Extreme Amount Of Calories In Fast Food Pizza

[Tolley]

Here's the formula:

1. Good, consistent sleep. (Difficult sometimes if you're sensitive to noise here in Thailand)

2. Weight lifting adds muscle and added muscle raises metabolism.

3. Don't starve yourself. Eat all you want, but make sure it's healthy. You'll be happier, and you body won't shift into starvation/preservation mode.

4. Cardio--at least 20-30 minutes and break a sweat into minute 6. Cardio continues to burn calories for a few hours after one finishes. Extended cardio doesn't do anything to burn calories. (I've seen many pum pui (for lack of a better term) women ride the cardio equipment from dusk to dawn with few results.

5. Don't go to the gym everyday and work the same areas. Work different areas each day. Rest worked areas every other day.

6. Lift correctly, or you'll hurt yourself. It doesn't matter how heavy. If you're lifting correctly, your body is going to respond positively. Nobody cares how much you lift anyway.

7. Eat whatever you want one night a week. It's give you something to look forward to, and you won't feel

8. Giving up potato chips, Snickers bars, and other junk food is just like quitting smoking. Sooner or later you don't even think about them.

9. Eat som tam.

10. A lot of excess weight is actually food collected in the bowel. Increasing intake of high fiber foods (kiwi, corn, brown rice, vegetables) and water will get things moving. You'll have lots more energy, and feeling better is just as good--if not better--than looking good. It'll give you positive reinforcement to stay on track.

11. Drink water regularly. Lack of energy is often due to dehydration. More energy means a more positive outlook.

12. Avoid 7/11.

13. Thai food is loaded with oil. A lot of people say cut the carbs. Not necessarily. Cut the simple, calorie vacant carbs (sugars), and definitely cut the fat. The body expends a lot of energy converting carbs into fat, but fat is usually stored immediately--especially if one is in starvation mode.

14. Metabolism is like a furnace. You work out and are active, you burn calories. In a blazing furnace, you can toss in a lot of fuel. Again--don't starve yourself. You can eat until you're full, and if you eat good food, you'll be okay. Your body craves what it needs, and eating junk food won't satisfy the craving but maintain it. If you eat good food, you will be satisfied and not feel like you have to eat more.

15. Forget mayo.

16. Pizza is actually lower calorie than most people think. Just don't get the meat toppings. Dolores pizza near McDonalds across from Lumphini Park has some of the best pizza I've had in Bangkok. And it's only 60 baht each with a wide variety of extra topping. The vendors are very nice.

17. Babies burn a lot of calories just lying in the crib. Why? They're active. Be more active. You'll be surprised how much better you look and feel.

18. Do not hurt yourself in the gym. If your joints hurt when you lift, you're lifting incorrectly. You can build muscle and bone, but you cannot build up tendons, joints, etc. Be very careful.

Okay...you've already stopped reading so I'll end it here.

Hope all are happier and healthier!

You have a lot of excellent points there. Reminds me of a restaurant I go to occasionally. Western food but the owner is particular about the quality of the food. (it shows in the price) also the cleanliness you can see it in his kitchens and rest rooms. He says you might not know the difference between quality food but your body will.

The one warning I would give if you are going to be doing weights do some research on the effects on your joints at an elderly age. Particularly the knees. every pound you put on adds six more pounds of pressure to the knee. Check the hips and shoulders also. I am of the belief that to many people work out with out thinking of the effect years down the road. Just looking for that instantaneous effect. I know I am but I don't expect to ever find it.

Very, very true about the joints and ligaments. You can't build them up. Bones & muscle, yes. So those who steroids--on top of the other negative affects--really mess up their bodies and will most likely experience a very painful middle age. I visited my doctor more than a few years ago, and he asked, "Are you on steroids?" The fact was I wasn't and his question was really flattering. But I was in the gym working out hard four days a week and following everything above. It was a 6-month run, and the results were good (though no six pack).

A year or two ago my doctor told me that people who live healthy lives and forego the weights (to a large extent) live longer, happier lives. He also said fitness is pretty boring. He's right. Sports is actually more fun.

The right diet will help with wear and tear on ligaments and joints up to a certain point of course.

An anti inflammatory diet including the following : Salmon , almonds , papaya, apples, broccoli, ginger are some of the good things you eat in this regard.

[seancbk]

Eating junk food a couple times a week on a diet ?

A proper diet is 1 cheat meal per week max, no alcohol etc.. weight lifting is a good start but it will never offset a bad diet.

I know, but I honestly thought that hard weight lifting 3 times a week would be enough. But clearly not if a fast food meal has 4000 calories!

You don't say what weight you are or what age, nor do we know what build you are etc....

