State Railway Of Thailand Wants To Take Over Chatuchak Market From BMA

[webfact]

CHATUCHAK MARKET

SRT wants to take over from BMA, raises rent

The Nation

The Transport Ministry will submit a proposal to Cabinet today to set up a company under the State Railway of Thailand to operate Chatuchak Market. It wants to take control of the site from the Bangkok Metropolitan Administration from March 1.

The BMA, which rented abandoned SRT land near Chatuchak public park in the city's north and developed it into a popular weekend market, said the current contract ends on July 1 and it would seek intervention from the Central Administrative Court.

Transport Minister Sukampol Suwannathat, who oversees the SRT, said: "We are certain that SRT owns the land and is entitled to govern and commercialise the property. I am responsible for my decision to set up the firm to take over Chatuchak Market and ready for any legal battle.

"SRT has been in a position of disadvantage to the BMA, which has been overexploiting the Chatuchak Market on SRT-owned property. We are confident that the new firm could effectively run the market after the takeover, although most vendors don't have much confidence in the SRT," he said.

Deputy Bangkok governor Pornthep Tejapaibool said the BMA was proposing an annual rent of Bt79 million, for the 68-rai plot, while SRT wants Bt420 million. He said a Cabinet decision in 1979, when the market was first opened, mandated that it was a BMA duty to provide markets helping small-time vendors to sell good and cheap products to the residents in the capital.

SRT governor Yutthana Thabcharoen admitted the debt-ridden SRT had an image problem in regard to transparency and the expectation of running efficient businesses, but vowed to improve things to boost confidence among the public and vendors.

He complained that the BMA paid only a small rent - initially just Bt1.6 million a year, then Bt24 million under the current contract.

In regard to the BMA's statement that the contract ended on July 7, Yutthana said that was an extended period for the city to relocate tenants and not an actual active phase of the lease. He said the SRT would prefer to buy out all offices and infrastructure from the BMA while the stalls and shops belonged to vendors. They did not need to be relocated or dismantled.

The new firm is an SRT subsidiary and would open on paid registered capital of Bt50 million. Yutthana said Cabinet could lay out guidelines to make sure the SRT would benefit after the takeover.

There are now 12,807 stalls under contract with the BMA, including around 4,000 that pay rent at higher daily and monthly fees.

Pornthep said he hoped today's Cabinet decision would be a win-win solution for both the SRT and BMA, with the latter allowed to operate the market under a deal backed by the SRT. If the SRT was allowed to take over and run the market without BMA involvement, a new name may be needed, because "Chatuchak Market" was granted by His Majesty specifically at BMA request, he said.

-- The Nation 2011-12-27

[mccw]

Next step would then be to sell it on for peanuts to a shiwatra family member or business.

[airconsult]

What an odd headline... "SRT wants to take over from BMA, raises rent"...

Pretty misleading.

The past situation has been that SRT leased the land to BMA (at a certain cost, I could not be bothered quoting figures right now), then BMA set up the Market Management, organised stall areas and streets, then (adding about 50%) leased almost all the stall areas to 6 families. Those families then added about 200% (per sq. mtre) and leased to individual stall owners.

The whole thing was set up in the past just to funnel money to 6 families. In reality, SRT taking over (if it leases directly to the stall owners, which seems to be the intention) cuts out both the middlemen (BMA and the 6 families), *possibly* lowers the rent to the stall operators, and increases the amount received by SRT, which they can use to offset their losses in offering the free train services.

The only losers are the 6 families who sub-let the space from the BMA.

[ratcatcher]

What an odd headline... "SRT wants to take over from BMA, raises rent"...

Pretty misleading.

The past situation has been that SRT leased the land to BMA (at a certain cost, I could not be bothered quoting figures right now), then BMA set up the Market Management, organised stall areas and streets, then (adding about 50%) leased almost all the stall areas to 6 families. Those families then added about 200% (per sq. mtre) and leased to individual stall owners.

