Snacks That Are Okay..

[Tolley]

Raw almonds are good.. but really calorie dense too. I believe 350 cals for just 100 grams. That is near the level of oatmeal. And i add milk with oatmeal to give me a healthy breakfast and it fills. I don't see almonds doing the same thing.

Almonds are nearly 50% fat by weight, so 100 grams will provide about 575 cals.

It's the same with all seeds and nuts. Not a good idea on a fat loss diet as you'd provide too high a percentage of your daily calorie allowance in what appears to be a small snack.

Nuts and seeds in small amounts are quite good during the day as they stop people eating much worse things and they have the added benefit of being very nutritous.

Secondly we really shouldn't be talking weight loss program at all we should be eating these foods as part of a regular diet and a lifestyle regime that includes other nutritous foods and regular exercise.

[pumpum]

Raw almonds are good.. but really calorie dense too. I believe 350 cals for just 100 grams. That is near the level of oatmeal. And i add milk with oatmeal to give me a healthy breakfast and it fills. I don't see almonds doing the same thing.

Almonds are nearly 50% fat by weight, so 100 grams will provide about 575 cals.

It's the same with all seeds and nuts. Not a good idea on a fat loss diet as you'd provide too high a percentage of your daily calorie allowance in what appears to be a small snack.

Nuts and seeds in small amounts are quite good during the day as they stop people eating much worse things and they have the added benefit of being very nutritous.

Secondly we really shouldn't be talking weight loss program at all we should be eating these foods as part of a regular diet and a lifestyle regime that includes other nutritous foods and regular exercise.

Exactly. Nuts and seeds (preferably raw and unsalted) should be part of a healthy person's long-term diet plan. They are calorie dense but also NUTRITION DENSE. I have always done well when on diets by eating nuts and seeds in moderation.

[pumpum]

dairy (which is pretty fattening, I might add, b/c it is designed to quickly fatten up baby cows).

We hear this myth all the time. I've never seen any scientific evidence that cow's milk has magical properties which increase weight gain more than other foods with the same fat, protein and carb content. Sure, it's a calorie dense food with a big hit of fat, carbs and protein. Perhaps the only reason people think it's has magical weight gaining properties is that you drink it so it doesn't feel like a meal so it is consumed in addition to meals, not in place of.

Perhaps it worked for you as you were able to limit your calories for the rest of the day, but generally drinking liquid meals is the wrong way to go when a person is trying to lose bodyfat. It digests too quickly compared to a solid meal, leaving the person hungry again sooner. There's no point consuming a very large percentage of your daily calorie allowance in one hit with a liquid meal first thing in the morning... just as consuming calorie dense nuts and seeds will get you to your calorie limit too quickly.

Regular vigorous exercise is extremely important for anyone wanting to lose bodyfat because it allows more calories to be consumed which in turn makes it easier to obtain daily nutrient requirements.

Green smoothies helped me lose 25 pounds when nothing else does. Also, not sure I would consider the green smoothie to make up the "bulk" of my daily calories...and absolutely did NOT make me hungry sooner - quite the opposite. In fact, I could easily wait until 2 PM to consume lunch, when having a green smoothie for breakfast.

[pumpum]

dairy (which is pretty fattening, I might add, b/c it is designed to quickly fatten up baby cows).

We hear this myth all the time. I've never seen any scientific evidence that cow's milk has magical properties which increase weight gain more than other foods with the same fat, protein and carb content. Sure, it's a calorie dense food with a big hit of fat, carbs and protein. Perhaps the only reason people think it's has magical weight gaining properties is that you drink it so it doesn't feel like a meal so it is consumed in addition to meals, not in place of.

Perhaps it worked for you as you were able to limit your calories for the rest of the day, but generally drinking liquid meals is the wrong way to go when a person is trying to lose bodyfat. It digests too quickly compared to a solid meal, leaving the person hungry again sooner. There's no point consuming a very large percentage of your daily calorie allowance in one hit with a liquid meal first thing in the morning... just as consuming calorie dense nuts and seeds will get you to your calorie limit too quickly.

Regular vigorous exercise is extremely important for anyone wanting to lose bodyfat because it allows more calories to be consumed which in turn makes it easier to obtain daily nutrient requirements.