But first of all weight training (the type you are probably doing) will build muscle and muscle weighs more than fat, so you will gain weight.

What are you concerned with? the number on the scales or what you look like in the mirror?

Secondly you said you've been on this 'diet' for only a month and a half...

Eating pizza and Coyote nachos a few times a week I'm surprised you have lost ANY weight.

I lost 12 Kgs in about 6 months last year.

I cut out ALL alcohol, all junk food, bread, full fat milk, soft drinks, sugar and anything else that would add empty calories or fat.

I made sure I was eating healthy and no more than 1800 calories a day, plus I swam several times a day for exercise.

My goal was to have a flat stomach by my 45 birthday and I did it :-)

However a year later and after being a bit slack this year, (not doing enough exercise mostly) I've put on 4.5 kgs and I'm back up to 77 kgs and the fat is showing around my mid section again :-(

Anyway, good luck with your attempts at weight loss, if you think you can do it by lifting weights and eating 2500 calories a day of junk food (any idea how many calories you are consuming in drinks?).

[laislica]

Well what a super thread, fantastic advice here.

Search www.mercola.com for high intensity interval training - it works.

It can be done with or without gym equipment, just using your own body.

When starting HIIT, do the 20 mins at the rate of one day on, next day rest.

Resting is as important as training, you must allow your body sufficient time to recover.

In a short time you will have increased the work load in the 20 min slot and one day on and one off will feel too much so change to one day on and two off.

After a couple of months you will have increased the work load to the point that you do one day on and 6 off.

Watch the video of Joe Mercola actually doing his work out and you will understand how this works.

As long as you eat healthily and avoid artificial stuff, all sugars and grains (and that is what booze is made from) and basically anything white - bread, potatoes, pasta etc.

You will lose fat, tone muscle and get ripped into the bargain.

I am 71, 5' 10" and used to be fat, like 95Kg+

Currently less than 74Kg and can even squeeze into 32" pants.

No way I will ever be ripped, never have been and don't want to.

I still have a bit of a gut but that will go since we moved back to Europe, cooler temperature, more walking, bicycle and gym kit available.

Good luck and as many have said here, don't worry too much about weight, measure your body with a tape measure, better yet with electronic fat callipers.

Great to hear that you are having so much success, best of luck that you continue with your changed lifestyle.

[1FinickyOne]

Saw a documentary on taking a group of like a dozen or more average people and training them to run a marathon - and most completed the task though the overweight did not lose more than a couple of pounds, which surprised them - it is calories and eating habits, though exercise is still good for you...

and besides, that pizza hut pizza is awful - when I have the pizza craving, I toast an English muffin, spread some tomato sauce and melt a little cheddar on top -

but sure, losing weight is not easy stuff.

[dsj]

If you are working out that much it is know that muscle weighs more than fat so if you only gain 1 kg but have gain muscle then I would say that you have lost weight. I have a weight problem as I have lost nearly 60kgs over the last 2 years, all I did was execercise more and cut out the pizza and KFC and get down on the carbs and fat.

[bri1guy]

Are you eating the whole Pizza?? A few slices is OK like someone said once a week, try staying away from Carbs after lunch it helps me.. Alcohol is very hard on me in Thailand but a beer gut is a sign of man hood I have been told..

[tropo]

Do you know about this ??

http://exercise.about.com/od/weightloss/f/gainingweight.htm

Yes, I am really not a noob. I was in great shape up until 2 years ago after some physical and mental challenges kept me inactive for a long time. As I wrote, I can tell I have added quite a lot of muscle mass (I am doing a 5x5 weight lifting program), but still I should lose weight imo. I must be eating too much honestly. But I will take the advice from that article and measure gut circumference too

Doing the 5x5 program I'm guessing that you're squatting and deadlifting? If you are, they can add inches to your gut as they develop the core muscles. Most strong squatters and deadlifters have big waistlines.

I know, someone with a small waistline (hi Rob! ) will tell you that this is not necessarily the case, but mostly it is. Some lucky individuals can be very strong on these lifts and still sport small midsections. There's a genetic variability.

[attento]

Eat less ! not difficult in theory, but a real problem for some people.

Doing more exercise can change fat to muscle, but not necessarily cause weight loss. Certainly not saying that more exercise is anything but good. Problem here is that doing more exercise tends to increase appetite.

Stating the obvious, but must consume less than daily energy requirements so that the body starts to metabolise reserves. IF you have a healthy diet now, dont need to cut out anything just eat less of it(ignore the diet 'experts' telling you to cut out this and that, because you wont be able to keep that up for ever).

Must learn to ignore hunger feelings. Dont worry, you wont starve to death.

