Chiang Mai Then And Now. Four Years On

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Here's yet another excellent topic, if I may say so myself. I was wondering today if Chiang Mai is just growing and being beautified at a regular healthy rate of development, or that it's actually closer to a complete development and population explosion, with expansion increasing exponentially a la Bangkok in the booming years. It's hard to tell living here all the time, but even so I can't help but notice all thew new housing developments, roads and shopping malls, and that's just in suburban areas; also in town things are going at break-neck speed.

Here's something nice to do on a rainy afternoon: Compare Chiang Mai 4 years ago with today. How? By comparing the old Mapjack.com site with the recently updated Google Streetview. There's about 4 years difference between those, so a really short time by city development standards. And yet, the differences are remarkable.

Sit back, relax and enjoy. Then see if you can find some other noteworthy changes within the area that Mapjack covered.

Huay Kaew, near CMU

Moon Muang, the old Kinnaree dump that was completely renovated. And the addition of the Tiger Kingdom In Town place.

Siam TV, on the Southern Moat used to be an empty wasteland where sometimes a market was held.

Airport Plaza Intersection

More renovation / beautification, near Thapae Gate

Ratchamankha Road

Ratchapakinai Road, near the moat

We're of course restricted to the area Mapjack covered, so can't see all the development along the ring roads and roads out of town. It did cover Nimmanhaemin and the CMU area, I think there's probably more good changes to be seen there.

Edited April 30, 2012 by WinnieTheKhwai

[ARISTIDE]

Area in the Chiang Mai Business Park is also moving fast. Expect completely different surroundings in the next 5-6 months.

[Paagai]

No need for the technology, just take a drive around Santitham, some streets are unrecognisable from four years ago! Let alone maybe six years ago which is around the time some of the bigger projects started,.e.g. Santitham Plaza.

Of course, in the same time frame, upgrades to the infrastructure have been almost non existent. Only recently have there been some belated attempts to patch up the power and water systems. As to roads and parking, let's not go there......

Edited May 1, 2012 by Paagai

[WinnieTheKhwai]

No need for the technology, just take a drive around Santitham, some streets are unrecognisable from four years ago! Let alone maybe six years ago which is around the time some of the bigger projects started,.e.g. Santitham Plaza.

Right, but it's different form just saying 'oh, the city is developing fast' form actually seeing it in front of you. I'm also still undecided if it is a healthy -and overall positive- rate of growth, or that it's going too fast.. After all a lively, attractive city needs development, both expansion as well as improvements and beautification in the older parts. Both are happening in Chiang Mai.

Of course, in the same time frame, upgrades to the infrastructure have been almost non existent. Only recently have there been some belated attempts to patch up the power and water systems. As to roads and parking, let's not go there......

Possibly; though if you look at the reliability and quality of the water and electricity supply then it's at least not getting worse. It could (and should) improve probably, but I don't think it's getting worse. Or would you say that it IS getting worse in the Santhitham area?

[daoyai]

When we experience total gridlock in the Huey Keau, Nimman area, you will know CM has finally arrived as a "city".

[trainman34014]

Biggest thing I notice when riding around on my Bike is how many Paddy's are being filled in and built on. Shops, Offices, Houses, you name it, are springing up fast all around the Countryside, which is kind of sad as more green belt vanishes under concrete. Reminds me of the UK in the 80's when most of the green between my Village and the nearest Town vanished in the same way. Also a lot of old wooden houses are being demolished and more modern structures taking their place. I suppose this is progress but some of the more quaint aspects of Thailand are being taken from us.

[haybilly]

I am reliably informed that last year's floods brought a huge surge of investment northwards from wealthy Bangkokians--but you already knew that.

[el jefe]

... if Chiang Mai is just growing and being beautified at a regular healthy rate of development, or that it's actually closer to a complete development and population explosion, with expansion increasing exponentially a la Bangkok in the booming years.

Where is the dividing line between "a regular healthy rate of development" and "complete development and population explosion"?

imho, it all depends on when you arrived in CM and where in the CM are you currently live. I moved to the Nimman area 7 years ago and up until 3 years ago there were still several old teak houses on the sois.

When CMU sells off their agricultural property to a real estate developer who puts up yet another mall, then I'll be in the "explosion" camp.

