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Traffic Accident Victim In The Family - And Corrupt Cops


tutsiwarrior

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a BiL was involved in a serious accident that requires major surgery...the wife got hold of a police report that is a complete fabrication and it appears that the perp paid off the cops to obtain something favorable to him...now the wife wants to approach the local cops (the police report was issued by police in the next province) and seek justice...

I said: 'don't mess with the cops as they are a corrupt brotherhood and we presently have a peaceful life and we got kids to think of...' but she persists and then I said to contact a lawyer for him to handle her appeal as the cops wouldn't listen to her if she approached them directly herself...

what would you do?

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A Thai friend of mine caused a serious accident without fatalities, she paid the cops 10,000 baht to state on the crime report that she wasn't drunk when driving. The other driver tried to complain later and he was unceremoniously put in his place by the police.

Once it's in the system the only way it's coming out is by getting involved in a corruption allegation / investigation. Someone at the the other province is going to be hooked for this. That will go down like a ton of bricks and will most likely cause serious repercussions.

Your first reaction is correct, stay out of it. You cannot win here Tutsi, but you know that already.

ps There's also the possibility that the BiL is lying about the accident.

Edited by theblether
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By giving any recommendations you most likely will be viewed as responsible for the outcome, maybe even for funding the IMO hopeless crusade.

I would stay out of it completely and let the Thais do whatever the Thais want to do. In short "I don't know, why look at me, this is your country, I'm just a guest here". Not that you don't care of course, give her emotional support etc. But there are far more people within even our own direct circle of friends and family that at some point need help than most of us have the ability to do so without jeopardizing the future of our own family unit.

Presumably your SO has her own funds she can use if she'd like to help.

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the wife dominates her siblings and none of them lie or mess with her so I believe the BiL's story...we will haveta foot the medical bill anyway...looks like he needs his knee rebuilt with steel rods and etc...thb30k should do the trick in a local hospital but he'll never walk normally again...

oh, well...too bad but now he will have problems supporting his family and he has 2 little boys and etc...so it don't really matter as even the best medical care in BKK won't improve things...we'll just haveta buy them a 50k bag of rice from time to time...I just hate the idea of corrupt cops gettin' away with stuff...

thanks for yer comments...

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My gf & I came off our bike a few months ago, which put me in a wheelchair for nearly six weeks; while I was being maltreated in the local govt hospital (bandaged up and being sent out while still unable to walk) the gf, who was injured herself, was receiving calls from the local BiB demanding we attend the station as soon as we were released from hospital. When we attended, there were a dozen people in there all wanting a piece of the action; the big BiB came out and said to me, without asking ANY questions, "You wrong. You pay 20,000 baht and we finish. You not pay, we go to [the main station in Samui] and you go court, pay big fine. Be big trouble." The problem here was - I wasn't in the wrong.

At that stage, all I wanted to do was go to a proper hospital and get proper treatment, so I paid. The subsequent proper treatment has cost me over 150,000 baht so far, none of which was covered by insurance, because the BiB didn't write an accident report.

Unfortunately, these are the types of situations where the best thing to do is suck it up and move on.

Edited by jamesbrock
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My gf & I came off our bike a few months ago, which put me in a wheelchair for nearly six weeks; while I was being maltreated in the local govt hospital (bandaged up and being sent out while still unable to walk) the gf, who was injured herself, was receiving calls from the local BiB demanding we attend the station as soon as we were released from hospital. When we attended, there were a dozen people in there all wanting a piece of the action; the big BiB came out and said to me, without asking ANY questions, "You wrong. You pay 20,000 baht and we finish. You not pay, we go to [the main station in Samui] and you go court, pay big fine. Be big trouble." The problem here was - I wasn't in the wrong.

At that stage, all I wanted to do was go to a proper hospital and get proper treatment, so I paid. The subsequent proper treatment has cost me over 150,000 baht so far, none of which was covered by insurance, because the BiB didn't write an accident report.

Unfortunately, these are the types of situations where the best thing to do is suck it up and move on.

