Britain, Scotland Sign Deal For Independence Referendum

[theblether]

Yes he could have..............and as I also said he would have nailed himself to a cross in Scotland for ever more if he refused it.

Truthfully, in defence of Cameron......he is an innocent here, he has been left deep in it by the Labour Party, who are mortified at their stupidity.

[MAJIC]

Yes he could have..............and as I also said he would have nailed himself to a cross in Scotland for ever more if he refused it.

Truthfully, in defence of Cameron......he is an innocent here, he has been left deep in it by the Labour Party, who are mortified at their stupidity.

With 1 Tory MP in Scotland,I shouldn't think that Cameron has got any illusions of building up a Blue Scotland Power Base in the event of a NO vote. The word expendable (Politically) springs to mind,

[theblether]

Yes he could have..............and as I also said he would have nailed himself to a cross in Scotland for ever more if he refused it.

Truthfully, in defence of Cameron......he is an innocent here, he has been left deep in it by the Labour Party, who are mortified at their stupidity.

With 1 Tory MP in Scotland,I shouldn't think that Cameron has got any illusions of building up a Blue Scotland Power Base in the event of a NO vote. The word expendable (Politically) springs to mind,

That takes us all the way back to the UNSC /diminished status of the UK etc narrative from earlier in the thread.......I honestly believe he knows the price to pay is too high for the remainder of the UK, as you point out, politically it would be in his favour to see Scotland break away.

[ScotsExpat]

Kudos, theblether...

I have quickly scanned thru the detritus being posted as pro-Unionist attacks on the upcoming opportunity that we, the Scots, have to determine our own future post-2014. As always, all we hear is 'You'll be worse off', with very little substantive arguments as to how or why. In what way?

As you have said, on numerous occasions, the over-riding argument that will determine the outcome of the referendum vote is quite simple..

Can we afford to?

I personally feel that we can't afford NOT to take this opportunity.

[bigbamboo]

So......here's a multiple choice question for you.

Why did Alex Salmond want the referendum in October 2014?. Was it?..........

a) To hope that we get a feel good factor after the Ryder Cup is played at Gleneagles?

To hope that we get a feel good factor after the Commonwealth Games in Glasgow?

c) To hope that we get a feel good factor after the Commemoration of the 700th Hundred Anniversary of the Battle of Bannockburn?

d) To give time for the Unionist parties to implode, to watch as an unpopular Coalition government within 6 months of a General election fights likes rats in a sack? to watch the effect on the electorate as the austerity cuts still affect people's day to day life's?

Hmmmm........I wonder

Or it could be as simple that Salmond needs the 2 years to try and convince the people to join him on his peoples suicide mission!

Well it won't be after Scotland wins the World Cup!

[StreetCowboy]

So......here's a multiple choice question for you.

Why did Alex Salmond want the referendum in October 2014?. Was it?..........

a) To hope that we get a feel good factor after the Ryder Cup is played at Gleneagles?

To hope that we get a feel good factor after the Commonwealth Games in Glasgow?

c) To hope that we get a feel good factor after the Commemoration of the 700th Hundred Anniversary of the Battle of Bannockburn?

d) To give time for the Unionist parties to implode, to watch as an unpopular Coalition government within 6 months of a General election fights likes rats in a sack? to watch the effect on the electorate as the austerity cuts still affect people's day to day life's?

Hmmmm........I wonder

Or it could be as simple that Salmond needs the 2 years to try and convince the people to join him on his peoples suicide mission!

Well it won't be after Scotland wins the World Cup!

We'll be lucky to win the World Cup in curling - even that seems to be going downhill

SC

Gaun' doonhill? Ahthinkakenwhit thepraublemmightbee...

RIBB

[nontabury]

Kudos, theblether...

I have quickly scanned thru the detritus being posted as pro-Unionist attacks on the upcoming opportunity that we, the Scots, have to determine our own future post-2014. As always, all we hear is 'You'll be worse off', with very little substantive arguments as to how or why. In what way?

As you have said, on numerous occasions, the over-riding argument that will determine the outcome of the referendum vote is quite simple..

Can we afford to?

I personally feel that we can't afford NOT to take this opportunity.