Eat less, is the only sure way. Reduce portion size. But try to drink more water, less alcohol or sugary drinks.

Dont expect overnight results. It takes much longer to reduce weight safely, than to put it on.

Body weight is a reflection of life style. So, having lost weight, must permanently change life style or the old body will return !

Edited June 9, 2013 by attento

[vhartling]

Congrats on taking control of your health.

As someone else said diet is much more effective than exercise in losing weight. I highly recommend checking out the G.I. diet, particularly books by Rick Gallop, past president of the Ontario Heart and Stroke foundation. G.I. stands for glycemic index. He makes it very easy by classifying foods in a colour chart - green, yellow and red. You can eat all you want of the foods in the green column, add foods in the yellow column once you have achieved your desired weight and never eat foods in the red column. It is surprising how quickly you can remember what foods are in the green column. I thought that I knew what a healthy diet was but I was surprised at what I learnt from reading his books. You will never be hungry on this diet, you don't have to count anything and you will lose weight. It permanently changed the way my husband and I eat.

Good luck.

[Amras]

Ahh, people think, just add a little exercise and the weight will come off. If only it was that easy. The exercise portion of getting 'fit' or losing weight equates to about 20-25% max of the actual cause of weight loss. Diet is everything, litterally, 80% of results will be based on diet, unless you have great genetics, but seeing if you are overweight already, probably not.

Eating junk food a couple times a week on a diet ?

A proper diet is 1 cheat meal per week max, no alcohol etc.. weight lifting is a good start but it will never offset a bad diet.

Actually not true. Single cheat meal's don't really work. Cheat days work much better. You need a day of over eating followed by a day either low in calories (ie a fast) or low in carbs. Both work wonders for fat loss, as your metabolism is primed from the previous over feed and doesn't notice the 'lack' of food for about 48 hours or so (from memory).

Wasnt there a study carried out recently where they compared a cardio programme, a weights programme and a mixture of the two to check for weight loss?

The result was unequivocal. Weight training did NOTHING for weight loss. The group running 15km/week had fantastic results. And the mix group were obvioulsy between the two (with the rather interesting point that those who ran 15km/week on top of weight training still performed around the same as the cardio group). Entertaining stuff.

Might want to check facts before sprouting untrue info.

Weight training does more for fat loss long term, than cardio alone. Weight training increases muscle mass, increase's metabolic rate and increase your standing daily energy needs (muscle burns energy even when you aren't moving). Short term, cardio can help weight loss, but you will reach a plateau pretty quick (around a month for someone who rarely exercises).

Doing both is a great way to increase metabolic rate and burn extra calories.

But as long as you continue to eat pizza, nachos and crap 3-4 times a week. Well, you aren't going to get anywhere with your weight loss. Honestly do this.

week 1: sat or sun; cheat day, eat what you want. then for the next 6 days, minimal carbs, no processed carbs, no fruit, vegies are ok.

week 2. sat or sun (whatever day you started) cheat day again, eat what you want, pizza is ok on this day ONLY. Then follow with a low carb day the next 2 days, then 2 days of low GI carbs (usually fruit etc, not including bananas), rice noodles are ok as they are moderate GI (nearly low), but absolutely NO rice. Rice ha sa GI of around 95, it sky rockets your insulin. Then 2 days of High GI, rice is ok, as are most normal foods (still no junk food though).

Then repeat. It's not that hard and you will lose weight on this guaranteed. I got my parents doing it and they lost weight without even doing a training program.

Losing weight is all about diet. No amount of exercise can make up for a shitty diet.

[pgrahmm]

Last year I was only here for 6 months - dropped from 258# to 215# (I'm 6'4") the secret - I lived in Doylor - didn't go to CM much and except for some sourdough toast for breakfast a couple of times a week I ate what the housekeeper cooked - exclusively a Thai diet.

Didn't lift but still went into town weekly and played an organised sport. That's when I had my cheater meal (thanks Duke's).

If I had lifted it might have been better because when I returned to the US I had to add some weight to keep playing (loss of power).

Back up to 245# now and this article didn't help as my other half is away & I just went out and bought a big pizza so I could freeze/thaw to make life easier.....

And - no - it's good pizza - I'm not sharing.....

Edited June 9, 2013 by pgrahmm

[tropo]

Problem here is that doing more exercise tends to increase appetite.

You may find it surprising that doing a lot of intense exercise (weight training) can reduce the appetite. I often have to force myself to eat more on the days I go to the gym because I just don't have the desire to eat. I always eat less on my gym days. This may depend on the length of the exercise routine and how hard you push.

