Liverpool F.c.

[carmine]

I think liverpool should be happy with a point. Dowd got that wrong. Clear penalty to Swansea.

A long way to go abrak and i don't know how you can say at this stage of the season fourth is out of the question. We're doing ok at the moment and Arsenal are a diferent team to that of five weeks ago. Theres no reason why you lot can't do the same, but, Dalglish really doesn't seem to have things very organised and Henderson for example doesn't seem to know what he's supposed to be doing.

I'd keep your fingers crossed Suarez doesn't get injured because i think Kenny could still do a better job upfront than Carroll.

Edited November 6, 2011 by carmine

[MrRed]

it makes us look very ordinary.

Which, at the moment we are.

Very realistic from a Liverpool fan,not much change from when Woy was there really only you have spent a lot more money!

Swansea where the better team from what i saw.

[MrRed]

Police cordoned off Liverpool City Centre this morning when a suspicious object was discovered in a car.

It later turned out to be a tax disc

[Abrak]

I think liverpool should be happy with a point. Dowd got that wrong. Clear penalty to Swansea.

A long way to go abrak and i don't know how you can say at this stage of the season fourth is out of the question. We're doing ok at the moment and Arsenal are a diferent team to that of five weeks ago. Theres no reason why you lot can't do the same, but, Dalglish really doesn't seem to have things very organised and Henderson for example doesn't seem to know what he's supposed to be doing.

I'd keep your fingers crossed Suarez doesn't get injured because i think Kenny could still do a better job upfront than Carroll.

Penalty? Are you talking about the time that a player ran into Lucas on the edge of the box?

I didnt say that 4th is out of the question just that it is 'slipping from our grasp' - we were favourites for 4th a few weeks ago. I just recognize that performances like yesterday are not going to be good enough but I also know we have the potential to play better. For someone to say we are not much better than Hodgson's time is having a memory lapse. We have spent a net 50m on the team over the past two windows - half Chelsea and City - and we have radically improved both the strength and depth in the squad. Both Arsenal and Spurs have had their we are not going to make top 4 moments this year and we have to be better than yesterday if we want to remain in the chase. In particular, we cant afford too many more of these 'ordinary' performances or else we will end up with too much to do when we do turn it around.

I do think we have the makings of a top 4 squad which I never thought we had last year. Problems I see.

1. A couple of our regulars have gone off the boil like Kuyt who was scoring goals for fun at the end of last season.

2. Downing has been disappointing of late. His shooting seems to be from a player lacking in confidence.

3. Henderson is not working on the right at the moment. He usually plays in the centre and about his best match was when he came on for Lucas. I think it is pretty tough to ask a very young player to play out of position. But then we are missing Gerard.

4. Adam is a mixed bag. I thought he should have been subbed yesterday after the yellow card (that is what Kenny usually does). He doesnt exactly partner Lucas as he plays at least 10 yards in front of him. I dont think we have found either the right time or perhaps the right way to play him.

5. Our backline is fine but that is dependent on Agger and Agger's fitness is not dependable.

6. In my view Carroll has improved beyond recognition compared to some of his earlier performances. I am slightly confused how we are playing though. He won a lot of headers in the six yard box, headed them down nicely but with no Liverpool player to pounce on them.

[MrRed]

Abrak,i do have a lot of respect for you as a Liverpool fan because you always try to back your feelings or opinion up with statistics or your own personal opinion,but the last sentence got me bamboozled a little

"6. In my view Carroll has improved beyond recognition compared to some of his earlier performances"

It is patently obvious he hasn't

[Abrak]

I dont pretend to understand tactics but I will also offer what is perhaps more a statistical theory. I suspect possession and territory advantage are perhaps overvalued in terms of the performance they produce.

Now if you look at the positioning of the two teams.

First Liverpool....

Then Swansea.....

You can see how Liverpool had 64% territory, 53% possession. However it also meant that for a lot of the time Swansea could effectively keep 10 men around or behind the ball. Actually Liverpool have quite a lot of strength in counter attacks with Johnson and Enrique as wing backs and Downing and Bellamy/Kuyt on the RHS. We dont get much chance to use it if we are at the other end of the pitch.

And in support of this I would suggest that we have looked at best at home against Man U who did not allow the territory/possession and that our away performances (whereby the opposition are bound to press forward) have actually been pretty good (bar the Spurs shocker.) So we have been playing better in more difficult matches.

[carmine]

I think liverpool should be happy with a point. Dowd got that wrong. Clear penalty to Swansea.

