Speaking English Campaign Is Just A Passing Fad: Thai Opinion

[thequietman]

many of my English conversation classes were cancelled last week because........................................ the students had to attend cheerleading classes for the sports day.

sort of shows you immediately, the importance the Thai education system puts on the study of the English language.

dont get me wrong, the school I work in has soooooooo many pretty waterfalls and flowers. Its a " to be number 1" school, so it has to be taken seriously.

Edited December 31, 2011 by thequietman

[inquisitive]

Why so much effort to teach English to a population that will never need it.

Maybe tops 5% of the population will need it and of those 5% only half will need to be proficient in it.

I live here in Chiang Mai and constantly find myself making purchases from Thai's who can not speak English.

I believe that the pressure to learn English stems from people who do not want to learn the Language of Thailand and are trying to get it so the clerk who sells them a clearly marked price item can explain to them what 200 baht means.

Thai's need to learn the basics Science Mathematics how to reason. English will always be avalable but a waste of money 95% of the time. Why not teach them Chinese?

I have no doubt that you are completely correct when you say that most Thais will never need English. But then again, how many of them will ever need advanced math? Or science? Or even Thai history? Heck, when was the last time anyone in Thailand really needed to know the name of the second king of the Ayuthaya period?

Fact is that darn near everything taught in school anywhere in the world is not used in adult life. Some of us use our science training, but never use the French we learned. Others use the French and never need the physics.

My point is that basic education is a matter of opening up doors for kids, letting them see what's in the room, and preparing them so they may enter if they choose. We have no way to tell in advance which kids will choose a path of science and which will choose one of art. And so the school system must teach everything and let the child decide which subjects to remember and which to let fall by.

If you don't teach English (or science, or math, or music) in school, then you are effectively barring that child from some of life's opportunities.

[Chopperboy]

I remember reading a Thai school book for English students.Two lines that stood out amongst all the other rubbish

"I perceived the fish to swim"

"The dog sits next to its matter"

The Thais are in a cultural and Linguistics vacuum - best just to leave them there!

[Rhys]

Until parents buy into this, support it, see the value of it, nothing will ever come. The English teachers, Thai and Westerners have their own challenges. The MOE, subsquent Thai government mouthpieces, spew out the same meaningless buzz phrase(s).

"Some" English programs are filled with students who should be in vocational training. Sadly, they are simply taking up space.

"Some" English programs even outside BKK taught by both Thai and Westerners are on the mark and should be left alone.

English learners, are emerging even outside of MUIC, CHULA, Thammasat.

• A motivated English learner does not need a populalist policy, the student will find their way. Leave the English programs alone that excell all by their lonesome.. infact, may the MOE get thee farther away, before the S it up.
  

• Students are making their choices, let their construct their on realities.
  

• Does not matter how many students per class (MOE Credo). What will it take 50 - 100 - 300 student per class, especially in general skills introductory course, for the so called Adminstrators to acknowlege opps we have a problem. Take the finger out of the apple core.
  
• Until the the Minister of Education, is an appointment based on qualifications, rather than.. awh.. a political appointment, Thai Educational standards shall always remain right where they are....
  
• What students need more than anything else, critical thinking skills.... Some students will amaze you and some you will merely encourage.
  

[sparebox2]

"Good English teachers are hard to find these days."

This is not true. Thailand is just not prepared to pay for a good english teacher from UK, which typically coast 200,000 + Baht per month. What Thai govt pay is between 15,000 to 30,000 Baht per months, which only attract Khao San tourist interested only to extend their visa, and not teaching.

[Scott]

I remember reading a Thai school book for English students.Two lines that stood out amongst all the other rubbish

"I perceived the fish to swim"

"The dog sits next to its matter"

The Thais are in a cultural and Linguistics vacuum - best just to leave them there!

Things tend to get sucked into a vacuum. Our job is to make sure that what gets sucked in is the good, rather than the bad.

[lannarebirth]

Last year, around this time, I was in a university in Thailand for a promotion day they were holding for their university. I walked around until I found the English Education majors. I stopped and had a chat with them. They asked where I was from, so I said, "The United States." They looked puzzled, so I repeated it two times. The only male student at the tent spoke up and said, "Ahh France."