The whole thing was set up in the past just to funnel money to 6 families. In reality, SRT taking over (if it leases directly to the stall owners, which seems to be the intention) cuts out both the middlemen (BMA and the 6 families), *possibly* lowers the rent to the stall operators, and increases the amount received by SRT, which they can use to offset their losses in offering the free train services.

The only losers are the 6 families who sub-let the space from the BMA.

Are the names of the 6 families known to the public I wonder?

IF this is public land (via State Railway of Thailand), why is it being run by 6 (mafia?) type families?

[airconsult]

What an odd headline... "SRT wants to take over from BMA, raises rent"...

Pretty misleading.

The past situation has been that SRT leased the land to BMA (at a certain cost, I could not be bothered quoting figures right now), then BMA set up the Market Management, organised stall areas and streets, then (adding about 50%) leased almost all the stall areas to 6 families. Those families then added about 200% (per sq. mtre) and leased to individual stall owners.

The whole thing was set up in the past just to funnel money to 6 families. In reality, SRT taking over (if it leases directly to the stall owners, which seems to be the intention) cuts out both the middlemen (BMA and the 6 families), *possibly* lowers the rent to the stall operators, and increases the amount received by SRT, which they can use to offset their losses in offering the free train services.

The only losers are the 6 families who sub-let the space from the BMA.

Are the names of the 6 families known to the public I wonder?

IF this is public land (via State Railway of Thailand), why is it being run by 6 (mafia?) type families?

Not criminal (or at least not more than anyone else) - but if you search news articles for the past few months on who is objecting to SRT ending BMA's lease, you will get a good idea. SRT originally gave notice of the increase or termination in 2010, so BMA and the involved parties have had more than 12 months to try and get it squashed, but... it's been busy.

Sorry, but whenever there is millions involved, I don't quote names, but it might be fair to say that this loss of income will affect the next elections in Bangkok districts.

Cheers

[Oberkommando]

This has been going on for a while now.

Comes down to only one issue; money.

[sparebox2]

What an odd headline... "SRT wants to take over from BMA, raises rent"...

Pretty misleading.

The past situation has been that SRT leased the land to BMA (at a certain cost, I could not be bothered quoting figures right now), then BMA set up the Market Management, organised stall areas and streets, then (adding about 50%) leased almost all the stall areas to 6 families. Those families then added about 200% (per sq. mtre) and leased to individual stall owners.

The whole thing was set up in the past just to funnel money to 6 families. In reality, SRT taking over (if it leases directly to the stall owners, which seems to be the intention) cuts out both the middlemen (BMA and the 6 families), *possibly* lowers the rent to the stall operators, and increases the amount received by SRT, which they can use to offset their losses in offering the free train services.

The only losers are the 6 families who sub-let the space from the BMA.

Are the names of the 6 families known to the public I wonder?

IF this is public land (via State Railway of Thailand), why is it being run by 6 (mafia?) type families?

Not criminal (or at least not more than anyone else) - but if you search news articles for the past few months on who is objecting to SRT ending BMA's lease, you will get a good idea. SRT originally gave notice of the increase or termination in 2010, so BMA and the involved parties have had more than 12 months to try and get it squashed, but... it's been busy.

Sorry, but whenever there is millions involved, I don't quote names, but it might be fair to say that this loss of income will affect the next elections in Bangkok districts.

Cheers

This is what we call supply chain.

Try to go to Coke factory to buy a can of coke directly. They won't sell it to you. You have to buy from the shop which has to go throught at last 5 dealing chain. That's life.

[webfact]

Cabinet gives SRT nod to run Chatuchak weekend market

BANGKOK, Dec 27 - The Cabinet on Tuesday agreed that the State Railway of Thailand (SRT) has the management rights to Chatuchak weekend market once its lease with the Bangkok Metropolitan Administration expires on Monday, according to Deputy Transport Minister Chatt Kuldiloke.

The SRT owns 27 acres of land occupied by Chatuchak, and SRT and City Hall have been wrangling for the ongoing rights to run the market for some time.

Deputy Transport Minister Chatt Kuldiloke said after the weekly cabinet meeting that the SRT’s carry-on rights as landlord was acknowledged. The national railway can reclaim its management rights over Chatuchak after the lease with City Hall expires Jan 2 and the premises must be handed over to the SRT.