If I'm at the gym for 2 hours, that's at least about 5 hours less in the day that I'm thinking about food. About 1.5 - 2 hours of not eating leading up to a workout, and at least 1 hour cooldown period. A good protein/carb meal about 1.5 to 2 hours before the workout keeps me going for the duration.

So I'm getting a double benefit here.... burning more calories and eating less.

I'm not sure how long cardio would affect my appetite as I don't do long cardio. Perhaps someone who does could chime in.

Edited June 9, 2013 by tropo

[Amras]

Problem here is that doing more exercise tends to increase appetite.

You may find it surprising that doing a lot of intense exercise (weight training) can reduce the appetite. I often have to force myself to eat more on the days I go to the gym because I just don't have the desire to eat. I always eat less on my gym days. This may depend on the length of the exercise routine and how hard you push.

If I'm at the gym for 2 hours, that's at least about 5 hours less in the day that I'm thinking about food. About 1.5 - 2 hours of not eating leading up to a workout, and at least 1 hour cooldown period. A good protein/carb meal about 1.5 to 2 hours before the workout keeps me going for the duration.

So I'm getting a double benefit here.... burning more calories and eating less.

I'm not sure how long cardio would affect my appetite as I don't do long cardio. Perhaps someone who does could chime in.

That's a hell of a lot of weight training. If it's 2 hours of non stop weights, I'm surprised you are not over doing it (unless you spend time talking as well). Generally I'm doing about 1hr 20 max including warm up and stretching for weight training days, but that's non stop...no fluffing around, so to say.

But to the OP.

Long cardio, generally avoid it, unless you have time to stand on a tread mill and walk/jog for an hour. It's boring and helps burn fat during the time you are doing it, but has no lasting effect on metabolism. Short intense interval training is much better. Even if you can't sprint, either get on a bike (much easier), or one of those eliptical striders and go hard for a minute and then go slow for a minute and repeat for about 20 mins. Much better than slow cardio and isn't so mind numbing boring.

The thing you need to watch for, especially if you are just starting out to exercise, is not overdoing it. If you exercise too much (in a short space of time) you can raise your cortisol which isn't good. Generally, keep cardio sessions to around 30 mins and weight training to max an hour and you will be alright.

But as I said in an earlier post...eat clean, follow my suggestions and the weight will come off.

[MrHammer]

Lots of good advice here, I "liked" your posts

Someone asked for stats so I'm 31, 186cm/103kg. I have lifted weights for several years now and have quite high maxes (no bragging).

A couple of years back I was 90 kg and could eat literally everything as long as I did those 3xweek sessions. Apparantly can't do that anymore. I also find it difficult to estimate how much to eat over here, particularly with all the rice. Every meal is 2/3 rice and only 1/3 protein. Difficult to know how many calories are there and one typical thai meal is far from enough to satisfy my hunger.

[Tolley]

Problem here is that doing more exercise tends to increase appetite.

You may find it surprising that doing a lot of intense exercise (weight training) can reduce the appetite. I often have to force myself to eat more on the days I go to the gym because I just don't have the desire to eat. I always eat less on my gym days. This may depend on the length of the exercise routine and how hard you push.

If I'm at the gym for 2 hours, that's at least about 5 hours less in the day that I'm thinking about food. About 1.5 - 2 hours of not eating leading up to a workout, and at least 1 hour cooldown period. A good protein/carb meal about 1.5 to 2 hours before the workout keeps me going for the duration.

So I'm getting a double benefit here.... burning more calories and eating less.

I'm not sure how long cardio would affect my appetite as I don't do long cardio. Perhaps someone who does could chime in.

Although squash is not 100 percent cardio as it is also anerobic(not sure of the breakdown here but plenty of guys who are aerobic fit dont do so well at squash as they are too slow off the mark) i find that when I play I dont eat much at all.

Firstly I dont eat for a couple of hours before I play then after playing I am drinking around 2 litres of water plus gatorade to rehydrate and then I eat maybe two hours after playing but cant eat a big meal.

However when I do a weight session I am hungry pretty quickly and hungry for a couple of hours later as well and I eat quite a lot.

Overall I am actually in better shape i reckon not doing too much weight training albeit not as strong as I tend to eat too much after weight training.

Edited June 10, 2013 by Tolley

[manarak]

Lots of good advice here, I "liked" your posts:)

Someone asked for stats so I'm 31, 186cm/103kg. I have lifted weights for several years now and have quite high maxes (no bragging).

A couple of years back I was 90 kg and could eat literally everything as long as I did those 3xweek sessions. Apparantly can't do that anymore. I also find it difficult to estimate how much to eat over here, particularly with all the rice. Every meal is 2/3 rice and only 1/3 protein. Difficult to know how many calories are there and one typical thai meal is far from enough to satisfy my hunger.

