Best Bank & Interest Rate For 800'000.- Baht-Account

[chiangmaibruce]

Thanks for that info Fletch. I did look first in the English-language version of the RD web site and couldn't find anything.

It makes sense that they would only consider an application for refund of witholding tax in the context of receiving a full tax return filing, but from other threads it appears that many people are applying for (and getting) such refunds just by lodging a separate claim form, and independent from a complete tax return. So far I've been unable to get a definitive answer on this. Any thoughts?

[fletchsmile]

Thanks for that info Fletch. I did look first in the English-language version of the RD web site and couldn't find anything.

It makes sense that they would only consider an application for refund of witholding tax in the context of receiving a full tax return filing, but from other threads it appears that many people are applying for (and getting) such refunds just by lodging a separate claim form, and independent from a complete tax return. So far I've been unable to get a definitive answer on this. Any thoughts?

Bruce

I think when people are saying they "fill in a form", the form that they are actually completing is a tax return. The website in English version, gives a list of "tax forms" http://rdserver.rd.go.th/publish/en/index.htm Cut and paste below

Tax Forms

Persoal Income Tax Year 2009

• Personal Income Tax Return for Taxpayers with Income in General Cases (P.N.D.90)
  
• Personal Income Tax Return for Taxpayers with Income from Employment under Section 40(1) of the Revenue Code Only (P.N.D.91)
  
• Personal Income Tax Return for Taxpayers filing in advance (P.N.D.93)
  
• Attachment of P.N.D.90 or P.N.D.91
  

The PND91 is most common for those people who are in employment, as it fits better with the forms that your employer supplies you at the end of the tax year.

The PND90 is a simpler form for general cases. I am guessing that this is what most people refer to if they are not working and say they "fill in a form", as a Thai revenue official would probably ask them do they work, and if they say no just give them this form.

The "attachment" is for people who have terminated their employment, which have special rules for the tax calc if you elect to have your termination payment taxed separately, which it is often advantageous to do.

As you say though the English language version isn't that clear. Also it doesn't inspire confidence that it still refers to 2009. But that's my understanding of the way it works, and that's what I've been doing online and (last year) in person. This year was the first year I submitted in English too - I printed off the PND 91 Eng version tippexed out 2009 and wrote 2011 over the top then photocopied it so I had a clean version. There was a slight diff in the English version and online Thai version, in the numbering but it didn't seem to matter much.

Cheers

Fletch

[Darrel]

Thanks for that info Fletch. I did look first in the English-language version of the RD web site and couldn't find anything.

It makes sense that they would only consider an application for refund of witholding tax in the context of receiving a full tax return filing, but from other threads it appears that many people are applying for (and getting) such refunds just by lodging a separate claim form, and independent from a complete tax return. So far I've been unable to get a definitive answer on this. Any thoughts?

I went in today to see about this, having been meaning to do it for months.

With a few photocopies I quickly got a tax number and proceeded to the claims desk where I was told that I could get a refund of withholding tax without completing a tax return (I have no income in Thailand apart from savings interest).

In order to get the refund (which apparently applies only to time deposits and not savings accounts, but see below) I would need to present a certificate of tax withheld from my bank. So I went to one of my banks where I was told that interest on that account is paid gross up to 20KBaht per year, and as I had only received 16K last year there would be no tax deducted or reclaimable on that account for that year. Friday I will be calling into the other bank that paid me interest last year (Kbank on the step bond) and will see what they have to say about the certificate. My other accounts with CIMB will only generate interest in this tax year, so I will be claiming for those next year.

The experience in the tax office was little short of perfect. No queue at all (I was the only person there at 11am), good aircon, comfortable seats, pleasant, polite staff speaking a reasonable amount of English and who were very insistent that I should drink some free coffee.

[chiangmaibruce]

Fletch and Darrel: Thanks for that info - helps fill in some gaps

[fletchsmile]

Thanks for that info Fletch. I did look first in the English-language version of the RD web site and couldn't find anything.

It makes sense that they would only consider an application for refund of witholding tax in the context of receiving a full tax return filing, but from other threads it appears that many people are applying for (and getting) such refunds just by lodging a separate claim form, and independent from a complete tax return. So far I've been unable to get a definitive answer on this. Any thoughts?

I went in today to see about this, having been meaning to do it for months.

With a few photocopies I quickly got a tax number and proceeded to the claims desk where I was told that I could get a refund of withholding tax without completing a tax return (I have no income in Thailand apart from savings interest).

In order to get the refund (which apparently applies only to time deposits and not savings accounts, but see below) I would need to present a certificate of tax withheld from my bank. So I went to one of my banks where I was told that interest on that account is paid gross up to 20KBaht per year, and as I had only received 16K last year there would be no tax deducted or reclaimable on that account for that year. Friday I will be calling into the other bank that paid me interest last year (Kbank on the step bond) and will see what they have to say about the certificate. My other accounts with CIMB will only generate interest in this tax year, so I will be claiming for those next year.