Also, it does not require a lot of thought to understand why cow's milk is designed to fatten...and therefore will also fatten up a human. Milk is considered the ultimate "building" food...in that it is designed, by nature, to support a THREE HUNDRED PERCENT WEIGHT GAIN over a year's time in a calf! There are over 95 hormones and other substances in it that are designed to do this, and they exist whether you drink skimmed milk or whatever else...

If you are looking to lose weight, you probably don't want to "build", right? Cow's milk is, in fact, better at "fattening" than human milk...b/c humans are much smaller than cows.

[robblok]

dairy (which is pretty fattening, I might add, b/c it is designed to quickly fatten up baby cows).

We hear this myth all the time. I've never seen any scientific evidence that cow's milk has magical properties which increase weight gain more than other foods with the same fat, protein and carb content. Sure, it's a calorie dense food with a big hit of fat, carbs and protein. Perhaps the only reason people think it's has magical weight gaining properties is that you drink it so it doesn't feel like a meal so it is consumed in addition to meals, not in place of.

Perhaps it worked for you as you were able to limit your calories for the rest of the day, but generally drinking liquid meals is the wrong way to go when a person is trying to lose bodyfat. It digests too quickly compared to a solid meal, leaving the person hungry again sooner. There's no point consuming a very large percentage of your daily calorie allowance in one hit with a liquid meal first thing in the morning... just as consuming calorie dense nuts and seeds will get you to your calorie limit too quickly.

Regular vigorous exercise is extremely important for anyone wanting to lose bodyfat because it allows more calories to be consumed which in turn makes it easier to obtain daily nutrient requirements.

Also, it does not require a lot of thought to understand why cow's milk is designed to fatten...and therefore will also fatten up a human. Milk is considered the ultimate "building" food...in that it is designed, by nature, to support a THREE HUNDRED PERCENT WEIGHT GAIN over a year's time in a calf! There are over 95 hormones and other substances in it that are designed to do this, and they exist whether you drink skimmed milk or whatever else...t

If you are looking to lose weight, you probably don't want to "build", right? Cow's milke is, in fact, better at "fattening" than human milk...b/c humans are much smaller than cows.

Its not often that i read complete nonsense. Cows milk better at fattening then human milk because cows are bigger. How about elephant milk. Seals are smaller as humans but their milk is much more fattening.

Come on read a bit and learn.

[tropo]

dairy (which is pretty fattening, I might add, b/c it is designed to quickly fatten up baby cows).

We hear this myth all the time. I've never seen any scientific evidence that cow's milk has magical properties which increase weight gain more than other foods with the same fat, protein and carb content. Sure, it's a calorie dense food with a big hit of fat, carbs and protein. Perhaps the only reason people think it's has magical weight gaining properties is that you drink it so it doesn't feel like a meal so it is consumed in addition to meals, not in place of.

Perhaps it worked for you as you were able to limit your calories for the rest of the day, but generally drinking liquid meals is the wrong way to go when a person is trying to lose bodyfat. It digests too quickly compared to a solid meal, leaving the person hungry again sooner. There's no point consuming a very large percentage of your daily calorie allowance in one hit with a liquid meal first thing in the morning... just as consuming calorie dense nuts and seeds will get you to your calorie limit too quickly.

Regular vigorous exercise is extremely important for anyone wanting to lose bodyfat because it allows more calories to be consumed which in turn makes it easier to obtain daily nutrient requirements.

Also, it does not require a lot of thought to understand why cow's milk is designed to fatten...and therefore will also fatten up a human. Milk is considered the ultimate "building" food...in that it is designed, by nature, to support a THREE HUNDRED PERCENT WEIGHT GAIN over a year's time in a calf! There are over 95 hormones and other substances in it that are designed to do this, and they exist whether you drink skimmed milk or whatever else...

If you are looking to lose weight, you probably don't want to "build", right? Cow's milk is, in fact, better at "fattening" than human milk...b/c humans are much smaller than cows.

As I said, we hear this ridiculous myth too often.

Cow's milk has no magical properties over any other milk. If you can prove otherwise, please supply the scientific studies. I suppose you didn't factor in how much milk baby cows drink.

