' Crony' Of African Strongman Among Thai Names In Secret Offshore Files

[slapout]

To propose that 'offshore accounts' are used for retirement purposes, coming from a 'ex swiss bank manager' may be stretching a point. The ultra wealthly do not have much of a need for a legit retirement account as most of us peons know it. 4 or 5 thouand a month retirement income is a pittence to them.

Secretive offshore accounts as well as some banking systems have been used to laundrer monies accumulated via illegal methods. As far as a tax haven, this is based on where the company is incorporated, operates, etc as any astute tax man can tell you. Many of these instituations were and are run to launder drug money, illegal arms sales, kick backs to corrupt poloticians, proceeds from illegal gambling, etc

There are several banks worldwide who can set up offshore accounts for those with a legit requirement, but they do not operate out a clapboard shack, painted bright yellow or blue. I do not claim to know more than others, but from personal experience, investigation, etc, my description/opinion can be and has been verfied many times.

[manarak]

To propose that 'offshore accounts' are used for retirement purposes, coming from a 'ex swiss bank manager' may be stretching a point. The ultra wealthly do not have much of a need for a legit retirement account as most of us peons know it. 4 or 5 thouand a month retirement income is a pittence to them.

Secretive offshore accounts as well as some banking systems have been used to laundrer monies accumulated via illegal methods. As far as a tax haven, this is based on where the company is incorporated, operates, etc as any astute tax man can tell you. Many of these instituations were and are run to launder drug money, illegal arms sales, kick backs to corrupt poloticians, proceeds from illegal gambling, etc

There are several banks worldwide who can set up offshore accounts for those with a legit requirement, but they do not operate out a clapboard shack, painted bright yellow or blue. I do not claim to know more than others, but from personal experience, investigation, etc, my description/opinion can be and has been verfied many times.

Many offshore accounts are held by people with less than 10 million in total assets, hiding away maybe 500k to 1 million.

Sadly, these legit accounts are not very attractive for the big banks, who prefer to concentrate on accounts of 50 million +.

If you go to major banks with a million and ask for an offshore structure, they are likely to show you the door, laughing.

So the clients are forced to use "do it yourself" structures, setup through independent "offshore advisors", and have often fought hard and struggled to open a bank account.

Many of them unfortunately ended up in Cyprus (I have always been instinctively opposed to using a bank in a EU country for offshore business).

You are right that offshore accounts are often abused for illegal activity.

But my point is that offshore companies and accounts currently are an easy way (and maybe the only way) for the upper middle classes and lower upper classes to stash away some money.

The ultra rich will always have other means at their disposal, including buying whole banks.

So if secret offshore banking is made impossible, this will again hit the wrong people, i.e. those who make the country work, instead of hitting those who bleed the country out, i.e. importing trade companies and big corporations.

Edited April 5, 2013 by manarak

[sjjmmi]

nothing wrong with owning one or two offshore companies or even more.

In the case of Thailand's International Trade Representative and Yingluck Cabinet Appointee Nalinee.... lying and concealing hidden assets IS wrong, illegal even.

What is also suspect is Thaksin's Potjaman's financial dealings during a time when she was being investigated for tax evasion.

.

.

I believe Kuhn Zou Zou as bing festicious, lighten up a bit hey??

He is only a troll claiming to be Chinese and we all know it.

Could be from NK

[khaowong1]

Revealing these secret offshore files is ging to upset a lot of people.

[manarak]

Revealing these secret offshore files is ging to upset a lot of people.

They know that and therefore they so far only reveal data about persons that can't become serious threats.

I'd be surprised if we see a lot of the names of American, Russian, Ukrainian or Chinese dangerous guys on the list.

Sadly, it's again the harmless people that will get hit - the tax avoiders instead of the murderers.

[unanimosity]

An individual's sole purpose for setting up an off shore company is to avoid (lessen) paying tax in their home country. This is a tax loophole plain and simple. Tax avoidance and evasion is primarily the name of the game and governments need to clamp down on this.

Sorry to disagree, but another reason might be to hide money, for which one has no reasonable explanation of where it came from, and what was given in-exchange, commissions on concessions or contracts for example.

Or perhaps some people simply don't trust the banks in Cyprus anymore ?

Well, there's always bitcoins.

[F430murci]

It appears that all these lovely people in the article with offshore bank accounts and companies have the Sgt. Schultz syndrome. "I know nothing".

Liked for Sgt Shultz. Awesome.

[rubl]

People have offshore account, cool. People have lots of money not previously made known, very cool. People have money no one knew they had, amazingly cool. People were trying to hide they had money, criminally cool

[manarak]

People have offshore account, cool. People have lots of money not previously made known, very cool. People have money no one knew they had, amazingly cool. People were trying to hide they had money, criminally cool

I don't agree.

When tax has already been paid on earned money, people should be free to do what they want with their money, including hiding it.

Hiding the money is the natural answer to the taxman wanting to come several times to collect taxes from the same money on which tax has already been paid, in addition to inflation.

