I Want To Give Up My Us Citizenship

[TinoThailand]

I pretty much know how to do the renunciation thing. What I am really looking for is a country I can apply for 2nd citizenship before I do it.

Is it easy to become a Thai citizen? I have a Thai wife and son and I speak a Thai a little bit.

But I'm open to other options.

I have been told that it's more easy for a "farang" female to merry and get a passport in Thailand.

You will travel much more easy with ur USA passport anyway.

[TinoThailand]

I don't think you've really thought this through, have you?

Well put!!

This sure wont help

[commande]

It is very obvious that the OP has not thought this thru or he wouldn't be here on an open to the world forum asking questions. Just to be clear to the OP, in order to give up your US Citizenship you already have to be a citizen and passport holder of another country. So you solve this issue and THEN you can apply cia the US Legal system give up your citizenship which cost a lot of money and there is a very large exit tax, more money you have the more you pay, almost 50% of everything you give up.

There are many places to get information on this that is relavent, an US Immigration Attorney is the best choice, definitely here on TV you are probably not going to get the right answers or they would be buried in other BS that people think they know what to do but really have no idea.

Singapore is a great place to get citizenship and is a very respected passport worldwide. I would try and get that one and then go forward from there, takes time though, about a year or more, I don't know all the requirements.

Good luck!

[laobali]

Get a second passport first; there are several countries that offer this. If you're entitled to US military benefits, you'll lose them if you renounce citizenship.

[sawadeeken]

if u are jewish u have the right to return and become a citizen of israel; but frankly, (depending on how old u are) its a tough place to live: we have inflation, our neighbhors hate us, our passports are problematic (an arabic girlfriend from a village here went to american college in egypt as an honours scholorship student, she almost couldnt come back to visit her mom, the egyptians thought she was spy, sinc eshe spoke english, arabic and hebrew, and held an israeli passport. other arab friends have had similar problems when go to vacations , due to having an israeli passport). , acording to psychologists, we are always in a constant state of stress which is bad for health, we are the worst qualities of middle east and western societies... if u are not jewish, its along hard haul, a (and a snip possibly depending onhow u are doing the citizenship route)// i have dual, and made sure my kids have their dual us passports, apart form european ty pe things, cant see why someoen would change to an other coutnry's citizenshp.

as for thailand........5555555555555 dream on.... speak thai a little bit, are married... so are 99% of the people on the board, including some that are half thai, and they' re waiting years and years just for a permanent residancy card..good luck

bina

israel

I totally agree with the above post.............

My God man, Do you know what you are doing? You must be out of your mind. I been to almost 90 countries and there is not any one of them I would give up my US citizenship for. Even though I consider Thailand my home away from home, I would not give up my 'right' to re-enter the US and stay as long as I want. Please consider all aspects of what you are wanting to do, You may someday want to return even you don't think so now - don't burn the bridge behind you!!!

I love Thailand and the Thai's, but I couldn't enjoy Thailand without what I have first aquired outside of Thailand ( read this a couple times till you understand what I mean)

I have many, many Thai friends (don't claim to know Mr. Taksin), And there are not even one of them who can live the life that I can live in Thailand, because I brought my assets with me from another country.

All I can recommend is that you give this move much consideration - and hopefully you will be wise enough to make the right decision................ OR possibly suffer the consequenses.

[SouthernMan3]

I haven't read the posts yet but think of YOU.

That blue book you can go almost anywhere in the world.

I understand.

i am an American citizen too.

I don't care for America, it's politics and most of it's population.

I've thought of it too.

I can even get a Thai passport and I have lived here for decades and plan to stay, can, and will.

But, then visas for everywhere you go.

What do you want ?

What's as good as the blue book ? For YOU ?

EU passport ?

What gives YOU the most freedom, power and best feeling ?

Just my two cents......

[samran]

If you are renouncing, I thought there was an effective 'exit tax' for those who do.

[ubeturazz]

I don't think you've really thought this through, have you?

Best answer in the whole thread.

TH

Heartily agree...

[bangkokheat]

what is your ethnic background? I was born in oz, my parents are italian so i was to able to apply successfully for italian citizinship, now I have 2 passports

[lovetotravel]

I think this is riduculous. Giving up your citizenship because you don't like the government? Name one that is better. And where you can become a citizen? I was with my Canadian friend last night and all he did was complain about his government. He lives here and has NO intention of going back. I bet if you talk with an Aussie you'll get the same ear full.

Sorry, but this is just crazy. I know many expats here who are going back to the US to live out their final years. I love Thailand, but it's has way more problems than the US.