Here's a good idea for a study. You could feed one test group goat's milk and another cow's milk in equal quantity and monitor weight gain. According to your simplistic thinking the cow's milk group will put on more weight because baby cows are bigger.

Humans have been drinking cow's milk for thousands of years. It's a great food. You can gain weight drinking it, you can lose weight drinking it or you can stay just the same drinking it. It all comes down to how many calories you consume.

Skim milk can be a dieter's best friend. I have no problems losing bodyfat while drinking it. I couldn't live without it.

[tropo]

Green smoothies helped me lose 25 pounds when nothing else does. Also, not sure I would consider the green smoothie to make up the "bulk" of my daily calories...and absolutely did NOT make me hungry sooner - quite the opposite. In fact, I could easily wait until 2 PM to consume lunch, when having a green smoothie for breakfast.

I don't know how fat you were, but if you'd had a normal solid meal instead of your calorie dense green smoothie you may have lost more weight than you did. It's impossible for you to know the difference as you cannot go back in time to test another method. The fact that one system worked for you doesn't mean another may not have worked even better.

If you tried my fat loss diet you'd probably put on 50 lbs. It's all a matter of calories in - calories out.

[pumpum]

_{Cow's milk-based formula causes babies to gain weight faster, which leads to higher risk of obesity and diabetes later in life, a new study suggests.}

<sub>Most of us have heard that formula-fed babies gain more weight than breast-fed infants, but the seven-month study of 64 babies, published in Pediatrics, found that cow's milk-based formula -- the kind most moms use -- made babies two pounds heavier than protein hydrolysates-based formula. Typically, moms only use protein-based formula if the baby is allergic to cow’s milk. (The study didn’t test soy-based formula, which is another popular choice.)

The researchers from the Monell Chemical Senses Center in Philadelphia don’t know exactly why the cow's milk formula had this effect -- it could be because cow's milk is more difficult for the human body to break down. What they do know is that too many babies are obese, and that can lead to greater health risks later in life. "Numerous studies have shown that rapid rates of growth during the first year are linked to obesity, metabolic syndrome, mortality," study researcher Julie Mennella told My Health News Daily. "Lifelong heath begins during infancy."</sub>

_{Read More http://www.ivillage.com/cows-milk-formula-linked-rapid-weight-gain/6-a-311069#ixzz1ppJ4Knho}

[pumpum]

Study: More Milk Means More Weight Gain

The National Dairy Council claims drinking milk helps people lose weight. (By Tracy A. Woodward -- The Washington Post)

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By Rob SteinWashington Post Staff Writer

Tuesday, June 7, 2005

Children who drink more than three servings of milk each day are prone to becoming overweight, according to a large new study that undermines a heavily advertised dairy industry claim that milk helps people lose weight.

The study of more than 12,000 children nationwide found that the more milk they drank, the more weight they gained: Those consuming more than three servings each day were about 35 percent more likely to become overweight than those who drank one or two.

"The take-home message is that children should not be drinking milk as a means of losing weight or trying to control weight," said Catherine S. Berkey of Harvard Medical School and Brigham and Women's Hospital in Boston, who led the study, the largest to examine the question in children.

The National Dairy Council has spent $200 million since 2003 to promote the idea that milk can help people lose weight. Some research has suggested that calcium or other elements in milk may cause the body to make less fat and speed its elimination, but the studies produced mixed results.

"I went into this project expecting that drinking milk would have some weight benefit for children. So I was surprised when it turned out the way it did," said Berkey, whose findings are being published in the June issue of the journal Archives of Pediatrics & Adolescent Medicine. "The studies are all over the place, but the dairy industry tells children and adults, 'Drink more milk and you will lose weight.' I think that's misleading."

The dairy industry disputed the idea that the new study challenges its ads, saying it had said only that adults may be able to lose more weight if they drink milk while cutting calories.

[pumpum]

Got milk? For weight loss, don't bother

May 2, 2008 | 9:13am

{C}

Posing for a "Got Milk?" ad wearing a milk mustache has become a symbol of stardom. Brooke Shields is the latest "Got Milk" cover girl, following Glenn Close, Mariska Hargitay and Laila Ali. But some nutritionists are warning consumers they won't achieve a Brooke Shields-like body by consuming dairy products.

