dave111223 Posted April 4, 2013 Author Share Posted April 4, 2013 Have to say, the more I read, the more it looks like a large virtual pyramid scheme to me. Someone just creating money out of 1's and 0's. It seems like you have not read much on the topic at all. As we already discussed how "mining" working in order to create bitcoins. Dave . To use your commodity analogy it's more like an gold mine and then another and another and another until it's hardly worth theeeffort drilling any more coz the cost of the golds less then that to get it out of the ground Over supply and just the same stuff at the end of the day So if I dig a bunch of silver mines will it affect the price of gold? They are basically just the same thing, shiny metal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sustento Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 Can I go down the shop and buy a loaf of bread with bitcoins? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave111223 Posted April 4, 2013 Author Share Posted April 4, 2013 (edited) Can I go down the shop and buy a loaf of bread with bitcoins? Can I go down the shop and buy a loaf of bread with US dollars? My local 7-11 doesn't seem to think so. It's debatable whether bitcoins will ever be useful for small item purchases (due to the time it takes for confirmations), maybe fiat will always have a place for these kind of transactions, I guess only the future will tell. Edited April 4, 2013 by dave111223 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sustento Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 (edited) Can I go down the shop and buy a loaf of bread with bitcoins? Can I go down the shop and buy a loaf of bread with US dollars? My local 7-11 doesn't seem to think so. That's because you're not in the US. Try baht. Can you buy a loaf at your local 7-11 with bitcoins? Edited April 4, 2013 by sustento Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave111223 Posted April 4, 2013 Author Share Posted April 4, 2013 Can I go down the shop and buy a loaf of bread with bitcoins? Can I go down the shop and buy a loaf of bread with US dollars? My local 7-11 doesn't seem to think so. That's because you're not in the US. Try baht. Can you buy a loaf at your local 7-11 with bitcoins? Nope they don't accept bitcoins here's a list of some other currencies I also cannot use at my local 7-11: USD AUD EUR CAD Conclusion: all these currencies are worthless. Or are you asking "Is there anywhere in the world where you can buy a loaf of bread with bitcoins", then yes I'm sure you can find somewhere: http://bitcoin.travel/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CobraSnakeNecktie Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 They have a few valid points... http://www.forbes.com/sites/timothylee/2013/04/03/four-reason-you-shouldnt-buy-bitcoins/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccw Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 Have to say, the more I read, the more it looks like a large virtual pyramid scheme to me. Someone just creating money out of 1's and 0's.It seems like you have not read much on the topic at all. As we already discussed how "mining" working in order to create bitcoins. Dave . To use your commodity analogy it's more like an gold mine and then another and another and another until it's hardly worth theeeffort drilling any more coz the cost of the golds less then that to get it out of the ground Over supply and just the same stuff at the end of the day So if I dig a bunch of silver mines will it affect the price of gold? They are basically just the same thing, shiny metal. Dave. You seem to be blinded by your love of bit coin. Gold and silver is not the same at all. Industrially they have different uses, aesthetically they are different colours, they are different elements. They are completely different. You might say that as currencies they are just different shiny metals serving the same function byte tithe other uses thier relative scarcity that gives value. So I ask again where is the value determined between e coins? If you have no answer then the scarcity is out of the window. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave111223 Posted April 4, 2013 Author Share Posted April 4, 2013 (edited) They have a few valid points... http://www.forbes.com/sites/timothylee/2013/04/03/four-reason-you-shouldnt-buy-bitcoins/ Point 1) You can loss your wallet if your harddrive crashes: FALSE You can use a wallet such as Electrum that allows you to restore a wallet from your "seed phrase", so as long as you write down the phrase (12 words) you can restore your wallet. No need to worry about Harddrive crashes/backups etc... Point 2) Government could crack down: TRUE...as with anything government can put a hurt on it if they want, but only to a certain degree, they cannot stop it completely. Point 3) Scaling: FALSE You can get lightweight clients (such as Bitcoinspinner, Electrum, Multibits) which do not require downloading the entire blockchain (transaction history) Point 4) Lack of applications: mostly TRUE but that's like saying "the internet sucks, there are no good websites, bin it" in 1990 Edited April 4, 2013 by dave111223 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave111223 Posted April 4, 2013 Author Share Posted April 4, 2013 (edited) Have to say, the more I read, the more it looks like a large virtual pyramid scheme to me. Someone just creating money out of 1's and 0's.It seems like you have not read much on the topic at all. As we already discussed how "mining" working in order to create bitcoins. Dave . To use your commodity analogy it's more like an gold mine and then another and another and another until it's hardly worth theeeffort drilling any more coz the cost of the golds less then that to get it out of the ground Over supply and just the same stuff at the end of the day ockquote> So if I dig a bunch of silver mines will it affect the price of gold? They are basically just the same thing, shiny metal. Dave. You seem to be blinded by your love of bit coin. Gold and silver is not the same at all. Industrially they have different uses, aesthetically they are different