Retirees? What'S Your Thai Living Budget?

[NancyL]

One of the problems with trying to budget is that I believe many of us overestimate our ability to live the "Thai Way". I don't live in Thailand, but I have come over there several times for about a month each time to explore what it would be like to live there. Two things I have learned:

1. I found that the humidity there kills me. I would be running the air conditioner all year long in Bangkok, and in Chiang Mai 8 months a year for most of the day. I live near the beach in the US and because I never need the air conditioner nor the heater my electricity bill runs about 20 USD per month (for cooking and lights), and I figured it would at least triple that amount in Thailand, and maybe more.

2. I overestimated my ability to eat Thai food all the time. I love Thai food, but I also love Italian food, Mexican food, and even American food. After about 10 days in Thailand I would kill for a baked potato. On my last visit I checked the prices of some of the Western food in the grocery markets and found that most of it is more expensive there than here at home.

After crunching the numbers, I concluded that for me Thailand would be no cheaper. There are many reasons to live in Thailand, but unless you can live like a local, I don't think cost is one of them.

Yes, I've thought about this, too. Our lifestyle here is very different than in the U.S. What would our living expenses be in the U.S. if we had a CM-style lifestyle -- i.e. no cars, 1000 sq.ft. rental condo, etc?

To duplicate this lifestyle in the U.S., we'd probably have to live in a college town with many free activities and good public transportation. I doubt we'd find a nice 1000 sq.ft. rental for what we're paying here. While we wouldn't be running the air con as much as we do here, we'd probably have to heat the place. A nice night out for us, with a few drinks and good dinner, would cost at least $50 - $60, $20 more if we went to a movie. That's about 2500-3000 baht. We can have a similar nice evening in CM for about 1000-1500 baht.

But the real kicker is the health costs. In the U.S., we ran a small business and paid a group rate thru our trade association for Blue Cross/Blue Shield medical coverage. The annual bill for Hubby and me was over $16,000 per year and that was three years ago. Friends tell us it would be over $20,000 now. Here we pay $3000 per year for the two of us and find the medical system much easier to deal with -- the care isn't as fragmented as it is in the U.S.

[Ulysses G.]

One can also live cheaply by moving to Arkansas and living in a shack.

Not if the "shack" is air-con and comfortable and one is eating at fairly good restaurants three times a day.

[sfokevin]

One recommended keeping an inexpensive traveler's insurance plan with medical removal just in case.

These usually have a clause that you must travel at least 100 miles from your "residence" (I have a AE standard travel policy for ~$120/year)... And I would bet they would consider your Thailand address your residence.

[sfokevin]

One can also live cheaply by moving to Arkansas and living in a shack.

Not if the "shack" is air-con and comfortable and one is eating at fairly good restaurants three times a day.

And it is doubtful one could find a single female (or male) with a waistline below 40 inches...

[justmaybe]

"These usually have a clause that you must travel at least 100 miles from your "residence" (I have a AE standard travel policy for ~$120/year)... And I would bet they would consider your Thailand address your residence."

Good point. It would probably depend on where you maintain your tax nexis during retirement and if there's a way to deny the claim I'm confident they'd find it.

"These posts are a waste of time - the OP puts up the topic and then goes on holiday - probably no interest at all in anyone's costs and has already figured out how much he has to live on.

I know some people spend a vast amount and some very little, that's the way it is and everyone's circumstances, needs and wants are different.......I can't really see the point of advertising it to the TV world though."

Even better point. Time for a good book.

[Thakkar]

uptheos is right. Most such threads invariably descend into pissing contests where no one but the individual posters care about their own posts.

However, in all this silliness, I discovered a little gem of wisdom with this from UG:

I find that if I eat some Thai food and some foreign food and choose restaurants carefully, I can eat out every meal and live on far less than than in America - even if I was doing my own cooking.

However, I am single, and am perfectly comfortable in a clean, medium-sized room with air-con, a computer and cable TV, instead of living in a big house with an expensive car and eating lots of imported food.

