Carrying A Firearm

[Kerryd]

My first firearm was a .22 rifle my father gave me when I was 8. I still have it (many, many years later ) back in the home country.

During my 22 years in uniform, I trained and handled a wide variety of weapons, from pistols to anti-tank missiles.

Back home, I have a number of handguns, rifles and shotguns. Some are for target shooting, some I use when I work back there (I often find myself deep in the mountains, summer and winter, with no other humans for 50+ kilometers in any direction. The only things I had to worry about were bears, wolves, cougars and wolverines. Somewhat nicer and more merciful than many humans )

Never once have I felt the need to carry a firearm in Thailand. If I get the urge to to some target shooting, there are a number of legal shooting clubs around (apparently you can even go to Cambodia and fire an RPG (Rocket Propelled Grenade) at a cow for $300 US, if you are that sadistic).

I have considered looking into the legal ownership of firearms here, as I would prefer to do some target shooting with my custom gear, rather than worn-out club stuff. How ever, just getting the firearms out of Canada would be a considerable pain in the privates (paperwork wise).

When you watch some of the local news stories about people getting arrested while carrying an illegal weapon, one of the charges mentioned is "carrying a weapon without a valid reason". I assume that means if you had a valid reason, you could get a permit (as mentioned in another reply, if you or your relatives worked in certain industries).

As far as Thailand is concerned, here is an excerpt from the Phuket Gazette (November 2002)

“In Phuket, the Governor’s policy forbids foreigners to own firearms. So if you have a Thai spouse, she will have to apply.

She will need to show her house registration document, her ID card and also give a reasonable answer as to why she needs a gun.

However, even if she is approved a gun license, the Governor will not issue a permit to carry the gun, so it must be kept inside the house at all times.

Kitja Chaitong, Palad, Phuket Town District Office."

and:

"To import a pistol, you must first have a permit to own a gun and then apply to the Chief of your local District Office for a permit to import one.

You will be questioned as to the type of pistol and why you need to import it. Provided your answers are reasonable, your application will be forwarded to the Ministry of Interior.

You will need to show Customs officers the permit when the pistol arrives.

Do not order the pistol until you have the permit. ”

Officer, Office of the Permanent Secretary, Ministry of Interior."

While the articles seem to contradict each other, note that one refers to the Phuket Governor's policy, while the other appears to be a National policy.

Here is a link to a news article that came out in 2003 (I queried the Post's website, but didn't want to pay to join just to d/l the original article).

Ministry slaps ban on sale of most firearms (7 Sept 2003)[/url]

The one sentence that stood out was:

Interior Minister Wan Muhamad Nor Matha said yesterday the order followed Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra's policy to make Thailand gun-free by banning the sale and carrying of weapons.

(2 1/2 years later, his policy doesn't appear to be working )

[Sydney_Tom]

The "Path of least resistance" hire a driver, and let him carry the gun. There are plenty of ex-army guys looking for work. You need to pay them a minimum of 8k a month, plus the uniform allowance plus the "Gun allowance". You should also encourage them to take half a day a month to go to a range and practice, you can help this by paying for the range time and the ammunition, and round up the amount so that they can have a drink with friends.

If you can't find someone, go for dinner one night at the splendid Army Club out near the airport, they will find someone for you. When you go out at night, you will find if you have a good driver he is worth his weight in gold. Apart from having the car nearby, they will also talk and joke with the other drivers and the security. They will know quickly that your driver is ex-military and carries a gun.

Trust me, if you have a gun, it will cause trouble for everyone, better to hire someone who knows all the local rules.

[Kerryd]

The "Path of least resistance" hire a driver, and let him carry the gun. There are plenty of ex-army guys looking for work. You need to pay them a minimum of 8k a month, plus the uniform allowance plus the "Gun allowance". You should also encourage them to take half a day a month to go to a range and practice, you can help this by paying for the range time and the ammunition, and round up the amount so that they can have a drink with friends.

If you can't find someone, go for dinner one night at the splendid Army Club out near the airport, they will find someone for you. When you go out at night, you will find if you have a good driver he is worth his weight in gold. Apart from having the car nearby, they will also talk and joke with the other drivers and the security. They will know quickly that your driver is ex-military and carries a gun.

Trust me, if you have a gun, it will cause trouble for everyone, better to hire someone who knows all the local rules.

Sheesh, not sure if you are talking about Bangkok or Baghdad !

Sounds almost exactly what you should do when in places like Baghdad or Kabul !

