New Draconian Property Law To Deport Foreigners Who "Owns" Land Illegally

[PingManDan]

LOL LOL LOL how many times has this issue, been talked about, I have really got to laugh how Thailand is trying to screw themselves. With all the high rate of farang murders etc. going on here in Thailand, they'll find out soon enough, that people will not be coming here, they'll be going somewhere else to spend their vacation money, purchase long lease condos, , homes etc. Thailand is going to go down very, very soon, you watch, the baht is loosing ground ever so slowly, then they'll be crying their a_sses off for the farang to come back and spend money, it is only a matter of time. The line is being drawn in the sand now.

[OnTheRun]

Lets face it, these laws are not set up to protect future generations but to ensure the continuity of wealth amongst the Thai elite class. The same elite class that is almost exclusivly Chinese Thai. It's a pity the indigenous Thais didn't enforce the same laws 100 - 200 years ago.

I would have loved the English FA to insist that Thaksin, when buying Man City Football Club a few years back, do it in an English mistresses name....

[crazykopite]

And who are they going tp employ to check all these so called illegal companies they cannot even recruit enough immigration staff for the airport It is that time of year again yawn yawn yawn I hope that in the next couple of years Burma will be the place and that is where I will take my money if the Thai's do not want it with there outdated regulations Would be interesting to know how many officials own property in neighbouring countries !!!!

[Arkady]

This guy is obviously floundering and looking for friends and cheap brownie points by jumping on the "foreigners buying up the whole country" grandstand which never fails to get attention. He has quite rightly criticized Yingluck for appointing officials with dubious backgrounds, e.g. the trade representative who is blacklisted by the US for doing business with Robert Mugabe's wife. Now he wants to shift the heat elsewhere. It seems unlikely that such a law would be passed but in Thailand anything can happen.

[OnTheRun]

No use trying to apply logic in anything that the Thai government does when it comes to foreigners, their xenophobic ways will never change.

And foreigners who does not know anything about anything, and who always just want to complain about thai culture and thai politics will never change either...

And Thais can't really own (take "possession" of) land in the UK because they are not allowed to live there. Comes to the same thing as barring Brits from owning land here. They are at least allowed to live here!!

Yes they can.

[travelmann]

Why dont they just tattoo us all.....................oh hang on thats been done before, Im sure Mrs and Mrs "wev'e been married 20 yrs" will appreciate more crap like this whilst the real big business will just grease more palms

[how241]

They should start with getting rid of the corruption within their own system of government. All we ever see is a lot of talk and funny it always seems to be the foreigners are taking over. Granted there are a lot of bad foreigners here but it is the Thai's fault because they don't enforce the laws already in place which are more than enough to keep things fair and equal.

+1

[iang]

Xenophobia & sabre rattling!

[KhunVee]

I notice they say about land being held in a nominee company, but there is no mention about condos being owned the same way? It's not like a condo owner is going to set up a paddy field in his front room is it?

With condo's no problem.It's the land they're talking about.

Foreigners can buy and own condo's for 100% legally, even on a tourist Visa.

As long as the percentage of the whole condominium (building or complex) ownership is not exceeding 49% owned by foreigner.

[robertson468]

So imagine a mass exodus by property owners (big and small) to Cambodia/Burma and the then surplus of housing left in Thailand which would burst the threatening housing bubble with disastrous effects on the Thai economy. Compound this by a two level tax system, which is totally contrary to equal opportunities and human rights. Not surprising one can but conclude there appear to be very few Thai Politicians who engage their brain before opening their mouths. Two Friends of mine have just left for Cambodia and said on their visits before committing, it is much easier to buy property and work in the Country. Apparently you can buy a five year visa, with no need for a separate working permit. Others might be able to advise with specifics? Agreed the infrastructure in those Countries is no where near as developed as Thailand, but providing you set up in the areas that is developed, it should not be too much of a problem.

