Pre-Screening To Be Launched This Year: Thai Immigration Bureau

[Hermes100]

This procedure is almost completley useless and pure window dressing.

It will not be able to stop anyone bar the most incompetant.

In other words, the most deserving who should be stopped will in no way at all be troubled by this.

Unless you are on the most wanted list all one needs to do to get off any black list and enter thailand is;

1-pay money in the form of either ;

A- an overt bribe or ;

B- enlisting the services of a lawyer who will " smooth things over".

2- One can also change the name that one travel's with either slightly or completley ( something most europeans can do legaly and quite easily and which renders all lists completley useless)

Or of course obtain illegal documents that are still readily available.

[Hermes100]

Also, the idea of facebook to help immergation matters is really quite absurd and wide open to serious abuse.

If I was a baddy I would just flood the immergration service with bogus " tips offs" all day long and over whelm them.Something very easy to do here.

And, how many upset girlfriends will then use it as an intimadation tool ?

[tropo]

Is this somehow not the problem in Thailand? That many people think respect must be 'earned'? Respect should be given automatically and then given some more if it is reciprocated. If it is not reciprocated, it is no longer necessary to be respectful. Believing respect need be earned is the root of the problem... just ask many teachers about students' attitudes regarding respect. Hint: they are very much in-line with your way of thinking (the bolded part at least).

I prefer just to remain respectful anyway as that is the way to live life in a peaceful and joyful manner. It doesn't matter how others treat me, that is their path. The way I treat them, that is my path.

I came in through Thai Immigration at the airport last week, and the way this one Immigration officer was talking to people was downright rude. He wanted to close his booth and escorted half a dozen tourists through to close his lane. He was barking at them like they were animals. I expect this from Thai immigration officers but I wonder how first timers would feel.

He gets no respect from me. I think he was one of the more senior officers by the way he was talking to some others.

This is a very good post, I always said respect has to be earned, but I know now that this is not the case. If the respect you give is not returned,then you do not give the respect back.

Easy to say just try treating him the same way and he will show you a whole new low for respect.

Make sure you know some one in power and you have a lot of money.

Try asking your self is this worth it? No matter how disrespectful they are.

What are you going on about? Even if the officer treats me that way, I don't show any obvious signs of disrespect - I'm not that stupid. I keep my mouth shut, hand him the passport and take it back when he is done.

[tropo]

Personally I prefer they only speak Thai

I cannot speak one word of Thai

It means they ask no questions

They take passport, stamp it and I am off

Can only imagine the delays of they try to

ask questions in a foreign language

"pardon, what, pardon, again please ... slowly"

No thanks

You cannot speak "one word of Thai" WOW, hope you are only a short stay visitor. Ever heard of RESPECT ?

What a stupid comment.

Where are you from. ?

That's exactly what I thought, but was too shy to come out and say it.

Cheers

I'll place bets that generally Thais prefer us not to speak their language. It makes it easier for them to make a joke about us to their mates, right in front of us.

Edited October 30, 2012 by tropo

[tropo]

You are very deluded if you think that. All the tourists I know who came to Thailand love it here and want to come back. All those that have been to Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, etc don't have any desire to go back at all. Tourists love Thailand. And they keep coming back.

Yet tourism is growing faster in Vietnam and Cambodia than Thailand. And all the people that I know that have discovered Cambodia now spend more time there than in Thailand.

Different demographic though, the package tourists are descending on Thailand, and the adventure seekers and backpackers are moving away.

That's only a temporary situation as Vietnam and Cambodia improve their tourist infrastructure. It will level out sooner or later. It will never surpass Thailand. They are still light years behind in every way.

[RogueLeader]

That's only a temporary situation as Vietnam and Cambodia improve their tourist infrastructure. It will level out sooner or later. It will never surpass Thailand. They are still light years behind in every way.

Yes. Then the backpackers will move to somewhere more adventurous and leave Vietnam and Cambodia to the old, the dull, the fat and the sex tourists. That's the way it works. In the 70s and 80s, the frontier was Ko Pha Ngan and Phi Phi. In the 90s it was Vietnam and Laos. Recently, it's been Cambodia and Burma. I don't know what will be next. Somalia is apparently almost open to the adventurous. Perhaps one day soon, it'll be Iraq and Afghanistan. Thailand won't be another Switzerland in this century though. Its public officials seem incapable of long-term strategy, of thinking beyond short-term graft even when doing so would clearly benefit them.