A long way to go abrak and i don't know how you can say at this stage of the season fourth is out of the question. We're doing ok at the moment and Arsenal are a diferent team to that of five weeks ago. Theres no reason why you lot can't do the same, but, Dalglish really doesn't seem to have things very organised and Henderson for example doesn't seem to know what he's supposed to be doing.

I'd keep your fingers crossed Suarez doesn't get injured because i think Kenny could still do a better job upfront than Carroll.

Penalty? Are you talking about the time that a player ran into Lucas on the edge of the box?

I didnt say that 4th is out of the question just that it is 'slipping from our grasp' - we were favourites for 4th a few weeks ago. I just recognize that performances like yesterday are not going to be good enough but I also know we have the potential to play better. For someone to say we are not much better than Hodgson's time is having a memory lapse. We have spent a net 50m on the team over the past two windows - half Chelsea and City - and we have radically improved both the strength and depth in the squad. Both Arsenal and Spurs have had their we are not going to make top 4 moments this year and we have to be better than yesterday if we want to remain in the chase. In particular, we cant afford too many more of these 'ordinary' performances or else we will end up with too much to do when we do turn it around.

I do think we have the makings of a top 4 squad which I never thought we had last year. Problems I see.

1. A couple of our regulars have gone off the boil like Kuyt who was scoring goals for fun at the end of last season.

2. Downing has been disappointing of late. His shooting seems to be from a player lacking in confidence.

3. Henderson is not working on the right at the moment. He usually plays in the centre and about his best match was when he came on for Lucas. I think it is pretty tough to ask a very young player to play out of position. But then we are missing Gerard.

4. Adam is a mixed bag. I thought he should have been subbed yesterday after the yellow card (that is what Kenny usually does). He doesnt exactly partner Lucas as he plays at least 10 yards in front of him. I dont think we have found either the right time or perhaps the right way to play him.

5. Our backline is fine but that is dependent on Agger and Agger's fitness is not dependable.

6. In my view Carroll has improved beyond recognition compared to some of his earlier performances. I am slightly confused how we are playing though. He won a lot of headers in the six yard box, headed them down nicely but with no Liverpool player to pounce on them.

Carroll has not improved. If anything its rather a shame for the lad because that ludicrous price tag's not his fault and he always been little more than an average player albeit a big lump to handle at times but nothing a decent center back couldn't keep neatly in his pocket.

Isn't it glaringly obvious Henderson shouldn't be playing wide?

When exactly were you favourites for fourth? You were never favourites, its always been percieved as a three horse race, rightly of wrongly.

Edited November 6, 2011 by carmine

[Abrak]

Abrak,i do have a lot of respect for you as a Liverpool fan because you always try to back your feelings or opinion up with statistics or your own personal opinion,but the last sentence got me bamboozled a little

"6. In my view Carroll has improved beyond recognition compared to some of his earlier performances"

It is patently obvious he hasn't

Fair point. It is merely an observation of mine and there isnt a lot of evidence in the stats.

But first of all, I am not making an 'he is worth 35m argument' just that he is playing much better and I believe now justifies his places in the team perhaps not ahead of but no longer behind Kuyt/Bellamy.

What I am saying is that 'for whatever reason' for his first six months he looked 'short of pace', 'uninterested', uncordinated etc. As an example yesterday he won a lot of headers that were booted up to him with long passes. A few months ago he was not even competing for them. And finally he may not have looked that effective but he was winning long balls and knocking them down into the six yard box - I sort of think that is what he is supposed to be doing - the fact that there is noone there is beside the point.

But fair point and as he patently missed a sitter from 5 yards into a virtually open goal you can easily argue he is still crap.

[carmine]

Abrak,i do have a lot of respect for you as a Liverpool fan because you always try to back your feelings or opinion up with statistics or your own personal opinion,but the last sentence got me bamboozled a little

"6. In my view Carroll has improved beyond recognition compared to some of his earlier performances"

It is patently obvious he hasn't

Fair point. It is merely an observation of mine and there isnt a lot of evidence in the stats.

But first of all, I am not making an 'he is worth 35m argument' just that he is playing much better and I believe now justifies his places in the team perhaps not ahead of but no longer behind Kuyt/Bellamy.

What I am saying is that 'for whatever reason' for his first six months he looked 'short of pace', 'uninterested', uncordinated etc. As an example yesterday he won a lot of headers that were booted up to him with long passes. A few months ago he was not even competing for them. And finally he may not have looked that effective but he was winning long balls and knocking them down into the six yard box - I sort of think that is what he is supposed to be doing - the fact that there is noone there is beside the point.

