Would You Send You Child 50-50 Farang To Thai State School ?

[scorpio]

just a question at this point. my wife wants to return to thailand ( she is missing her 2 sons who are still there, uk government refused them theyre visa,s ) anyway we both have a 3 year old daughter and obviously she will need to go to school in thailand. i have listened to some thai people and have got mixed views on thai state schools , some say they are ok and others say they are really bad. what are your views on them and do any of you send your 50-50 thai/farang children to thai state school , and if so what are your expiriences of this ?

i have looked into this before and it seems that even the standard kindergarden school fees are around 60,000 baht per term . thats a lot of money to us to pay out considering we will have rent /overheads to pay out each month, visa fees etc etc etc. we will also need to open some type of business "IF" we do make the move so that is going to cost us money each month if it doesnt do well.

as i say its only a question at this point, im not jumping in to anything again without doing my homework as ive lost too much money in the past being impulsive. we are not wealthy and i would hate to make the move only to end up coming home to uk broke after a few years.

what are your thoughts, one half of me is telling me to use our money in thailand for holidays and send some to support our twin boys in isaan ( they are 13 years old now ) and the other half of me is telling me to take a chance , gamble my money and try to make it work ( im 46 years old ) and at least if everything goes tits up i will come back to uk and start again , making sure my wife and child have enough money for themselves and will not be struggling.

[Semper]

gamble my money and try to make it work

I'm a gambler and the rule number 1 in gambling is: Don't gamble with more money than you can comfortably lose.

Edited February 10, 2013 by Semper

[scorpio]

so true semper, im also a dreamer and i dream of a life outside of uk. after years of thinking about it i am ready to make the move "if " the wife is ready. as i say im going to use my money and she can keep her money if it all goes belly up.

[Neeranam]

gamble my money and try to make it work

I'm a gambler and the rule number 1 in gambling is: Don't gamble with more money than you can comfortably lose.

Hope you don't do it in Thailand - it's illegal.

[jamescollister]

OP have 2 kids one 3, 4 in March and the other 5. They attend a Government school, but it is by invite only. By that I mean it's paid for by local Government funds, but is is not local a pre school, Has better facilities than any pre school I have seen in Australia.

It's free, has 4 MacDonald s type play grounds, 10 to 1 teacher ratio, their own Merc bus, only 100 kids.

School march last week cost near on 10,000 Baht and I was no where near the biggest payer, only farang.

It's all about status, not education, Oxford, Cambridge, Harvard don't make people smarter or better, they just let you enter the circle. Jim

[Neeranam]

My kids went to private kinders and they only cost about 10,000 a term.

They now go to a private school and that is 20,000 a term.

State schools are good enough, although if the kid wants to be a brain surgeon they'll need a lot of extra classes outside the school.

[scorpio]

thanks guys, can anyone provide a list of schools and prices in the pattaya area.

[Semper]

gamble my money and try to make it work

I'm a gambler and the rule number 1 in gambling is: Don't gamble with more money than you can comfortably lose.

Hope you don't do it in Thailand - it's illegal.

Of course not. What do you take me for?

[rattler]

Only if I wanted them to become a complete brainwashed sheep would I send ANY child there, Thai culture is the last thing anyone needs and the education ministry should hang its head in shame.

[Dancealot]

gamble my money and try to make it work

I'm a gambler and the rule number 1 in gambling is: Don't gamble with more money than you can comfortably lose.

Hope you don't do it in Thailand - it's illegal.

Of course not. What do you take me for?

B100 on Mr. Semper is!

[Will2011]

Answer: NO

[naboo]

Don't do it. Whatever you do, do not send your child to a Thai state school. Extended holidays in Thailand, your wife heading out a week before you, coming home a week after you, every Christmas, Easter and Summer break would be a much better option.

If you do decide to come, make sure you have enough cash for an international school education, or at the very least, seek out a good English Program where foreign teachers might have an inclination to allow the students to think. Thai school = no analysis, no evaluation, no comprehension, no meaning.