The experience in the tax office was little short of perfect. No queue at all (I was the only person there at 11am), good aircon, comfortable seats, pleasant, polite staff speaking a reasonable amount of English and who were very insistent that I should drink some free coffee.

Cheers for this Darrel. Yes I found the tax office great too.

Could you do us a favour and take down the number of the form you complete and let us know what it is? Every single formal form I've ever come across in Thailand usually has a number with the tax related ones on income tax often being PND...

[Darrel]

Could you do us a favour and take down the number of the form you complete and let us know what it is?

I will try, but the application form for the tax id number was just waved in front of me for a signature and then completed by the nice lady in charge, so I didnt have the chance of noticing anything written on it. I have no idea what she wrote on it and for all I know it was a confession to genocide. I dont know if the same will happen for the claim.

[fletchsmile]

Could you do us a favour and take down the number of the form you complete and let us know what it is?

I will try, but the application form for the tax id number was just waved in front of me for a signature and then completed by the nice lady in charge, so I didnt have the chance of noticing anything written on it. I have no idea what she wrote on it and for all I know it was a confession to genocide. I dont know if the same will happen for the claim.

555 Cheers Darrel

Think we've all signed forms like that in Thailand one time or another

I believe even confessions to genocide have a reference number over here, so if you could ask when you go back would be useful. I've heard before that fixed deposits can claim the tax back and savings deposits not. If we get a few more pieces of the puzzle though would be useful - always worth knowing more

[mpm]

Could you do us a favour and take down the number of the form you complete and let us know what it is?

I will try, but the application form for the tax id number was just waved in front of me for a signature and then completed by the nice lady in charge, so I didnt have the chance of noticing anything written on it. I have no idea what she wrote on it and for all I know it was a confession to genocide. I dont know if the same will happen for the claim. Can withholding tax they take off you at the land office when you sell a condo be claimed back by this method?

555 Cheers Darrel

Think we've all signed forms like that in Thailand one time or another

I believe even confessions to genocide have a reference number over here, so if you could ask when you go back would be useful. I've heard before that fixed deposits can claim the tax back and savings deposits not. If we get a few more pieces of the puzzle though would be useful - always worth knowing more

[Darrel]

Can withholding tax they take off you at the land office when you sell a condo be claimed back by this method?

As far as I know that isn't withholding tax.

[chiang mai]

Can withholding tax they take off you at the land office when you sell a condo be claimed back by this method?

As far as I know that isn't withholding tax.

Correct, witholding tax only applies to earned income not real estate taxes.

[edwardandtubs]

If I was in BKK then I would try and open a MyTMB online account as this pays 3.5% with instant access.

Are you sure about this? I can't find any information on this on the TMB website and it seems highly unlikely considering the Bank of Thailand base rate is 3%

[chiang mai]

If I was in BKK then I would try and open a MyTMB online account as this pays 3.5% with instant access.

Are you sure about this? I can't find any information on this on the TMB website and it seems highly unlikely considering the Bank of Thailand base rate is 3%

I've just done a trawl of the banks to see if there's anything decent out there for my personal use and as you say, with the base rate so low there's nothing particularly exciting to be had, I certainly did not see anything at that rate for instant access!

Here's the current list that excludes the specials that many banks often run:

http://www.bot.or.th...te/IN_Rate.aspx

BTW: MB has branches througout the country so you don't need to be just in BKK to open an account. Having said that, TMB is one of the more difficult banks for farangs to open an account, in my experience, I've tried several times in Chiang Mai and they just seem to think it's beyond their capabillites, unless one has a work permit - I've lost interest in them because of their attitude although I suppose if I were to push the point I could manage it, I'll save that activity until a day when I'm really bored and having nothing better to do

Edited April 27, 2012 by chiang mai

[flying]

Here's the current list that excludes the specials that many banks often run:

Thanks CM good link to see.

Still way better than US CD's

In regards to instant access ....Would you know if

these fixed rate deals work for qualifying your seasoned accounts for Visa use?

Meaning are they totally locked or are they available for withdrawal ...of course with penalties

would be understood.

I have read some immigration offices are iffy about fixed accounts.

[Darrel]

Are you sure about this? I can't find any information on this on the TMB website and it seems highly unlikely considering the Bank of Thailand base rate is 3%

It's "me" not "my", sorry.

http://www.mebytmb.com/

The rate has dropped to 3% from 3.5% since last month.

The account is only available online and from certain special branches (not TMB branches) and they go out of their way to make it difficult for non-Thais to learn about it. I dont know why.