If one is willing to compromise on adapting to living in a different country, the savings here can be enormous, but it depends on what makes one happy and I guess that I have fairly simple needs as I love living here and do not spend a lot of money.

Whether one's living cost here is the same/more/less than back home, there is a certain serenity in knowing that, if one wants to, or if needs be, it's possible to live here with a fair amount of dignity and in reasonable comfort on a small outlay to the degree that isn't possible in any other equivalent city. That's something money can't buy. Stick that in your cost of living comparison spread sheets, people.

T

Edited October 9, 2011 by Thakkar

[Gladiator]

'In Times Like These' - Alan Price

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=28AwCSEl6II

[LivinLOS]

High prices for driving a car == Farang Myth.

Only if your talking naff asian cars and pickups..

Try a nice sports car... Something maybe german.. I dont mean with a dancing horse on it exotic, just well engineered.

I can get a beemer M5 E46 for about 250k baht in the UK.. I couldnt get one for 10x that here.. Doesnt matter the maintenance costs.

Yes I miss my cars.

[MangoAndCo]

One can also live cheaply by moving to Arkansas and living in a shack.

Not if the "shack" is air-con and comfortable and one is eating at fairly good restaurants three times a day.

And it is doubtful one could find a single female (or male) with a waistline below 40 inches...

*yawn*

But seriously, nobody I know has higher living costs in CM than in former homecountry.

[LivinLOS]

My costs are around 150,000 per month. Of course that includes my pool, my truck and 3 well paid staff, as well as daily food from MOW4u. I don't drink, never go out to eat, and my rent is only 5,000 per month. I do like to buy cameras and phones also... My utilities are expensive with water at 4,000 per month, and electricity at over 5,000 per month...

Firstly, I don't disbelieve a word you say,my question is, how expensive is your water?Here in Maesa Noi I pay 4Baht /1000ltr. Last month 48Baht which will rise to about 150/170Baht in the upcoming dry time to maintain the garden.

If I've done my numbers correctly at my rate your using 1,000,000ltrs/mth. or 30,000ltrs/day.If me I'd be headed out to the meter,turn it off and check that your meter is not redlining when it should be doing nothing.Just a tip.

Well, I have a large garden, 3 waterfalls, and 2 fish ponds, as well as a pool. This month it was 4,500 baht. I can afford it, so no worrys about me.

you fill pool with government water w have same except pool and I know lots of people who have pools no one spends 4,000 baht a month on water unless their totally stupid or lying I suppose you empty the pool every week and waterfalls dont use a pump to recirculate water your talking nonsense

Our water use here is often over 2k.. Pool uses quite a bit tho not for the last couple of months as rains been filling it.

If he has ponds and waterfalls It doesnt strike me as impossible.. High yes but not impossible.

[LivinLOS]

After crunching the numbers, I concluded that for me Thailand would be no cheaper. There are many reasons to live in Thailand, but unless you can live like a local, I don't think cost is one of them.

After 10 years here thats about where I am..

I support my mother with a UK household also so know what it costs to keep a house and person who lives a normal life in the UK. Living here in Thailand I spend (a lot more) than she does but make no pretense its living frugally.

I love living here, enjoy life a lot.. But am not here because its cheap. I actually think I could live in southern Europe pretty much the same with a decent villa, climate, and pool etc..

You can exist for 50k a month, you can live pretty decently for 80 or so.. Quality imported fixtures fitting linens etc dont come into that kind of budget tho.. Good stuff rapidly gets VERY expensive.. Getting the balance right between where to spend and where to economize is the skill.

My life on Phuket before was always north of 120k a month and often 150.

[LJW]

you fill pool with government water w have same except pool and I know lots of people who have pools no one spends 4,000 baht a month on water unless their totally stupid or lying I suppose you empty the pool every week and waterfalls dont use a pump to recirculate water your talking nonsense

Listen guy, you don't know me or anything about me except my water bill. Don't call me stupid or say I'm lying, because you don't understand why my water bill is 4,000 baht.