[catweazle]

Aaaahhh, nice one! Let's hammer a few more nails into the coffin!!! I doubt that any other tourist destination in this world except Thailand is more agile, versatile, and determined in the area of shooting itself in the knee by coming up with frequent crackdowns and new laws to prevent foreign investment. As far as I can see, it is only Thailand that manages to be named "the Land of Smiles" while the majority of its people hold an aggressive anti-foreign / nationalistic sentiment.

Instead of granting foreigners the rights which Thai people are able to enjoy in most parts of the western world (such as being able to legally buy and own land, house and business there by a 100%), they reject and scare away not only potential foreign investors on a frequent basis but also the foreigners who love Thailand so much, that they would like to either live and work or retire here (and of course would spend most of their money here as well). Why - for Christ's sake - can you people not grant private foreigners their half or full Rai of land to live here legally and in peace? Why can't this nation come up with a proper legal basis for foreigners to invest without the need of 51% Thai co-ownership? Where is the problem? One can't physically take the land away from Thailand anyway, since it always was here and it always will remain here!

But no - especially in times where everything (including tourism in Thailand) already is on a drastic (or should I say "frightening") decline, officials here need to push it even farther. If anyone in Germany's parliament would come up in the open with such drastic measures against foreigners, he would be flamed and branded a "Nazi" by international media. A politician here in Thailand does it and is hailed a national hero... How weird is that?

I just hope that Laos, Cambodia, Vietnam, and Burma (if the latter one ever rises up as a free country and free tourist destination, then behold Thailand!!!!) manage to get their act together and create on top of a functioning infra-structure a legal foreign-friendly "Welcome in our country" immigration policy like Malaysia. Perhaps then, when foreign visitor and investment numbers drop by over 50%, Thailand will finally wake up and implement more rights to foreigners when it already is too late. Until then, they just do with us what they want. Why? Because they can!

[peterdk]

I still have a big doubt: How can possibly any foreigner "own" land throught nominees??? In any case they are renting that land, cuz the real owner is the nominee.

Imagine Company A.

It has a number of shareholders, all Thai - but they only amount to 49% of the shares.

Company A also have a Thai director.

Company B holds 51% of the shares in Company A and can thus control Company A.

Company B does not own any land, and have a foreign director.

In Company B, foreigners own at least 51% of the shares.

In above example, no foreigners own any land, however a foreigner is in control of a piece of land.

Uhh scary stuff this.. God forbit such nasty business.

Lets deport the foreigner straight away.. Bad foreigner !!

In this example, Company B would be considered "foreign owned"

Since it owns a majority stake in Cy A, this would be considered the same => a foreigner would be owning the land.

... if I'm not wrong and not too pragmatic

I think at least with the new draconian law, they want to get rid of this type of setup.

However as it is now, there is a lot of examples of that type of setup.

[jomtienbob]

My brother was a senr exec at an Australian property investment giant and he looked at it many years ago and said, there is no way you can legally fully own private land in Thailand. The scheisters and real estate agents all try to convince the throngs of lemmings otherwise but the simple fact remains. There's no point complaining about it just as there's no point complaining about the hot weather. That's the way it is. If you've been conned into something less than legal get it sorted or sold or put up with the consequences...

[RigPig]

probably the reason for the double-standard is that Thailand is worried that since foreigners have more money than the average Thai, foreigners will wind up buying most of the countries land and most Thai's will end up having to rent from foreigners at higher rent prices than if the land was protected against foreign ownership, or buying land at higher prices.

Can you please explain to me why a Thai can buy land in the UK, but UK citizens can't buy land here?

"Will there be any land left for our Thai children?"

So the average Thai has the money to own the multitude of condos and apartments built in places like Patong? These were built for Farang no Thai so why cant we own them. Oh that is because they can reap money from them more than once. No one is going to grow rice in Patong, Pattaya etc. Fair enough rural land should remain Thai but I see no reason why the mass Farang populated areas can't be bought. The majority og the Gold Coast in Aus was and probably still is owned by people from overseas, it thrives.

But yeah I too steered away from owning property of any sort through a nominee company as it will happen one day. If it was a loophole it can (and probably will be) closed one day.

[jomtienbob]

What about a similar law for Thai living abroad ,in the interest of FairPlay !