At age 14-16 in the UK, in their native language students learn to write in a number of ways - to inform, to persuade, to discuss and analyse opposing views, to report, they read a wide variety of literature and analyse meaning, viewpoints, bias... In Thailand, they're learning how to use the royal language appropriately, they look at a poem and get told what it means, then have to remember what it means for the exam. In the UK, a maths student of the same age will be analysing and solving problems given context, choosing the appropriate method and pathway to the answer. In Thailand, they will be doing endless sums with absolutely no understanding of what it all means. Your average student in a Thai school does not even understand the concept of division - what is the point of learning to divide if you don't understand what it means?!? In science, a student in the UK will be given a question, will have to plan an investigation, consider a number of variables, consider their results, evaluate the validity of what they have done. In Thailand, they'll be learning chemical formula of endless organic molecules.

But most importantly, the Thai curriculum is disjointed, by the age of 12, most haven't got the faintest idea of what is going on - I even saw a 5 year old pre-school child doing some algebra homework the other day (x + 2 = 3, find x) and this kid hadn't learnt how to add up yet. So they leave Prathom for Mathayom, where in the next 3 years, they study it all again. Well, they didn't get it the first time round so this is a good thing right? Except kids don't want to do it again, its boring, especially if you remember it being impossible the first time around. So they go to sleep. And that's 6 years of Matthayom gone, at which point they go to a university and get a degree in turning up.

Do you really want to put your kid through an education system which turns out people qualified to work as a cashier who need to use a calculator to work out the change from 1000B on a bill of 500B? Its a joke, and the Ministry of Education is the root of it, an indestructible root malnourishing the entire country.

Now, don't even get me on the teachings of Thai history, or the fact that the foreign languages of English and Chinese have exactly the same curricula. Nor that the kids are at school from 7:55am to 4:00pm, and in a state school, if you don't attend your teachers' weekend classes for an extra fee you will end up bottom of the class because she'll be too busy avoiding teaching you in the week so that she has something to teach you at the weekend. Oh I could rant forever.

Just don't.

[thehelmsman]

It would be unfair to say all government schools are bad BUT, I see too many kids in the village who stop going to school at an early age with few reading and writing skills.

My lady and I joke about sending our girl to the local school but wouldn't seriously consider it. Why would you if you can afford a private school. When I stop working we plan to relocate to an area with International schools.

[Geekfreaklover]

I can speak from the experience of having raised three kids in Thailand and having taught at various schools in Thailand.

Location is VERY important. If you are in Bangkok, Pattaya or Chang Mai then the best way forward is to enroll your children into a good private school at elementary/primary level.

With High School, even the richest Thais understand that the best way forward is to have their kids obtain the best grades and then enter a public / government school in one of the top sets. This is where they will learn the tools to merge into Thai society.

International high schools with a pure English langauge program are for students who are looking at working overseas or have a job already in the family business. A Thai student who does not understand the Thai language and the nuances of social interaction, without the benefit of a rich family network, will usually be an outcast in the Thai job market.

I have seen this time and time again.

Millions of baht spent on a international education and the luk krung can do no better than getting a job as an English teacher.

Of course an English language university would be prefferable either here in Thailand or overseas.

So think about it. If you have the money then perhaps one of the international Asian schools may be a good idea. One that teaches English and Asian languages such as Mandarin, along with Thai lessons. Singapore international, or some such school.

But of course, much of the teaching has to be done at home. Same as anywhere in the world.

Do not even consider an Isaan government school.

The best schools are in the major cities. And the first step is to find one with an intensive Enlish program. Not difficult to find for 20k a term.

Good luck.

Edit: Just reread the first post. If you don't have a job here then don't consider it. Thai education is not as bad as Thai Visa posters like to make out. But I would never advise anyone at the age of 46 to move here without a job here or a regular income. Try to consider why the Mrs wants to move back. Maybe she finds it easier to live in Thailand, it won't be easier for you or the kids without a job.

Edited February 10, 2013 by Geekfreaklover

[scorpio]

hey guys as ive stated allready, we are not wealthy . 20k a term ( i hope you mean 20k thai baht ? ) does anyone have a list of school prices etc in pattaya ?

cheers

Edited February 10, 2013 by scorpio

[pattayadingo]

60,000 Baht per term?

