A Farming Myth …

[Canada]

My plan, when I started farming earlier in the year was that I would be the boss and use local labour to do the actual work.

I soon realised that the local labour was expensive and they did crap work.

If I complained about the work they would actually say " Why do you care? you are rich! You don't need to make a profit."

As well as that, people would turn up for work when they felt like it, not when I wanted the work done.

When I have seen people working on neighbouring farms, I have gone over and chatted with them. I've seen a totally differnt work ethic and have some phone numbers. I am building contacts.

I will be lucky to break even this year, but I now have some more contacts. I won't use local labour if I can help it in futuire. the closer they are to you, the more they will take the piss.

Isaan is a farming area, but so many have no idea how to farm, well maybe they do, but decide not to put in the effort if it is not their farm.

Maybe one day someone will explain the thought process behind this attitude. Same thing happened here to me.

It's called entitlement. Personally I wouldn't hire anybody unless I have to. It's not just Isaan, it's all of Thailand. If you want a job done, pay for it buy the piece of by the job. It'll get done. Same as anyone else, Thais love incentive. Give em daily wage and it is a lean on a shovel day.

I'll buy all the equipment I need to do all my jobs and hire help as a last resort. Worker Thais are proud, entitled, and broke, not a good combination.

[IsaanAussie]

I used a guy and his team from a neighbouring village to harvest, cart, thrash and bag, and even transport our rice for sale this year. Now three years in a row. And yes he does come back with all of the money.This year he will bale our straw as well. It is completely business, he tell us what he needs and presents details of what has been done, I pay him on the spot. There is no personal entanglements or feelings of indebtedness. There is a guy in our village who is a good tradesman and I will use him again, same with two local guys with tractors that know what they are doing. But the vast majority are just monkey see monkey do shovel leaners.

I agree with Loong that the more distant you can keep things, the better for everyone. I think Canada's term "entitlement" is very apt. It seems that if you allow people to get closer to you they feel that they are entitled to do as they please. In the long run I suppose we have a saying that warns of this, "Never do business with family or friends".

[loong]

My plan, when I started farming earlier in the year was that I would be the boss and use local labour to do the actual work.

I soon realised that the local labour was expensive and they did crap work.

If I complained about the work they would actually say " Why do you care? you are rich! You don't need to make a profit."

As well as that, people would turn up for work when they felt like it, not when I wanted the work done.

When I have seen people working on neighbouring farms, I have gone over and chatted with them. I've seen a totally differnt work ethic and have some phone numbers. I am building contacts.

I will be lucky to break even this year, but I now have some more contacts. I won't use local labour if I can help it in futuire. the closer they are to you, the more they will take the piss.

Isaan is a farming area, but so many have no idea how to farm, well maybe they do, but decide not to put in the effort if it is not their farm.

Maybe one day someone will explain the thought process behind this attitude. Same thing happened here to me.

this is true capitalism:

they getting the most out (money from you) with the least effort invested.( their passable work)

thais arent that much behind in this, it seems

I don't know about true capitalism.

They may have received money for minimal effort for a very short while, but they will not get any more work from me unless I am desperate. Very shortsighted.

[IsaanAussie]

I'd keep that thought to yourself in the village Loong. I made the mistake of telling a few guys that their work was <deleted> and it bounced back on me with claims of me being black hearted, hot hearted.......It is a death spiral for the likes of us, check out what each guy is capable of BEFORE you get them involved, or just cop it sweet and move on.

An example, I had three guys building the low walls between pens. I wanted the concrete blocks reinforced half way up and a concrete cap on the wall to attach the steelwork to. One guy, a happy talker (all day) just left the reo wire out. I asked him to take the blocks above off again and put it in, he refused saying it was too late. I started doing it myself and he flew into a rage. I asked him to leave and he hasn't spoken to me since. His lack of concentration was blamed on me, I caused him to loose face. To me that is still his problem, if he had kept the hole in his face shut a bit more often the wire would have just been in place.

[loong]

Yes, entitlement.

