Any Legal Issues With Casually Helping A Friend With English For No Money?

[Neeranam]

Are there any possible legal issues with this, work permit wise? Visa issues (for retirement visa/no work rule)?

technically you would need a WP, but if no one says anything you should be ok, so I would be suggesting to your aquaintance to keep their mouth shut about what you are doing

This is wrong. It's not work, so you don't need a work permit. I help friends all the time, and they help me. That's a normal part for socialising. It's certainly not work. Obviously there's a grey area between help and work, but stop overthinking these things. No-one cares if you help a friend with grammar. We'd all have to sit home alone frightened to talk to anyone if we needed a WP to talk to a friend.

Get some common sense into this debate. Immigration aren't out to get people for helping friends.

Jeez.

dj, if you think there is an ounce of common sense in Thai immigration and labor laws then you have not been in Thailand for very long.

Firstly, you need to remove the word "volunteer" or "not being paid" from the discussion, as this is completely irrelevant. Technically speaking the OP is working as per Thai law, but as pointed out it is very, very unlikely they will run into any problems. After meeting dozens of foreigners in Thailand that work at home without getting a WP or business visa, it is clear to me that this is the norm. Very few people have problems, but remember that if the police receive a complaint, they must act. This also happens a lot. Imagine the OP sitting at the table teaching English to the friend and the police (immigration, labor, whoever) walk in. The burden of proof will be on him. Yes, he may be able to explain his way out of it, but it will mean going down to the police station for several hours and may require a small donation of tea money. This also happens. An acquaintance of mine was just arrested for picking up ciggy butts outside his establishment. He has a WP as managing director. Where is the "common sense" in that?

Phuket Gazette's website is down but when it goes back up I will post some responses from immigration and labor about questions just like these. The responses were very interesting.

Phuket is very different from the real Thailand.

[churchill]

I was told by immigration that as I had a marriage visa I did not need a work permit ......

[oops]

To me this is like asking if you help someone on the street speak English do I need a work permit.

This is really an anal question. Please don't go anywhere because if you do you are most likely

indirectly employing someone therefor your in business and should require a business license.

Edited May 3, 2013 by oops

[Tatsujin]

Going back to the original question:

Any Legal Issues With Casually Helping A Friend With English For No Money?

Simply, yes, you need a Work Permit to comply with Thai Law.

The real question however, is:

Will I get caught or in trouble if I work illegally?

The answer to this is very unlikely. But it does happen. So know the law, then make your own choices as to whether to abide by it.

[sandgroper3]

Going back to the original question:

Any Legal Issues With Casually Helping A Friend With English For No Money?

Simply, yes, you need a Work Permit to comply with Thai Law.

The real question however, is:

Will I get caught or in trouble if I work illegally?

The answer to this is very unlikely. But it does happen. So know the law, then make your own choices as to whether to abide by it.

after reading this topic i can get into trouble by< Cigarette making by hand> rolling my own cigarettes i will have to smoke tailor made then

[sausageandmash]

I think this post may be a wind-up, judging by the fact that the poster is a senior member and not a newbie, fresh off the plane.

A large percentage of white guys are doing some kind of work here illegally, whether it's topping up their income with language school work or selling goods online. Unless you have an extremely well-paid international school job or you work for an embassy, that's just the way things are here.

I really think this poster is either looking for a reaction or is extremely bored.

[Jingthing]

I think this post may be a wind-up, judging by the fact that the poster is a senior member and not a newbie, fresh off the plane.

...

You would be wrong.

[Jingthing]

if i can't go to a hospital and volunteer to hold babies that are either sick or have been abandoned without a work permit, I wouldn't think you could volunteer helping someone else. If they won't let you help a Thai for free why would they let you help someone who is not Thai for free?

Because I am talking about a private matter between two people, again with no money involved, not a visible thing in a public institution. Why does it matter that the person isn't a Thai?

[uty6543]

Are there any possible legal issues with this, work permit wise? Visa issues (for retirement visa/no work rule)?

technically you would need a WP, but if no one says anything you should be ok, so I would be suggesting to your aquaintance to keep their mouth shut about what you are doing

This is wrong. It's not work, so you don't need a work permit. I help friends all the time, and they help me. That's a normal part for socialising. It's certainly not work. Obviously there's a grey area between help and work, but stop overthinking these things. No-one cares if you help a friend with grammar. We'd all have to sit home alone frightened to talk to anyone if we needed a WP to talk to a friend.