That is a lot of money for a state / government school.

Was that a typo?

[NanLaew]

hey guys as ive stated allready, we are not wealthy . 20k a term ( i hope you mean 20k thai baht ? ) does anyone have a list of school prices etc in pattaya ?

cheers

google 'em, email 'em or phone 'em. Or you can wait until I've done my research on the ground... should have a handle on it by end of the month.

PS. You will find most with websites are still posting 2012/13 fees and schedules. I guess the more relevant 2013/14 details will be posted some time before end of the current academic year.

Edited February 10, 2013 by NanLaew

[Pormax]

I have to agree with the majority of posts here. Maybe thereare some good Goverment schools but the majority are very poor.

If you can scrape the money together then private is the way to go.

From the experiences I have learned from my Thai relatives, passing school grades depends not on your ability to learn and do the work. The pupils get extra marks for going to the school on a weekend (no warning given to the parents) so that they can plant vegatables which when grown are taken home by the teachers. Or they have to go to THREE local temples, report to the head monk who gets them to clean the temple and it's grounds. They have to come back with a slip signed. If they do not do this activities then they are told they will not pass the end of term exams.

Now I have a feeling this happens more in rural Thailand but can't be sure.

I have a 15 year old girl (neice of my wife) who lives with us. Has supposedly been having English classes for the last two years. It is a joke.

She comes home with homework where not only is it very badly written that I even have problems at times understanding what is required but the pupils have not been taught to read. Until I started teaching her she could not count up to 20 in English, did not know the alphabet. Could not say the days of the week or months of the year. As is normal with any children the tend to do homework together and one girl has some English knowledge. So my neice copied. I looked at the work and things that were quite clealy wrong were given as correct.

Ok this should not be a problem for your child but it does give one an example of the standard of teaching.

Another exxample. One of the nephews, now in high school for one year and supposedly learning electronics can't even wire a plug. Last month came home with a considerable amount of documents that he was told to copy (in hand writing). What happens? The whole family including my wife all do a few pages each. When I said to my wife, 'surely the teacher will see not only has my nephew not read any of it but will see at least 5 different hand writings and will not pass him'. 'No' she says 'as long as he takes it back he will pass, not do it and he will fail'.

I believe the same thingsas above happens in all the school levels which means that the certiicates are basically meaningless.

Education privately can be expensive but it depends what you want for your child.

[NanLaew]

Don't do it. Whatever you do, do not send your child to a Thai state school. Extended holidays in Thailand, your wife heading out a week before you, coming home a week after you, every Christmas, Easter and Summer break would be a much better option.

If you do decide to come, make sure you have enough cash for an international school education, or at the very least, seek out a good English Program where foreign teachers might have an inclination to allow the students to think. Thai school = no analysis, no evaluation, no comprehension, no meaning.

At age 14-16 in the UK, in their native language students learn to write in a number of ways - to inform, to persuade, to discuss and analyse opposing views, to report, they read a wide variety of literature and analyse meaning, viewpoints, bias... In Thailand, they're learning how to use the royal language appropriately, they look at a poem and get told what it means, then have to remember what it means for the exam. In the UK, a maths student of the same age will be analysing and solving problems given context, choosing the appropriate method and pathway to the answer. In Thailand, they will be doing endless sums with absolutely no understanding of what it all means. Your average student in a Thai school does not even understand the concept of division - what is the point of learning to divide if you don't understand what it means?!? In science, a student in the UK will be given a question, will have to plan an investigation, consider a number of variables, consider their results, evaluate the validity of what they have done. In Thailand, they'll be learning chemical formula of endless organic molecules.

But most importantly, the Thai curriculum is disjointed, by the age of 12, most haven't got the faintest idea of what is going on - I even saw a 5 year old pre-school child doing some algebra homework the other day (x + 2 = 3, find x) and this kid hadn't learnt how to add up yet. So they leave Prathom for Mathayom, where in the next 3 years, they study it all again. Well, they didn't get it the first time round so this is a good thing right? Except kids don't want to do it again, its boring, especially if you remember it being impossible the first time around. So they go to sleep. And that's 6 years of Matthayom gone, at which point they go to a university and get a degree in turning up.

