Bangkok's Airport Of Smiles In Crisis

[Squigy]

Why can't you buy the Bangkok Post at this airport?

There is a contractual dispute with King Power and BP. That's why.

[BuffaloRescue]

In my previous post I wasn't complaining.

I just meant to point out that the real purpose for swampy was to have a nice looking place where incoming and outgoing tourists would spend their mony. That's why I refered to it before as a shopping mall where customers FLY in and leave by cars.

Any other consideration....such as it's suitability a/nd/or efficency as an airport or even the safety of it's runways was always considered less important than it's revenue generating capacity.

Question: If swampy isn't a big fancy shopping mall with stores selling expensive high-end (and I say overpriced) luxury goods....then why is there that long walk through all those shops on both arrival and departure to and from the departure gates?

It's was, and still is, that "shopping is first priority" attitude that made swampy what it is.

I guess that's called "Capitalisim".

True - but they are selling the wrong stuff.

Who wants to buy a $5000 watch from a Bangkok airport? What are you going to do when it breaks, fly back to Bangkok to use the warrantee? Why would you buy a $3000 boss suit when you can get a better one taylor made for $500 in Bangkok. All that french makeup for women - I dont understand, is that stuff just a scam or what? I dont see Thai girls buying that shit and they look much nicer than farang munters

Theres no decent shops to buy books, travel accessories or anything you might actually need for your trip. Just a lot of designer stuff - and i hardly ever see people shopping in those shops. I wonder how much the rents are and if any shops turn a profit there. I got kicked out of a coffee shop there for using my laptop with my own aircard when they wanted to charge me for wifi i said i didnt need it. They then say i have to pay for wifi just to use my laptop there without using their wifi. Priks

Changi is the best airport ive ever been in. Soothing music, fish swimming in ponds, nice plants everywhere. Free cinema, Free wifi. BEDS to sleep in ad the departure gate. Brilliant.

Edited July 14, 2012 by BuffaloRescue

[jocko]

The element of surprise is entirely inappropriate given the entire project was supervised by Thaksin's crew and managed by AOT, the

the most bare-faced mafia ever to gain serious control of a public service in Thailand - even including the SRT; and supervised by the most corrupt of all the Ministries - Transport. When Thaksin forced the goons to open the airport too soon, it was a year behind schedule because of the fixes required...did he care? When a clown runs the show, you get what you expect. The corrupt in Thailand will stoop to any level to outdo their hideous cronies. And that's why you have half an airport, floating on an old swamp with half the concrete missing...I believe there were some expat engineers involved too in this laughable project...any word from any of them recently?

I recall at the last stages of constuction there was some issue about QC with some ex pat engineer's who quit the job over it

QC is compulsory in most country's in Thailand it's a extra.

We know it was built on a swamp and the starting point of any major build is the foundation if you can try and find the documentry on the constrution of Hong Kong Airport on a man made island it is worth a look but of course that was built with international companies

[samjaidee]

Somebody should conduct an investigation into the number of workers who have died on the job at this airport. Suspected to be a chemical poisoning from the materials used to build the airport. This has been hushed up by somebody.

How many people are searching for chemical poisoning now? lol

[humqdpf]

For me the worst nightmare in Bangkok airport is delays in getting to the plane. Even though I have arrived more than two and a half hours before flying time, there have been several occasions where, because of the must be at the gate 30 minutes before takeoff, I could have missed my plane.

THe two sources of delay are at checkin and immigration (leaving the country). Last week I had to spend over an hour on the immigration line - now they herd everyone upstairs and separate everyone into Thai and non-Thai. The foreigner queue was over one hour long, check-in was 40 minutes and the Cebu Pacific announced boarding time for Manila was 40 minutes before takeoff.

[gark]

I flew in a month ago, went thru immigration and baggage faster than JFK. I don't get all the hype in the article. Was it because of low season?

[BuffaloRescue]

Why can't you buy the Bangkok Post at this airport?

Because high fashion, electronic gadgets and face gaining paraphernalia are more important than newspapers,books,education in Thailand.

Edited July 14, 2012 by BuffaloRescue

[Suradit69]

The Culture Of Thailand epitomized by the country's first port of call

When it comes to epitomizing shambolic culture, wait for the Olympics. Finger pointing and blame shifting is gaining traction.

Government plans to bring in 80 extra staff to tackle unacceptable delays at Heathrow Airport are like "putting a sticking plaster on a serious injury", a union warned today.

