Will Linux Finally Become The Alternative Desktop Operating System?

[Richard-BKK]

For the people that need professional grade photo editing software, Corel has AfterShot Pro available for Linux, okay it's not free software, but Adobe PhotoShop is also not free.

Corel AfterShot Pro is intended to compete with Adobe's Photoshop Lightroom software, but it actually does much more. AfterShot Pro is designed to deliver competitive performance (it's multi-threaded), RAW* imaging support, flexible photo manager, robust meta-data tools, non-destructive editing, batch processing, and many other features. Corel's photo software and it's available natively for Linux platforms...

*AfterShot Pro can process RAW files from all major camera manufacturers.

http://www.corel.com/corel/product/index.jsp?pid=prod4670071&cid=catalog20038&segid=6000006&onyxcampaignid=&promo=&dcs_action=&url_coupon=&storeKey=&mapcounter=

[endure]

For the people that need professional grade photo editing software, Corel has AfterShot Pro available for Linux, okay it's not free software, but Adobe PhotoShop is also not free.

Corel AfterShot Pro is intended to compete with Adobe's Photoshop Lightroom software,

It's not 'Adobe's Photoshop Lightroom' software it's Adobe Lightroom - it is a free standing piece of software that has nothing to do with Photoshop. It doesn't require Photoshop. The latest version (v4) has just been released and it costs £20 more than Corel's Aftershot Pro. It is the standard workflow product for photographers who aren't likely to quibble about paying £20 extra for industry standard software.

[endure]

Linux actually has its own alternative to Lightroom in Darktable http://www.darktable.org/

I've no idea how good it is as I'm one of those stupid people who doesn't really care what the operating system is as long as the PC does what I want it to.

[Richard-BKK]

For the people that need professional grade photo editing software, Corel has AfterShot Pro available for Linux, okay it's not free software, but Adobe PhotoShop is also not free.

Corel AfterShot Pro is intended to compete with Adobe's Photoshop Lightroom software,

It's not 'Adobe's Photoshop Lightroom' software it's Adobe Lightroom - it is a free standing piece of software that has nothing to do with Photoshop. It doesn't require Photoshop. The latest version (v4) has just been released and it costs £20 more than Corel's Aftershot Pro. It is the standard workflow product for photographers who aren't likely to quibble about paying £20 extra for industry standard software.

Sorry but it's Adobe Photoshop Lightroom, check http://www.adobe.com...-lightroom.html for more information.... Also Adobe Photoshop Lightroom 4 doesn't work with Linux, while the software from Corel is available as a Linux version...

Edited July 30, 2012 by Richard-BKK

[Richard-BKK]

Linux actually has its own alternative to Lightroom in Darktable http://www.darktable.org/

I've no idea how good it is as I'm one of those stupid people who doesn't really care what the operating system is as long as the PC does what I want it to.

Darktable is a nice software package, but it's not something you could compare to what Corel is offering with Aftershot Pro. But that is probably the difference between free and professional commercial software.

[thaimite]

To report back on my previous post, my friend is loving their Ubuntu.

They have not used Windows since I installed Ubuntu on their Asus laptop, an yesterday I was asked how to make it the default boot option.

Admittedly it is still very early but as a typical home user they are able to do almost everything they could in windows. The only exception is no support for Yahoo Messenger voice calls, but as they can do that with their Android phone it is no loss.

Currently they are checking out some of the keyboard shortcuts., and learning new software appears to be more fun than a hassle. Seeing how Shotwell catalogued their numerous photos was shouts of joy, especially when it was discovered they could easily tag and sort them.

The software installed using WUBI without a glitch on an Asus K52F laptop and all hardware worked with no tweaks required.

The one remaining challenge is to install the drivers for a brother multifunction printer / scanner. This is not something I would wish on any newbie, and is an area where things still need to improve.

I know it is still early, but things are looking good.