[qualtrough]

We had a computer stolen from an outbuilding once and my wife wanted me to get a gun. I told her that if I shot someone invading our house it would not be case of 'Homeowner Shoots Intruder', it would be 'Trigger-happy Farang shoots Thai". Acknowledgement to Beachcomber for pointing this out earlier. In the event we bought two dogs. If anyone is interested in obtaining Thai dogs that don't bark I have two available for breeding purposes!

Someone also pointed out another reason why having/using a gun might not be a good idea-revenge. If you are paranoid enough to worry about drug-crazed murderers invading your house you are going to go off the paranoid-meter worrying about the friends of the guy you just killed!

All that being said, if I lived in some wild and remote part of Thailand I could see wanting to have a gun somewhere on the premises...but if I was that worried it might be a better idea to live somewhere else.

[Sydney_Tom]

Kerry;

What I am trying to say is a farang carrying a gun is an accident waiting to happen, for many reasons. If you go and hire a local that is used to carrying weapons then the risk of a problem is lower.

Personally, I would never carry a weapon in Bangkok, and I would always advise people against it. Imagine the trouble a farang would have if you needed to draw a weapon, then how much more trouble there would be if the thing went off, the whole idea makes my blood cold.

However, there are some situations where it is required, so easy answer, as it is illegal for farangs to carry weapons, the only answer is to hire someone trustworthy. What are the situations, well you can probably guess, like up-country cash escort is one that jumps to my mind.

[Heng]

There are guard companies whose employees are licensed. I can't recall of the name of the firm that works the MRT, but they are obviously licensed. The driver way works as well, although for myself, I'd rather not have armed non-family members around me.

[Ajarn_Jonesy]

<snip>

(Harming some one with a firearm will lead to problems for you.) <snip>

I wouldn't even want to know what would happen to you here if you were charged with wrongful use of a firearm.

I never owned a firearm myself and don't care to. Never could see the fascination. Aside from the rare need or for sport, e.g. target practice, clay pidgeon shooting, I don't subscribe to the hypothetical situations people come up with. As far as I'm concerned those situations are then much more likely to happen after the purchase of a gun for those reasons. The old what comes first question, the chicken or the egg? The gun does.

No doubt there's a lot of different mentality out there when it comes to owning firearms. I always like the people whose argument when asked why they want a gun is really nothing more than "because." "Because why?" "Because I do." These people really don't care to consider anything other that. Once somebody is able to justify something to themselves they become blind to anything else.

Guns =

You know I see your point and I agree that there is really no use to carry a gun for self defense (an accident waiting to happen) Never carried one myself at least not as a civilian.

As far as owning guns general.. Nothing Wrong with it IF they are kept under LOCK and KEY

Personally I grew up with guns in the house. My father, and Grand faher all Hunted so it was instilled since I was young. Growing up I could not wait till I turned 21 and bought my first hand gun.. That Changed when I joined the millitary, and changed even more when I went to Iraq and Afghanastan.

The old gun debate Gotta love that one... I think whether you like guns or not depends a lot on the kind of family you were raised in.. ie do you like sports or computers. Cars or coins.. I think that part has to do with the family you are from.

[The Dan Sai Kid]

There are guard companies whose employees are licensed. I can't recall of the name of the firm that works the MRT, but they are obviously licensed. The driver way works as well, although for myself, I'd rather not have armed non-family members around me.

I'm sure there is a rigorous process to go through before any security guards are given guns...

What need is there really to move money around physically in this day and age?

[Ajarn_Jonesy]

... Harming some one with a firearm will lead to problems for you...

Excellent point,

The downside to shooting or killing someone, in self-defense or not, will always carry the specter of retaliation.

Whether its comes to realization or not, it's going to increase your paranoia.

Given the option, I'd pistol whip someone before I'd shoot them, then I'd beg them not to make me have to shoot them, but if your dealing with someone irrational or intent on moving forward with their agenda, well your options are limited.

In my neighborhood, everyone had a Walter PPK under their pillow, but an actually shooting was very rare. Best defense ? Live in a good neighborhood.

Paranoia seems to be the best way to describe. I would prefer the the option to pistol whip someone instead of shoot them. However when they are shooting back that is not really an option.. The worst of it has to be the night mares.....

I like that idea... "Best defense? Live in a good neighborhood."

[Kerryd]

I'm sure there is a rigorous process to go through before any security guards are given guns...

What need is there really to move money around physically in this day and age?

You may be surprised.

A friend of mine joined a security company in Vancouver. She was in the reserves, but as a nurse, not a soldier.

The hardest part of her course apparently was getting a passing grade on the shooting range. After she passed, she was all excited, telling me how they had issued her a .365 magnum ! That's right, a .365 magnum !