Do you really want to put your kid through an education system which turns out people qualified to work as a cashier who need to use a calculator to work out the change from 1000B on a bill of 500B? Its a joke, and the Ministry of Education is the root of it, an indestructible root malnourishing the entire country.

Now, don't even get me on the teachings of Thai history, or the fact that the foreign languages of English and Chinese have exactly the same curricula. Nor that the kids are at school from 7:55am to 4:00pm, and in a state school, if you don't attend your teachers' weekend classes for an extra fee you will end up bottom of the class because she'll be too busy avoiding teaching you in the week so that she has something to teach you at the weekend. Oh I could rant forever.

Just don't.

I can speak from the experience of having raised three kids in Thailand and having taught at various schools in Thailand.

Location is VERY important. If you are in Bangkok, Pattaya or Chang Mai then the best way forward is to enroll your children into a good private school at elementary/primary level.

With High School, even the richest Thais understand that the best way forward is to have their kids obtain the best grades and then enter a public / government school in one of the top sets. This is where they will learn the tools to merge into Thai society.

International high schools with a pure English langauge program are for students who are looking at working overseas or have a job already in the family business. A Thai student who does not understand the Thai language and the nuances of social interaction, without the benefit of a rich family network, will usually be an outcast in the Thai job market.

I have seen this time and time again.

Millions of baht spent on a international education and the luk krung can do no better than getting a job as an English teacher.

Of course an English language university would be prefferable either here in Thailand or overseas.

So think about it. If you have the money then perhaps one of the international Asian schools may be a good idea. One that teaches English and Asian languages such as Mandarin, along with Thai lessons. Singapore international, or some such school.

But of course, much of the teaching has to be done at home. Same as anywhere in the world.

Do not even consider an Isaan government school.

The best schools are in the major cities. And the first step is to find one with an intensive Enlish program. Not difficult to find for 20k a term.

Good luck.

Edit: Just reread the first post. If you don't have a job here then don't consider it. Thai education is not as bad as Thai Visa posters like to make out. But I would never advise anyone at the age of 46 to move here without a job here or a regular income. Try to consider why the Mrs wants to move back. Maybe she finds it easier to live in Thailand, it won't be easier for you or the kids without a job.

Two good posts, based on experience and bringing up the pretty important detail of where you expect your high-school graduate to be looking for work and/or seeking further education. This isn't usually on the radar when deciding what is best for your precious 5 year-old's early education. If your kids are with you as you work temporarily in Thailand but this isn't where they are going into the workplace, uni or even adulthood, then fork out for the 'International' education as they will need that for the 'real world'. If you are planning on parking your own arse in LOS along with the family, either working or retired, then maybe the best pick of the Thai private schools will fit the bill.

As mentioned there are some state schools that are better than others but I understand they are few and far between. I think that success in a state school very much depends on the students own intelligence, aptitude, willingness to learn, self initiative and lots to do with the lessons taught by doting parents; the REAL homework!

[scorpio]

ok, ive tried to google private schools in pattaya area. not much info. can anyone provide names of schools and prices per term ? please

[Fgis]

Of course. Look at the local and wonder if you want your kid to be like them...

[pistachios]

Some of the posts are really frightening. I didn't think it was that bad. Isn't it a bit exagerrated? The country seems to be working fairly well with decent doctors, nurses and pharmacists. Buildings and bridge don't collapse every two days, communication networks and electricity are running smoothly, electronic and automotive factories seems to be OK, the SET50 companies are healthy... Surely most of the thais working there come from public schools. Those schools must do something else than producing brainless morons incapable of doing anything else than futile memory exercises, right?

[scorecard]

I can speak from the experience of having raised three kids in Thailand and having taught at various schools in Thailand.