Hunger is the key - you need to make your stomach used to smaller meals and it will cut the hunger.

Rice will bind lipids (=fat) same as bread.

You could also try to separate the rice from the proteins, or not eat rice at all and replace it with pak (=vegetables) instead.

Personally, I feel that eating anything that isn't fat except fruits is a torture.

So I chose to eat less, it works.

[robblok]

Problem here is that doing more exercise tends to increase appetite.

You may find it surprising that doing a lot of intense exercise (weight training) can reduce the appetite. I often have to force myself to eat more on the days I go to the gym because I just don't have the desire to eat. I always eat less on my gym days. This may depend on the length of the exercise routine and how hard you push.

If I'm at the gym for 2 hours, that's at least about 5 hours less in the day that I'm thinking about food. About 1.5 - 2 hours of not eating leading up to a workout, and at least 1 hour cooldown period. A good protein/carb meal about 1.5 to 2 hours before the workout keeps me going for the duration.

So I'm getting a double benefit here.... burning more calories and eating less.

I'm not sure how long cardio would affect my appetite as I don't do long cardio. Perhaps someone who does could chime in.

Although squash is not 100 percent cardio as it is also anerobic(not sure of the breakdown here but plenty of guys who are aerobic fit dont do so well at squash as they are too slow off the mark) i find that when I play I dont eat much at all.

Firstly I dont eat for a couple of hours before I play then after playing I am drinking around 2 litres of water plus gatorade to rehydrate and then I eat maybe two hours after playing but cant eat a big meal.

However when I do a weight session I am hungry pretty quickly and hungry for a couple of hours later as well and I eat quite a lot.

Overall I am actually in better shape i reckon not doing too much weight training albeit not as strong as I tend to eat too much after weight training.

My weight sessions always kill my hunger just as with Tropo. I never feel hungry after training even if I workout just before I should normally eat. I don't know why, must be some variance in there just like in all other things some people have and some people have not.

[robblok]

Last year I was only here for 6 months - dropped from 258# to 215# (I'm 6'4") the secret - I lived in Doylor - didn't go to CM much and except for some sourdough toast for breakfast a couple of times a week I ate what the housekeeper cooked - exclusively a Thai diet.

Didn't lift but still went into town weekly and played an organised sport. That's when I had my cheater meal (thanks Duke's).

If I had lifted it might have been better because when I returned to the US I had to add some weight to keep playing (loss of power).

Back up to 245# now and this article didn't help as my other half is away & I just went out and bought a big pizza so I could freeze/thaw to make life easier.....

And - no - it's good pizza - I'm not sharing.....

If you lost power you probably lost some muscle, i lost some power too during my year long diet, i got it all back now and a bit more. I lifted a lot during that one year but also did a lot of cardio and was on a caloric restricted diet. I dropped 53 lbs in that period.

I believe that a combination of cardio with weight training and a caloric restrictive diet is the best thing to do. I doubt one can 100% keep onto muscle but it would help keeping it in check.

[Tolley]

Problem here is that doing more exercise tends to increase appetite.

You may find it surprising that doing a lot of intense exercise (weight training) can reduce the appetite. I often have to force myself to eat more on the days I go to the gym because I just don't have the desire to eat. I always eat less on my gym days. This may depend on the length of the exercise routine and how hard you push.

If I'm at the gym for 2 hours, that's at least about 5 hours less in the day that I'm thinking about food. About 1.5 - 2 hours of not eating leading up to a workout, and at least 1 hour cooldown period. A good protein/carb meal about 1.5 to 2 hours before the workout keeps me going for the duration.

So I'm getting a double benefit here.... burning more calories and eating less.

I'm not sure how long cardio would affect my appetite as I don't do long cardio. Perhaps someone who does could chime in.

Although squash is not 100 percent cardio as it is also anerobic(not sure of the breakdown here but plenty of guys who are aerobic fit dont do so well at squash as they are too slow off the mark) i find that when I play I dont eat much at all.

Firstly I dont eat for a couple of hours before I play then after playing I am drinking around 2 litres of water plus gatorade to rehydrate and then I eat maybe two hours after playing but cant eat a big meal.

However when I do a weight session I am hungry pretty quickly and hungry for a couple of hours later as well and I eat quite a lot.

Overall I am actually in better shape i reckon not doing too much weight training albeit not as strong as I tend to eat too much after weight training.

My weight sessions always kill my hunger just as with Tropo. I never feel hungry after training even if I workout just before I should normally eat. I don't know why, must be some variance in there just like in all other things some people have and some people have not.

Maybe I am not going hard enough on the weights. My sessions never last more than 45 mins in the gym but I do everything quickly no mucking around.