Paid for WHAT? Go to court for what? What law(s) are you accused of violating that would lead to a 20k Baht fine? What did the police say you did wrong? Drunk? Was your bike insured? Did you have a valid license?

Sounds like there's more to this story than you're sharing with us...

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My gf & I came off our bike a few months ago, which put me in a wheelchair for nearly six weeks; while I was being maltreated in the local govt hospital (bandaged up and being sent out while still unable to walk) the gf, who was injured herself, was receiving calls from the local BiB demanding we attend the station as soon as we were released from hospital. When we attended, there were a dozen people in there all wanting a piece of the action; the big BiB came out and said to me, without asking ANY questions, "You wrong. You pay 20,000 baht and we finish. You not pay, we go to [the main station in Samui] and you go court, pay big fine. Be big trouble." The problem here was - I wasn't in the wrong.

At that stage, all I wanted to do was go to a proper hospital and get proper treatment, so I paid. The subsequent proper treatment has cost me over 150,000 baht so far, none of which was covered by insurance, because the BiB didn't write an accident report.

Unfortunately, these are the types of situations where the best thing to do is suck it up and move on.

Paid for WHAT? Go to court for what? What law(s) are you accused of violating that would lead to a 20k Baht fine? What did the police say you did wrong? Drunk? Was your bike insured? Did you have a valid license?

Sounds like there's more to this story than you're sharing with us...

Surely you know that we farangs are always in the wrong even when we are in the right? Come on, you must have come across this type of " selective farang taxation" in the past.

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My gf & I came off our bike a few months ago, which put me in a wheelchair for nearly six weeks; while I was being maltreated in the local govt hospital (bandaged up and being sent out while still unable to walk) the gf, who was injured herself, was receiving calls from the local BiB demanding we attend the station as soon as we were released from hospital. When we attended, there were a dozen people in there all wanting a piece of the action; the big BiB came out and said to me, without asking ANY questions, "You wrong. You pay 20,000 baht and we finish. You not pay, we go to [the main station in Samui] and you go court, pay big fine. Be big trouble." The problem here was - I wasn't in the wrong.

At that stage, all I wanted to do was go to a proper hospital and get proper treatment, so I paid. The subsequent proper treatment has cost me over 150,000 baht so far, none of which was covered by insurance, because the BiB didn't write an accident report.

Unfortunately, these are the types of situations where the best thing to do is suck it up and move on.

Paid for WHAT? Go to court for what? What law(s) are you accused of violating that would lead to a 20k Baht fine? What did the police say you did wrong? Drunk? Was your bike insured? Did you have a valid license?

Sounds like there's more to this story than you're sharing with us...

Well, I've been called a "delusional Thai-hater" after sharing this story previously, so you inferring that I'm being somehow dishonest is nothing. I'm not sure what I could possibly hope to obtain by 'telling a lie' like this, or withholding pertinent facts, but you're obviously free to believe whatever you want.

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"Black box" recorders for bikes & cars cost considerably less than the THB 30k the OP has been asked to pay. IMO any residents that are otherwise legal should arm themselves with one & produce the files when needed. It's a no brainer.

Edited by evadgib
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"Black box" recorders for bikes & cars cost considerably less than the THB 30k the OP has been asked to pay. IMO any residents that are otherwise legal should arm themselves with one & produce the files when needed. It's a no brainer.

what is that? can you tell more?buy were?
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My gf & I came off our bike a few months ago, which put me in a wheelchair for nearly six weeks; while I was being maltreated in the local govt hospital (bandaged up and being sent out while still unable to walk) the gf, who was injured herself, was receiving calls from the local BiB demanding we attend the station as soon as we were released from hospital. When we attended, there were a dozen people in there all wanting a piece of the action; the big BiB came out and said to me, without asking ANY questions, "You wrong. You pay 20,000 baht and we finish. You not pay, we go to [the main station in Samui] and you go court, pay big fine. Be big trouble." The problem here was - I wasn't in the wrong.

At that stage, all I wanted to do was go to a proper hospital and get proper treatment, so I paid. The subsequent proper treatment has cost me over 150,000 baht so far, none of which was covered by insurance, because the BiB didn't write an accident report.