[lovetotravel]

Here's the tax rates by country. Canada Pays more and Australia is just about the same. Sounds like jumping from the pan into the fire.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Income_Taxes_By_Country.svg

P.S. If you are married filing jointly and make under 69k, your tax rate is 15%. Tough to beat.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rate_schedule_%28federal_income_tax%29

Edited June 24, 2012 by lovetotravel

[bangkokheat]

I have felt the same way about oz, I dont know of any governments that are any better than another, oz in my opinion has become a communist country in the sense that your freedoms are being taken away, I even heard this in australia by a croation stating that even in his communist country there is more freedom than oz. I remember saying when I was a teenager, " there are only 2 ways of freedom, one is to be filthy rich that nothing can affect you, other is to have absolutely nothing and live in the bush away from society" well of course there is the 3rd way........if anyone is that way inclined

[reenatinnakor]

I will be interested to see the replies on this one Chops. Is it for tax reasons?

Do you have Thai citizenship? If not, who would you be a citizen of then?

I think you are very brave, personally I couldnt give up my citizenship for anyone but then I dont have to lodge tax returns to a country that I dont frequent!

No. I just don't want to be a US citizen any longer.

I only wish to have one item: a passport that I can use to travel most of the globe without much hassle.

That would be a US passport then. But you want to give up the thing that you want.

[meand]

I will be interested to see the replies on this one Chops. Is it for tax reasons?

Do you have Thai citizenship? If not, who would you be a citizen of then?

I think you are very brave, personally I couldnt give up my citizenship for anyone but then I dont have to lodge tax returns to a country that I dont frequent!

No. I just don't want to be a US citizen any longer.

I only wish to have one item: a passport that I can use to travel most of the globe without much hassle.

That would be a US passport then. But you want to give up the thing that you want.

"You have what you want." I love it, so true.

[sawadeeken]

I don't think you've really thought this through, have you?

I don't need a US passport. It's of no value for me except to travel on.

My citizenship status might become a tax liability in the future so I think I should start to cut my ties now.

I'm planning an extended dating trip to Canada and/or Australia with the intent on finding a wife who can sponsor me. If you know any Canadian or Australian ladies(doesn't matter how ugly) looking for an american man let me know.

Personally, I think you are dreaming. You been reading to many of those online dating ads. Thai girls have a hard time finding overseas husbands, and most likely they have more to offer than you will have with no first world citizenship.

[Sydebolle]

I will be interested to see the replies on this one Chops. Is it for tax reasons?

Do you have Thai citizenship? If not, who would you be a citizen of then?

I think you are very brave, personally I couldnt give up my citizenship for anyone but then I dont have to lodge tax returns to a country that I dont frequent!

No. I just don't want to be a US citizen any longer.

I only wish to have one item: a passport that I can use to travel most of the globe without much hassle.

Ask the PM to check with her brother. He seems to have as he became Montenegroan, Ugandan and even a Nicaraguan diplomat.

[Pinot]

I've found that there are a couple of reasons American citizens renounce citizenship. The first one being the requirement to report any holdings over $10,000 becomes onerous. I don't know, I wish I had those kinds of issues. The tax issues are minimal. If that's your reasoning, you don't know what you're talking about. I paid a couple hundred dollars last year in taxers on American investments. The other reason is because they don't like the US government policies. Usually, I find these are right wing nutters. They hate Obama so much (he's black, you know), that they want out.

It's a priviledge being an American. When the <deleted> hits the fan, you want to be an American citizen. See how much assistance you get at the Dominican Embassy when your Fortuna rolls over a Thai. Up to you if you want out. I think your crazy, but up to you. Don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out. By the way, do you know the most admired country the Thais say is in surveys?

Oh, and one other thing, good luck collecting social security.

Edited June 24, 2012 by Pinot

[NBD]

I don't think the overall tax rates are the problem. It's the idea that if you live and work in Thailand you still pay US taxes. As far as I know the US is the only western country with this arrangement. As a Brit living and working in Thailand I don't pay any UK taxes, if I was American I would be liable to pay US taxes regardless.

[jshorts]

The us doesnt care if you relinquish your citizenship (sorry to burst your bubble you aint that important to them) and is not going to punish you for it. Many people have been doing it the last few years but guess what they were all very wealthy and could afford to do it and not look back. Personally I think you are just young and foolish enough to believe that all the worlds ills are to blame on the usa, well guess what all 5 permanent members of the un security council are guilty along with every other country in the world, the usa is just the youngest player at the table of corruption and happens to have been top dog for quite some time so they take all the blame. People always seem to forget who always gets asked first to do something when there is a problem in the world and then when it goes bad we take the blame and everyone else runs for cover. Personally i am glad to see china becoming a world power as maybe we can take a break from taking it up the ass every time something bad happens in the world. But dont come crying when you find out they are just as corrupt and self serving as america. There are many countries I know of that will give you citizenship if you invest the required amount of money there just pick your country and google citizenship, you dont have to come on a forum and use taxes as an excuse to air your dislike of your home country. One more thing is thailand would be the last country I would want citizenship in as it is the only country in the world still 95% indigenous, got it falang ?

"Taking it up the ass"? How quaint!