In a lengthy review published Thursday in the journal Nutrition Reviews, researchers concluded that consuming calcium or dairy products does not help people lose weight or maintain their current weight. Of the 49 studies analyzed, they said, two showed dairy consumption was linked with weight gain and 41 showed no effect. The only studies that show dairy consumption contributes to weight loss were funded by the dairy industry, they said.

Last year, the Federal Trade Commission forced two national dairy organizations to stop claiming that dairy consumption can cause weight loss. Now the "Got Milk" ads state:

"Studies suggest the nutrients in three glasses of lowfat or fat free milk a day can help maintain a healthy weight."

Consumers would do well not to be swayed by a milk mustache on a pretty face. On the other hand, the lead author of the current paper in Nutrition Reviews, Dr. Amy Joy Lanou, is a senior nutrition scientist with the Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine. That group is vehemently anti-dairy and believes that dairy products are not needed in the diet at all.

If we can find someone who is unbiased on this, we'll get back to you.

--Shari Roan

Photo: Milk Processor Education Program / Associated Press

[pumpum]

Green smoothies helped me lose 25 pounds when nothing else does. Also, not sure I would consider the green smoothie to make up the "bulk" of my daily calories...and absolutely did NOT make me hungry sooner - quite the opposite. In fact, I could easily wait until 2 PM to consume lunch, when having a green smoothie for breakfast.

I don't know how fat you were, but if you'd had a normal solid meal instead of your calorie dense green smoothie you may have lost more weight than you did. It's impossible for you to know the difference as you cannot go back in time to test another method. The fact that one system worked for you doesn't mean another may not have worked even better.

If you tried my fat loss diet you'd probably put on 50 lbs. It's all a matter of calories in - calories out.

I didn't need to lose more weight than I did. I got down to 120 pounds this way!

[pumpum]

Dairy Consumption: The Effects on Diabetes, Obesity, and Heart Disease in Women

The British Women's Heart and Health Study examined 4,286 British women ranging in age from 60 to 79 for links to the Metabolic Syndrome. The Metabolic Syndrome was defined as those women who had Type 2 Diabetes or Pre-Diabetes (insulin resistance or high fasting glucose) and, in addition, at least two of the following: Obesity, Hypertension, and Lipid Disorders (i.e. high triglycerides or low HDL). The results were promising. Those women who avoided milk were about half as likely to have the Metabolic Syndrome when compared to milk drinkers. The non-milk drinkers benefited from lower insulin resistance levels, lower triglyceride levels, lower BMI’s (an indicator for obesity) and higher levels of that healthy HDL cholesterol.

[tropo]

Green smoothies helped me lose 25 pounds when nothing else does. Also, not sure I would consider the green smoothie to make up the "bulk" of my daily calories...and absolutely did NOT make me hungry sooner - quite the opposite. In fact, I could easily wait until 2 PM to consume lunch, when having a green smoothie for breakfast.

I don't know how fat you were, but if you'd had a normal solid meal instead of your calorie dense green smoothie you may have lost more weight than you did. It's impossible for you to know the difference as you cannot go back in time to test another method. The fact that one system worked for you doesn't mean another may not have worked even better.

If you tried my fat loss diet you'd probably put on 50 lbs. It's all a matter of calories in - calories out.

I didn't need to lose more weight than I did. I got down to 120 pounds this way!

120 lbs?? Yikes! You're a waif. Get into some of that full cream milk.

[tropo]

Study: More Milk Means More Weight Gain

The National Dairy Council claims drinking milk helps people lose weight. (By Tracy A. Woodward -- The Washington Post)

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By Rob SteinWashington Post Staff Writer

Tuesday, June 7, 2005

Children who drink more than three servings of milk each day are prone to becoming overweight, according to a large new study that undermines a heavily advertised dairy industry claim that milk helps people lose weight.

The study of more than 12,000 children nationwide found that the more milk they drank, the more weight they gained: Those consuming more than three servings each day were about 35 percent more likely to become overweight than those who drank one or two.

"The take-home message is that children should not be drinking milk as a means of losing weight or trying to control weight," said Catherine S. Berkey of Harvard Medical School and Brigham and Women's Hospital in Boston, who led the study, the largest to examine the question in children.