.Let's hope it's a YES vote,England is broke,thanks in no small measure to subsidising Scotland for the most part of 300yrs.This was achieved by MANY Scottish MP's, from Ramsay Macdonald thru to Gordon Brown, not forgetting of course Kier Hardie. I feel England will be better of in every aspect without the burden of Scotland. I hope we will be friendly neighbours,similar to what we are with Germany,with one difference,we know for certain that we will never loose to Scotland

In the finals of the world cup.

[theblether]

Kudos, theblether...

I have quickly scanned thru the detritus being posted as pro-Unionist attacks on the upcoming opportunity that we, the Scots, have to determine our own future post-2014. As always, all we hear is 'You'll be worse off', with very little substantive arguments as to how or why. In what way?

As you have said, on numerous occasions, the over-riding argument that will determine the outcome of the referendum vote is quite simple..

Can we afford to?

I personally feel that we can't afford NOT to take this opportunity.

.Let's hope it's a YES vote,England is broke,thanks in no small measure to subsidising Scotland for the most part of 300yrs.This was achieved by MANY Scottish MP's, from Ramsay Macdonald thru to Gordon Brown, not forgetting of course Kier Hardie. I feel England will be better of in every aspect without the burden of Scotland. I hope we will be friendly neighbours,similar to what we are with Germany,with one difference,we know for certain that we will never loose to Scotland

In the finals of the world cup.

In as much as I appreciate your support for our campaign to be Independent........you'll need to go back and read the history of the Union, you'll get a shock.

Anyway, more than that, it would be handy if you could relocate to Scotland for the vote and vote Yes to Independence. You may as well join us in this good fight.

@ ScotsExpat.

Thanks very much, and I agree with you. It is all about the money at the end of the day, all this hyperbole about "Braveheart" diminishes the argument on the Unionist side. They don't understand the facts so they go on childish attacks instead.

[theblether]

So......here's a multiple choice question for you.

Why did Alex Salmond want the referendum in October 2014?. Was it?..........

a) To hope that we get a feel good factor after the Ryder Cup is played at Gleneagles?

To hope that we get a feel good factor after the Commonwealth Games in Glasgow?

c) To hope that we get a feel good factor after the Commemoration of the 700th Hundred Anniversary of the Battle of Bannockburn?

d) To give time for the Unionist parties to implode, to watch as an unpopular Coalition government within 6 months of a General election fights likes rats in a sack? to watch the effect on the electorate as the austerity cuts still affect people's day to day life's?

Hmmmm........I wonder

Or it could be as simple that Salmond needs the 2 years to try and convince the people to join him on his peoples suicide mission!

Well it won't be after Scotland wins the World Cup!

Hopefully it will be before England win the World Cup again, I would like to be Independent before Armaggedon.

[7by7]

Well, theblether, I've read your posts, and yet again you dodge the issues with political raving rather than proper answers!

Cameron is not scared of asking for clarification; he simply doesn't have to ask a question everyone knows the answer to.

You keep asking questions about Scotland's past; but it's Scotland's future, and it's economic future in particular, we are talking about here.

You, yourself, say that it's all about the money at the end of the day!

I, and others, have repeatedly asked you questions about that and you repeatedly refuse to answer them, as does Salmond when he is asked.

Why are you and he scared of those questions and the answers?

Is it because you both know that the answers will be disastrous to the independence cause?

SC asked about British citizenship, you waffle on about EU citizenship! Not the same thing. I don't know the answer to that question; but have one of my own. If Scotland becomes independent; why should Scots retain their British citizenship?

And yet again you bring up the dead issue of the UNSC! Why? Why don't you give us the benefit of your erudition on the real issue; the financial disaster awaiting Scotland if it becomes independent.

I will continue to read this topic, if only to watch as the hole you are digging for yourself becomes even deeper, but see little point in responding to your posts until and unless you actually answer the tough questions instead of posting pathetic excuses for not doing so.

[theblether]

I think you were asked what Tam Dalyell said.....and I said that if you couldn't answer that question then I would ignore any further input from you.

I've been playing with you on this thread 7x7, I know you keep rushing to Google to pick up links, but Google can't show you the bigger picture.

You don't know the bigger picture, and rather than run away, come back with an answer to the question..........what did Tam Dalyell say?

ps. It's been entertaining watching you writhe.

You say that the UNSC issue is dead, and yet you also said it was live and provided links to prove it.

It can't be both eh?

Edited November 7, 2012 by theblether

[transam]

You lot can argue all you like but to me the Union is a Union to keep the UK strong in a fairly recently big world. I cannot see Scotland doing anything to improve it's foot print on the world.