As the row grew over the impact on the UK's reputation and ability to deal with the 2012 Olympics, Damian Green admitted the Border Force needs to change the way it operates and said the extra staff would start work this month.

But Mark Serwotka, general secretary of the Public and Commercial Services (PCS) union, warned: "Drafting in staff from other areas of an already overstretched agency is like putting a sticking plaster

...

"The Government has tried to convince people that we don't have a crisis," Mr Walsh told the BBC Radio 4 Today programme.

"The Government is misleading people. We have a crisis, it has been there for some time and we need urgent action."

Shadow transport secretary Maria Eagle added: "Instead of getting a grip on the shambles at Heathrow, we now discover that the Prime Minister is planning to shift responsibility to the aviation industry.

"There is now a real fear that these additional costs end up on ticket prices, meaning passengers face higher ticket prices as well as lengthy delays.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/union-issues-warning-over-heathrow-queues-plan-7703860.html

UK puts army on standby over security concern

LONDON - The British government has put extra soldiers on standby to provide security for the London Olympics following concerns the private contractor G4S would not train enough guards in time for this month's Games.

Some 23,700 security guards will protect the Olympic venues as part of Britain's biggest peacetime security operation, and 13,500 military personnel have already been earmarked to contribute to this.

However, fears over whether G4S would recruit enough guards in time has prompted the government to take action with the Olympics due to start on July 27.

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/2012olympics/2012-07/13/content_15578038.htm

[apetley]

@apetley :

Sorry for my ignorance but what's AJ stuff ?

"Inexpensive electrical goods."

Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect App

Inexpensive French electrical goods ?

Btw, Don't you mean AV as in audio visual or am I back in the last century ?

Cheap Thai brand.

Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect App

[mistymiles]

The Bangkok Post reported that 3 mafias have divided up the airport.

My guess?

The Army.

The Police.

Relatives of the invisible hand.

red shirts.

And my wife's family, too.

[swillowbee]

Several of us shared a rather lengthy discussion on the safety threats of a disintegrating runway in the original article's thread at Suvarnabhumi Airport Runway Crisis Deepens, http://www.thaivisa....-crisis-deepens … see posts #130 and #146 at http://www.thaivisa....s/page__st__125

The not so short summary:

• The failure described in the original article cited above sounds as a “punching” failure, which is a structural failure; not the micro-cracking in all concrete structures, due to the shrinkage to which all concrete is subject (designed for, expected and acceptable);
  
• A "punching" failure is likely a consequence of poor foundations and subsoil conditions, rather than a failure of the concrete runway slab itself, which is generally pretty burly stuff;
  
• Poor foundations and subsoil conditions would not generally be associated with bad engineering design, but more likely a consequence of construction defects;
  
• The construction defects of all kinds could occur, but defects that could cause failures as this would likely be expansion and contraction of the clayey soils upon which the runway is built, typical of marshlands in alluvial planes, as is the site selected for Suvarnabhumi Airport (the absolute worse soils upon which to build anything ... other than a swamp, of course);
  
• The unstable soil beneath the runway would be most likely caused by:
  
  • Defective fill materials;
    
  • Insufficient compaction of the fill materials; or,
    
  • Defective subsoil drainage system (installed to prevent underground water intrusion, which causes clayey soils to expand and contract with tremendous pressures);
    

  [*]A runway as this is unlikely to dramatically fail, as in the sinkholes into which some mistakenly imagine a landing aircraft would fall; it is more likely that whole slabs of the runway (in this case, a 60cm x 60cm slab) will separate from the monolithic slab, which is what runways are supposed to be; these fractured slabs would remain suspended, roughly in place (though structurally failed), by adjoining concrete to which it is connected by steel reinforcing bars placed in the concrete slab itself;

  [*]A risk occurs when the edges of the large cracks around the separated slab agitate against each other (due to wheel loads, or the unstable soils beneath pushing up and down), causing small chunks of concrete to break off;

  [*]These concrete chunks might be sucked into the engine intake at maximum takeoff thrust, or might be chipped into an engine intake by the front nose gear; modern jet engines are designed to take a whole frozen goose through the intake at full power, and puke it out the exhaust appearing as refried beans slammed through a spaghetti strainer at Mach 2; not sure how that works with concrete chunks, which are a bit harder than frozen goose beaks and eyeballs.

