Plan Mulled To Cut Channel Through Bangkok Roads

[webfact]

Plan mulled to cut channel through Bangkok roads

The Nation

A group of engineers led by a Toyota Motor Thailand executive yesterday suggested that the government cut sections through five roads in eastern Bangkok to speed up the flow of water into the sea.

Ninnart Chaithirapinyo, vice chairman of Toyota Motor Thailand, led a group of engineers and water resource experts to meet PM Yingluck Shinawatra. They told her that Pracha Ruamjai, Rat Uthit, Suwinthawong, Ruam Patthana and Nimit Mai roads were standing in the way of the large masses of water from upstream provinces heading for the Gulf of Thailand.

"The proposal calls for 5 to 6 metres of the road to be cut through. We are mobilising private contractors to help. The government will have to make a decision and determine if this will affect residents," Ninnart said.

He said that the engineers came up with the proposal after it was found that the pumping water out of Bangkok was inefficient. "We went into the area [on Wednesday] and found that the water pumps were working at only 30-per-cent capacity because the water flow was blocked by many roads," he said.

After meeting with Ninnart's group, Yingluck assigned Transport Minister ukampol Suwannathat to meet with them and representatives from relevant state agencies such as the Highway Department, Royal Irrigation Department and Bangkok Metropolitan Administration in order to assess the pros and cons of the proposal.

The group later boarded a helicopter to survey the roads included in the plan.

Transport minister all for it

The transport minister agreed that some roads were blocking the run-off and should be cut through to speed up the flow, if necessary. These include Bang Na-Trat Road. He did not think severing the road would adversely affect traffic to the eastern seaboard, as there was the elevated Burapha Withi expressway linking Bangkok's Bang Na district and Chon Buri province.

However, Seri Suparathit, an expert in public disasters from Rangsit University, yesterday expressed opposition to the plan, saying it would not work as the water level in the eastern Bang Pakong River was higher than that in Bangkok.

He suggested that the best solution would be to remove the floodwalls along Canals 9 to 13 and focus on pumping water out at 50 million cubic metres per second.

-- The Nation 2011-10-28

[zydeco]

This was first brought up in the news a week or so ago. And the government still can't make a decision?

[bkkjames]

Guess if they do this the Ikea Grand Opening may get delayed?

The decision making process is / has been how to say 'at best, patient-at worst, by comittee'.

[Jawnie]

I say "DO IT."

And a big THANK YOU for the lady Prime Minister who is holding up and doing remarkably well. I believe in you and I support you. You are dealing with an unprecedented situation in Thailand.

May the blessing of the Triple Gem be with you!!!

[sfbandung]

This doesn't sound like something to go charging into. There is going to be enough infrastructure damage as it is without deliberately destroying roads based on a "maybe" scenario. Unless it's minimal damage to roads that are pretty well unusable as it is now.

[bkkjames]

Jawnie, I read that article twice, still don't see anything attributed to your savior?

[Crushdepth]

I say "DO IT."

And a big THANK YOU for the lady Prime Minister who is holding up and doing remarkably well. I believe in you and I support you. You are dealing with an unprecedented situation in Thailand.

May the blessing of the Triple Gem be with you!!!

Thank Toyota for doing some work and coming up with a plan. Do you really need to post grovelly comments in public? Maybe a note would be better? :-)

[noitom]

This idea is preposterous. To be "studying" a spur of the moment plan just days ago proposed by Toyota to "cut" through five major roads is totally mind boggling. This is the best case of "thrashing about" that you could imagine. Kill off everything around, but let's make sure that Toyota gets back in business. The Japanese probably gave this Thai partner the "or else" and he's actually proposing it to the government. How much disaster bakup and recovery planning did Toyota do? Let's take a look at their plan for flood and disaster management. How much effort did Toyota invest in educating its employees on flood safety, diseases, electrocution risk? Let's get that plan approved and, protect Toyota's interest and see how many more Thais can get Cholera, Dengue, Leptostirosis, Typhoid..etc. Maybe Toyota will have a new line of ambulances, medical vehicles, evacuation vehicles, and trucks to save all the people they killed off in this preposterous last minute thrashing about proposal to save their business. Shame on them.

[hellodolly]

Interesting that the private sector is the one to come up with the plan.

My original thought was would 6 meters be wide enough.

Quote

"However, Seri Suparathit, an expert in public disasters from Rangsit University, yesterday expressed opposition to the plan, saying it would not work as the water level in the eastern Bang Pakong River was higher than that in Bangkok."