Yeh, Scots can say we are alone and brave but brave means nothing in todays world. Just ask those who have ''crept'' into the EU for hand outs. Scots are an incredibly strong race but now money is all that counts, not strength of formidable character.

[StreetCowboy]

As I recall, Tam Dalyell was the one that posed the Linlithgow question (or a question related to some traditional central belt town), which is a strong argument in favour of diminishing the standing of Scottish MPs in Westminster, and an argument for devolution for England from Westminster, similar to that enjoyed by Scotland and the other Celtic nations within the Kingdom. Indeed, that would take us towards a form of federalism, which might not be a bad thing, and which might be accompanied by a clearer accounting of many of the things about which people on this thread currently hold conflicting views of the facts.

It would seem inequitable to remove the citizenship of people who were not allowed to vote, but equally, I would expect Scots living overseas to be allowed to opt for Scottish nationality; similarly, there are many English (and other nationalities) living in Scotland who may wish to retain their British citizenship.

SC

[MAJIC]

I think you were asked what Tam Dalyell said.....and I said that if you couldn't answer that question then I would ignore any further input from you.

I've been playing with you on this thread 7x7, I know you keep rushing to Google to pick up links, but Google can't show you the bigger picture.

You don't know the bigger picture, and rather than run away, come back with an answer to the question..........what did Tam Dalyell say?

ps. It's been entertaining watching you writhe.

You say that the UNSC issue is dead, and yet you also said it was live and provided links to prove it.

It can't be both eh?

If Self Righteous Arrogance was on the Ballot paper,then you would be sure of a Victory.

[theblether]

I think you were asked what Tam Dalyell said.....and I said that if you couldn't answer that question then I would ignore any further input from you.

I've been playing with you on this thread 7x7, I know you keep rushing to Google to pick up links, but Google can't show you the bigger picture.

You don't know the bigger picture, and rather than run away, come back with an answer to the question..........what did Tam Dalyell say?

ps. It's been entertaining watching you writhe.

You say that the UNSC issue is dead, and yet you also said it was live and provided links to prove it.

It can't be both eh?

If Self Righteous Arrogance was on the Ballot paper,then you would be sure of a Victory.

I'm responding to a continuous haranguing by 7x7, anyone reading this thread can see he has been on the attack continuously all the way through it. He argued black and blue on two fundamental points, then bizarrely, he flipped position on one.

He admitted that he knew the UNSC seat was under review.

Then he stated that the SNP wanted a second question......he couldn't prove it, and when it was shown to be a piece of political genius by Alex Salmond, he ran from the subject.

I'm not an arrogant man, but treat me like an idiot and take what you get.

Edited November 7, 2012 by theblether

[theblether]

As I recall, Tam Dalyell was the one that posed the Linlithgow question (or a question related to some traditional central belt town), which is a strong argument in favour of diminishing the standing of Scottish MPs in Westminster, and an argument for devolution for England from Westminster, similar to that enjoyed by Scotland and the other Celtic nations within the Kingdom. Indeed, that would take us towards a form of federalism, which might not be a bad thing, and which might be accompanied by a clearer accounting of many of the things about which people on this thread currently hold conflicting views of the facts.

It would seem inequitable to remove the citizenship of people who were not allowed to vote, but equally, I would expect Scots living overseas to be allowed to opt for Scottish nationality; similarly, there are many English (and other nationalities) living in Scotland who may wish to retain their British citizenship.

SC

You recollection is correct, the infamous West Lothian question, however that was relevant to the Westminster Parliament, not to Holyrood. he made an even more prophetic comment about devolution that Tony Blair believed, but Donald Dewar ignored.

I have dropped hints to 7x7 all the way through this thread, the last one being that "the Labour Party are mortified"............I have also said that Cameron was innocent, he was left this mess.

The issue here is not the West Lothian question......it's something else altogether that Tam Dalyell predicted, and it's come true.

[MAJIC]

I think you were asked what Tam Dalyell said.....and I said that if you couldn't answer that question then I would ignore any further input from you.

I've been playing with you on this thread 7x7, I know you keep rushing to Google to pick up links, but Google can't show you the bigger picture.

You don't know the bigger picture, and rather than run away, come back with an answer to the question..........what did Tam Dalyell say?

ps. It's been entertaining watching you writhe.

