Steroid Vacation In Thailand

[thetitan99]

This is the same sort of "Reefer Madness" BS that always goes on when the hyper-opinionated are completely ill-informed. How does this work where your heart explodes? I guess you think the steroid works on your "heart muscle until it gets so big it explodes? Jeez!!! Here's a hint for the morons. A major precursor to heart problem stems from LOW TESTOSTERONE LEVELS!!! Did any of you know that? Guess not. The fact is if you monitor your blood pressure, get some cardio exercise and stick to injectables rather than oral steroids your heart liver and kidneys are in much less danger than those who eat deep-fried pizza, smoke like chimneys and drink like jackasses. I know none of the super smart, health concious becons of brilliance on this forum would do anything like this!! No way!! MUCH TO SMART FOR THAT!! The fact is, more people have died from taking Flintstone vitimans. That's a fact. The instance of hospitalization for the use of asprin is 20 times higher than AAS or any of their ancillaries. This is also a fact. I saw this douche bag who wrote this tripe researching on Bodybuilding.com and the Anabolic Review 2 months ago and he had absolutely zero knowledge of anything to do with steroids. Now he's written an article that contains no facts. However, people like Yunia and some other experts are spouting BS about steroids being uppers (<deleted>!!?) and how scary it would be to run in to a guy post cycle in a dark ally. Is this because his estrogen levels might be a little high and he would want to watch Sex in the City? Because this would be the case, not raging like a maniac. Laughable if not so paralitacally retarded.

Now, as far as Doctors are concerned, when steroids were outlawed in the states they consulted the AMA, the American heart foundation, all the leading endrocrinologists and were brought before the U.S. Senate Sub comittee on steroids and, without exception, stated that it was idiocy to outlaw anabolic steroids. So, in true form for U.S law makers, they listened to the testimony of Jose Conseco and Mark Maquire. Joe Biden (maybe the stupidest man in modern politics) testified that it was "unfair" to use these performance inhancing drugs in PROFESSIONAL SPORTS and hola, they were banned. DID YOU ALL GET THAT? That said, I get blood work done once every 4 months and have full blood panels done and couldn't be more healthy. You also test for female hormones. I had a Doctor ask me what I would do if my estrogen levels were to high? Itold him I would take a selective estrogen receptor modulator. He didn't know what that was. A Doctor. The truth is, bodybuilders live THE healthiest, most disiplined, closely monitored life styles of any pro or amateur sport, hands down. All this anti steroid blabbering by fools like many of those above are fueled by a sheep-like mentality to believe anything they read, but more often than not it's pure envy, plain and simple. In case you haven't guessed, I use AAS, I'm 47 years old and I look better than any 21 year old I see. It's a very comforting rationalization for the lazy, the fat and the inferior to believe the difference between them and me is not genetics, extremely disiplined training, regimented, unwavering dieatary disiplline and a committment to a lifestyle which constantly monitors medical health along with brutally honest self evaluation. It's instead a small oil injection of a hormone that the body produces naturally and tapers in production in later life. Anyone who things that "Juicers" pump themselves full of dangerous chemicals and "Swell up to huge proportions" is an ill-informed envious idiot that will be proved wrong with the massive surge in anti-aging research and hormone replacement therapy. Your father didn't have a choice, you do.

[bangkokheat]

This is the same sort of "Reefer Madness" BS that always goes on when the hyper-opinionated are completely ill-informed. How does this work where your heart explodes? I guess you think the steroid works on your "heart muscle until it gets so big it explodes? Jeez!!! Here's a hint for the morons. A major precursor to heart problem stems from LOW TESTOSTERONE LEVELS!!! Did any of you know that? Guess not. The fact is if you monitor your blood pressure, get some cardio exercise and stick to injectables rather than oral steroids your heart liver and kidneys are in much less danger than those who eat deep-fried pizza, smoke like chimneys and drink like jackasses. I know none of the super smart, health concious becons of brilliance on this forum would do anything like this!! No way!! MUCH TO SMART FOR THAT!! The fact is, more people have died from taking Flintstone vitimans. That's a fact. The instance of hospitalization for the use of asprin is 20 times higher than AAS or any of their ancillaries. This is also a fact. I saw this douche bag who wrote this tripe researching on Bodybuilding.com and the Anabolic Review 2 months ago and he had absolutely zero knowledge of anything to do with steroids. Now he's written an article that contains no facts. However, people like Yunia and some other experts are spouting BS about steroids being uppers (<deleted>!!?) and how scary it would be to run in to a guy post cycle in a dark ally. Is this because his estrogen levels might be a little high and he would want to watch Sex in the City? Because this would be the case, not raging like a maniac. Laughable if not so paralitacally retarded.

Now, as far as Doctors are concerned, when steroids were outlawed in the states they consulted the AMA, the American heart foundation, all the leading endrocrinologists and were brought before the U.S. Senate Sub comittee on steroids and, without exception, stated that it was idiocy to outlaw anabolic steroids. So, in true form for U.S law makers, they listened to the testimony of Jose Conseco and Mark Maquire. Joe Biden (maybe the stupidest man in modern politics) testified that it was "unfair" to use these performance inhancing drugs in PROFESSIONAL SPORTS and hola, they were banned. DID YOU ALL GET THAT? That said, I get blood work done once every 4 months and have full blood panels done and couldn't be more healthy. You also test for female hormones. I had a Doctor ask me what I would do if my estrogen levels were to high? Itold him I would take a selective estrogen receptor modulator. He didn't know what that was. A Doctor. The truth is, bodybuilders live THE healthiest, most disiplined, closely monitored life styles of any pro or amateur sport, hands down. All this anti steroid blabbering by fools like many of those above are fueled by a sheep-like mentality to believe anything they read, but more often than not it's pure envy, plain and simple. In case you haven't guessed, I use AAS, I'm 47 years old and I look better than any 21 year old I see. It's a very comforting rationalization for the lazy, the fat and the inferior to believe the difference between them and me is not genetics, extremely disiplined training, regimented, unwavering dieatary disiplline and a committment to a lifestyle which constantly monitors medical health along with brutally honest self evaluation. It's instead a small oil injection of a hormone that the body produces naturally and tapers in production in later life. Anyone who things that "Juicers" pump themselves full of dangerous chemicals and "Swell up to huge proportions" is an ill-informed envious idiot that will be proved wrong with the massive surge in anti-aging research and hormone replacement therapy. Your father didn't have a choice, you do.

well done, your on my xmas card list, straight to the point, well explained and THE TRUTH

[ttelise]

Bangkokheat:

Man I cannot quote anymore because typing on iPhone and doing that is not working well.

I hear you about preserving the integrity of your body. Antibiotics are bad for you and they have a cascading effect natural substances, like some opiates, do not have. They can cause a flora imbalance and some if the popular first line gram negatives (Levoquin, Avelox and etc.) can cause spontaneous tendon ruptures and a litany of other problems. Antibiotics are effectively selective poisons.