[elektrified]

Biggest thing I notice when riding around on my Bike is how many Paddy's are being filled in and built on. Shops, Offices, Houses, you name it, are springing up fast all around the Countryside, which is kind of sad as more green belt vanishes under concrete. Reminds me of the UK in the 80's when most of the green between my Village and the nearest Town vanished in the same way. Also a lot of old wooden houses are being demolished and more modern structures taking their place. I suppose this is progress but some of the more quaint aspects of Thailand are being taken from us.

My feelings EXACTLY. Kind of sad....yes indeed.

[Throatwobbler]

I live out near Doi Saket. The amount of building work that is being done on that road once you get past the 121 is incredible. As someone else mentioned the sad thing is the amount of paddy being filled in. I think we will be looking at more of an urban sprawl in the not too distant future.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

I kind of disagree with people saying that developing paddy land along the main roads into town is worrisome. I think that's just expected for a city that's growing. Keep in mind the alternative is NOT expanding along those roads, but cramming all development into the downtown area, increasing congestion. Be careful what you wish for. An example of development not away from town you will see within the next couple of years around the old Rincome Hotel which will become a mall & cinema. Let's see how that works out for congestion. I bet by then people will be wishing they had the good sense to build it in a spot like the new Promenada, or Meechoke Plaza.

Also it's not like paddy land in the North is at risk of running out; as the city's borders extend, it just starts a little further out of the city center than it used to; no biggie. We're talking privately owned land only in use as rice paddies; not pristine forests or national parks. Eventually the likes of Doi Saket and Hang Dong will be merged into a larger city area, just like other villages before, like Ban Jed Yod, Fa Ham, etc.

Also, once paddy land is developed, it can't get burned anymore every March.

Edited May 3, 2012 by WinnieTheKhwai

[CMX]

Winnie, all you say has its customary long view.

Yet you mentioned in your original OP 'beautified.' To those of us watching green fields being turned into storefronts and malls on our rides homeward, the specter of unlimited strip malls in all directions is disheartening, particularly when matched with the sight of condominiums and vast housing projects sprouting up everywhere.

It seems to me that the charge could be made that Thais have attained the level of advance planning, with regard to city expansion, of that found in the U.S., where land owners and investors make most of the decisions.

Edited May 3, 2012 by CMX

[trainman34014]

I kind of disagree with people saying that developing paddy land along the main roads into town is worrisome. I think that's just expected for a city that's growing. Keep in mind the alternative is NOT expanding along those roads, but cramming all development into the downtown area, increasing congestion. Be careful what you wish for. An example of development not away from town you will see within the next couple of years around the old Rincome Hotel which will become a mall & cinema. Let's see how that works out for congestion. I bet by then people will be wishing they had the good sense to build it in a spot like the new Promenada, or Meechoke Plaza.

Also it's not like paddy land in the North is at risk of running out; as the city's borders extend, it just starts a little further out of the city center than it used to; no biggie. We're talking privately owned land only in use as rice paddies; not pristine forests or national parks. Eventually the likes of Doi Saket and Hang Dong will be merged into a larger city area, just like other villages before, like Ban Jed Yod, Fa Ham, etc.

Also, once paddy land is developed, it can't get burned anymore every March.

40 years ago we used to say this type of thing where I came from, but now when I return all I see is concrete and bricks where fields,hedgerows,streams, wildlife and rare wild flowers used to flourish. All in the name of progress they say but I don't believe that to be the real reason it happened. Many millions of bucks have been made from destroying what the almighty created and there were other ways to solve the problems of new road and housing requirements. Using 'Brownfield sites' instead of 'Greenbelt sites' makes a huge difference to how much land is gobbled up by building. Have a good look around in the City and you will see a lot of empty buildings that require renovation and could be used to house people and create new shops/offices etc. A lot of the new land that is being filled in is hosting shops with living quarters above and if the City planners had any sense they would encourage people to use existing redundant buildings. Traffic congestion can be remedied with the right road systems, underground parking facilities,integrated public transport systems and so on. Not much hope of any real sense coming to the surface though I would guess.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Yet you mentioned in your original OP 'beautified.' To those of us watching green fields being turned into storefronts and malls on our rides homeward, the specter of unlimited strip malls in all directions is disheartening, particularly when matched with the sight of condominiums and vast housing projects sprouting up everywhere.

