. There can be no hope for reconciliation with this sort of mindset. And some think the Dems are the right party to lead the country.

Exactly, and some think Pheu Thai is the right party. The right party to care for k. Thaksin probably. Barely in government and only helping k. Thaksin, the rest can wait. Inflation, cost of living rising, wait, too early. 'one man, one party, no compromise'

With your "exactly" phrase, dare I take it to mean that you agree with my last sentence as well? In any case, we do not know if PT is the right party since it's too early to judge. The Dems had a couple of years, PT hardly a couple of weeks so why not give them more time? Another thing of course is that there is no such thing as the right party for a country because who can judge after all? What's good for the elites might not be good for the poor rural folk and vice versa. The right party depends on whether that party does right for you or not.

[Siripon]

The Democrats are telling Yingluk, etc to work for the country and not Thaksin, as she promised. Still I understand the fear and pressure the Pheua Thai MPs are under when Thaksin has their resignation letters in his pocket.

[jonclark]

The Thai Criminal Code Section 192 (which is what the dems are filing charges under) states:

Section 192 Whoever, harboring, hiding or assisting with any means the person escaped from the lawful custody under the power of the Court, inquiry official or official empowered to investigate the criminal cases so as to such person may not be arrested, shall be imprisoned not out of three years or fined not out of six thousand Baht, or both.

It will be interesting to see the interpretations of this section,

Did the FM help him escape arrest by assisting taksin with a visa? Probably not as he wouldn't have returned to Thailand had the visa not been issued.

Is the FM setting a good example and keeping with the spirit of the Criminal Code - No.

Negligent - Very much so

[rayw]

Oh dear. Let us just forget the political wrangling and remind everybody that as of now Thaksin is STILL a convicted criminal who jumped bail (a serious offence in its own right) and as such should be brought back to Thailand to face sentence or a successful unbiased open appeal to try to clear his name if that is remotely possible. As of now he is a wanted criminal and as such the international community should treat him as a fugitive and arrest him anywhere he turns up in the world to send him back to Thailand under internationally accepted law. They can hardly give him amnesty as his own sister and his supported party is currently the Thai Government AND let us not forget he was convicted when his brother-in-law and political ally was PM too. Any country allowing him to reside freely in their state (like Dubai!!) is breaking international law and should be answerable to this by the UN or equivalent appropriate body. and prosecuted accordingly.

Neither his sister, nor any PM or Government minister or indeed anybody else should do ANYTHING to impinge on the due process of law and if they do then of course then they are guilty of corrupting the due process of law which has to be an impeachable offence for a PM or Government minister and that is apolitical and 100% for sure. Encouraging Japan to break international law is hardly sensible or legally sound, so there is clearly a charge to be answered by Yinglat and her cronies. Pity as I wanted to see this new Thai Government given a chance to show it is is truly for the people and a fair, honest and just one and do not want to see more political wrangling to overthrow it for party political gain, though I am honestly not surprised by the apparent truth in this latest charge again the PTP Government as it was sadly predictable and all stinks of Thaksin's manipulated self gratifying crap again.

[Chefku]

The whole world is watching and laughing about the Thai politics. They make themselves look like fools of a country. What a shame for a country like Thailand. If they could work together instead of blaming eachother this country could be very, very rich. And not only the rich one.

[Lizard2010]

It did not take long for Thaksin to be in the news, and to be wanting to get back and being involved in the Thailand System.

It will be interesting to see what happens next.

[rubl]

the amount of straw clutching in here is a joy to behold

You refer to your mistaken assumption the Dem's had let a convicted criminal escape on bail and did even fail to catch him when he divorced his wife in the Thai Embassy in HK? In 2008 when we had k. Thaksin's brother-in-law PM Somchai and the sequence of events was 'jump bail', 'divorce', 'be convicted' ?

He who lives in a porcelain shop shouldn't throw rocks

[MILT]

Has it ever occurred to anyone that the Democrat's were not set in place to Govern per say but rather to protect and thwart off the exploitation of the true culture of Thailand. Certain Thai people have not forgotten what dynasty allowed the freedoms that everyone enjoys including the current committee of Thai people set to free Thaskin before even one mention of the policies that are said to be ready for implementation. This a blatant attempt by this government to prioritize the prime ministers brother by attempting to by pass legal proceedings to exonerate a family member.

The Dems don't give a hoot about seizing power, they have it already. Pure and simple the Dems will always have the backing to protect Thailand.

This current Government is about power and control and making money for it's self, the masses come second yet once again.

[jdinasia]

Exactly, no different. Just childish and immature. You pushed me, that's why I pushed you back. You did this to me, that's why I'm doing it back to you. There can be no hope for reconciliation with this sort of mindset. And some think the Dems are the right party to lead the country.

If you are saying this ... that they are the same and no different .... then you think PTP is the "right party to lead the nation"?

All-in-all I disagree because right now the Dems are doing what they actually are good at .... being an effective opposition party

[lazygourmet]

It did not take long for Thaksin to be in the news, and to be wanting to get back and being involved in the Thailand System.

It will be interesting to see what happens next.

We all know what Thaksin is waiting for to make his come back... but we can not discuss -at least on a public forum- regarding that matter!

[daninthai]

The Dems just will not accept that the lost the election. Give the democratically elected government a chance to do something. How long has she been sworn in, a week? What next yellow shirts blockading the airport next month?

The impeachments have nothing to do with the election. The democratically elected government is being given every chance to do something right for the country, unfortunately, only sworn in for 1 week and they are already breaking laws. Of course impeachment is called for. How much do Thaksin supporters cry that we shouldn't worry about the crimes, just give them a chance. Sorry, crimes matter.

[OzMick]

The Thai Criminal Code Section 192 (which is what the dems are filing charges under) states:

Section 192 Whoever, harboring, hiding or assisting with any means the person escaped from the lawful custody under the power of the Court, inquiry official or official empowered to investigate the criminal cases so as to such person may not be arrested, shall be imprisoned not out of three years or fined not out of six thousand Baht, or both.

It will be interesting to see the interpretations of this section,

Did the FM help him escape arrest by assisting taksin with a visa? Probably not as he wouldn't have returned to Thailand had the visa not been issued.

Is the FM setting a good example and keeping with the spirit of the Criminal Code - No.

Negligent - Very much so

I don't think you read that law correctly. "Escape" has a D attached, so it is not assisting him to escape, but assisting he who has escaped. Under that interpretation there is little doubt that an offense has been committed.