Opiates simply are not bad for one when not abused. The problem with tolerance and dependence really only becomes an issue for those predisposed to addiction. Opiates do cause slow motility which retains toxins in the body longer than desired.

The synthetics are nasty and the body cannot achieve homeostasis on the synthetics such ad methadone and Bupe/Suboxone. The naltrexenone in suboxone us particularly harsh on the body also.

Opiate abuse is bad, but taking opiates innoroper prescribed doses for pain control is not really bad at all on the body. The body does decrease dopamine and endorphine response, but production returns to normal levels Ina relatively short time.

RE: Shuppe saying opiates cause ED from dopamine

Dopamine from opiate use does erectile dysfunction. Increase in dopamine can actually increae libido. I have taken leva dopa (the only substance that crosses BBB and converts to dopamine) for increased GH production in the past and this causes a huge libido increae.

Dopamine is a precusor to gh production. hGH has a fountain of youth effect, one of which is a huge increae in libido.

Haha, I am 45 and I have to get up almost every night and walk it off because it hurts and I get concerned about the four hour thing. I have great natural GH levels (IGF-1 runs around 300 to 350). Levadopa and Rhodiola generally gives me about a 20 percent boost in GH on top of that when I do it once or twice a year for four weeks in an OTC supplement called IGF-2.

I don't advocate the recreational use of opiates, but someone stated they were worse for the body than steroids which us an absolute crock.

Edited May 29, 2012 by ttelise

[ttelise]

This is the same sort of "Reefer Madness" BS that always goes on when the hyper-opinionated are completely ill-informed. How does this work where your heart explodes? I guess you think the steroid works on your "heart muscle until it gets so big it explodes? Jeez!!! Here's a hint for the morons. A major precursor to heart problem stems from LOW TESTOSTERONE LEVELS!!! Did any of you know that? Guess not. The fact is if you monitor your blood pressure, get some cardio exercise and stick to injectables rather than oral steroids your heart liver and kidneys are in much less danger than those who eat deep-fried pizza, smoke like chimneys and drink like jackasses. I know none of the super smart, health concious becons of brilliance on this forum would do anything like this!! No way!! MUCH TO SMART FOR THAT!! The fact is, more people have died from taking Flintstone vitimans. That's a fact. The instance of hospitalization for the use of asprin is 20 times higher than AAS or any of their ancillaries. This is also a fact. I saw this douche bag who wrote this tripe researching on Bodybuilding.com and the Anabolic Review 2 months ago and he had absolutely zero knowledge of anything to do with steroids. Now he's written an article that contains no facts. However, people like Yunia and some other experts are spouting BS about steroids being uppers (<deleted>!!?) and how scary it would be to run in to a guy post cycle in a dark ally. Is this because his estrogen levels might be a little high and he would want to watch Sex in the City? Because this would be the case, not raging like a maniac. Laughable if not so paralitacally retarded.

Now, as far as Doctors are concerned, when steroids were outlawed in the states they consulted the AMA, the American heart foundation, all the leading endrocrinologists and were brought before the U.S. Senate Sub comittee on steroids and, without exception, stated that it was idiocy to outlaw anabolic steroids. So, in true form for U.S law makers, they listened to the testimony of Jose Conseco and Mark Maquire. Joe Biden (maybe the stupidest man in modern politics) testified that it was "unfair" to use these performance inhancing drugs in PROFESSIONAL SPORTS and hola, they were banned. DID YOU ALL GET THAT? That said, I get blood work done once every 4 months and have full blood panels done and couldn't be more healthy. You also test for female hormones. I had a Doctor ask me what I would do if my estrogen levels were to high? Itold him I would take a selective estrogen receptor modulator. He didn't know what that was. A Doctor. The truth is, bodybuilders live THE healthiest, most disiplined, closely monitored life styles of any pro or amateur sport, hands down. All this anti steroid blabbering by fools like many of those above are fueled by a sheep-like mentality to believe anything they read, but more often than not it's pure envy, plain and simple. In case you haven't guessed, I use AAS, I'm 47 years old and I look better than any 21 year old I see. It's a very comforting rationalization for the lazy, the fat and the inferior to believe the difference between them and me is not genetics, extremely disiplined training, regimented, unwavering dieatary disiplline and a committment to a lifestyle which constantly monitors medical health along with brutally honest self evaluation. It's instead a small oil injection of a hormone that the body produces naturally and tapers in production in later life. Anyone who things that "Juicers" pump themselves full of dangerous chemicals and "Swell up to huge proportions" is an ill-informed envious idiot that will be proved wrong with the massive surge in anti-aging research and hormone replacement therapy. Your father didn't have a choice, you do.

Roid rage much???

Haha, I could tell you were on AAS before I even got down to that part. Wrong, wrong and wrong except for fact that body builders do live healthy lives as far as macro nutrition and exercise.

Sounds as if you are on HRT presumably because you are deficient naturally. If HRT, I agree there should be no adverse health consequences except you cannot get an erection or function without your injections for the rest of your life. The danger is the gear heads doing 1000 of test a week stacked with others along with 10 to 20 ius of hGH at a pop. We are not talking about dangers of HRT.

Women are on HRT and I assume you also believe that is very safe and in fact healthy.

I am a mass tort lawyer and won a 42 million dollar judgment for 6 ladies in a consolidated trial in Las Vegas 3 or so years ago and then hit for 10.2 million in Philadelphia for 2 more ladies in a jury trial.

All 8 cases were HRT cases and each one of my clients had terminal illnesses caused by HRT. So HRT not so safe.

Edited May 29, 2012 by ttelise

[Shurup]

Seeing as you're female, I've got to ask: what do you know about the birth control (BC) pills? I bet you were on them at some point of your life, but did you know it's also classified as a synthetic steroid? Did you know the BC pills are more harmful than the injectable steroid testosterone in amounts similar to those in BC pills? What makes the BC pills good and testosterone bad? Only the fact that testosterone can be abused and BC pills not and that automatically doesn't make all steroid users bad people. The way I see it, girls take BC pills for the recreational lifestyle and not out of necessity.

You have made a statement that is not factually supported. Can you cite the specific clinical studies and research that supports your statement? No, you cannot. Birth control is safe when the dosing guidelines are followed. Yes there are some issues that have arisen,but they relate to the use of the products off script or in situations contrary to the dosing guidelines, i.e. improper screening. Birth control "pill" use has been widespread since the 1960's. Hundreds of millions of women have used the formulations to the point where the risks and contradictions are known. These pills have saved lives, and provided a better quality of life for their users since their introduction. One cannot say the same thing about off prescription testosterone use.

The subject here is the use and availability of steroids in Thailand. It is not their legitimacy. The fact of the matter is that the steroids obtained at the street level are often counterfeit or are of undetermined origin. FULL STOP. Can you proviode one reference where the recreational steroids obtained on the Thai black market were quality assured? You cannot, because the reality is that the drugs available outside legal distribution channels are likely to be conterfeit. The likelihood is even greater the more "valuable" the drug is. It is not worth a counterfeiters time to make bogus birth control pills since the generic versions are often handed out for free by NGOs or made available at a negligible cost. Injectable testosterone, the kind favoured by self appointed endocrinologists that spend their time in a gym, is expensive and a lucrative item to be counterfeited.