[Richard-BKK]

Rumors are growing rapidly that Blizzard Entertainment will also step into the Linux gaming... especially now Rob Pardo (President at Blizzard Entertainment) has said "I think Windows 8 is a catastrophe for everyone in the PC space* - not awesome for Blizzard either.

[Richard-BKK]

To report back on my previous post, my friend is loving their Ubuntu.

They have not used Windows since I installed Ubuntu on their Asus laptop, an yesterday I was asked how to make it the default boot option.

Admittedly it is still very early but as a typical home user they are able to do almost everything they could in windows. The only exception is no support for Yahoo Messenger voice calls, but as they can do that with their Android phone it is no loss.

Currently they are checking out some of the keyboard shortcuts., and learning new software appears to be more fun than a hassle. Seeing how Shotwell catalogued their numerous photos was shouts of joy, especially when it was discovered they could easily tag and sort them.

The software installed using WUBI without a glitch on an Asus K52F laptop and all hardware worked with no tweaks required.

The one remaining challenge is to install the drivers for a brother multifunction printer / scanner. This is not something I would wish on any newbie, and is an area where things still need to improve.

I know it is still early, but things are looking good.

With a Brother printer it depends a bit how old the printer-combo-device is, most Brother printers now-a-day have excellent Linux support but a few of the older printers have some problems.

http://welcome.solutions.brother.com/bsc/public_s/id/linux/en/index.html

Of course some of the low-cost laser printers, which where especially made for MS Windows will not work very well. The problem with this printers is that they have no processor and depend on the GDI (graphical device interface) of MS Windows to do the rendering. Understandable the GDI in MS Windows is property (copyright) software so not easy to duplicate with Linux.

[Richard-BKK]

Some screens Darktable vs Corel AfterShot Pro (both are native Linux programs), Corel AfterShot Pro cost currently US$ 59, I sadly paid US$ 99.

Dealing with large files, Corel AfterShot Pro is much faster and easier to work with... more tools quickly at hand...

[thaimite]

To report back on my previous post, my friend is loving their Ubuntu.

They have not used Windows since I installed Ubuntu on their Asus laptop, an yesterday I was asked how to make it the default boot option.

Admittedly it is still very early but as a typical home user they are able to do almost everything they could in windows. The only exception is no support for Yahoo Messenger voice calls, but as they can do that with their Android phone it is no loss.

Currently they are checking out some of the keyboard shortcuts., and learning new software appears to be more fun than a hassle. Seeing how Shotwell catalogued their numerous photos was shouts of joy, especially when it was discovered they could easily tag and sort them.

The software installed using WUBI without a glitch on an Asus K52F laptop and all hardware worked with no tweaks required.

The one remaining challenge is to install the drivers for a brother multifunction printer / scanner. This is not something I would wish on any newbie, and is an area where things still need to improve.

I know it is still early, but things are looking good.

With a Brother printer it depends a bit how old the printer-combo-device is, most Brother printers now-a-day have excellent Linux support but a few of the older printers have some problems.

http://welcome.solut...x/en/index.html

Of course some of the low-cost laser printers, which where especially made for MS Windows will not work very well. The problem with this printers is that they have no processor and depend on the GDI (graphical device interface) of MS Windows to do the rendering. Understandable the GDI in MS Windows is property (copyright) software so not easy to duplicate with Linux.

Many thanks for your reply.

I have actually already installed this same model of printer on another Linux computer. It works well with all functionality, it is just the install was not straight forward from the Ubuntu printer set-up.

It mean finding the right files on the Brother website (which is very badly organised and unintuitive) and then following detailed instructions in a specific order. I found about 4 sets of instructions but only one worked and had all the steps for printer and scanner. By the time I had researched the web and found instructions that worked I had wasted at least half a day. not the sort of thing a newbie should have to do, and not something I am looking forward to doing again on my day off this week.

I believe I bookmarked all the links, and maybe with the newer release of 12.04 it will be easier. However this is the sort of hangover from the old days that gives Linux a bad name.

