Robert Mugabe 'Fighting For Life In Singapore Hospital'

[MegaRanter]

Did the land suddenly go barren, or did Zimbabwean farmers all got jobs at the banks? It was systematic sabotage, the lands are there, the farm hands there too, ask yourself what happened. Let's just pretend the media propaganda did nt reach us. Go and read diverse opinions on the zim issue, the government side and the white farmers side. Imagine let's say black immigrants to Norway owning 98% of the farm lands, farming tobacco primarily.

One man's liberator is another man's anarchist. He said whatever he did was for the good of his people. Most people here only know him from what the western media have said of him. Most of the African continent is in a mess because their leaders want to be seen and talked about nicely by the west. 2% of the population have no right to own 98% of the land. This 2% would not be allowed to own their homes in today's Thailand. He wanted some reforms, some equity, some fairness, and west labelled him a monster and succeeded in making him look like one. South Africa would one day do what he did,may be subtly, but inevitable. Considering the umber of lives lost in Iraq, I bet none of the above posters would toast to GWB death. I wonder how many of you ll live to be 88.

Tell that to the starving Zimbabwe people,who have lived for decades on world aid,and abuse by this Evil Monster,who only stayed in power,by fixed Ballots.

[MAJIC]

One man's liberator is another man's anarchist. He said whatever he did was for the good of his people. Most people here only know him from what the western media have said of him. Most of the African continent is in a mess because their leaders want to be seen and talked about nicely by the west. 2% of the population have no right to own 98% of the land. This 2% would not be allowed to own their homes in today's Thailand. He wanted some reforms, some equity, some fairness, and west labelled him a monster and succeeded in making him look like one. South Africa would one day do what he did,may be subtly, but inevitable. Considering the umber of lives lost in Iraq, I bet none of the above posters would toast to GWB death. I wonder how many of you ll live to be 88.

I do not want to live to 88 if it means intentionally causing children to starve to death, or destroying multiple generations of those that never wanted anything but a chance to live in peace.

Ahh yes, South Africa and the potential to emulate Zimbabwe's mistakes. So far, the South African rulers understand the value and contributions of South African's minority groups, whether they be Asian, or caucasian. Had Zimbabwe not purged its farmers, who just so happened to be caucasian, Zimbabwe would not be filled with starving people. I think South Africa, for all of its foibles understands and appreciates the importance of its farmers.

Correct.

Under Magabe rule,they Slaughtered the white Afrikaneer farmers,who had farmed the land sucessfully,including huge exports,for near on 200 years. Mugabe drove them off the land,and awarded the Plantation to the so called Veteran Army,who promptly let the lush Farmland,go back to Jungle,and in that condition it stayed,no use to anyone.

Edited April 10, 2012 by MAJIC

[MegaRanter]

If the black farmers produced tobacco they won't be able to sell it to anyone, due to sanctions. How do you show up at a place and in 200years own all the land while still a minute minority. Question first how the white farmers acquired th land then you can question the land reforms. It's only because they the white farmers refused any government organized reforms the authorities turned a blind eye to the veterans mob approach.

[MAJIC]

Children were starved to death by the west with all the sanctions and propaganda, a leader of a country sees an issue to redress, foreign powers tell him, no you can or else shitface you.the farmers could all have gone to an agreement with their felllo citizens in form of co operatives or any other way instead of running back to their real countries and engineering all the mayhem that crippled Mugabe.

One man's liberator is another man's anarchist. He said whatever he did was for the good of his people. Most people here only know him from what the western media have said of him. Most of the African continent is in a mess because their leaders want to be seen and talked about nicely by the west. 2% of the population have no right to own 98% of the land. This 2% would not be allowed to own their homes in today's Thailand. He wanted some reforms, some equity, some fairness, and west labelled him a monster and succeeded in making him look like one. South Africa would one day do what he did,may be subtly, but inevitable. Considering the umber of lives lost in Iraq, I bet none of the above posters would toast to GWB death. I wonder how many of you ll live to be 88.

I do not want to live to 88 if it means intentionally causing children to starve to death, or destroying multiple generations of those that never wanted anything but a chance to live in peace.

Ahh yes, South Africa and the potential to emulate Zimbabwe's mistakes. So far, the South African rulers understand the value and contributions of South African's minority groups, whether they be Asian, or caucasian. Had Zimbabwe not purged its farmers, who just so happened to be caucasian, Zimbabwe would not be filled with starving people. I think South Africa, for all of its foibles understands and appreciates the importance of its farmers.

Well your Rhetoric is exactly what Magabe was spouting for years,he always had someone to blame (usually the UK) rather than blame his own incompetence.