Edited October 30, 2012 by RogueLeader

[notmyself]

I would think English would always be a priority. Just about every nation (apart from Thailand), irrespective of mother tongue, speaks English. China is fast learning English as well. Teaching anyone Laos or Cambodian? How many 'visitors' do we get from there? Mandarin and English I think would be a good start with emphasis on English. Japanese is way down the list at 3rd place as being essential.

Russian is important as well. Many visitors comes from there and they mostly speak poor English.

Would be nice to see the TM 7 in Russian/Thai.

[Colabamumbai]

This procedure is almost completley useless and pure window dressing.

It will not be able to stop anyone bar the most incompetant.

In other words, the most deserving who should be stopped will in no way at all be troubled by this.

Unless you are on the most wanted list all one needs to do to get off any black list and enter thailand is;

1-pay money in the form of either ;

A- an overt bribe or ;

B- enlisting the services of a lawyer who will " smooth things over".

2- One can also change the name that one travel's with either slightly or completley ( something most europeans can do legaly and quite easily and which renders all lists completley useless)

Or of course obtain illegal documents that are still readily available.

You are correct Had 6 passports and I did not know my real name.

[Fozfromoz]

This procedure is almost completley useless and pure window dressing.

It will not be able to stop anyone bar the most incompetant.

In other words, the most deserving who should be stopped will in no way at all be troubled by this.

Unless you are on the most wanted list all one needs to do to get off any black list and enter thailand is;

1-pay money in the form of either ;

A- an overt bribe or ;

B- enlisting the services of a lawyer who will " smooth things over".

2- One can also change the name that one travel's with either slightly or completley ( something most europeans can do legaly and quite easily and which renders all lists completley useless)

Or of course obtain illegal documents that are still readily available.

You are correct Had 6 passports and I did not know my real name.

Jason Bourne?

[Basil B]

I had exactly the same thing at Heathrow some years ago. Some b!tch immigration officer was shouting at a woman (Japanese) and the lady hadn't got a clue what the woman was getting so agitated about. The officer just kept getting redder and redder, shouting louder and louder, then got on the "if you can't speak English, you shouldn't be here" thing. I walked over and interjected and helped the woman understand what as going on. I then went to the senior immigration officer and reported the woman for verbal abuse. She got sacked on the spot when they reviewed the video. If someone had spoken to me in that way, they would have been flat on the floor.

I find it hard to believe, "instant dismissal" is something of the past, certainly within the public sector, almost certainly the offending employee who warranted dismissal would first be suspended while the incident was investigated.

In the UK anyone instantly dismissed without a formal interview and opportunity of representation would almost certainly win a case of unfair dismissal.

[OZEMADE]

Sounds like a job for my sister in law. She is Thai, speaks English and is learning more English and Chinese at the university in Lop Buri. She is a wizz on the computer in Thai and English. She would do well in Immigration or Police of Customs, good Gov job, pension in the future etc.

These are the ones they should be hiring and recruiting, all they have to do with them is teach them Immigration Rules and Regs and or Police laws. They already know the rest.

[pmem]

From 2015 onward Thailand will become the leper colony of S.E. Asia - everyone will bypass the country and visit the others. This country is heading one way only and that is further down. The English language is not going to curb the arrogance, it's just going to make it worse. Respect is a two way street and something to be earned not demanded.

Airport is open! No reason to wait until 2015, you are free to leave NOW ! Bye, bye

Ditto! @ozall- YOU spoke of respect? You need to apply the "two way street" axiom on respect to yourself.

Aren't we a couple of little darlings, 5 mins. in the country and you adapt the same arrogance. Constructive criticism is always welcome, not junior high school twaddle. If you have something to say about the subject we all would like to read. it. Personal comments are a bore and a waist of time. Edited October 30, 2012 by ozall

[attento]

I would think English would always be a priority. Just about every nation (apart from Thailand), irrespective of mother tongue, speaks English. China is fast learning English as well. Teaching anyone Laos or Cambodian? How many 'visitors' do we get from there? Mandarin and English I think would be a good start with emphasis on English. Japanese is way down the list at 3rd place as being essential.