Unfortunately, these are the types of situations where the best thing to do is suck it up and move on.

Paid for WHAT? Go to court for what? What law(s) are you accused of violating that would lead to a 20k Baht fine? What did the police say you did wrong? Drunk? Was your bike insured? Did you have a valid license?

Sounds like there's more to this story than you're sharing with us...

Well, I've been called a "delusional Thai-hater" after sharing this story previously, so you inferring that I'm being somehow dishonest is nothing. I'm not sure what I could possibly hope to obtain by 'telling a lie' like this, or withholding pertinent facts, but you're obviously free to believe whatever you want.

James maybe a few more details would help clear things up because at the moment to the uninitiated it's reading like you and your gf fell off the bike and then the cops and lynchmob wanted a fair sum of money or its court and a massive fine which raises a few questions.

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"Black box" recorders for bikes & cars cost considerably less than the THB 30k the OP has been asked to pay. IMO any residents that are otherwise legal should arm themselves with one & produce the files when needed. It's a no brainer.

What he said.

Scams can range from being something like this:

or like this:

[media=]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lmpx_2zwPlg&feature=fvwrel

Not to mention dash cams can save your butt in the accidents especially in Thailand.

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"Black box" recorders for bikes & cars cost considerably less than the THB 30k the OP has been asked to pay. IMO any residents that are otherwise legal should arm themselves with one & produce the files when needed. It's a no brainer.

what is that? can you tell more?buy were?

Crille see here http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/557767-beware-of-accidents-with-motorbikes/#entry5331175

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My gf & I came off our bike a few months ago, which put me in a wheelchair for nearly six weeks; while I was being maltreated in the local govt hospital (bandaged up and being sent out while still unable to walk) the gf, who was injured herself, was receiving calls from the local BiB demanding we attend the station as soon as we were released from hospital. When we attended, there were a dozen people in there all wanting a piece of the action; the big BiB came out and said to me, without asking ANY questions, "You wrong. You pay 20,000 baht and we finish. You not pay, we go to [the main station in Samui] and you go court, pay big fine. Be big trouble." The problem here was - I wasn't in the wrong.

At that stage, all I wanted to do was go to a proper hospital and get proper treatment, so I paid. The subsequent proper treatment has cost me over 150,000 baht so far, none of which was covered by insurance, because the BiB didn't write an accident report.

Unfortunately, these are the types of situations where the best thing to do is suck it up and move on.

Paid for WHAT? Go to court for what? What law(s) are you accused of violating that would lead to a 20k Baht fine? What did the police say you did wrong? Drunk? Was your bike insured? Did you have a valid license?

Sounds like there's more to this story than you're sharing with us...

*Contents of deleted post removed.*

I followed James whole story from the start and while he probably was put under pressure by the cops and not given time to think , his story does change alittle bit in his original post he fully admitted the accident was his fault , this post claims he was not in the wrong.

20,000 bht was not a bad outcome and the 150,000 medical bill well we all know if you don't have insurance and wear protective gear you can be in for dome big bills from James story he was pretty lucky with his injuries could have been a lot worse but that is a whole new topic

Edited by metisdead
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My gf & I came off our bike a few months ago, which put me in a wheelchair for nearly six weeks; while I was being maltreated in the local govt hospital (bandaged up and being sent out while still unable to walk) the gf, who was injured herself, was receiving calls from the local BiB demanding we attend the station as soon as we were released from hospital. When we attended, there were a dozen people in there all wanting a piece of the action; the big BiB came out and said to me, without asking ANY questions, "You wrong. You pay 20,000 baht and we finish. You not pay, we go to [the main station in Samui] and you go court, pay big fine. Be big trouble." The problem here was - I wasn't in the wrong.

At that stage, all I wanted to do was go to a proper hospital and get proper treatment, so I paid. The subsequent proper treatment has cost me over 150,000 baht so far, none of which was covered by insurance, because the BiB didn't write an accident report.

Unfortunately, these are the types of situations where the best thing to do is suck it up and move on.