I laughed and asked her if they gave her a different bullet for each day of the year. She didn't get the joke at first.

(for those of you that don't get it, there is no such handgun as a .365 magnum. What she meant was a .357 magnum. She passed her security guard course and couldn't properly identify the weapon she was carrying on the job).

As the recent robbery in the UK has just demonstrated, there is still a requirement to move large quantities of cash around various countries on a daily basis.

People still need to withdraw cash from ATM machines. They don't automatically refill themselves.

Businesses still need to deposit cash (I'm thinking large businesses, like WalMarts). Banks still need to transfer cash back and forth between branches.

And it's not limited to cash. Stock certificates, bearer bonds and various other financial documents are usually transported by (armed) security companies.

[Patex]

... it is illegal for farangs to carry weapons, the only answer is to hire someone trustworthy...

Nearly 80% of my Thaifriends are soldiers and all of them only would touch/possess a gun/weapon if they were forced to.

Only 1 guy has between 5- 10 handguns left with him as a pledge from people who lend his money.

I would not say that these are trustworthy... or think about the securityman from the BKK-bank...

Gunfreaks are a special bunch of people, for myself, I feel very uncomfortable just seeing a toygun .

[Heng]

There are guard companies whose employees are licensed. I can't recall of the name of the firm that works the MRT, but they are obviously licensed. The driver way works as well, although for myself, I'd rather not have armed non-family members around me.

I'm sure there is a rigorous process to go through before any security guards are given guns...

What need is there really to move money around physically in this day and age?

You might want to direct that question towards Ganpai, Chubb, Securicor, Samco, etc. all companies that are hired to physically transport cash locally -literally tons of cash- on a day to day basis. As for normal folks in retail business it's the same, only on a smaller scale.

[thedude]

The "Path of least resistance" hire a driver, and let him carry the gun. There are plenty of ex-army guys looking for work. You need to pay them a minimum of 8k a month, plus the uniform allowance plus the "Gun allowance". You should also encourage them to take half a day a month to go to a range and practice, you can help this by paying for the range time and the ammunition, and round up the amount so that they can have a drink with friends.

If you can't find someone, go for dinner one night at the splendid Army Club out near the airport, they will find someone for you. When you go out at night, you will find if you have a good driver he is worth his weight in gold. Apart from having the car nearby, they will also talk and joke with the other drivers and the security. They will know quickly that your driver is ex-military and carries a gun.

Trust me, if you have a gun, it will cause trouble for everyone, better to hire someone who knows all the local rules.

sounds like a recipe for disaster.

headlines : drunk driver shoots boss

[Thaiboxer]

Except for guns, plenty of self-defense weapons are available here in Thailand; just check at any large market. Also, don't forget about the weapons your body already has (foot, fist, knee and elbow) as these are free and easy to use. Many folks these days are taking up unarmed self-defense as an alternative to carrying concealed weapons. I'm not sure what it would take to get a concealed carry permit here but the hassle one would have to go through could very well outweigh the benefit of carrying a firearm. That said, Thai cities are much safer IMO than American cities and crimes against foreigners draw a lot of attention which makes bad guys think twice. However, having one at home (especially in the sticks) may be a good idea. If you can afford it, target shooting is lots of fun.

[edd]

Except for guns, plenty of self-defense weapons are available here in Thailand; just check at any large market. Also, don't forget about the weapons your body already has (foot, fist, knee and elbow) as these are free and easy to use. Many folks these days are taking up unarmed self-defense as an alternative to carrying concealed weapons.

Quite right! All you really need to do is join a GOOD Martial arts club and then work hard at it for several years, I recommend upwards of 20 years, and then you will still be at a disadvantage to a man with a gun.

Films and TV make people think they can fight an armed man,

REALITY CHECK you will loose.

As for Martial Arts weapons, I prefer the sword for CLOSE WORK but you don’t take a knife to a gun fight, you will loose.

Dont get yourself into the situation where you have to fight. even if you think you have the advantage

If a man with a gun wants to rob you, give him your money.

See motto below

[Thaiboxer]

Except for guns, plenty of self-defense weapons are available here in Thailand; just check at any large market. Also, don't forget about the weapons your body already has (foot, fist, knee and elbow) as these are free and easy to use. Many folks these days are taking up unarmed self-defense as an alternative to carrying concealed weapons.

Quite right! All you really need to do is join a GOOD Martial arts club and then work hard at it for several years, I recommend upwards of 20 years, and then you will still be at a disadvantage to a man with a gun.