These posts are a waste of time - the OP puts up the topic and then goes on holiday - probably no interest at all in anyone's costs and has already figured out how much he has to live on.

I know some people spend a vast amount and some very little, that's the way it is and everyone's circumstances, needs and wants are different.......I can't really see the sense of advertising it to the TV world.

Maybe to feed one's own ego?

MSPain

Or maybe to answer the OPs question...

I get no thrill talking about my water bill, but He deserved a truthfull response, na'?

[LJW]

Maybe to feed one's own ego?

MSPain

Probably a valid statement.

It really doesn't matter to anyone else, how much or how little a person lives on.

By the stupid responses I have recieved, I think it does matter to some of you.

[LJW]

Firstly, I don't disbelieve a word you say,my question is, how expensive is your water?Here in Maesa Noi I pay 4Baht /1000ltr. Last month 48Baht which will rise to about 150/170Baht in the upcoming dry time to maintain the garden.

If I've done my numbers correctly at my rate your using 1,000,000ltrs/mth. or 30,000ltrs/day.If me I'd be headed out to the meter,turn it off and check that your meter is not redlining when it should be doing nothing.Just a tip.

Well, I have a large garden, 3 waterfalls, and 2 fish ponds, as well as a pool. This month it was 4,500 baht. I can afford it, so no worrys about me.

you fill pool with government water w have same except pool and I know lots of people who have pools no one spends 4,000 baht a month on water unless their totally stupid or lying I suppose you empty the pool every week and waterfalls dont use a pump to recirculate water your talking nonsense

Our water use here is often over 2k.. Pool uses quite a bit tho not for the last couple of months as rains been filling it.

If he has ponds and waterfalls It doesnt strike me as impossible.. High yes but not impossible.

I think I probably do have some leaking pipes, but I just don't care much.

[uptheos]

Or maybe to answer the OPs question...

I get no thrill talking about my water bill, but He deserved a truthfull response, na'?

Can't argue with that - he asked what our living budgets are and you answered.

That's why I think those sort of questions are ridiculous, the figures will vary according to ones means - the best thing the OP can do is figure out how much he has and do some real homework himself.......not that he's been particularly active since asking.

Edited October 9, 2011 by uptheos

[RidersCorner]

100,000 bht a month seems to be my magic number without watching the pennies, that includes riding (motorcycles) whenever i get the itch

After crunching the numbers, I concluded that for me Thailand would be no cheaper. There are many reasons to live in Thailand, but unless you can live like a local, I don't think cost is one of them.

After 10 years here thats about where I am..

I support my mother with a UK household also so know what it costs to keep a house and person who lives a normal life in the UK. Living here in Thailand I spend (a lot more) than she does but make no pretense its living frugally.

I love living here, enjoy life a lot.. But am not here because its cheap. I actually think I could live in southern Europe pretty much the same with a decent villa, climate, and pool etc..

You can exist for 50k a month, you can live pretty decently for 80 or so.. Quality imported fixtures fitting linens etc dont come into that kind of budget tho.. Good stuff rapidly gets VERY expensive.. Getting the balance right between where to spend and where to economize is the skill.

My life on Phuket before was always north of 120k a month and often 150.

[MangoAndCo]

Guys, give LJW a break, he is saving money! He can afford the 4k water bill now he weighs150 kg less and doesn't eat loads of junkfood anymore!

[dighambara]

50,000 Baht a month seems to be the magic amount,and if you rent maybe 15,000pm bills water,elect about 3,000pm,internet and phone about 1,500pm + running a car or motor bike and the cost of the most important FOOD around 10,000pm. then you may fancy a beer ???? and extra cost like a chick or 2 per month Price ummm sky's the limit.this is a rough guide only.oh if you have kids they will need school etc 30,000-50,000 baht each per term

Guess you didn't read his post?? He doesn't drink and and is not interested in BG's or Thai g/f's.

