Real Italian Sub. In Bangkok Or Pattaya?

[Awohalitsiktoli]

Lots of responses. Le lepin seems like a European experience (might try it but honestly nothing looked good to me), and they are trying to do too much, which is one reason so many places fail (as Jingthing intimated earlier). About Wayned's post and Koh Samui and an Italian baker. I lived there two months way back in 1999 and met an Italian who owned a restaurant and his wife did most of the cooking. They made me some of the best Italian food I have ever eaten, and the break was fantastic! I wonder if he is the same person. I am sure he could have made some great Italian-style (American-Italian style) subs/hoagies. About Notmyself's post and Jingthings's post, with all of the seafood here, you would think that some of the ideas you put forth would work, certainly for farangs but probably for Thais as well. I would like to see a very simple menu for the Cajun stuff (and add an Italian-American-style hoagie/sub). Focus on a few things and do them well. That should be carved in stone on some restaurant wall, I think.

[notmyself]

Focus on a few things and do them well. That should be carved in stone on some restaurant wall, I think.

And in doing so you cast aside many potential problems.

JT's sketch sounds about the right balance to me though I think I would have a special too.

[thenoilif]

You have to ask yourself, is there a real demand for this type of fare in BKK? Outside of the US, what other country eats subs or gourmet sandwiches? I would compare this to hamburgers but will less global appeal and gourmet hamburger joints haven't exactly achieved long term success here. Many shops come and go and like almost all other restaurants here, it's style over substance. Given that most the ingredients that go into a "quality" italian are not local products, most of the sandwich would have to be made from imported goods. I've made my own at home and even with imported meats and cheeses from the US that I brought with me on my last visit, a 8" sub cost around 300 baht in ingredients just to make. About the price of what gourmet burgers go for here and generally the shelf life of even the best burger joints is roughly about two years. In order for a good sub place to work you would have to make "cool" and the next big thing which is very difficult for a farang do to unless you are hooked into the social scene of high society.

One other thing, it's difficult to compare this type of food to Mexican food. Even though Mexican food is expensive to buy in Thailand it's isn't that expensive to make. Many of the ingredients that go into Mexican food can be produced in Thailand, especially the Californian style that places like La Monitas offers. The only reason why it's so expensive is because they take advantage of the farang market.

[RabC]

Look how many Sub shops there are in Europe and you can see why it won't take off here. It's a North American thing and if it won't fly in Europe it certainly won't fly here, just compare numbers of North Americans here verses Thais and others, too small a client base.

[FOODLOVER]

39,000 Subway sandwich stores in 99 countries.

[Jingthing]

39,000 Subway sandwich stores in 99 countries.

But their food in quite low quality and not really representative of the glory of sub sandwich culture in the U.S. The question for Thailand is there a market demand to pay quite a bit more for quite a bit more quality? Personally, I wouldn't invest my money but I think it is possible with the right people behind it.

[RabC]

39,000 Subway sandwich stores in 99 countries.

I can't be bothered using WiKi but I seriously believe the majority will be in North America, also the OP was talking about quality places, Subway are already here in Thailand. I could list loads of things I would love to see here from My home country, but just because I miss them and would like them doesn't mean there is a viable market hear for them.

Edited November 19, 2012 by RabC

[FOODLOVER]

Am i missing anything?

Mortadella

Genoa

Salami

Capicola

Provolone

Roasted red peppers

Tomato

Onion

Pickle

Baguette( Outsource?)

Extra Virgin Olive

Red wine Vinegar

Fresh Basil

Fresh Thyme

Garlic

Salt Pepper

Plastic bag

Deli paper

[mogandave]

Before moving here, I wouldn’t have eaten at Subway or McD’s on a bet, but I actually look forward to a Double Cheeseburger & fries or a toasted Spicy Italian with jalapenos when I get to town. If you don’t like Subway, maybe you just have not been here long enough.

The two main issues I see with a higher end deli/sub shop are Subway and Au Bon Pain. This eats up a lot of your market right off the top, because the food is okay, the prices are reasonable, the stores are relatively clean, and people recognize the name. Tourists more often than not, will eat at places they recognize.

Assuming you were good enough that locals are willing to seek you out and pay extra, the costs and overhead would eat you up. Bread is cheap and easy to make, but deli supplies are not. Domestic ham, salami, cheese, sausage and beef are all crap. You either have to make it, import it, or buy it from someone that does import it. Subway can sell a 12” for THB200 because they are importing the meat, cheese, condiments and most of the vegetables by the container. They have hole-in-the-wall outlets all over, and offer free delivery. Thinking you would be profitable selling a high-end sandwich loaded with pricy, imported meats and cheeses, in a decent location (with a Subway a block down) for THB300 would be tough. I could be done, but it would be long and painful building your market. You will not win the tourist market, and not many locals are ready to travel across town to eat.

The only way I could see it working would be if one were to start by developing and marketing domestic lunch meats and cheeses, then operate a deli, then maybe a sub shop. I like a good sub, but I could go for kielbasa and kraut, or how about a liverwurst and Swiss on Kaiser with Dijon mustard? A limited menu is nice, but if you’re going across town to eat, you are probably not going to go by yourself.

It is worth noting that Starbucks is “successful” because tourists love them, they have great locations and most important, they have deep pockets and can stand to lose money year after year just to maintain market exposure. Plenty of great coffee shops go belly-up here every year.

All that said, I can’t speak to the subs, but that Italian joint on Sukumvitt Soi 21 across from the Queen’s Park Hotel has surprisingly good sausage…

[smokie36]

I'm surprised Pala isn't doind something like this....maybe they do on request....certainly they have many quality ingredients.