My thoughts exactly. Just to even things up they could ban Thai nationals from owning property abroad. But that's not very likely, is it?

That is actually the case! Most rich ones do, but just as technically illegal as vice versa

[EarthAlien]

These guys are myopic and xenophobic idiots.

At times like this I revisit thoughts of just packing up and leaving,.. problem is though,- where on Earth to go? Insanity of varying styles and degrees appears to be prevalent the entire world over!

Is there anywhere on the planet where sanity and balanced government prevail?... probably not but Thailand sure tests the imagination and lure of a better overall alternative at times!

[simosiam]

He suggested the government set guidelines for foreigners, forbidding their purchase of land banks, farm land, property in border areas, and locations related to the country's security. Foreigners are permitted to buy land in industrial estates because they generate income and employment. Residential units near industrial estates are allowed for foreign investors or executives working there to bring their compatriots to visit Thailand.

be quiet no one will come to take our home

[blueshark]

I read this yesterday and i must say this smacks very much of "yes we want your money but we don't really want to give you anything in return" nothing new in that respect.

If they want to outlaw company ownership, fine, do it definitively once and for all, but offer a real solution.. 99 Year leases would

be a good start.

They have no idea how much damage their reluctance to change will create, with places like Cambodia and Myanmar starting to open up to Foreigners and Foreign business' if Thailand does not "get with the program" inward investment to this country in this sector will rapidly become a thing of the past!!

"Ombudsman Siracha Charoenpanij said the new law would comprise punishment for companies offering advice to foreigners on how to hold Thai property by disguising their legal transaction. This would include law firms and consultants"

I wonder if this would also apply to Land Department officers that demand hefty "fees" to process such transactions?

I couldn't agree more. What kind of message does this evoke for foreign investment. what will they achieve by doing this, what ever happened to the ASEAN spirit. This is just another group of greedy Thais crying and stamping their feet about land to gain financial advantage. If they had transparent laws to cover this sort of thing then it would be far better. But laws that actually welcome foreign investment rather than hinder it!.

They are really starting to loose face internationally with this sort of thing. Word will spread, oh it already has. Perhaps they think people don't talk anymore.

Another ill fated idea that will smack them in the face sooner or later.

Idiots.

[technologybytes]

So really we are just talking about ENFORCEMENT of existing laws.

WE ALL know that it's illegal to purchase land through nominees, be that the standard dodgy companies the Pattaya crowd love so much, or the equally illegal act of giving money to your girlfriend, boyfreind or wife to buy it on your behalf.

The Alien Bussiness Act has already made it a blanket offence to circumvent land ownership laws, that's been in effect since 2003, so NOBODY has any right to start moaning now just because the law is in some danger of being enforced.

With the exception of real condos (ie ones that fall within the remit of the condominium act, not fake condos like when a couple of town houses are modifed into so-called condos) are the only safe way for most of us to get involved in property, anything else is illegal.

It's about time the phoney lawyers and consultants were punished, they hang a "law office" sign outside a shop and do business by encouraging forigners to break the law, the vast majority are not lawyers at all and many are common criminals.

And why shouldn't they deport offenders, most other countries deport offenders so why not Thailand !

[Crushdepth]

Poor little children. dam_n those greedy good for nothing foreign barbarians.

Xenophobia, Thailand be thy name.

[RigPig]

So imagine a mass exodus by property owners (big and small) to Cambodia/Burma and the then surplus of housing left in Thailand which would burst the threatening housing bubble with disastrous effects on the Thai economy. Compound this by a two level tax system, which is totally contrary to equal opportunities and human rights. Not surprising one can but conclude there appear to be very few Thai Politicians who engage their brain before opening their mouths. Two Friends of mine have just left for Cambodia and said on their visits before committing, it is much easier to buy property and work in the Country. Apparently you can buy a five year visa, with no need for a separate working permit. Others might be able to advise with specifics? Agreed the infrastructure in those Countries is no where near as developed as Thailand, but providing you set up in the areas that is developed, it should not be too much of a problem.