Get some common sense into this debate. Immigration aren't out to get people for helping friends.

Jeez.

Talking to someone is consulting, by the legal definition it is absolutely 100% work

and so is brushing your teeth and having sex with your wife.

if i lie still and let my wife do the work is that still work

[Tatsujin]

Are there any possible legal issues with this, work permit wise? Visa issues (for retirement visa/no work rule)?

technically you would need a WP, but if no one says anything you should be ok, so I would be suggesting to your aquaintance to keep their mouth shut about what you are doing

This is wrong. It's not work, so you don't need a work permit. I help friends all the time, and they help me. That's a normal part for socialising. It's certainly not work. Obviously there's a grey area between help and work, but stop overthinking these things. No-one cares if you help a friend with grammar. We'd all have to sit home alone frightened to talk to anyone if we needed a WP to talk to a friend.

Get some common sense into this debate. Immigration aren't out to get people for helping friends.

Jeez.

Talking to someone is consulting, by the legal definition it is absolutely 100% work

and so is brushing your teeth and having sex with your wife.

if i lie still and let my wife do the work is that still work

That's what I do with her . . . but I'm lazy . . .

[rct99q]

I was told by immigration that as I had a marriage visa I did not need a work permit ......

Wrong. You need a work permit.

edit - unless you have a Thai ID Card or Passport

Edited May 3, 2013 by rct99q

[SteeleJoe]

A large percentage of white guys are doing some kind of work here illegally, whether it's topping up their income with language school work or selling goods online. Unless you have an extremely well-paid international school job or you work for an embassy, that's just the way things are here.

Uhmm..no. The first part is no doubt true but you've left out the thousands who are working legally in many jobs other than the two types you have specified (a vast array of companies - some partly owned by the foreigner in question, hotels, and schools - that are NOT International or all that well paid - come with work permits ).

I'm guessing that perhaps you haven't been here long and/or are a teacher with a social circle limited to your colleagues - and there is nothing wrong with that at all, of course - but you shouldn't assume that this the entirety of the expat experience.

Edited May 3, 2013 by SteeleJoe

[Just1Voice]

I'll not specify what I have or haven't done - you never know if "Big Brother" is watching, but will ask if anyone remembers the guy who was arrested last year and charged for "illegally working" because he got up and sang in a KARAOE BAR??

Ok, so the cop was bored, drunk, or having a really bad night, but the point is that the BiB can pretty much interpret the law the way they want. Then it's up to you to figure out how to get out of it.

In your home, doors closed, not open to the public, I wouldn't sweat it.

[keithkarmann]

I am planning on building a house and need to be hands on as I can't trust anyone to build it as I want it built.I do plan on using local Thai labour for the hard work as I believe it is a good idea to keep well in with the locals.

The questions I have are: Do I need a work permit to work on building my own house? If I do need a work permit: How easy is it to get a work permit and what is the cost?

[Kilgore Trout]

I am planning on building a house and need to be hands on as I can't trust anyone to build it as I want it built.I do plan on using local Thai labour for the hard work as I believe it is a good idea to keep well in with the locals.

The questions I have are: Do I need a work permit to work on building my own house? If I do need a work permit: How easy is it to get a work permit and what is the cost?

Legally yes you do need a work permit

No, you cannot get one, construction is a thai only protected profession

[luckyluke]

^

See post 45,

According to the letter of the law you can't, neither will you receive a W.P.

[Mudcrab]

English... meetings to help with usage and pronunciation

yo sho will be put in the slammer JT. not for lack of a work permit but for the fraudulous claim "English".

It would have to be on a volunteer basis....you couldn't charge for that!!!!!

[keithkarmann]

I am planning on building a house and need to be hands on as I can't trust anyone to build it as I want it built.I do plan on using local Thai labour for the hard work as I believe it is a good idea to keep well in with the locals.

The questions I have are: Do I need a work permit to work on building my own house? If I do need a work permit: How easy is it to get a work permit and what is the cost?

Legally yes you do need a work permit

No, you cannot get one, construction is a thai only protected profession

Thanks for that,I guess I will just have to direct the Thai workers and watch over them (sitting by the fan) all the time as I have heard many reports of instructing workers to do something in a certain way and they do the opposite. As a matter of interest do all the Myanmar workers building houses here in Thailand have work permits?