The cabinet requires SRT to present a detailed plan for cabinet consideration provided that it will set up a subsidiary to run the market, the minister said.

SRT Governor Yutthana Tapcharoen insisted earlier today that the SRT would run the market through a subsidiary with registered capital of Bt50 million. The SRT also accepted a vendor representatives' request that they should be given a say in running the market.

Mr Yutthana said the move would help build confidence among vendors regarding SRT's management.

Meanwhile, Transport Minister Sukampol Suwannatat said the BMA has the rights to take the case to the Administrative Court if it deems the decision as being unfair.

Deputy Bangkok Governor Pornthep Techapaiboon declined comment, saying he would like to study details of today's cabinet resolution first.

Chatuchak Weekend Market is a popular outdoor shopping venue for both Thais and international tourists. Some 12,000 booths offer shoppers bargains galore with a wide variety of goods.

About 200,000 visitors are recorded each day on weekends with 30 per cent of the visitors being foreigners. (MCOT online news)

-- TNA 2011-12-27

[webfact]

WEEKEND MARKET

Control of Chatuchak market passes to SRT

The Nation

Photo : Pramote Putthaisong

The Cabinet on Tuesday ended the row between Bangkok Metropolitan Administration and the State Railway of Thailand over the rights to operate the country's most famous weekend market, Chatuchak.

Deputy Transport Minister Chad Kuladilok noted that the Cabinet had passed a resolution to return the market to SRT, the actual landowner, and acknowledged that the state agency would set up a subsidiary to operate the 68-rai market.

"The Transport Ministry will call for a meeting with the Finance Ministry, the National Economic and Social Development Board and the State Enterprise Policy Committee to finalise the capital that the new subsidiary will require. The decision will then be re-submitted to the Cabinet," Chad said.

Bangkok Governor MR Sukhumbhand Paribatra has been adamant that the market would remain under Bangkok's control, even though the lease would expire on January 2.

Chad said that the SRT would discuss with BMA the return of the land on January 2.

The state agency would also negotiate with vendors over the rents, which must be reasonable for both sides, he said, admitting that the SRT needs to operate the market efficiently due to huge debts.

During the first two months of next year while negotiations are going on, rents will be waived for all vendors.

-- The Nation 2011-12-27

[DocN]

I guess, there goes another popular tourist attraction!

[samran]

..and again we have SRT worrying more about being a property developer than running trains in the country.

[slapout]

The old saying "if it ain't broke don't attempt to fix it' , comes to mind. SRT has never been known for their business sense nor approach to problems, that I can remember.

I would venture that the Bangkok governor is getting a slap on the wrist for past comments/action. Of course he being a democrat has nothing to do with the cabinet decision.

[spidermike007]

What an odd headline... "SRT wants to take over from BMA, raises rent"...

Pretty misleading.

The past situation has been that SRT leased the land to BMA (at a certain cost, I could not be bothered quoting figures right now), then BMA set up the Market Management, organised stall areas and streets, then (adding about 50%) leased almost all the stall areas to 6 families. Those families then added about 200% (per sq. mtre) and leased to individual stall owners.

The whole thing was set up in the past just to funnel money to 6 families. In reality, SRT taking over (if it leases directly to the stall owners, which seems to be the intention) cuts out both the middlemen (BMA and the 6 families), *possibly* lowers the rent to the stall operators, and increases the amount received by SRT, which they can use to offset their losses in offering the free train services.

The only losers are the 6 families who sub-let the space from the BMA.

Well, anytime you can cut our six families that are making hundreds of millions of baht that they do not need, everyone benefits. I am certain they will be cutting out the mayor too, and perhaps the governor of the province, so that is all good. If there is a way to do it so that the Thai people, the little people who are earning a living in an honest way that benefits us all, that would be wonderful. Chatuchak is a wonderful market, and millions visit this attraction. It is one of my favorite markets in the world, and it would be a loss to everyone if this market was diminished in any way, if the rents were raised, or if it was otherwise tooled with. But, if you can get rid of the greed mongers, that it a big step. Many, many hard working Thais generate a living from this market. There is more creativity at Chatuchak than in most other areas of Thailand, so create a situation where their livelihoods are improved. Cut out the middle man!