Location is VERY important. If you are in Bangkok, Pattaya or Chang Mai then the best way forward is to enroll your children into a good private school at elementary/primary level.

With High School, even the richest Thais understand that the best way forward is to have their kids obtain the best grades and then enter a public / government school in one of the top sets. This is where they will learn the tools to merge into Thai society.

International high schools with a pure English langauge program are for students who are looking at working overseas or have a job already in the family business. A Thai student who does not understand the Thai language and the nuances of social interaction, without the benefit of a rich family network, will usually be an outcast in the Thai job market.

I have seen this time and time again.

Millions of baht spent on a international education and the luk krung can do no better than getting a job as an English teacher.

Of course an English language university would be prefferable either here in Thailand or overseas.

So think about it. If you have the money then perhaps one of the international Asian schools may be a good idea. One that teaches English and Asian languages such as Mandarin, along with Thai lessons. Singapore international, or some such school.

But of course, much of the teaching has to be done at home. Same as anywhere in the world.

Do not even consider an Isaan government school.

The best schools are in the major cities. And the first step is to find one with an intensive Enlish program. Not difficult to find for 20k a term.

Good luck.

Edit: Just reread the first post. If you don't have a job here then don't consider it. Thai education is not as bad as Thai Visa posters like to make out. But I would never advise anyone at the age of 46 to move here without a job here or a regular income. Try to consider why the Mrs wants to move back. Maybe she finds it easier to live in Thailand, it won't be easier for you or the kids without a job.

IMHO the OP needs to do the research about bi-lingual schools. I think the OP is saying he has twin boys in govt., schools in Thailand. To move them, at 13, from a govt., school, especially it it's upcountry, to a full international school would be a lot to cope with for these kids, both academically and acceptance by the other kids.

Somehow I suspect that moving into a typical bi-lingual school might be the best compromise. In any event this type of move will need a lot of TLC and home coaching.

There's also a balancing act between what can be afforded and the benefits of these kids growing up with mum and dad around every day. At 13 kids need guidance.

To the OP, do you have skills and experiece which would be of interest to an international company operating in Thailand, especially oil and gas?

If you do, then start to explore this area, will probably take time but could be worth the hassle. I know that many international oil and gas companies have a few 'locally employed' farang staff.

Don't call the comany switchboard and ask about jobs, do thedetective work and get some names of senior staff in the relevant departments and try to talk to them direct and 'engineer' a conversation focusing on what you could specifically contribute . Even turn up and see if you can get a 5 minute face to face conversation going as a starter. Ask questions / more detective work, find the location / room no., of the senior person your focusing on and make an excuse. "I just came today to get an application form, but now I'm here I was just wondering if you have 5 minutes". Have something, a CV, work related photos you could hand over immediately.

Don't go through the HR department, often they are too detached, and just give an automatic answer 'no vacancies'.

Edited February 10, 2013 by scorecard

[Chittychangchang]

thanks guys, can anyone provide a list of schools and prices in the pattaya area.

Stick with the holidays is the safes bet.

Your 3 year old daughter is the priority.

Your wifes teenage children live in Isann yet you want to move to Pattaya?

If everything goes belly up in a couple of years will you be able to return to the UK satisfying the new financial requirments assuming your wife does not posses a British passport. The ILR is invalid after 2 years away.

All the best whatever you decide.

[scorecard]

60,000 Baht per term?

That is a lot of money for a state / government school.

Was that a typo?

Agree, I suspect there are much cheaper bi-lingual places around.

[mca]

There was a similar thread running and I mentioned on that one that in my daughter's international school there are 15 kids in her class. The state schools seem to have about 50. That's enough to convince me. You could be the teacher out of Dead Poet's Society and you'd struggle with those numbers. There must be kids in those classes who just blend into the background and go through their entire school career learning sweet F.A.

In my humble opinion one of the things we can give our children is the best education we possibly can. Nobody can ever take that away from them.

[rattler]

Is it actually possible to teach your own kids here, am pretty dam_n sure I could teach them so much more than the "Royal Language" how useful is that!

Maths for one would be a major leap forwards.