I offer this challenge. Take 10 vials of injectable testosterone you purchase in the black market and have them tested. I guarantee that the quality will be questionable in all vials. There will either be contaminants, or the drug will be from a lot that was supposed to have been destroyed due to age or defect, or there will be an inadequacy of the ATI. In Thailand, drugs that ould have been destroyed elsewhere, often end up for resale on the black market.

I challenge anyone to show that the off script steroids they purchase and use in Thailand would meet the legal quality requirements.

When someone takes liver toxic substances (alcohol, oral steroids and even drugs like paracetamol), liver can slowly get rid of them. If the consumption rate is lover then the removal rate - nothing happens, if the cosumption rate is higher then the removal but it's done for short time periods, the liver will handle it but if the consumption rate is higher then the removal rate and it's done for a long time frame, the liver will fail at some point.

BC pills are syntetic steroids (estrogen + progesteron) and being oral, just like the oral anabolics, they are chemically altered (c17 alpha alkylated) in order to prevent the drug from being deactivated by the liver so the drug can reach the bloodstream. Prolonged exposure to this type of altered drugs when taken in larger quantities can cause liver cancers. BC pills are taken in such small amounts that liver can easily remove the toxins so technically they are "safe" however add here other rec drugs and booze some party girls might take and it all adds up. Before the BC script is issued a blood work is required (not in Thailand from what I see) and some individuals may not be good candidates for the BC pills depending on their liver function.

On the other hand the injectable testosterone do not need to be modified is such a way as the drug is slowly released from the injection (depot) site directly into the blood stream so in this way it's safer than the BC pills. That what I was saying in my post that you quoted. Now if it's injected in huge doses it still is harmfull to the liver as it (including the natural T) is still broken down by the liver so if it's abused (taken in insanely huge amounts and/or for prolonged periods of time) it's gonna hurt you and that's why smart BBs doing frequent blood works to avoid the troubles. I talked about the HRT doses in my post however so it's less harmful than the BC pills. I'm not gonna provide you with any links, I've done my research so you're welcome to prove me wrong with links to researches saying otherwise after you do your homework.

Not sure what you mean by BC pills saved lifes. One can argue that they're taken for recreational purposes: using condoms isn't a life treatening condition; refraining from sex isn't a life treatening conditon... Sounds purely recreational use to me but hey, there is no potential to abuse them and it makes everyone happy so nobody talks about it.

You don't need to buy steroid from the Black market, Testosterone Enanthate (aka Testoviron Depot) is legally available OTC in Thailand and there is no police that check how much of it someone pinned himself with. Of course there are other drugs that's only available on the black market and it's up to an individual what they want to inject themselves with. Most BBs don't venture furthen than using Testosterone Enanthate which is the most common (and legal) BB steroid.

[Shurup]

...

The longer you take steroids of any kind without stopping, the greater chance you have of permanent shutting down natural testosterone production. If you don't use a post cycle therapy immediately after a 6 or 8 week cycle, you may not be able to stimulate LH production in the testes ever again.

...

Again, there is no such thing as a permanent shutdown. The longer someone takes then, the longer it will take to recover but even without the PCT it will eventially come back.

Do you know who Scott Siegel is? He was that big meat head steroid dealer in the movie Wrestler. Too bad he took that movie personage into the real word and eventially got busted for dealing steroids. After being on stuff for 2 DECADES (!!!) was was forced to quit cold turkey when he was thrown to jail. It took him 8 months to recover before his body started producing T naturally again. No PCT, nothing.

[Shurup]

I'm out of this debate, can't argue with people who have no idea what they're talking about and seeing as where this topic went, I don't think it will be opened for much longer.

[ttelise]

...

The longer you take steroids of any kind without stopping, the greater chance you have of permanent shutting down natural testosterone production. If you don't use a post cycle therapy immediately after a 6 or 8 week cycle, you may not be able to stimulate LH production in the testes ever again.

...

Again, there is no such thing as a permanent shutdown. The longer someone takes then, the longer it will take to recover but even without the PCT it will eventially come back.

Do you know who Scott Siegel is? He was that big meat head steroid dealer in the movie Wrestler. Too bad he took that movie personage into the real word and eventially got busted for dealing steroids. After being on stuff for 2 DECADES (!!!) was was forced to quit cold turkey when he was thrown to jail. It took him 8 months to recover before his body started producing T naturally again. No PCT, nothing.

Seriously, have you ever even been in a gym. I am in there every day and been lifting since 14. My two best friends have been on roids and HRT since the early 90s. Both shut down.

I have known of Scott for years. Dude, you are the Ine reading stuff if you think he is not shut down. He maybe went through acute withdrawals for 8 months, but shut down is linger than withdrawals. Do you even know what all health consequences he suffered inlcuding infections and heart issues? Do you know what he was injecting directly into his biceps, what his levels are today or whether he is in HRT today?

Do you even know what shut down means?

Shutdown does not mean zero. Shut down can be 200 or lower. Try living at those levels after being normal or out of range high.

I remember seeing studies showing that 83 percent if body builders doing roids at levels if 675 a week or more had an ejection fraction if less than 55 perecent (not good in case you didn't know) where as around 5 percent of the same age group with no history of steroid use has an ejection fracture of less than 55 percent.

Seriously, I tried to be nice even though I could see you were completely clueless pages ago when saying opiates cause ED because of dopamine increae. Haha, now you bring up Scott to prove that roids are harmless. You are hilarious.

[thetitan99]

This is the same sort of "Reefer Madness" BS that always goes on when the hyper-opinionated are completely ill-informed. How does this work where your heart explodes? I guess you think the steroid works on your "heart muscle until it gets so big it explodes? Jeez!!! Here's a hint for the morons. A major precursor to heart problem stems from LOW TESTOSTERONE LEVELS!!! Did any of you know that? Guess not. The fact is if you monitor your blood pressure, get some cardio exercise and stick to injectables rather than oral steroids your heart liver and kidneys are in much less danger than those who eat deep-fried pizza, smoke like chimneys and drink like jackasses. I know none of the super smart, health concious becons of brilliance on this forum would do anything like this!! No way!! MUCH TO SMART FOR THAT!! The fact is, more people have died from taking Flintstone vitimans. That's a fact. The instance of hospitalization for the use of asprin is 20 times higher than AAS or any of their ancillaries. This is also a fact. I saw this douche bag who wrote this tripe researching on Bodybuilding.com and the Anabolic Review 2 months ago and he had absolutely zero knowledge of anything to do with steroids. Now he's written an article that contains no facts. However, people like Yunia and some other experts are spouting BS about steroids being uppers (<deleted>!!?) and how scary it would be to run in to a guy post cycle in a dark ally. Is this because his estrogen levels might be a little high and he would want to watch Sex in the City? Because this would be the case, not raging like a maniac. Laughable if not so paralitacally retarded.