But fair point and as he patently missed a sitter from 5 yards into a virtually open goal you can easily argue he is still crap.

Sandra Redknapp could have scored that five yarder.

[Abrak]

Isn't it glaringly obvious Henderson shouldn't be playing wide?

When exactly were you favourites for fourth? You were never favourites, its always been percieved as a three horse race, rightly of wrongly.

On Henderson I agree with you entirely. Some would say it is glaringly obvious he shouldnt be playing. I am sure say Kenny believes that he can play wide even though it isnt his preferred position and that it will take time for it to work. I think Henderson is a good player (his stats are quite neat but he isnt involved enough) but I think he should be in the centre. Yesterday I think that Adam should have been substituted (because of his yellow card), Kuyt brought in and Henderson moved to the centre. There was not a lot to lose in that strategy.

Both Coates and Henderson are very young and are clearly purchases of the future. Together they account for half of our net spend but they were not bought to make an immediate big difference.

I say we were 'favourites' for 4th based on the bookies odds. It always has been a 3 horse race and still is.

[Abrak]

Sandra Redknapp could have scored that five yarder.

And my argument is that 3 months ago Carroll wouldnt have been in the 6 yard box.

[smokie36]

Sandra Redknapp could have scored that five yarder.

And my argument is that 3 months ago Carroll wouldnt have been in the 6 yard box.

None of your mates coming out to play today Abrak?

Fair play to you lad.

[Devil]

Poor display in the end but got a point. In other games played some excellent football and got a point.

I was expecting a tough game and Kenny had warned about Swanseas possession play and attacking football - they played some very good football at times...

Just dissapointed to drop 2 points at home and some below average displayed out there mainly Adam, Henderson.

Might be a knee jerk reaction but will say it again prefer Spearing with Lucas in the middle.

Very tough games coming up Chesleas then Man City!

[Abrak]

In a magical stroke of good timing, a website has declared that Liverpool is going to buy Tevez. Admittedly it is caughtoffside.com so it is almost certainly complete rubbish.

I will say with absolute certainty that if Liverpool do recruit him I will switch off my support Liverpool button. He isnt worthy of wearing the City shirt let alone Liverpool's. I am not taking the moral high ground, my moral standards are disgracefully low. And I have switched off my Liverpool switch before most recently for well over a year when H&G were owners. (Yes I know that doesnt make me a true supporter but I have no interest in watching a club I love self-destruct in front of my eyes.)

If he decides to stay in England, I hope that Abromavich tries to buy him again. At least then when he screws up he will mysteriously disappear like most of the witnesses at Abromavich's current trial.

http://www.caughtoffside.com/2011/11/06/liverpool-prepare-audacious-bid-to-sign-manchester-city-striker-carlos-tevez/#comments

[Devil]

1320642071[/url]' post='4828561']

In a magical stroke of good timing, a website has declared that Liverpool is going to buy Tevez. Admittedly it is caughtoffside.com so it is almost certainly complete rubbish.

I will say with absolute certainty that if Liverpool do recruit him I will switch off my support Liverpool button. He isnt worthy of wearing the City shirt let alone Liverpool's. I am not taking the moral high ground, my moral standards are disgracefully low. And I have switched off my Liverpool switch before most recently for well over a year when H&G were owners. (Yes I know that doesnt make me a true supporter but I have no interest in watching a club I love self-destruct in front of my eyes.)

If he decides to stay in England, I hope that Abromavich tries to buy him again. At least then when he screws up he will mysteriously disappear like most of the witnesses at Abromavich's current trial.

http://www.caughtoff...tevez/#comments

Fraudoffside.com you should of stopped there, never gonna happen...

[carmine]

In a magical stroke of good timing, a website has declared that Liverpool is going to buy Tevez. Admittedly it is caughtoffside.com so it is almost certainly complete rubbish.

I will say with absolute certainty that if Liverpool do recruit him I will switch off my support Liverpool button. He isnt worthy of wearing the City shirt let alone Liverpool's. I am not taking the moral high ground, my moral standards are disgracefully low. And I have switched off my Liverpool switch before most recently for well over a year when H&G were owners. (Yes I know that doesnt make me a true supporter but I have no interest in watching a club I love self-destruct in front of my eyes.)

