Do You Pay Tax In Thailand ?

[Crossy]

Yes or I don't get my visa extension.

Yup, me too, Thai employer with salary paid here, tax deducted at source.

[rattler]

I evade taxes at all times even in my own country, note I said evade not avoid................yes evasion is illegal, however when any govt spends the money sensibly they can have it.

Any government that disburses funds for your benefit, such as for foreign affairs personnel that will respond in the event that you are in need, is not spending its money sensibly. My opinion of what is "sensible", just as you have an opinion of what is "sensible". I also do not think people like you should be able to avail yourself of medical care, legal protections, or any other assistance funded by your government. Again. just my interpretation of being "sensible".

And quite rightly so, last time I used the NHS was when I was 10 years old and cut an ear off. I could have lived without it.............I said I could have ( oh never mind)

Dentists always private anything else pay for as I need it, last dentist bill £4000 in the UK

Agreed, mine and your definitions of sensible may vary greatly but on the whole Id abolish 75% of UK benefits.

[kevvy]

my wife and I pay a huge tax bill, but i dont get upset from it , as this country has been good to me .

[Semper]

I pay the alcohol and tobacco taxes.

[eeeya]

My Lamborghini had big tax ..

[monty]

The reason you won't see your streetside vendor or small mom and pop shop pay tax is that they can have a pretty big turnover before having to pay tax.

They are (as sole proprieters) allowed to deduct a lumpsum expense of 70% of revenue.

So with some allowances and the first 150000 tax free they can turnover almost up to 60000 Baht/month...taxfree...

And a lot of them play it smart and declare a tad over the tax tresshold (regardless of sales) then pay a few thousand/year tax and have all paperwork nicely in order.

And a system where no paperwork (invoices, expenses) is required makes it mighty hard for the taxman to check!

[AbeSurd]

My Lamborghini had big tax ..

My Lamborghini had even bigger tax

[Hedghog]

I pay, VAT.

[lemoncake]

i pay full tax on my declared minimum salary of 50K, i then also pay some tax on company earning at the end of the year.

One thing though i must say, Thai tax and accounting system is truly mind blowing to a point that even accountants do not really understand or know it.

I have given up even trying to understand it, while back in Oz i was able to run all accounting with ease, here i struggle to even comprehend were it starts.

[StreetCowboy]

i pay full tax on my declared minimum salary of 50K, i then also pay some tax on company earning at the end of the year.

One thing though i must say, Thai tax and accounting system is truly mind blowing to a point that even accountants do not really understand or know it.

I have given up even trying to understand it, while back in Oz i was able to run all accounting with ease, here i struggle to even comprehend were it starts.

My income tax forms were relatively straightforward to fill out. We employed professional accountants to do the company tax returns, same as we did in Hong Kong and elsewhere.

SC

[lemoncake]

i pay full tax on my declared minimum salary of 50K, i then also pay some tax on company earning at the end of the year.

One thing though i must say, Thai tax and accounting system is truly mind blowing to a point that even accountants do not really understand or know it.

I have given up even trying to understand it, while back in Oz i was able to run all accounting with ease, here i struggle to even comprehend were it starts.

My income tax forms were relatively straightforward to fill out. We employed professional accountants to do the company tax returns, same as we did in Hong Kong and elsewhere.

SC

I did not mean personal tax, i was referring to entire Thai tax system.

I also use an accounting firm, but would like to understand the system as i could before.

Next time your firm does company returns, ask the accountant to explain the system and see how you go.

[CWMcMurray]

Aren't corporate taxes 30%?

If so it would save you some money in taxes if you paid yourself a higher salary?

As at 50k per month that is only 600k per year which is only 15%

Used to be 30% after 1 million, but this year that has been revised

New tax brackets

0 - 150,000 tax-exempt

150,001 - 300,000 5%

300,001 - 500,000 10%

500,001 - 750,000 15%

750,001 - 1,000,000 20%

1,000,001 - 2,000,000 25%

2,000,001 - 4,000,000 30%

4,000,001 and up 35%

But please note that this new personal income tax structure only takes effect in the 2013 tax year (i.e. tax returns you file by 31 March 2014 latest). 2012 tax (tax returns filed by 31 March 2013) is still subject to the "old" structure.

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

Edited March 2, 2013 by CWMcMurray

[lemoncake]

Aren't corporate taxes 30%?