Now, as far as Doctors are concerned, when steroids were outlawed in the states they consulted the AMA, the American heart foundation, all the leading endrocrinologists and were brought before the U.S. Senate Sub comittee on steroids and, without exception, stated that it was idiocy to outlaw anabolic steroids. So, in true form for U.S law makers, they listened to the testimony of Jose Conseco and Mark Maquire. Joe Biden (maybe the stupidest man in modern politics) testified that it was "unfair" to use these performance inhancing drugs in PROFESSIONAL SPORTS and hola, they were banned. DID YOU ALL GET THAT? That said, I get blood work done once every 4 months and have full blood panels done and couldn't be more healthy. You also test for female hormones. I had a Doctor ask me what I would do if my estrogen levels were to high? Itold him I would take a selective estrogen receptor modulator. He didn't know what that was. A Doctor. The truth is, bodybuilders live THE healthiest, most disiplined, closely monitored life styles of any pro or amateur sport, hands down. All this anti steroid blabbering by fools like many of those above are fueled by a sheep-like mentality to believe anything they read, but more often than not it's pure envy, plain and simple. In case you haven't guessed, I use AAS, I'm 47 years old and I look better than any 21 year old I see. It's a very comforting rationalization for the lazy, the fat and the inferior to believe the difference between them and me is not genetics, extremely disiplined training, regimented, unwavering dieatary disiplline and a committment to a lifestyle which constantly monitors medical health along with brutally honest self evaluation. It's instead a small oil injection of a hormone that the body produces naturally and tapers in production in later life. Anyone who things that "Juicers" pump themselves full of dangerous chemicals and "Swell up to huge proportions" is an ill-informed envious idiot that will be proved wrong with the massive surge in anti-aging research and hormone replacement therapy. Your father didn't have a choice, you do.

Roid rage much???

Haha, I could tell you were on AAS before I even got down to that part. Wrong, wrong and wrong except for fact that body builders do live healthy lives as far as macro nutrition and exercise.

Sounds as if you are on HRT presumably because you are deficient naturally. If HRT, I agree there should be no adverse health consequences except you cannot get an erection or function without your injections for the rest of your life. The danger is the gear heads doing 1000 of test a week stacked with others along with 10 to 20 ius of hGH at a pop. We are not talking about dangers of HRT.

Women are on HRT and I assume you also believe that is very safe and in fact healthy.

I am a mass tort lawyer and won a 42 million dollar judgment for 6 ladies in a consolidated trial in Las Vegas 3 or so years ago and then hit for 10.2 million in Philadelphia for 2 more ladies in a jury trial.

All 8 cases were HRT cases and each one of my clients had terminal illnesses caused by HRT. So HRT not so safe.

You could tell. AND your a lawyer. You must be an expert then. Everybody knows that if a lawyer sues some one and wins they must be right. The fact is your just like this jerlk off that wrote this article in the first place. You found some unsubstantiated bullshit and used it to dupe 12 fools that were too stupid to get out of jury duty. Congratulations sir, you are a shining example of all that's wrong with your profession. Typical misdirection and misinformation, or are they teaching this stuff in law school now because they sure aren't spending too much time on it in medical school.

BTW, erectile disfunction is WAY down the list of reasons why men go on TRT, or maybe that was just the problem your 8 ladies were having...

So really I'm right, right and right...

[ttelise]

...

The longer you take steroids of any kind without stopping, the greater chance you have of permanent shutting down natural testosterone production. If you don't use a post cycle therapy immediately after a 6 or 8 week cycle, you may not be able to stimulate LH production in the testes ever again.

...

Again, there is no such thing as a permanent shutdown. The longer someone takes then, the longer it will take to recover but even without the PCT it will eventially come back.

Do you know who Scott Siegel is? He was that big meat head steroid dealer in the movie Wrestler. Too bad he took that movie personage into the real word and eventially got busted for dealing steroids. After being on stuff for 2 DECADES (!!!) was was forced to quit cold turkey when he was thrown to jail. It took him 8 months to recover before his body started producing T naturally again. No PCT, nothing.

Scott's level was 59 in jail and it is only 128 now. He is still well outoif range low. That is shut down. So he seems a permanent since it's been a couple if years and he is still out of range low.

Scott is a poster child for why people should not do steroids for body building purposes. I will do TRT one day when mine gets low and will probably be in Bali or Thailand when that occur so I hope the test is hood there. Seems to work for Sharky.

[ttelise]

This is the same sort of "Reefer Madness" BS that always goes on when the hyper-opinionated are completely ill-informed. How does this work where your heart explodes? I guess you think the steroid works on your "heart muscle until it gets so big it explodes? Jeez!!! Here's a hint for the morons. A major precursor to heart problem stems from LOW TESTOSTERONE LEVELS!!! Did any of you know that? Guess not. The fact is if you monitor your blood pressure, get some cardio exercise and stick to injectables rather than oral steroids your heart liver and kidneys are in much less danger than those who eat deep-fried pizza, smoke like chimneys and drink like jackasses. I know none of the super smart, health concious becons of brilliance on this forum would do anything like this!! No way!! MUCH TO SMART FOR THAT!! The fact is, more people have died from taking Flintstone vitimans. That's a fact. The instance of hospitalization for the use of asprin is 20 times higher than AAS or any of their ancillaries. This is also a fact. I saw this douche bag who wrote this tripe researching on Bodybuilding.com and the Anabolic Review 2 months ago and he had absolutely zero knowledge of anything to do with steroids. Now he's written an article that contains no facts. However, people like Yunia and some other experts are spouting BS about steroids being uppers (<deleted>!!?) and how scary it would be to run in to a guy post cycle in a dark ally. Is this because his estrogen levels might be a little high and he would want to watch Sex in the City? Because this would be the case, not raging like a maniac. Laughable if not so paralitacally retarded.

Now, as far as Doctors are concerned, when steroids were outlawed in the states they consulted the AMA, the American heart foundation, all the leading endrocrinologists and were brought before the U.S. Senate Sub comittee on steroids and, without exception, stated that it was idiocy to outlaw anabolic steroids. So, in true form for U.S law makers, they listened to the testimony of Jose Conseco and Mark Maquire. Joe Biden (maybe the stupidest man in modern politics) testified that it was "unfair" to use these performance inhancing drugs in PROFESSIONAL SPORTS and hola, they were banned. DID YOU ALL GET THAT? That said, I get blood work done once every 4 months and have full blood panels done and couldn't be more healthy. You also test for female hormones. I had a Doctor ask me what I would do if my estrogen levels were to high? Itold him I would take a selective estrogen receptor modulator. He didn't know what that was. A Doctor. The truth is, bodybuilders live THE healthiest, most disiplined, closely monitored life styles of any pro or amateur sport, hands down. All this anti steroid blabbering by fools like many of those above are fueled by a sheep-like mentality to believe anything they read, but more often than not it's pure envy, plain and simple. In case you haven't guessed, I use AAS, I'm 47 years old and I look better than any 21 year old I see. It's a very comforting rationalization for the lazy, the fat and the inferior to believe the difference between them and me is not genetics, extremely disiplined training, regimented, unwavering dieatary disiplline and a committment to a lifestyle which constantly monitors medical health along with brutally honest self evaluation. It's instead a small oil injection of a hormone that the body produces naturally and tapers in production in later life. Anyone who things that "Juicers" pump themselves full of dangerous chemicals and "Swell up to huge proportions" is an ill-informed envious idiot that will be proved wrong with the massive surge in anti-aging research and hormone replacement therapy. Your father didn't have a choice, you do.