You say that the UNSC issue is dead, and yet you also said it was live and provided links to prove it.

It can't be both eh?

If Self Righteous Arrogance was on the Ballot paper,then you would be sure of a Victory.

I'm responding to a continuous haranguing by 7x7, anyone reading this thread can see he has been on the attack continuously all the way through it. He argued black and blue on two fundamental points, then bizarrely, he flipped position on one.

He admitted that he knew the UNSC seat was under review.

Then he stated that the SNP wanted a second question......he couldn't prove it, and when it was shown to be a piece of political genius by Alex Salmond, he ran from the subject.

I'm not an arrogant man, but treat me like an idiot and take what you get.

On the contrary 7x7 put forward his argument in a sensible,factual, and logical manner,and resisted the temptation to debate in a personal manner,what we used to call Gentlemanly!

Your ideas of your "Political Genius" Alex Salmond,does not seem to be an overwhelming belief of the majority of Scottish People,time will tell at the Ballot box, a vote for English people should also have been included,it's our future as well as yours.

[theblether]

Factual until his facts were proved wrong? That's a clever trick eh?

Now he's leaving the debate in a strop. This is what happens when you use Google to construct your argument.........we Scots, and certainly I, have lived with this story all of our lives. Give us the credit of knowing far more about the reality of the subject that Johnnie Come Lately's eh?

[nontabury]

Kudos, theblether...

I have quickly scanned thru the detritus being posted as pro-Unionist attacks on the upcoming opportunity that we, the Scots, have to determine our own future post-2014. As always, all we hear is 'You'll be worse off', with very little substantive arguments as to how or why. In what way?

As you have said, on numerous occasions, the over-riding argument that will determine the outcome of the referendum vote is quite simple..

Can we afford to?

I personally feel that we can't afford NOT to take this opportunity.

.Let's hope it's a YES vote,England is broke,thanks in no small measure to subsidising Scotland for the most part of 300yrs.This was achieved by MANY Scottish MP's, from Ramsay Macdonald thru to Gordon Brown, not forgetting of course Kier Hardie. I feel England will be better of in every aspect without the burden of Scotland. I hope we will be friendly neighbours,similar to what we are with Germany,with one difference,we know for certain that we will never loose to Scotland

In the finals of the world cup.

In as much as I appreciate your support for our campaign to be Independent........you'll need to go back and read the history of the Union, you'll get a shock.

Anyway, more than that, it would be handy if you could relocate to Scotland for the vote and vote Yes to Independence. You may as well join us in this good fight.

.

I know about the history of the Union already thank you,and you know that only a small number of Englishmen voted FOR the union.

Relocate to Scotland,not in my wildest nightmare,to bloody cold,terrible food, not to mention all the moaning locals.

I know you've taken an active interest in another thread regarding UK pensions,what is the SNP policy regarding the freezing or unfreezing of the state pension for pensioners in a independent Scotland, but who happen to be resident in Thailand.?.The reason I ask is, If you can confirm that it is official SNP policy to give the yearly increase to Scots pensioners,this may encourage many to return home to Scotland and vote yes,it might even tip the scales in OUR favour.

[MAJIC]

Kudos, theblether...

I have quickly scanned thru the detritus being posted as pro-Unionist attacks on the upcoming opportunity that we, the Scots, have to determine our own future post-2014. As always, all we hear is 'You'll be worse off', with very little substantive arguments as to how or why. In what way?

As you have said, on numerous occasions, the over-riding argument that will determine the outcome of the referendum vote is quite simple..

Can we afford to?

I personally feel that we can't afford NOT to take this opportunity.

.Let's hope it's a YES vote,England is broke,thanks in no small measure to subsidising Scotland for the most part of 300yrs.This was achieved by MANY Scottish MP's, from Ramsay Macdonald thru to Gordon Brown, not forgetting of course Kier Hardie. I feel England will be better of in every aspect without the burden of Scotland. I hope we will be friendly neighbours,similar to what we are with Germany,with one difference,we know for certain that we will never loose to Scotland

In the finals of the world cup.

In as much as I appreciate your support for our campaign to be Independent........you'll need to go back and read the history of the Union, you'll get a shock.

Anyway, more than that, it would be handy if you could relocate to Scotland for the vote and vote Yes to Independence. You may as well join us in this good fight.

.