Russian is important as well. Many visitors comes from there and they mostly speak poor English.

poor English is just about acceptable. The problem under question is "no English".

You are right, most countries schools have English as 1st foreign language, even the French have now

Most Russians learn English in school these days.

[khaowong1]

Would be better if they understood their own dam_n systems..

My most recent return to the kingdom (long stay extension, 3 days left on a re-entry permit) she couldnt understand the stamps.. Told me my visa was expired (yes it did 3 years ago.. When extensions began) and then would only give me 3 days to the end of the re-entry permit !! I was super smily and polite, explained all my stamps and showed the longer 'permission to stay' stamp.. I gently asked to speak to a manager and she refused.. Scowling, barking, threatening the entire time.. I got a 3 day entry !!

No one at any other point in Swampy or Chiang mai airport immigrations would repair her mistake and I had to take more time out to go to immigration locally to repair it..

Having an immigration officer who doesnt understand visas, permissions to stay and re entry permits.. Scowling and grunting through the whole process.. Just in such contrast to Singapore, Malay, even Cambo.. Just another 'welcome home'..

Yes, I have to do this quite often.. point out all the various stamps for them.. some of them seem to have never even seen a re-entry permit stamp before. amazing thailand.

[notmyself]

poor English is just about acceptable. The problem under question is "no English".

You are right, most countries schools have English as 1st foreign language, even the French have now

Most Russians learn English in school these days.

Spoken English for the most part, few can read even to a poor standard I have found.

[OZEMADE]

I would think English would always be a priority. Just about every nation (apart from Thailand), irrespective of mother tongue, speaks English. China is fast learning English as well. Teaching anyone Laos or Cambodian? How many 'visitors' do we get from there? Mandarin and English I think would be a good start with emphasis on English. Japanese is way down the list at 3rd place as being essential.

Russian is important as well. Many visitors comes from there and they mostly speak poor English.

poor English is just about acceptable. The problem under question is "no English".

You are right, most countries schools have English as 1st foreign language, even the French have now

Most Russians learn English in school these days.

Thats because they already know French and Russian. O have a laugh, I thought that was funny

[rubl]

Maybe because I haven't been out of Thailand for the last ten years, maybe because I'm a non-native English speaker. Whatever the reason, but my eye felt on a part of the OP totally ignored by other posters. I mean this part

More than 30 million people had travelled in and out of Thailand this year, he noted. (the 'he' being Immigration Bureau chief Pol Lt-General Panu Lerdlarpphol)

Just two weeks ago we had a very lively discussion on the Tourist Authority of Thailand saying to have had 15 million tourists arriving in the first nine months of the year and expecting to reach 20 million by the end of the year. The number seems to be confirmed now. This may be a very first in a country where quoted numbers seem to have to differ almost by law :-)

[Beetlejuice]

I would like to think that it will happen, but my true thoughts are that its just more talk and next week it will be forgoten like pretty much all the MUST DO things that come from Thai management and above.

It will happen.

For 2 main reasons. First it`s because Thailand is under International pressure to introduce more stringent security checks to help stop the flow of criminals and terrorists entering and moving on from countries inside South East Asia and second, this has been brought about by visitors taking advantage of the easy no questions asked approach to letting foreigners into the country where many are abusing the system here.

I have heard that eventually this new screening system will be extended to the borders and will include people entering the country by land and by sea. In my opinion, the sooner the better.

[Imkah]

Getting a job in immigration here isn't so much skill related. One must have family connections or know someone in the Police or immigration. Even then Its an expensive job to buy into. Yes these jobs are sold sometimes for several million baht. Its not a case of going along and saying "I have perfect English and feel I would be good for the job" Oh no.

When Swampi opened I was living with Thai Police woman and paid for her entrance exams and courses. Before the 20,000+ applicants where going to get their results almost all of the 250 positions where filled behind closed doors. Many couldn't speak a word of English.

As with many aspects of Thai society and corporate hierarchy educated professional cannot get to the positions where they are needed. As a result complete incompetents end up in positions of authority.

These jobs are handed down through the old boys network.