Roid rage much???

Haha, I could tell you were on AAS before I even got down to that part. Wrong, wrong and wrong except for fact that body builders do live healthy lives as far as macro nutrition and exercise.

Sounds as if you are on HRT presumably because you are deficient naturally. If HRT, I agree there should be no adverse health consequences except you cannot get an erection or function without your injections for the rest of your life. The danger is the gear heads doing 1000 of test a week stacked with others along with 10 to 20 ius of hGH at a pop. We are not talking about dangers of HRT.

Women are on HRT and I assume you also believe that is very safe and in fact healthy.

I am a mass tort lawyer and won a 42 million dollar judgment for 6 ladies in a consolidated trial in Las Vegas 3 or so years ago and then hit for 10.2 million in Philadelphia for 2 more ladies in a jury trial.

All 8 cases were HRT cases and each one of my clients had terminal illnesses caused by HRT. So HRT not so safe.

You could tell. AND your a lawyer. You must be an expert then. Everybody knows that if a lawyer sues some one and wins they must be right. The fact is your just like this jerlk off that wrote this article in the first place. You found some unsubstantiated bullshit and used it to dupe 12 fools that were too stupid to get out of jury duty. Congratulations sir, you are a shining example of all that's wrong with your profession. Typical misdirection and misinformation, or are they teaching this stuff in law school now because they sure aren't spending too much time on it in medical school.

BTW, erectile disfunction is WAY down the list of reasons why men go on TRT, or maybe that was just the problem your 8 ladies were having...

So really I'm right, right and right...

They were on for osteo and each one got cancer. The medical literature supports causation and every doctor testified that HRT can cause breast cancer in women. We would gave settled for less and the jury awarded much more. The judge remitted to 42.

So are you TRT or use for lifting. Man I love sex so I think ED would drive me to TRT. I am fluctuating now 750 and 800, but I am below 10 percent body fat, in gym every day and do everything I can to keep hormone levels optimal. No alcohol, no smokes, 200/100/100 macro diet, lots of sex and Tocotrenols and lots of C and D which I think help.

My best friend is 46 and he has cycled everything and done hGH. He is a mess and sex us impossible for him unless he is doing his pretty high TRT doses. I feel for him, but he just had a kid last year so something must be working.

Are you in Thailand and if so, do you have opinions on purity of AAS in Thailand. Dont you think you could tell if a batch was bunk since you are in TRT?

[thetitan99]

I cycle 8 weeks on multiple compounds then 2 weeks I drop everything but 250-400 mg test, then back on. I use various compounds depending on what I'm trying to do at the time. Currently I'm about 260 lbs 8% BF. I eat about 4800-5000 clean calories a day. I'm currently taking 1200 mg Test A/700 mg Tren A/700 mg Masteron P/350 mg NPP along with 50 mg of turinabol ed as well as 50 mg Proviron. I'm also taking 8 i.u.'s og HGH. My BP is 124/75, liver enzymes normal. I have AI's on hand as well as progesterone angonist's if needed but I've never needed them. Full head of hair, none on my body to speak of, no acne and just met a 23 year old girl who I've had sex with 12 times in three days. It's just funny when I occasionally get lectured about the dangers of AAS (usually by some fat, drunk 20 year old girl). My motto is if people don't know your using steroids your not doing it right. It is actually an extremely small part of the overall effort to maintain what I have, but like I said, people find it comforting to think that the only diffence between me and them is a couple of mililiters of "Extremely dangerous" oil injections. My big fat friends parents are both Doctors, I've known them for 10 years, and when they came to visit him he couldn't wait to tell them I was taking AAS. Their collective response was "You'd better get on them to before you completely fall to pieces." I'm 15 years older than him...

Edited May 29, 2012 by thetitan99

[Shurup]

Seriously, have you ever even been in a gym. I am in there every day and been lifting since 14. My two best friends have been on roids and HRT since the early 90s. Both shut down.

I have known of Scott for years. Dude, you are the Ine reading stuff if you think he is not shut down. He maybe went through acute withdrawals for 8 months, but shut down is linger than withdrawals. Do you even know what all health consequences he suffered inlcuding infections and heart issues? Do you know what he was injecting directly into his biceps, what his levels are today or whether he is in HRT today?

Do you even know what shut down means?

Shutdown does not mean zero. Shut down can be 200 or lower. Try living at those levels after being normal or out of range high.

I remember seeing studies showing that 83 percent if body builders doing roids at levels if 675 a week or more had an ejection fraction if less than 55 perecent (not good in case you didn't know) where as around 5 percent of the same age group with no history of steroid use has an ejection fracture of less than 55 percent.

Seriously, I tried to be nice even though I could see you were completely clueless pages ago when saying opiates cause ED because of dopamine increae. Haha, now you bring up Scott to prove that roids are harmless. You are hilarious.

No, I've never been to gym, I've got my physique sitting on a couch and consuming pizza.

Mind posting a pic of you? Since you pretty much live in the gym for the most part of your life you shouldn't be ashamed showing what you got to others? Below 10% BF eh?

As for your interest in opiates, you can pin yourself with what you want and take all the l-dopa you want, unlike steroids, there is no use for these drugs except for rec usage or unless you have some health issues. Maybe I was wrong making a connection between opiates and dopamine response, I don't really care, I read a study on the effect of drugs like cocaine, amphetamines and others (don't remember if heroin was on the list) on dopamine and when person experience the euphoria of these drugs (which inhibit the dopamine reuptake), they don't responce for less pleasurable feelings. You can take what you want and you're entitled to your opinion about safety of these drugs.

Now I'm out of here.

Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. ©

[Shurup]

thetitan 99

What's your height? Just curious.

[Ferangled]

This thread makes interesting reading from an outside perspective. The general trend seems to be that anyone actively taking steroids very ironically engages anyone that even suggests that they could have negative effects in an overly aggressive rant!

Some of the view points expressed range from the idiotic to the childish, with a good smattering of playground assertions of "my mate said this...!". It would appear that at least in the eyes of a steroid user, anecdotal stories hold more relevance than medical research.

Here's a few of the choice quotes that give a great impression of the mentality of those that put their vanity before their health:

just met a 23 year old girl who I've had sex with 12 times in three days…

So really I'm right, right and right...

i haven't seen many bodybuilders robbing people to pay for their habit...

I know a lot people who took steroids when they were young: zero addictions…

I know a couple who took heavy drugs, they are all watching the grass growing now...