Furtile land,lay unworked,huge amounts of labour unused,a large export industry,which died under his command,once known as the Bread Basket of Africa,but under his leadership couldn't feed his own countrymen. And the thieving of a once rich nation,the asset stripping,that went into his own offshore Bank Accounts,leaving Zimbabe stripped of untold wealth.

Please don't believe he was a Messiah,the opposite would have been the truth,and if he is now dying,there is no need to mourn,he was not one of the people.

[Skywalker69]

Relay good news.

"Another-one bites the dust"

[Scott]

An off-topic post has been removed.

[WarpSpeed]

Say Hello to: Pol Pot,....Saddam,....Papa Doc,.... Mao Zedong,.... Gadhaffi ..................

You forgot his close buddy though, Mr. Amin...

[Steely Dan]

If the black farmers produced tobacco they won't be able to sell it to anyone, due to sanctions. How do you show up at a place and in 200years own all the land while still a minute minority. Question first how the white farmers acquired th land then you can question the land reforms. It's only because they the white farmers refused any government organized reforms the authorities turned a blind eye to the veterans mob approach.

I could almost buy your 'African nationalist' argument save for the fact that Mugabe presided over the deaths of more black opponents to his regime than he did white farmers, no doubt as the latter saw the writing on the wall and left. As for sanctions, did that include Russia and China? I'm sure those two would have no qualms in accepting food exports from the former bread basket of Africa. Alas, it is no longer bread basket, but basket case instead.

P.S O/T But I would appreciate your thoughts on Nigeria on the recent thread about the Easter church bombings.

[Skywalker69]

I wonder if his close family friend Nalinee Taweesin is at his bedside?

Also how will it go with Thaksin´s plans?

I am sure Yingluck appointed her on big

Brother´s order.

Wonder why?

[KeyserSoze01]

If there is such as place as hell, then there is a special place carved out for Mr. Mugabe.

[WarpSpeed]

If the black farmers produced tobacco they won't be able to sell it to anyone, due to sanctions. How do you show up at a place and in 200years own all the land while still a minute minority. Question first how the white farmers acquired th land then you can question the land reforms. It's only because they the white farmers refused any government organized reforms the authorities turned a blind eye to the veterans mob approach.

That's as good a reason as any? Mob rule and intimidating extortion to force them to capitulate, sounds more like organized criminals than a government for the PEOPLE to me..

Edited April 10, 2012 by WarpSpeed

[GentlemanJim]

Considering the fact that many of Zimbabwe's intellectuals, educated class and non Black african African ethnic groups have been forced to flee for their lives, there won't be many people of value left to slaughter. I am sure Zimbabwe's backers in South Africa will act to protect their fellow "revolutionaries" in the event that the people rise up and seek freedom and justice. Any assets of values were already looted and destroyed by Mugabe's cronies so I don't know what people will loot, although I understand that maize husks may hold special allure to the starving populace of Harare.

Whilst I think I understand what you are driving at, the way you have written it is not very nice really is it. Every man woman and child that is about to be slaughtered has family that consider them of great value.

Meanwhile back in Singapore, I hope the Doctors and Nurses are doing everything they can to make Mugabe's last remaining days as uncomfortable as possible.

[MegaRanter]

Wrong forum for a subjective debate of the issues,do you think if ivory coast stops exporting cocoa, that their economy will falter? It won't, cos no ivories can sell cocoa on the international market, the western middle men will buy it for pittance, and resell it at gold prices. If someday some president says no, it's not fair that way, the middle men would lobby who ever sent them to make life difficult for them. Assuming Mugabe stole the millions, he won't bank it in Nigeria or Libya, guess where he would. If the white farmers were any useful to Zimbabwe, there is nothing on the ground to show for it. The ANC govt in SA have been less than capable for over a decade now, but you can the fundamentals still holding forte. To us Africans, the tobacco profits don't make it back to harare. The politics in Africa is murky with a lot of foreign interference. Mugabe may not be a saint, but he is far from being the devil.

[MAJIC]

Tony Blair was all hugs and kisses with gadarfi shortly before he was killed. For years they called him an animal who has no place in the last century, when he said oil is open for business, they all lined upto share his tent.

Yes,that was probably the most puke making episode of Blairs career

[MegaRanter]

Dan, do you know the crops that's these farmers produce and in what proportion? Study the crop produce then tell if you can sell it out of a union. The last steel mill hat the Russians built in my country was designed to use only Russian coal, and the Chinese, well, can't tell.their cigarettes don't sell well may be. I did not see the bombing in Nigeria thread, I now live in Abuja. I ll find it and say a few

If the black farmers produced tobacco they won't be able to sell it to anyone, due to sanctions. How do you show up at a place and in 200years own all the land while still a minute minority. Question first how the white farmers acquired th land then you can question the land reforms. It's only because they the white farmers refused any government organized reforms the authorities turned a blind eye to the veterans mob approach.