So you don't embarass yourself further, if asked where you're from in the future, tell the America, which is correct, while The United States is not.

[Warhammer820]

Last year, around this time, I was in a university in Thailand for a promotion day they were holding for their university. I walked around until I found the English Education majors. I stopped and had a chat with them. They asked where I was from, so I said, "The United States." They looked puzzled, so I repeated it two times. The only male student at the tent spoke up and said, "Ahh France."

So you don't embarass yourself further, if asked where you're from in the future, tell the America, which is correct, while The United States is not.

Well both are incorrect by names alone. The real name is The United States of America. There are two American continents.

[lannarebirth]

Last year, around this time, I was in a university in Thailand for a promotion day they were holding for their university. I walked around until I found the English Education majors. I stopped and had a chat with them. They asked where I was from, so I said, "The United States." They looked puzzled, so I repeated it two times. The only male student at the tent spoke up and said, "Ahh France."

So you don't embarass yourself further, if asked where you're from in the future, tell the America, which is correct, while The United States is not.

Well both are incorrect by names alone. The real name is The United States of America. There are two American continents.

Most people don't include these descriptive prefixes . Like you hardly ever hear anyone say the are from the Estados Unidos de Mexico, or the Principality of Monaco or the Kingdom of Thailand or The Peoples Republic of China.

[Warhammer820]

Last year, around this time, I was in a university in Thailand for a promotion day they were holding for their university. I walked around until I found the English Education majors. I stopped and had a chat with them. They asked where I was from, so I said, "The United States." They looked puzzled, so I repeated it two times. The only male student at the tent spoke up and said, "Ahh France."

So you don't embarass yourself further, if asked where you're from in the future, tell the America, which is correct, while The United States is not.

Well both are incorrect by names alone. The real name is The United States of America. There are two American continents.

Most people don't include these descriptive prefixes . Like you hardly ever hear anyone say the are from the Estados Unidos de Mexico, or the Principality of Monaco or the Kingdom of Thailand or The Peoples Republic of China.

Are you from the US? Most people I know say The United States. Thai people were the only ones that I met who strictly called it America.

Edited January 1, 2012 by Warhammer820

[lannarebirth]

Are you from the US? Most people I know say The United States. Thai people were the only ones that I met who strictly called it America.

Yes I am and I didn't mean to pick a nit with you, and it's true you can call it any of those things, any of which would make you understood by most parties. "America" tends to work best in countries where English is not widely spoken and the society is more insular, like Thailand.

[Warhammer820]

Yeah I understand, I just did not know that other countries did not know that we had The US in our name.

Edited January 1, 2012 by Warhammer820

[Somtamnication]

As are Mexico and Brazil. All are U.S.

Irrelevant, however, as Thais will forever believe that the Sun revolves around Thailand. They now believe that by 2015, they will have a handle on their English. It has taken Malaysia 2 decades, since the mid 80s, to speak as good as they do, with government backing.

Here, the govt are as xenophobic as their residents. With one of them saying that making English the second language is akin to admitting to colonialism, they will never get it. With the O-NET tests coming up in February, wait till you see the English tests. A laughable matter.

[happysanook]

almost choked with laughter regarding 'better trained teachers / well thought out curriculum if thai are to learn english'

they need to completely turn their culture on it's head if they're to learn ANYTHING...let alone a foreign language.

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[Anyse]

A neighbor's son came to see me for a weekend and even brough his English book with him. His class in on page 76 and I took a simple exercise from page 12. He simple could not do it or even figure out what it was that needed to be done! Well, did he sleep through that class? It was a very simple exercise! So, from this, I know that they are wasting their time by not making English a complete part of the curriculum with English work done in every class throughout the school day, not just some rote work done for 45 minutes with no indivitual attenttion to correct or to guide students in English individually . . . . Sad.

[sanuk21]

you ask a native speaker of the language. which includes americans, south americans, irish, scottish, australians.

South Americans speak either Castilian (Spanish) or Portuguese. Maybe you mean South Africans?

Sanuk

[kanderson]

Last year, around this time, I was in a university in Thailand for a promotion day they were holding for their university. I walked around until I found the English Education majors. I stopped and had a chat with them. They asked where I was from, so I said, "The United States." They looked puzzled, so I repeated it two times. The only male student at the tent spoke up and said, "Ahh France."