Maybe one fine day some printer manufacturers will soon decide to ship Linux install discs with their products giving them easier access to a potentially very large market.

[Richard-BKK]

The current Lexmark printers come with Linux support, the Lexmark OfficeEdge Pro4000 supports Red Hat Enterprise, Fedora, Suse, Red Flag, Ubuntu, LinPlus and Debian. They also support Unix and Apply Mac OS-X...

And very likely they suport more, as you probably can use the .rpm and .deb files with other Linux distributions...

Edited July 30, 2012 by Richard-BKK

[thaimite]

That is interesting about Lexmark

Previously I have stayed away from Lexmark products due to their over priced consumables such as ink etc.

Do you know if they do any Laser printers / scanners with Linux support?

Edited July 30, 2012 by thaimite

[Richard-BKK]

That is interesting about Lexmark

Previously I have stayed away from Lexmark products due to their over priced consumables such as ink etc.

Do you know if they do any Laser printers / scanners with Linux support?

Most new Lexmark printers have Linux support out of the box. I'm not sure if Lexmark still makes printers that use the Windows GDI. You can check the Thai Lexmark website (has every information in English) http://www1.lexmark....functions.shtml

Also most printers from other manufacturers that support Apple Mac OS X will work with Linux, Linux and Mac OS X use the same CUPS printer driver system.

Edited July 30, 2012 by Richard-BKK

[endure]

I've just run live Ubuntu on a 6 year old laptop and it found an SD reader that W7 refuses to believe is there. Quite impressive.

[thaimite]

That is interesting about Lexmark

Previously I have stayed away from Lexmark products due to their over priced consumables such as ink etc.

Do you know if they do any Laser printers / scanners with Linux support?

Most new Lexmark printers have Linux support out of the box. I'm not sure if Lexmark still makes printers that use the Windows GDI. You can check the Thai Lexmark website (has every information in English) http://www1.lexmark....functions.shtml

Also most printers from other manufacturers that support Apple Mac OS X will work with Linux, Linux and Mac OS X use the same CUPS printer driver system.

When further investigating your comments, I came across this excellent site for Linux supported Printers.

I will need a new printer soon, and when I am ready to buy I will be seeing what is commended there. Most probably the exact models will not be available in Thailand but it will narrow the search

[JSixpack]

Linux has always been the alternative OS. The question is will mainstream users be comfortable using Linux? No, at least not yet. Linux had its chance when it was distributed commercially with the alternative-OS netbooks just a couple years back.

Dell may be starting to bring it back; I take this as a good sign:

http://www.zdnet.com...nux-7000001583/

I don't know any normal-user who bought an Ubuntu/Linux version. Most people don't even know that versions of Linux/Unix power a lot of everyday devices. They don't care. The Windows GUI is comfortable, used everywhere, and is supported by almost all developers. Microsoft won't be disappearing anytime soon. All Windows releases have always been between $100-200. Even if we don't buy the upgrade, they'll just distribute it with new PCs and dominate by sheer volume, forcing developers to support the most-common OS, Windows 8.

On the contrary, Windows 8 may be the wedge that opens things up for Linux on the average desktop. As things stand, few are going to like the Win 8 interface on their desktop or laptop. Meanwhile, Linux and its applications keep getting better and better. Personally, I'm starting to hear of more people using it now.

And WinXP or Win7 can always be run virtually under Linux. Support for XP doesn't end until 4/8/2014; for Win 7, 1/14/2020--but will probably be extended, just was XP support.

You heard that Valve is bringing Steam, a major player in the gaming market, to Linux?

http://arstechnica.c...-embrace-linux/

And one of the big reasons is a lack of faith in Windows 8, combined w/ the growing interest in Linux as a worthy alternative.

Linux needs more publicity out in the market so that average users know about it and can start requesting that their OEM computer offer Linux as an option--at a discount.

Linux is gathering a head of steam, I think.