[Mudcrab]

If two people where talking in English,with no note books or pens and pencils were in view,and one was verbally correcting the other,and occasionally introducing some new words,it would be a clever man who could prove one of the two was working,and not just having a conversation in English.

It doesn't need a clever man. It just needs 1 x Thai official who can twist the laws to suit themselves. "Work" is so poorly defined it can encompass anything they want it to.

But hey, each to their own. Being ignorant of the law here is no defense.

or anywhere else.......it begs the question (definition of work that is).....if I drive the missus to the shop...am I working as an unpaid taxi driver...... hmmmm?

[Kilgore Trout]

I am planning on building a house and need to be hands on as I can't trust anyone to build it as I want it built.I do plan on using local Thai labour for the hard work as I believe it is a good idea to keep well in with the locals.

The questions I have are: Do I need a work permit to work on building my own house? If I do need a work permit: How easy is it to get a work permit and what is the cost?

Legally yes you do need a work permit

No, you cannot get one, construction is a thai only protected profession

Thanks for that,I guess I will just have to direct the Thai workers and watch over them (sitting by the fan) all the time as I have heard many reports of instructing workers to do something in a certain way and they do the opposite. As a matter of interest do all the Myanmar workers building houses here in Thailand have work permits?

Probably be your best bet, do as much as you can, I'm sure thats got to be frustrating.

Good question about myanmar workers; some are legal many are not; keep in mind they are being exploited by people with connections, but they do get rounded up occasionaly, same for Cambodians and Laotians.

[dunque]

Are there any possible legal issues with this, work permit wise? Visa issues (for retirement visa/no work rule)?

technically you would need a WP, but if no one says anything you should be ok, so I would be suggesting to your aquaintance to keep their mouth shut about what you are doing

This is wrong. It's not work, so you don't need a work permit. I help friends all the time, and they help me. That's a normal part for socialising. It's certainly not work. Obviously there's a grey area between help and work, but stop overthinking these things. No-one cares if you help a friend with grammar. We'd all have to sit home alone frightened to talk to anyone if we needed a WP to talk to a friend.

Get some common sense into this debate. Immigration aren't out to get people for helping friends.

Jeez.

Talking to someone is consulting, by the legal definition it is absolutely 100% work

and so is brushing your teeth and having sex with your wife.

I hope, for the sake of Mr Trout, that you meant 'one's wife'.

[belg]

2012 and we still have these backwards laws to show us every day: YOU ARE ONLY A GUEST

thai people are the smartest in the world and the best and most handsum and everything .. why would they need farang that want to volunteer for free.... i guess it does not make sense

and i can see that when i go for my daily walks... as i walk by, the labour people cutting grass, trimming trees, cleaning the street, mostly think: there goes the crazy farang, walking in the sun with no purpose.... they have to sweat in the sun for a living and farang can just go for a walk, swim, gym, whenever they want ....

Edited May 3, 2013 by belg

[MAJIC]

If two people where talking in English,with no note books or pens and pencils were in view,and one was verbally correcting the other,and occasionally introducing some new words,it would be a clever man who could prove one of the two was working,and not just having a conversation in English.

It doesn't need a clever man. It just needs 1 x Thai official who can twist the laws to suit themselves. "Work" is so poorly defined it can encompass anything they want it to.

But hey, each to their own. Being ignorant of the law here is no defense.

or anywhere else.......it begs the question (definition of work that is).....if I drive the missus to the shop...am I working as an unpaid taxi driver...... hmmmm?

No, the missus is not counted as a Taxi fare,it's the other Ten passengers + that think you are a free Taxi Driver.

[Jingthing]

Honestly I'm not sure how to process all this.

If I tell the requester sorry no for work permit reasons, I reckon he'll think that's a very lame excuse.

[Haydn]

I used to teach English as an unpaid volunteer but was reported three times by falanges to the police for teaching without a work permit. One had been a headmaster of a boy's school but there had been questions so he came to Pattaya, another had taken a TEFL course but was usually found in a Bar finishing off the night at 8am. Fortunately my Thai friends supported me with the police but it cost me a bottle of black label each time.

[bangon04]

I'll ask the father of one of my students the next time I'm at her house. He's in the Royal Thai Police - in charge of 7 provinces, he'll surely know.