What is a expert in public disasters doing at a university? Is there a course in public disasters there?

What are the qualifications to be a expert at public disaster? Did the red shirt ocupation in down town Bangkok qualify as a public disaster?

Would it be considered a public disaster if Bangkok was not threatened?

[Braveheart24]

This was first brought up in the news a week or so ago. And the government still can't make a decision?

He suggested that the best solution would be to remove the floodwalls along Canals 9 to 13 and focus on pumping water out at 50 million cubic metres per second.

50 million cubic metres per second!! Won't take too long then

[jackdawson]

Well, the Japanese certainly know about blowing things up; ask the guys at Pearl. But I say destroying Bangkok's key thoroughfares (Bangna Trat!) is simply not enough.

I don't work for Toyota (or even Mazda for that matter) but I suggest the selective use of thermonuclear weapons to clear a few channels between the water and the sea is what's really needed.

Now where's the USS G. Washington, and more specifically it's arsenal, when you REALLY need it.

Edited October 28, 2011 by jackdawson

[USExpat]

I have seen what they build on top of here in Thailand...Those roads are protecting the dirt and mostly sand from being washed away....so if they cut a trrench .....all of that water will start washing away that dirt and sand from under things they don't want to....as the water runs through the trench it will get wider and wider and they will not be able to stop it...

[DizietSma]

Also, these roads are protecting eastern Bangkok from eastern floodwaters not the northern waters. If you open these roads up, going by the elevation map, these eastern waters will drain into Bangkok via Klong San Saep and Klong Prawet, not out of it to Ban Pakong river.It will effectively flood inner Bangkok, Suvarnabhumi (because those floodwalls won't hold), and the Bang Chan and Lat Krabang industrial estates (any car manufacturers there?). However, it will drain the Ban Pakong rive as well (because it's currently at a higher lever to the klongs feeding into it).This will keep the two Toyota manufacturing plants in Chachongsao nice and dry. Coincidence?cheersDM

[GeorgeO]

This was first brought up in the news a week or so ago. And the government still can't make a decision?

He suggested that the best solution would be to remove the floodwalls along Canals 9 to 13 and focus on pumping water out at 50 million cubic metres per second.

50 million cubic metres per second!! Won't take too long then

Yes, I would be very interested to see what kind of equipment this "expert" has which can remove 180 billion cubic metres of water in one hour. If he does have it, then the problem is over...!!

The only point that this news item highlights is the fact that there is still no consensus between anyone involved in government as to how best to proceed. If only they had set aside the issue of "face" months ago, and sought advice from overseas "real experts" (such as the Dutch), we would not be in this situation now.

[siampolee]

The truth of the matter is that in reality not one of these .'experts' we keep hearing from have any idea of what to do or where to go to seek a solution to easing and then solving the current flooding situation.

Edited October 28, 2011 by siampolee

[Crushdepth]

The truth of the matter is that in reality not one of these .'experts' we keep hearing from have any idea of what to do or where to go to seek a solution to easing and then solving the current flooding situation.

The media likes to label people 'experts'. It adds credence to their poorly researched articles.

[BigBikeBKK]

The transport minister agreed that some roads were blocking the run-off and should be cut through to speed up the flow, if necessary. These include Bang Na-Trat Road. He did not think severing the road would adversely affect traffic to the eastern seaboard, as there was the elevated Burapha Withi expressway linking Bangkok's Bang Na district and Chon Buri province.

On the one hand they are telling people to evacuate Bangkok, and on the other hand they want to destroy some of the last remaining routes out of the city?! The incompetence of this government knows no bounds. What's more dangerous? This government or the floodwaters?

Edited October 28, 2011 by BigBikeBKK

[CockneyGit]

So the new plan is to dig up the roads. Genius, absolute genius..!!

This will help the water cross the road a little quicker, gaining around 20m in distance and "oh so closer" to the sea..!!

T.I.T

[smedly]

water flows down hill, it seems from what the Uni Prof says - this would have the opposite of the desired effect, in saying that I wouldn't write off the principle of creating extra waterways to expediate the drainage just make sure you do it in the right places, when this is all over make them permanent waterways for future flood relief by building proper chanels and bridges.

[fred110]

So officials have a helicopter to fly around in, when it could be used to deliver supplies. Maybe they should have bought those submarines after all!

[Credo]

There is little that can be done to control the water, so I hope they consider this plan very, very carefully. Once you cut channels through the roads, you are effectively cutting off large sections of the city and unless you have flood gates, you have lost what little control over the water that they do have.

If they put in flood gates, it starts sounding like a major project.