A bit hard on the comment, as many who drink beer or only occasionally imbibe, don't consider that as "DRINKING".

Edited October 9, 2011 by dighambara

[dighambara]

After crunching the numbers, I concluded that for me Thailand would be no cheaper. There are many reasons to live in Thailand, but unless you can live like a local, I don't think cost is one of them.

After 10 years here thats about where I am..

I support my mother with a UK household also so know what it costs to keep a house and person who lives a normal life in the UK. Living here in Thailand I spend (a lot more) than she does but make no pretense its living frugally.

I love living here, enjoy life a lot.. But am not here because its cheap. I actually think I could live in southern Europe pretty much the same with a decent villa, climate, and pool etc..

You can exist for 50k a month, you can live pretty decently for 80 or so.. Quality imported fixtures fitting linens etc dont come into that kind of budget tho.. Good stuff rapidly gets VERY expensive.. Getting the balance right between where to spend and where to economize is the skill.

My life on Phuket before was always north of 120k a month and often 150.

I have a friend, with Thai GF, who claims to get by on 45,000 Baht a month, eating out, nice apartment, motorbike, computer, etc.

Edited October 9, 2011 by dighambara

[heybruce]

I find that if I eat some Thai food and some foreign food and choose restaurants carefully, I can eat out every meal and live on far less than than in America - even if I was doing my own cooking.

However, I am single, and am perfectly comfortable in a clean, medium-sized room with air-con, a computer and cable TV, instead of living in a big house with an expensive car and eating lots of imported food.

If one is willing to compromise on adapting to living in a different country, the savings here can be enormous, but it depends on what makes one happy and I guess that I have fairly simple needs as I love living here and do not spend a lot of money.

Absolutely, but is your savings coming more from downgrading your lifestyle (from having house, car.etc to a small apartment & a bicycle) or from being in a different country? One can also live cheaply by moving to Arkansas and living in a shack.

It depends on what you consider important to quality of life. To give a U.S. example, when I moved from Albuquerque New Mexico to Hermosa Beach California I moved from a three bedroom, two and a half bath, two car garage house to a one bedroom, one bath, one car garage apartment that was a five minute walk from the Hermosa Beach Pier, and I loved life at the beach much more than life in Albuquerque.

Chiang Mai isn't on the beach, but it certainly has its appeal. I suspect many retirees here happily gave up expensive houses and cars in their home countries that were more than they needed and now live here with a house, condo or apartment and mode of transportation that exactly suits their needs and costs a fraction of what a similar life-style would cost in their home country.

It all depends on what you need to make you happy. So unless you say what you need for a happy and comfortable retirement, nobody can tell you how much retirement will cost you in Chiang Mai.

[LivinLOS]

100,000 bht a month seems to be my magic number without watching the pennies, that includes riding (motorcycles) whenever i get the itch

By my count you have spent about 100k a month ON motorcycles since I met you

[LivinLOS]

Chiang Mai isn't on the beach, but it certainly has its appeal. I suspect many retirees here happily gave up expensive houses and cars in their home countries that were more than they needed and now live here with a house, condo or apartment and mode of transportation that exactly suits their needs and costs a fraction of what a similar life-style would cost in their home country.

It all depends on what you need to make you happy. So unless you say what you need for a happy and comfortable retirement, nobody can tell you how much retirement will cost you in Chiang Mai.

But isnt that the case others are saying ?? I mean I always find it kind of comical, when I meet someone (usually in their first 3 years here) who is raving about how cheap life is, still living from a suitcase in a small apartment, often with no insurance, riding a scooter for transport, when hes comparing his costs of living to being in the west, with a full 3 large quality built home, driving a decent beemer or similar.. Its not like for like and as far as guys go, its usually driven by one much cheaper thing.