I feel that having teachers who have learned to speak Thai (at least a little bit) can save time. Thais might usually say "ma jak America"

- I come from America - a teachable moment - ma jak United States - I come from xyz etc..

[Jingthing]

Are you from the US? Most people I know say The United States. Thai people were the only ones that I met who strictly called it America.

Yes I am and I didn't mean to pick a nit with you, and it's true you can call it any of those things, any of which would make you understood by most parties. "America" tends to work best in countries where English is not widely spoken and the society is more insular, like Thailand.

I beg to differ. When Americans speak to other English speakers they quite commonly just say U.S. and are of course understood. If Thais want to really learn English, why not learn what Americans, from the most populous native English speaking country, actually say to people who speak English? BTW, in Latin America the PC thing to say is simply Estados Unidos. No America. Yes, I do say America here to Thai speakers as I'm not an English teacher. I also know most Thai so called English speakers wouldn't know U.S. and would resist being taught about it as what they think is correct is so ingrained. What really cracks me up is how often Thais are correcting my English pronunciation towards Thai English pronunciation! Edited January 1, 2012 by Jingthing

[Somtamnication]

you ask a native speaker of the language. which includes americans, south americans, irish, scottish, australians.

South Americans speak either Castilian (Spanish) or Portuguese. Maybe you mean South Africans?

Sanuk

Please tell the people of Guyana. They have been wrong for centuries!

[simon43]

Why so much effort to teach English to a population that will never need it

The fact that the above statement is probably true, (and the reasons why it's true) is truly depressing.

Simon

[Weally]

I guess the government targets on young generation especially students. The old generation who doesn't need the new language doesn't need to participate, I believe.

Don't like a lack of improving attitude of some Thai people myself. Which makes it hard for the system to get through.

Edited January 2, 2012 by Weally

[mijan24]

I remember reading a Thai school book for English students.Two lines that stood out amongst all the other rubbish

"I perceived the fish to swim"

"The dog sits next to its matter"

The Thais are in a cultural and Linguistics vacuum - best just to leave them there!

Things tend to get sucked into a vacuum. Our job is to make sure that what gets sucked in is the good, rather than the bad.

I would have said "things" are pushed into the void (vacuum) isn't our job to see all receive equal opportunity, to emerge better than when they tumbled in.

Only my 2 bahts worth I am not a teacher yet I taught in Australia, Papua New Guinea and Thailand for more years than I care to remember and I enjoyed the outcomes.

[mijan24]

I guess the government targets on young generation especially students. The old generation who doesn't need the new language doesn't need to participate, I believe.

Don't like a lack of improving attitude of some Thai people myself. Which makes it hard for the system to get through.

Weally lets hope you are not here teaching English because if you are sorry to say this but you are part of the problem certainly not part of the solution.

Just hark back to your post and re-read what you have written "I guess the government targets on the younger generation especially students - (the young generation are the students).

You go on to say the older generation doesn't need (did you mean "do not" or even "will not") etc.

Matey as an earlier poster said us Australians are not good to learn from and maybe that is true but one thing for sure when a Thai person asks where do I come from I answer Australia if there is any bewilderment I follow up with Not Austria and repronounce Australia if still not clear of course I mention jing joe (kangaroo) by this time all lights are on and the bells are ringing.

Edited January 2, 2012 by mijan24

[mahtin]

"almost all Thai students study the language at their schools for at least 12 years, throughout their adolescence."

Whlst agreeing about the prolonged adolescence, I take issue with the precept; most kids around here leave school early.

[ovaltina]

English is the language of Medicine, and if you spend any time in hospital in Thailand as I have, you will hear Thai doctors and Nurses speaking fluent Thai with each other, interspersed with English words for conditions and medicines & procedures. It is especially obvious to the listener if you don't understand Thai, and you hear an endless stream of meaningless words punctuated by "epilepsy", "aspirin", "seizure", "IV" etc.etc. Even when words exist in Thai, the tendency among doctors is to use the English word, and of course that is essential for most corporate medicinal brands which are in English.