Paid for WHAT? Go to court for what? What law(s) are you accused of violating that would lead to a 20k Baht fine? What did the police say you did wrong? Drunk? Was your bike insured? Did you have a valid license?

Sounds like there's more to this story than you're sharing with us...

Surely you know that we farangs are always in the wrong even when we are in the right? Come on, you must have come across this type of " selective farang taxation" in the past.

I disagree Blether – In 15 years in Thailand I’ve experienced nothing other than fair treatment no different to that any Thai would experience

The issue of blaming the foreigner simply because he’s foreign does not exist.

The issue of blaming anyone who will accept the blame without resistance does exist – I believe this is where many foreigners will fall on their face, they are faced with the blame simply because the police are lazy and looking for the path of least resistance. In general foreigners simply accept the blame too easily and the police know this (they don't care if you are a foreigner or not).

The police do and will try it on, but when they face polite resistance they will generally take another path.

It’s not that the foreigner is always in the wrong. Its simply that the quickest and easiest person to blame is blamed first.

Even the last two times I've been pulled over in my car (twice in 2 years) I refused to accept fault and eventually waved along (Thai's were also pulled over in other cars). However, before that when I knew I had done something wrong I accepted fault quickly and dealt with the matter efficiently.

Edited by richard_smith237
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Chances are you're not important or influential enough to affect the outcome, but once in awhile there are cases where the little person does end up 'winning' ....usually it involves the press helping out a bit.... which often has all kinds of politics of its own... the least of which is that your story has to be interesting media material, which I'm not sure if it even meets that criteria.

:)

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My gf & I came off our bike a few months ago, which put me in a wheelchair for nearly six weeks; while I was being maltreated in the local govt hospital (bandaged up and being sent out while still unable to walk) the gf, who was injured herself, was receiving calls from the local BiB demanding we attend the station as soon as we were released from hospital. When we attended, there were a dozen people in there all wanting a piece of the action; the big BiB came out and said to me, without asking ANY questions, "You wrong. You pay 20,000 baht and we finish. You not pay, we go to [the main station in Samui] and you go court, pay big fine. Be big trouble." The problem here was - I wasn't in the wrong.

At that stage, all I wanted to do was go to a proper hospital and get proper treatment, so I paid. The subsequent proper treatment has cost me over 150,000 baht so far, none of which was covered by insurance, because the BiB didn't write an accident report.

Unfortunately, these are the types of situations where the best thing to do is suck it up and move on.

I followed James whole story from the start and while he probably was put under pressure by the cops and not given time to think , his story does change alittle bit in his original post he fully admitted the accident was his fault , this post claims he was not in the wrong.

Interesting. But I wouldn't say it changed "a little bit," but rather a lot. Whether he was in the wrong or not is a rather important piece of information. This is standard TV protocol, however, which is to embellish a story to garner sympathy.

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I'm really sad to say but, i hired a so called lawyer to take a police to court for not giving back money he borrowed,

as it happened, she didnt do anything, and instead she borrowed money too, before she disappeared too

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Even the last two times I've been pulled over in my car (twice in 2 years) I refused to accept fault and eventually waved along (Thai's were also pulled over in other cars). However, before that when I knew I had done something wrong I accepted fault quickly and dealt with the matter efficiently.

This is precisely my experience.

As a foreigner, of course I'm an easy target but I've found that the more you stand up to them the more they will back down. In my first couple of years driving in Thailand I was regularly pulled aside at tollbooths claiming I'd illegally swapped lanes etc; 200 seemed an easy solution.

However, as i learned more Thai and gained more confidence, the dynamic changed. Sure I would get pulled over, but by calmly asking the precise details of what I had done and insisting there was no infringment and standing my ground, I've found they soon get bored - it's usually 2-3 minutes - realise you're not a pushover and tell you to move on.

It's intriguing watching their big greedy 'oh, a farang opportunity' eyes get more an more disappointed as they realise this one is not gonna get suckered.

There is not much I don't like about Thailand, except for the police. I truly despise them and refuse to be bullied by the pot-bellied pigs.