If anyone has, in fact been arrested for working without a work permit it will be because they have upset someone with a bit of influence.

and that seems to be the important point - don't be too obvious and upset anyone who is in a position to make trouble for you. If you open a market stall and your Thai neighbour sees you are more successful than he is, then you are looking for trouble.

It's not that the laws are enforced very efficiently, it's just that the laws can be used by Thais against foreigners whenever it suits them.

[dao16]

Just have some beers and have the guy bring a notebook to write things down, etc. Or, just tell him how to pronounce things. You are just two people having a beer and talking about language and culture. If that is work, then I worked last night until 3AM at 3 (maybe 4?) different bars.

[Docno]

Wow - now you have me worried. I've helped plant and harvest rice on my gf's farm before (to the amusement of the Thai hired labour) each time while on a tourist pass. Will have to delete those photos and hope those workers don't give up to the coppers...

[NomadJoe]

Are there any possible legal issues with this, work permit wise? Visa issues (for retirement visa/no work rule)?

technically you would need a WP, but if no one says anything you should be ok, so I would be suggesting to your aquaintance to keep their mouth shut about what you are doing

This is wrong. It's not work, so you don't need a work permit. I help friends all the time, and they help me. That's a normal part for socialising. It's certainly not work. Obviously there's a grey area between help and work, but stop overthinking these things. No-one cares if you help a friend with grammar. We'd all have to sit home alone frightened to talk to anyone if we needed a WP to talk to a friend.

Get some common sense into this debate. Immigration aren't out to get people for helping friends.

Jeez.

dj, if you think there is an ounce of common sense in Thai immigration and labor laws then you have not been in Thailand for very long.

Firstly, you need to remove the word "volunteer" or "not being paid" from the discussion, as this is completely irrelevant. Technically speaking the OP is working as per Thai law, but as pointed out it is very, very unlikely they will run into any problems. After meeting dozens of foreigners in Thailand that work at home without getting a WP or business visa, it is clear to me that this is the norm. Very few people have problems, but remember that if the police receive a complaint, they must act. This also happens a lot. Imagine the OP sitting at the table teaching English to the friend and the police (immigration, labor, whoever) walk in. The burden of proof will be on him. Yes, he may be able to explain his way out of it, but it will mean going down to the police station for several hours and may require a small donation of tea money. This also happens. An acquaintance of mine was just arrested for picking up ciggy butts outside his establishment. He has a WP as managing director. Where is the "common sense" in that?

Phuket Gazette's website is down but when it goes back up I will post some responses from immigration and labor about questions just like these. The responses were very interesting.

Phuket is very different from the real Thailand.

Rubbish. Thai laws are nation wide and do not change from province to province. How and whether they are enforced varies wildly but that doesn't matter here as pretty much everyone is in agreement that according to Thai law the OP would need a WP, but in reality there is very little chance of running into a problem unless someone reported him, so I wouldn't worry about it too much.

Incidentally, a Russian girl (actually from a former Soviet eastern bloc country but same same) whom I suggested be careful about working illegally in Phuket just a couple weeks ago was arrested yesterday. That makes 2 people I know in a matter of two weeks. I am keeping my WP close by and looking over my shoulder when I help out the Thai staff.

Here are the issue and answers I promised in the earlier post. All have bits that are relevant to Jing's question.

Does an unpaid volunteer need a work permit to teach?

I was told that it is illegal to work without a permit in Thailand, even if it were for no pay.

I was asked by some Thai friends to help them with their English by giving them some lessons in the evenings. I was told that even this was not allowed, even though I am not being paid for it. Is this true?

Jackie Kam, Malaysia Thursday, July 29, 2010 2:15:45 PM

“You are not allowed to do any job in Thailand without a work permit, even if you are not being paid for it.

If you work as a volunteer, your organization will need to apply for a work permit for you.

For more information, please come by the PPEO at 38/27 Rattanakosin 200 Pi Road at Saphan Hin in Phuket Town or call 076-219660 ext 13.”

Thursday, July 29, 2010 2:15:45 PM An officer at the Phuket Provincial Employment Office (PPEO), Work Permit section

Do I need a work permit to sit on my condo committee?

I am a Patong condo owner and hold a long-term retirement visa extension. Do I need a work permit to sit on my condo committee?

I can find nothing in the online Condominium Act of 2008 that says it is a prerequisite to sit on such a committee, only that you must be an owner.