I know about the history of the Union already thank you,and you know that only a small number of Englishmen voted FOR the union.

Relocate to Scotland,not in my wildest nightmare,to bloody cold,terrible food, not to mention all the moaning locals.

I know you've taken an active interest in another thread regarding UK pensions,what is the SNP policy regarding the freezing or unfreezing of the state pension for pensioners in a independent Scotland, but who happen to be resident in Thailand.?.The reason I ask is, If you can confirm that it is official SNP policy to give the yearly increase to Scots pensioners,this may encourage many to return home to Scotland and vote yes,it might even tip the scales in OUR favour.

Having Googled Expats Referendum vote,it doesn't look like Salmond is going to give the vote to Ex Pats, he prefers mature 16 and 17 year olds to have the vote,they are more controllable.........

I doubt he would want Ex Pats to dictate their Pension terms,and annual increases whilst being of Ex Pat Status, either.

http://www.expatforu...dependence.html

Edited November 7, 2012 by MAJIC

[theblether]

Don't be making claims that are palpably untrue gents..........the Electoral Commission are in control of the voting process, not Alex Salmond

Legality

The Edinburgh Agreement states that the governments have agreed to promote an Order in Council under Section 30 of the Scotland Act 1998 in the United Kingdom and Scottish Parliaments to allow a single-question referendum on Scottish independence to be held before the end of 2014. The Order will put it beyond doubt that the Scottish Parliament can legislate for that referendum.^[30]

Until the agreement was signed, there were discussions as to whether the Scottish Parliament had the power to legislate for a referendum relating to the issue of Scottish Independence without a Section 30 Order. According to the BBC, under the current system of devolution, the Scottish Parliament does not have the power to unilaterally secede from the United Kingdom, because the constitution is a reserved matter for the UK parliament.^[15] However, according to the Scottish Government, the proposed referendum is an "advisory referendum on extending the powers of the Scottish Parliament",^[14] whose result "will have no legal effect on the Union."^[13] In January 2012, the UK Government expressed the contrary opinion that the holding of any referendum concerning the constitution would be outside the legislative competence of the Scottish Parliament.^[21][31] Lord Wallace, the Advocate General for Scotland, said that private individuals could successfully challenge a referendum bill passed by the Scottish Parliament.^[32]

The UK parliament could temporarily transfer legal authority to the Scottish Parliament to prevent this, but the Scottish Government had objected to the attachment of conditions to any referendum by this process.^[32] However, the Edinburgh Agreement allowed the temporary transfer of legal authority to be made.

[edit]Oversight

According to the Edinburgh Agreement, the Electoral Commission will be responsible for overseeing the referendum, with the exception of the conduct of the poll and announcement of the result, and the giving of grants. In its role of regulating the campaign and campaign spending, the Electoral Commission will report to the Scottish Parliament. The poll and count will be managed in the same way as local elections, by local returning officers and directed by a Chief Counting Officer.^[33]

[theblether]

I wonder if any of you can spot the glaring anomaly in the previous post........you know, that one that will wind every Unionist up to the High Heavens.

If you really understood what was happening here you would be bouncing off the walls with rage. I keep telling you AS is a political genius, I'm telling you, genius.

He's made a complete and utter fool out of the Unionist Parties, a complete and utter fool.

[MAJIC]

Don't be making claims that are palpably untrue gents..........the Electoral Commission are in control of the voting process, not Alex Salmond

Legality

The Edinburgh Agreement states that the governments have agreed to promote an Order in Council under Section 30 of the Scotland Act 1998 in the United Kingdom and Scottish Parliaments to allow a single-question referendum on Scottish independence to be held before the end of 2014. The Order will put it beyond doubt that the Scottish Parliament can legislate for that referendum.^[30]

Until the agreement was signed, there were discussions as to whether the Scottish Parliament had the power to legislate for a referendum relating to the issue of Scottish Independence without a Section 30 Order. According to the BBC, under the current system of devolution, the Scottish Parliament does not have the power to unilaterally secede from the United Kingdom, because the constitution is a reserved matter for the UK parliament.^[15] However, according to the Scottish Government, the proposed referendum is an "advisory referendum on extending the powers of the Scottish Parliament",^[14] whose result "will have no legal effect on the Union."^[13] In January 2012, the UK Government expressed the contrary opinion that the holding of any referendum concerning the constitution would be outside the legislative competence of the Scottish Parliament.^[21][31] Lord Wallace, the Advocate General for Scotland, said that private individuals could successfully challenge a referendum bill passed by the Scottish Parliament.^[32]

The UK parliament could temporarily transfer legal authority to the Scottish Parliament to prevent this, but the Scottish Government had objected to the attachment of conditions to any referendum by this process.^[32] However, the Edinburgh Agreement allowed the temporary transfer of legal authority to be made.