This is all true, and a very unfortunate result of a corrupt society. Problem is: where do you start if you want to change this? With the single police woman/man who is given the chance by a mutual effort by family to buy her/his way into the system and thereby help the other "clan"-members? Nope. By attacking the one's feeding off the top of this food-chain? Nope, they either move to Dubai or become PM to avoid the heat. The most effective way is when a country gets a growing no of "upper-middle class" citizens who themselves are not in line for a hand-out, but still have to pay teachers, police, minor officials on a monthly basis. Problem with Thailand is that this segment is not growing on the same level as would be normal in other likewise developing economies. So this will take time! And in the meantime, sit back, relax and enjoy the reasons you originally had for coming here!

Like friendly people, good climate and excellent food. And a good laugh thrice a day if you meet people with a smile! How better can it get, if you remember you're rantings and complaints about the leadership of the country you once chose to leave? Try to be a bit Thai, enjoy the smiles and the few moments of pure joy, and while waiting for hours in immigration: Imagine that you, a few hours from now will be sitting on a much too low red or blue plastic stool enjoying world class cooking for 30 Baht + 1 for the ice cubes. Smile! folks!

[PoodMaiDai]

Good to know they are going to finally check a black list before you enter the country. Not sure what use the black list has been up to this point if no one checked it.

[lizardtongue]

I agree with Pui's post, but yet again the Thai's are not starting at the beginning, what I mean is that if properly trained native speaking English/Mandarin (or any other language) teachers where encouraged to seek employment here there would now be an abundance of English/Mandarin speakers.

Another thing that may not be up to 'scratch' is the web site that one will obviously have to use for the pre-screening, which will have to be in 19 other languages!

*19 Countries eligible to enter Thailand under the VISA ON ARRIVAL rule:

1. Bhutan
   
2. China
   
3. Cyprus
   
4. Czech Republic
   
5. Estonia
   
6. Hungary
   
7. India
   
8. Kazakhstan
   
9. Latvia
   
10. Liechtenstein
    
11. Lithuania
    
12. Maldives
    
13. Mauritius
    
14. Poland
    
15. Saudi Arabia
    
16. Slovakia
    
17. Slovenia
    
18. Taiwan
    
19. Ukraine
    

[jerrysteve]

I once took an Enlgish teaching position many years ago out of shear bordem. The head of the administration had a Masters Degree in Enlgish from a Thai University.

The position was to teach them how to speak only, not to teach any grammAR. She pronounced it with a very long A and R. I had never heard

the word grammar pronounced in that fashion and her accent horrible, like she just got off the boat.

Not knowing what the word grammar was in the way she pronounced the word, I said, "oh you mean grammar" in the normal way which

native English speaking normally pronounce the word. I proceeded to give here the right accent to pronounce the word.

She then said, her way was what she called, THAI ENGLISH. I proceed to tell her there is no such thing as THAI ENGLISH OR ENGLISH THAI,

or any other imaginable combination of any 2 or 3 or 4 different languages etc etc etc.

The bottom line is do not be suprised, when you step up to the Immigration person that in the back of your mind, your going to be asking yourself,

WHAT THE HELL IS SHE or HE ASKING.

[notmyself]

I agree with Pui's post,

Perhaps you should quote it in your post.

[Bagwan]

How comic that this is a discussion on the the subject of Thai oficials learning English, and comments on their ability to use what they may or may not have retained, whereas many posts appearing on this board are littered with spelling and grammatical errors, and such a phenomenon is supported by the mods who clamp down on the 'grammar Nazis'. I am not so naive to expect perfection but with the availability of software to check spelling and grammar, and the practice of reading through what one has written before posting, surely indicates that the root cause is laziness. If people from the First World cannot be bothered, why should Thai peoples? I am not holding my breath that the abilities of any Thai official wil improve if this latest initiative by what passes for a Thai Government is actually implemented.

[tropo]

She then said, her way was what she called, THAI ENGLISH. I proceed to tell her there is no such thing as THAI ENGLISH OR ENGLISH THAI,

or any other imaginable combination of any 2 or 3 or 4 different languages etc etc etc.

Are you serious? You told her this? English is pronounced in hundreds of ways by people from all over the world. If "X" is a language, then English has hundreds of combinations of X English or English X.