My fear is that failures as this, if they are the “punching” failures described in the original article, are not isolated, but merely the symptoms of widespread deficiencies beneath the runway structure -- the real problem; that the cracking could continue and eventually reduce the runway to a series of loosely connected floating concrete slabs producing a never-ending stream of concrete debris at their edges.

Paving over them at the surface with high-strength epoxy grout only conceals the failures, and does nothing to correct the underlying problem. This might not end soon.

Edited July 14, 2012 by swillowbee

[sangfroid]

3 weeks a go I drove to the airport to pick up visitors. I went to car park 3 on the top level

I entered as usual and was given the ticket by the girl in the booth. Past the booth however ALL the parking spaces in the centre of the floor were roped and netted off. Access was only available at the end of the rows where guys with books of tickets stood. I drove in despite his gesturing me to stop. He followed me to the parking space I chose, and he told me this was now the "service area" and I had to pay IIRC. 90 baht for the first 2 hours. I showed him the ticket from the booth "You have to pay that extra on the way out" he told me. I politely declined and proceeded down to the 2nd level where everything was as normal.

I was there again three night ago when my visitors flew out. No sign at all of the "service area" Obviously it was a scam by the people running the car parks.

The Bangkok Post reported that 3 mafias have divided up the airport.

My guess?

The Army.

The Police.

Relatives of the invisible hand.

[bigdod]

True - I remember a whole bunch of times arriving at H'row terminal 4 (prior to T5 being opened) where I faced too many delays - one security scanner thing working for close on 1000 pax, staff who couldnt speak English etc etc, it was a nightmare, but then again, that said I fly in & out of swampy (int'l) a dozen or so times per year and I've been stuck in the hour plus immigration queues (both ways) there too. The only bit that seems to work well consistently (for me) is the domestic side. That doesn't change the facts that the airport definitely has a whole bunch of issues that it needs to take care of if it wants to continue to be what it proposes to be...

[Monkeyrobot]

Our flight was in a holding pattern last Thursday night for 30 min

[SouthernMan3]

@apetley :

Sorry for my ignorance but what's AJ stuff ?

"Inexpensive electrical goods."

Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect App

Inexpensive French electrical goods ?

Btw, Don't you mean AV as in audio visual or am I back in the last century ?

Cheap Thai brand.

Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect App

Why AJ ?

[ableguy]

You may recall when it opened it was more like a shopping mall than an airport, many of the toilets that were in the plans but never built turned into space for making money, remmember the rape that occured because there were no electric lights in some areas, but hey we all accept the massive corruption that takes place so why complain, officials convicted of corruption just get transferred for a month, its one big club and most Thais think its ok just wishing they could get a slice of the action.

[Maestro]

Kudos to our member swillowbee, from whose post in an earlier topic on ThaiVisa the news article in Asia Sentinel is quoting. That post is worth reading again.

[tragickingdom]

Thailand's airports are still heavenly in comparison with the mess they make in a country like the UK. If you like to visit the Olympic games and you want to be in time, fly tomorrow. The immigration might stamp your passport just in time for the 27th.

[Colabamumbai]

And that is why the call it "Swampy." soon you can depart the plane thru the emergency exits on the inflatable emergency rubber type rafts right into the water, but remember the sign says take your shoes off first.

[tragickingdom]

Thailand's airports are still heavenly in comparison with the mess they make in a country like the UK. If you like to visit the Olympic games and you want to be in time, fly tomorrow. The immigration might stamp your passport just in time for the 27th.

[NCFC]

Its very easy to be negative. However, Bangkok, Ayuttaya, etc, are on a flood plane. So where can you build a new airport? Virtually every factory in this area is built on flood plane/sinking land! I remember when the airport was being built and a huge amount of earth was moved to fill the swamp. As with most Thai projects, the build is done at breakneck speed and no time is made to allow the ground to settle; however sink age will happen anyway. Thus ongoing problems are inevitable. Thailand is not alone in this respect; look at the airport at Osaka, which is built on a man made island, and has also suffered sinking. Whats the answer? Live with the problems and fix them as they arise?

Where can you build a new airport? Hum?

Does Korat ever flood? Is there high ground around Korat? Is there plenty of land available in and around Korat? Land settle - errm about 5 billion years.

Does Saraburi ever flood? Is there high ground around Saraburi? Is there land available in and around Saraburi? Land settle - errm about 5 billion years.