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I was recently involved in an accident .. I was stationary and the other car , on an empty road , lost control and crashed into a concrete pole .. Thankfully nobody was hurt ..

I considered myself a witness to a dangerous driving event .. my insurance agreed ..

However the police report was made up without speaking to me or my passengers or another witness .. The local prosecutor , again without speaking to me , decided I was guilty of a criminal charge .. basing his assumptions on an incorrect police report .

To cut a long story short , and after being locked in a cell for an afternoon and my passport being confiscated , I am in court on Monday ... I have decided to plead guilty and say I caused the accident ... Just by being there I was at fault . I am in a no win situation and have been told through local contacts that I will be found guilty ( even though nobody yet knows the facts )

I then at least have my passport back ... but will be landed with a civil case from the other driver to recover damages , which my insurance should pay ..

But I agree with other posters that it seems to be very difficult to get justice and one has to accept that the least stressful route is probably the best . I would try and avoid courts at all costs ...

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I was recently involved in an accident .. I was stationary and the other car , on an empty road , lost control and crashed into a concrete pole .. Thankfully nobody was hurt ..

I considered myself a witness to a dangerous driving event .. my insurance agreed ..

However the police report was made up without speaking to me or my passengers or another witness .. The local prosecutor , again without speaking to me , decided I was guilty of a criminal charge .. basing his assumptions on an incorrect police report .

To cut a long story short , and after being locked in a cell for an afternoon and my passport being confiscated , I am in court on Monday ... I have decided to plead guilty and say I caused the accident ... Just by being there I was at fault . I am in a no win situation and have been told through local contacts that I will be found guilty ( even though nobody yet knows the facts )

I then at least have my passport back ... but will be landed with a civil case from the other driver to recover damages , which my insurance should pay ..

But I agree with other posters that it seems to be very difficult to get justice and one has to accept that the least stressful route is probably the best . I would try and avoid courts at all costs ...

This is terrible and quite a contrast to what I have experienced and witnessed in Thailand (that of friends too).

It just goes to show that for different people in different areas and given different circumstances there is no norm and experiences can differ dramatically.

No one can truly tell how they will respond unless in the same situation, but I’d like to think I would fight this as far as I can.

Sometimes it is easier to simply allow yourself to become the path of least resistance, it might be cheaper in the long run too. I can certainly understand Churchill for making this decision.

However, I can’t help but think that in the same circumstances I would fight this all the way starting out with accusations against the police officer who made the a false report.

Of course, without adequate back up this can prove somewhat difficult.

On the incident, why were you locked up? Was the other driver also locked up? Did you sign any Police report? We're you stopped at traffic lights or just on the side of the road? (i.e. could you have been stopped in a 'no-stop area? - I think main highways might be a non-stop area).

Was the other driver tested for drink driving?, could they calculate speed etc ?... I suspect that with an honest and good lawyer you might have a shot.

Best of luck.

Edited by richard_smith237
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My gf & I came off our bike a few months ago, which put me in a wheelchair for nearly six weeks; while I was being maltreated in the local govt hospital (bandaged up and being sent out while still unable to walk) the gf, who was injured herself, was receiving calls from the local BiB demanding we attend the station as soon as we were released from hospital. When we attended, there were a dozen people in there all wanting a piece of the action; the big BiB came out and said to me, without asking ANY questions, "You wrong. You pay 20,000 baht and we finish. You not pay, we go to [the main station in Samui] and you go court, pay big fine. Be big trouble." The problem here was - I wasn't in the wrong.

At that stage, all I wanted to do was go to a proper hospital and get proper treatment, so I paid. The subsequent proper treatment has cost me over 150,000 baht so far, none of which was covered by insurance, because the BiB didn't write an accident report.

Unfortunately, these are the types of situations where the best thing to do is suck it up and move on.

I followed James whole story from the start and while he probably was put under pressure by the cops and not given time to think , his story does change alittle bit in his original post he fully admitted the accident was his fault , this post claims he was not in the wrong.

Interesting. But I wouldn't say it changed "a little bit," but rather a lot. Whether he was in the wrong or not is a rather important piece of information. This is standard TV protocol, however, which is to embellish a story to garner sympathy.