If so it would save you some money in taxes if you paid yourself a higher salary?

As at 50k per month that is only 600k per year which is only 20%

Used to be 30% after 1 million, but this year that has been revised

If I remember correctly it is now 25% over 1 million and then goes upto 30% at 2million (I think)

As the rate doesn't go up to 30

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

LOL, I am honestly as clueless as they come,i have put all my trust into an accountant i use, and so far she has been ok

[CWMcMurray]

Just found the new rates... And revised earlier post.... You may want to check with your accountant on this

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[StreetCowboy]

Aren't corporate taxes 30%?

If so it would save you some money in taxes if you paid yourself a higher salary?

As at 50k per month that is only 600k per year which is only 20%

Used to be 30% after 1 million, but this year that has been revised

If I remember correctly it is now 25% over 1 million and then goes upto 30% at 2million (I think)

As the rate doesn't go up to 30

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

Maybe he makes only minimal profits because he sub-contracts a lot of work to an overseas company.

The complexity of the company tax laws relates

a ) to the complexity of doing business, particularly across borders

b ) to the use of taxation to implement policy, (and particularly, I believe, in Thailand, to the policies geared towards advantaging the interests of members of government...)(Oops! Wrong thread...)('n'besides, thon's speculation; Better no' let Ray French catch ye at that!)

SC

EDIT: It's good to see the top rate coming down, and fiscal drag bringing more people into the tax net. People take a less extravagant view on public spending when some of it comes from their pocket.

As well as the 150,000 0% band, there is also a personal allowance (was 30,000) and a salary allowance (was 60,000) plus spouse's allowance and child allowance so a man with wife and two children could earn THB 300K at zero percent.

Edited March 2, 2013 by StreetCowboy

[lemoncake]

Just found the new rates... And revised earlier post.... You may want to check with your accountant on this

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

Yeah, i saw that, thank you, will have a chat and see what she would suggest

[AbeSurd]

I'd be interested to know whether there's anyone on ThaiVisa.com on a retirement visa who completes a Thai tax return each year?

I'd be particularly interested if this is case with any Brits who are non-resident for UK tax.

[lemoncake]

I'd be interested to know whether there's anyone on ThaiVisa.com on a retirement visa who completes a Thai tax return each year?

I'd be particularly interested if this is case with any Brits who are non-resident for UK tax.

why would anyone pay tax if they did not have to?

[CWMcMurray]

Just took a look at revenue dep website to double check...

It looks like 30% is for listed companies

Otherwise 23% last year and 20% this year

If you qualify as a small business then if net profit not over - Mil then 15% if profit over this, then 20%

So not sure on the size or net profits of your company, but depending, it may make sense to crunch the numbers to see if it makes sense to adjust your salary

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6044.0.html

For example... Ran some quick numbers in my head...

If you qualify as small business and had profit of 2 mil then you would be paying 20%... But if you increased your salary by 1 mil and 1 dollar, you would be under 1 mil and corporate would go down to 15%

It you add that to your salary your PIT would increase but looks like you would save aprox 28k in taxes overall

Not a lot but better in your pocket than in the tax mans pocket

Also it may be easier to manage if base salary stays the same but you give your self a annual bonus at the end of the year

You could then just run the numbers and give yourself what ever bonus amount will be most beneficial for over all tax purposes based upon that years net profit

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Edited March 2, 2013 by CWMcMurray

[PaullyW]

It's an old gag, but I'm an old fart.

What's the difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion ?

About ten years.

Not entirely without some basis in reality - the system jailed Wesley Snipes for three years for tax evasion (scheduled for release in July this year) while Michael Jackson and OJ got away with much more serious crimes (karma eventually got OJ). Granted, old Wes' should have had a better defence than 'I'm an alien, your honor !', but what's the point of having millions in unpaid taxes if it doesnt buy you a $1500-an-hour lawyers ? Faced with something like that in Thailand (!), I would just pay the 'fine' and cut my losses - I couldn't do a week in a Thai jail, much less 3 years.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wesley_Snipes#Tax_conviction

Interesting examples you've chosen. Surely, there are better ones to use as examples, but perhaps not in keeping with your tendency to show your color preference.

Pretty sad to move half way around the world, brining with you your silly biases which don't hold any value here in Asia.

Lame

[samran]

i pay full tax on my declared minimum salary of 50K, i then also pay some tax on company earning at the end of the year.