[BookMan]

I didn't know how Chatuchak worked until this thread...

Hard to see the elimination of the middle man... I'd say a more likely scenario is a re-jigging of who gets the best bits of the pie..

[Heng]

The SRT is good at collecting rent from a FEW tenants. It's one of those things.... you think that because you rent out a few of your vacant rooms that you'll be able to run an apartment complex with a thousand tenants (and often literally a thousand and one problems every single day). There is a reason why the gov't and large gov't organizations more often rely on subcontracting and concessions... it's because they don't know how (and even when they carbon copy someone else's management plan, they can't execute it) to manage the finer details.

Edited December 27, 2011 by Heng

[SAffer]

What an odd headline... "SRT wants to take over from BMA, raises rent"...

Pretty misleading.

The past situation has been that SRT leased the land to BMA (at a certain cost, I could not be bothered quoting figures right now), then BMA set up the Market Management, organised stall areas and streets, then (adding about 50%) leased almost all the stall areas to 6 families. Those families then added about 200% (per sq. mtre) and leased to individual stall owners.

The whole thing was set up in the past just to funnel money to 6 families. In reality, SRT taking over (if it leases directly to the stall owners, which seems to be the intention) cuts out both the middlemen (BMA and the 6 families), *possibly* lowers the rent to the stall operators, and increases the amount received by SRT, which they can use to offset their losses in offering the free train services.

The only losers are the 6 families who sub-let the space from the BMA.

Sounds like you haven't really got any proof of the 6 family allegation... so be it.

If, and this is a big 'if', what you say is true- I am sure it would improve the situation, and hopefully allow small stall owners to make a better living. I hope this is the case, and that the little people will benefit.

Knowing Thailand, and knowing the world; I sincerely doubt it.

[mccw]

Amazing how naive some posters are; it seems obvious this is all about taking over a lucrative money source. There's no mention of lowering rents, just renegotiation, most likely meaning increases. Looks to me like the BMA turned a piece of dirt in to a thriving Market for small traders and a huge success; now the greedy corrupt transport ministry wants to muscle in on the action, will probably jack up rents and kill the goose. Another point is this removes any local accountability and since the transport minister is appointed rather than elected this is anti democratic- the very opposite of what PTP love to proclaim they really want- again.

[Johpa]

This is very prime real estate and somebody wants to develop the land. There is probably more to this story than who is collecting the rents from small shop keepers.

[lannarebirth]

As far as I know the SRT are very good at providing trains that smell like piss, having a derailment somewhere about once per month and killing people at crossings with about the same regularity . Hey, let's see how they are at developmnent and retail. Couldn't be any worse, right?

[webfact]

Cabinet backs SRT to run Chatuchak

Watcharapong Thongrung,

Onpicha Boonnarong,

Thanatpong Khongsai

The Nation

BMA vows court battle as vendors stage protest outside Govt House

Business and political interests seem to be intertwined with the future of Chatuchak Market, which faced yet another upheaval yesterday when control was grabbed from the Bangkok Metropolitan Administration (BMA) and handed over to the State Railway of Thailand (SRT).

The BMA, currently run by the opposition Democrat Party, said it would put up a legal fight to hang on to Chatuchak, whose vendors staged a rally at Government House yesterday.

The Cabinet "acknowledged" SRT's plan to reclaim the market, which means that a new group will be in charge of leasing market stalls, not to mention the fact that the Democrats would lose a political tool.

A source at the Transport Ministry said the Cabinet's decision to hand the management of Chatuchak over to the SRT only paved the way for some new operator taking over the space-leasing duties.

The source said it is widely believed that vendors need a "good connection" before they can lease a space. Also, the space is leased and sub-leased on several levels and vendors end up paying anything between Bt11,000 and Bt20,000 per month.

In addition, the source doubted if the SRT benefited greatly from the Cabinet's decision, because now it had the additional responsibility of improving the market's landscape.