Did I miss some posts? I have only seen the above quoted post by JamesBrock, but you 2 seem to know a lot more about it than i do from reading it.

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My gf & I came off our bike a few months ago, which put me in a wheelchair for nearly six weeks; while I was being maltreated in the local govt hospital (bandaged up and being sent out while still unable to walk) the gf, who was injured herself, was receiving calls from the local BiB demanding we attend the station as soon as we were released from hospital. When we attended, there were a dozen people in there all wanting a piece of the action; the big BiB came out and said to me, without asking ANY questions, "You wrong. You pay 20,000 baht and we finish. You not pay, we go to [the main station in Samui] and you go court, pay big fine. Be big trouble." The problem here was - I wasn't in the wrong.

At that stage, all I wanted to do was go to a proper hospital and get proper treatment, so I paid. The subsequent proper treatment has cost me over 150,000 baht so far, none of which was covered by insurance, because the BiB didn't write an accident report.

Unfortunately, these are the types of situations where the best thing to do is suck it up and move on.

Paid for WHAT? Go to court for what? What law(s) are you accused of violating that would lead to a 20k Baht fine? What did the police say you did wrong? Drunk? Was your bike insured? Did you have a valid license?

Sounds like there's more to this story than you're sharing with us...

Well, I've been called a "delusional Thai-hater" after sharing this story previously, so you inferring that I'm being somehow dishonest is nothing. I'm not sure what I could possibly hope to obtain by 'telling a lie' like this, or withholding pertinent facts, but you're obviously free to believe whatever you want.

Dear James,

I'm not attacking you, I'm just asking for more details, because the story, as you've reported it in this thread, doesn't make much sense.

There has to be more to the story. And it seems, from subsequent posts that indeed there is more to the story. (I guess it's covered in another thread? Perhaps you can provide a link?)

I don't want to ASSUME anything, but either you were guilty or you weren't. I realize that sometimes even if innocent it's still easier and less headache to just pay off the cops in Thailand. If that's the case, please say so.

Your comment about needing a police report in order for your insurance to cover your medical bills also sounds a bit suspect. When I crashed my bike my health insurance company (BUPA) didn't require or ask for a police report. But it's stated quite clearly in the policy that I'm not covered if driving drunk and also that coverage limits are 50% for motorcycle accidents. (This type of language is common to pretty much all health insurance policies I looked at prior to choosing BUPA).

Wishing you a full and speedy recovery. Again, I'm not here to attack you, I just want to understand why you had to pay 20,000 Baht when you say that you weren't in the wrong. Was is blatant police corruption or were you actually in the wrong?

Thanks for any clarification you can provide.

Ride on!

Tony

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I was recently involved in an accident .. I was stationary and the other car , on an empty road , lost control and crashed into a concrete pole .. Thankfully nobody was hurt ..

I considered myself a witness to a dangerous driving event .. my insurance agreed ..

However the police report was made up without speaking to me or my passengers or another witness .. The local prosecutor , again without speaking to me , decided I was guilty of a criminal charge .. basing his assumptions on an incorrect police report .

To cut a long story short , and after being locked in a cell for an afternoon and my passport being confiscated , I am in court on Monday ... I have decided to plead guilty and say I caused the accident ... Just by being there I was at fault . I am in a no win situation and have been told through local contacts that I will be found guilty ( even though nobody yet knows the facts )

I then at least have my passport back ... but will be landed with a civil case from the other driver to recover damages , which my insurance should pay ..

But I agree with other posters that it seems to be very difficult to get justice and one has to accept that the least stressful route is probably the best . I would try and avoid courts at all costs ...

Your insurance doesn't include bail bond? Bummer!

IF your insurance company is potentially liable for a claim it's in their own fiduciary interest to send an attorney to represent you in court. (that's what my insurance company did when I was a witness to a fatal accident).

You SHOULD go to court and declare your innocence! Thai municipal courts are remarkably fair, impartial and just.

Court is were the TRUTH will be determined and is a check against corrupt police actions like the one you've described.

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