[Richard-BKK]

Okay, probably nobody will actually say this, but since the guys from Valve are getting into Linux they have found a kernel bug that limited the graphical speed of drivers (Nvidia programmers fixed that), they helped Intel to fix and speedup its drivers remarkable...

And they had so much helpful comments on other projects that we will see probable a big wave of upgrades in the next few weeks... This is just one team of programmers that helps to get opensource Linux ready to do gaming... with it they help to speedup graphics and overall performance.... This happened with MS Windows and it will happen with any OS that the gaming industry sees as the standard...

Even for Linux we had similar as MS Windows the 295.59 driver, but in a short time we went in less than 2 weeks from 295.59 to 304.17, to 304,22, and today to 304.30 yes this is the first time that an option on a new Nvidia graphic card is first introduced on the Linux platform (before new options where first developed for MS Windows and will later also be available for Linux.)

Trust me when all three big gaming companies release and support Linux as the major platform, Linux will have a major boost in attention... And currently all cards are in place...

Edited July 31, 2012 by Richard-BKK

[bendejo]

Some things about Linux may not be issues for you personally, but when you run into them it will change your perspective on the OS considerably. I'm taking about hardware compatibility. If you do an install and it goes well, congratulations. If not you need to use another OS. Or go fish.

By 'go fish' I mean take to the web and try to figure out why the install didn't work. It may take a while to discover but perhaps you came up against a known bug, for which someone posted a possible solution: download the source code and edit part of it, now download the development kit (compilers etc) and rebuild the kernel (of course if one of the things you can't get working is your network connection the challenge is amplified). Still not working? Maybe your problem is different. Back to the beginning. Maybe you'll be lucky and, after another day of sleuthing, you'll find that other bug someone else caught, eg, on line 156 of doohickey.h there should be a space between the third and fourth commas.

Ok, this is the way Linux was from the beginning, and back in the 1990s with distros like Red Hat kernel rebuilding was part of the installation . Ubuntu came along, which was supposed to be Linux for everyone, easy to install, up and running quickly etc. And it was, for a few years.

Personally, on my current laptop, I cannot successfully run Ubuntu releases later than 10.xx. When I get a new computer I'll try again. The really annoying part is certain device drivers that worked previously became 'broken' with later releases.

I know there are hundreds of devices that need to be supported and tested, which of course is impossible. I don't mean to whinge, as this is a free OS and we shouldn't complain about the quality of free stuff. But, in some hardware situations the Ubuntu distros are simply not an option. Like on my Compaq CQ40. In my case I can't even use Debian, as it won't recognize my SATA drive controller.

Anyway, the point I'm reaching for is that most people who have never used Unix before and cannot get their system working within one or two installation attempts are going to be scared off and never look back. Experienced people who are willing to put effort into getting their installation working will probably give up by day #3. Until this is remedied MS has nothing to worry about on the desktop.

[thaimite]

I agree, that hardware issues can be one of the biggest headache, and I have had a few, but in my experience I have never had to do anything with the kernel or re-compile anything to fix any issues I have had. I can also say that from my experience these issues are getting less with the new releases. 12.04 went on my Sony Vaio lap top without a hitch as it did not my friends Asus.

Oh and the Brother printer install was much easier than I thought although I must admit I was armed with all the drivers before I started, and I was already aware of the scan configuration file that had to be edited but was not mentioned in the main instructions from the Brother website.

Having stated all of the above, yes there is hardware that willl not work, and I am always that little bit more careful if I am bying a devcie to run under Linux

[JSixpack]

Some things about Linux may not be issues for you personally, but when you run into them it will change your perspective on the OS considerably. I'm taking about hardware compatibility. If you do an install and it goes well, congratulations. If not you need to use another OS. Or go fish.

You do have a point; I know exactly what you mean.

You have to be aware that many hardware manufacturers don't provide Linux drivers. Really, you should check around first before you buy or even try to install--if you want to be absolutely sure.

If we just buy from Linux-friendly vendors, it will help the spread of Linux. It is spreading.