The National Dairy Council has spent $200 million since 2003 to promote the idea that milk can help people lose weight. Some research has suggested that calcium or other elements in milk may cause the body to make less fat and speed its elimination, but the studies produced mixed results.

"I went into this project expecting that drinking milk would have some weight benefit for children. So I was surprised when it turned out the way it did," said Berkey, whose findings are being published in the June issue of the journal Archives of Pediatrics & Adolescent Medicine. "The studies are all over the place, but the dairy industry tells children and adults, 'Drink more milk and you will lose weight.' I think that's misleading."

The dairy industry disputed the idea that the new study challenges its ads, saying it had said only that adults may be able to lose more weight if they drink milk while cutting calories.

We've established that you know how to use Google. I've been reading anti-milk articles for 30 years and I'm well aware of the general arguments. I really don't need you to start posting them up here as I can find them myself.

The point you made was that milk has some magical properties where it can increase weight beyond it's mere calorie and nutrient content. i.e. because a baby cow is bigger than a baby goat (or baby human) the cow's milk has greater weight gaining properties.

That is what I wanted to see scientific proof for - I'm talking about scientific studies or trials.

[Tolley]

On a more general note about cows milk and adults ....I would avoid it all costs. Homeginised pasteurised milk is not good for you at all. Quite to the contrary in fact. And there are a number of scientific studies done independently of the dairy industry to support this.

The only dairy that is really worthwhile consuming is good quality yogurt.

[pumpum]

Study: More Milk Means More Weight Gain

The National Dairy Council claims drinking milk helps people lose weight. (By Tracy A. Woodward -- The Washington Post)

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By Rob SteinWashington Post Staff Writer

Tuesday, June 7, 2005

Children who drink more than three servings of milk each day are prone to becoming overweight, according to a large new study that undermines a heavily advertised dairy industry claim that milk helps people lose weight.

The study of more than 12,000 children nationwide found that the more milk they drank, the more weight they gained: Those consuming more than three servings each day were about 35 percent more likely to become overweight than those who drank one or two.

"The take-home message is that children should not be drinking milk as a means of losing weight or trying to control weight," said Catherine S. Berkey of Harvard Medical School and Brigham and Women's Hospital in Boston, who led the study, the largest to examine the question in children.

The National Dairy Council has spent $200 million since 2003 to promote the idea that milk can help people lose weight. Some research has suggested that calcium or other elements in milk may cause the body to make less fat and speed its elimination, but the studies produced mixed results.

"I went into this project expecting that drinking milk would have some weight benefit for children. So I was surprised when it turned out the way it did," said Berkey, whose findings are being published in the June issue of the journal Archives of Pediatrics & Adolescent Medicine. "The studies are all over the place, but the dairy industry tells children and adults, 'Drink more milk and you will lose weight.' I think that's misleading."

The dairy industry disputed the idea that the new study challenges its ads, saying it had said only that adults may be able to lose more weight if they drink milk while cutting calories.

We've established that you know how to use Google. I've been reading anti-milk articles for 30 years and I'm well aware of the general arguments. I really don't need you to start posting them up here as I can find them myself.

The point you made was that milk has some magical properties where it can increase weight beyond it's mere calorie and nutrient content. i.e. because a baby cow is bigger than a baby goat (or baby human) the cow's milk has greater weight gaining properties.

That is what I wanted to see scientific proof for - I'm talking about scientific studies or trials.

You totally missed my point and misunderstood my argument - I am trying to say that PEOPLE (or animals) who are NOT BABIES should not be consuming a substance that has evovled over time with the express purpose of nourishing and fattening! Unless, of course, the human would like to be fattened up as if he/she were growing from newborn size to regular human! Do you understand that that is the ONLY THING that milk is designed to do? - take a baby being from infant to childhood? And how does it do that...by being very fattening and containing hormones and compounds designed to do this in the best interest of the baby - nature is a survivor and milk is its weapon to plump up little ones! I think it's a pretty clear cut issue myself.

[pumpum]

Also, in addition to the natural hormones and substances designed to plump up the milk drinker, milk, of course, contains TONS of added hormones that are also going to - unnaturally - plump up the drinker. For example the hormones given to cows ALL THE TIME to keep them lactating. You drink milk, you are drinking that fattening and sickening hormone residue too...even if it's skimmed milk.