Jim Mills, Patong Monday, August 27, 2012 12:19:03 PM

“Whether or not you will need a work permit depends on whether your intended activity actually qualifies as work under the Employment Department's existing definition.

Normally, being on a committee involves attending meetings to make decisions and signing papers. In this case, you would need a work permit.

If you want to apply for a work permit you must be in possession of a non-immigrant "B" visa.

You can not use your retirement visa to apply.

You can visit the Phuket Employment Office at 38/27 Rattanakosin 200 Pi Road during normal office hours: Monday to Friday, 8:30am to 4:30pm, or call 076-219660 or 076-219661 ext. 13.” Monday, August 27, 2012 12:19:03 PM Phuket Employment Office, Work Permit Division chief Jeeraphan Sookhwan.

Do I need a work permit to give horse riding lessons?

I have repeatedly called the number recently given out for the work permit department: 076-219660-1

The female officer answering the phone has been most unprofessional and can barely speak English. The work permit department is for foreigners, correct?

She puts one on interminable hold by loudly placing the the phone where one can hear the giggling remarks about Caucasians.

A young man who called himself “Khun Boy, who I have been able to get through to, instructed me to send an email to his private Hotmail address, but for two weeks now it has yet to be answered.

I simply want to know if it is possible to be issued a work permit to teach riding with my personal horse on a freelance basis without having to start a company.

I already reside here on a non-immigrant B Investor visa.

I cannot find a Thai I trust enough to have 51 per cent control of my money as a legal company would entail. So, can I start a business as a sole proprietor?

Queries to “attorneys” have resulted in a completely different answer in each case.

May I also ask: Are expat actors in neighborhood playhouses required to start companies to get work permits? Belly dance teachers? Yoga instructors? Moderators on discussion forums? Bloggers? IT fixers?

What about growing fruit for personal consumption?

I’d say the Phuket Gazette classified ads are full of foreigners advertising their services, but the ads do not specifically say they have a work permit.

Is this allowed?

Why not make a provision and adopt a freelance permit and a system for legally taxing residing foreigners who are not criminals so they can pass on their knowledge?

Thalang Friday, April 1, 2011 4:24:26 PM

“In general, foreigners who want to work without forming their own company can apply for a freelance work permit, but I cannot say exactly which types of work will be approved and which will not.

However, just for example, artists, artisans, singers, musicians, technicians, reporters, among others, are some of the types of workers who are usually allowed to work on a self-employed basis.

They need to file the application form and show us “relevant documents” and we will consider approval case-by-case.

If your request is approved, it would be only temporarily, until we can check your tax payment history when you renew your work permit.

For a work permit for horse riding lessons, prepare whatever relevant documents you have, such as any licenses or permits proving you own the horse, photos and details of where the horse is stabled, a plan of which customers you intend to serve, details of the location where you will conduct your lessons and so on. Come in to the office in person to talk with us.

And, if you find any foreigners working without a permit, please let us know by letter or fax.

We will investigate and prosecute any person found breaking the law.

Please call our work permit division for more information at 076-219660-1 ext13 and ask specifically for Khun Boy.

He is the officer who can offer basic information in English and Chinese.” Friday, April 1, 2011 4:24:26 PM Noppadol Ployudee, Phuket Provincial Employment Office chief

Do I need a ‘business visa’ to work online?

Is earning money through online advertising, website affiliate marketing or operating a business that has only an online presence whilst staying in Thailand considered working? Would that person be required to have a “business visa”?

Ting Tong Farang, Phuket Town Thursday, November 25, 2010 3:56:43 PM

“Any foreigners working or starting a business in Thailand, online or off, need to first get a proper visa.

They can apply for a Non-Immigrant B visa at a Royal Thai Embassy in their home country.

Once they get it they can come to Thailand and apply for a work permit with the Department of Employment.

If we find out that a foreigner is doing business online without a work permit, we will arrest them and take legal action through the court.”

Thursday, November 25, 2010 3:56:43 PM Pol Col Panuwat Ruamrak, Superintendent of Phuket Immigration

“Doing business online is considered a type of work, so foreigners are required to have a work permit to do so.

The first thing to do is get the proper business visa. Foreigners with any other type of visa generally cannot apply for a work permit.

An exception to that rule is made for foreigners legally married to Thai citizens.