Most people (excluding the elites here on the forum) don't do their own installs of an OS. They buy an OEM machine where it's pre-installed, or a shop installs it or a geek friend installs it. In those cases, a user doesn't need to frustrate himself. If the OEMs would start offering Linux as an option (at least), then the whole problem would go away from that point. This may happen.

In most cases (though not that cited above), installing Linux and getting it working satisfactorily has become easier and much more likely of success than ever before. I think it's always worth a try even it fails.

Yet if it fails beyond redemption in a particular case, one needn't remain soured throughout eternity. I tried Linux (as opposed to Unix) some 8 years ago and decided it and its apps definitely weren't ready for prime time. I had hope for them, however. Now I think they are, w/ the caveat that hardware support is still an issue. Even if you need a critical Windows-only app, it can be run either under Wine or in a Windows VM environment.

Edited August 5, 2012 by JSixpack

[bendejo]

Thanks for the encouragement. The really disappointing thing is that stuff that once worked on my 4 yr old laptop no longer does.

> In most cases (though not that cited above), installing Linux and getting it working satisfactorily has become easier and much more likely of success than ever before. I think it's always worth a try even it fails.

Then it needs to be decided how much effort should be put into it if it doesn't work right out of the box. In my case I woke up one morning and realized I had just spent nearly every waking hour of the previous three days trying to get a 12.04 distro up and running. With only one machine, and only wifi access, having to shut down and boot into Windows in order to access the net can really eat into your hours.

The way it used to be (at least with me, with my various hw configurations over the years) was that things either worked or didn't, but if they did work they worked properly. Yes, sometimes it took some wizardry and research to get the settings right etc. In my adventures with the latest Ubuntu kernel (12.04) there are things that work sometimes, don't work at others, and work poorly the rest of the time. It's not just me, others are posting and trying to get advice on the same problems.

In the Western world broken usually defines a transient state where the thing in question is going to be either repaired or replaced. Most of us who live in the "less than fully developed world" know that broken could very well mean a state of existence, with nothing to imply that anyone will give it any further attention. This is why I see Ubuntu becoming a Third World OS. On the other hand maybe 12.04 is Ubuntu's "Vista," soon to be followed by a kick-arse 12.10. I'm not holding my breath for this.

It also seems things are being changed just for the sake of change, and the new versions are operationally unimpressive, this started with 11.04. Reminds me of a intern I once worked with, a grad student at Stanford at the time; he thought all programs in the world should be re-written in perl, and he was just the guy to do it. Turns out he did just that with the project I was working on and checked in the code the day he left, didn't tell anyone about it, and of course it didn't work. A few days later three (count 'em, 3) levels of management appeared in my office wanting to know <deleted> was going on. I had no idea. It took a few minutes but I figured it out (the sudden appearance of so many .pl files was the giveaway). Thank goodness we were able to roll back, good thing he didn't have the code admin pw. A week later I ran into one of the managers, he said the kid emailed him a few days before fishing for compliments for how he revolutionized the project; the manager didn't tell me how he responded, but that's an easy guess.

I may try 12.10 when it comes out in October, but I'll probably put off further Linux attempts (other than re-installing 10.04) until I get a new laptop (life's too short). Thank goodness for the other U-based distros like Mint, so we don't have to contend with the apple-wannabe interface fashions. Even the package manager has been removed from U-12.04, my guess is that it worked so well it annoyed someone in development. I suspect that the people running the Ubuntu show these days are all ex-MS employees/stockholders (this is meant as cynical humor).

But as for addressing the question being asked in the topic heading, my reply is "maybe someday, but not today."

Edited August 7, 2012 by bendejo

[JSixpack]

Thanks for the encouragement. The really disappointing thing is that stuff that once worked on my 4 yr old laptop no longer does.

> In most cases (though not that cited above), installing Linux and getting it working satisfactorily has become easier and much more likely of success than ever before. I think it's always worth a try even it fails.