[pumpum]

Here's a tip - cows don't lactate for their entire lives naturally or normally...they have to be pumped full of hormones to do that. And you, my friend, are unfortunately drinking it all in when you have a glass.

[pumpum]

Also, I will be gathering my research on the compounds in milk that are expressly designed to fatten...and in the meantime, would appreciate it if you could gather me some names of species besides humans who continue to drink milk (or even better, another species' milk) beyond their infancy and earliest childhood. Much appreciated!

[tropo]

You totally missed my point and misunderstood my argument - I am trying to say that PEOPLE (or animals) who are NOT BABIES should not be consuming a substance that has evovled over time with the express purpose of nourishing and fattening! Unless, of course, the human would like to be fattened up as if he/she were growing from newborn size to regular human! Do you understand that that is the ONLY THING that milk is designed to do? - take a baby being from infant to childhood? And how does it do that...by being very fattening and containing hormones and compounds designed to do this in the best interest of the baby - nature is a survivor and milk is its weapon to plump up little ones! I think it's a pretty clear cut issue myself.

You're almost religiously attached to the idea that cow's milk is only for baby cows, yet humans have been consuming animal milk in one form or another since the dawn of civilization.

What food was designed for humans?

The answer will depend on your fundamental beliefs. Obviously if you're an evolutionist then you'll believe that humans evolved drinking animal milk. If you're a creationist you'll have to believe that animal milk was designed as food suitable for humans as they were drinking it 6,000 years ago in the Middle East. Heard of the expression - "land of milk and honey"? I'm sure they weren't referring to human milk.

Either way, you're fixated on the idea that cow's milk is only for baby cows. I disagree.

I'm still waiting for the scientific evidence that cow's milk fattens up people faster than other animal milks, proving your theory that cow's milk has magical fattening properties due to your special 95 hormone and 300% weight gain of baby cows in their first year theory. If we could get elephant milk, would we fatten up even faster?

Until then, I'll stick with my theory - that milk is a source of fat, protein (whey and casein) and carbohydrates (lactose) with no particular magical fattening properties other than those normally attributed to consuming these macro nutrients.

[tropo]

Also, I will be gathering my research on the compounds in milk that are expressly designed to fatten...and in the meantime, would appreciate it if you could gather me some names of species besides humans who continue to drink milk (or even better, another species' milk) beyond their infancy and earliest childhood. Much appreciated!

There's no need to provide a list because we're discussing HUMANS, who have been drinking animal milk since the dawn of civilization as mentioned in my reply above.

[tropo]

Here's a tip - cows don't lactate for their entire lives naturally or normally...they have to be pumped full of hormones to do that. And you, my friend, are unfortunately drinking it all in when you have a glass.

The first point is irrelevant because humans have been farming milk producing animals for thousands of years.

The second point - yes, I would need to find organically produced cow's milk to avoid some of the nasty stuff modern farmers use, however, most food you and I eat has bad stuff in it, including your vegetables.

[tropo]

On a more general note about cows milk and adults ....I would avoid it all costs. Homeginised pasteurised milk is not good for you at all. Quite to the contrary in fact. And there are a number of scientific studies done independently of the dairy industry to support this.

The only dairy that is really worthwhile consuming is good quality yogurt.

Despite your blanket warning - I do very well on milk. Contamination of food is a general problem that encompasses just about everything we eat. To avoid all contaminants you'll have to avoid all food.

There are large populations in the world who thrive on milk into their 90's. Some people can't tolerate it but that's true of most food.

You should try making kefir from milk. It's far superior to yogurt. If you need some kefir grains, my free offer still stands.

[poanoi]

Oat meal = gas ?

I've had around a plate of oat meal/day lately and,

if i fart any more, it would just be one neverending fart ~~!!

[tutsiwarrior]

in the past I useta do an oatmeal, plain yogurt and banana smoothie in the morning (top up with skimmed milk a bit to get the desired consistency) and I only stopped when I couldn't get plain sugar free yogurt which is difficult in asian countries..good bowel movements and usually kept me goin' until lunchtime...but not too good for the BG if yer a diabetic...lots of carbs...