I 'retired' when I was 28.. I lived the simple life for a while, put the rolex in the safe and said material stuff isnt important.. But give it 5 years chilling on the beach or by the pool, and you start to miss high quality things, be it fast cars, or the home theater, or audiophile music systems, or good camera gear, or a ducati motorbike, or going to an international sporting event or race, or whatever your interests are. If your not just hanging around ticking off the time left in life, these things ARE life, they are your hobbies and interests, your passions define you. To not have interests and passions is to effectively downgrade large parts of your existence and settle for a developing world set of options. Well I am not interesting in settling for anything, I dont see why anyone should. If I need more then so be it, I will just make more.

Life is not defined by material things, but enjoying life is a dam_n sight easier when your not being restricted and forced to make second rate choices (choosing noodles or rice has a lower reward for either choice than a nice wine and lamb shank). Thailand is very cheap to exist in, and theres a lot of substitution you can make, but lots of things are much more expensive than the west, so its a personal choice how many compromises people wish to make. Hence why these threads never have any resolution.

[amexpat]

^

"If I need more then so be it, I will just make more."

Dang! Why didn't I think of that?

[LivinLOS]

^

"If I need more then so be it, I will just make more."

Dang! Why didn't I think of that?

Whats so odd ?? The world is full of opportunity.. Just IMO most of it (the big ticket stuff) exists back in the west.

I have already built pan european, many 100 employee companies, while just in my 20's.. I see businesses I could make 'retirement' money out of in a few years if I would just go to places I dont want to be, and work like an entrepreneur (80 - 100 hours a week) all the time. Look at the kind of money flood thats about to happen in libya to get their oil industry back up and pumping, someone who goes there now to supply oil and gas / construction / engineering, contract labor could have 100 employees at top absolute rate pay by next Christmas. The worlds full of hustles.

I am not motivated or hungry enough to do it, so I just play the markets, provide VC and startup investment to ideas I like, and ride bikes in the hills, but if I needed to, theres an airport here.

[ludditeman]

I 'retired' when I was 28.. I lived the simple life for a while, put the rolex in the safe and said material stuff isnt important.. But give it 5 years chilling on the beach or by the pool, and you start to miss high quality things, be it fast cars, or the home theater, or audiophile music systems, or good camera gear, or a ducati motorbike, or going to an international sporting event or race, or whatever your interests are. If your not just hanging around ticking off the time left in life, these things ARE life, they are your hobbies and interests, your passions define you. To not have interests and passions is to effectively downgrade large parts of your existence and settle for a developing world set of options. Well I am not interesting in settling for anything, I dont see why anyone should. If I need more then so be it, I will just make more.

You don't have to spend money to have hobbies and interests.

Owning 'stuff' is not living life, materialism is a disease thats looking for a cure.

I prefer noodles or rice to wine and lamb shank, not everyone from the west is addicted to unhealthy western food.

Edited October 10, 2011 by ludditeman

[LivinLOS]

You don't have to spend money to have hobbies and interests.

But the good ones generally do !! Yeah sure hill walkings free.. until you need the boots..

Sure theres some free stuff, but lets be honest, not much in life is free. Want to go mountain biking, you need the bike, want to go fishing, go get the rod, want to build or make something, you need the hobby tools and bits, want to pain or be arty, go to the paint supply store. This 'materialism' is about enabling experiences, and experiences are the stuff of life.

If your hobby is meditating, I guess your in luck..

Plus I will take a lamb shank and wine on the health stakes, over fried in palm oil bleached white rice, or reconstituted fish / meat ball soup washed down with an over chemical preserved domestic beer. I eat Thai every day, just about to have a Phad Khrapow breakfast, but life is made interesting with verity.

Edited October 10, 2011 by LivinLOS

[ludditeman]

You don't have to spend money to have hobbies and interests.

But the good ones generally do !! Yeah sure hill walkings free.. until you need the boots..