[culicine]

Wasnt there a study carried out recently where they compared a cardio programme, a weights programme and a mixture of the two to check for weight loss?

The result was unequivocal. Weight training did NOTHING for weight loss. The group running 15km/week had fantastic results. And the mix group were obvioulsy between the two (with the rather interesting point that those who ran 15km/week on top of weight training still performed around the same as the cardio group). Entertaining stuff.

Perhaps but personally I found that if I do cardio first (say 30 mins), I still have energy for weights afterwards. However, If I do weights first, cardio afterwards is a real struggle. Weight lifting is very energy sapping - whether that contributes to weight loss i don't know.

For the OP, it also depends on your age. Two years ago, I managed to shed 5 kgs over about 2 months, just doing weights/cardio a few times a week. Now I'm nearly 45. After a long break i started the same regime again - now my weight had barely changed over 3 months, and may have increased a little. I don't understand it. I'm guessing my metabolism has slowed a lot and really need to modify my diet more than before.

[tropo]

That's a hell of a lot of weight training. If it's 2 hours of non stop weights, I'm surprised you are not over doing it (unless you spend time talking as well). Generally I'm doing about 1hr 20 max including warm up and stretching for weight training days, but that's non stop...no fluffing around, so to say.

No "fluffing around" and no talking. All rest periods are timed depending on what I'm training. A lot of it is supersetting or alternating bodyparts to cut down on rest periods. The first 15 minutes is a warmup (rowing).

Obviously weight training is not non-stop because you rest between sets. 2 hours is no problem whatsoever - I've been doing 2 hour workouts for decades. I don't do it everyday - 3 to 4 times per week. Back in the 70's and 80's everyone used to do 2 - 3 hour workouts. These days people are lazy and use cortisol and hormone theories as an excuse to cut their workouts short. Obviously meal planning is important to make sure you have enough energy to make it through.

I don't agree with the theory that HIIT is better than slower cardio. IMO hard or moderate cardio is going to burn the most calories, not HIIT. HIIT is being marketed very successfully as the premise is that you can do very short sessions 3 times a week and get more benefit. In fact HIIT is quite dangerous for most unfit or older people because you're forcing yourself up to the higher end of you max heart rate.

Genuine HIIT is very hard to do and most people who claim to do it are just pretending. If you do genuine HIIT, you'll soon burn yourself out and give up - it's no fun whatsoever. Everyone is talking about it, but few are doing it. You've got to ask yourself why.

It's very important when recommending exercise programs to consider the person's age and fitness levels. What works for a teenager is not going to be good for an unfit 40 plus person.

At nearly 54 I'm really starting to appreciate this. It's easy for me to injure myself at the gym if I'm not careful. I know this because I'm not careful enough and often do.

Edited June 10, 2013 by tropo

[tropo]

Maybe I am not going hard enough on the weights. My sessions never last more than 45 mins in the gym but I do everything quickly no mucking around.

You have to strike a happy medium. If you train too fast, you'll be lifting less and not increasing your strength optimally.

If you want to build max muscle mass, you have to attack they key compound exercises with the correct rest intervals.

[Amras]

Wasnt there a study carried out recently where they compared a cardio programme, a weights programme and a mixture of the two to check for weight loss?

The result was unequivocal. Weight training did NOTHING for weight loss. The group running 15km/week had fantastic results. And the mix group were obvioulsy between the two (with the rather interesting point that those who ran 15km/week on top of weight training still performed around the same as the cardio group). Entertaining stuff.

Perhaps but personally I found that if I do cardio first (say 30 mins), I still have energy for weights afterwards. However, If I do weights first, cardio afterwards is a real struggle. Weight lifting is very energy sapping - whether that contributes to weight loss i don't know.

For the OP, it also depends on your age. Two years ago, I managed to shed 5 kgs over about 2 months, just doing weights/cardio a few times a week. Now I'm nearly 45. After a long break i started the same regime again - now my weight had barely changed over 3 months, and may have increased a little. I don't understand it. I'm guessing my metabolism has slowed a lot and really need to modify my diet more than before.

That's because weights are harder, (should be), compared to moderate or low intensity cardio. Of course it's going to sap your energy. That means you are working hard.

However, ideally, cardio should follow weights. For the simple fact that, you don't want to use your glycogen stores for cardio. You want to use these for your lifting and then use the cardio afterwards, to start burning other sources of energy, ie the fat and stored carbs. Glycogen are your 'intermediary' energy storage, which follows your creatine storage. Creatine and glycogen are made for those intense short bouts of energy that your body needs. Fat metabolism etc is for longer sustained periods of energy needs, walking, running, resting metabolism etc.