[Tolley]

On a more general note about cows milk and adults ....I would avoid it all costs. Homeginised pasteurised milk is not good for you at all. Quite to the contrary in fact. And there are a number of scientific studies done independently of the dairy industry to support this.

The only dairy that is really worthwhile consuming is good quality yogurt.

Despite your blanket warning - I do very well on milk. Contamination of food is a general problem that encompasses just about everything we eat. To avoid all contaminants you'll have to avoid all food.

There are large populations in the world who thrive on milk into their 90's. Some people can't tolerate it but that's true of most food.

You should try making kefir from milk. It's far superior to yogurt. If you need some kefir grains, my free offer still stands.

Good luck to you. You can ignore the research as you see fit. It is not just about contaminants thou that are a problem. I suggest you read Professor Peter Dingle's research on milk. He is an highly accliamed Australian research scientist with over 100 published papers.

Here is an excerpt from one of his published papers.

Milk is not the food it used to be. It is so highly processed it no longer resembles the milk our ancestors consumed thousands of years ago. Today a cow (a Friesian cow) gives 25 litres per day compared to just the few litres daily that cows produced centuries ago. Modern farming practices have extended the milking period to 305 days per year (1). Pasteurisation was necessary 100 years ago due to poor hygiene, but today it destroys the enzymes that make milk easy to digest, particularly for infants. All milk, including human milk, comes with a rich array of nutrients, including 20 or more enzymes to help digest itself - such as lactase to digest lactose. Homogenisation forces the particles of fat through a series of sieves to mix it with water, just so cream does not settle on top. It then becomes difficult for the body to determine whether it is fat or water. Normally, the two don't go together.

Modern milk has been sold to millions of people around the world based on its supposed benefits in building healthy bones. The research shows that milk has, at best, questionable benefits for preventing osteoporosis and bone fractures and is, in fact, linked with many forms of chronic illness including cancer, cardiovascular disease, multiple sclerosis, diabetes type 1, Parkinson's disease, gut disorders and allergies.

[Crushdepth]

When you want to loose weight, you need to realize that it's not only about the calories but also about the carbohydrates. All the snack you have mentioned are high in simple carbs (rice cookies, mashed potato) and sugar (dried fruit, watermelon) - the only time you can have this is after heavy workout (I mean weights here not cardio) and even then these are not the perfect foods. And sorry, but any instant stuff is an absolute no-go when dieting.

This is so true. Fat deposition is not a simple 'calories in vs calories out' process. Fat deposition is under hormonal control, the hormone responsible is insulin, and it is secreted when your blood sugar rises - which is exactly what happens when you eat carbohydrates (check out the book Why we get fat and what to do about it for a more thorough explanation).

I'm on a simple no carbohydrate diet and it works amazingly well. I don't count calories, don't avoid fat and eat when I feel hungry. I'm losing about 1kg a week and the suffering is minimal :-)

[tropo]

This is so true. Fat deposition is not a simple 'calories in vs calories out' process. Fat deposition is under hormonal control, the hormone responsible is insulin, and it is secreted when your blood sugar rises - which is exactly what happens when you eat carbohydrates (check out the book Why we get fat and what to do about it for a more thorough explanation).

I'm on a simple no carbohydrate diet and it works amazingly well. I don't count calories, don't avoid fat and eat when I feel hungry. I'm losing about 1kg a week and the suffering is minimal :-)

People with insulin resistance tend to get fatter than people with normal blood sugar metabolism, so yes, you could say that hormones are involved in people with impaired hormonal systems. Lack of exercise is the main culprit though. If you take a person who is insulin resistant and put him on a vigorous daily exercise program he will improve his blood sugar metabolism without lowering carbs. How far it improves will depend on the level of impairment.

But lets get back to normal people...

If you eat a high fat and protein diet you will get fat - or do you think you just pass out the excess as long as it's not carbohydrate?

Don't kid yourself - it's calories in, calories out for people with normal blood sugar metabolism.

I feel sorry for people wanting to punish themselves with zero carbohydrate diets just to lose weight (save that punishment when/if you're diagnosed as a full blown type 2 diabetic) - which will eventually fail because you won't be able to keep it up long term.