Sure theres some free stuff, but lets be honest, not much in life is free. Want to go mountain biking, you need the bike, want to go fishing, go get the rod, want to build or make something, you need the hobby tools and bits, want to pain or be arty, go to the paint supply store. This 'materialism' is about enabling experiences, and experiences are the stuff of life.

If your hobby is meditating, I guess your in luck..

Plus I will take a lamb shank and wine on the health stakes, over fried in palm oil bleached white rice, or reconstituted fish / meat ball soup washed down with an over chemical preserved domestic beer. I eat Thai every day, just about to have a Phad Khrapow breakfast, but life is made interesting with verity.

We seem to mainly agree, but not about the costs.

Hill walking great and free.

Fishing and mountain biking, you only need to buy a rod and bike once, and that cost is trivial.

Reading books, nearly free with a Kindle and internet access (631bht pcm) , same for PC games, movies Tv series

Rice comes from the gfs rice farm, mother winnows the rice, I'm sure that is fairly healthy.

Edited October 10, 2011 by ludditeman

[LivinLOS]

Also very relevant is age.. If I was 50 or 60 then I doubt I would be wanting a ducati (does that really go away ?? ) retirement in most peoples minds is middle or older age.. Not just the point when we no longer go to work.

If your younger, or just act as foolish as someone whose younger then theres more focus still in action and activity in life, more need to hop around South east asia every few months, go sailing or surfing, etc etc.. Its easier to putter around the garden (I expect) post 50.

Nothing wrong or right about either. Again its that theres no 'one' retirement. My old man is constantly globe hopping, this week hes driving overland from Africa to UK, with his new young bride (same age as my wife) to get her visa to fly to the USA all before Christmas. One day he will know what he wants to do when he grows up.

[Naam]

Owning 'stuff' is not living life, materialism is a disease thats looking for a cure. I prefer noodles or rice to wine and lamb shank, not everyone from the west is addicted to unhealthy western food.

that reminds me of something... what was it... if only that old age dementia... AH YES! it reminds me of the parable "The Fox and the Sour Grapes".

[cmsally]

Chiang Mai isn't on the beach, but it certainly has its appeal. I suspect many retirees here happily gave up expensive houses and cars in their home countries that were more than they needed and now live here with a house, condo or apartment and mode of transportation that exactly suits their needs and costs a fraction of what a similar life-style would cost in their home country.

It all depends on what you need to make you happy. So unless you say what you need for a happy and comfortable retirement, nobody can tell you how much retirement will cost you in Chiang Mai.

But isnt that the case others are saying ?? I mean I always find it kind of comical, when I meet someone (usually in their first 3 years here) who is raving about how cheap life is, still living from a suitcase in a small apartment, often with no insurance, riding a scooter for transport, when hes comparing his costs of living to being in the west, with a full 3 large quality built home, driving a decent beemer or similar.. Its not like for like and as far as guys go, its usually driven by one much cheaper thing.

I 'retired' when I was 28.. I lived the simple life for a while, put the rolex in the safe and said material stuff isnt important.. But give it 5 years chilling on the beach or by the pool, and you start to miss high quality things, be it fast cars, or the home theater, or audiophile music systems, or good camera gear, or a ducati motorbike, or going to an international sporting event or race, or whatever your interests are. If your not just hanging around ticking off the time left in life, these things ARE life, they are your hobbies and interests, your passions define you. To not have interests and passions is to effectively downgrade large parts of your existence and settle for a developing world set of options. Well I am not interesting in settling for anything, I dont see why anyone should. If I need more then so be it, I will just make more.

Life is not defined by material things, but enjoying life is a dam_n sight easier when your not being restricted and forced to make second rate choices (choosing noodles or rice has a lower reward for either choice than a nice wine and lamb shank). Thailand is very cheap to exist in, and theres a lot of substitution you can make, but lots of things are much more expensive than the west, so its a personal choice how many compromises people wish to make. Hence why these threads never have any resolution.

Hear, hear!