I could almost buy your 'African nationalist' argument save for the fact that Mugabe presided over the deaths of more black opponents to his regime than he did white farmers, no doubt as the latter saw the writing on the wall and left. As for sanctions, did that include Russia and China? I'm sure those two would have no qualms in accepting food exports from the former bread basket of Africa. Alas, it is no longer bread basket, but basket case instead.

P.S O/T But I would appreciate your thoughts on Nigeria on the recent thread about the Easter church bombings.

[Scott]

Stay on the topic of Robert Mugabe. The thread is not about racial relations or colonial history or other off-topic subjects.

Should he remain hospitalized for an extended time or die, there will be other news that may be a better place for a historical review of events.

[MEL1]

Epitath anybody?

" zulu."

" Did do."

" Killed"

" Tried you too".

" Testi-money"

" Got yours, of course."

-Mugabe.

[endure]

Couldn't happen to a nicer bloke.

[RaoulDuke]

It's a shame he never got the proper treatment by his countryman....eaten alive like they did in Liberia. I am sure his successor is no better.

Posted with Thaivisa App http://apps.thaivisa.com

[Soutpeel]

Enjoy your time in h*ll Uncle Bob.

[Zatoichi]

He had the right idea in the beginning to kick out the land thieving occupiers, but he executed it poorly. Then everything went down a slippery slope, getting worse and worse till the mess that we have now. May the Gods judge him justly. Now that being said I think I may go visit soon to see what kind of opportunities are abound his passing.

[MegaRanter]

He bit off more than he can chew by confronting Britain. The occupiers had a different agenda from the Zimbabwean nation. He is 88, a ripe old age, hope he is happy with the progress so far. It would all have been different if they had oil too.

[F4UCorsair]

His wake will be held in a 'phone box.

[jackr]

Good news, but sadly 80-odd years too late!

[Colin Yai]

If the black farmers produced tobacco they won't be able to sell it to anyone, due to sanctions. How do you show up at a place and in 200years own all the land while still a minute minority. Question first how the white farmers acquired th land then you can question the land reforms. It's only because they the white farmers refused any government organized reforms the authorities turned a blind eye to the veterans mob approach.

I could almost buy your 'African nationalist' argument save for the fact that Mugabe presided over the deaths of more black opponents to his regime than he did white farmers, no doubt as the latter saw the writing on the wall and left. As for sanctions, did that include Russia and China? I'm sure those two would have no qualms in accepting food exports from the former bread basket of Africa. Alas, it is no longer bread basket, but basket case instead.

P.S O/T But I would appreciate your thoughts on Nigeria on the recent thread about the Easter church bombings.

Quite correct Dan, very early in Mugabe's "tenure" his North Korean trained troops " The Fifth brigade" committed genocide under his orders and massacred an estimated 60,000 Ndeleble Civilian tribesmen, there is much information to be had on this subject in the public domain . Edited April 11, 2012 by Colin Yai

[madmitch]

If the black farmers produced tobacco they won't be able to sell it to anyone, due to sanctions. How do you show up at a place and in 200years own all the land while still a minute minority. Question first how the white farmers acquired th land then you can question the land reforms. It's only because they the white farmers refused any government organized reforms the authorities turned a blind eye to the veterans mob approach.

So, do you think that all the land acquired by the Chinese in Thailand over the past century should be returned to the real Thais?

[geriatrickid]

Wrong forum for a subjective debate of the issues,do you think if ivory coast stops exporting cocoa, that their economy will falter? It won't, cos no ivories can sell cocoa on the international market, the western middle men will buy it for pittance, and resell it at gold prices. If someday some president says no, it's not fair that way, the middle men would lobby who ever sent them to make life difficult for them. Assuming Mugabe stole the millions, he won't bank it in Nigeria or Libya, guess where he would. If the white farmers were any useful to Zimbabwe, there is nothing on the ground to show for it. The ANC govt in SA have been less than capable for over a decade now, but you can the fundamentals still holding forte. To us Africans, the tobacco profits don't make it back to harare. The politics in Africa is murky with a lot of foreign interference. Mugabe may not be a saint, but he is far from being the devil.

LOL. I too support African national aspirations and independence. That is why I believe that foreign aid to Africa be terminated. With all of the resources on the continent, self sufficiency will be easily attained as Africa's leadership is well educated, impeccably honest and dedicated to the betterment and improvement of the lives of all Africans.