colours, they are different elements. They are completely different. You might say that as currencies they are just different shiny metals serving the same function byte tithe other uses thier relative scarcity that gives value. So I ask again where is the value determined between e coins? If you have no answer then the scarcity is out of the window.Different virtually currencies have different qualities, or they would be pointless (no one would use them an exact clone of Bitcoin). For example Litecoin differs from Bitcoin because transactions are processed more frequently (every 2.5minutes instead of 10 minutes), it also involves a different mining process, whereby you can only mine on a "computer" (with CPU or GPU) as opposed to Bitcoins which can be mined in a manner where you use a specialized circuit board that can do nothing by mine bitcoins. This means Litecoin will still be mineable by normal people using normal computers. I'm not saying Gold and Silver are the same; I'm saying the opposite. I know they are different, they are different; I'm using this illustration to show you that the various virtual currencies are different in the same way that gold and silver are different. Edited April 4, 2013 by dave111223 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccw Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 They way a coin is produced does not change its use/ properties as just another e currency. Like saying silver from an open cast mine has more or less value than silver from a deep bored mine. It's still the same stuff just means of production different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave111223 Posted April 4, 2013 Author Share Posted April 4, 2013 (edited) They way a coin is produced does not change its use/ properties as just another e currency. Like saying silver from an open cast mine has more or less value than silver from a deep bored mine. It's still the same stuff just means of production different. So in your opinion a mined diamond and a manufactured diamond have the same value (price)? Because after all "It's still the same stuff just means of production different." Also you conveniently did not mentioned the other differences between virtual currencies, such as the difference in transaction times between the currencies. Edited April 4, 2013 by dave111223 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taninthai Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 I got access to silk road market place last nght ,i honestly dont know how the powers that be have let this get this far something is not right with this.very interesting thread though. Sent from my GT-P7500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CobraSnakeNecktie Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 I got access to silk road market place last nght ,i honestly dont know how the powers that be have let this get this far something is not right with this.very interesting thread though. Sent from my GT-P7500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app with silk road are there many sellers inside Thailand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taninthai Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 Only had a quick look last night it was getting late will have a look again tonight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccw Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 (edited) Is the danger not that the "qualities" of different coins you speak of are not so different Dave? People might jump in to other coins looking for better value. E.g. now bit coin is so high I might think to speculate of lite coin going the same way. People might jump in to new currencies looking for better starting value and so feeding a succession of bubbles and crashes. Eventually they would all vadue out to less as people eventually realise there's unlimited supply. I'm not saying for sure it will go down like this; I'm just applying logic to theorise how it might play out longest term. That's if it's not shut down / outlawed somehow first. I might put a grand on light coin going the same way as bit coin. I worked out that if I did the same first time I'd heard about bit coin right now I'd have about 1.5million quid worth! Lite coin looks to be the better designed one as well Edited April 4, 2013 by mccw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronz28 Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 Bitcoin suffers database attack: http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9238114/Bitcoin_storage_service_Instawallet_suffers_database_attack Check your wallet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave111223 Posted April 4, 2013 Author Share Posted April 4, 2013 (edited) Is the danger not that the "qualities" of different coins you speak of are not so different Dave? People might jump in to other coins looking for better value. E.g. now bit coin is so high I might think to speculate of lite coin going the same way. People might jump in to new currencies looking for better starting value and so feeding a succession of bubbles and crashes. Eventually they would all vadue out to less as people eventually realise there's unlimited supply. Sure the alternative virtual currencies will dilute value of overall virtual currencies; provided that they have usefulness and people who would have invested in Bitcoins invest in an alternative instead. But I think competition is good, it will force bitcoin to stay current and useful or be overtaken. However each alternative currency has to offer something different/more useful that the existing currencies. Bitcoin suffers database attack: http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9238114/Bitcoin_storage_service_Instawallet_suffers_database_attack Check your wallet. People must be pretty dumb to keep any money in an online wallet and doesn't even have a password. Instawallet was a disaster just waiting to happen. Bitcoins gives you the opportunity to keep/guard your own money yourself, I'm surprised at how quickly some people seem to throw that advantage away and trust their money to a 3rd party website instead. Edited April 4, 2013 by