If you just normalize your carbohydrate consumption, improve the quality of the carbs and undertake a serious exercise program including resistance training, you won't need to punish yourself and you will lose fat and maintain the loss long term. The weight loss may take longer but you'll be a lot better off in the long run.

Taking unnatural measures in a effort to try to obtain a natural healthy state is weird science.

Of course, if you were fat in the first place you've probably lost touch of what is natural and need to retrain yourself.

Zero carb diets are for impatient people looking for fast results, ultimately doomed to failure. How long did it take for you to get fat? Why the rush to lose it again?

[tropo]

Good luck to you. You can ignore the research as you see fit. It is not just about contaminants thou that are a problem. I suggest you read Professor Peter Dingle's research on milk. He is an highly accliamed Australian research scientist with over 100 published papers.

No luck involved. As I said, I do well on milk but please understand I don't live on it but use it as a convenient, enjoyable source of extra protein. I eat other food.

I don't have any problems with lactose digestion. I digest milk very well.

I don't have any problems with my body confusing fat for water (I find that ridiculous) as I use 0%.

I don't rely on milk as my soul source of any nutrients, including calcium.

I'm not talking about living on milk, but consuming it as part of a varied diet.

Not all people can handle milk - perhaps you're one of those. You may have a problem digesting milk protein or lactose.

I went off milk completely for many years in the late 80's and 90's (after reading too many scare reports). I definitely felt better drinking it again and wondered why I ever gave it up.

[Crushdepth]

This is so true. Fat deposition is not a simple 'calories in vs calories out' process. Fat deposition is under hormonal control, the hormone responsible is insulin, and it is secreted when your blood sugar rises - which is exactly what happens when you eat carbohydrates (check out the book Why we get fat and what to do about it for a more thorough explanation).

I'm on a simple no carbohydrate diet and it works amazingly well. I don't count calories, don't avoid fat and eat when I feel hungry. I'm losing about 1kg a week and the suffering is minimal :-)

People with insulin resistance tend to get fatter than people with normal blood sugar metabolism, so yes, you could say that hormones are involved in people with impaired hormonal systems. Lack of exercise is the main culprit though. If you take a person who is insulin resistant and put him on a vigorous daily exercise program he will improve his blood sugar metabolism without lowering carbs. How far it improves will depend on the level of impairment.

But lets get back to normal people...

If you eat a high fat and protein diet you will get fat - or do you think you just pass out the excess as long as it's not carbohydrate?

Don't kid yourself - it's calories in, calories out for people with normal blood sugar metabolism.

I feel sorry for people wanting to punish themselves with zero carbohydrate diets just to lose weight (save that punishment when/if you're diagnosed as a full blown type 2 diabetic) - which will eventually fail because you won't be able to keep it up long term.

If you just normalize your carbohydrate consumption, improve the quality of the carbs and undertake a serious exercise program including resistance training, you won't need to punish yourself and you will lose fat and maintain the loss long term. The weight loss may take longer but you'll be a lot better off in the long run.

Taking unnatural measures in a effort to try to obtain a natural healthy state is weird science.

Of course, if you were fat in the first place you've probably lost touch of what is natural and need to retrain yourself.

Zero carb diets are for impatient people looking for fast results, ultimately doomed to failure. How long did it take for you to get fat? Why the rush to lose it again?

Jeez where do I start? Sorry but you are living in a land of misconceptions here. I've done the calorie counting and the training/exercise routine and it does not work anywhere near as well. Not even remotely.

No carbohydrate diets are not weird (meat and vegetables, weird?). They do not have to be high fat, nor are you obliged to stuff yourself with unreasonable quantities of food. They are not 'punishment' (calorie counting is punishment!). Its easy to follow and relatively painless precisely because there is no artificial calorie restriction. Nor is it 'unnatural', carbohydrates have only been a significant part of our diet since we developed agriculture, a tiny part of our evolutionary history. If you want to normalise your blood sugar levels cutting carbs (=sugar) is the best way to do it.

When I reach my target weight I'll add carbs in again but in greater moderation than before. The no carb diet is for weight loss, not weight maintenance.

Anyway, to the sceptics all I can say is read the book, which explains the science behind it, and do the experiment. Then you can tell me I'm wrong.