Seeing as you're female, I've got to ask…

all the attackers of steroid users are absolutely fine with millions of girls being hooked on BC pills and it never get mentioned…

friends are black belt in martial arts and heavy weight powerlifters amongst others I have known, none of them suffered any problems either physical or psychological…

BC pill is taken for recreational usage and not a necessity…

You couch potatoes that surf the bars and the internet dont live in the real world…

My motto is if people don't know your using steroids your not doing it right…

Each to their own guys but please for your own sakes do some proper research and don't rely on what your mates think or what you "feel". You'll find a common trend with abusers of all drugs being the tendency to believe that they are the exception to the rule and that because they feel "fine" there's clearly nothing wrong with what they are doing...

[thetitan99]

Young guy's already have "steroids" in their blood stream. The addition of exogenous testosterone and other AAS while the system is still developing is what leads to the sensationalized stories of permanant hypothalametic (sic) testicular axis shutdown. Also, the young, big mouthed and immature are the most likely the source of all the "roid rage" tales. The fact is, steroids make you bigger, stronger and faster. If you are an a$$hole, they will probably make you a bigger one. If you are a nice guy, they'll probably make you a nicer one...

I'm 6'2".

And AAS is in no way a "stimulant". It's that kind of basic, root ignorance that lead to these fantastically ridiculous ideas.

Edited May 29, 2012 by thetitan99

[thetitan99]

This thread makes interesting reading from an outside perspective. The general trend seems to be that anyone actively taking steroids very ironically engages anyone that even suggests that they could have negative effects in an overly aggressive rant!

Some of the view points expressed range from the idiotic to the childish, with a good smattering of playground assertions of "my mate said this...!". It would appear that at least in the eyes of a steroid user, anecdotal stories hold more relevance than medical research.

Here's a few of the choice quotes that give a great impression of the mentality of those that put their vanity before their health:

just met a 23 year old girl who I've had sex with 12 times in three days…

So really I'm right, right and right...

i haven't seen many bodybuilders robbing people to pay for their habit...

I know a lot people who took steroids when they were young: zero addictions…

I know a couple who took heavy drugs, they are all watching the grass growing now...

Seeing as you're female, I've got to ask…

all the attackers of steroid users are absolutely fine with millions of girls being hooked on BC pills and it never get mentioned…

friends are black belt in martial arts and heavy weight powerlifters amongst others I have known, none of them suffered any problems either physical or psychological…

BC pill is taken for recreational usage and not a necessity…

You couch potatoes that surf the bars and the internet dont live in the real world…

My motto is if people don't know your using steroids your not doing it right…

Each to their own guys but please for your own sakes do some proper research and don't rely on what your mates think or what you "feel". You'll find a common trend with abusers of all drugs being the tendency to believe that they are the exception to the rule and that because they feel "fine" there's clearly nothing wrong with what they are doing...

I can't help but notice all the medical studies your siting here. How does anything I say imply I'm relying on how I feel? Guess you didn't read the advise of the Doctors or the results of the regular bloodwork? But then again I guess if you did you couldn't keep talking about vanity before health, or making smarmy remarks about all the quotes from other posters. Doesn't really fit in with what you felt like saying so just ignore it. I have a feeling you are one of those "perfect pictures of health" I get drunkenly lectured by from a bar stool while I sit by amused sipping a soda and lime...

[Yunla]

The fact is, steroids make you bigger, stronger and faster. If you are an a$$hole, they will probably make you a bigger one. If you are a nice guy, they'll probably make you a nicer one...

I'm 6'2".

And AAS is in no way a "stimulant". It's that kind of basic, root ignorance that lead to these fantastically ridiculous ideas.

I read most of your posts &while I disagree with you on much of it, I agree with the above section to a certain extent. Not everybody will go crazy taking a strong drug, but some people will & they become a hazard to society. When things go bad in the body, they often go bad in the mind and personality too. It is also difficult to realise you have a problem when you are on the inside looking-out, you feel great, for sometimes years, and you find excuses for your addiction, this is the classic addiction spiral and often by the time you realise the problem it can be too late physically. Even the much maligned cigarette smokers will be happy smokers for twenty or thirty years or longer, not feeling any real serious life-threatening problems, and cheerfully defending their addiction just like all drug addicts do. But then it catches up with them. The difference is that smoking doesn't have the same psychological effects as taking synthetic uppers does.

But what you wrote above, that is exactly why these drugs are considered dangerous controlled substances. Because for many people taking these anabolic steroid stimulants they can control it, but a lot of people can not. Drugs are legally controlled not for what they do to strong-minded people, but for what they can do to people with underlying mental health problems & other disorders. Legislation is intended to protect the weak as well as the strong.

You also contradict yourself when you say (in the same paragraph) that anabolic steroids make you 'bigger stronger and faster' then a few lines down you say "they are not a stimulant", but stimulants are substances that induce temporary improvements in physical (or mental) function.

Other points raised over the last few pages, about Hrt steroids, BC pills etc. being harmless unless abused in excessive high doses are also untrue. the most common normal dose longterm Hrt prescriptions are for menopausal women & a test group of 160,000 women tested over a fifteen year period, by the 'womens health initiative', showed that women taking synthetic HRT at normal doses suffered 29% higher heart attack rate & 41% higher stroke rate compared to women not taking estrogen/progestin HRT. http://health.nytime...y/overview.html

While that is female hormone trial, the testosterone HRT steroid has the same invasive synthetic profile if used over a long period of time.

Edited May 29, 2012 by Yunla

[Ferangled]

This thread makes interesting reading from an outside perspective. The general trend seems to be that anyone actively taking steroids very ironically engages anyone that even suggests that they could have negative effects in an overly aggressive rant!

Some of the view points expressed range from the idiotic to the childish, with a good smattering of playground assertions of "my mate said this...!". It would appear that at least in the eyes of a steroid user, anecdotal stories hold more relevance than medical research.

Here's a few of the choice quotes that give a great impression of the mentality of those that put their vanity before their health:

just met a 23 year old girl who I've had sex with 12 times in three days…

So really I'm right, right and right...

i haven't seen many bodybuilders robbing people to pay for their habit...

I know a lot people who took steroids when they were young: zero addictions…

I know a couple who took heavy drugs, they are all watching the grass growing now...

Seeing as you're female, I've got to ask…

all the attackers of steroid users are absolutely fine with millions of girls being hooked on BC pills and it never get mentioned…

friends are black belt in martial arts and heavy weight powerlifters amongst others I have known, none of them suffered any problems either physical or psychological…

BC pill is taken for recreational usage and not a necessity…

You couch potatoes that surf the bars and the internet dont live in the real world…

My motto is if people don't know your using steroids your not doing it right…

Each to their own guys but please for your own sakes do some proper research and don't rely on what your mates think or what you "feel". You'll find a common trend with abusers of all drugs being the tendency to believe that they are the exception to the rule and that because they feel "fine" there's clearly nothing wrong with what they are doing...