It is the same as Thailsnd apart from the visa's, businesses and work permits. You can't own land and with the corruption there with the Gov't you can loose anything at a whim. I just came back from checking it out. It's not so rosey as people are making out. I also heard the Russians are buying big in Snooky.....

[Fozfromoz]

P*ss off the Foreigner enough, they can just take the money elsewhere. No problem.

An incentive to "dob" should be appealing. Another way to get income without having to actually work for it.

On a clear day may even see and hear the high rises going up in Vietnam, Cambodia or Myanmar

[crazykopite]

No use trying to apply logic in anything that the Thai government does when it comes to foreigners, their xenophobic ways will never change.

And foreigners who does not know anything about anything, and who always just want to complain about thai culture and thai politics will never change either...

And Thais can't really own (take "possession" of) land in the UK because they are not allowed to live there. Comes to the same thing as barring Brits from owning land here. They are at least allowed to live here!!

There are many wealthy Thais who own huge estates in the UK. Thaskin comes to mind as I read that he alone owns a number of properties including a big estate in the Surrey area .

[M8FYU]

Best thing is for westerners to boycott investing in Thailand all together I think. Best thing I did was get out after 7 years of living there. I'd like to see how well the kingdom fares without considerable western money flowing in.

[BKKBrit]

Time to move. I hear Cambodia is nice.

Don't forget to turn off the lights when you leave!

[rayw]

Stop the old company land owning LEGAL loophole and allow for residential purposes all long stay VISA holding foreigners to own say up to 1/2 Rai of land purely for their own single residential purposes. This would be in line with most other countries (and in Asia) as to say retirement homes for expats. Sensible, income earning and morally sound and fair.and would if fairly restricted and controlled to small residential plots not be more of a ripple than a small pebble dropped in the ocean as to the amount of land then so owned by foreigners. Oh for goodness sake grow up and get real Thailand and elect some grown up and capable politicians. I just truly do not see what their problem is ????????

Surely folk who have so set up their home ownership this way many years ago when it was pretty normal (and in line with many immigration officers' advice) have a done deal and have a then legally FULLY APPROVED by the Governmental land office Thai company ownership with a Thai company stamped and approved by the Thai authorities at the time too. To undo past legally approved done deals would infringe human rights in anyone's eyes. is it right to take away perfectly decent law abiding retirees only asset left in their lives with their residential property, if so that sucks and some politicians here need removing from office for lack of decency and caring and no consideration for human rights.. Am I talking sense and moral decency or not hmm ??

[belg]

ASEAN 2015 ? yeah, make some more laws to go disown the "farangs"....the big land owners are mostly thai-chinese for decades...

[bangkokheat]

Im sure when they start confiscating land and deporting foreigners it will make global headlines, yet another reason for foreigners to piss their pants and look for alternatives

[Darrel]

Malaysia's "My Second Home" certainly contrasts with Thai policies. They actually welcome qualified foreigners, and no, they do not have a double price system for property transfer tax. They allow you to own a home on a plot of property together with a ten year renewable visa .........

Read the T&Cs http://www.mm2h.gov.my/conditions.php

This is a very expensive procedure to get a retirement visa compared to the Thai 800KB bank deposit.

Edited June 29, 2012 by Darrel

[Jirapa]

The most senseless comment yet - unless you are joking of course.

Can you please explain to me why a Thai can buy land in the UK, but UK citizens can't buy land here?

This should not be illegal in the first place. Allow foreigners to buy land in Thailand, but put a limit on how muuch they can buy. Then everybody's happy.

This is the one instance that I wish I had some kind of influence over David Cameron. I would love to see the look on Hi-so Thais' faces if the a UK law came in to stop Thais buying ouur land, unless they change their laws. Som-num-naa!!

"Will there be any land left for our Thai children?"

Definitely not if the foreigners are allowed to take the land back to their countries. More laws are badly needed and rewards should be as big as half of the land being taken away!

There'd be an outcry and huge long winded court battles in the UK if we suddenly forced all foreign land owners to sell up or be deported.