One thing though i must say, Thai tax and accounting system is truly mind blowing to a point that even accountants do not really understand or know it.

I have given up even trying to understand it, while back in Oz i was able to run all accounting with ease, here i struggle to even comprehend were it starts.

difficult to understand a personal income tax form which runs all of two pages?

I pay an accountant 7000 per quarter to take care of my Thai company's books. Can't be that hard can it. Australia is far far far more complex.... Just my opinion though.

[MrWorldwide]

PaullyW, I happen to be a huge fan of Wesley Snipes - I picked 3 black men purely to show that it was NOT an issue of color. All 3 were rich men, and that seems to be what matters in the US - end of story. It's sad that you read that and immediately leapt to those conclusions.

[PaullyW]

PaullyW, I happen to be a huge fan of Wesley Snipes - I picked 3 black men purely to show that it was NOT an issue of color. All 3 were rich men, and that seems to be what matters in the US - end of story. It's sad that you read that and immediately leapt to those conclusions.

Just happen to notice this, your comments about Nigerians and a few other, similar posts that would lead one to believe that you've brought irrelevant biases over to Asia with you. However, if I have misread your comments, I am truly sorry.

[lemoncake]

i pay full tax on my declared minimum salary of 50K, i then also pay some tax on company earning at the end of the year.

One thing though i must say, Thai tax and accounting system is truly mind blowing to a point that even accountants do not really understand or know it.

I have given up even trying to understand it, while back in Oz i was able to run all accounting with ease, here i struggle to even comprehend were it starts.

difficult to understand a personal income tax form which runs all of two pages?

I pay an accountant 7000 per quarter to take care of my Thai company's books. Can't be that hard can it. Australia is far far far more complex.... Just my opinion though.

Please read again, i was not referring to personal tax but tax system in Thailand in general

Australia is not complex at all, you even have a simple software which does everything for you MYOB

[samran]

i pay full tax on my declared minimum salary of 50K, i then also pay some tax on company earning at the end of the year.

One thing though i must say, Thai tax and accounting system is truly mind blowing to a point that even accountants do not really understand or know it.

I have given up even trying to understand it, while back in Oz i was able to run all accounting with ease, here i struggle to even comprehend were it starts.

difficult to understand a personal income tax form which runs all of two pages?

I pay an accountant 7000 per quarter to take care of my Thai company's books. Can't be that hard can it. Australia is far far far more complex.... Just my opinion though.

Please read again, i was not referring to personal tax but tax system in Thailand in general

Australia is not complex at all, you even have a simple software which does everything for you MYOB

Apologies for the misread.

[Time Traveller]

I'd be interested to know whether there's anyone on ThaiVisa.com on a retirement visa who completes a Thai tax return each year?

I'd be particularly interested if this is case with any Brits who are non-resident for UK tax.

why would anyone pay tax if they did not have to?

lemoncake, perhaps you didn't understand the question or maybe there is an error in your thinking. As the question was about completing a tax return (not paying tax), basically any rational person that is entitled to a return of taxes paid would submit a tax return. If you have any income at all in Thailand, it's probably worthwhile to submit a tax return (unless you have a very high income) as virtually all forms of income - salary, dividends, interest etc - have tax withheld at the source. Also in some instances types of income - such as stock dividends - come with tax credits as well at the the corporate tax rate, so by reporting your income on such forms of income you would be able to use tax credit of both the tax withheld plus the tax credits. Typically the rate of tax paid is higher than your personal income rate and you will get a refund unless your effective tax rate on total income is higher than rate at which you can claim the tax credits. Used to be around 3.5million+ Baht or more but would be less now under the lower tax rates).

Note, many American investors in the Thai stock market may not be aware of using tax credits on dividends received as the american tax system does not allow for such credits of corporate taxes paid for stock market investors to claim back.

Edited March 3, 2013 by Time Traveller

[lemoncake]

I'd be interested to know whether there's anyone on ThaiVisa.com on a retirement visa who completes a Thai tax return each year?