[scorecard]

I can speak from the experience of having raised three kids in Thailand and having taught at various schools in Thailand. Location is VERY important. If you are in Bangkok, Pattaya or Chang Mai then the best way forward is to enroll your children into a good private school at elementary/primary level. With High School, even the richest Thais understand that the best way forward is to have their kids obtain the best grades and then enter a public / government school in one of the top sets. This is where they will learn the tools to merge into Thai society. International high schools with a pure English langauge program are for students who are looking at working overseas or have a job already in the family business. A Thai student who does not understand the Thai language and the nuances of social interaction, without the benefit of a rich family network, will usually be an outcast in the Thai job market. I have seen this time and time again. Millions of baht spent on a international education and the luk krung can do no better than getting a job as an English teacher. Of course an English language university would be prefferable either here in Thailand or overseas. So think about it. If you have the money then perhaps one of the international Asian schools may be a good idea. One that teaches English and Asian languages such as Mandarin, along with Thai lessons. Singapore international, or some such school. But of course, much of the teaching has to be done at home. Same as anywhere in the world. Do not even consider an Isaan government school. The best schools are in the major cities. And the first step is to find one with an intensive Enlish program. Not difficult to find for 20k a term. Good luck. Edit: Just reread the first post. If you don't have a job here then don't consider it. Thai education is not as bad as Thai Visa posters like to make out. But I would never advise anyone at the age of 46 to move here without a job here or a regular income. Try to consider why the Mrs wants to move back. Maybe she finds it easier to live in Thailand, it won't be easier for you or the kids without a job.

FURTHER ADDITION TO MY POST, AT THE BOTTOM:

IMHO the OP needs to do the research about bi-lingual schools. I think the OP is saying he has twin boys in govt., schools in Thailand. To move them, at 13, from a govt., school, especially it it's upcountry, to a full international school would be a lot to cope with for these kids, both academically and acceptance by the other kids. Somehow I suspect that moving into a typical bi-lingual school might be the best compromise. In any event this type of move will need a lot of TLC and home coaching. There's also a balancing act between what can be afforded and the benefits of these kids growing up with mum and dad around every day. At 13 kids need guidance. To the OP, do you have skills and experiece which would be of interest to an international company operating in Thailand, especially oil and gas? If you do, then start to explore this area, will probably take time but could be worth the hassle. I know that many international oil and gas companies have a few 'locally employed' farang staff. Don't call the comany switchboard and ask about jobs, do thedetective work and get some names of senior staff in the relevant departments and try to talk to them direct and 'engineer' a conversation focusing on what you could specifically contribute . Even turn up and see if you can get a 5 minute face to face conversation going as a starter. Ask questions / more detective work, find the location / room no., of the senior person your focusing on and make an excuse. "I just came today to get an application form, but now I'm here I was just wondering if you have 5 minutes". Have something, a CV, work related photos you could hand over immediately. Don't go through the HR department, often they are too detached, and just give an automatic answer 'no vacancies'.

I very much admire your thinking and desire to get the best situation possible for the education of your kids.

Lots of hard work ahead to get the planning right, work out the best comprromise all round, fund it, roll the many bumps that will be there along the way, and to see it through.

You can do it, good luck!

Edited February 11, 2013 by scorecard

[guzzi850m2]

An international school is only good if you send your kid overseas (from Thailand) afterward and they are really expensive.

My boy attend Maryvit where over 90% of the students ends up on university in Thailand. The only problem I have with that school is that they don't have a biannual program but believe me, it's a very demanding school and the students are very disciplined and polite.

If you plan to stay in Thailand forever that's the way to go.

A neighbor is a Thai doctor on Bkk/Pattaya hospital and he got all of his education in Thailand and his 2 kids also attend Maryvit.

All the Thais/expats I spoken to have almost all recommended that school.

Try Goggle Maryvit school

[Shot]

Nice thread. I appreciate the positive and informative thoughts . There was a similar one running in Phuket forum a year or so ago, that quickly turned into a “if you don’t send your Thai, 50/50 or Farang kid to an international school, you’re a bad parent”.