I can't help but notice all the medical studies your siting here. How does anything I say imply I'm relying on how I feel? Guess you didn't read the advise of the Doctors or the results of the regular bloodwork? But then again I guess if you did you couldn't keep talking about vanity before health, or making smarmy remarks about all the quotes from other posters. Doesn't really fit in with what you felt like saying so just ignore it. I have a feeling you are one of those "perfect pictures of health" I get drunkenly lectured by from a bar stool while I sit by amused sipping a soda and lime...

Way to prove a point! Just insult anyone that posts anything that you don't agree with and take everything mentioned about steroid abuse personally... you might have noticed that the only point I made was as to the childish nature of the posts in reply to anything perceived as coming from "all the attackers of steroid users"!

Perhaps you guys should form some sort of self-help club, you could all get together and compare quads whilst swapping stories of oppression under the scrutiny of the terrible "attackers of steroid users"!

Responding with a comment like "I have a feeling you are one of those "perfect pictures of health" I get drunkenly lectured by from a bar stool while I sit by amused sipping a soda and lime..." just reinforces my point. Interesting the use of the phrase "picture of health", quite ironic given the objection you had to the expression "vanity over health"...

As for that, I'm sorry but unless you're being prescribed steroid treatment for a specific medical condition I can't see what else you could call it. It's not necessary to inject yourself with steroids to sustain a healthy lifestyle and keep fit, so in my humble opinion, vanity is one of the main reasons for steroid abuse. Another would be a lack of self esteem.

Please feel free to rage on and continue to use such pearls as "just met a 23 year old girl who I've had sex with 12 times in three days" to emphatically prove how your self imposed steroid regime does wonders for your health. I'm nearly sold; all these years I've been foolishly thinking that my balanced diet, moderate alcohol consumption and regular exercise/ passion for sport was keeping me in good condition but clearly not... evidently you are the living embodiment of the little known fact that to be really healthy one must inject steroids...

[ttelise]

Seriously, have you ever even been in a gym. I am in there every day and been lifting since 14. My two best friends have been on roids and HRT since the early 90s. Both shut down.

I have known of Scott for years. Dude, you are the Ine reading stuff if you think he is not shut down. He maybe went through acute withdrawals for 8 months, but shut down is linger than withdrawals. Do you even know what all health consequences he suffered inlcuding infections and heart issues? Do you know what he was injecting directly into his biceps, what his levels are today or whether he is in HRT today?

Do you even know what shut down means?

Shutdown does not mean zero. Shut down can be 200 or lower. Try living at those levels after being normal or out of range high.

I remember seeing studies showing that 83 percent if body builders doing roids at levels if 675 a week or more had an ejection fraction if less than 55 perecent (not good in case you didn't know) where as around 5 percent of the same age group with no history of steroid use has an ejection fracture of less than 55 percent.

Seriously, I tried to be nice even though I could see you were completely clueless pages ago when saying opiates cause ED because of dopamine increae. Haha, now you bring up Scott to prove that roids are harmless. You are hilarious.

No, I've never been to gym, I've got my physique sitting on a couch and consuming pizza.

Mind posting a pic of you? Since you pretty much live in the gym for the most part of your life you shouldn't be ashamed showing what you got to others? Below 10% BF eh?

As for your interest in opiates, you can pin yourself with what you want and take all the l-dopa you want, unlike steroids, there is no use for these drugs except for rec usage or unless you have some health issues. Maybe I was wrong making a connection between opiates and dopamine response, I don't really care, I read a study on the effect of drugs like cocaine, amphetamines and others (don't remember if heroin was on the list) on dopamine and when person experience the euphoria of these drugs (which inhibit the dopamine reuptake), they don't responce for less pleasurable feelings. You can take what you want and you're entitled to your opinion about safety of these drugs.

Now I'm out of here.

Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. ©

You jump to too many conclusions. I don't take opiates. I don't take any drugs. I don't smoke, I don't consume alcohol, I don't drink carbonation and don't drink colas. My My diet is generally 200 protein, 100 fat, 100 carbs, but changes a bit daily based on needs, activity and testing.

I am not a body builder and need to stay a certain size as, as I stated on here for years, I am a professional surfer that does very little in way of contests now that i am older. I primarily travel for big wave surfing whenever swells are forecasted at a handful of locations.

I need speed, stamina and strength when dropping in 50 foot plus face or towing in on heavier. My trainer also focuses on V02 max. I pay ridiculous amounts for best endo, dietician and testing facilities in the world and would not muck that up by doing drugs.

I do IVs ranging from Glutathione, Glutimate, DMSO, preps like Myers, but she has her own formula and mixtures based on individual, b12, collagen marshmallow, magnesium sulfate, alpha lipoic acid, Folate, glyoxia???, some coenzyme.

Aside from that, I focus on gut health with probiotics, take fish oils, Toco 8s, 800 ius of D, and do IGF-2 for four weeks maybe twice a year.

I am a walking example that people can stat off AAS, injectable GH and derive huge anti aging benefits naturally if one is committed.

[ttelise]

RE: Titan

Haha, awesome. I would be humping everything that moved at 8 ius a day of GH not to mention that all the AAS. Love me some GH, but only did it once for a few months to heal a broken femur. I was pinning 2 ius, then 4, then back to 2.

My endo will write if I want due to my age if my IGF-1 drops and I know what supps to take to suppress IGF-1 to get GH. Still having sex 2 or 3 times a day without and scared to mess with natural libido.

[IsaanUSA]

I would be scared injecting myself with anything in Thailand. Who knows what's in there.

[nurofiend]

This thread makes interesting reading from an outside perspective. The general trend seems to be that anyone actively taking steroids very ironically engages anyone that even suggests that they could have negative effects in an overly aggressive rant!

Some of the view points expressed range from the idiotic to the childish, with a good smattering of playground assertions of "my mate said this...!". It would appear that at least in the eyes of a steroid user, anecdotal stories hold more relevance than medical research.

Here's a few of the choice quotes that give a great impression of the mentality of those that put their vanity before their health:

just met a 23 year old girl who I've had sex with 12 times in three days…

So really I'm right, right and right...

i haven't seen many bodybuilders robbing people to pay for their habit...

I know a lot people who took steroids when they were young: zero addictions…

I know a couple who took heavy drugs, they are all watching the grass growing now...

Seeing as you're female, I've got to ask…

all the attackers of steroid users are absolutely fine with millions of girls being hooked on BC pills and it never get mentioned…

friends are black belt in martial arts and heavy weight powerlifters amongst others I have known, none of them suffered any problems either physical or psychological…

BC pill is taken for recreational usage and not a necessity…

You couch potatoes that surf the bars and the internet dont live in the real world…

My motto is if people don't know your using steroids your not doing it right…

Each to their own guys but please for your own sakes do some proper research and don't rely on what your mates think or what you "feel". You'll find a common trend with abusers of all drugs being the tendency to believe that they are the exception to the rule and that because they feel "fine" there's clearly nothing wrong with what they are doing...

is it wrong that i read all the quotes in a 'wrestler voice'?...