dave111223 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sustento Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 Can I go down the shop and buy a loaf of bread with bitcoins? Can I go down the shop and buy a loaf of bread with US dollars? My local 7-11 doesn't seem to think so. That's because you're not in the US. Try baht. Can you buy a loaf at your local 7-11 with bitcoins? Nope they don't accept bitcoins here's a list of some other currencies I also cannot use at my local 7-11: USD AUD EUR CAD Conclusion: all these currencies are worthless. Or are you asking "Is there anywhere in the world where you can buy a loaf of bread with bitcoins", then yes I'm sure you can find somewhere: http://bitcoin.travel/ Provided you're in the right country you can use all of those currencies to buy a loaf of bread. Name me one country where you can walk into any shop and buy a loaf of bread with bitcoins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronz28 Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 It just points out that vapor money can be gone in a flash and what will you do? Complain to the central bank regulator? I'll continue to keep my 2 bits in diversified investments like hard money, real estate, gold, silver, stocks, insured deposits, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccw Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 http://bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22026961 More than likely the powers that be trying to bring it down or discredit it as an alternative to the banks. 140 to 90 ouch. See how long that lasts for. Not long maybe. Who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yankee99 Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 seems like a disaster waiting to happen. This can only end in very badly. What seller in their right mind would sell a real tangible product for a virtual currency? It stinks of virtual fraud and Ponzi scheme. Its to complicated for me so my opinions are worthless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khun Jean Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 People must be pretty dumb to keep any money in an online wallet and doesn't even have a password. Instawallet was a disaster just waiting to happen. Bitcoins gives you the opportunity to keep/guard your own money yourself, I'm surprised at how quickly some people seem to throw that advantage away and trust their money to a 3rd party website instead.All because the average person is incapable of guarding their own bitcoins because it requires tools and knowledge 90% don't have. Those online 'wallets' are a disaster in the making, but they are also the only way for those 90% to "own" bitcoins. Just as the regular banks are right now. You must be pretty dumb to keep all your money in the bank. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khun Jean Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 seems like a disaster waiting to happen. This can only end in very badly. What seller in their right mind would sell a real tangible product for a virtual currency? It stinks of virtual fraud and Ponzi scheme. Its to complicated for me so my opinions are worthless.Most sellers just use bitcoins as a way to attract more buyers. Prices for products are not really in bitcoins but in their own currency converted to bitcoins at the current exchange rate and with a spread to minimize the risk. Once those bitcoins are paid, they are converted straight into their own currency. Most payment portals work that way. Extra advantage for the seller is that the buyer has no protection at all if the seller not delivers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave111223 Posted April 4, 2013 Author Share Posted April 4, 2013 http://bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22026961 More than likely the powers that be trying to bring it down or discredit it as an alternative to the banks. 140 to 90 ouch. See how long that lasts for. Not long maybe. Who knows. This you need to check your reading glasses dude: The value of Bitcoins surged to a new high this week with each one worth about $142 (£94). Barely a week ago, each virtual coin was worth only $90. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naam Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 It just points out that vapor money can be gone in a flash and what will you do? Complain to the central bank regulator? I'll continue to keep my 2 bits in diversified investments like hard money, real estate, gold, silver, stocks, insured deposits, etc. Bitcoin acounts are not protected by FDIC or a similar guarantee? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave111223 Posted April 5, 2013 Author Share Posted April 5, 2013 http://www.oanda.com/currency/converter/ Looks like Oanda has added bitcoin conversion rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave111223 Posted April 5, 2013 Author Share Posted April 5, 2013 Provided you're in the right country you can use all of those currencies to buy a loaf of bread. Name me one country where you can walk into any shop and buy a loaf of bread with bitcoins. Finland http://www.vegemesta.fi/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naam Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 http://www.oanda.com/currency/converter/ Looks like Oanda has added bitcoin conversion rate. hmmm... Warning: USD/BTC exchange rates not available for Friday, Apr 5, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naam Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 Provided you're in the right country you can use all of those currencies to buy a loaf of bread. Name me one country where you can walk into any shop and buy a loaf of bread with bitcoins. Finland http://www.vegemesta.fi/ convenient shopping for people who live in Nakhon Ratchasima Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccw Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 Glasses on again thanks for poinoting that out. Bit coin is the unstoppable saviour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.png.3b3332cc2256ad0edbc2fe9404feeef0.png)
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now