[F430murci]

People have offshore account, cool. People have lots of money not previously made known, very cool. People have money no one knew they had, amazingly cool. People were trying to hide they had money, criminally cool

I would rather have my money in Caymans account than Thai account as Thai banks seem to have some serious troubled asset and debt issues. Maybe criminal, perhaps just smart.

[F430murci]

People have offshore account, cool. People have lots of money not previously made known, very cool. People have money no one knew they had, amazingly cool. People were trying to hide they had money, criminally cool

I would rather have my money in Caymans account than Thai account as Thai banks seem to have some serious troubled asset and debt issues. Maybe criminal, perhaps just smart.

[473geo]

Revealing these secret offshore files is ging to upset a lot of people.

I benefit from tax efficient offshore betting...... In a few years, I'm sure some of the more tedious Tvisa members will come up with a Thaksin connection....who knows maybe I have travelled through the same airport as Thaksin.....the shame of it.....

Edited April 5, 2013 by 473geo

[F430murci]

He is only a troll claiming to be Chinese and we all know it.

Could be from NK

Could be from Uranus.

Edited April 5, 2013 by F430murci

[EyesWideOpen]

Does Buchholz have a life outside trying to dig up dirt and be upset about Thaksin and anyone related to or associated with Thaksin. Dude was having a coronary when Thaksin was in the US. Yeah, so. People have offshore bank accounts. Cool. Move on.

You seem to have a low curiosity level.... :-)

[EyesWideOpen]

He is only a troll claiming to be Chinese and we all know it.

Could be from NK

Could be from Uranus.

He is from the UK...

[Skywalker69]

nothing wrong with owning one or two offshore companies or even more.

In the case of Thailand's International Trade Representative and Yingluck Cabinet Appointee Nalinee.... lying and concealing hidden assets IS wrong, illegal even.

What is also suspect is Thaksin's Potjaman's financial dealings during a time when she was being investigated for tax evasion.

.

.

I believe Kuhn Zou Zou as bing festicious, lighten up a bit hey??

He is only a troll claiming to be Chinese and we all know it.

http://www.prachatai.com/english/node/1686

[Buchholz]

People have offshore account, cool. People have lots of money not previously made known, very cool. People have money no one knew they had, amazingly cool. People were trying to hide they had money, criminally cool

I don't agree.

When tax has already been paid on earned money, people should be free to do what they want with their money, including hiding it.

Hiding the money is the natural answer to the taxman wanting to come several times to collect taxes from the same money on which tax has already been paid, in addition to inflation.

Returning to the OP,, this is about the criminal act of concealing assets when legally required to report those assets.

.

[Greer]

An individual's sole purpose for setting up an off shore company is to avoid (lessen) paying tax in their home country. This is a tax loophole plain and simple. Tax avoidance and evasion is primarily the name of the game and governments need to clamp down on this.

Maybe if the governments of the world had one flat rate tax percentage this would not happen. I mean if you pay 20% tax on £10000 it will be more the tax on £1000.

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE Q6

No, if you pay 20% tax on ANY amount it will not be more or less across the board, it will be 20%.

I have always said that a flat rate tax with NO exceptions for anyone within a taxable income level should be employed. Yes we still have to have a tax threshold, but the entire tax system must be simplified, and the horrendous theft of income by governments to pay for bludgers (including themselves) must go.

But it requires a total rework, so the likelihood of it ever happening is zero, nil, no way... don't forget that government departments are run by supervisors and managers, and their pay scale is linked to their seniority, and the larger a department, the more senior one must be to be in charge, so the more money they make - hence, large government departments in ANY and ALL governments, will NEVER go away.

The idiotic idea that rich people and companies should be taxed more than the rest denies the fact that rich people who own and run companies are the ones employing the vast majority of people in the world. Tax the rich to the point where they don't want to run the company any more, and all you have succeeded in doing, is killing the goose that lays the golden egg.

Edited April 6, 2013 by Greer

[OzMick]

People have offshore account, cool. People have lots of money not previously made known, very cool. People have money no one knew they had, amazingly cool. People were trying to hide they had money, criminally cool

I don't agree.

When tax has already been paid on earned money, people should be free to do what they want with their money, including hiding it.

Hiding the money is the natural answer to the taxman wanting to come several times to collect taxes from the same money on which tax has already been paid, in addition to inflation.

Do you not understand the difference between tax avoidance (a legal maneuver) and tax evasion (criminal activity)? If tax is payable on "money on which tax has already been paid" and you fail to declare or hide such funds due to philosophical differences with the tax laws of your country of residence, don't be surprised if you are given free accommodation (incarceration).

[philw]

People have offshore account, cool. People have lots of money not previously made known, very cool. People have money no one knew they had, amazingly cool. People were trying to hide they had money, criminally cool

I don't agree.

When tax has already been paid on earned money, people should be free to do what they want with their money, including hiding it.

Hiding the money is the natural answer to the taxman wanting to come several times to collect taxes from the same money on which tax has already been paid, in addition to inflation.

Returning to the OP,, this is about the criminal act of concealing assets when legally required to report those assets.

.

Then why do you not feel the need to mention other people doing the same ???

How about Adm. Banawit Kengrian, the former deputy permanent secretary of defense,

who is listed as one of many shareholders in the British Virgin Islands

company Vnet Capital International Co., Ltd in 1998 ???