Do we need rocket science to decide where to build an airport?

No! We need uncorrupt Ministers, who own land in none of the areas discussed, and who won't profit from the choice of land for an airport in order to silverline their back ass pockets.

Unfortunately, the Shinawatras owned most of the land where Suvarnabhumi was built, along with their cronies.

There is plenty of land that does not flood, and believe me, none of the Ministers own it, as their dirty hands are in rice and shit fields. Dry land is of no interest to them, as it is not arable land.

So Thailand IS alone in this crooked mess, AND it all stems from the top. Pisses me off no end, and you need a rethink!

And, just to add, you can get to bangkok a lot quicker from Korat and Saraburi than from that junkyard called Suvarnabhumi, because all the roads leading from there to BKK are also sinking and under constant repair!

It's not often, but by Buddha your post made me vehement. You didn't think one iota about other possibilities, but made excuses for Suva being the way it is. Pathetic!

Now, I'll have a beer and chill.

-mel.

The site for the new airport was chosen over 40 years ago and the government began buying the land way back then, long before Thaksin was on the scene. So please get your facts right before you start shooting your mouth off about things of which you know nothing.

[bangkokrick]

Thailand's airports are still heavenly in comparison with the mess they make in a country like the UK. If you like to visit the Olympic games and you want to be in time, fly tomorrow. The immigration might stamp your passport just in time for the 27th.

The UK is not a Country.

[Payboy]

Just departed thru the airport a few days ago and no problems leaving, thru immigration in about 15 min.., we where a bit late departing but the airplane arrived late. When I arrived from the Philippines earlier thru immigration in about 20 min no hassel. In the end all you can use to measure the airports preformance is your own experience.

Why are we getting off the plane and on to a bus to get to the terminal? Compared to Changi, Hong Kong, Incheon...it's a joke.

Better thank walking a mile from the gate.

[tonysilly]

51 Million! wow! mmmm We Need some more ladyBoys lol

[rakman]

This just makes me feel all warm and fuzzy seeing as how I'm flying in on a new 590 ton Airbus A380 in 45 days.

Per Thai standard and regulation will it take a major disaster at Suvarnabhumi before these issues get addressed?

The weight of an aircraft isn't as important as its pavement loading. The A380 is less than a 777-300ER because of the tire size and number of tires. Surprisingly, the 727-200 had a higher pavement loading than the 777-300ER.

Don't get a woman in high heels to land the heel on your foot..

[QED]

Why are we getting off the plane and on to a bus to get to the terminal? Compared to Changi, Hong Kong, Incheon...it's a joke.

You get on a bus when you fly low cost airlines who want to keep fees to a minimum, pretty much like anywhere else.

Err, no, this is common with Thai Airways who are too tight to pay for decent parking spots at their HOME airport. They are probably the most expensive airline flying in and out of Swampy.

I pass through Swampy between 60-80 times a year for work, always with Thai, and have seen the ups and downs over the years. As said it is better than a lot of other international airports.

I have noticed a few delays recently, but nothing too severe. As long as they keep on top of the repairs I don't see an issue apart from the original choice of location and construction (corruption).

[GeorgeO]

"Designed by Helmut Jahn of Murphy/Jahn Architects of Chicago, the airport was in trouble the day it opened,"

Somehow I don't think the original designs called for substandard materials. Nor was there a section in the designs titled: "Shortcuts no one should notice".

Agreed. It has always been the case that they will look for an external party when it comes to the apportioning of blame!

[BigC]

The Bangkok Post reported that 3 mafias have divided up the airport.

My guess?

The Army.

The Police.

Relatives of the invisible hand.

wow by hinting that without evidence you must be a big man lol. To take on theArmy , police and anything else that goes Bang bang lol

[BigC]

The Bangkok Post reported that 3 mafias have divided up the airport.

My guess?

The Army.

The Police.

Relatives of the invisible hand.

wow by hinting that without evidence you must be a big man lol. To take on theArmy , police and anything else that goes Bang bang lol

[jacko45k]

Just departed thru the airport a few days ago and no problems leaving, thru immigration in about 15 min.., we where a bit late departing but the airplane arrived late. When I arrived from the Philippines earlier thru immigration in about 20 min no hassel. In the end all you can use to measure the airports preformance is your own experience.

Of which mine was going around in little circles over Thailand for an hour the other day.