The issue of slight changes in elevation have proven to be a big problem. I am in an area that is supposed to be flooded. It was supposed to flood a long time ago. It hasn't. Either we are higher than we thought, or somewhere nearby is higher.

Engineers with a plan are good, but these guys might not fully comprehend the complexity of destroying infrastructure.

[siampolee]

Totally new take on, " Why did the chicken cross the road>"

However considering that chickens find water somewhat challenging perhaps it should be , "Why did the ducks swim across the road ?

[Crushdepth]

So the new plan is to dig up the roads. Genius, absolute genius..!!

This will help the water cross the road a little quicker, gaining around 20m in distance and "oh so closer" to the sea..!!

T.I.T

Some roads are raised and act as embankments.

[easybullet3]

Quote: [last paragraph]

"... and focus on pumping water out at 50 million cubic metres per second".

- really? are they saying that they have pumps that are pumping at 50 MILLION cubic metres PER SECOND????

doesn't that sound a bit high??? is this correct?

Edited October 28, 2011 by easybullet3

[hbullinger]

50 million cabic metres per second?

Can anyone imagine the size of such a pump?

[prvtdetdave]

This idea is preposterous. To be "studying" a spur of the moment plan just days ago proposed by Toyota to "cut" through five major roads is totally mind boggling. This is the best case of "thrashing about" that you could imagine. Kill off everything around, but let's make sure that Toyota gets back in business. The Japanese probably gave this Thai partner the "or else" and he's actually proposing it to the government. How much disaster bakup and recovery planning did Toyota do? Let's take a look at their plan for flood and disaster management. How much effort did Toyota invest in educating its employees on flood safety, diseases, electrocution risk? Let's get that plan approved and, protect Toyota's interest and see how many more Thais can get Cholera, Dengue, Leptostirosis, Typhoid..etc. Maybe Toyota will have a new line of ambulances, medical vehicles, evacuation vehicles, and trucks to save all the people they killed off in this preposterous last minute thrashing about proposal to save their business. Shame on them.

How much disaster planning have you done? I would say shame on you.

This disaster is because of people like you, who nay nay poo poo every solution.

I am not a supporter of big corporations, but they are correct this time.

[siampolee]

if when those roads had been constructed culverts were incorporated in the construction with flood gates ( if needed ) to control water flow on an ' As and when needed basis'' there would be no need for the proposed infrastructure damage plan.

Certainly in England and also Europe and I am sure the America's such structures are normal sights.

Edited October 28, 2011 by siampolee

[sirchai]

This was first brought up in the news a week or so ago. And the government still can't make a decision?

He suggested that the best solution would be to remove the floodwalls along Canals 9 to 13 and focus on pumping water out at 50 million cubic metres per second.

50 million cubic metres per second!! Won't take too long then

Hope the Korean pumps and Ying's pumps will do their job almost perfect. Or shouldn't they wait until her older brother the scum back is back? Mai Lou....

[huck]

This is a great idea. The government should do it without delay. These roads need to be dug up anyway to put in huge piping for furure flood waters.

With glabal warming it will become a yearly accurance that Thailand floods and Bangkok stands in the way of the flood waters draining to the sea.

Unless ofcourse the Thai government wants to relocate the capital, and this might not be a bad idea either. In both senario s the Thai government

is going to have to spend massive amounts of money. We are speaking about dycks being build around the city. I am affraid all the promises of

computor tablets for children and 300 Baht wage increases are going to have to be put on hold.

[noitom]

Once everyone decides that the Toyota "cutting through roads" idea is preposterous and only a way to assure Toyota's business continuity, then attention should be focused on reality -Continue the best water management at hand, but most important at this stage is flood safety and health issues. It's amazing that Toyota and 20 other top companies and the newspapers spend little if any time educating the people on flood safety and risk to health. Educate the people immediately on the risk of electrocution and health and disease. This is a very serious disaster of epic proportion in terms of disease and lack of education. The newspapers and corporate leadership should be ashamed , with or without government, they have done nothing to help communities of people to understand disease and floods. I have seen countless photos of children "playing" in filthy water, people carrying numerous dogs, people eating and preparing food in the flood water, and the newspapers seem to make a joke- isn't that cute about it. Amazing. The aftermath will be monumental - Leptospirosis, Cholera, Dengue, Typhoid..etc... Is Thailand educating its people on health and safety? Are they prepared? Is Toyota assisting its employees, customers, stockholders, and the community in better understanding preventive action in time of disaster for health and safety? Or will this be the next political scrimmage a week or two down the road?