[phuketrichard]

I pretty much know how to do the renunciation thing. What I am really looking for is a country I can apply for 2nd citizenship before I do it.

Is it easy to become a Thai citizen? I have a Thai wife and son and I speak a Thai a little bit.

But I'm open to other options.

Best chance for second passport is one of the South American countries. OR Cambodia if u wnat stay there 3 years and pay $50,000

http://www.sovereignman.com/

for 2nd passport;

http://www.sovereignman.com/?s=second+passport+for+us+

[phuketrichard]

http://www.sovereignman.com/expat/facts-and-myths-about-renunciation-of-us-citizenship/

[NowImEasy]

I memorized this poem in 7th grade, a poem written by Sir Walter Scott over 200 years ago.

Breathes there the man with soul so dead

Who never to himself hath said:

"This is my own, my native land"?

Who's heart hath ne'er within him burned

As home his footsteps he hath turned,

From wandering on a foreign strand.

If such there breathes, go mark him well;

For him no minstrel's raptures swell;

High though his title, proud his name,

Boundless his wealth as wish can claim;

Despite those titles, power and pelf,

The wretch concentered all in self,

Living, shall forfeit fair renown,

And, doubly dying, shall go down

To the vile dust from whence he sprung,

Unwept, unhonored, and unsung.

Dedicated to all peoples who love their native land.

[bangkokheat]

Never heard of so much baloney.

Over ten years ago I waltzed into the US emb. in my home country. Asked to speak to a State Dept. official. While his mouth was still opened, I stated "I hereby willingly and happily renounce my US citizenship. I do so without fear nor am I being forced to do so".

He asked me why, I said "because you idiots voted Bush into office".

Never regretted it since. Yes, I have another citizenship. Of course! Never signed papers, no interviews and yes, my non citizenship was confirmed years later.

yeh but you gotta remember, one mans baloney is another mans sausage

[lovetotravel]

I don't think the overall tax rates are the problem. It's the idea that if you live and work in Thailand you still pay US taxes. As far as I know the US is the only western country with this arrangement. As a Brit living and working in Thailand I don't pay any UK taxes, if I was American I would be liable to pay US taxes regardless.

Absolutely not the only country. Ask my Norweigan friends who are selling their condo here because of concerns the government will find and and nail them for taxes and penalties for not reporting the investment. As a Brit, you can only go home for less than 30 days per year if you don't want to pay taxes. Any more, and they got ya. But yes, better than the US!! As has been said before, there's a fairly large exclusion for foreign income. You don't have to pay if you are below that threshold.

[NBD]

I think it's 90 days, so long as you're not earning income in the UK.

Not sure though, I haven't spent 30 days there in the last 3 years, so it's not an issue for me! Also if I arrive in another EU country first there's a good chance that there wouldn't even be a record of me entering the UK so it's much harder to enforce.

Suspect your Norwegian friend lives or works in Norway - not sure about the Norwegian system but I believe foreign income is taxable if you are normally resident in any country.

The substantial difference with the US compared to other countries I know of is that if I held a US passport I would be required to fill in a US tax return, even if I never visited the US.

[NewlyMintedThai]

You won't be able to "travel the world" on any passport that can be easily purchased. If that's the goal, the OP already has one of the best passports out there. If you don't like taxes, there are countless ways to avoid them. If you don't like the government, just ignore it.

[lovetotravel]

My Norwegian friends live here, but do go back about 1/2 the year. Both are retired, so do have income. They say tax rates are around 60-70% or so. Ouch. They love Norway, but do complain about the tax burden. And how they are now tracking citizens with real estate investments outside Norway.

You only have to file US tax if you earn more than a certain threshold. I think 10k is the number for singles, around 20k married filing jointly. But if it is earned overseas, you are excluded from taxes up to around 90k or so. And filing the tax return, if that simple, is a breeze.

[bangkokheat]

My Norwegian friends live here, but do go back about 1/2 the year. Both are retired, so do have income. They say tax rates are around 60-70% or so. Ouch. They love Norway, but do complain about the tax burden. And how they are now tracking citizens with real estate investments outside Norway.

You only have to file US tax if you earn more than a certain threshold. I think 10k is the number for singles, around 20k married filing jointly. But if it is earned overseas, you are excluded from taxes up to around 90k or so. And filing the tax return, if that simple, is a breeze.

60 to 70% your kidding right? that would be the country i would be handing in my citizenship, you think the thai police are crooks

[Pseudolus]

Money or time spent. In Hong Kong, 7 years gets you PR status and a passport. But you need to be living there for that time (or mostly). This is interesting reading as you are American;

http://www.qwealthreport.com/second_passports.php

http://www.qwealthreport.com/economic_citizenship.php

If you have a wife, get her pregnant, baby born in a place like Hong Kong, child gets passport and you can then as well after a while and some shenangigans.

[how241]

I don't think you've really thought this through, have you?

Best answer in the whole thread.

TH

+1....Think again...Read all the post.