I expect that there will be some disgruntlement amongst the locals when they realise that I am hiring from other villages.

Their sense of entitlement will probably make them feel that I am doing wrong by not using them.

[David48]

Thanks for giving this thread a second wind ... some great stories out there and I ran out of 'likes' above.

When I can process the photos I'll share a little more about life on the Farm for me as a distant observer.

Cheers and keep the stories coming ...

.

[FredLee]

My wife has an eleven rai farm north of Chiang Mai. It is planted half with Lamyai and half with lime trees. She put in the lime trees about six years ago, and they have never produced in any meaningful way. She made enough from the Lamyai this year to pay about four months worth of expenses. Her brother-in-law and sister take care of the farm. (he was not a brother-in-law when she hired him, he married her sister about two years later). They live on the farm in a small bungalow, and don't have any land of their own. We have been living abroad until just four months ago, and not too concerned with taking a loss each year on the farm. We just wanted it to be well maintained until our retirement here. The loss is not really that great because her caretaker also maintains her other properties in the area, and also acts as our general handyman.

Since we have retired now, the wife wants to try to at least break even on the farm. She has decided to get rid of the lime trees, and has already had over half of them removed. She is not sure what to replace them with. She is thinking corn. The other alternative is to replace them with more Lamyai. We are also in the last three months of our new house being completed, about seven kilometers from the farm, so neither of us has had a lot of time to spend on the farm. She is looking to become the full time on site manager sometime around March.

I am looking forward along with the wife on seeing what can be achieved. There is a lot of good information in this thread, so thanks to all the posters.

[Gary A]

I have a friend who has had no luck using local labor. He needed someone who could be a handyman who could be on his farm permanently and ended up with a Lao guy who is working out very well. Now it is sugar cane cutting time and he and the Lao guy went to Chiang Khan and hired six Lao workers. He has provided housing for them and intends to cut his own sugar cane plus all his neighbors. So far they have ninety rai to cut. And, yes, they work much cheaper than the Thais.

[TommoPhysicist]

@FredLee

How about lychees, very popular crop around CM and usually brings good prices.

They need good irrigation. Taken near Mae Rim earlier this year.

Edited December 5, 2012 by TommoPhysicist

[IsaanAussie]

Heres a little something that I wish would be more reflected here. Unfortunately ATM or money tree is the usual label most of us get. I place more stock on what people do than what they say or how much money or influence they have.

Then afterall I am only human so more often than not I greet the reality I find around me with this

[Canada]

My plan, when I started farming earlier in the year was that I would be the boss and use local labour to do the actual work.

I soon realised that the local labour was expensive and they did crap work.

If I complained about the work they would actually say " Why do you care? you are rich! You don't need to make a profit."

As well as that, people would turn up for work when they felt like it, not when I wanted the work done.

When I have seen people working on neighbouring farms, I have gone over and chatted with them. I've seen a totally differnt work ethic and have some phone numbers. I am building contacts.

I will be lucky to break even this year, but I now have some more contacts. I won't use local labour if I can help it in futuire. the closer they are to you, the more they will take the piss.

Isaan is a farming area, but so many have no idea how to farm, well maybe they do, but decide not to put in the effort if it is not their farm.

Maybe one day someone will explain the thought process behind this attitude. Same thing happened here to me.

this is true capitalism:

they getting the most out (money from you) with the least effort invested.( their passable work)

thais arent that much behind in this, it seems

I don't know about true capitalism.

They may have received money for minimal effort for a very short while, but they will not get any more work from me unless I am desperate. Very shortsighted.

Shortsighted.....nationwide. It's like an epidemic.

[Canada]

I have a friend who has had no luck using local labor. He needed someone who could be a handyman who could be on his farm permanently and ended up with a Lao guy who is working out very well. Now it is sugar cane cutting time and he and the Lao guy went to Chiang Khan and hired six Lao workers. He has provided housing for them and intends to cut his own sugar cane plus all his neighbors. So far they have ninety rai to cut. And, yes, they work much cheaper than the Thais.