5kgs over 2 months, you can do on diet alone, withouth exercise. That's about 250grams per week (which is nothing), especially if you are starting from being sedentary and just starting exercising.

As I said, and seems people ignored...diet is critical. Get your diet right, and do the exercise. Exercise and continuing the same diet will do little. Might strengthen your height a bit, but it's not going to result in significant weight loss.

[Amras]

That's a hell of a lot of weight training. If it's 2 hours of non stop weights, I'm surprised you are not over doing it (unless you spend time talking as well). Generally I'm doing about 1hr 20 max including warm up and stretching for weight training days, but that's non stop...no fluffing around, so to say.

No "fluffing around" and no talking. All rest periods are timed depending on what I'm training. A lot of it is supersetting or alternating bodyparts to cut down on rest periods. The first 15 minutes is a warmup (rowing).

Obviously weight training is not non-stop because you rest between sets. 2 hours is no problem whatsoever - I've been doing 2 hour workouts for decades. I don't do it everyday - 3 to 4 times per week. Back in the 70's and 80's everyone used to do 2 - 3 hour workouts. These days people are lazy and use cortisol and hormone theories as an excuse to cut their workouts short. Obviously meal planning is important to make sure you have enough energy to make it through.

I don't agree with the theory that HIIT is better than slower cardio. IMO hard or moderate cardio is going to burn the most calories, not HIIT. HIIT is being marketed very successfully as the premise is that you can do very short sessions 3 times a week and get more benefit. In fact HIIT is quite dangerous for most unfit or older people because you're forcing yourself up to the higher end of you max heart rate.

Genuine HIIT is very hard to do and most people who claim to do it are just pretending. If you do genuine HIIT, you'll soon burn yourself out and give up - it's no fun whatsoever. Everyone is talking about it, but few are doing it. You've got to ask yourself why.

It's very important when recommending exercise programs to consider the person's age and fitness levels. What works for a teenager is not going to be good for an unfit 40 plus person.

At nearly 54 I'm really starting to appreciate this. It's easy for me to injure myself at the gym if I'm not careful. I know this because I'm not careful enough and often do.

Actually I don't think everyone is lazy (many maybe). People who go to the gym 'work out' and talk in between, spend an hour and a half there and then go home saying they were at the gym for 90 mins, sure. But you can get a lot done in an hour. It also depends on how you are training. It also depends on the time you can fit in. I've read a lot from fitness experts (not body builders as they sprout rubbish) and many agree that if you are doing intense exercises, you should only need around an hour at the gym (maybe hour 30 mins max with warm up and cool down/stretching). These guys who are doing 2-3 hours a day, are not training that time all in one go, they are doing 2 x 1 or so hour sessions per day. They body needs time to recover.

Cortisol can be an issue, if you have a big gut, its the result of obviously over eating, but cortisol, ie stress too. Mid section fat is usually associated with increase cortisol levels in the blood, blood tests confirm this. Genetics also play a part. I find if I train too often (ie weights) my body doesn't recover and I don't gain stregth. It's a bit trial and error for each person as well.

On the HIT, you are right about one thing, you need to have a reasonable level of fitness before you do it. Unfit or older people shouldn't do it without getting a heart check from their doc first. But for a generally healthy, moderately fit individual, it's much better for fat loss than long slow cardio. You only have to look at a sprinter compared to a long distance runner (even someone who runs 4-8ks regularly). The long distance runners are skinny, not lean. That's because it burns muscle and fat. HIT has been proven to increase resting metabolism, for around 8-12 hours after it's finished, slow/moderate cardio does so for around 1-2 hours. The whole reason you do weight training is to increase muscle mass to increase resting metabolism and burn more calories throughout the entire day (it's simple biology). Hit compounds that effect.

People don't do it because it's hard...try sprinting off and on for 20 minutes, with 1 minute sprinting and 1 minute walking, it sounds much easier than it is. But that doesn't mean it doesn't work. Slow cardio is much eaiser...so of course people chose the easier road (again as you said, this all depends on your age and fitness level as well). Like weight training properly, most people aren't working out, or doing anything remotely what they should be doing. Hence why most people aren't exactly the ideal 'normal' or reasonable body weight or fitness level.

Personally, I do HIT, about 2 times a week and I'm stuffed after my 20 minute session, however my fitness level goes up much faster than if I was doing only steady state cardio. I am however only 29 and reasonably fit.

Again, like you said, it's important if you haven't exercised for a while and are a bit overweight, to get a physical before doing any exercise, especially a heart check. Even moderate cardio can cause a heart attack without warning (so thanks for pointing that out to the OP, it's something I forgot to highlight in my suggestions).