[edit]Oversight

According to the Edinburgh Agreement, the Electoral Commission will be responsible for overseeing the referendum, with the exception of the conduct of the poll and announcement of the result, and the giving of grants. In its role of regulating the campaign and campaign spending, the Electoral Commission will report to the Scottish Parliament. The poll and count will be managed in the same way as local elections, by local returning officers and directed by a Chief Counting Officer.^[33]

So voting was agreed with the Electoral Commission for 16 and 17 year olds.but not for Expats? Sounds like Scottish Expats can kiss their Annual Pension increases goodbye. If you are not entitled to a vote (which should be your birthright) then it's doubtful any increases will be forthcoming. but the English have already fought that battle for you in the European Courts.

But when it comes to Politicians self interest,there needs to be a lot of irate voters before they realise there will be a loss for the Party,so we better listen (no difference whatever Countries Politicians)

[theblether]

MAJIC......stop talking garbage. The English have had no argument on our behalf with the EU, the English don't exist in the eyes of the EU.

The UNITED KINGDOM is a member of the EU, not England!!!!

This is the problem with all you Little Englanders...........you don't even know what country your a citizen of.

[MAJIC]

MAJIC......stop talking garbage. The English have had no argument on our behalf with the EU, the English don't exist in the eyes of the EU.

The UNITED KINGDOM is a member of the EU, not England!!!!

This is the problem with all you Little Englanders...........you don't even know what country your a citizen of.

Obvious contrary to common belief,endorsed by Salmond,Scotland will not sail unhindered into the EU,in fact they will have to rejoin.

Another shall we politely say hm! mistatement from Salmond.And that's what people like you think,every door will open on command. Get real!

I shall resist the temptation of calling you a little Scotlander,and get into a verbal tennis match with you,which is what you seem to specialise in.

No doubt you will be asking for evidence of Salmonds extreme embarressment over yet more of his Porkies,read and digest! this is the man the general Public are struggling to have confidence and credibility in

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2012/nov/03/alex-salmond-scottish-independence

Edited November 7, 2012 by MAJIC

[7by7]

The second question question?

I've already given you two links to newspaper reports, have you read them? Here's another.

In the clearest sign yet he wants a second question on the referendum ballot paper, the First Minister said having all financial matters devolved to Holyrood instead of independence was “a very attractive argument.”

He said the Scottish people have the “right to decide” on maximum devolution – or devo max – in the forthcoming referendum as well as the SNP’s flagship policy. ..........

.......However, the First Minister has become increasingly desperate to get a "devo max" option to devolve more powers on the ballot paper after recent opinion polls showed support for independence was only at 35 per cent compared with 55 per cent for remaining part of the UK.

Are you saying that these three newspapers, and all the other media, have misquoted him? If that is the case, why has he not sought retractions?

Alex Salmond; political genius? Well he's certainly got you fooled! I just hope for their sakes that the rest of the Scottish people are not so gullible.

You say that the UNSC issue is dead, and yet you also said it was live and provided links to prove it.

It can't be both eh?

What I meant was that the effect of Scottish independence on the UK's position on the UNSC is a dead issue; certainly as far as this topic is concerned.

Something I would have thought obvious to anyone with the slightest intelligence who has read this topic, as I have made that point time and time again! Sorry if I overestimated you.

Factual until his facts were proved wrong? That's a clever trick eh?

Now he's leaving the debate in a strop.

I am still waiting for you to prove any of the facts I have posted wrong. You haven't even made a decent fist of proving the opinions I've posted wrong!

I have not left this topic in a strop; I can see no point in attempting to engage you in a debate when you resolutely refuse to answer the difficult questions; preferring instead to post snide remarks and silly smileys. Very adult of you.

[theblether]

1. I sent you a link earlier pointing out that Alex Salmond never asked for second question.....

2. The UNSC issue is not dead You've admitted that yourself, and as I have already pointed out to you, the potential break up of the UK will have an effect. Choose to believe otherwise if you will.