I would be happy to pay a Loas guy a fair wage if he worked. I don't necessarily agree with getting good workers from Laos and paying less than the shitty Thai workers who lean on a fence or find a good shady spot to lie down.

[Canada]

"I place more stock on what people do than what they say or how much money or influence they have."

I like this. It resembles my own way: I don't care what you think, feel, hope for, wish for, who or what you know, what you can do for me or just what you can do, period. The only thing that matters to me is what you do.

[somo]

Not a lot new here. Actions do indeed speak louder than words. In Thailand money and influence are much the same things.

Certainly without money there is no influence.

The flip side is that everyone needs a chance to prove himself. Often the words have to come first followed by the action.

It is keeping the promises you make (with words) that marks a man out as deserving of respect.

A man is only as good as his word is also a truism.

Sometimes the ability to judge a mans character is a huge asset for a businessman as initially you only have the word to go on.

[FredLee]

@FredLee

How about lychees, very popular crop around CM and usually brings good prices.

They need good irrigation. Taken near Mae Rim earlier this year.

Thanks for the suggestion. I do want to have a little diversity for the times the lamyai either don't do well, or the price is down. The irrigation should be no problem. We have a good well and several storage tanks, and have PVC laid to provide the water where we need it. We also have water available from the local canal when needed.

[annsd]

I have a friend who has had no luck using local labor. He needed someone who could be a handyman who could be on his farm permanently and ended up with a Lao guy who is working out very well. Now it is sugar cane cutting time and he and the Lao guy went to Chiang Khan and hired six Lao workers. He has provided housing for them and intends to cut his own sugar cane plus all his neighbors. So far they have ninety rai to cut. And, yes, they work much cheaper than the Thais.

I would be happy to pay a Loas guy a fair wage if he worked. I don't necessarily agree with getting good workers from Laos and paying less than the shitty Thai workers who lean on a fence or find a good shady spot to lie down.

[diddums]

@FredLee

How about lychees, very popular crop around CM and usually brings good prices.

They need good irrigation. Taken near Mae Rim earlier this year.

The fruit of the gods.

[David48]

Thanks to who ever breathed life back into this thread with a post.

I have to say, of the many that I have written the Opening Post for, I'm very proud of how the Farming Community shared their experiences here.

Edited February 12, 2013 by David48

[David48]

My OP was along the lines of ...

On a positive note there are the health benefits of a

small Farm holding

.

The Farm style where you have some space around you, a large vege patch and maybe a pond for some fish and more then one fruit tree.

Surely the heath benefit of living on a ‘Hobby Farm’ outweighs any argument that is put that the ‘Farm’ is profitable.

Hopefully you are exercising more working the small Farm holding, eating your own produce … a general sense of well-being.

Maybe you think … Farm profit …

But you will live to a ripe old age to enjoy the fruits of your labour.

Your story to tell …

Fell free to tell your story here ... no photos required ...

David48

.

[jamescollister]

I have a friend who has had no luck using local labor. He needed someone who could be a handyman who could be on his farm permanently and ended up with a Lao guy who is working out very well. Now it is sugar cane cutting time and he and the Lao guy went to Chiang Khan and hired six Lao workers. He has provided housing for them and intends to cut his own sugar cane plus all his neighbors. So far they have ninety rai to cut. And, yes, they work much cheaper than the Thais.

I would be happy to pay a Loas guy a fair wage if he worked. I don't necessarily agree with getting good workers from Laos and paying less than the shitty Thai workers who lean on a fence or find a good shady spot to lie down.

Smart move, a farang hiring illegal Lao workers, road block they go home. You go to jail, a no, no. Hire locals by the job not the day. Jim

[Canada]

I have a friend who has had no luck using local labor. He needed someone who could be a handyman who could be on his farm permanently and ended up with a Lao guy who is working out very well. Now it is sugar cane cutting time and he and the Lao guy went to Chiang Khan and hired six Lao workers. He has provided housing for them and intends to cut his own sugar cane plus all his neighbors. So far they have ninety rai to cut. And, yes, they work much cheaper than the Thais.