A member of the National Legislative Council after the military coup in 2006.

[whybother]

Then why do you not feel the need to mention other people doing the same ???

How about Adm. Banawit Kengrian, the former deputy permanent secretary of defense,

who is listed as one of many shareholders in the British Virgin Islands

company Vnet Capital International Co., Ltd in 1998 ???

A member of the National Legislative Council after the military coup in 2006.

Maybe because "There is no suggestion Kengrian avoided his disclosure responsibilities."

[muttley]

People have offshore account, cool. People have lots of money not previously made known, very cool. People have money no one knew they had, amazingly cool. People were trying to hide they had money, criminally cool

I don't agree.

When tax has already been paid on earned money, people should be free to do what they want with their money, including hiding it.

Hiding the money is the natural answer to the taxman wanting to come several times to collect taxes from the same money on which tax has already been paid, in addition to inflation.

Returning to the OP,, this is about the criminal act of concealing assets when legally required to report those assets.

.

Then why do you not feel the need to mention other people doing the same ???

How about Adm. Banawit Kengrian, the former deputy permanent secretary of defense,

who is listed as one of many shareholders in the British Virgin Islands

company Vnet Capital International Co., Ltd in 1998 ???

A member of the National Legislative Council after the military coup in 2006.

I asked the same question in another thread. Didn't get a reply either. Par for the course. It does show the influence the local rags have - out of 600 odd Thais involved Thaksins wife and her brother are the ones highlighted - some members of the family that control the Central Group are on the list just like the Coup participant above, an acolyte of Prem it turns out, wonder if he's on the list?

One things for sure, Thaksin isn't, otherwise we would have heard from the frothers by now.

Perhaps it's because he is more obvious with his tax avoidance schemes as opposed to some other rich people - kind of exposes the hypocrisy, doesn't it? After all, in reality these people are stealing from the public as well and I bet the combined amount of tax avoidance they are responsible for is a darn sight more than Thaksin.

I wonder if those posters that are so voiciferous in their condemnation of Thaksins tax avoidance will be up in arms over this?

[muttley]

Then why do you not feel the need to mention other people doing the same ???

How about Adm. Banawit Kengrian, the former deputy permanent secretary of defense,

who is listed as one of many shareholders in the British Virgin Islands

company Vnet Capital International Co., Ltd in 1998 ???

A member of the National Legislative Council after the military coup in 2006.

Maybe because "There is no suggestion Kengrian avoided his disclosure responsibilities."

Thats just newspaper lawyer speak for CYA.

[slapout]

Philw: What is the thinking/logic, when someone is caught out (hand in cookie jar), the intial response seems to be, "everyone is doing the same, look at the other individuals"?

Many of us drive over the speed limit, when pulled over, ticketed, and fined, we do not try to justify our misdeed, by pointing out those who were not caught/fined. As adults we are responsible for our misdeeds, as such we are responsible for the what got us in the situation, not our parents, extended family, co conspiritors, the 2nd cousin, etc.

[whybother]

Then why do you not feel the need to mention other people doing the same ???

How about Adm. Banawit Kengrian, the former deputy permanent secretary of defense,

who is listed as one of many shareholders in the British Virgin Islands

company Vnet Capital International Co., Ltd in 1998 ???

A member of the National Legislative Council after the military coup in 2006.

Maybe because "There is no suggestion Kengrian avoided his disclosure responsibilities."

Thats just newspaper lawyer speak for CYA.

Maybe you or phil can find some evidence that he did avoid his disclosure responsibilities then.

Ryle cautioned, however, that many of the individuals brought to his attention by the hard drive may not have broken any laws.

http://www.theage.com.au/business/world-business/mysterious-mail-to-australian-journalist-triggers-global-tax-haven-expose-20130405-2hak3.htm

[hellodolly]

I only wish I had the money to need an offshore company to manage it. Unfortunately I'm not one of the Amply Rich people

Take out Thai citizenship and buddy up to Thaksin.

[philw]

Then why do you not feel the need to mention other people doing the same ???

How about Adm. Banawit Kengrian, the former deputy permanent secretary of defense,

who is listed as one of many shareholders in the British Virgin Islands

company Vnet Capital International Co., Ltd in 1998 ???

A member of the National Legislative Council after the military coup in 2006.

Maybe because "There is no suggestion Kengrian avoided his disclosure responsibilities."

You are of course right, coup makers and their appointees are not exactly accountable, are they ??

[whybother]

Maybe because "There is no suggestion Kengrian avoided his disclosure responsibilities."

You are of course right, coup makers and their appointees are not exactly accountable, are they ??

So you do have some evidence that he avoided his disclosure responsibilities?

[belg]

and why is this list not public to everybody like wikileaks?

because they want to "negociate" the price of not releasing their names ?

[whybother]

and why is this list not public to everybody like wikileaks?

because they want to "negociate" the price of not releasing their names ?

Go and have a look here: http://www.icij.org/offshore, for a few more articles and details.

The reason that the list is not public is because a lot of people who have offshore accounts have not broken any laws.