For any Nurse or Doctor in Thailand it can make the difference between life or death of the patient if they don't understand *good* English, regardless of if the patient is a Thai or foreigner. If a patient is Thai it will help them greatly to know how to pronounce their medicine names in English, and to understand for example Self-Help books/websites which also tell patients what to do using key-words in English.

English is my second language & I use it to tell non-English doctors my underlying disorders, even though neither the doctor nor myself are English.

Even so, fluency in English for Thai people - while imho very important - is a LOT further down the priority list after things like safe roads, pollution controls, greater legal and political transparency, & the removal of the mafia from the top slots.

[Weally]

I guess the government targets on young generation especially students. The old generation who doesn't need the new language doesn't need to participate, I believe.

Don't like a lack of improving attitude of some Thai people myself. Which makes it hard for the system to get through.

Weally lets hope you are not here teaching English because if you are sorry to say this but you are part of the problem certainly not part of the solution.

Just hark back to your post and re-read what you have written "I guess the government targets on the younger generation especially students - (the young generation are the students).

You go on to say the older generation doesn't need (did you mean "do not" or even "will not") etc.

Matey as an earlier poster said us Australians are not good to learn from and maybe that is true but one thing for sure when a Thai person asks where do I come from I answer Australia if there is any bewilderment I follow up with Not Austria and repronounce Australia if still not clear of course I mention jing joe (kangaroo) by this time all lights are on and the bells are ringing.

Hi, I'm glad that I am not a teacher and I am very happy to hear that the government sees the importance of the English language (about time!!!), however, not all could do it as to what I mentioned above that for old generation who doesn't need it doesn't need to participate; especially those who live in villages, would they use the language among themselves - I guess not, aye!!. Have you ever spoken with the old generation or married people about taking further study? Very rare that they would say ' yes, I would love to study new things so that I can improve my life ' but you would get different answers if you asked young generation and who want to improve.

Though, the government also needs to look at something more beneficial apart from encouraging Thai English teachers to teach one day a week. It is not enough. You need it every day!!!! And you think that old generation would go to school and talk to teachers? My suggestion is the government should cut down some rubbish TV shows and start broadcasting more decent and educational programs. For example, Cartoon, kid series and so on in English - something easy for Thais to understand. You can't just get the teacher to teach you a new language in the classroom and nothing else.

It may take 20 or more years for Thailand population to be able to use English fluently all over Thailand. I hope you know what I mean.

P.S. - Just wanted to also say that most Thai people say that their life ends after marrying especially women. A lot of them don't want to pursue anything but take care of their families.

Edited January 2, 2012 by Weally

[landofidiots]

Im surprised (well not really) at how many Thais can't even understand each other when they are speaking Thai never mind English. Find a way to teach common sense first then work on English.

[jshorts]

"When Thais speak English, they almost always carry a distinctive Thai accent."

I have noticed this with a lot of Americans, British, South African etc also. Are we Aussies the only ones that speak without an accent? Just kidding, not bashing anyone. My son is always correcting me on how I pronounce certain words. He speaks fluent english/thai at home and is also taught at school by Thai's and says he is constantly being corrected by his teachers in the pronounciation of english words. It hard to tell him that it is the Thai teachers who are teaching him wrong. When we speak with the teachers at his school the farang teachers will say his english language is excellent but the Thai teachers tell us that he is struggling to grasp the english language.

"It hard to tell him that . . ."

Where is your pride?

[sparebox2]

I guess the government targets on young generation especially students. The old generation who doesn't need the new language doesn't need to participate, I believe.

Don't like a lack of improving attitude of some Thai people myself. Which makes it hard for the system to get through.

Forget the older generation. It is already too late for them. Just listen to Dr. Seri, or Surayud, etc.

[jshorts]

A lot of people talk about the quality of English teaching and content in Thailand. But it seems to be a never-ending discussion.

Never ending discussions seem to be the norm in most areas of how folks lives could be improved over here.

Back in the UK me and my pals all used to ride big sports bikes. One of our group who didn't was always on about how he was going to get one too. He'd read all the bike mags, go to the dealers and get brochures, ask the sales staff about this model or that model.

We all knew he'd never do it. Multiply that by 100000000 and you've got Thailand.

We are discussing the quality of English language education and you write "me and my palls all used to ride . . ."

Huh?