I would be happy to pay a Loas guy a fair wage if he worked. I don't necessarily agree with getting good workers from Laos and paying less than the shitty Thai workers who lean on a fence or find a good shady spot to lie down.

Smart move, a farang hiring illegal Lao workers, road block they go home. You go to jail, a no, no. Hire locals by the job not the day. Jim

It was just a comment on the ethics of it Jim. Not really interested in losing all I have here to get a good worker. I am aware of most of the laws here that I may have a chance to break and the consequences of doing so.

D

[Gary A]

What makes you think they are illegal workers? They came through the Loei immigration office in Chiang Khan. Immigration is quite lenient in that area due to the fact that Thai farm workers, especially cane cutters, are difficult to find.

[jamescollister]

What makes you think they are illegal workers? They came through the Loei immigration office in Chiang Khan. Immigration is quite lenient in that area due to the fact that Thai farm workers, especially cane cutters, are difficult to find.

If they are documented legal guest workers no problem. We live on the border and there are road blocks everywhere checking IDs etc Transporting illegals, be you farang or Thai will see you in handcuffs. Jim

[David48]

Sort of related to the above comments.

Was driving with the Thai Family (gf, outlaws) on a major road Chiang Mai.

Came across a check point. They were stopping buses and the like.

As we approached everyone in the car wound down their windows on instruction from the Farm Father.

They were indeed looking for 'illegals'.

The policeman, who I had stopped earlier (much to the embarrassment of all on board ... but I don't care) at the checkpoint going the other way and asked about the approximate distance to the Cheing Dow Caves, looked at me (I was driving), a second glance at the Family smiled, then smirked, then something like 'handsome man', shook my hand and waved me though.

Sure .. a piss take ... but indeed, for once, they were serious with their intent of stopping the road transport of illegal workers into Thailand.

Just saying like and relaying my personal experiences.

.

[Mosha]

I've got news for the BIB, try opening up some of the refrigerated trucks if they are serious about catching illegals.

[David48]

I've got news for the BIB, try opening up some of the refrigerated trucks if they are serious about catching illegals.

Hearing you ...

.

[Rsquared]

Got a pleasant surprise the other day on my way to Ranong to do my visa run, one checkpoint run by the army, normal thing, windows down so they can see inside, I keep eye contact with the soldier while smiling.......then he puts his hand inside my open window and gives me two lollies (heart shaped) and waves us on.

I asked the wife if she had experienced anything like that before and said no.

Kept me smiling for the rest of the journey.

Cheers.

[Mosha]

Got a pleasant surprise the other day on my way to Ranong to do my visa run, one checkpoint run by the army, normal thing, windows down so they can see inside, I keep eye contact with the soldier while smiling.......then he puts his hand inside my open window and gives me two lollies (heart shaped) and waves us on.

I asked the wife if she had experienced anything like that before and said no.

Kept me smiling for the rest of the journey.

Cheers.

Which checkpoint? I'm in Ranong, I want a lolly 555

[jamescollister]

Got a pleasant surprise the other day on my way to Ranong to do my visa run, one checkpoint run by the army, normal thing, windows down so they can see inside, I keep eye contact with the soldier while smiling.......then he puts his hand inside my open window and gives me two lollies (heart shaped) and waves us on.

I asked the wife if she had experienced anything like that before and said no.

Kept me smiling for the rest of the journey.

Cheers.

Which checkpoint? I'm in Ranong, I want a lolly 555

Valentines day I think. Lucky the wife's not well as I forgot. She has just been lying in bed for a few days and didn't remember. Jim

[David48]

Valentines day I think. Lucky the wife's not well as I forgot. She has just been lying in bed for a few days and didn't remember. Jim

Jim, score heaps of brownie points. Sidle up to her a repeat the words ... sùk sân wan Walentive

Or check out the prettiest Mod you will ever see ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=zhgSyb6SodA