For more information on the visas and documents required to apply for a work permit, we advise foreigners to contact us or the Department of Employment in the area they live.

We need detailed information from the foreigner before advising on further action.

Please call Phuket Department of Employment at 076-219660-1 ext 13 for further information.”

Thursday, November 25, 2010 3:56:43 PM Somkiat Baiadul, an officer at the work permit division of the Phuket Department of Employment

Source: phuketgazette.net; Issues and Answers section.

Edited May 3, 2013 by NomadJoe

[Tatsujin]

Are there any possible legal issues with this, work permit wise? Visa issues (for retirement visa/no work rule)?

technically you would need a WP, but if no one says anything you should be ok, so I would be suggesting to your aquaintance to keep their mouth shut about what you are doing

This is wrong. It's not work, so you don't need a work permit. I help friends all the time, and they help me. That's a normal part for socialising. It's certainly not work. Obviously there's a grey area between help and work, but stop overthinking these things. No-one cares if you help a friend with grammar. We'd all have to sit home alone frightened to talk to anyone if we needed a WP to talk to a friend.

Get some common sense into this debate. Immigration aren't out to get people for helping friends.

Jeez.

dj, if you think there is an ounce of common sense in Thai immigration and labor laws then you have not been in Thailand for very long.

Firstly, you need to remove the word "volunteer" or "not being paid" from the discussion, as this is completely irrelevant. Technically speaking the OP is working as per Thai law, but as pointed out it is very, very unlikely they will run into any problems. After meeting dozens of foreigners in Thailand that work at home without getting a WP or business visa, it is clear to me that this is the norm. Very few people have problems, but remember that if the police receive a complaint, they must act. This also happens a lot. Imagine the OP sitting at the table teaching English to the friend and the police (immigration, labor, whoever) walk in. The burden of proof will be on him. Yes, he may be able to explain his way out of it, but it will mean going down to the police station for several hours and may require a small donation of tea money. This also happens. An acquaintance of mine was just arrested for picking up ciggy butts outside his establishment. He has a WP as managing director. Where is the "common sense" in that?

Phuket Gazette's website is down but when it goes back up I will post some responses from immigration and labor about questions just like these. The responses were very interesting.

Phuket is very different from the real Thailand.

Rubbish. Thai laws are nation wide and do not change from province to province. How and whether they are enforced varies wildly but that doesn't matter here as pretty much everyone is in agreement that according to Thai law the OP would need a WP, but in reality there is very little chance of running into a problem unless someone reported him, so I wouldn't worry about it too much.

Incidentally, a Russian girl (actually from a former Soviet eastern bloc country but same same) whom I suggested be careful about working illegally in Phuket just a couple weeks ago was arrested yesterday. That makes 2 people I know in a matter of two weeks. I am keeping my WP close by and looking over my shoulder when I help out the Thai staff.

Here are the issue and answers I promised in the earlier post. All have bits that are relevant to Jing's question.

Does an unpaid volunteer need a work permit to teach?

I was told that it is illegal to work without a permit in Thailand, even if it were for no pay.

I was asked by some Thai friends to help them with their English by giving them some lessons in the evenings. I was told that even this was not allowed, even though I am not being paid for it. Is this true? Jackie Kam, Malaysia Thursday, July 29, 2010 2:15:45 PM You are not allowed to do any job in Thailand without a work permit, even if you are not being paid for it.

If you work as a volunteer, your organization will need to apply for a work permit for you.

For more information, please come by the PPEO at 38/27 Rattanakosin 200 Pi Road at Saphan Hin in Phuket Town or call 076-219660 ext 13. Thursday, July 29, 2010 2:15:45 PM An officer at the Phuket Provincial Employment Office (PPEO), Work Permit section

Do I need a work permit to sit on my condo committee?

I am a Patong condo owner and hold a long-term retirement visa extension. Do I need a work permit to sit on my condo committee?

I can find nothing in the online Condominium Act of 2008 that says it is a prerequisite to sit on such a committee, only that you must be an owner. Jim Mills, Patong Monday, August 27, 2012 12:19:03 PM Whether or not you will need a work permit depends on whether your intended activity actually qualifies as work under the Employment Department's existing definition.

Normally, being on a committee involves attending meetings to make decisions and signing papers. In this case, you would need a work permit.

If you want to apply for a work permit you must be in possession of a non-immigrant "B" visa.