Here's some major variations: Philippine English, Singapore English, Australian English, American English, Indian English, South African English. Thai English has a rightful place amongst them.

Half the English accents in the UK are barely intelligible by outsiders who can speak English. Even Americans can have major trouble understanding some of them. They took Cheryl Cole off the American X-Factor last year because the Americans had trouble understanding her.

My Filipino wife has the most trouble understanding UK English accents.

What version of English should a Thai person speak? Your version?

Edited October 31, 2012 by tropo

[smedly]

How comic that this is a discussion on the the subject of Thai oficials learning English, and comments on their ability to use what they may or may not have retained, whereas many posts appearing on this board are littered with spelling and grammatical errors, and such a phenomenon is supported by the mods who clamp down on the 'grammar Nazis'. I am not so naive to expect perfection but with the availability of software to check spelling and grammar, and the practice of reading through what one has written before posting, surely indicates that the root cause is laziness. If people from the First World cannot be bothered, why should Thai peoples? I am not holding my breath that the abilities of any Thai official wil improve if this latest initiative by what passes for a Thai Government is actually implemented.

It's not laziness - it's quite simply people don't care, I very seldom use a spell checker or read over my posts, as long as people get the general gist of what I'm saying then I couldn't give a rats ass about the odd typo, hav u ever tried reading a teenager text message - a whole new form of shorthand has developed - they couldn't give a shit about spelling either - perhaps you should consider a contribution to this thread rather than wasting your time slating people

[Payboy]

I once took an Enlgish teaching position many years ago out of shear bordem.

If only there were more like you.

[millwall_fan]

"We will also consider getting officials to learn a third language such as Lao, Cambodia, Mandarin or Japanese depending on the number of visitors from that country," Panu said.

Yeah! I can really see your average Bangkokian rushing to sign up for Lao courses! Thais have looked down on the Lao language since the year dot (same gobbledygook these Isaan peasants speak right?) and I wouldn't think Khmer would be high up their lists either. Great way of manoeuvring some of the top Immigration officials Chinese speaking relatives into jobs though.

[SICHONSTEVE]

Oh, Oooh, prepare for longer cues and longer waiting times times 100 folds, folks...

Are they teaching them to play snooker??

Actually, change that to pool as something tells me you probably come from the USA!!!

Edited October 31, 2012 by SICHONSTEVE

[andid]

I have been asked to reply to this post by others here to correct some factual errors, and it seems many readers and replies show the same uncertainty about what the AEC will do and what it won't do as the original article writer and the Immigration Bureau.

The Immigration Bureau is preparing to launch a pre-screening system for visitors to Thailand before the end of this year. This crucial step, in addition to equipping immigration officials with foreign-language skills, is part of preparation for the Asean Economic Community (AEC), which will kick off in 2015. .... He said that in order to prepare for the AEC, fluency in English would be a necessary qualification for immigration officers....We will also consider getting officials to learn a third language such as Lao, Cambodia, Mandarin or Japanese depending on the number of visitors from that country," Panu said........

1. The AEC does not start (or kick-off) on any date in 2015 ... many of the sub agreements (such as goods tariff changes and some of the labour Mutual Recognition Agreements) are already in effect (or should be). 2015 is actually the end date by which all changes are supposed to be completed and implemented. Some changes were implemented in 2008.

2. There is no open border concept (like Europe for example) within the AEC plans, so therefore no more or less tourists (or terrorists or criminals) can be expected to visit Thailand starting on Jan 1st 2015 than there is today based on the AEC changes.

3. English is the agreed language of ASEAN, and China and Japan are not in ASEAN, therefore none of the AEC changes will impact the need for Immigration officers to speak more or less of these languages as of 2015.

4. The changes (improvements?) mentioned in the article are needed today to benefit the Thai economy and to do away with corruption - not in 2015 (that is my humble opinion).

5. The benefits and changes within the AEC Concept are mainly provided only to citizens (or juristic persons) of ASEAN countries only.

6. The writer of the article should understand the AEC arrangements better, which would benefit all readers by explaining what the AEC is actually all about. The AEC nowhere talks about open borders, or allowing people to come to Thailand to live or work without the appropriate visas in place.