3. Waffle......you don't know what your talking about and it's causing high amusement among the Scots that know the answers to the questions.

So once again can you answer the question..........what did Tam Dalyell say?

[theblether]

MAJIC......stop talking garbage. The English have had no argument on our behalf with the EU, the English don't exist in the eyes of the EU.

The UNITED KINGDOM is a member of the EU, not England!!!!

This is the problem with all you Little Englanders...........you don't even know what country your a citizen of.

Obvious contrary to common belief,endorsed by Salmond,Scotland will not sail unhindered into the EU,in fact they will have to rejoin.

Another shall we politely say hm! mistatement from Salmond.And that's what people like you think,every door will open on command. Get real!

I shall resist the temptation of calling you a little Scotlander,and get into a verbal tennis match with you,which is what you seem to specialise in.

No doubt you will be asking for evidence of Salmonds extreme embarressment over yet more of his Porkies,read and digest! this is the man the general Public are struggling to have confidence and credibility in

http://www.guardian....sh-independence

I specialize in understanding Scottish politics. I also specialize in understanding that the Guardian is a Left Wing Pro Unionist newspaper in the pocket of the British Labour Party.

Don't be sending me Guardian links, it's just Labour Party propaganda.

There is no mechanism to strip current EU citizens of citizenship, and we Scots are EU citizens.

There is no way the EU will refuse membership to a democratically elected Scottish government.

If you believe otherwise then you will need to go study the reason why the Common Market was formed, and to understand that the EU is the greatest post war success story in the World.

ps. That Youtube clip is comical

Edited November 7, 2012 by theblether

[theblether]

[MAJIC]

MAJIC......stop talking garbage. The English have had no argument on our behalf with the EU, the English don't exist in the eyes of the EU.

The UNITED KINGDOM is a member of the EU, not England!!!!

This is the problem with all you Little Englanders...........you don't even know what country your a citizen of.

Obvious contrary to common belief,endorsed by Salmond,Scotland will not sail unhindered into the EU,in fact they will have to rejoin.

Another shall we politely say hm! mistatement from Salmond.And that's what people like you think,every door will open on command. Get real!

I shall resist the temptation of calling you a little Scotlander,and get into a verbal tennis match with you,which is what you seem to specialise in.

No doubt you will be asking for evidence of Salmonds extreme embarressment over yet more of his Porkies,read and digest! this is the man the general Public are struggling to have confidence and credibility in

http://www.guardian....sh-independence

I specialize in understanding Scottish politics. I also specialize in understanding that the Guardian is a Left Wing Pro Unionist newspaper in the pocket of the British Labour Party.

Don't be sending me Guardian links, it's just Labour Party propaganda.

There is no mechanism to strip current EU citizens of citizenship, and we Scots are EU citizens.

There is no way the EU will refuse membership to a democratically elected Scottish government.

If you believe otherwise then you will need to go study the reason why the Common Market was formed, and to understand that the EU is the greatest post war success story in the World.

ps. That Youtube clip is comical

It's pretty obvious that if some information doesn't suit your point of view,then you go into Destroy and Attack mode,and completely ignore the articles because the media is not on your approved reading list,so it doesn't count. Even the revered Google is not good enough for you,but perversely Wiki is.which is odd,because it can be written by anyone,or indeed altered and updated by anyone.

I have to say it The Blether: A more pathetic way of debating I have yet to come across. Small wonder other Posters can't get straight answers from you.

Carry on in your little dream World,.....that you think Salmond is a Genius,......Scotland holds all the negotiating cards,......England has nothing to bargain with.........Scotland has automatic right to EU membership,........ You can use our Fiscal system with no penalty,.......we will still pay for your Social Security People..........give Scotland 2/3rds of the Oil Platforms and wells paid for by the English............

Whats really comical is that you actually believe all this Bunkum! Unfortunately The Blether, the reality of the truth,when it finally hits you,is going to be extremely painful and some..............

The Scottish will easily see through the likes of Salmond,and if it's a yes vote it will be a miracle,after all the years he has been in office,right now he should be able to rely on a 70% Yes vote, instead of that, today a poll gave a 30% Yes vote.

In short the depth of mistrust for Salmond speaks volumes,but you already know that,that's why you protest too much!

Edited November 7, 2012 by MAJIC