[chiang mai]

Here's the current list that excludes the specials that many banks often run:

Thanks CM good link to see.

Still way better than US CD's

In regards to instant access ....Would you know if

these fixed rate deals work for qualifying your seasoned accounts for Visa use?

Meaning are they totally locked or are they available for withdrawal ...of course with penalties

would be understood.

I have read some immigration offices are iffy about fixed accounts.

I'm unsure, I hear mixed reports. I think the general rule is that they are OK to use for seasoning purposes although there will likely be some account types where the deposit is completely inaccessible until the end of the term and if that's longer than nine months I can't see them being acceptable. It's probabaly sensible to check with individual banks re their T & C's regarding withdrawl/loss of interest in an emergency. It's probably also best to try and get an answer from your local Immigration office and hope the person you speak to shares the same view as everyone else in that office! Sorry I can't be more definitive.

[Darrel]

In regards to instant access ....Would you know if

these fixed rate deals work for qualifying your seasoned accounts for Visa use?

Meaning are they totally locked or are they available for withdrawal ...of course with penalties

would be understood.

I have read some immigration offices are iffy about fixed accounts.

I mentioned this in my original post.

Yes, different offices/officers interpret the rules differently but in theory nearly all time deposits are suitable for visa extension use as they do allow instant access, albeit with an interest rate penalty.

The immigration office is not interested in the penalty, only that the money is instantly available.

[chiang mai]

In regards to instant access ....Would you know if

these fixed rate deals work for qualifying your seasoned accounts for Visa use?

Meaning are they totally locked or are they available for withdrawal ...of course with penalties

would be understood.

I have read some immigration offices are iffy about fixed accounts.

I mentioned this in my original post.

Yes, different offices/officers interpret the rules differently but in theory nearly all time deposits are suitable for visa extension use as they do allow instant access, albeit with an interest rate penalty.

The immigration office is not interested in the penalty, only that the money is instantly available.

Be careful with this Darrel, I have a fixed term/rate with BAY for five months and I cannot access the funds under any circumstances, interest is paid monthly into a secondary account which is accessible but the principle is not.

Whilst thinking on this subject, Kasikorn has a money market account that earns an effective 2.7% and the funds are available on 24 hours notice.

[fletchsmile]

The BOT website isn't that useful for finding the best rates. It provides rates only for the standard basic accounts. If you look at it from time it can help in giving an idea of relative to each other which banks consistently give better rates, as a whole.

Almost all banks will have accounts with special rates, with different terms and conditions, and quirks like the hahaha (555) account above. For these you need to trawl thru the websites of individual banks or visit and ask the banks or word of mouth. That's why this type of thread is useful when it crops up from time to time, as there is no decent source for all rates at all banks on all accounts. As an example of special rates, look at all the ones on Standard Chartered Bank Thai website:

index page

http://www.standardc...terest-fees/en/

retail deposits

http://www.standardc...20120412_WM.pdf

I have with them an eSaver account that pays 3% on balances over THB1. Online account so you generally need another account to run alongside it if you want an ATM, cheque book etc. Accessible and easy to use though. I don't believe an eSaver would qualify for immigration as there is no nice passbook or statement to photocopy for them. Never tried tho.

I also have "Marathon" Savings Accounts with them. These are promotional accounts they run each year and adjust the rates each year, to coincide with the BKK Marathon they sponsor. Broadly:

- Only open for new accounts in September, October, November

- Promotions runs over one year

- Interest rates are tiers and 2011 interest rates on balances over THB 200k were set at:

2.75% first 4 months

3.25% next 4 months

4.5% next 4 months

so an "effective annual interest rate" around 3.54% if you don't touch the balances

- you can make up to 2 withdrawals a month, using the passbook

- no ATM card

As it's described in both Thai and English as a "savings account" I believe it will qualify for Visa purposes. Haven't tried it yet at immigration as last year used another. Will be trying it this week tho

For someone who plans and manages their money, this is a reasonable account. More flexible than a fixed deposit on withdrawals, but better interest than simple savings

Fletch

Edited April 28, 2012 by fletchsmile

[flying]

As it's described in both Thai and English as a "savings account" I believe it will qualify for Visa purposes. Haven't tried it yet at immigration as last year used another. Will be trying it this week tho

Fletch

Please report back if you can

Thanks

[Darrel]

Be careful with this Darrel, I have a fixed term/rate with BAY for five months and I cannot access the funds under any circumstances, interest is paid monthly into a secondary account which is accessible but the principle is not.

Yes, you certainly need to be careful and pay attention to the T&Cs. My Kbank step-bond and my CIMB time-deposits are all suitable though.

Whilst thinking on this subject, Kasikorn has a money market account that earns an effective 2.7% and the funds are available on 24 hours notice.