Films and TV make people think they can fight an armed man,

REALITY CHECK you will loose.

As for Martial Arts weapons, I prefer the sword for CLOSE WORK but you don’t take a knife to a gun fight, you will loose.

Dont get yourself into the situation where you have to fight. even if you think you have the advantage

If a man with a gun wants to rob you, give him your money.

See motto below

I was referring to unarmed opponents...obviously if the guy has a gun or some other weapon there is little you can do. Some martial arts are more effective than others. Muay Thai is one of them. Other fighting styles such as Krav Maga are excellent.

[edd]

Except for guns, plenty of self-defense weapons are available here in Thailand; just check at any large market. Also, don't forget about the weapons your body already has (foot, fist, knee and elbow) as these are free and easy to use. Many folks these days are taking up unarmed self-defense as an alternative to carrying concealed weapons.

Quite right! All you really need to do is join a GOOD Martial arts club and then work hard at it for several years, I recommend upwards of 20 years, and then you will still be at a disadvantage to a man with a gun.

Films and TV make people think they can fight an armed man,

REALITY CHECK you will loose.

As for Martial Arts weapons, I prefer the sword for CLOSE WORK but you don’t take a knife to a gun fight, you will loose.

Dont get yourself into the situation where you have to fight. even if you think you have the advantage

If a man with a gun wants to rob you, give him your money.

See motto below

I was referring to unarmed opponents...obviously if the guy has a gun or some other weapon there is little you can do. Some martial arts are more effective than others. Muay Thai is one of them. Other fighting styles such as Krav Maga are excellent.

Sorry! not much experience in the fighting arts

Its No good just learning one style, every style has its limits, you need to learn as many arts as you can

Edd Jackson

Ex Chief British instructor Chin Kok Martial Arts {retired}

Martial Arts Instructor {Black Belt} for over 25 years

I hold 11 Dan grades in 6 Martial Arts, including wepons

But still learning.

Any one that tells you that they know everything is an idiot

[Totster]

YES! ITS A GUN TO BE USED FOR FUN NOT HURTING PEOPLE

Hmm... so a gun for fun cannot kill or at least maim... ? C'mon.. do you really need this fun/protection in Thailand...

I s'pose you could always get it decomissioned... you still have the gun.. !

totster

[gburns57au]

Edd Jackson

Ex Chief British instructor Chin Kok Martial Arts {retired}

Martial Arts Instructor {Black Belt} for over 25 years

I hold 11 Dan grades in 6 Martial Arts, including wepons

A kick in the nuts will still bring you down.....

[edd]

YES! ITS A GUN TO BE USED FOR FUN NOT HURTING PEOPLE

Hmm... so a gun for fun cannot kill or at least maim... ? C'mon.. do you really need this fun/protection in Thailand...

I s'pose you could always get it decomissioned... you still have the gun.. !

totster

No! I don’t need a gun and you are quite correct that even a sporting gun can kill or maim but if, some one, can not be trusted they should not have a knife or even a car under their control.

There are more people killed with knives and far more killed with cars than guns excluding wars etc.

In Salford Manchester UK, about the same size as Pattaya, there were over 1000 stabbings reported last year

My shot gun is more than just a weapon it is a link to my late father.

decommissioning the gun would be poss. but what a shame to destroy a beautiful weapon

Edd Jackson

Ex Chief British instructor Chin Kok Martial Arts {retired}

Martial Arts Instructor {Black Belt} for over 25 years

I hold 11 Dan grades in 6 Martial Arts, including wepons

A kick in the nuts will still bring you down.....

AND MAKE MY EYES WATER

[NordicMan]

You may take the bus over to Pnomh Penh and pick up a nice second hand Vietnamese AK47 or AKS-47 for US$100. Add a Colt 1911 .45 to that, for $300. Handgrenades can go for $20 each, very useful for home protection - perhaps a tripwire on your front door? No need worry about license either (in Cambodia). Getting a license for them in Thailand is a different issue though.

Alternatively, look into the taser x26 (http://www.taser.com/self_defense/index.htm), which is a stun gun with a few meters range. For home protection, the taser is naturally a lot better - will knock out a drugged-up burglar, you don't get problems with killing someone, and you don't need to worry about getting a license (correct me if i'm wrong on the last one)

cheers

-nm

[Uma~~]

Just wondering, is it possible to obtain a permit in thailand to carry a weapon (firearm) either on your person or in your vehicle? Is the law different for thai nationals? I'm asking sincerly here, as I'm not looking to be a Clint Eastwood-type, so i would appreciate straightforward answers rather than "Sure, you can carry a gun, just don't get caught" or "Why would you want to carry a weapon, better not to piss of a thai and die" etc. No, I'm not a police officer, nor am I in the military... so the question is directed at permits for civilians.