With beautified I mean the renovation and re-use of old decrepit buildings downtown. That's happening. Slowly, but it IS happening. Which I think is mafnificent. Also see below:

Have a good look around in the City and you will see a lot of empty buildings that require renovation and could be used to house people and create new shops/offices etc. A lot of the new land that is being filled in is hosting shops with living quarters above and if the City planners had any sense they would encourage people to use existing redundant buildings.

Right. Well, buildings are privately owned, so it's the individual property owner's decision to either let it sit and decay, or renovate and repurpose it. As I said above, this IS happening, slowly. As the city grows, there is more and more value to being downtown. So I'm hoping and expecting that more and more old buildings, even the hideous concrete ones, will be renovated. Some examples below.

First a wooden building:

Ugly concrete building in iffy color 1:

REALLY ugly concrete building, redone as apartments / bed & breakfast :

(In the above also note the building to the left; that whole intersection looks a lot more civilized now compared to 4 years ago.)

Edited May 3, 2012 by WinnieTheKhwai

[WinnieTheKhwai]

BTW, you know which one I'm really, REALLY hoping will get renovated in my lifetime... This one. What a magnificent building, and what a waste. So many people driving past it on Thapae gate likely without noticing..

Imagine the value of that building in that location, compared to it's current use, to sell some dusty magazines..

[YoungBrit]

Thanks for posting those Winnie. Sometimes I forget how much it has changed and this has helped remind me. Very interesting indeed.

YoungBrit

[WinnieTheKhwai]

One more thing that happened in the last four years that I forgot to mention is that the ugly electrical cables were all removed and put underground on Chang Klan and Thapae Roads. Let's hope that some budget can be found to do it for more roads, Ratchadamnoen for example and other roads in the old town area. (Ratchadamnoen actually makes more sense than Chang Klan, which for more than half the day has those grubby night bazar carts along the road.)

Anyway, the below shots show the removal of the wires; also note the building on the right which has been renovated in a modern style.

[KhunVee]

BTW, you know which one I'm really, REALLY hoping will get renovated in my lifetime... This one. What a magnificent building, and what a waste. So many people driving past it on Thapae gate likely without noticing..

Imagine the value of that building in that location, compared to it's current use, to sell some dusty magazines..

you are AB-SO-LU-TE-LY right !!!

I've been admiring this house for YEARS!

Happy there's more people noticing these things,.... but my heart bleeds a lot and I actually go sad when houses like this get leveled and another frigging row of 5 shop/townhouses replaces it.

Seen this happening in Chiang Mai too many times.

[wolf5370]

Biggest thing I notice when riding around on my Bike is how many Paddy's are being filled in and built on. Shops, Offices, Houses, you name it, are springing up fast all around the Countryside, which is kind of sad as more green belt vanishes under concrete. Reminds me of the UK in the 80's when most of the green between my Village and the nearest Town vanished in the same way. Also a lot of old wooden houses are being demolished and more modern structures taking their place. I suppose this is progress but some of the more quaint aspects of Thailand are being taken from us.

Rather worrying some of these too. We watched a new row of houses going up in a paddy this year. They are maybe 50 meters from the edge of the paddy. They have been raised from the paddy floor about 15 feet or so, and "roads" (pathways/drives) have been banked up too on either end and one in the centre. Worry is, they were raised using brown earth, not concrete or even walled in soakaway. My feeling is that as the paddy around it fills up this rainy season the earth that banked it up (drives and under the slab foundations of the building) will become saturated and will leach. At some point it will either list or just collapse in on itself. They seem to be 2.5 floor properties, terraced. I would also be concerned about the legality of the land ownership too - much of the aggricultural land is NS2 or 3 and not chanote (as it really belongs to the state and was handed out for aggricultural use only), so chanotes (if they have them) may not be particularly kosher (like the ones on beach fronts and national parks that hits the news from time to time).

[bristolgeoff]

i remember the old sharky bar when it was a late closer.it was a popular place back then.chiang mai is changing as the years go by,as all things do