[nurofiend]

The fact is, steroids make you bigger, stronger and faster. If you are an a$$hole, they will probably make you a bigger one. If you are a nice guy, they'll probably make you a nicer one...

I'm 6'2".

And AAS is in no way a "stimulant". It's that kind of basic, root ignorance that lead to these fantastically ridiculous ideas.

I read most of your posts &while I disagree with you on much of it, I agree with the above section to a certain extent. Not everybody will go crazy taking a strong drug, but some people will & they become a hazard to society. When things go bad in the body, they often go bad in the mind and personality too. It is also difficult to realise you have a problem when you are on the inside looking-out, you feel great, for sometimes years, and you find excuses for your addiction, this is the classic addiction spiral and often by the time you realise the problem it can be too late physically. Even the much maligned cigarette smokers will be happy smokers for twenty or thirty years or longer, not feeling any real serious life-threatening problems, and cheerfully defending their addiction just like all drug addicts do. But then it catches up with them. The difference is that smoking doesn't have the same psychological effects as taking synthetic uppers does.

But what you wrote above, that is exactly why these drugs are considered dangerous controlled substances. Because for many people taking these anabolic steroid stimulants they can control it, but a lot of people can not. Drugs are legally controlled not for what they do to strong-minded people, but for what they can do to people with underlying mental health problems & other disorders. Legislation is intended to protect the weak as well as the strong.

You also contradict yourself when you say (in the same paragraph) that anabolic steroids make you 'bigger stronger and faster' then a few lines down you say "they are not a stimulant", but stimulants are substances that induce temporary improvements in physical (or mental) function.

Other points raised over the last few pages, about Hrt steroids, BC pills etc. being harmless unless abused in excessive high doses are also untrue. the most common normal dose longterm Hrt prescriptions are for menopausal women & a test group of 160,000 women tested over a fifteen year period, by the 'womens health initiative', showed that women taking synthetic HRT at normal doses suffered 29% higher heart attack rate & 41% higher stroke rate compared to women not taking estrogen/progestin HRT. http://health.nytime...y/overview.html

While that is female hormone trial, the testosterone HRT steroid has the same invasive synthetic profile if used over a long period of time.

Drugs are legally controlled not for what they do to strong-minded people, but for what they can do to people with underlying mental health problems & other disorders. Legislation is intended to protect the weak as well as the strong.

out of interest, what's your stance on illegal drugs?

[GentlemanJim]

Well with all this publicity and everything being legal I just might want to start up a thriving tourist business. Any one out there want to be partners

Gotta laugh your ass off at the Google ads all over the page!

Edited May 29, 2012 by GentlemanJim

[ttelise]

I would be scared injecting myself with anything in Thailand. Who knows what's in there.

Haha, you would think. A lot of guys in the States are getting the gear from China and Mexico and using it or redistributing it. At least if you buy in person in Thailand, you probably can ask around to see if seller has quality stuffand you probably could go back to seller and exact retribution if bunk unlike buying the stuff over the internet.

[nurofiend]

i love this thread

[Yunla]

out of interest, what's your stance on illegal drugs?

I believe all synthetic drugs (including steroids) should be legal, clinical grade and controlled by the state. By controlled I mean monitored by medical professionals & calculated on a personal basis. The sliding scale is the same as for the more powerful prescription drugs as used today, doctors will not prescribe you pills if your medical report says they will kill you or you have a history of psychotic events on this type of substance. They will issue you the correct dose for your safety, and no more than that. Its safer for the user and society. Also means you always get clean drugs at clinical grade, for low cost.

That ends gangsterism, turf war over illegal drugs etc. Nobody wants to buy impure & overpriced junk off a gangster when they can get the clean pure drugs from a doctor for a tenth of the price. It will require good admin and monitoring to make sure people get what they need. The approve / deny sliding scale would have to be based on known risks of the drug to users health, and chart the patients usage to ensure they are not overdoing it & blood tests to check the patient is not selling the pills instead of using them.

In the future the many new steroids and other synthetic drugs that will be discovered, could be prescribed much the same as they are today for Ms asthma and menopause etc. Pschedelics will require background checks on psychotic behaviour etc. Its all admin really. I'm still taking prescribed sodium-valproate (highdose) for over 20 years, for epilepsy, it is a powerful psychotropic anticonvulsant which has a lot of side-effects, doctors made me sign a legal consent form back in the 80s before they gave me the first dose. This is an example of the type of conrol that has to be applied to all strong drugs after legalisation.

All natural plant drugs should be legal and available in the wild (as before) and from commercial farming sources - not the state. You can't have state ownership of plants, but you should have state control of all synthetics imo, for safety & medical standards.

Edited May 29, 2012 by Yunla

[nurofiend]

out of interest, what's your stance on illegal drugs?

I believe all synthetic drugs (including steroids) should be legal, clinical grade and controlled by the state. By controlled I mean monitored by medical professionals & calculated on a personal basis. The sliding scale is the same as for the more powerful prescription drugs as used today, doctors will not prescribe you pills if your medical report says they will kill you or you have a history of psychotic events on this type of substance. They will issue you the correct dose for your safety, and no more than that. Its safer for the user and society. Also means you always get clean drugs at clinical grade, for low cost.

That ends gangsterism, turf war over illegal drugs etc. Nobody wants to buy impure & overpriced junk off a gangster when they can get the clean pure drugs from a doctor for a tenth of the price. It will require good admin and monitoring to make sure people get what they need. The approve / deny sliding scale would have to be based on known risks of the drug to users health, and chart the patients usage to ensure they are not overdoing it & blood tests to check the patient is not selling the pills instead of using them.

In the future the many new steroids and other synthetic drugs that will be discovered, could be prescribed much the same as they are today for Ms asthma and menopause etc. Pschedelics will require background checks on psychotic behaviour etc. Its all admin really. I'm still taking prescribed sodium-valproate (highdose) for over 20 years, for epilepsy, it is a powerful psychotropic anticonvulsant which has a lot of side-effects, doctors made me sign a legal consent form back in the 80s before they gave me the first dose. This is an example of the type of conrol that has to be applied to all strong drugs after legalisation.

All natural plant drugs should be legal and available in the wild (as before) and from commercial farming sources - not the state. You can't have state ownership of plants, but you should have state control of all synthetics imo, for safety & medical standards.

point well made and i fully agree.

i thought you had posted leaning towards pro drug war before, that's why i was wondering of your opinion when i read your original quote.

i can't understand the logic behind or argument for drug criminalization, it truly baffles me.

anyway, back to the pros and cons of being a roid head

[ttelise]

I agree about legalization. I don't care to ever smoke dope again, but I have no problem with anyone else doing it.

Regarding synthetics, wouldn't it be better to allow the non synthetics. For instance, the synthetic opiates such as bupe, methadone, and fentanyl are much more damgerous than say morphine, heroine, codeine, and etc. I think oxycodone and hydrocodone are synthetics which are the most abused in the US. Also test seems less damaging than these synthetic prohormones and analogs that areafe to get around the bans in place. Just a thought or maybe I don't fully get synthetics.