Then it needs to be decided how much effort should be put into it if it doesn't work right out of the box. In my case I woke up one morning and realized I had just spent nearly every waking hour of the previous three days trying to get a 12.04 distro up and running. With only one machine, and only wifi access, having to shut down and boot into Windows in order to access the net can really eat into your hours.

The way it used to be (at least with me, with my various hw configurations over the years) was that things either worked or didn't, but if they did work they worked properly. Yes, sometimes it took some wizardry and research to get the settings right etc. In my adventures with the latest Ubuntu kernel (12.04) there are things that work sometimes, don't work at others, and work poorly the rest of the time. It's not just me, others are posting and trying to get advice on the same problems.

In the Western world broken usually defines a transient state where the thing in question is going to be either repaired or replaced. Most of us who live in the "less than fully developed world" know that broken could very well mean a state of existence, with nothing to imply that anyone will give it any further attention. This is why I see Ubuntu becoming a Third World OS. On the other hand maybe 12.04 is Ubuntu's "Vista," soon to be followed by a kick-arse 12.10. I'm not holding my breath for this.

Right. Me, I figure one afternoon of unpaid fooling around w/ something is my limit. I agree: life's short and mine's gettin' shorter.

It also seems things are being changed just for the sake of change, and the new versions are operationally unimpressive, this started with 11.04. Reminds me of a intern I once worked with, a grad student at Stanford at the time; he thought all programs in the world should be re-written in perl, and he was just the guy to do it. Turns out he did just that with the project I was working on and checked in the code the day he left, didn't tell anyone about it, and of course it didn't work. A few days later three (count 'em, 3) levels of management appeared in my office wanting to know <deleted> was going on. I had no idea. It took a few minutes but I figured it out (the sudden appearance of so many .pl files was the giveaway). Thank goodness we were able to roll back, good thing he didn't have the code admin pw. A week later I ran into one of the managers, he said the kid emailed him a few days before fishing for compliments for how he revolutionized the project; the manager didn't tell me how he responded, but that's an easy guess.

Great story and not atypical in IT environments. What kills me is how some uber geek cons the mngmt into supporting some esoteric project that nobody understands, 'cause it's truly incomprehensible, but it just sounds SO impressive. The guy's obviously SO smart that he's just GOT to be kept happy. In the end, it all comes to naught, lots of $$ wasted.

I may try 12.10 when it comes out in October, but I'll probably put off further Linux attempts (other than re-installing 10.04) until I get a new laptop (life's too short). Thank goodness for the other U-based distros like Mint, so we don't have to contend with the apple-wannabe interface fashions. Even the package manager has been removed from U-12.04, my guess is that it worked so well it annoyed someone in development. I suspect that the people running the Ubuntu show these days are all ex-MS employees/stockholders (this is meant as cynical humor).

But as for addressing the question being asked in the topic heading, my reply is "maybe someday, but not today."

OK, my suggestion for getting a more recent distro running on your laptop is just to use yumi or unetbootin to get several non-Ubuntu flavors to boot from a flashdrive and try them out one at a time. Linux Mint has a Debian flavor, as you probably know, with different desktop managers. (I don't like bloated interfaces either.) This is kinda fun to do for a while anyway, if you have the time. This way you can keep your present installation while trying them out.

[JSixpack]

20-million new Ubuntu Linux PCs in 2012? | ZDNet

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/20-million-new-ubuntu-linux-pcs-in-2012/10770

[linuxuser010101]

Linux Mint is definitely a good desktop OS I have been running it as my primary desktop for the past 4 distros on all of my machines and have never had any trouble. I have been playing with Zenix a bit it's very clean but I'm not sure because of the odd GUI that it is a good desktop.