If he decides to stay in England, I hope that Abromavich tries to buy him again. At least then when he screws up he will mysteriously disappear like most of the witnesses at Abromavich's current trial.

http://www.caughtoff...tevez/#comments

Fraudoffside.com you should of stopped there, never gonna happen...

Won't happen. Anyways, Tevez is a perfect fit for the revolting Chelsea FC and the way they are playing they need to spend rather a lot soon.

[Abrak]

Won't happen. Anyways, Tevez is a perfect fit for the revolting Chelsea FC and the way they are playing they need to spend rather a lot soon.

Yes I thought that a while back when Joorabchian was pushing Hughes for the Chelsea job. My view is that no EPL supporters will really accept Tevez joining their team (apart from Bishop's Staufford getting him on loan).

Kia basically used to own Corinthians and I suspect he will finance most of the deal for them to purchase him and take his ownership rights. Tevez will press for a move to Corinthians. Corinthians dont have the money themselves to finance the purchase. They will almost certainly get a low pay deal as Tevez will know he can make out on the ownership rights in the future. Kia will probably finance it with much of the payment staggered. Then after a year he will resell back to Europe. In the best case scenario he will find Hughes a job somewhere and get him to be the buyer.

[Abrak]

Isn't it glaringly obvious Henderson shouldn't be playing wide?

I have just been looking into this.

I agree he should'nt be played wide but it is debatable how wide he is being played at the moment.

To a degree now that Johnson has returned in he has dropped in very narrow to Lucas allowing Johnson from right-back to surge up the wing now that he is back in the squad.

You can see that here with the heat map.

26 is Adam

14 is Henderson

21 is Lucas

(I dont really understand formations - this is 4,4,2 - for instance and it is hard to fathom. (Actually I believe in modern foootball nowadays teams set up with say a fixed formation at the start of the whistle with absolutely no intention of actually playing to it.) In reality I think we need a 'poacher' upfront (is that called a 4,3,3). It is not Carroll because he is always at least 5 and often 10 yards behind Suarez, Kuyt in my view has gone off the boil and Bellamy has not had the chance.)

[mrbojangles]

Well said Kenny. He has made many a good point in this article, in particular about the League wanting the comp to be taken seriously and then forcing clubs to play matches this close together and so will probably have to play youth players.

http://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/2920/league-cup/2011/11/10/2750890/liverpool-manager-kenny-dalglish-criticises-league-cup-game

Liverpool manager Kenny Dalglish criticises League Cup game at Chelsea just 48 hours after Manchester City showdown

Liverpool manager Kenny Dalglish is furious that his side will have to play a League Cup quarter-final away to Chelsea just 48 hours after facing Manchester City at home in the Premier League.

A rally by the Trades Union Congress (TUC) has led police to advise that the cup game not be played on Wednesday 30 November, so the fixture has been moved forward a day.

“It is disgraceful in this day and age that players are being asked to play a key Premier League game and then a League Cup quarter-final in London just 48 hours later,” Dalglish told the club’s official website.

“It's understandable with the Spurs v PAOK Salonika match and the TUC rally that the Met Police have said that our game cannot be played on the Wednesday. But it's surely the duty of the football authorities to think of other solutions which consider the welfare of the players and this clearly hasn't happened.

“Manchester City are in a similar position to us with their game at Arsenal and it's for them to argue their case, but it is my job to stand up for the interests of Liverpool Football Club.

“Here you have two clubs who have treated this competition with the utmost respect over the years and they are being treated like this.

“I'd be interested to know what the sponsors think of the situation and what it does for the reputation of the competition.

“It seems totally irresponsible as well that the quarter-finals are scheduled in the same week as Europa League games.

“If Stoke had beaten us in the last round and were through to face Chelsea then the tie gets rescheduled for another date - it's as simple as that. But when we ask the Football League to move our game to a later date, we're told it's impossible. Where's the logic in that?

“What would have happened if all four of the English clubs playing in the Europa League had got through to the quarter-finals?

“If the Football League want to devalue their own competition, that's up to them, but they shouldn't then be upset if people use these games to help in the development of young players.

“We've also got the situation that both ourselves and Manchester City were happy for the league game to be moved back to the Saturday so we both had proper time to prepare, but again we are told by the Premier League that this is not possible either for TV reasons and just to get on with it.”

Dalglish had a warning for Reds fans who might be thinking of buying a ticket for the Chelsea match.

“The one thing I will say to our fans is to think carefully before buying tickets for the League Cup game because we do not want them spending their money and then we decide there is no other option but to use only young players in the tie,” said the Scot.