I have never felt the need to carry any sort of weapon in Thailand, (so far) but when in England if I felt my safety was in jeopardy then I would carry a knide and/or a tazer regardless of the law. My life comes first.

I should add that if you want a weapon for reasons of power or paranoia then it is asking for trouble.

Edited March 1, 2006 by Uma~~

[edd]

ave never felt the need to carry any sort of weapon in Thailand, (so far) but when in England if I felt my safety was in jeopardy then I would carry a knide and/or a tazer regardless of the law. My life comes first.

I have never used a KNIDE are they any good

[Totster]

You may take the bus over to Pnomh Penh and pick up a nice second hand Vietnamese AK47 or AKS-47 for US$100. Add a Colt 1911 .45 to that, for $300. Handgrenades can go for $20 each, very useful for home protection - perhaps a tripwire on your front door? No need worry about license either (in Cambodia). Getting a license for them in Thailand is a different issue though.

Alternatively, look into the taser x26 (http://www.taser.com/self_defense/index.htm), which is a stun gun with a few meters range. For home protection, the taser is naturally a lot better - will knock out a drugged-up burglar, you don't get problems with killing someone, and you don't need to worry about getting a license (correct me if i'm wrong on the last one)

cheers

-nm

totster

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Another student from the Late Night Beer School of Urban Myths

[Thaiboxer]

You may take the bus over to Pnomh Penh and pick up a nice second hand Vietnamese AK47 or AKS-47 for US$100. Add a Colt 1911 .45 to that, for $300. Handgrenades can go for $20 each, very useful for home protection

Ak's for $100! $20 for hand grenades! I should have gone shopping in Pnomh Penh....could have used those items when I taught high school

Actually, there were SO many bad teens perhaps a laser guided bomb would have been more useful.

I'm not so sure about hand grenades for home protection...you'd hate to make such a mess of your livingroom.

Edited March 2, 2006 by Thaiboxer

[dr_Pat_Pong]

The high school picnic lol

[NordicMan]

You may take the bus over to Pnomh Penh and pick up a nice second hand Vietnamese AK47 or AKS-47 for US$100. Add a Colt 1911 .45 to that, for $300. Handgrenades can go for $20 each, very useful for home protection

Ak's for $100! $20 for hand grenades! I should have gone shopping in Pnomh Penh....could have used those items when I taught high school

Actually, there were SO many bad teens perhaps a laser guided bomb would have been more useful.

I'm not so sure about hand grenades for home protection...you'd hate to make such a mess of your livingroom.

For further improved home protection, look around a bit and you'll find Vietnamese B50 rocket launchers as well (similar to the Russian RPG-2) for a couple hundred $, plus around $100 for each rocket. Not very modern, effective rangs is only 100-150m, but it may come in very handy when the burglars (or schoolkids) try escape in their vehicle. Shove a rocket up their a*s and you can be sure they'll never come back to harass you. You can buy pretty much whatever you like in Pnomh Penh. I haven't seen it, but assume you can get some landmines to bury in your garden as well. With a properly stocked arsenal, you'll never feel scared in your home again. You may of course consider moving somewhere else instead?

cheers

-nm

[Thaiboxer]

" With a properly stocked arsenal, you'll never feel scared in your home again. You may of course consider moving somewhere else instead?"

I'm not worried about burglars and I feel very secure in my home. The AK's and hand grenades are just for fun:)

[ColPyat]

Quite right! All you really need to do is join a GOOD Martial arts club and then work hard at it for several years, I recommend upwards of 20 years, and then you will still be at a disadvantage to a man with a gun.

Films and TV make people think they can fight an armed man,

REALITY CHECK you will loose.

As for Martial Arts weapons, I prefer the sword for CLOSE WORK but you don’t take a knife to a gun fight, you will loose.

Dont get yourself into the situation where you have to fight. even if you think you have the advantage

If a man with a gun wants to rob you, give him your money.

See motto below

Nice that someone speaks from reality, finally.

And the people believe that Bangkok, or Thailand, are very safe countries, they should please have a look at Thai news, or hang around in the lower class Thai entertainment areas, slums, lower class suburban mu bans, etc..

But who thinks that martial arts skills, a gun, or any other weapon would help you if in trouble on the streets has very little idea. The gangs here are armed as well, and genarally they are in large groups. What helps is to inform yourself about the situation, avoid the dangerous areas, or, if not possible, make friends there first.