You can not use your retirement visa to apply.

You can visit the Phuket Employment Office at 38/27 Rattanakosin 200 Pi Road during normal office hours: Monday to Friday, 8:30am to 4:30pm, or call 076-219660 or 076-219661 ext. 13. Monday, August 27, 2012 12:19:03 PM Phuket Employment Office, Work Permit Division chief Jeeraphan Sookhwan.

Do I need a work permit to give horse riding lessons?

I have repeatedly called the number recently given out for the work permit department: 076-219660-1

The female officer answering the phone has been most unprofessional and can barely speak English. The work permit department is for foreigners, correct?

She puts one on interminable hold by loudly placing the the phone where one can hear the giggling remarks about Caucasians.

A young man who called himself Khun Boy, who I have been able to get through to, instructed me to send an email to his private Hotmail address, but for two weeks now it has yet to be answered.

I simply want to know if it is possible to be issued a work permit to teach riding with my personal horse on a freelance basis without having to start a company.

I already reside here on a non-immigrant B Investor visa.

I cannot find a Thai I trust enough to have 51 per cent control of my money as a legal company would entail. So, can I start a business as a sole proprietor?

Queries to attorneys have resulted in a completely different answer in each case.

May I also ask: Are expat actors in neighborhood playhouses required to start companies to get work permits? Belly dance teachers? Yoga instructors? Moderators on discussion forums? Bloggers? IT fixers?

What about growing fruit for personal consumption?

Id say the Phuket Gazette classified ads are full of foreigners advertising their services, but the ads do not specifically say they have a work permit.

Is this allowed?

Why not make a provision and adopt a freelance permit and a system for legally taxing residing foreigners who are not criminals so they can pass on their knowledge? Thalang Friday, April 1, 2011 4:24:26 PM In general, foreigners who want to work without forming their own company can apply for a freelance work permit, but I cannot say exactly which types of work will be approved and which will not.

However, just for example, artists, artisans, singers, musicians, technicians, reporters, among others, are some of the types of workers who are usually allowed to work on a self-employed basis.

They need to file the application form and show us relevant documents and we will consider approval case-by-case.

If your request is approved, it would be only temporarily, until we can check your tax payment history when you renew your work permit.

For a work permit for horse riding lessons, prepare whatever relevant documents you have, such as any licenses or permits proving you own the horse, photos and details of where the horse is stabled, a plan of which customers you intend to serve, details of the location where you will conduct your lessons and so on. Come in to the office in person to talk with us.

And, if you find any foreigners working without a permit, please let us know by letter or fax.

We will investigate and prosecute any person found breaking the law.

Please call our work permit division for more information at 076-219660-1 ext13 and ask specifically for Khun Boy.

He is the officer who can offer basic information in English and Chinese. Friday, April 1, 2011 4:24:26 PM Noppadol Ployudee, Phuket Provincial Employment Office chief

Do I need a business visa to work online?

Is earning money through online advertising, website affiliate marketing or operating a business that has only an online presence whilst staying in Thailand considered working? Would that person be required to have a business visa? Ting Tong Farang, Phuket Town Thursday, November 25, 2010 3:56:43 PM Any foreigners working or starting a business in Thailand, online or off, need to first get a proper visa.

They can apply for a Non-Immigrant B visa at a Royal Thai Embassy in their home country.

Once they get it they can come to Thailand and apply for a work permit with the Department of Employment.

If we find out that a foreigner is doing business online without a work permit, we will arrest them and take legal action through the court. Thursday, November 25, 2010 3:56:43 PM Pol Col Panuwat Ruamrak, Superintendent of Phuket Immigration

Doing business online is considered a type of work, so foreigners are required to have a work permit to do so.

The first thing to do is get the proper business visa. Foreigners with any other type of visa generally cannot apply for a work permit.

An exception to that rule is made for foreigners legally married to Thai citizens.

For more information on the visas and documents required to apply for a work permit, we advise foreigners to contact us or the Department of Employment in the area they live.

We need detailed information from the foreigner before advising on further action.

Please call Phuket Department of Employment at 076-219660-1 ext 13 for further information. Thursday, November 25, 2010 3:56:43 PM Somkiat Baiadul, an officer at the work permit division of the Phuket Department of Employment

Source: phuketgazette.net; Issues and Answers section.

Nicely summed up. That pretty much covers the topic now. Including "online" work.