[SantiSuk]

Must be struggling if he intends to field the same side that would play in an important EPL game in that waste of space Milk Cup. All phases up to the semis should be relabelled the Youth Team Tryout Cup.

[if we all stopped watching it just because it's 'our team' playing maybe it would go away. There's too much football played these days IMO. I didn't watch a single Arsenal game in the dam_n thing last year apart from 20 minutes of the final before flying. Must admit I watched one replay this year because we had a lot of new boys like Wade-Chamberlain trying out]

Edited November 10, 2011 by SantiSuk

[Jimjim]

Well said Kenny. He has made many a good point in this article, in particular about the League wanting the comp to be taken seriously and then forcing clubs to play matches this close together and so will probably have to play youth players.

Totally agree with that, mrbojangles. It's nonsense, really, and sucks that it's basically come down to the decision of Sky. Anyone with a brain knows that the reason footballers get so much money is because of TV but c'mon, 48 hours rest between two huge matches for both Man City and Liverpool is bonkers.

Don't think this C. Cup is a waste of space, either, especially for teams not in Europe. If you're in Europe you have 4 chances at a trophy but not in it you have 3 chances, so it obviously makes it a bigger chance at a trophy for Liverpool.

I think Man City are better equipped to deal with this situation, however, having a deeper squad, in my opinion. Both clubs will definitely have to make several changes, for sure.

I don't think you'll find any fans that got to go to a Carling Cup final and see their team win complaining about it. It may be the lesser of the 3 domestic comps, but it's still silverware and it's a chance to win something. For Liverpool fans, it's been far too long since seeing Stevie G. lift the FA Cup trophy in 2006.

Troll away about Liverpool not winning any cups for 5 years...

[Abrak]

Luis Suarez hitting some form for Uruguay. Scoring 4 in a 4-0 win over Chile.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GUpHvRYIfk

The goals are pretty good but the commentating is superb.

[alfieconn]

Luis Suarez hitting some form for Uruguay. Scoring 4 in a 4-0 win over Chile.

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=0GUpHvRYIfk

The goals are pretty good but the commentating is superb.

I think this just confirms what Carmines been saying, that you are a one man team

[smokie36]

Luis Suarez hitting some form for Uruguay. Scoring 4 in a 4-0 win over Chile.

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=0GUpHvRYIfk

The goals are pretty good but the commentating is superb.

I think this just confirms what Carmines been saying, that you are a one man team

We've clubbed together over on the Spurs thread and bought this to keep your £35m warm....

Edited November 12, 2011 by smokie36

[Thaddeus]

Luis Suarez hitting some form for Uruguay. Scoring 4 in a 4-0 win over Chile.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GUpHvRYIfk

The goals are pretty good but the commentating is superb.

Brilliant..... could he give John Motson some help.

[carmine]

Luis Suarez hitting some form for Uruguay. Scoring 4 in a 4-0 win over Chile.

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=0GUpHvRYIfk

The goals are pretty good but the commentating is superb.

I think this just confirms what Carmines been saying, that you are a one man team

Yes alfredo, and i also gave stevie a perfect example of Suarez up to no good and i've noticed that he's conspicuous by his absense. I think this lot are ignoring me!

On a Liverpuddle related side issue, whilst Johnson had a very decent game last night, do you really think he's a better all round right back than Kyle Walker? I don't, and don't understand why Capello doesn't go with the future which is obviously 21 year old Walker.

Now stop sulking on here and lets have some debate......

[Devil]

Thought this was worth a read if your a red.

Andy Carroll Prime Target!

Link tomkins times

[Jimjim]

Wasn't too pleased to read this today:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/15764900.stm

And the LFC statement:

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/latest-news/lfc-issue-suarez-statement

[carmine]

Thought this was worth a read if your a red.

Andy Carroll Prime Target!

Link tomkins times

And yes, he's still <deleted>. Possibily the worst financial transaction by Comilli in the history of premier league football. Add to that Adam and the amount spent on Henderson you can understand why Levy kicked him out and he is loathed at White Hart Lane.

[alfieconn]

Thought this was worth a read if your a red.

Andy Carroll Prime Target!

Link tomkins times

And yes, he's still <deleted>. Possibily the worst financial transaction by Comilli in the history of premier league football. Add to that Adam and the amount spent on Henderson you can understand why Levy kicked him out and he is loathed at White Hart Lane.

He might be shit carms but he's got potential

Footnote : did abrak write that report cos thats the sort of baloney he comes out with you know baffle them with science hoping people actually believe whats he's saying