Kudo's to you though for continuing to keep up the exercise. Most people your age (even most my age) are too lazy and unmotivated to do so.

[Amras]

Lots of good advice here, I "liked" your posts

Someone asked for stats so I'm 31, 186cm/103kg. I have lifted weights for several years now and have quite high maxes (no bragging).

A couple of years back I was 90 kg and could eat literally everything as long as I did those 3xweek sessions. Apparantly can't do that anymore. I also find it difficult to estimate how much to eat over here, particularly with all the rice. Every meal is 2/3 rice and only 1/3 protein. Difficult to know how many calories are there and one typical thai meal is far from enough to satisfy my hunger.

Missed this post. I'd say reduce the rice. Jasmine rice has a horrendously high GI, something around 98. It actually causes an insulin spike like eating pure sugar. Add to that everything you are eating with it and it shoves a lot of it into fat cells. The exception would be rice before your workout, or on the odd day. But if you are eating it every day, multiple meals a day. Same effect of eating white bread pretty much. I've cut rice down to twice a week (two days a week) on my higher GI carb days. Rice noodles are different (their GI is around 50, so moderate).

I'd have a guess you are over eating because of all the rice. Because of the high insulin response you end up hungry again pretty quickly. Eat some rice noodles, you will see the difference (same goes for ramen, high GI, whereas Soba is made from whole buckwheat, so actually has a pretty low GI, takes time to digest).

The reasons Thai's can eat rice and not put on weight, I gather is from 1. They only really eat twice a day (maybe 3 meals), that's it and 2. genetics. Hot climate, fat stores aren't needed. Most of us westerners still have those genes to keep fat for the cold. It can be hard to fight.

so reduce the rice, eat more vegetables, fruits and protein (meat). Rice is a silent killer, with the appearance of being healthy.

[tropo]

Kudo's to you though for continuing to keep up the exercise. Most people your age (even most my age) are too lazy and unmotivated to do so.

I started weight training when I'm 15, 39 years ago. When you're starting to get old the training is more important than when you're young... but make no mistake about it.... I don't train like an old man.

Most people are lazy at the gym and just go through the motions. Having trained at public gyms for nearly 40 years in many countries, I've seen a few come and go.

Yes, you can get a lot done in an hour, but you can get a lot more done in 2 hours. I know exactly when I've had enough, and that feeling normally comes at about 2 hours. You can work calves, abs and other small muscle groups even when you're feeling fatigued. Sometimes I might feel fatigued early and stop - but that's rare.

Obviously the more you push your body, the more conditioned it will become provided you're feeding it well and giving it enough rest to recover.

If you're doing enough weight training, and keeping it moving along at a solid pace, you don't need HIIT. It'll interfere with muscle building and strength gains.

Edited June 10, 2013 by tropo

[MrHammer]

I would find it hard to do 2 hours of weight lifting if I'm doing compound lifts. My current program has squats, rows/deadlift and bench/overhead press. Though it is pyramiding so the first 3 sets are light, you're still bombed after heavy squats and particularly the deadlifts. If you do some sort of bodybuilding split I suppose 2 hours is easier to do. I usually try to get 2-3 x 10 min of rowing after lifting, which is imo the best form of cardio next to something like thai boxing.

[tropo]

I would find it hard to do 2 hours of weight lifting if I'm doing compound lifts. My current program has squats, rows/deadlift and bench/overhead press. Though it is pyramiding so the first 3 sets are light, you're still bombed after heavy squats and particularly the deadlifts. If you do some sort of bodybuilding split I suppose 2 hours is easier to do. I usually try to get 2-3 x 10 min of rowing after lifting, which is imo the best form of cardio next to something like thai boxing.

It's a bodybuilding split involving both compound and isolation work. A squat workout would come in at approximately 10 sets in a pyramid type system. The same with incline bench presses and other upper body work. It takes time. Obviously I like high volume and it works great for me.

[robblok]

I workout a bit less as Tropo but still more then the 45 minutes the experts are talking about. I don't talk to anyone as I train alone. The body does get used to longer workouts if you have trained for a long time. I would not advise it for beginners.

I have done HIIT and I would do it no more then 1 / 2 times a week if you combine it with heavy lifting else you are sure to burnout. I prefer MAF cardio next to my lifting if I am in a weight loss phase.

I am not saying that what I do is perfect for everyone but it works for me.

[poanoi]

Replace the pizza with boiled egg & caviar.

ed: and IMO deadlift is not a good thing for lower back, lest you have the hex thing rob has,

stick with squats.

I do DB squats myself, i cant mess up my back with it

Edited June 11, 2013 by poanoi