This is what Mr. Mugabe emphasized. His first task, as per your earlier intimations, was to rid his nation of those evil white people who had settled on barren lands. The Rhodesians ability to transform previously unproductive lands into those that fed the nation all came about due to the Rhodesians importation of evil European farming methods. The seizure of the farmlands and handover to those with no knowledge of farming was sheer genius by Mr. Mugabe. His plan provided important jobs to those that had previously sat about collecting money taken from the poor of Zimbabwe. By providing jobs to his thugs & fighters he intended to help the Zimbabawean people, Taxes could be diverted from supporting the fighters & thugs and directed to more useful things like building palatial homes and buying expensive vehicles and jewellery for Mugabe's inner circle. This would create solidarity and build peace. No one driving a mercedes and wearing lots of bling would want to start a fight lest they lose a diamond or scratch the car. As well, with the the thugs and fighters attention focused on growing things they wouldn't need to engage in their youthful hijinks of beating, raping and extorting money from Zimbabaweans. As you state, the Rhodesians "engineering all the mayhem that crippled Mugabe". Mr. Mugabe's plans were obviously sabotaged by the expelled Rhodesians ooops sorr, the Rhodesians that ran away, because had they stayed and helped out when the thugs and fighters accidentally set fires burning the farms or whyen the thugs and fighters borrowed farm machinery and forgot to return it or when the thugs and fighters threatened the Rhodesians, everything would be okay today.

BTW, I don't know if your sentiment expressed in your earlier post about the Rhodesians returning to their " real countries" is really a wise statement. What if all of the Africans were obliged to leave Europe and other countries and return to their "real countries"? It might cause a few problems don't you think? I don't know if Bangkok's African community wishes to give up their important professional positions to return to Africa. Lagos might have one too many commercial entrepreneurs at this time.

Edited April 11, 2012 by geriatrickid

[GentlemanJim]

He had the right idea in the beginning to kick out the land thieving occupiers, but he executed it poorly. Then everything went down a slippery slope, getting worse and worse till the mess that we have now. May the Gods judge him justly. Now that being said I think I may go visit soon to see what kind of opportunities are abound his passing.

The 'Land thieving occupiers' as you put it had taken the country from being a jungle to what is correctly described as the bread basket of Africa. The white farmers employed hundreds of thousands of farm working families. The farmers were given homes, money, food and importantly schools for their children The farms were well tended and successful. All in all if you ask any of those farmers they long for the days of the 'white run' farming system.

All this had been going on progressively for a little over 200 years, in fact a very similar time frame to the occupying of America by the 'whites'. Do we consider that the 'land thieving occupiers' in the United States should hand over all their lands back to the native Americans? The answer is of course no! That was history, the 'occupiers' have improved the lands, made everything commercially successful in the modern world. Had it not been for the white farmers, Mugabe would never even have had an education, nor the infrastructure to become a president. It's similar to the black Americans that scream for countries to apologise for the slave trade....why? Without the slave trade (which was implemented by the African Chieftans anyway), the self same black Americans would likely be living in mud huts somewhere in an African jungle. Blaming the White farmers that made Rhodesia/Zimbabwe such a great place as it was 20 years ago for the occupation by their Great Great Great Grandfathers is nonsense.

There was nothing noble about what Mugabe did as Megaranter would have us believe, he simply allowed the farmers to build a wealthy agricultural nation and then decided he wanted it...ALL. He had zero interest in the normal farmer that was clear, as their homes were burned and destroyed, their schools were burned and destroyed, and their farms that they worked on and made a living for themselves and their families were burned and destroyed. If he cared one iota for his people, I doubt he would have so many numbered accounts in Switzerland. The UN sanctions did not starve the people of Zimbabwe, Mugabe did.

[Scott]

Some off-topic posts and some baiting and inflammatory posts as well as replies, have been deleted.

Out of curiosity, were the white farmers who left or were expelled citizens of Zimbabwe?

[p_brownstone]

He bit off more than he can chew by confronting Britain. The occupiers had a different agenda from the Zimbabwean nation. He is 88, a ripe old age, hope he is happy with the progress so far. It would all have been different if they had oil too.

It's one of the tragedies of Africa that the locals can never accept that their problems are caused by their own and their Leader's ineptitude. I lived in Lagos, Nigeria, for 4 years between 1984 - 1989 and every time something went wrong (and it did, a LOT!) the instant refrain was "it's a result of our Colonial heritage". Pointing out that they had been "Independent" for over a generation and that the infrastructure left by Britain had been shattered by their own incompetence and laziness was a waste of time.

Mugabe destroyed a whole vibrant and viable Nation and society simply as an outlet for his own racism and cronyism - but there are still people who regard him as a hero of anti-colonialism who can do no wrong.

Patrick