The holders of around 7,000 of the total 8,805 stalls have said they will continue leasing their space from the SRT. The vendors have reportedly agreed to pay Bt2,800 a month in leasing fees to SRT, in addition to Bt700 per month in management and garbage-collection costs.

The source said the ministry was planning to turn Chatuchak into a walking street.

A second source, a former SRT board member, said the BMA could take this case to the Administrative Court and seek protection for six months. According to the source, the Cabinet had overruled the 1979 contract between the BMA and SRT, and the only way to solve this problem was to seek a new resolution.

Under the State Railway of Thailand Act 2535 (1992) amendment, SRT would have to set up a separate company, with a registered capital of Bt50 million, to run the leasing business.

The BMA, meanwhile, is trying to hang on to Chatuchak Market, and will today seek legal advice on how it can fight the Cabinet's decision to put the market in SRT's hands on January 2, without the mandatory 60-day wait.

BMA Governor Sukhumbhand Paribatra said he would check details first before seeking legal advice. He also responded to Deputy Transport Minister Chatt Kuldiloke's comment that the BMA was being a thug by refusing to negotiate, saying that it wasn't up to him or Chatt to talk as there was a panel for this matter and that the city had not taken anyone's property.

Deputy Governor Pornthep Techapaiboon said the BMA had accepted the Cabinet's decision but would seek legal advice on how it can continue operating the market. He said the city's income would only drop by Bt20 million in terms of rent from market vendors.

Meanwhile, Pravit Wittayakha-jornsart led 100 some vendors to a rally outside Government House yesterday to demand that the authorities stick with the 1979 resolution to have the BMA run the market. They also called on the Transport Ministry and the BMA to jointly decide on the fees and extend leases by another 30 years, adding that they would keep fighting if the management were to be handed over to the SRT.

Another group of vendors, led by Nareumol Saehoon, also gathered at Government House to say they wanted the new management to be fair and extend the lease contract by 30 in a direct deal with the government.

-- The Nation 2011-12-28

[airconsult]

What an odd headline... "SRT wants to take over from BMA, raises rent"...

Pretty misleading.

The past situation has been that SRT leased the land to BMA (at a certain cost, I could not be bothered quoting figures right now), then BMA set up the Market Management, organised stall areas and streets, then (adding about 50%) leased almost all the stall areas to 6 families. Those families then added about 200% (per sq. mtre) and leased to individual stall owners.

The whole thing was set up in the past just to funnel money to 6 families. In reality, SRT taking over (if it leases directly to the stall owners, which seems to be the intention) cuts out both the middlemen (BMA and the 6 families), *possibly* lowers the rent to the stall operators, and increases the amount received by SRT, which they can use to offset their losses in offering the free train services.

The only losers are the 6 families who sub-let the space from the BMA.

Sounds like you haven't really got any proof of the 6 family allegation... so be it.

If, and this is a big 'if', what you say is true- I am sure it would improve the situation, and hopefully allow small stall owners to make a better living. I hope this is the case, and that the little people will benefit.

Knowing Thailand, and knowing the world; I sincerely doubt it.

Saffer, please review this link..... http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/522009-dont-let-vested-interests-spoil-bangkoks-chatuchak-market/

and at the link just above.....

Even the Nation' reporters know that most of the market is sub-let illegally.

If you mean hard-and-fast, incontrovertible truth.... does such really exist here in LOS? If I were to trot out the paperwork of the sub-leases, it would be very quickly argued in a kafkaesque manner that as those sub-leases are illegal, those papers have no legal standing and therefore are not evidence - makes your head spin sometimes. If you're looking for black/white - wrong place, grey/grey is generally where we are.

But it's not even *really* a major crime, sure, sub-letting is not supposed to be allowed under the terms of the BMA leases, but I'm sure BMA would argue that doing it this way they saved money by not managing so many leases. And traditionally, this is how the system worked in a semi-feudal way, those people would argue that they are providing a service to the stall owners as they provide BMA with the required proof of financial security, but don't demand such conditions from the individuals.

Cheers