I'd be particularly interested if this is case with any Brits who are non-resident for UK tax.

why would anyone pay tax if they did not have to?

lemoncake, perhaps you didn't understand the question or maybe there is an error in your thinking. As the question was about completing a tax return (not paying tax), basically any rational person that is entitled to a return of taxes paid would submit a tax return. If you have any income at all in Thailand, it's probably worthwhile to submit a tax return (unless you have a very high income) as virtually all forms of income - salary, dividends, interest etc - have tax withheld at the source. Also in some instances types of income - such as stock dividends - come with tax credits as well at the the corporate tax rate, so by reporting your income on such forms of income you would be able to use tax credit of both the tax withheld plus the tax credits. Typically the rate of tax paid is higher than your personal income rate and you will get a refund unless your effective tax rate on total income is higher than rate at which you can claim the tax credits. Used to be around 3.5million+ Baht or more but would be less now under the lower tax rates).

Note, many American investors in the Thai stock market may not be aware of using tax credits on dividends received as the american tax system does not allow for such credits of corporate taxes paid for stock market investors to claim back.

But tax return for which country? if i am not wrong, the question was UK citizens on pension filing for tax in Thailand? with Revenue department? or filing with UK?

Again, i could be wrong, but do not those on a pension do not need to file at all? I know in Oz they do not have to(my mother is a pensioner and she does not need to file)

USA is a totally different ball game from my understanding.

[Time Traveller]

I'd be interested to know whether there's anyone on ThaiVisa.com on a retirement visa who completes a Thai tax return each year?

I'd be particularly interested if this is case with any Brits who are non-resident for UK tax.

why would anyone pay tax if they did not have to?

lemoncake, perhaps you didn't understand the question or maybe there is an error in your thinking. As the question was about completing a tax return (not paying tax), basically any rational person that is entitled to a return of taxes paid would submit a tax return. If you have any income at all in Thailand, it's probably worthwhile to submit a tax return (unless you have a very high income) as virtually all forms of income - salary, dividends, interest etc - have tax withheld at the source. Also in some instances types of income - such as stock dividends - come with tax credits as well at the the corporate tax rate, so by reporting your income on such forms of income you would be able to use tax credit of both the tax withheld plus the tax credits. Typically the rate of tax paid is higher than your personal income rate and you will get a refund unless your effective tax rate on total income is higher than rate at which you can claim the tax credits. Used to be around 3.5million+ Baht or more but would be less now under the lower tax rates).

Note, many American investors in the Thai stock market may not be aware of using tax credits on dividends received as the american tax system does not allow for such credits of corporate taxes paid for stock market investors to claim back.

But tax return for which country? if i am not wrong, the question was UK citizens on pension filing for tax in Thailand? with Revenue department? or filing with UK?

Again, i could be wrong, but do not those on a pension do not need to file at all? I know in Oz they do not have to(my mother is a pensioner and she does not need to file)

USA is a totally different ball game from my understanding.

Thailand. If you reside in Thailand for more than 180 days per year and have any income from Thailand - and it doesn't matter whether most of your income comes from another country since that's not liable for tax in Thailand - then you almost certainly will have had tax withheld at source before you receive it. So, for many people submitting a tax return will certainly return money to them due to their effective personal tax rate (on Thai income) is less than the rate of the tax that was withheld. For example, Thai bank interest has withholding tax at 15% but your personal effective tax rate (not the marginal rate) does not reach 15% until around total income is just above 1,000,000 baht. So people earning less than that would get a refund on such tax already paid. For dividend income it is worthwhile for even higher incomes.

Edited March 3, 2013 by Time Traveller

[lemoncake]

Ok, now i am totally confused.

So someone receiving pension from UK(as per original question) would be filing tax return in Thailand with Revenue Department? declaring his/her pension

[AbeSurd]

I'd be interested to know whether there's anyone on ThaiVisa.com on a retirement visa who completes a Thai tax return each year?

I'd be particularly interested if this is case with any Brits who are non-resident for UK tax.

why would anyone pay tax if they did not have to?

Firstly there is a tax treaty between the UK and Thailand. A UK accountant has assured me that under this, having become non-resident for UK tax, certain kinds of income earned in the UK can be more favourably treated by the UK tax authorities IF you declare the income in Thailand. Here I'm talking about non-pension income that continues after you've retired and finished work. For example, like continuing commission payments from work done before retirement.

Secondly, is your question about tax evasion or tax avoidance? If you mean tax evasion, well, as I'm sure you can appreciate, not everyone has the stomach for that. Not everyone is so inclined. I would never burn my bridges with the UK. If I need to return permanently to the UK in the future, I don't want to return to a load of trouble from the UK taxman.