That sounds reasonable. Presumably it isnt covered by the deposit protection fund?

[Darrel]

As an example of special rates, look at all the ones on Standard Chartered Bank Thai website:

The StanChart rates and accounts are pretty good. But what sort of pea-brained bank has a branch in Rayong and no branch in nearby Pattaya?

I nearly trekked off to BKK to open an account with them (BKK being much easier to get to than Rayong) but in the end I couldnt be bothered.

[chiang mai]

Be careful with this Darrel, I have a fixed term/rate with BAY for five months and I cannot access the funds under any circumstances, interest is paid monthly into a secondary account which is accessible but the principle is not.

Yes, you certainly need to be careful and pay attention to the T&Cs. My Kbank step-bond and my CIMB time-deposits are all suitable though.

Whilst thinking on this subject, Kasikorn has a money market account that earns an effective 2.7% and the funds are available on 24 hours notice.

That sounds reasonable. Presumably it isnt covered by the deposit protection fund?

It probably isn't dunno, but I'm not unduly concerned about that aspect. I tend to do here the same thing I do anywhere else and that is to spread my funds around a series of banks, I rarely put more than 1mill. in any one bank so as to spread my risk. If my 1 mill. in Kasikorn Money Markets was my sole financial lifeline I might behave differently, but as things stand I'm comfortable with the level of risk.

[12DrinkMore]

Whilst thinking on this subject, Kasikorn has a money market account that earns an effective 2.7% and the funds are available on 24 hours notice.

Forget that for visa purposes.

A couple of years ago I was nearly refused my extension due to using an MM account.

That would have involved a trip to Malaysia and extra expense. Luckily a bit of humble pie "Sorry, I didn't know", "but it was OK last year" and "what can we do" coupled with smiles and the plain vanilla envelope fixed it.

Edited April 28, 2012 by 12DrinkMore

[12DrinkMore]

Whilst thinking on this subject, Kasikorn has a money market account that earns an effective 2.7% and the funds are available on 24 hours notice.

That sounds reasonable. Presumably it isnt covered by the deposit protection fund?

Correct, it isn't and it is no good for visa extensions either.

[fletchsmile]

As an example of special rates, look at all the ones on Standard Chartered Bank Thai website:

The StanChart rates and accounts are pretty good. But what sort of pea-brained bank has a branch in Rayong and no branch in nearby Pattaya?

I nearly trekked off to BKK to open an account with them (BKK being much easier to get to than Rayong) but in the end I couldnt be bothered.

StanChart has no real interest in the expat banking market on the retail side, so from that perspective they think Rayong with its industrial estates and corporate businesses makes more sense to them than Pattaya. Their view on expats is that given the small balances generally held and the extra difficulties in serving expats they have no real interest for retail. {BTW in case someone makes the point of the average Thai vs the average expat they do not target they average Thai either, and are more interested in the more affluent element of Thai society}. Historically it has been very difficult for foreign banks to build networks in Thailand, which is one reason why banks like HSBC have given up the ghost - as it's too late to catch up on volume, hence the focus on higher end.

Fletch

[chiang mai]

Whilst thinking on this subject, Kasikorn has a money market account that earns an effective 2.7% and the funds are available on 24 hours notice.

That sounds reasonable. Presumably it isnt covered by the deposit protection fund?

Correct, it isn't and it is no good for visa extensions either.

That being the case, it's easy enough to cash out of the MM producttwo days before the visa is to be renewed and then reinvest the day after it is renewed, you will still be able to show that the funds were seasoned and they will be immediatley available on the day the visa is extended, ta ra!

[mikebell]

Still on banking but slightly off-topic; I received a cheque from UK tax. It has my Thai address on it. Can I just pay it into my Bangkok bank account? Do I need proof of address?

[12DrinkMore]

Whilst thinking on this subject, Kasikorn has a money market account that earns an effective 2.7% and the funds are available on 24 hours notice.

That sounds reasonable. Presumably it isnt covered by the deposit protection fund?

Correct, it isn't and it is no good for visa extensions either.

That being the case, it's easy enough to cash out of the MM producttwo days before the visa is to be renewed and then reinvest the day after it is renewed, you will still be able to show that the funds were seasoned and they will be immediatley available on the day the visa is extended, ta ra!

I would check with immigration before trying that trick at least three months before your extension comes up.

I suspect that it would not work.

[flying]

So then Immigration does not allow any seasoned funds that are in time deposits even if they

are the type that can be withdrawn? ( with interest penalty )

Edited April 29, 2012 by flying

[chiang mai]

So then Immigration does not allow any seasoned funds that are in time deposits even if they

are the type that can be withdrawn? ( with interest penalty )

I don't believe that's the case, I feel certain that 12D is being overly negative, again!