[JSixpack]

Linux Made Easy: Linux on the Desktop Dead? More Alive then Never - 750 Desktops at Portugal

http://linuxmadeasy.blogspot.pt/2012/10/linux-on-desktop-dead-more-alive-then.html

[taha]

linux based os are quiet widespread among developers , Ubuntu is one of those which absorbed normal users as well

myself I prefer KDE environment its a bit slower than other environments but have a full set of useful applications and packages provided by KDE

Since come to Ubuntu 12.04 I found out windows would be the biggest mistake of my life , now have 12.04 setup for eclipse and SDK for android development

so far no problem, no crashes, no virus matters and ...

for applications there are always equivalent versions for linux and if there is not, wine Virtual machine would be an alternative for windows softwares

but there is a major problem for thai people in linux and thats there is no well working camfrog

[inthepink]

I don't think Linux is going to be a viable alternative for most people until driver support is improved dramatically. The only distro I have tried that made it easy to install drivers has been Ubuntu 12.04. The rest - openSUSE 12.2, Debian 6.05, Linux Mint 13 KDE / Xfce and Arch Linux are not very user friendly. Actually, the last one I use to learn more about Linux and realise that it was never intended to be user friendly but as for the rest - the average user does not want to search through software repositories and work out which of the dozens of nvidia packages they actually need to install, then work out how to blacklist the open source drivers that are already installed etcetera, just to get 3D effects working on their desktop.

Things will have to improve considerably before widespread adoption takes place.

Maybe a little irrelevant but the figure quoted at the beginning of this thread for buying Windows 8 is way out of line. It costs 1,250 baht for the WIndows 8 Pro upgrade and approx 3,000 baht for a completely new copy of Windows 8 (non-pro) - nowhere near the 5,000 baht that was mentioned.

Personally I really like Windows 7, will probably upgrade at least one of my machines to Windows 8, and will continue to experiment with various Linux distros, but them I am a sad old geek (I have PC-BSD too).

[Gary A]

The major problem that I see with Linux is that there is absolutely NO discipline among developers. There is NO standard operating system to work from. Everything can be improved but who decides what is better? It's the old story that too many cooks spoil the stew.

Edited October 28, 2012 by Gary A

[ITGabs]

yes!

Ubuntu and unity surprise me, was nothing about what I expected, I really hate that change but for new pc users, or beginners looks amazing.

The major problem that I see with Linux is that there is absolutely NO discipline among developers. There is NO standard operating system to work from. Everything can be improved but who decides what is better? It's the old story that too many cooks spoil the stew.

I am looking for an alternative to ubuntu right now and I understand your point, there is no order in the open source field, more that the crowd popularity, before was ubuntu now mint, before was gnome or kde, now unity or wherever.

I like gnome for example but now looks like the team divided into unity and mint and more projects more divisions, that means very few people are working or interested in the root project and derived into many branches, what is better? difficult, so much new developments and so much bugs, instabilities, features lost, or integrations problems since one team decides different patterns and integrations get complicated, upgrades worst, but windows it's not a perfect os, I see that I have the same number on instabilities or things get me out of my work for find a solution for a OS problem it's similar.

Wherever, Linux will never stop to grow, Apple or Microsoft can disappear, but open source, gnu and linux never.

Edited November 20, 2012 by ITGabs

[lapd]

Not to sound like a typical Linux nerd but you guys do realize that all the various Linux distributions are basically the same right? The most annoying thing for me is directory structure. That seems to vary quite a bit. I wish all the linux distributions could agree on a standard directory structure. That will probably never happen now this far down the road.

Anways, besides directory structure and the other big one with is the different package managers each distro uses, there isn't much if any difference. Even the GUI they use is the same. Generally Gnome or KDE with only a few tweaks here and there between distro's. The thing most 'users' associate with an OS. More advanced people know more about the underlying OS and may place more association with the package manager and directory structure. However, it's all still pretty much the same after that. They all use the same packages more or less which is what makes an OS and OS...at the user level. Of course they all use the same Kernel.

Think about that next time someone says something dumb like "Ubuntu is more stable than...SUSE" or other such nonsense. One is just as stable as the next because they are both essentially the same.

Edited April 14, 2013 by lapd